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Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

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To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

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If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

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The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

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We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

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Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

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What's wrong with our offense?

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  • #46
    Re: What's wrong with our offense?

    One other thing our young squad is going to have to adjust to is that teams are going to be gearing up to play hard against them. It's not something the Pacers have had to contend with in quite some time, but they are a playoff contender and teams are going to come in aggressive. I'm not saying this the main problem with the offense, but when was the last time you heard a coach say playing the Pacers is going to be a good test of where they are as a team (see Byron Scott and the Cavs)? They aren't going to be surprising anyone and will have to get their legs under them to be aggressive on both ends of the floor.

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    • #47
      Re: What's wrong with our offense?

      Originally posted by BlueNGold View Post
      Doesn't it at least feel good that Vogel is probably working hard on this problem now?
      The implications of this are a bit over the top.
      "A man with no belly has no appetite for life."

      - Salman Rushdie

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      • #48
        Re: What's wrong with our offense?

        well hill seems like the only guy who can get to the rim w/o being a blackhole.

        granger and jones never seem to pass when they drive and collison has all that speed, but doesn't attack the rim (probably his size)

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        • #49
          Re: What's wrong with our offense?

          Originally posted by Harddrive7 View Post
          True but I haven't seen many coming off those picks cleanly either. It's like the timing is off. Again, something time will fix.
          For whatever reason, the Pacers have been poor at setting picks for many lineups over multiple coaches now. Foster can set a pick well (but had no offense for the critical second part of the PnR/PnP), and Josh could do it, but no one else even harkening back to JO could manage to do it without completely telegraphing the move. Yes, we were spoiled by Dale "bone jar" Davis, but that's no excuse for it completely falling off the radar.

          We also have problems USING the pick when it is set, and I think that is timing related. It takes so long for the pick to get into position that the ball handler moves early, making the pick useless and often simply drawing the double-team WITHOUT opening a passing lane to the pick setter.

          Originally posted by joeyd View Post
          We have been out-assisted in the last 2 games, and this is reflected in the team's inability to score at times.
          Or the other way around. Hard to chalk up an assist when the guy you pass to bricks the shot.
          BillS

          A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.
          Or throw in a first-round pick and flip it for a max-level point guard...

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          • #50
            Re: What's wrong with our offense?

            Originally posted by BillS View Post
            For whatever reason, the Pacers have been poor at setting picks for many lineups over multiple coaches now. Foster can set a pick well (but had no offense for the critical second part of the PnR/PnP), and Josh could do it, but no one else even harkening back to JO could manage to do it without completely telegraphing the move. Yes, we were spoiled by Dale "bone jar" Davis, but that's no excuse for it completely falling off the radar.

            We also have problems USING the pick when it is set, and I think that is timing related. It takes so long for the pick to get into position that the ball handler moves early, making the pick useless and often simply drawing the double-team WITHOUT opening a passing lane to the pick setter.



            Or the other way around. Hard to chalk up an assist when the guy you pass to bricks the shot.
            Teams work very hard to contain the PnR...and it does take excellent execution to make use of it. The pick setters too often float rather than pop off the pick, so this isn't all DC's fault. Yet, I think part of the problem is DC. There are times when the pick setter is open but DC cannot seem to get the ball to them. Part of this is due to his height and the other part is his ability to pass. He's not bad, he's just not great at passing...and he's short. Perhaps they need to work on executing it better, because right now it's not working at all.
            Lance is finally home. Whether he becomes our starting PG or he's 6th man, he's getting big minutes and he's here to stay. #llortontnia

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            • #51
              Re: What's wrong with our offense?

              of course would not be a major improvement, but i would definitely play AJ instead of Lance... not only better play maker, but he can hit jumpers, and we need that badly right now...

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              • #52
                Re: What's wrong with our offense?

                Originally posted by threein73 View Post
                of course would not be a major improvement, but i would definitely play AJ instead of Lance... not only better play maker, but he can hit jumpers, and we need that badly right now...
                Lance has taken five total shots this year.

                AJ doesn't even shoot 40% for his career. I have no clue how you are trying to justify that.

                Hill isn't a creator. He's a shot maker. When Lance and Hill are in, Hill should be playing off ball. Lance is a better creator and passer. Lance's shot will start to fall when he gets more playing time.
                First time in a long time, I've been happy with the team that was constructed, and now they struggle. I blame the coach.

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                • #53
                  Re: What's wrong with our offense?

                  I am on board of the rust and conditioning. I think after this coming week we will get a better idea on the offense.

                  But I will say that I was not impressed with the offense at all last year. With Vogel and with JOB it was predictable.

                  If Monroe cannot stop Roy, go to him until they figure how to stop them. Then let the holes and open jumpers come.

                  I do like the low-posting of West, Granger, and even Tyler. But I do think that we have to allow them a little more time before we flip out.

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                  • #54
                    Re: What's wrong with our offense?

                    Originally posted by BillS View Post
                    Or the other way around. Hard to chalk up an assist when the guy you pass to bricks the shot.
                    Just saying that already in this young season, I've seen a trend where players that should be giving up the ball fail to make the extra pass. A low FG percentage can also be due to poor shot selection (e.g., driving against 3 players and shooting in traffic). But yeah, there have also been some bricks.

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                    • #55
                      Re: What's wrong with our offense?

                      We need Jeff back to make the offense run better.

                      But seriously, he can make things a bit smoother, good cuts and smart play. He is one of the few players we have who isn't going to jack up a shot every time he touches the ball.

                      The biggest problem right now is we have alot of guys who want to do things themselves. Danny, George Hill, Paul George, Tyler, DWest and DJones.

                      It's ok if you have one or sometimes two of those guys on the floor together... it's like having a good backup plan when the play falls apart. You always have one of these guys who can create their own offense in case of emergency, but it's bad when everyone is trying to create their own offense at the expense of team play.

                      I'd still sacrifice a sweet looking offense for badass defense any day though.

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                      • #56
                        Re: What's wrong with our offense?

                        Originally posted by Sparhawk View Post
                        Lance has taken five total shots this year.

                        AJ doesn't even shoot 40% for his career. I have no clue how you are trying to justify that.

                        Hill isn't a creator. He's a shot maker. When Lance and Hill are in, Hill should be playing off ball. Lance is a better creator and passer. Lance's shot will start to fall when he gets more playing time.
                        AJ has played two seasons, and was recovering from a knee injury in one of them. His shooting was good when he was healthy (especially for a rookie)..it wasn't wonderful, but definitely decent for a rookie. Dun's three point percentage was almost 10 percent lower after his knee injury than the following season, and his FG% almost 5%. This isn't rocket science. It's the same reason West is struggling a bit with his midrange. They aren't 100% so they don't get as much lift. But it shouldn't be a Lance vs. AJ issue anyway. Lance is getting developmental minutes. Vogel isn't giving him enough to really impact the game, just enough to get Lance's feet wet. It's really whether you think Dahntay or AJ would help the second unit more.

                        Regardless, my point wasn't even about MAKING shots. It was about the willingness to take those shots, (making them would be nice though..but regardless, if you are a willing to take them, it forces the other team to guard you from there) and the ability to move the ball and move without the ball (making good reads while doing it. Some players try and move but have no clue..) which is something sorely needed in the second unit.

                        It's not that important anyway, but it would help the second unit out. The more important issue is the starting unit. Which, I think Vogel's going to have to teach PG how to move without the ball, and get Granger to stop driving into three people. Then have a few "go to" plays to go along with the increased ball/player movement.
                        Last edited by Sookie; 01-02-2012, 01:27 PM.

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                        • #57
                          Re: What's wrong with our offense?

                          Just wanted to add.....we DO have a young coach doing his first HEAD COACHING gig EVER in NBA. It's really not an excuse, but he really hasn't had the time to seriously work on his own system of offense and defense. If you really think about it, Vogel has essentionally been coaching "on the fly" since he's took over the team. Probably one of the reasons why Bird insisted on veteran assistant coaches this offseason, because he highly expected that the NBA lockout was going to wipe out part of the season.

                          From a coaching perspective, the NBA Lockout probably hurt us more than any other team in the NBA, since Vogel didn't have the benefit of training camps and preseason games to implement and test his system. However, it's kinda nice that NBA Experts still believe that Indiana can make the playoffs on talent alone. If Indiana makes the playoffs as a very high seed, it kinda makes you wonder if we came across a VERY special coach in Vogel.


                          Remember when we could have gotten 1-2 solid players and a possible Top 3 draft pick in the 2017 NBA Draft by trading away Paul George?

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                          • #58
                            Re: What's wrong with our offense?

                            Originally posted by BlueNGold View Post
                            Teams work very hard to contain the PnR...and it does take excellent execution to make use of it. The pick setters too often float rather than pop off the pick, so this isn't all DC's fault. Yet, I think part of the problem is DC. There are times when the pick setter is open but DC cannot seem to get the ball to them. Part of this is due to his height and the other part is his ability to pass. He's not bad, he's just not great at passing...and he's short. Perhaps they need to work on executing it better, because right now it's not working at all.
                            I agree with this. It gets too cluttered for us in the Pick and Pop/Roll situations. The big defender is almost always jumping the pick. Our bigs need to recognize this and immediately roll to the basket with the PG on their hip or just slip to the basket. Instead, Our bigs just (like you said) float over to the side and our ballhandler just reverses his direction and looks to the other side. It would also help our Pick and Roll/Pop if our PG would sometimes use the pick to get to the basket. Make the defenders think about it.

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                            • #59
                              Re: What's wrong with our offense?

                              Originally posted by Sookie View Post
                              AJ has played two seasons, and was recovering from a knee injury in one of them. His shooting was good when he was healthy (especially for a rookie)..it wasn't wonderful, but definitely decent for a rookie. Dun's three point percentage was almost 10 percent lower after his knee injury than the following season, and his FG% almost 5%. This isn't rocket science. It's the same reason West is struggling a bit with his midrange. They aren't 100% so they don't get as much lift.
                              West has an excuse we had a short camp he isnt in basketball shape and has only played for 20 days. If they had a full camp im sure it would be different.

                              AJ cant shoot and for a pg who cant get to the rim or have good vision that is a death sentence.

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