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The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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NBA steroid problem?

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  • NBA steroid problem?

    http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/bal...urn=nba-wp3662

    yahoo sports!

    Kelly Dwyer

    Derrick Rose and the NBA’s apparent ‘huge’ steroid problem

    By Kelly Dwyer

    Derrick Rose(notes) says that performance enhancing drugs are a huge problem in the NBA, in a snippet that made the pages of ESPN the Magazine a few weeks ago, and the reaction to his comment seems to have hit a fever pitch.
    And while we don't question Rose's knowledge of the inner-workings of this league, and what he's seen versus what we've observed and learned from afar, this does appear to be much ado about nothing. I'm hardly the NBA's favorite scribe these days, but it should be pointed out that this league has had strict testing for both drugs and supplements for decades, with ever-evolving guidelines, and that those who have been caught in the crosshairs with these sorts of things have been quickly sent to the sidelines. The league tests, and the few who use get caught.
    In one of those quickie Q and A's ESPN Mag likes to run every-however-often-they-publish, Rose was asked to rate the NBA's problem with PEDs on a scale from one to ten. He classified it as a "seven," and then dropped this:
    "It's huge and I think we need a level playing field, where nobody has that advantage over the next person."
    What matters here is context, and you understanding that I'm not trying to argue away on behalf of Rose and/or the NBA.
    Is "it" huge, or would the idea of PEDs being legally dumped into the NBA's bloodstream be huge? Was this question offered to Derrick as an idea, or as his take on what he knows about the league? Does he really think that the NBA doesn't have a level playing field because of these drugs and/or supplements? Or was he responding to a hypothetical that would come as a result of this uneven scope?
    So far, only middling types like Don MacLean, O.J. Mayo(notes), and Rashard Lewis(notes) have been suspended because of testing positive for this stuff. Others have been banished due to other chemical additives (be they recreational or otherwise), and if you want to get into some argument that allows for the idea that the NBA would knowingly gloss over some superstar who had tested positive so as not to keep him away from the national television cameras, then you're going to have to go to some message board for that.
    Because it takes two to tango, and several to test and then react, and if that were actually the case with [name your All-Star], then some doctor or lab assistant would have a million-dollar exclusive on their hands. Unless you think the NBA, which regulates and labels headbands, would pay off a doctor or lab assistant. And then … wait, why am I even listening to you?
    Rose denied through a team spokesman on Sunday that he even made the comments, and that'll be more than enough to fuel the fire, because nothing satiates a conspiracy theorist more than an outright denial spun through the professional hands of a team or league employee.
    Common sense, here, everyone. I'm on nobody's payroll save for Yahoo!'s, and I'm not out to save "my boy." Give it a moment's thought before prattling on.
    UPDATE:
    Steve Aschburner, as he usually does, clarifies my thoughts in a more articulate fashion, while adding a nugget taken from the Chicago Tribune:
    And the possibility loomed large that what Rose was asked, or thought he was asked, different significantly than what showed up on the final magazine page. That was the view of a Bull spokesman, who denied the quote on Rose's behalf that he was alleging a current, ongoing problem in the NBA.
    The Chicago Tribune also reported:
    One person close to Rose said the question was posed to him as "How big of a problem would it be if steroid use were rampant in the NBA?"
    Fitting answers to questions reconfigured and slanted later happens sometimes in print journalism. It's a shoddy practice, mostly undone these days by video or audio recordings of most interviews. But without pictures or sound of this Q&A exchange between Rose and the reporter, it's hard to know if what was asked —- and what was answered -— were precisely as portrayed in the one-page, graphics-heavy feature.
    Your read, so to speak, as to what happens from here.

  • #2
    Re: NBA steroid problem?

    Rose is denying he's said this by the way.

    Wouldn't be shocked if that was the case

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: NBA steroid problem?

      Gotta love irresponsible journalism.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: NBA steroid problem?

        I think a lot of players use some form of PED's, but more for recovery than anything. The NBA has a grueling schedule. The level that these guys play at for so long is ridiculous.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: NBA steroid problem?

          Performance enhancing drugs are called that for a reason. It's not a coincidence Rashard Lewis level of play dwindled after he tested for it.

          Most baseball players lose it once they're off it, guessing football would be the same if you look at Shawne Merriman. I personally think Bob Sanders was on them, but that's just my opinion.

          It gives you an advantage, you still need the skill, but if it gives you an extra gear, or extra boost, it's not really fair, but I understand why athletes do it, to get paid, and achieve that level of fame, even if only for a few years

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: NBA steroid problem?

            Someone must have given D Rose a call late at night....
            "We've got to be very clear about this. We don't want our players hanging around with murderers," said Larry Bird, Pacers president.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: NBA steroid problem?

              Originally posted by pwee31 View Post
              It's not a coincidence Rashard Lewis level of play dwindled after he tested for it.
              Maybe this was a joke I took seriously, but I thought it was mentioned somewhere that Lewis just took too much Viagra, which led to his high testosterone levels?

              I always thought that story was hilarious and didn't doubt it for some reason.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: NBA steroid problem?

                Originally posted by Major Cold View Post
                If Rose said this, then, he is an idiot and the Bulls need to hire him some kind of (or a new) P.R. manager. Rose has also had loose lips since the NBA-Players union negotiations began. The league doesn't need this kind of blow or that type of investigation at this juncture.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: NBA steroid problem?

                  Originally posted by DemonHunter1105 View Post
                  Maybe this was a joke I took seriously, but I thought it was mentioned somewhere that Lewis just took too much Viagra, which led to his high testosterone levels?

                  I always thought that story was hilarious and didn't doubt it for some reason.
                  I never heard that. It is a performance enhancing drug I suppose

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by DemonHunter1105 View Post
                    Maybe this was a joke I took seriously, but I thought it was mentioned somewhere that Lewis just took too much Viagra, which led to his high testosterone levels?

                    I always thought that story was hilarious and didn't doubt it for some reason.
                    As a physician, I can tell you that Viagra does not elevate your testosterone levels. It works by dilating blood vessels, allowing more blood flow to certain areas. So that report is bogus. Funny, but bogus.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: NBA steroid problem?

                      Professor S is right.

                      Viagra (and Cialis) increase blood flow and do nothing to hormones. In fact, Viagra was originally in clinical trials as a drug to lower blood pressure. It didn't come close to having the desired blood pressure lowering affects, since it seemed to operate mostly in dilating peripheral arteries (closer to your skin).

                      But male test patients reported an interesting side effect...
                      Last edited by Slick Pinkham; 05-23-2011, 08:46 AM.
                      The poster "pacertom" since this forum began (and before!). I changed my name here to "Slick Pinkham" in honor of the imaginary player That Bobby "Slick" Leonard picked late in the 1971 ABA draft (true story!).

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: NBA steroid problem?

                        I guess it depends on what you consider to be "Performance Enhancing Drugs". Personally, if you can buy it in a GNC store, then it's fair game. As a side note, I believe basketball is a rare sport where I believe bulk is actually to your disadvantage. I know that I used to buy a lot of over-the-counter "drugs" to help me with lifting weights and muscle recovery when I used to play basketball 3-4 days a week and 2-3 hours per session at Purdue University.


                        Remember when we could have gotten 1-2 solid players and a possible Top 3 draft pick in the 2017 NBA Draft by trading away Paul George?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: NBA steroid problem?

                          Originally posted by DemonHunter1105 View Post
                          Maybe this was a joke I took seriously, but I thought it was mentioned somewhere that Lewis just took too much Viagra, which led to his high testosterone levels?

                          I always thought that story was hilarious and didn't doubt it for some reason.
                          Not Viagra. It was Extenze. And this is not joke. While the active ingredients in Extenze have been scientifically proven to be basically worthless in making anything but credit card bills larger, there is an ingredient in the formula, dehydropiandrosterone, that is on the NBA's list of banned substances. Lewis was looking for a performance enhancer. But it wouldn't have been much help on the court. Just after Lewis's failed test, the NBA Player's Association sent a letter to each member saying exactly what happened to Rashard, how much it was going to cost him (a ****load), and a list of other over the counter supplements which contained DHEA so as to avoid another potentially embarrassing and financially irresponsible incident. Evidently, OJ Mayo didn't read that memo as he was suspeneded for DHEA as well. No word from the NBPA on whether or not his suspension was related to Extenze also.
                          "I had to take her down like Chris Brown."

                          -Lance Stephenson

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: NBA steroid problem?

                            Originally posted by BRushWithDeath View Post
                            Not Viagra. It was Extenze. And this is not joke. While the active ingredients in Extenze have been scientifically proven to be basically worthless in making anything but credit card bills larger, there is an ingredient in the formula, dehydropiandrosterone, that is on the NBA's list of banned substances. Lewis was looking for a performance enhancer. But it wouldn't have been much help on the court. Just after Lewis's failed test, the NBA Player's Association sent a letter to each member saying exactly what happened to Rashard, how much it was going to cost him (a ****load), and a list of other over the counter supplements which contained DHEA so as to avoid another potentially embarrassing and financially irresponsible incident. Evidently, OJ Mayo didn't read that memo as he was suspeneded for DHEA as well. No word from the NBPA on whether or not his suspension was related to Extenze also.
                            Good to know. That certainly seems plausible. DHEA was the substance that Mark McGwire initially admitted to using during the '98 season when he broke the home run record; at the time it was not banned by MLB.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: NBA steroid problem?

                              Originally posted by pwee31 View Post
                              Performance enhancing drugs are called that for a reason. It's not a coincidence Rashard Lewis level of play dwindled after he tested for it.

                              Most baseball players lose it once they're off it, guessing football would be the same if you look at Shawne Merriman. I personally think Bob Sanders was on them, but that's just my opinion.

                              It gives you an advantage, you still need the skill, but if it gives you an extra gear, or extra boost, it's not really fair, but I understand why athletes do it, to get paid, and achieve that level of fame, even if only for a few years
                              I agree about Bob Sanders, no way he can get that big without some kind of boost by drugs. Now his biceps are so large they keep ripping.
                              First time in a long time, I've been happy with the team that was constructed, and now they struggle. I blame the coach.

                              Comment

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