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The Rules of Pacers Digest

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Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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Shawne Williams

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  • Shawne Williams

    Knicks’ Williams Is Far From Home and Trouble
    By JONATHAN ABRAMS
    Published: December 19, 2010

    When the Knicks’ president, Donnie Walsh, informed Shawne Williams that his N.B.A. lifespan had been granted an extension with the Knicks, he offered one strong caveat. “I told him, ‘It’s a different ballgame now,’ ” said Walsh, who kept Williams over the sentimental favorite Patrick Ewing Jr. for the last roster spot before the season. “ ‘If anything negative comes up, you’re out of here.’ ”

    Williams, a 6-foot-9 forward, is one of the few substitutes Coach Mike D’Antoni regularly calls upon. After making 10 of his first 12 attempts from 3-point range this season, Williams is again settling into the ups and downs of the N.B.A.

    It is a fable to think that atonement arrives through athletics. Williams is in the process of distancing himself from his troubles and resurrecting a derailed career. His past includes several arrests and a desperate plea before a judge for his future — an act that led the former Nets general manager Kiki Vandeweghe, who had traded for and then released Williams, to utter that he was “luckily not our issue.”

    Ted Anderson, Williams’s coach at Hamilton High in Memphis, said of Williams, “He’s got nine lives.”

    Williams started the season saddled at the end of the bench before flourishing during the Knicks’ recent eight-game winning streak. His shot stopped dropping, though, and his minutes soon did also. But Williams scored 12 points Saturday as one of the team’s lone bright spots in a loss at Cleveland, and D’Antoni vowed to give him steady minutes again.

    Before joining the Knicks, Williams drifted among Indiana, Dallas and the Nets. He had troubles at each stop. Three times in Indiana, friends from Memphis ran afoul of the law while in Williams’s company. In Dallas, the Mavericks eventually asked Williams to stay away from the organization.

    Authorities in Memphis indicted Williams, 1 of 24 defendants facing drug charges in January after a seven-month investigation called Operation: Lockdown, on eight counts. The Nets had just waived Williams after he reported out of shape. He pleaded guilty to four misdemeanor drug charges, including the possession and conspiracy to possess a controlled substance, in this case, hydrocodone, a codeine-based syrup. Then over the summer he was charged with driving with a suspended license. A passenger was charged with possession of marijuana and carrying a handgun.

    “You’ve got one skill, one God-given ability, and you’re doing everything you can to throw it away,” Judge James Beasley Jr. told Williams in August, according to The Commercial Appeal in Memphis. Most of his troubles involved a common thread: Williams would be with hometown friends. With Memphis a day’s drive from Indiana, the hangers-on could and did hang on.

    “Really, I had to iron out a lot of wrinkles in my life,” the 24-year-old Williams said recently. “I sat back — even though I wanted a team to call me after the Nets — I knew I wasn’t in great shape” to go to a team.

    It was a precipitous fall. In an area rich in amateur basketball, some declared Williams the best prospect from Memphis since Penny Hardaway. Williams’s former coaches speak of a studious athlete willing to learn the game and of a person who engaged in mild mischief.

    Williams’s grandfather, Leon Williams, raised him and his brother, Ramone. They lived in South Memphis, in an area blanketed with drug dealers and prostitutes. Ramone, one year older than Shawne, was murdered before Williams entered the N.B.A.

    Anderson has known Williams since he was 9. Occasionally, Williams’s grandfather summoned Anderson to discipline Williams. Anderson, like others close to Williams as he grew up, did not recall him having any serious issues.

    At one national tournament, basketballs started to disappear and the director threatened to cancel the tournament. Keith Easterwood, one of Williams’s youth coaches, found the balls in the room of Williams and another teammate. Williams said that he could sell the basketballs once he returned to Memphis in order to buy school clothes.

    “He always did silly stuff,” Easterwood said. “Perhaps some of it was him and some of it was his environment. But he was always a pretty good kid.”

    Arkansas and Kansas recruited Williams. To Anderson’s dismay, Williams decided to play under John Calipari at Memphis.

    “I made a lot of University of Memphis fans angry when I suggested he needed to leave town,” Anderson said. He added, “Here in Memphis, it was hard for him to get away from people who he grew up around with who might not have his best interests” in mind.

    In an effort to improve his grades and become eligible to play at Memphis, Williams transferred to North Carolina’s Laurinburg Institute for his senior year. The team went 40-0 in 2004-5 and Williams debated forgoing college for the N.B.A. He announced his decision to uphold his Memphis commitment at a nightclub.

    After a year at Memphis, Walsh selected him with the 17th overall pick in the 2006 draft. His tangles with the law arose soon after.

    Out of the league most of last season, Williams saw his weight balloon. His skills atrophied. In the spring, after contemplating his life, Williams paid his way to the IMG Basketball Academy in Bradenton, Fla.

    Williams trained with several players picked in June’s draft. Off the court, he cautioned the rookies on the league’s vices. On the court, he dominated them.

    “I changed a lot of things,” Williams said, adding. “Mostly, the biggest thing with me, it was never me. It was just the crowd who I ran with and the people who I had around me. But I wouldn’t say it was a bad choosing of the people, it was just the people I grew up with all my life and I just had to separate myself from that if I wanted better things.”

    When asked if the responsibility fell on his shoulders, Williams said: “Most definitely. Nobody made me do some of the stuff I did, hang with the people I hanged with.”

    Williams’s confidence to come back never wavered; he had a successful stint with the Charlotte Bobcats in the summer league. It is part of the mind-set that helped spur his path to the N.B.A. and also his troubles.

    “Throughout all the adversity I done been through, when it all came when I was sitting at home, not playing, like I said, a light switched on that I know what I want to do with my life,” Williams said. “I want to play ball and have fun doing it.”

    In the N.B.A., labels are easy to acquire and hard to dispel. “From the beginning, I’ve been open-minded, and he’s been nothing like what I’ve heard of him,” said Roger Mason Jr., a Knicks teammate.

    That is the type of future that Williams is trying to carve out. “That’s how I’m looking at it,” Williams said. “I just want my actions to do the talking for all the off-the-court stuff.”

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/20/sp...iams.html?_r=1

  • #2
    Re: Shawne Williams

    He's played very solid in his limited minutes with the Knicks. 21-36 (.583) from the field and 12-16 (.667) from downtown.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Shawne Williams

      I'm disappointed with how Shawne turned out for us, however it's good to see him getting his career back on track.

      There was a lot of potential there. I wish him nothing but continued success in New York.
      Stop quoting people I have on ignore!

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Shawne Williams

        Really happy for him. Hope he makes it.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Shawne Williams

          No disrespect to the poster but I'm tired of hearing how our headcases "pan-out" on other teams

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Shawne Williams

            Originally posted by Pacemaker View Post
            No disrespect to the poster but I'm tired of hearing how our headcases "pan-out" on other teams
            I liked him up until he started getting in trouble and at one point thought that with his upside he could one day be the best player on the team.

            Now, I have a feeling this "feel-good" story won't have a happy ending.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Shawne Williams

              I wish him the best, but he'll find a way to blow it again.
              Larry Bird and Ryan Grigson- wasting the talents of Paul George and Andrew Luck

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Shawne Williams

                I'm not buying that Shawne is really a good person, just it was his "friends" that got him into trouble. Shawne put himself in bad situations.

                Williams is a "thug" and can't leave alone the lifestyle of a criminal. He will be out of the league soon. Walsh should have his head examined for keeping this goon.
                Being unable to close out a game in which you have a comfortable lead in the 4th Q = Pulling a Frank Vogel

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Shawne Williams

                  From the article:

                  First he says -

                  “Mostly, the biggest thing with me, it was never me. It was just the crowd who I ran with and the people who I had around me. But I wouldn’t say it was a bad choosing of the people, it was just the people I grew up with all my life and I just had to separate myself from that if I wanted better things.”

                  then he follows with -

                  When asked if the responsibility fell on his shoulders, Williams said: “Most definitely. Nobody made me do some of the stuff I did, hang with the people I hanged with.”


                  How self contradicting can one person be? It was never him? Yet nobody made him do the stuff he did? It was always someone else's fault? How the heck does a person rationalize that?

                  My guess is that the legal system has not seen the last of Williams.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Shawne Williams

                    Originally posted by Tom White View Post
                    From the article:

                    First he says -

                    “Mostly, the biggest thing with me, it was never me. It was just the crowd who I ran with and the people who I had around me. But I wouldn’t say it was a bad choosing of the people, it was just the people I grew up with all my life and I just had to separate myself from that if I wanted better things.”

                    then he follows with -

                    When asked if the responsibility fell on his shoulders, Williams said: “Most definitely. Nobody made me do some of the stuff I did, hang with the people I hanged with.”


                    How self contradicting can one person be? It was never him? Yet nobody made him do the stuff he did? It was always someone else's fault? How the heck does a person rationalize that?

                    My guess is that the legal system has not seen the last of Williams.
                    How is that self contradicting? At all. It's not. He admits it was his fault he hung out with wrong people. The wrong people influenced him to do not so great things. They're completely separate things.

                    I'm sure the same could be said of many other people. Peresonally I had the same 'issue' (though not nearly to his degree) and I'd say the exact same thing.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Shawne Williams

                      Originally posted by oxxo View Post
                      How is that self contradicting? At all. It's not. He admits it was his fault he hung out with wrong people. The wrong people influenced him to do not so great things. They're completely separate things.

                      I'm sure the same could be said of many other people. Peresonally I had the same 'issue' (though not nearly to his degree) and I'd say the exact same thing.
                      I can understand still keeping in touch with your loser friends that you grew up with, but getting involved in their lives and assisting them in their criminial activity is inexcuseable. I understand that Shawne was "young", but even adults in their early 20's know the difference between right and wrong. Shawne had to know what he was doing was wrong, but he decided to do it anyway because he had to get "steet cred" from his crew.

                      Shawne is a POS, and I could care less about how he has "changed" and "matured." He is actually a scary guy that I wouldn't want to be left in a room alone with him.
                      Being unable to close out a game in which you have a comfortable lead in the 4th Q = Pulling a Frank Vogel

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Shawne Williams

                        Originally posted by bhaas0532 View Post
                        I can understand still keeping in touch with your loser friends that you grew up with, but getting involved in their lives and assisting them in their criminial activity is inexcuseable. I understand that Shawne was "young", but even adults in their early 20's know the difference between right and wrong. Shawne had to know what he was doing was wrong, but he decided to do it anyway because he had to get "steet cred" from his crew.

                        Shawne is a POS, and I could care less about how he has "changed" and "matured." He is actually a scary guy that I wouldn't want to be left in a room alone with him.
                        Especially after you called him a POS.
                        Passion. Pride. Patience. Pacers

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Shawne Williams

                          Wow! You post about a guy doing good and look what it turns to. I guess a lot people say didn't change is because THEY too have not changed. But some people can and do change, so unless you have a P.I. following Shawne how do you know he hasn't changed? My goodness.....
                          I'm not perfect and neither are you.

                          Romans 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the esteem of Elohim,
                          Ephisians 4: 32 And be kind towards one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, as Elohim also forgave you in Messiah.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Shawne Williams

                            Originally posted by oxxo View Post
                            How is that self contradicting? At all. It's not. He admits it was his fault he hung out with wrong people. The wrong people influenced him to do not so great things. They're completely separate things.

                            I'm sure the same could be said of many other people. Peresonally I had the same 'issue' (though not nearly to his degree) and I'd say the exact same thing.
                            I agree. Recognizing the reasons isn't the same as deflecting blame. "Hey, this toaster has a busted plug" doesn't mean it's a good idea to keep trying to make toast with it because it's "not its fault".

                            Shawne has issues that can be overcome by making tough changes, but which usually aren't made because the issues are explicitly that he was raised in a way that didn't give him the skill set to make changes of that nature. It's a catch 22.

                            Does that mean I want him staying at my place or back on the Pacers? **** no. I just think he's correctly identified his barriers which is one minor step toward overcoming them.



                            I'd almost like to seem him put it together just to justify my claims of his NBA talent. Like NapMenace I thought Shawne was extremely talented and his first year looked further along as an NBA player than Granger.



                            But I'm also in that camp that doesn't want to see our guys blow it here and figure it out someplace else. To be honest I don't think anyone's done that. Artest hasn't played better elsewhere and is still all over the map. He salvaged a disasterous playoff effort with some key plays. Jackson, a guy I actually like, continues to let the refs get in his head and to make horrible shot selections. Still waiting on Tins to prove anything to us, still waiting on JO to return to that all-star form.

                            Comment

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