The Rules of Pacers Digest

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Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

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"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

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We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

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In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

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If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

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When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

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Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

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The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on

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Winning basketball: Top 10 Underrated basketball traits/fundamentals

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  • Winning basketball: Top 10 Underrated basketball traits/fundamentals

    Way back in August of 2006, I started one of my favorite ever threads of my own creation on here about "overrated" things in basketball. Someone smarter than I am can link it if you wish, but here is a list of what my personal list was at the time:

    1. "Off floor chemistry"
    2. "Experience"
    3. The offseason coaching phrase "playing uptempo"
    4. "Time outs"
    5. "Halftime motivational pep talks"
    6. "Revenge" as a motivator.
    7. A players "confidence"
    8. Individual blocked shots.
    9. Made 3 point shots early in the game.
    10. The starting lineup.

    I might change or add to that original list today, but that is not what this thread is going to be about. Instead, I want to write about things/fundamentals/traits that I consider to be UNDERRATED in individual players and in an overall team and organizational perspective. Just like the many opinions that eminated from that thread, I hope this one creates alot of great discussions among us all. Here is my list as of today, with explanations of my reasoning for all:


    All the Ron Artest drama being brought back into the limelight after his trade to Houston has this famous coaching saying coming to my mind again: "Great players don't make great teams, great TEAMMATES do".

    What makes a great teammate? Someone who leads by example, is professional, and who cares more about the team and his teammates than himself. Someone who cares for the group as a whole and the entire organization and its fanbase. Someone who defends his teammates in public and handles problems behind closed doors. Someone who takes pride in winning the right way, and who treats the game itself with dignity, honor, and respect. Someone who does his job consistently, who works hard and comes to play every night, and is reliable, steady, and can be counted upon.

    In other words, everything Ron Artest is not.

    I guess Houston becomes more INTERESTING with acquiring Ron-Ron, and they are unquestionably more talented. But Houston, nor anyone else, can form a championship nucleus when relying on a player so troubled, tone deaf, selfish, and untrustworthy as Ron Artest.

    It is almost a sign of everything wrong with the world if a player who is a great teammate by all accounts (Shane Battier) loses playing time to the mercurial temperamental Artest. Of course, being the true pro that Battier is, he will no doubt continue to be the consummate role player for the Rockets, because he understands the right way to be on a winning team.

    Want a prediction from me? Artest and the Rockets are winners early in the season, getting lots of attention and accolades. Artest in a contract year gets off to a great start on and off the floor......then the selfishness, attention starvation, and greed will set in, and whining about his contract or looking forward to free agency will set in, and the Rockets will be torn apart. "The disease of me" is the condition Pat Riley so eloquently wrote about all those years ago, and Ron Artest carries and spreads that virus every where he goes.


    Ive come to believe that there are many many ways to coach basketball from a strategic standpoint successfully. We all have our favorite drills, favorite schemes, favorite plays, and overall philosophy on how best to do things. But by far the most important thing an organization can do is to create a successful "atmosphere for achievement", where doing the right thing and achieving goals is encouraged and expected without distraction or problems getting in the way.

    Great managers/coaches/business leaders do this instinctually. They weed out barriers their employees/players encounter, and make winning and success almost a natural occurance. This is done by having a singular purpose and belief system that filters down all through the organization.....the being able to get everyone to buy in to what you are trying to achieve and in the path to get there. It's imperative that your leaders set goals, set the agenda, and then give the players the tools and structure to get the job done.

    This is sometimes done on the coaching level, sometimes the "culture change" must occur in an organizationa/school/franchise/city collective mindset. I had lunch with a long time college and professional football coach once who told me that, in regards to college football, that winning wasnt just up to the individual coaching staff or players, but that first an individual school and campus must DECIDE to be winners, and to make it a priority to do so. I believe that to be true.

    Creating a positive winning crucial. This goes from the concept of how to fill the arena, to the music played, to the press coverage, to every single thing that occurs involving the team.


    This is one of the very best things that I like about Roy Hibbert being a Pacer, because when I watched him on film I thought defensively he talked to his teammates very well during play.

    Communicating with one another on the floor is very difficult for many individual players and teams to do well, because it does not come naturally at all. Being a good communicator is a SKILL that must be practiced, just like dribbling, shooting, or ballhandling. A clever coach always works some form of communication into every drill or meeting he has, to practice this skill and to make his players speak to one another on the floor.

    I always tell players and/or their parents that all day in school, teachers are trying to get their sons to be quiet and listen. But in my classroom (the gym floor) I want them to both be great at listening AND talking, sometimes at the same time.

    But, it isnt enough to just be communicating with one another, you have to be communicating EFFECTIVELY!

    From my vantagepoint watching the Pacers mostly on television but occasionally at the arena, I don't think they do communicate all that well with each other. I see some talking, but I also see resistance and confusion, especially defensively. Some basic communication skill practice might help our team more than we know.....things like the basic teaching principle of the "sandwich" method of influencing people: Encourage, correct/make your point, end on a positive.

    I'll be watching T.J. Ford in particularly in October, to see how he communicates with his new teammates. I havent seen TJ enough to know yet if this is correct, but I have always had the impression that he was a quiet, non verbal type player. The Pacers lack a perimeter player with charisma and a talkative nature otherwise, so TJ will need to bring that communication leadership to the table.

    The best teams always lead the league in chatter on the floor, as communicating positive things while the game is in progress is always a sign of a team that is in sync and "together", and this skill is one reason why I enjoyed the Celtics play so much this past season.


    A very underrated skill in an individual player and an overall team. Like communication, this must be practiced and learned and maintained. What good does a player do for your team if he plays well for 90% of the time, but drifts off and loses focus for the other 10%? Your team must learn to play the entire game, they must not let fatigue or other distractions get to them, and they must do this all the time. Concentration is a form of discipline, and it wanders in all of us from time to time. But teams must learn that concentration is a talent that can help them defeat more naturally talented opponents, and how crucial it is to not give away games or plays or end of quarter situations etc. You can't win with people who do the right thing most of the time, you need guys who concentrate and care enough to do it every time, or at least as close to that as humanly possible.


    This probably goes hand in hand with the others. Most individuals and teams will crack under heavy pressure or stress or for some other reason. One of the very best compliments one of my teams can get from opposing coaches is being relentless in our effort, or desire, or execution, or whatever. I also love hearing a player of mine or my entire team being referred to as "cold blooded". Maybe that isnt a great term to be known as a human being, but for a TEAM trying to achieve something, that is an awesome personality to have on your side.


    Getting into the bread and butter startegy sessions with younger coaches is always a fun thing for me to do. I've found that almost no one coaching at younger levels puts enough emphasis on this small yet critical aspect of successful offense. The angle that you set a screen at on a defender (does your screeners back face the ball or away from the ball?) often determines whether a cutter will get open or not. Lots of coaches teach the "setting" of the screen (stance, opening up to the ball, etc etc) but leave out where the screener should be facing and his feet positioning to be the utmost effective.

    The Pacers really struggled from a screen angle standpoint under Rick Carlisle, particularly in his last season. When we had great talent individually it wasnt as much of an issue, but as his talent pool dried up, his lack of attention to these tiny details finally did creep up. Many of his set offensive plays created bad screen angles for cutters to come off of, which (if any one reading this wants to search for) was criticized on by Dr Jack Ramsey during that period.

    I think the poor screen angle teaching is very widespread by the way, and it is all over the NBA, college, high school, and youth coaching communities. I'm looking forward to the Olympic games next week to see some of the European teams try and combat our superior talent and athleticism with superior strategic moves.....and one of those moves will be to costantly make themselves harder to guard by being better screeners than our defenders are used to playing against.


    Forgetting team defense for a moment (which I consider to be a bit overrated), a singular dominant individual defender along the perimeter affects the game so many ways it is unbelievable!

    Think about how many hidden ways a great point guard defender can help you. You can pressure the ball up court, causing extra fatigue for your opponent, limiting communication between the ballhandler and his coach, making teams run simply and less complex plays against you. You cause them to waste time getting into their sets, which eventually may lead to them having to make one less pass per possession. On a more mental level, it sets your identity as a team as one being tough minded, "relentless" (as I said before, an awesome thing to be known as), and unyielding.

    A great wing defender can deny a teams first pass, which almost all team offense originates from. A great wing defender can stop or slow down the opponents best player, freeing your other 4 guys to not to have to do that task collectively. A great wing defender wins you close games in the closing seconds more than a great scorer will, because great defenders don't have off nights. On a mental level, an awesome shutdown wingman can frustrate the opponents top gun, causing the other players on the floor to lose their rhythm and spirit, and to try and fill roles they are incapable of filling.....which often leads to dissension in the ranks, creating chaos and making the atmosphere of winning difficult to maintain for the opponent.


    It is one thing to be hurt, unable to play until you heal. That is part of sports, and it is something every team deals with. But you cannot be successful relying on guys who play, then sit, then play for a few games, then sit a couple, etc etc.

    No team can be win that way. You can have guys miss time, but it is impossible for your coaching staff and team to develop any thoughts of cohesion when your entire strategy and rotations change from game to game because who is available is always in doubt.

    This is where talent loses against reliability in my view. 80 games of a "B" level player is more conducive to winning than an on/off again performance of an "A" player. Someone once said that 50% of success in life is showing up.......your guys have to show up consistently and actually PLAY if you are going to go anywhere.

    Guys with nagging injuries constantly being nursed? It is very difficult to win with players like that, no matter how good they may be when they play for you.


    While occasionally at younger levels it is actually a positive coaching trait to have your team foul the opponent more than they foul you (it shows a tendency to be aggressive defensively usually), at the pro level, one of the easiest ways to win games is to get to the foul line more than your opponents. I think you can achieve this from either direction.....either concentrate on getting to the line alot YOURSELF, or to prevent your opponent from going.

    Our Pacers lost this category alot last season, which negated some of the other things they did well. In particularly, a point of emphasis for us this season needs to be to not get so many defensive three second calls, which cost us quite a few points last year........and had other disadvantages too, such as the stoppage of play allowing our opponents coach to call a better play, to be able to sub against us, to rest slightly, etc etc.

    10. HARD FOULS

    I am not advocating anything dirty or even close to it, but the Pacers could relaly use a dose of toughness and physicality inside. We lack an enforcer, a bruiser, who can set bonecrushing screens and can take a hard foul when necessary. We could use a LaSalle Thompson, Dale Davis, Rick Mahorn, Charles Oakley type guy to play occasionally in situations where needed.

    Teams have no one to fear physically on the Pacers roster.....that needs to change somehow, and we shouldn't be shy about admitting it or doing something about it.

    I'd love to hear all of your thoughts of this list, and to see what additions you all would make to it.

    As always, the above was just my opinion.


  • #2
    Re: Winning basketball: Top 10 Underrated basketball traits/fundamentals

    As always, a great read. I'd love to hear how to evaluate the screen angles. I'll be honest...I've watched basketball my whole life, but I haven't been "schooled" in it. A lot of what I understand, I understand instinctively. I could use some more tools on how to watch the game with a more critical eye.


    • #3
      Re: Winning basketball: Top 10 Underrated basketball traits/fundamentals

      So tell me do you REALLY feel about Artest?
      Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.


      • #4
        Re: Winning basketball: Top 10 Underrated basketball traits/fundamentals

        those are actually overrated compared to 2 I can think of:

        1. TALENT

        2. JOCK STRAPS


        • #5
          Re: Winning basketball: Top 10 Underrated basketball traits/fundamentals

          Originally posted by count55 View Post
          As always, a great read. I'd love to hear how to evaluate the screen angles. I'll be honest...I've watched basketball my whole life, but I haven't been "schooled" in it. A lot of what I understand, I understand instinctively. I could use some more tools on how to watch the game with a more critical eye.

          Thanks for reading and participating, as always.

          I probably could have done a better job explaining what I mean in the original post, so let me answer your question now.

          Here are some general rules about screen angles/feet position when screening away from the ball:

          1. When setting a "downscreen", which is moving from the top of the court toward the baseline generally speaking, you want your screener's back to be to directly to the ball. You want your screener's "inside" foot (the foot closer to the lane line) to be the lead foot, driving your feet right between the feet of the defender you are screening, in order to "pin him hard". Driving your feet this way and setting the screen at this angle causes the defender to have move more to avoid the screener, creating more space for your cutter.....when the angle is wrong (as many coaches teach poorly), the defender has space to "slide thru" between the passer and the cutter. This in turn usually makes the cutter "fade" toward the baseline, making the pass longer and slower, and giving the defender more time to recover to a potential catch and shoot.

          One of my major pet peeves is Jeff Foster's inability to grasp this concept. Jeff does the exact opposite of everything I just described when setting baseline screens for people.....often to try and make up for that weakness he moves.......which only leads to either he or the cutter being called for an offensive foul.

          2. When setting a "crossscreen", which is moving from one side of the lane to the other, the same rules apply. The proper angle for the screener is for his back to be directly facing the passer.

          3. When setting a "backscreen" (a screen coming outward from the baseline to the perimeter) the proper angle is to have your screener's back facing the rim in a direct line.

          The very best team in the league at screening is by far the Utah Jazz, and it is probably why I enjoy watching them play offense so much from a teachnical standpoint. Their screeners get great angles, really play physically, then do the league's best job at "pivoting" off of a very physical screen, opening up to the ball and recieving a pass, taking advantage of a switching or confused defense.

          With a little bit better defense, Utah is good enough to win it all I think, starting this year.


          • #6
            Re: Winning basketball: Top 10 Underrated basketball traits/fundamentals

            For down screens, cross screens, and back screens, how do you teach players to properly pivot after correctly setting the pick?


            • #7
              Re: Winning basketball: Top 10 Underrated basketball traits/fundamentals

              When is the precise moment a moving screen should be called? When are you allowed to move?


              • #8
                Re: Winning basketball: Top 10 Underrated basketball traits/fundamentals

                Originally posted by Hicks View Post
                For down screens, cross screens, and back screens, how do you teach players to properly pivot after correctly setting the pick?

                Great question. I wish I had some video to show you, but instead Ill just try and type it out....hopefully it will make sense to you.

                After setting a proper screen at the proper angle, the screener generally would want to make himself available for a pass. To do that most effectively, the screener needs to be able to turn in such a way that will prevent the defender guarding him from intercepting the pass.

                To do this, the screener can't just turn around in a normal way. Instead, he needs to "reverse pivot" (take his leg BEHIND his body and turn that way) to prevent the defender from being in front of he can recieve a pass with room to manuever.

                The same thing happens on an ideally executed ballscreen/roll situation. The screener in that case doesnt just turn and run to the basket, he is supposed to "reverse pivot" to pin his man behind him in a trailing position, then head to the rim.

                Proper footwork puts the defender in a bad position to guard you initially, and gives you the advantage.

                By the way, Jermaine O'Neal had particularly bad footwork in this situation. His athleticism sometimes let him overcome it, but he used to just "skinny turn" toward the basketball instead of reverse pivoting, enabling the man guarding him to recover better, and make it more difficult for JO to score. Jeff Foster has some of the same problems still today, which infuriates me too, except he isnt a scorer anyway so him not turning correctly to recieve a pass isnt as big a deal as it was when JO butchered it.

                Many youth players after they screen want to immediately turn their heads like JO did, and just turn around with no power, force, or strong base because they are anxious to see what is happening......their uncomfortableness (is that a word?) with playing the game while not seeing the basketball with their own eyes creates this issue.

                Carlos Boozer, both at Duke and especially now with Utah, is extremely good at this skill.Deron Williams often has the ball in the air toward Boozer after Carlos sets a screen before he even turns, knowing he will turn the proper way, recieve his pass and score in the paint against a slow reacting defense.

                It is all about the proper fundamentals and reading the situation. JO's offensive game had so much wasted one will ever know whether it was his own obstinance, lack of college coaching, lack of fundamentals as a youth, or Portland and Indiana's own lack of teaching skills and player development that hurt him in this fundamental skill set.


                • #9
                  Re: Winning basketball: Top 10 Underrated basketball traits/fundamentals

                  How can our players use screens better?


                  • #10
                    Re: Winning basketball: Top 10 Underrated basketball traits/fundamentals

                    While seeing it in front of me is still preferred, I think I can "see" what you are saying in my mind. Thanks.

                    Oh, and instead of, "uncomfortableness," may I suggest discomfort?


                    • #11
                      Re: Winning basketball: Top 10 Underrated basketball traits/fundamentals

                      Originally posted by Hicks View Post
                      While seeing it in front of me is still preferred, I think I can "see" what you are saying in my mind. Thanks.

                      Oh, and instead of, "uncomfortableness," may I suggest discomfort?

                      I'm like Jay Bilas on draft night.....I make up my own words sometimes.


                      • #12
                        Re: Winning basketball: Top 10 Underrated basketball traits/fundamentals

                        Bilas' draft night performances are truly scrumtralescent.


                        • #13
                          Re: Winning basketball: Top 10 Underrated basketball traits/fundamentals

                          good gods, number 1 has to be boxing out. After watching JO all these years... I sure hope Hibbert knows what he is doing. That is the NUMBER 1 fundamental that kids are taught in every good basketball camp in indiana, but yet it is such a weakness in so many player's over all game.


                          • #14
                            Re: Winning basketball: Top 10 Underrated basketball traits/fundamentals

                            Boxing out is overrated in my opinion.


                            • #15
                              Re: Winning basketball: Top 10 Underrated basketball traits/fundamentals

                              Agree with BR, consistent boxing out is key to defensive success and too often not given any shrift.
                              I'd rather die standing up than live on my knees.

                              -Emiliano Zapata