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Lord Helmet
01-17-2005, 10:13 AM
Well let me start off by saying I am very depressed about this season.I actaully think I am more pissed than sad.Just the fact that we didn't play "Colts football" and we got our asses stomped again.Yes, the New England Patriots are the Colts Daddys.Well this year brought hope but in the end the same exact thing happened our season was ended by the Pats.

What kind of changes do you guys want to see take place in the offseason?I think we will get some defensive guys maybe make the D a bit larger.And I have heard that we will draft all D in the draft which yes I think we should.

Freeagents
Well we have Edge who has been rumored to be tagged.And then I think we have some OLinemen and we have Vandy.I really kind of hope Vandy can stay because they aren't that many good kickers in the NFL.Look at the Jets' :puke:
Coaching
I don't think we need to fire anyone.I just think that they should have came up with a way better gameplan.


I couldn't find a complete list of all the freeagents.But I do know we still have some key FA we need to re-sign.

DisplacedKnick
01-17-2005, 11:01 AM
I'd let the Edge go myself. This is probably sacrilege but 1,000-yard running backs are a dime-a-dozen any more. Generally RB's don't have a huge shelf life either, Curtis Martin & Dillon to the contrary. I'd use the money you save there on linebacking. The D-Line isn't bad but the 'backers, other than Morris, need work.

I'd also make a decision between Marcus Pollard and Dallas Clark. As receivers they're redundant though Pollard's better on deep balls. Figure which one you want to go with.

Part of my gripe with the Edge is I've never seen a guy NOT fight for yards like he doesn't. Yesterday he seemed awful willing to hug the ground whenever there was much contact. I think it was a screen pass where he gained about 20 but went out of bounds pretty much without being touched. Guranteed if he'd driven his shoulder into the D-back he could have gotten another 4-5 yards and that was the only guy within 10 yards - a cutback and he might get another 15.

Lord Helmet
01-17-2005, 12:55 PM
Well I do agree that we need D.But I am sure that we will keep Edge and I am fine with that.Just please get some D.We have to be at least B+ on each side of the ball to win a Super Bowl.I like our run D but I hate the pass D it is pathetic.I think Edge is a good power runner when he goes straight up the middle and you think he is down he kind of slides and picks up another 2-3 more yards.God I hate talking about the offseason.I wish Peyton could have saved a few of his TD passes from the regular season for the postseason clearly he didn't need all of them :laugh: I need NBA League Pass now :( DAMN INSIGHT.

RA231
01-17-2005, 04:15 PM
I'd use the money you save there on linebacking. The D-Line isn't bad but the 'backers, other than Morris, need work.

I'd also make a decision between Marcus Pollard and Dallas Clark. As receivers they're redundant though Pollard's better on deep balls. Figure which one you want to go with.

.

Other tha Morris? He is the worst linebacker we have IMO. Thornton is solid, and June decent in pass coverage, can tackle, and is fast. Morris sucks in pass coverage, cant tackle, and isnt real athletic. Pollard is gone, that is an easy one.

RA231
01-17-2005, 04:19 PM
I hope we dont re-sign James, but re-sign Rhodes, then draft a guy like Eric Shelton out of Louisville in the 2nd round. Have Shelton and Rhodes split the carries next year. We are more of a pssing team anyways, and Im not real impressed with James as of late. We can use the money on defense. With the 1st rounder draft Justin Miller(CB) out of Clemson. And with the 3rd round pick use it on Robert McCune a MLB out of Louisville.

obnoxiousmodesty
01-17-2005, 04:31 PM
The Colts defense would improve dramatically if they could sign or draft playmakers at the nose tackle or middle linebacker positions. The defense needs someone near the line of scrimmage who can go blow up the other team consistently. As of now, the Colts' front seven are average while the secondary is mediocre. An above average front seven could really help out that poor secondary. I don't think Bob Sanders should be near the lead in tackles every week, but with this defense he becomes a tackling machine.

I actually think Edge is a great running back. He's an above average runner, can catch passes out of the backfield, and is a great blocker. However, if the team could save money while not giving up performance at the RB position, I'd be willing to let him walk.

The team is not terribly far from being a Super Bowl team; however, they must continue to improve those areas in need.

realtyczar
01-17-2005, 04:36 PM
I still think that Edge has yards left in him. Rhodes is not the back that Edge is. We have seen that in several games. With that said, Great Blue North, my favorite draft site says we will draft a RB.

29 Indianapolis *DeAngelo Williams RB Memphis
60 Indianapolis Antonio Perkins CB Oklahoma

I would like to see some changes. A Wide body for nose tackle, Sanders in preseason, a "Julius Peppers" type player. And a new Defensive coordinator. Meeks had to dummy down our defense because of all of our injuries. Maybe he took it too far.

I think we will lose Pollard. I i'm okay with that. We have Clark, Hertsock and Utuecht (sp) who will be healthy(?). I really hope we can keep Reggie Wayne.

Bball
01-17-2005, 04:36 PM
I'm not sure the coaching staff is truly sold on this approach we are following. I know I'm not sold on it. By that I mean so overbalancing the offense to the defense.

Dungy may not be the best coach for this type of system. That said, I'm not sure this type of system is really geared for playoff success. But, if you are going to go down this path you need a coach who is willing to get behind it and go with it. That means going for it on 4th down in some situations where you might rather play a field position game. That means a more wide open attack when you'd rather play a grind it out football game and not risk TO's to a team that makes you pay for them.

While I can understand not wanting to risk field position and grinding things out, what does it matter if the other team can march down the field anyway?

It's almost what Jeff Fischer was saying about playing the Colts when he tried to get gimmicky because he knew he couldn't stop the Colts. The Colts know they can't stop the other team consistently so the coaching should be willing to take some risks on offense because your odds are higher than putting your fate into the hands of your defense. And if your gamble fails then you are probably no worse that where you'd been anyway except you haven't allowed the other team to chew up clock and wear out your defense getting there.

That said, I'd address the defense but if I'm going to continue down this path with this system then I would have to rethink my coaching staff.

-Bball

ChicagoJ
01-17-2005, 05:13 PM
I'm trying to decide if I'd rather lie and tell you you've got a great system or tell you the truth and say that you've got a great coach but your GM, with the style of team he's assembled, is setting him up for failure every year in the playoffs.

You do need a different RB - one that's more bruising and less elusive. I've always thought James was the perfect 'third-down back' but he's not physical enough, in my opinion, to be the 'featured back.'

Obnox hit the nail on the head - you need a NG like Casey Hampton (and, no, you can't have HIM), a guy that requires triple teams every time your opponent runs the ball, freeing up your linebackers to do thier jobs - make plays behind the line of scrimmage. I'd be willing to sacrifice some sacks from your DL for that (you'd end up with more sack, long-term, those sack would just be spread among your LBs instead).

I'm not giving any more of Dick LeBeau's secrets away here, you'll just have to watch Sunday. :devil:

ChicagoJ
01-17-2005, 05:21 PM
But seriously, look at each of the two AFC defenses that advances last weekend. Each team only allowed three points to offenses that are capable of putting up much, much more. (The Steelers offense gave up a TD on a return and thier special teams gave up a TD on a return, making the score much closer than it *should* have been, based solely on the way the Steelers dominated the line of scrimmage.

Bball
01-17-2005, 05:35 PM
Jay,
You don't have to convince me. The Colts' system is simply not going to win the biggest of games IMHO. That means we'll always have to go thru somebody else's place to get to the SB because we'll get a couple of costly reg season losses and lose homefield.

And our team can't compete with the likes of the Pats on their own turf and the odds only get slightly better on our own turf.

And IMHO the Pats system is so good that it isn't like we are waiting for a Pat retirement or players jumping ship for $$$ elsewhere. The system will still work.

The Colts must change their approach and build a team to beat the Patriots and their ilk (that type system) or we're destined to see this same scenario unfold over and over. And beat them on a snowy, blustery winter day.... Beat them on a day where our offense isn't clicking...

I let my optimisim get ahead of me heading into the playoffs but I've been saying for the past few years we cannot continue fielding these patchwork defenses and expect it to be enough. I should've just listened to myself to begin with.

-Bball

ChicagoJ
01-17-2005, 06:00 PM
Somehow, I started out trying to make the point that James is the one guy on offense you should replace, and by the time I was done editing it, I guess I was 'preaching to the chior'. Ooops.

Lord Helmet
01-17-2005, 06:06 PM
Somehow, I started out trying to make the point that James is the one guy on offense you should replace, and by the time I was done editing it, I guess I was 'preaching to the chior'. Ooops.
If we did let him go which I would hope we would trade him rather than letting him walk.For who?Someone earlier in the season said trade him to Miami for Zach Thomas or someone on their D.

RA231
01-17-2005, 06:33 PM
Franchise him. Trade him to the Dolphins for a 2nd and 5th rounders. I think there's sort of a precedent for that...............

That sounds good to me.

Lord Helmet
01-17-2005, 07:58 PM
Well here are most of the Colts free agents.

Colts



Gary Brackett LB RFA

Joseph Jefferson CB RFA

Donald Strickland CB RFA

Idrees Bashir FS UFA

Cory Bird SS UFA

Raheem Brock DE UFA

Rick DeMulling OG UFA

Ryan Diem OT UFA

Nick Harper CB UFA



Edgerrin James RB UFA

Rob Morris LB UFA

James Mungro RB UFA

Jim Nelson LB UFA

Tupe Peko OG UFA

Dominic Rhodes RB UFA

David Thornton LB UFA

Troy Walters WR UFA

obnoxiousmodesty
01-17-2005, 09:17 PM
Wow, that is one long list, many of which are current starters. This offseason is going to be quite interesting.

Lord Helmet
01-17-2005, 09:32 PM
Yeah, a lot of people on that list we need to keep.

birdman
01-17-2005, 10:17 PM
Can an ESPN Insider subscriber please post the article on "Whispers Around the NFL"? The headline on it is about Edge.

birdman
01-17-2005, 10:19 PM
We need to make sure the O-line comes back and David Thornton and Nick Harper. Not too worried about the rest.

Bball
01-17-2005, 10:37 PM
Team observers aren't 100 percent convinced RB Edgerrin James will be in Indianapolis for the 2005 season. The Colts have said they plan to keep James, but the option to use the team's franchise designation and trade James remains a possibility. Remember, Colts president Bill Polian traded Marshall Faulk for draft picks.

Is this what you saw... or more than you saw?

-Bball

DisplacedKnick
01-17-2005, 10:53 PM
Team observers aren't 100 percent convinced RB Edgerrin James will be in Indianapolis for the 2005 season. The Colts have said they plan to keep James, but the option to use the team's franchise designation and trade James remains a possibility. Remember, Colts president Bill Polian traded Marshall Faulk for draft picks.

Is this what you saw... or more than you saw?

-Bball

For someone with more knowledge of the NFL salary cap, How many franchise players does each team get?

obnoxiousmodesty
01-17-2005, 10:56 PM
For someone with more knowledge of the NFL salary cap, How many franchise players does each team get?
One franchise tag per year.

DisplacedKnick
01-17-2005, 11:35 PM
One franchise tag per year.

Thought that was it. As long as they tag Freeney when his deal's up.

realtyczar
01-18-2005, 01:19 PM
Franchise him. Trade him to the Dolphins for a 2nd and 5th rounders. I think there's sort of a precedent for that...............
I would be all for that. The problem is that then you have to draft a RB in the first round. You are going to pay a rookie running back for what you could sign Edge for! Yes you get fresher legs, but Edge doesmore than just run, he blocks, VERY IMPORTANT and catches passes.

Now if you do trade him and get a 2nd & 5th, then you can take your 2 seconds and draft defense, which is not a bad idea. (Don't take defense in first roung, they hardly ever work out.) I like getting a CB with one, maybe even both picks with the 2-2nd round picks.

The question is, do we really want a rookie running back?

Also, I don't think Miami has a 2nd round Pick. I think it went to the Eagles for their QB!

Second Round

Philadelphia from Miami (QB AJ Feeley)

The Phins don't have a 2nd round! Next team?

DisplacedKnick
01-18-2005, 03:51 PM
Don't forget you have Rhodes. He gained over 1000 yards in about 10 games the year Edge was injured, he's younger and his yards/carry ave for his career is higher than Edge has ever averaged in a season. From what I remember he's a solid blocker too.

I'm not saying he's as good as James but I also don't think the drop-off is as much as a lot of people think.

realtyczar
01-18-2005, 04:29 PM
I don't have a problem treading Edge. Personally I like him, maybe not as good as Faulk or Dickerson or Bently that we have had.

Rhodes is an okay back. I still think we need a speed burner. Remember Edge just doesn't run the ball, he blocks A LOT and can catch and run. I would love to have Carnell "Cadilac" Williams, but he won't last that long, 19th pick in the first round. The other problem is that what ever back we draft will want "edge" money. Do we pay for an untested back? Whick is what we would have to do if we trade Edge.

I would like to see us change our Offensive scheme. Maybe less passing, more running and more ball control. That is the way that the Patriots won. Not having the defense play 2/3 of the game will make them better when rested. (Remember these are big guys and they need more than a 2 minutes breather.) They were just worn out by the end of the game. Though our running game sucked against the Pats.

I know this is going against everything the Colts have done for the last few years. The problem is that our Offense isn't suited for that. We don't run full backs as lead blockers, we use TE's. I don't think our TE's are the size of a FB.

Franchise Edge, then trade him. Use the 2 picks for Defense. Polian has this way of drafting quality defense in the later rounds. Use our first pick for a Running Back, and Second round picks for a corner and a WR if we can't keep Reggie Wayne.

RA231
01-18-2005, 04:44 PM
Yes Miami does not have a 2nd round pick. I think Edge would be worth more than that now that I think about. If AJ was worth a 2nd round pick, the edge would be worth like a 1st and a 4th.

RA231
01-18-2005, 04:46 PM
From what I remember he's a solid blocker too.



Not really, and he isnt a good catcher either.

RA231
01-18-2005, 04:47 PM
Marshall Faulk in his prime was worth only 2nd and 5th rounders. Why? Contract fears. Same thing with Edge. Though any team trading for him would come to an agreement first, the Colts wouldn't exactly be able to hold any team hostage given the huge amount of talented veteran running backs who will be availible this off-season.


Yeah I didnt really think about that. I jsut thought about the talent levels between Feely and James.

Lord Helmet
01-18-2005, 05:41 PM
Is Reggie Wayne a FA???? :shudder: KEEP HIM

Lord Helmet
01-18-2005, 06:05 PM
No.
:dance:

realtyczar
01-18-2005, 07:39 PM
My mistake. Reggie is NOT a free agent. However all of our running backs are!

Cory Bird
SS
UFA

David Thornton
LB
UFA

Dominic Rhodes
RB
UFA

Donald Strickland
CB
RFA

Edgerrin James
RB
UFA

Gary Brackett
LB
RFA

Idrees Bashir
FS
UFA

James Mungro
RB
UFA

Jim Nelson
LB
UFA

Joseph Jefferson
CB
RFA

Nick Harper
CB
UFA

Raheem Brock
DE
UFA

Rick DeMulling
OG
UFA

Rob Morris
LB
UFA

Ryan Diem
OT
UFA

Troy Walters
WR
UFA

Tupe Peko
OG
UFA

RA231
01-18-2005, 08:27 PM
Thornton is a RFA not a UFA.

DisplacedKnick
01-18-2005, 08:33 PM
Not really, and he isnt a good catcher either.

Funny that the Colts use him to return kickoffs then.

Natston
01-18-2005, 08:49 PM
Even funnier that my heart stops every time he's back there........and not in the Dante Hall kind of way.........


Exactly. I was very critical of his decision making on returning kicks this year. I have many requests for next year but I'd be content with an least one good to great CB that can play a whole season and doesn't have to play 29 yards off the WR and one big nasty run blocking mofo on the oline that can be physical... :buddies:

realtyczar
01-18-2005, 10:00 PM
Thornton is a RFA not a UFA.
I got this off of www.coltshistory.com

BigDawg44
01-18-2005, 10:51 PM
If we did let him go which I would hope we would trade him rather than letting him walk.For who?Someone earlier in the season said trade him to Miami for Zach Thomas or someone on their D.

That same person said we should trade him to the rams for S. Jackson and something more.....but that was also shot down.

Lord Helmet
01-18-2005, 10:56 PM
That same person said we should trade him to the rams for S. Jackson and something more.....but that was also shot down.
Did that "same person" happen to be you? ;)

BigDawg44
01-18-2005, 10:58 PM
Did that "same person" happen to be you? ;)


only if it was a good idea