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Kid Minneapolis
02-14-2013, 11:35 AM
http://espn.go.com/chicago/nba/story/_/id/8946403/derrick-rose-chicago-bulls-says-there-chance-return-season

Alright, so I posted my thoughts about him a few years ago and generally got lambasted, and I understan why, because my thoughts about him, like my thoughts about RG3 in the Colts forum, go against popular wisdom and sentiment.... but my thoughts 2 years ago were basically summarized thus (I can't find the original thread):

There were a lot of indicators (to me) that pointed to me that DRose's reign as a dominant player were likely to end sooner than later. Namely two factors:

1) His physical, aggressive style of play. It's impressive... it gets results --- and I said at the time that I cannot fathom a scenario in which his body can hold it up. Something was going to give (it did). It was unfortunate that it happened, and I never once wished it upon him, it was just an observation, and the history of athletes who play in that manner. He pushed himself beyond any player I've seen, to be honest.. and was often playing with any number of minor tweaks and ailments. I know this is common, but DRose seemed to be plagued more than typical. And his game is completely based off speed, acceleration, strength, and jumping... an injury to a major part would limit him.

2) Comments that he has made here and there point to someone who not only didn't want the spotlight, but even seemed to despise it. He was a... not even a reluctant superstar... but a.... what's the word..... someone who doesn't even want to be what it is that everyone is claiming him to be (a superstar). He made comments back then that I pointed to and everyone responded with, "Oh whatever dude he's a killer he'll dominate this league for years to come".

And so now this article comes out. This guy is now saying that he may not be back this year. Which I guess isn't in itself a big revelation or huge surprise, I had said last year I doubted he'd play this year, and I personally would've been surprised if he did... I think the Adrian Peterson recovery situation raised everyone's expectations unrealistically. Although I know people at the time said DRose was a freak who would recover quickly and likely play this season and possibly even start the season... But that's neither here nor there. My issue is not that he won't play this year. My concern is in the words that he chose to express it --- again:


I'm feeling good, but like I said, if it's where it's taking me a long time and I'm still not feeling right, I don't mind missing this year.

So wait... he's feeling good. He's practicing 5 on 5.... but "I don't mind", seems to indicate there's more than a physical reason for him not playing this year. I'm no psychologist, but I did sleep at a Holiday Inn Express last night. These words he chose to use are what I would categorize as a flag... maybe not a big huge RED flag, but it's yet another yellow flag,at least to me. He's an enigma, emotionally and mentally. I've watched this kid break down and cry in press conferences over seemingly innocuous circumstances... make statements that he's just not all that big on his place in this game, etc... I can't quite put my finger on it, but there is something there not quite right.

Feel free to debate this, I don't mind, I know it's just my opinion, but DRose is a puzzle to me.

Since86
02-14-2013, 11:40 AM
As much as I would love to pile on, he also said he couldn't dunk right now. That points to phsyical. His entire game is built around his freakish athleticism, and if that's not anywhere close to where it needs to be, him saying he's not ready is an indication of good decision making and intelligence, IMHO.

Might be the only time I'll say that regarding DRose.

But that does lead right into the "he'll never be the same" although I think the expectations of a recovery in 9-10 months isn't all that reasonable to begin with. It's possible, but it shouldn't be the expected norm.

Kid Minneapolis
02-14-2013, 11:43 AM
Oh I agree, he likely isn't physically ready, and I don't doubt that... but my point is his choice of words. The way to put this if I were him, would've been "I'm working my hardest to be back, I'm not quite there yet, but my goal is to be back". You know.. toe the company line. Instead... "I don't mind missing the year"? That's.... whoo boy.

Trader Joe
02-14-2013, 11:45 AM
Him not being able to dunk yet really struck me. Man, it's a little crazy to think about, but what if Rose is just one of those guys who never gets it back?

vnzla81
02-14-2013, 11:46 AM
The guy is saying that he is not able to dunk yet, that means he is not 100% not only that but he knows he is not going to win anything this year so there is not reason for him to come back early, I would do the same thing if I was him or any other athlete with similar issues.

Kid Minneapolis
02-14-2013, 11:49 AM
Yea, we get that vnzl, he has physical limitations at the moment... but it's not really what I'm driving at here.

Mac_Daddy
02-14-2013, 12:05 PM
Let him have his time to get back to 100%. I wouldn't rush him, especially if he thinks he isn't ready.

Hicks
02-14-2013, 12:15 PM
I think it's too easy to read too much into a person's choice of words / see something that isn't actually there. Typically you can only rely on that 'read' when you have a large body of evidence (comprised of other things the person has said) that supports this specific 'read'. I'm going to give Rose the benefit of the doubt.

King Tuts Tomb
02-14-2013, 12:16 PM
I was kind of mystified at the praise Rose was getting a couple years ago. (Edit to clarify: praise about his personality I meant. The basketball related praise I understood) You constantly heard about his relentlessness and heart and intensity but I never heard him say anything remotely interesting. He makes Kobe and LeBron looked like Sammy Davis Jr and Dean Martin by comparison. I don't blame him, he just seemed like a normal, boring jock. How he got a rep as the ultimate assassin I never really figured out. It seemed like everyone wanted so badly to have another player to replace LeBron, who was despised at the time, that they built up Rose into something he's not.

Having said that, I disagree with you Kid Min that there is something to be gleaned from his statement. I think it's more a reflection of where we are in sports that athletes and teams understand that an athlete taking one year off isn't that big a deal anymore. Careers last a lot longer than they did before. Teams are smarter about rushing players back and there isn't the stigma that there once was about taking games off when you're injured.

Rose doesn't mind missing a year because missing a year doesn't end your career anymore, it prolongs it. I think the fact that both sides understand this is a real step in the right direction. I wish football teams and players understood the same.

Goyle
02-14-2013, 12:41 PM
Way too easy to read into what people say these days. He's reserved when he speaks to the media. "I don't mind missing the year" is probably just the first thing that came to his mind, the dude has to be aching to play, to think he isn't is crazy.

15th parallel
02-14-2013, 12:54 PM
I think Rose is just making careful decisions when he said he doesn't mind missing this season. His injury is bad enough that there's some mental trauma that I'm seeing from the messages he's relaying to the media. He relies heavily on his speed, quickness and jumping ability, and if he's not yet fully recovered both physically and mentally, chances are he'll play so reserved out there or he might make his injury worse, ruining his career in the long run.

Anyway, I don't think of him really as a dominant player, even at his MVP season. He's very good against most of his matchups, but not dominant as media portrays him to be. Of course, he's still one of the best players out there until proven otherwise.

Ace E.Anderson
02-14-2013, 01:13 PM
Do you not remember the whole "I will never forget the way they celebrated" BS? D.Rose is very much so a killer.

I don't like the dude, but to play the way he plays (played) you have to have some killer in you. Him saying "I don't mind missing this year" says to me that he's wrapped his head around coming back 100%. He would rather miss an entire year and come back as good as before, than risk coming back less than 100% and end up being the next Penny Hardaway.

All in all, I think you're looking into his wording a little too much. Is D.Rose shy? Yes. Is he a guy that doesn't want the "spotlight". Sure. But judging by the way he plays, the dude is a straight competitor--a killer even. Just may be a little on the sensitive side.

TinManJoshua
02-14-2013, 01:29 PM
Derrick Rose may have shied away from the spotligh, but in his pre-draft interviews he was asked what he liked the least about college ball, his answer? "Losing."

I don't care if he doesn't "want" to be a superstar. He wants to win and that's more important.

naptownmenace
02-14-2013, 01:39 PM
How he got a rep as the ultimate assassin I never really figured out.

It was from all those tough game winning shots he hit against Rondo and the Celtics back during that 7 game series and against the Pacers a few years ago. He didn't win MVP because he was a passive player.

With the way that he attacks the rim and uses his athleticism, I can't blame him for not wanting to play until he's back to that level again. Playing through injuries was probably what led to him blowing out his knee in the first place. He's still young so there's no need to rush things. As we see with David West, it took about 15 months or so before he was back to his pre-torn ACL form.

Magic Johnson said the same thing nearly 2 weeks ago on ESPN. He said, the Bulls aren't going to win a Championship this year. Take the rest of the season to continue rehab and then start next season at full-strength.

ilive4sports
02-14-2013, 01:52 PM
From a fan of basketball, taking the Pacers/Bulls rivalry out of it, he should sit the year out. He relies so much on his speed and athleticism and if his knee really isn't 100% he won't be nearly as effective. The Bulls will be better off from it too. Look at West last year compared to this year. That extra year of healing does wonders.

clownskull
02-14-2013, 06:54 PM
I think it's too easy to read too much into a person's choice of words / see something that isn't actually there. Typically you can only rely on that 'read' when you have a large body of evidence (comprised of other things the person has said) that supports this specific 'read'. I'm going to give Rose the benefit of the doubt.

agreed. i don't see him as a slacker who doesn't really care one way or another. i think he knows he is still a ways off from where he needs to be. and as far as others wondering if he is one of those guys who doesn't regain the freakish ability he once showed- it is possible as these major injuries are a case by case scenario.

Major Cold
02-14-2013, 07:01 PM
Too bad the Bulls don't suck without him.

Coopdog23
02-14-2013, 07:24 PM
Too bad the Bulls don't suck without him.

They have one of the best coaching staffs in the league which keeps them disciplined

Sandman21
02-14-2013, 07:36 PM
Too bad the Bulls don't suck without him.

I wouldn't be surprised to see them fade down the stretch though.

RLeWorm
02-14-2013, 07:50 PM
D. Rose is on a mission. He wants to bring a championship back to Chicago. U don't ever see him laughing or playing around like Lebron and stuff. I remember last year when Lebron and Melo were dancing and Rose just stood up there with a blank stare. He just looks at the big picture.

ChicagoJ
02-15-2013, 07:43 PM
I think if you want to read too much into his words, you might want whoever took his ACT for him to help get them out those words out in the first place. Maybe Calipari can find that person for you.

He's a fierce competitor. On the court, he sees what is going on quite well.

But I wouldn't consider him to be a master of the English language so I wouldn't spend too much time trying to translate "what he said" and "what he meant" because I'm not sure that he's concerned at all about a literal or assumed translation of his words.

He's been cursed with unrealistic expecatations about when he'd be back to 100%. I don't mean just stepping on the court ready to contribute to a team but actually being back 100%. But I don't think he has enough mastery of the English language to put it out there that way. He probably only knows one definition of "coming back from injury" and that is when he's ready to play in the way he expects himself to play. Not just "good enough to be back out there", which is what the absurd predictions of a quick return were really based on.

Even professional writers - the ones would couldn't play the game but really could get high scores on their ACT's aren't doing a good job of describing it. There are some peope up here that actually know there is an NBA (a small % of the population) and are actually convinced that he'll be as good as new shortly after the ASG.

"You realize he tore his ACL and that 12-months is still about the right recovery time?"

"So what, he plays for the Bears so he'll be back sooner than that. Super Bowl, baby."

"You mean the Bulls, right?

"Yeah, whatever."

1984
02-15-2013, 07:49 PM
http://thesportingsnarf.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/smarf.jpg

1984
02-15-2013, 07:51 PM
You really need to re-read the sentence. He basically says, "If sitting is best for the big picture then I do not mind to sit out."