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The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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Indy's non-pursuit of NBA all-star game remains mystery

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  • #1

    Indy's non-pursuit of NBA all-star game remains mystery

    http://www.ibj.com/the-score-2013-02...AMS/post/39457

    The lease agreement the Indiana Pacers and Capital Improvement Board finalized in 1999 for the newly built Conseco Fieldhouse could not have been clearer.

    Both sides badly wanted to land an NBA All-Star Game. It is right there in the lease between the Pacers and CIB that locals would go after this high-profile event.

    So what happened?

    After reading a column penned by IBJ Managing Editor Greg Andrews for this week’s print edition, the answer to that question is as mystifying and elusive as ever. And I’ve covered the business of sports here at IBJ for nearly 15 years.

    The last serious effort to net the NBA All-Star Game was spearheaded by Don Welsh when he was president of the Indianapolis Convention and Visitors Association (now Visit Indy). In 2010, he led a recon mission to Dallas—that year’s host city—to see what it would take for Indianapolis to host the glitzy event.

    Welsh’s effort, for unknown reasons, went cold quickly. Then Welsh departed for Chicago the following year and the effort has not been revived.

    Fourteen years after the Pacers-CIB agreement for the Fieldhouse, the 1985 NBA All-Star Game, held at the newly built Hoosier Dome, remains the only all-star game the league has held in this city—a curious omission given Indianapolis’ propensity for landing big-time events.

    Odder still, no one locally can give a good reason why Indianapolis hasn’t landed the game or isn’t going after it.

    The NBA’s All-Star Weekend starts Friday and features a variety of events, including slam-dunk and three-point-shooting contests, leading up to Sunday’s game. A study commissioned by the Orlando Magic found that last year’s festivities in Orlando had an economic impact of $95 million, including $56 million in direct spending.

    An estimated 37,000 visitors from outside the county spent an average of $1,020 during their visits, and NBA players alone dropped $440,000, according to the study.

    Those are big numbers. And big numbers need to be put in perspective. Direct visitor spending for the 2012 Super Bowl in Indianapolis was $175 million, according to a study commissioned by the local host committee. A Final Four delivers $40 million in direct visitor spending to Indianapolis, according to Visit Indy.

    Did you catch that? An NBA All-Star Game could deliver $16 million more in direct visitor spending than a Final Four.

    Visit Indy and CIB officials seem to be at a loss for why this event hasn’t been pursued more aggressively. Pacers President Jim Morris said the Pacers would love to host it, but Bankers Life Fieldhouse’s schedule is simply packed.

    Really? Too crowded for an event with this type of economic impact?

    Apparently, it’s not just the Fieldhouse schedule that’s crowded.

    “Sometimes, even when we might be available, hotel rooms might not be available” because of sporting events or conventions held elsewhere downtown," said Rick Fuson, the Pacers chief operating officer.

    I’m guessing that’s a problem Welsh’s replacement at Visit Indy, Leonard Hoops, would like to wrestle with. February isn’t one of Indianapolis’ busiest convention months.

    Despite competition from other cities, if Indianapolis throws its hat in the ring, it surely will be able to work its way into the hosting schedule, said David Morton, president of locally based Sunrise Sports Group. He sees Lucas Oil Stadium, which proved its mettle as a basketball venue when it staged the 2010 NCAA men’s Final Four, as the ideal location.
    The NBA has gone both big and small with past venues. The 2010 game was in Cowboys Stadium, home of the Dallas Cowboys, while this year’s game is at Toyota Center, home of the Houston Rockets.

    There’s one consideration Pacers officials aren’t likely to address publicly. In recent years, some NBA all-star games have been marred by violence and other mayhem. So the security costs would be considerable.

    But this seems surmountable for a city that has become known as one of the most creative nationwide for hosting sporting events.

    Fuson—who as a new Pacers employee helped ready the Hoosier Dome for the 1985 game—fondly recalls that event. He said larger isn’t necessarily better. He called Bankers Life Fieldhouse the best basketball venue in the country. And he said its appeal has only grown with the installation this season of a massive high-definition scoreboard.

    “Our new scoreboard makes a significant difference about the NBA wanting to be there, too,” Fuson said.

    So again, I ask, what are we waiting on?
    Sittin on top of the world!
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  • #2
    Re: Indy's non-pursuit of NBA all-star game remains mystery

    I can't find the links but I thought sources within the Pacers have said previously that the All-Star Game is a logistical nightmare and more trouble than it's worth financially.

    Comment

    • #3
      Re: Indy's non-pursuit of NBA all-star game remains mystery

      Originally posted by rabidpacersfan View Post
      I can't find the links but I thought sources within the Pacers have said previously that the All-Star Game is a logistical nightmare and more trouble than it's worth financially.
      Maybe for the Pacers, but not for the city. That is a stupid excuses. The City obviously benefits.
      There is no NBA player named Monte Ellis.

      Comment

      • #4
        Re: Indy's non-pursuit of NBA all-star game remains mystery

        Originally posted by rabidpacersfan View Post
        I can't find the links but I thought sources within the Pacers have said previously that the All-Star Game is a logistical nightmare and more trouble than it's worth financially.

        Yes.

        One of their biggest concerns was that it is a big in-season distraction for the front office.

        Also, I'm not sure I buy the 37,000 out-of-town visitors argument for an NBA all-star game. That doesn't seem right at all. More than 2x the number of people that will get into the arena travel from out of town for the NBA all-star game?

        (Was another of Donnie's concerns about the ASG the relatively low number of tickets available to the ST holders? I think that's right... a lot of work and then you turn away your paying customers that are interested in the game. 5,000 tickets for the home team to sell to its ST holders is the number I seem to recall.)
        Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
        Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
        Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
        Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
        And life itself, rushing over me
        Life itself, the wind in black elms,
        Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

        Comment

        • #5
          Re: Indy's non-pursuit of NBA all-star game remains mystery

          "In Season" distractions for the front office is not a sufficient reason to turn down millions of dollars. After all the money the city has given then the Pacers, the least they can do is bring an all star game here.
          There is no NBA player named Monte Ellis.

          Comment

          • #6
            Re: Indy's non-pursuit of NBA all-star game remains mystery

            Originally posted by ChicagoJ View Post
            Also, I'm not sure I buy the 37,000 out-of-town visitors argument for an NBA all-star game. That doesn't seem right at all. More than 2x the number of people that will get into the arena travel from out of town for the NBA all-star game?
            I bet that here they'd have it at Lucas Oil instead of BLF, just like they had it at the Dome instead of MSA.
            Last edited by Sollozzo; 02-05-2013, 06:15 PM.

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            • #7
              Re: Indy's non-pursuit of NBA all-star game remains mystery

              People would definitely travel from Chicago I am sure of it. 37000 does not sound far off to me at all.
              There is no NBA player named Monte Ellis.

              Comment

              • #8
                Re: Indy's non-pursuit of NBA all-star game remains mystery

                Well, this is interesting... Donnie Walsh has definitely been quoted as basically saying they weren't interested in the All Star game. ...But yet it's in the lease???

                With BLF and Lucas, plus the city's reputation for hosting marquee sporting events, it's hard to imagine not landing the event... if they were trying. I feel confident the city would love having the event. I'm not sure I buy the excuses of TPTB but what makes this all interesting is that pursuing the ASG is part of the lease agreement. So basically, TPTB makes a token effort to satisfy the agreement while not actually pursuing the event at all for questionable reasons.
                Nuntius was right for a while. I was wrong for a while. But ultimately I was right and Frank Vogel has been let go.

                ------

                "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, that’s teamwork."

                -John Wooden

                Comment

                • #9
                  Re: Indy's non-pursuit of NBA all-star game remains mystery

                  The Spurs do not pursue them either, mostly because of the cost to the team and the above noted extra work.

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    Re: Indy's non-pursuit of NBA all-star game remains mystery

                    Originally posted by rabidpacersfan View Post
                    I can't find the links but I thought sources within the Pacers have said previously that the All-Star Game is a logistical nightmare and more trouble than it's worth financially.
                    That is what I was told from people in the know that work at BLF when I had my job rotating the ads on the scorers tables...
                    Last edited by J7F; 02-05-2013, 06:23 PM.
                    Nothing in life worth having comes easy.

                    Comment

                    • #11
                      Re: Indy's non-pursuit of NBA all-star game remains mystery

                      Originally posted by rabidpacersfan View Post
                      I can't find the links but I thought sources within the Pacers have said previously that the All-Star Game is a logistical nightmare and more trouble than it's worth financially.

                      I don't see how it could be any more of a nightmare than the Super Bowl, Final Fours, Indy 500, Big Ten Football and Basketball Championships, or marquee Colts/Pacers playoff games.......all of which the city has hosted masterfully.

                      Comment

                      • #12
                        Re: Indy's non-pursuit of NBA all-star game remains mystery

                        Hmmmm... Chicago hasn't hosted it since '88, which means its never been in The UC.

                        Wouldn't you think they'd rather host it than admit that yet again Indianapolis is better at hosting large sporting events than they are. They're still stinging over the Big Ten football championship.

                        I also don't buy the dome stadium idea. The ASG has been in two domed stadiums since playing in the Astrodome in 1989 - the Alamodome and Cowboys Stadium. They've been back to Houston twice (including this year) and played in the Toyota Center.

                        I think if the ASG ever comes back (and I wouldn't count on it), it will be at the Fieldhouse.
                        Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
                        Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
                        Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
                        Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
                        And life itself, rushing over me
                        Life itself, the wind in black elms,
                        Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

                        Comment

                        • #13
                          Re: Indy's non-pursuit of NBA all-star game remains mystery

                          Originally posted by Sollozzo View Post
                          I don't see how it could be any more of a nightmare than the Super Bowl, Final Fours, Indy 500, Big Ten Football and Basketball Championships, or marquee Colts/Pacers playoff games.......all of which the city has hosted masterfully.
                          It's not the city... It's BLF that doesn't want to host it...
                          Nothing in life worth having comes easy.

                          Comment

                          • #14
                            Re: Indy's non-pursuit of NBA all-star game remains mystery

                            Originally posted by J7F View Post
                            It's not the city... It's BLF that doesn't want to host it...
                            Right. I'm just saying that I fail to see the "nightmare" aspect to it.

                            Comment

                            • #15
                              Re: Indy's non-pursuit of NBA all-star game remains mystery

                              Originally posted by Sollozzo View Post
                              I don't see how it could be any more of a nightmare than the Super Bowl, Final Fours, Indy 500, Big Ten Football and Basketball Championships, or marquee Colts/Pacers playoff games.......all of which the city has hosted masterfully.
                              Most of which are administered by ISC. Would they handle this, or would it be PS&E?

                              Did the Colts front office plan the Super Bowl activities? I think there was a SB committee but could be wrong.

                              The Final Fours and Big Ten events aren't really administered by any of the teams. And while those are big games they aren't weekend-long events with numerous other activities beyond the main attraction.

                              The city gets an economic boom, but unlike the Colts/ Pacers playoff games, the team doesn't really see any economic benefit. It is a lot of cost and time during the middle of the season with no upside. If you were a business owner, how much would you spend to distract your front office while somebody else benefits?
                              Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
                              Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
                              Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
                              Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
                              And life itself, rushing over me
                              Life itself, the wind in black elms,
                              Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

                              Comment

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