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View Full Version : 11/13/2012 Game Thread #8: Pacers Vs. Raptors



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avoidingtheclowns
11-13-2012, 04:27 PM
BEAT THE BARNEYS



http://i.cdn.turner.com/nba/nba/.element/img/2.0/sect/gameinfo/teamlogos/IND.gif -VS-http://i.cdn.turner.com/nba/nba/.element/img/2.0/sect/gameinfo/teamlogos/TOR.gif


Game Time Start: 7:00 PM EST
Where: The Fieldhouse, Indianapolis, IN
Officials: B. Salvatore, K. Cutler, P. Fraher

Media Notes: Indiana Notes (http://www.nba.com/gamenotes/pacers.pdf), Toronto Notes (http://www.nba.com/gamenotes/raptors.pdf)
Television: FSI / TSN
Radio: WFNI 1070 AM / Sportsnet 590 The FAN
NBA Feeds:
*NBA Audio League Pass (available free to NBA All-Access members) (http://www.nba.com/broadband/alp_schedule.html)
*NBA League Pass Broadband (subscription req'd) (http://www.nba.com/leaguepass/)



REMINDER: Per PD policy, please do not share a link to, describe how to search for, request a link to, or request a PM about streaming video of a NBA game that is not coming directly through the NBA. Not even in a "wink-wink, nudge-nudge, know-what-I-mean" round-about sort of way. Thank you :)



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Season Records: (W-L)




:xpacers:

http://i49.tinypic.com/e1589d.pnghttp://i49.tinypic.com/e1589d.png<center>3-4</center>
http://i49.tinypic.com/e1589d.png<center>Home: 2-0
East: 2-2</center>



:raptors:

http://i49.tinypic.com/e1589d.pnghttp://i49.tinypic.com/e1589d.png<center>1-6</center>
http://i49.tinypic.com/e1589d.png<center>Away: 0-3
East: 0-3</center>

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Upcoming Games:



<center>Nov 14</center>
<center>Nov 16</center>
<center>Nov 18</center>
<center>Nov 19</center>



at :bucks:


vs :mavericks:


at :knicks:


at :wizards:




8:00pm


7:00pm


12:00pm


7:00pm


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http://www.nba.com/tvc/image/assets/wordmarks/IND_wordmark.png Projected Starting Lineup:



<center>http://www.nba.com/media/playerfile/roy_hibbert.jpg</center>
<center>http://www.nba.com/media/playerfile/david_west.jpg</center>
<center>http://www.nba.com/media/playerfile/paul_george.jpg</center>
<center>http://www.nba.com/media/playerfile/lance_stephenson.jpg</center>
<center>http://www.nba.com/media/playerfile/george_hill.jpg</center>


<center>HIBBERT</center>
<center>WEST</center>
<center>GEORGE</center>
<center>STEPHENSON</center>
<center>HILL</center>



http://www.nba.com/tvc/image/assets/wordmarks/TOR_wordmark.png Projected Starting Lineup:



<center>http://www.nba.com/media/playerfile/jonas_valanciunas.jpg</center>
<center>http://www.nba.com/media/playerfile/andrea_bargnani.jpg</center>
<center>http://www.nba.com/media/playerfile/dominic_mcguire.jpg</center>
<center>http://www.nba.com/media/playerfile/demar_derozan.jpg</center>
<center>http://www.nba.com/media/playerfile/jose_calderon.jpg</center>


<center>VALANCIUNAS</center>
<center>BARGNANI</center>
<center>McGUIRE</center>
<center>DEROZAN</center>
<center>CALDERON</center>

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http://c.dryicons.com/images/icon_sets/medical_icons/png/128x128/medicine.png

http://i49.tinypic.com/e1589d.png
PACERS
Danny Granger - left knee tendinosis (out)
http://i49.tinypic.com/e1589d.png
http://i49.tinypic.com/e1589d.png
http://i49.tinypic.com/e1589d.png
http://i49.tinypic.com/e1589d.png
WIZARDS
Alan Anderson - left sprained foot (out)
Landry Fields - right hand/wrist injury (out)
Kyle Lowry - right sprained ankle (out)



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Minimally Relevant Video:



<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/OQZmrdwK7YM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>


<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/7e6gW5FF7B0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>


<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/FpsGcnLEZbk" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

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Semi-Relevant Video:



<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/eHe-8Uc9250" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

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Eight Points, Nine Seconds Review:




http://i39.tinypic.com/nw1120.png (http://www.eightpointsnineseconds.com/)




Tim Donahue: Danny Granger Made His Teammates Better

Consider the following chart:


http://i46.tinypic.com/ozryo.png (http://www.eightpointsnineseconds.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/wodannyplusminus.jpg)

The picture represents the 2011-12 +/- per 48 minutes for each of nine key rotation
players for the Pacers on that squad. The blue bar is for when they were playing
with Danny Granger, the red is when the Captain was on the bench. Without Danny,
every single player’s +/- dropped, and the overall average was 11.4 points per 48
minutes.

Of course, that speaks as much about unit performance, as it does individual. It
makes sense that the team performance would drop when one of its two or three
most accomplished players was not on the floor. More evidence of Granger’s
positive impact on last year’s team can be seen in the Pacers shooting performance.


http://i46.tinypic.com/ku845.png (http://www.eightpointsnineseconds.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/2012-with-wo-Danny.jpg)

The Pacers shot a higher percentage in 11 of the 14 shooting zones on this chart
with Danny on the floor. Overall, the team’s eFG% dropped from 49.0% to 44.5%
when Granger went to the bench last year. And this wasn’t just Danny being an
above average shooter.

Over the first half of last season, Danny Granger suffered mightily from the floor,
posting an eFG% of only 44.3%. Still the Pacers shot better in 10 of the 14 zones,
their eFG% was 4.4% lower – 43.5% vs. 47.9% – with Granger on the bench. Again,
this is team performance, and not inconsistent with the overall squad talent declining
with anyone replacing Granger.

However, there’s actually some evidence that the individual performance of most of
the players was improved by...CONTINUE READING AT 8p9s (http://www.eightpointsnineseconds.com/2012/11/danny-granger-made-his-teammates-better/)


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Raptors Republic Preview:




http://i40.tinypic.com/110loqo.png (http://raptorsrepublic.com/)



Gameday: Raptors @ Pacers Nov. 13

It’s going to be a relatively quick pre-game today since we’re on a back-to-back and,
well, we’re all probably a little exhausted from last night’s triple overtime loss.

As it is, the team travelled late to Indiana and will play the Pacers, who defeated the
Raptors on opening night, 90-88. As I mentioned in my post-game, that was a loss
under better circumstances, with Lowry healthy, able-bodied wing players in the
lineup, and with the benefit of rest and a lively home crowd. Instead, the team will
be without Lowry, Fields and Anderson once again, tired from a travel night and a
triple overtime game that saw Jose Calderon log 50 minutes and DeMar DeRozan
log 60.

By the way, before I jump into the breakdown I should note that as per the latest
news I have, Lowry did NOT travel with the team, but he tweeted, “Indy! This being
injured is for the birds!” which could be taken as him having made the trip. Fields
and Double-A are also not expected to play, as of the latest chatter on Twitter, but
please comment if this news changes before tip-off.

Tale of the Tape, 2011-12

Offensive Rating:
Toronto 103.9 (11th), Indiana 97.3 (26th)

Defensive Rating:
Indiana 99.5 (7th), Toronto 108.6 (27th)

Pace:
Toronto 92.3 (19th), Indiana 90.3 (27th)

Strength:
Toronto – turnovers (4th in TO%, 6th in Opponent TO%)
Indiana – rebounding (5th in OReb%, 9th in DReb%)

Weakness:
Toronto – fouling (30th in Oponnent FTA/FGA, 12th in FTA/FGA)
Indiana – scoring (29th in eFG%)


Positional Breakdown

Point Guard – Advantage: Slightly Pacers
Calderon played a great game last night, but I am not hopeful about how he’ll play a
night after logging 50 minutes. Hopefully John Lucas broke his slump going three for
six last night and hitting a huge three late, because he’ll be relied on to provide
adequate back-up minutes. For the Pacers, Hill is seriously overpaid but has been
scoring at a steady clip so far this season now that he’s “the guy.” Augustin has been
terrible adjusting to his new squad, shooting just 18%. If Calderon can somehow look
fresh, you might give the nod to the Raptors, but that seems unlikely.

Wings – Advantage: Wash
With Danny Granger out, the Pacers have been struggling on the wings and have
resorted to rotating the starter beside George. While none have stood out, George
is a personal favorite who is oozing with potential and has already learned how to
contribute in other ways when the shots aren’t dropping. DeRozan has been at his
best of late, save for his shot selection late last night, but coming off of a 60-min
outing he could be tired/exhausted/zombified. Neither of the benches inspire much
confidence, so we call it a wash.

Bigs – Advantage: Pacers
West took it to Bargnani badly in the second half of the opener, and you can probably
expect more of the same tonight. Hibbert has been struggling significantly to lead “his”
team, but against Valanciunas...CONTINUE READING AT RAPTORS REPUBLIC (http://raptorsrepublic.com/2012/11/13/gameday-raptors-pacers-nov-13/)

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[
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140 Characters of (Non-PD) Coverage



http://cdn5.iconfinder.com/data/icons/yooicons_set01_socialbookmarks/128/social_twitter_box_blue.png

http://i49.tinypic.com/e1589d.png
http://i49.tinypic.com/e1589d.png
Pacers
Mike Wells @MikeWellsNBA (https://twitter.com/#!/MikeWellsNBA)
Jared Wade @8pts9secs (https://twitter.com/#!/8pts9secs)
Tim Donahue @TimDonahue8p9s (https://twitter.com/#!/TimDonahue8p9s)
Tom Lewis @indycornrows (https://twitter.com/#!/IndyCornrows)


http://i49.tinypic.com/e1589d.png
http://i49.tinypic.com/e1589d.png
Raptors
Doug Smith @SmithRaps (https://twitter.com/SmithRaps)
Holly MacKenzie @stackmack (https://twitter.com/stackmack)
J.E. Skeets @jeskeets (https://twitter.com/jeskeets)
Adam Francis @raptorshq (https://twitter.com/raptorshq)


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TMJ31
11-13-2012, 04:30 PM
I expect nothing short of us coming out, imposing our will and stepping on their necks early.

Ctman89
11-13-2012, 04:33 PM
Wow it's crazy seeing Stephenson as a starter.

TMJ31
11-13-2012, 04:50 PM
Wow it's crazy seeing Stephenson as a starter.

He has certainly earned it though.

Sparhawk
11-13-2012, 04:56 PM
Raptors played a 3OT game yesterday.

Pacers should really try and push the tempo to wear these guys out quickly. If their legs get tired, they'll start to miss a lot of shots.

LucasRL13
11-13-2012, 04:57 PM
We have to win this game, Toronto played yesterday a 3OT game vs Utah.

Tonight Lance will score a career high in points

QuickRelease
11-13-2012, 04:57 PM
He has certainly earned it though.
Happy for him. I was wrong about his ability to be a shot in the arm. It will be nice to see what he does as he becomes more comfortable. The added 3 point shot (so far) is really opening things up for him as well.

TMJ31
11-13-2012, 05:04 PM
Happy for him. I was wrong about his ability to be a shot in the arm. It will be nice to see what he does as he becomes more comfortable. The added 3 point shot (so far) is really opening things up for him as well.

Agreed, his shooting has been the biggest surprise for me.

He is still making some silly mistakes when he tries to force it and do too much, especially off the dribble going into the lane.

However, his shooting and playmaking abilities have been superb.

Hypnotiq
11-13-2012, 05:22 PM
What happened to kyle lowry? huge out if he's not playing

Pace Maker
11-13-2012, 05:23 PM
We should be facing a tired Toronto team without their best player.

If we find a way to lose to lose this I don't know what to say

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 05:33 PM
Pacers should be able to destroy them, I expect a career high for Paul George.

QuickRelease
11-13-2012, 05:56 PM
We should be facing a tired Toronto team without their best player.

If we find a way to lose to lose this I don't know what to sayThey still have Bargnani and Derosan...it's not like we're playing the Bobcats, a team we would walk right ov..

90'sNBARocked
11-13-2012, 06:08 PM
I just want to see better ball movement, better passing and less turnovers. If we can win this game convincingly I have faith that we will slowly start to turn the corner.

PaulGeorgeHill
11-13-2012, 06:19 PM
Going to the game thanks to Pacerscolt1125!!! Go Pacers....I'm going to be there when Paul George and Lance Stephenson have career games!!!

Derek2k3
11-13-2012, 06:24 PM
What happened to kyle lowry? huge out if he's not playing

Ankle issue. Sounds bad, actually. He's traveling somewhere to get the original prognosis confirmed, which a week later is a bad sign.

What I want to see is Roy shut down Jonas. JV had a big impact on the last game, and if he's able to push Roy around/clean the glass, it could keep them in it.

EDIT:

The franchise could really use a big exciting win to drum up some interest locally. With the Colts cruising towards the playoffs, the Pacers need to show they are "worth" investing in, both with their time and money. Hopefully a dominating performance tonight would spark more interest among the locals.

Trophy
11-13-2012, 06:31 PM
Lob City tonight? Gerald and Paul could be in for a big and exciting game.

jbx225
11-13-2012, 06:31 PM
Is this game a barometer to judge our progress from the first game or are the circumstances too different to compare?

Obviously the two teams are the same but the Raptors are coming off an overtime back-to-back. We are coming off of a few days off. Different home floor.

I'm just curious if we can look at this game in any way as a measure of progress and a taste of things to come (for the good or for the bad).

eric1516
11-13-2012, 06:49 PM
Pacers should be able to destroy them, I expect a career high for Paul George.

Agreed. Hopefully the same for Stephenson as well.

cgg
11-13-2012, 06:52 PM
Yay Raptors announcers. I've only seen Pacers broadcast once.

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 06:58 PM
I don't think there is more than 5k people there.

LucasRL13
11-13-2012, 06:59 PM
Lance for 3

eric1516
11-13-2012, 06:59 PM
Lance is off to a great start ;)

Dr. Awesome
11-13-2012, 06:59 PM
Serious question: When all is said and done, will Lance Stephenson have had a better career than Paul George?

He seems to want it more and whether you want to admit it or not, he has shown a lot more growth since entering the league.

LoneGranger33
11-13-2012, 06:59 PM
Three possessions, three turnovers for the Raptors...

cgg
11-13-2012, 07:00 PM
When Calderon is upset about the defense, you're in trouble.

LoneGranger33
11-13-2012, 07:01 PM
I can't believe that pass made it through. Nice PG to Lance fast break.

Johanvil
11-13-2012, 07:02 PM
Stellar D.That's how i like it.Very impressive start.Lance has been a revelation with his improved shooting.

Dr. Awesome
11-13-2012, 07:05 PM
Stephenson has better ball skills than anyone who has worn a Pacers uniform since Jamaal Tinsley. He makes NBA players look like they are on an AND 1 video.

LoneGranger33
11-13-2012, 07:05 PM
Hibbert is a steals factory. 3 in 4 minutes!

Ace E.Anderson
11-13-2012, 07:06 PM
Wish we looked to run like this every game

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 07:07 PM
Damn Calderon.

jbx225
11-13-2012, 07:08 PM
Yay Raptors announcers. I've only seen Pacers broadcast once.

Since I've moved out of the broadcast area and had to get league pass broadband, I've noticed that too... I like league pass but I wish you got a choice of which broadcast to watch. There have been very few announcers from other teams that are as good as the Pacers announcers. Maybe it's just because I am used to our announcers style but the other teams announcers I have heard seem pretty dull, lots of silence, just stating the obvious about what happened on a play and no commentary, opinions or background stats or stories.

TMJ31
11-13-2012, 07:09 PM
What are you guys using to watch LP? On DirecTV I can choose either team broadcast

cgg
11-13-2012, 07:09 PM
I don't mind other announcers to much unless they say things that are just wrong, but I do miss the Pacers broadcast.

cgg
11-13-2012, 07:09 PM
What are you guys using to watch LP? On DirecTV I can choose either team broadcast

League pass broadband.

LoneGranger33
11-13-2012, 07:10 PM
Andrea Bargnani has been a fantasy basketball disappointment thus far this season, but I can tolerate one more crappy game.

eric1516
11-13-2012, 07:11 PM
I love that jumper by West.

LoneGranger33
11-13-2012, 07:13 PM
Doesn't look like tonight will be the night Hibbert turns his season around.

TMJ31
11-13-2012, 07:13 PM
League pass broadband.

Ahhhh. Yes, they really need to allow you to view either broadcast on lp broadband :(

Dr. Awesome
11-13-2012, 07:14 PM
I wanna see Lance run the pick and roll more.

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 07:14 PM
It looks like they are finally running an offense and went away from so many ISO's, I still expect the West ISO's at the end.

rock747
11-13-2012, 07:15 PM
Pacers don;t hold leads well...

Kosmo Yagkoto
11-13-2012, 07:15 PM
Strong start, bad few minutes

eric1516
11-13-2012, 07:15 PM
Nice try by Hill but no dice. I'm ok with him missing it as long as the effort is there.

Dr. Awesome
11-13-2012, 07:15 PM
Dude just killed George Hill after that shot...

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 07:15 PM
Wow what a pass by Calderon wow.

LoneGranger33
11-13-2012, 07:16 PM
Nice try by Hill but no dice. I'm ok with him missing it as long as the effort is there.

It's nice to see a good inbounds pass from Gerald Green.

gummy
11-13-2012, 07:16 PM
Putting on extra muscle has not been good for Roy. It's not really helping him get deeper positioning and he looks winded after a few minutes. And he's slower than last year, as if he had speed to spare.

jbx225
11-13-2012, 07:16 PM
What are you guys using to watch LP? On DirecTV I can choose either team broadcast

For me, it's League Pass Broadband on my Apple TV.

Eddie Gill
11-13-2012, 07:18 PM
I don't expect Roy to be great guarding Bargnani out there, but at least don't bite on that pump fake.

LuckSwagger
11-13-2012, 07:19 PM
Come on, guys, play some defense.

LoneGranger33
11-13-2012, 07:19 PM
Our offense died.

gummy
11-13-2012, 07:21 PM
What a waste of a good start.

eric1516
11-13-2012, 07:21 PM
On my screen it looks like Lance has the ol' "high and tight" haircut. I'll take that as his homage to Veteran's Day haha.

gummy
11-13-2012, 07:23 PM
Two air balls from GH in the first quarter? Ouch.

TMJ31
11-13-2012, 07:23 PM
Well my initial outlook for the game held true... For about 5 minutes. Let's go guys! NO Reason we should be getting out played right now.

LuckSwagger
11-13-2012, 07:24 PM
Pacers are getting out-hustled by a team that lost at home in triple overtime last night.

eric1516
11-13-2012, 07:28 PM
Finally. Thank you George!

gummy
11-13-2012, 07:30 PM
Ian looks solid so far.

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 07:31 PM
Wow

rock747
11-13-2012, 07:31 PM
whenever augustine attempts a shot at the rim, its pretty much a wasted possesion

Johanvil
11-13-2012, 07:32 PM
Why the **** do we rush things offensively and why the **** Ian takes so many liberties on offense?

eric1516
11-13-2012, 07:34 PM
It looked ugly but Augustine is slowly getting his shooting % up haha.

rock747
11-13-2012, 07:36 PM
Pacers could go down 10 to a 1-6 team, who played 3ots yesterday, who is missing their starting pg

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 07:36 PM
West ISO is Vogels way of saying "I don't know what else to do" ...

rock747
11-13-2012, 07:40 PM
andd now they are down 10

eric1516
11-13-2012, 07:41 PM
Why are we taking such ugly shots? You are not going to make an off balanced jump shot with two defenders on you!

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 07:41 PM
Down 12 wow.

Sollozzo
11-13-2012, 07:42 PM
We are getting rolled at home by a 1-6 team that played a three OT game last night.

Our offense just sucks right now.

MiaDragon
11-13-2012, 07:42 PM
This is some of the worst basketball I've seen in a while.

Heisenberg
11-13-2012, 07:42 PM
get rid of everybody. Walsh to Pendergraph.

rock747
11-13-2012, 07:42 PM
down 12, even iF they Find a way to win this game.... this is alarming

gummy
11-13-2012, 07:43 PM
Drive to the basket, dammit!

MiaDragon
11-13-2012, 07:43 PM
We are getting rolled at home by a 1-6 team that played a three OT game last night.

Our offense just sucks right now.


its WAY more than just the O, its every facet of the game.

jjbjjbjjb
11-13-2012, 07:43 PM
What is going on with our offense? Vogel would be seriously on the hot seat if the Pacers were a serious franchise.

Hypnotiq
11-13-2012, 07:43 PM
down 12, even iF they Find a way to win this game.... this is alarming

but its only 7 games!!

MiaDragon
11-13-2012, 07:44 PM
get rid of everybody. Walsh to Pendergraph.

Id like to see another coach see what he can do with the current roster.

Johanvil
11-13-2012, 07:44 PM
Welcome to the Pacers Horror Show

BlueCollarColts
11-13-2012, 07:44 PM
when I see Lance play, he reminds me of Rajon Rondo, anybody else agree?

LucasRL13
11-13-2012, 07:44 PM
We need more West, Hill, Lance and George

rock747
11-13-2012, 07:44 PM
doesn't appear pacer's are starting to figure things out...

Mr_Smith
11-13-2012, 07:44 PM
This is downright awful.....

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 07:45 PM
What is going on with our offense? Vogel would be seriously on the hot seat if the Pacers were a serious franchise.

I'm going to keep saying it, the talent is just not that good.

BlueCollarColts
11-13-2012, 07:45 PM
you can yell and scream all you want but the Pacers are getting good, open looks, shots that an coach would like, they just have to make them

Johanvil
11-13-2012, 07:45 PM
Roy is laughable.He can't score a basket,grab a rebound,make or catch a single pass.Enjoy your fat contract.

MiaDragon
11-13-2012, 07:46 PM
We need more West, Hill, Lance and George

We need to box out and help on D its the little things that are lacking with the team.

Dr. Awesome
11-13-2012, 07:47 PM
I'm going to keep saying it, the talent is just not that good.

The talent is, the will isn't.

They simply look like they don't care.

MiaDragon
11-13-2012, 07:48 PM
The talent is, the will isn't.

They simply look like they don't care.

Starting to agree with this.

jjbjjbjjb
11-13-2012, 07:49 PM
I'm going to keep saying it, the talent is just not that good.

You actually don't have to pipe up every time you read something you disagree with.

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 07:49 PM
On a positive note at least Andrea is not killing West today so I don't need to have to explain to TJ how this happened :cool:

rock747
11-13-2012, 07:49 PM
The talent is, the will isn't.

They simply look like they don't care.

I just don't see this at all.... seems like they care...

Mr_Smith
11-13-2012, 07:50 PM
I'm going to keep saying it, the talent is just not that good.

Well said....

pathil275
11-13-2012, 07:51 PM
36 points first half points against a team that played 3 overtimes last night and had to travel to Indiana? And they lost the last 4 games, too. Come one, that's pathetic.

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 07:51 PM
You actually don't have to pipe up every time you read something you disagree with.

Bring Phill Jackson and you are still going to have the same issues, the players are just not that good.

tfarks
11-13-2012, 07:51 PM
George Hill has to hurry up on those possessions. It's a guaranteed wait for an ugly jumpshot with no chance of going in.

Johanvil
11-13-2012, 07:51 PM
Yeah GH,by all means,take your time....

1984
11-13-2012, 07:52 PM
​George Hill sucks.

TMJ31
11-13-2012, 07:52 PM
We're just setting up a more dramatic come from behind victory...

Sollozzo
11-13-2012, 07:52 PM
I'm going to keep saying it, the talent is just not that good.


Yeah. We are without two of our best players from the previous two seasons in Granger and Collison, and none of the new guys are adequate replacements. Also, none of the players from last year's roster have improved enough to make up the difference. So when you lose two of your best players (including arguably the best player), then it shouldn't be surprising when you don't look nearly as good. The Granger situation obviously isn't the Pacers' fault, but the Collision trade has been nothing short of a complete disaster so far this season.

1984
11-13-2012, 07:52 PM
George Hill has wasted a lot of positions. A lot, and I'm not referring exclusively to this game.

rock747
11-13-2012, 07:52 PM
Bring Phill Jackson and you are still going to have the same issues, the players are just not that good.

it's evident the team is worse than last year.

boombaby1987
11-13-2012, 07:53 PM
Bring Phill Jackson and you are still going to have the same issues, the players are just not that good.

You keep saying Danny was really bad last year, so how were we the 3rd seed if our talent is the same minus Danny Granger? And ignore the bench.

Hypnotiq
11-13-2012, 07:54 PM
Yeah. We are without two of our best players from the previous two seasons in Granger and Collison, and none of the new guys are adequate replacements. Also, none of the players from last year's roster have improved enough to make up the difference. So when you lose two of your best players (including arguably the best player), then it shouldn't be surprising when you don't look nearly as good. The Granger situation obviously isn't the Pacers fault, but the Collision trade has been nothing short of a complete disaster so far this season.

No.

Collison was NOT even close to our second best player

sorry but that is totally hilarious you posted that

odeez
11-13-2012, 07:54 PM
Our defense stinks, that's a big part of it. If we could get stops of any kind we get out on the break maybe score some easy buckets.

Sollozzo
11-13-2012, 07:55 PM
No.

Collison was NOT even close to our second best player

sorry but that is totally hilarious you posted that

No, go back and read what I wrote. I said "two of our best players (including arguably the best player)". The "best player" I'm referring to is Granger.

I did not say "our two best players".

notque
11-13-2012, 07:55 PM
Our defense stinks, that's a big part of it. If we could get stops of any kind we get out on the break maybe score some easy buckets.

It's not our defense. We actually have a good defense, it's the complete lack of offense that's a problem.

We have 36 points in the first half against a tired Raptor team....

odeez
11-13-2012, 07:55 PM
Augustine is really giving us nothing. He can bring the ball up and make a pass, but he never attacks the rim, I miss DC for that reason alone.

DaveP63
11-13-2012, 07:55 PM
It's craptastic.

crunk-juice
11-13-2012, 07:56 PM
hey guys

guess what








pacers suck

notque
11-13-2012, 07:56 PM
Can we hire Mike DAntoni?!

odeez
11-13-2012, 07:57 PM
It's not our defense. We actually have a good defense, it's the complete lack of offense that's a problem.

I actually think there are problems with both to be honest, where do we rank defensively this year?

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 07:57 PM
You keep saying Danny was really bad last year, so how were we the 3rd seed if our talent is the same minus Danny Granger? And ignore the bench.

Last year the Pacers had a lot of things working on their side, health, superstars injured(Rose,Howard), short season,etc, the short season was a great thing for a young team like the Pacers.

And the talent is not the same, the pacers are missing DC,DJ and Barbosa.

Regarding the game I still expect them to win it.

QuickRelease
11-13-2012, 07:57 PM
How long before TPTB start taking this serious enough to start making changes? Because this is not something that Danny alone is going to fix.

Sparhawk
11-13-2012, 07:57 PM
Vogel is seriously looking like he really can't coach. Pacers offense is putrid. And I wouldn't say that the Pacers defense is good. It's not good, but it's not bad. About average if you ask me. Doesn't seem nearly as good as last season.

notque
11-13-2012, 07:58 PM
I actually think there are problems with both to be honest, where do we rank defensively this year?

I read something today we are in the upper half of defense adjusted for pace, but I don't remember where.

Sparhawk
11-13-2012, 07:58 PM
I agree with the factors you wrote being in the Pacers favor, but they don't miss/need any of those guys.

owl
11-13-2012, 07:58 PM
Augustine is really giving us nothing. He can bring the ball up and make a pass, but he never attacks the rim, I miss DC for that reason alone.


I think giving Ben Hansbrough some of DJ minutes are warranted. Goodness, I don't think he can less productive than DJ.

Hypnotiq
11-13-2012, 07:59 PM
Vogel is seriously looking like he really can't coach. Pacers offense is putrid. And I wouldn't say that the Pacers defense is good. It's not good, but it's not bad. About average if you ask me. Doesn't seem nearly as good as last season.

Someone has said it before but frank just isnt a good X's and O's coach he cant run plays to save his life.

notque
11-13-2012, 07:59 PM
I think giving Ben Hansbrough some of DJ minutes are warranted. Goodness, I don't think he can less productive than DJ.

Really? This is what it's come to. Turning to the guy who could barely get the ball up court in Summer league.

This is really all we need to know. Thankfully we can't draw any conclusions about this team until 2016.

1984
11-13-2012, 08:00 PM
George Hill sucks.

Dece
11-13-2012, 08:00 PM
So our $40M point guard, against Calderon, a guy everyone screams they don't want here because he plays defense worse than their grandmas, has 7 points 1 assist a 2 turnovers at the half. Good investment.

However, he's looking like a great buy compared to the 2 points our $58M center.

I'm so frustrated. We are going to be mediocre at best for the next 4 years, those contracts are albatross and we are going nowhere with them. This is Murphleavy all over again... throw in a 4 year deal for Mahimi, who knows why, however much we're going to waste to retain West because we never trade anyone with the trading is good and who knows if Granger will be the same player when(if) he gets back. Cool.

Magic P
11-13-2012, 08:00 PM
Brooke is so annoying

Hypnotiq
11-13-2012, 08:01 PM
So our $40M point guard, against Calderon, a guy everyone screams they don't want here because he plays defense worse than their grandmas, has 7 points 1 assist a 2 turnovers at the half. Good investment.

However, he's looking like a great buy compared to the 2 points our $58M center.

I'm so frustrated. We are going to be mediocre at best for the next 4 years, those contracts are albatross and we are going nowhere with them. This is Murphleavy all over again... throw in a 4 year deal for Mahimi, who knows why, however much we're going to waste to retain West because we never trade anyone with the trading is good and who knows if Granger will be the same player when(if) he gets back. Cool.

Pretty much the last part especially anyone that doesnt agree just has there head in the sand.

notque
11-13-2012, 08:02 PM
Can we see some Miles Plumlee? We drafted him, and we're doing terribly, might as well let him in the game. At least he gives a ****.

LoneGranger33
11-13-2012, 08:02 PM
Whether it's due to the offensive system or not, George Hill is being completely outclassed by Jose Calderon.

odeez
11-13-2012, 08:02 PM
I read something today we are in the upper half of defense adjusted for pace, but I don't remember where.

Well I guess your right look here, we are #2?

http://www.nba.com/statistics/sortable_team_statistics/sortable2.html?cnf=1&prd=1

owl
11-13-2012, 08:02 PM
fThis team is missing its hustle players from last year. Foster,Amundson and Dante Jones.

Johanvil
11-13-2012, 08:03 PM
Disgusting performance after such a promising start.If you consider,what has Toronto gone through,then it's even worse.My God,we're terrible and disorganized.

OlBlu
11-13-2012, 08:03 PM
You keep saying Danny was really bad last year, so how were we the 3rd seed if our talent is the same minus Danny Granger? And ignore the bench.

Let me help you with that. They were incredibly luck with injuries last year. The shortened season helped them and that team was made to do well in the open season and then be taken out in the playoffs....... I said several times last year that the season they were having was "magic" and I got hooted down. Well, guess what, it was magic....:cool:

MiaDragon
11-13-2012, 08:03 PM
This team is missing its hustle from last year.

I agree

notque
11-13-2012, 08:03 PM
Well I guess your right look here, we are #2?

http://www.nba.com/statistics/sortable_team_statistics/sortable2.html?cnf=1&prd=1

Right, we are really great defensively, and our offense is completely terrible.

Which is why I wanted to have Brian Shaw take over the offense.

pacer4ever
11-13-2012, 08:04 PM
Drive to the basket, dammit!

No kidding a zone should be easy to beat but we look clueless. I am about to leave and I never leave but this is ridiculous. Our spacing is beyond bad I have seen 5th graders who know how to keep proper spacing better. I would just let Lance create its at the point where we should just run the offens though him especially vs a zone.

OlBlu
11-13-2012, 08:05 PM
On a positive note at least Andrea is not killing West today so I don't need to have to explain to TJ how this happened :cool:

Hey!!!! :cool:

diamonddave00
11-13-2012, 08:05 PM
I'm impressed by our point guard(not) Hill is 3 of 9, 7 points and 1 assist while Calderon had 10 points 6 rebounds and 8 assist. But Roy is once again owning a Rookie 2 points at half time. I have no idea what Roy's problem is maybe all that money in his pocket is causing him to no longer have any drive?

Eleazar
11-13-2012, 08:07 PM
I'm impressed by our point guard(not) Hill is 3 of 9, 7 points and 1 assist while Calderon had 10 points 6 rebounds and 8 assist. But Roy is once again owning a Rookie 2 points at half time. I have no idea what Roy's problem is maybe all that money in his pocket is causing him to no longer have any drive?

Hard to get assists when no one can make a shot.

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 08:07 PM
So our $40M point guard, against Calderon, a guy everyone screams they don't want here because he plays defense worse than their grandmas, has 7 points 1 assist a 2 turnovers at the half. Good investment.

However, he's looking like a great buy compared to the 2 points our $58M center.

I'm so frustrated. We are going to be mediocre at best for the next 4 years, those contracts are albatross and we are going nowhere with them. This is Murphleavy all over again... throw in a 4 year deal for Mahimi, who knows why, however much we're going to waste to retain West because we never trade anyone with the trading is good and who knows if Granger will be the same player when(if) he gets back. Cool.

West is going to get 3 years and 35 book it, I agree with everything you are saying by the way.

odeez
11-13-2012, 08:08 PM
You know what sucks, I bought league pass select this year ... where you pick your teams. Of course I have the Pacers, problem is 9 out of 10 I get the announcer feed from the opposing teams crew. I have no idea why ... like today I got Toronto's crew, ugh! I have got to complain about it, makes no sense!

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 08:08 PM
Get ready for West Iso after West ISO.

rock747
11-13-2012, 08:09 PM
embarassment.

Sparhawk
11-13-2012, 08:09 PM
West is going to get 3 years and 35 book it, I agree with everything you are saying by the way.

Dear Gawd, no.

LoneGranger33
11-13-2012, 08:09 PM
I've never seen so many damn in-and-outs.

odeez
11-13-2012, 08:09 PM
This IS sad!

Dece
11-13-2012, 08:09 PM
Nice bricked layup from 4 feet out Roy. That's a shot I'd take. Too bad I'm 5'7" and you are 7'2"

What a complete wuss. I can't root for this guy. Dunk the ball you pussy.

rock747
11-13-2012, 08:09 PM
there will be no one there friday to watch deron collison come back and kill us.

diamonddave00
11-13-2012, 08:10 PM
Hill having only one assist could also be in part to his taking 9 shots.

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 08:10 PM
And that's why I like Calderon, the guy is a freaking General.

odeez
11-13-2012, 08:11 PM
Almost at a point where I need to turn it off ... blood beginning to boil!

LoneGranger33
11-13-2012, 08:11 PM
there will be no one there friday to watch deron collison come back and kill us.

A mercy killing would be welcome.

gummy
11-13-2012, 08:11 PM
We're getting to the point where I may stop working to structure my schedule so that I can watch live. I can just check the score to see if we embarrassed ourselves and if so, save myself the angst by not watching.

immortality
11-13-2012, 08:13 PM
I'm glad Pacers still can't shoot like last year :/

MiaDragon
11-13-2012, 08:13 PM
Almost at a point where I need to turn it off ... blood beginning to boil!

and some are still aghast as to why people are not going to games.

LoneGranger33
11-13-2012, 08:13 PM
The good news is that Charlotte is 20 minutes away from a 3-3 record!

odeez
11-13-2012, 08:13 PM
Ok better ....

rock747
11-13-2012, 08:14 PM
maybe calderon is on the trade block?

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 08:14 PM
Damn they are back.

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 08:15 PM
maybe calderon is on the trade block?

Always has been, they want a pick for him.

Mr_Smith
11-13-2012, 08:15 PM
Really wanna turn this ***** off, but as usual i just stay glued and get more pissed off

crunk-juice
11-13-2012, 08:16 PM
even if we win, this is a loss

can we get to .500 this season?

rock747
11-13-2012, 08:16 PM
Hibber how do you miss that?

righteouscool
11-13-2012, 08:17 PM
I really expect nothing from this team at this point. Can't be bothered to be annoyed.

MiaDragon
11-13-2012, 08:17 PM
Hibbert finishes like David Harrison

odeez
11-13-2012, 08:17 PM
Yeah, that's it, we just can't score enough without DG.

tfarks
11-13-2012, 08:17 PM
Toronto is shooting a stupid % while shot after shot rolls barely out of the rim for the Pacers. Its just one of those nights. Hopefully there's enough time for it to equalize.

Dece
11-13-2012, 08:17 PM
ANOTHER BRICKED LAYUP ROY!? DUNK THE EFFING BALL!!!!

Wow, I wish I could talk to him just once. I'm pretty sure he'd cry, he's so sensitive and soft, he'd never cut it in the military. I'm done with this guy.

notque
11-13-2012, 08:18 PM
Toronto is shooting a stupid % while shot after shot rolls barely out of the rim for the Pacers. Its just one of those nights. Hopefully there's enough time for it to equalize.

One game is one of those nights. Every game is a catastrophic problem.

BlueCollarColts
11-13-2012, 08:18 PM
what the HELL is wrong with Hibbert?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? I CAN FREAKIN MAKE THOSE SHOTS OVER A DEFENDER!!!!!!!!!!!!!

notque
11-13-2012, 08:19 PM
Hibbert finishes like David Harrison

No, David Harrison dunked it.

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 08:19 PM
I still expect the Pacers to win this and the positive people are going to tell us how great the Pacers looked...

Johanvil
11-13-2012, 08:20 PM
Have you seen a 7"2 guy who can't dunk?

BlueCollarColts
11-13-2012, 08:20 PM
The Colts are going to dominate this city for A LONG time

Johanvil
11-13-2012, 08:20 PM
I still expect the Pacers to win this and the positive people are going to tell us how great the Pacers looked...

We're gonna win **** all tonight.Even if we did,it would mean **** all again.

Ace E.Anderson
11-13-2012, 08:21 PM
Can Roy not dunk anymore or something? Bc he really can't make a layup lol....

Those missed bunnies are momentum killers.

Hey Vogel..TAKE HIM OUT!!!

BlueCollarColts
11-13-2012, 08:21 PM
not gonna lie, Lance Stephenson is our best player

LoneGranger33
11-13-2012, 08:21 PM
Another great pass from PG! Color me surprised.

notque
11-13-2012, 08:22 PM
Stephenson is our best player right now. Go Born ready

Ace E.Anderson
11-13-2012, 08:22 PM
Can Roy not dunk anymore or something? Bc he really can't make a layup lol....

Those missed bunnies are momentum killers.

Hey Vogel..TAKE HIM OUT!!!

Annnnd then he makes two plays lol

LucasRL13
11-13-2012, 08:22 PM
It's the time to turnaround the season.

COME ON HIBBERT!!!!!!!!!!

Mr_Smith
11-13-2012, 08:23 PM
How much further in the paint does roy have to be before he can score the damn ball!?!?! Lower the rim for this dude, this is crazy!!!!

tfarks
11-13-2012, 08:23 PM
Lance needs to be handed the reigns.

cdash
11-13-2012, 08:23 PM
Vogel: Watch how Casey uses his timeouts. Absorb.

TMJ31
11-13-2012, 08:23 PM
There we go. Just have to fight through the tough shooting woes. Still fully expect to win this game.

notque
11-13-2012, 08:23 PM
We only have one option here. Stephensen can play point, George Hill can't.

PG Lance
SG George Hill

It works.. Hill can play his shooting guard, and Lance can create some shots.

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 08:23 PM
Hey they are only down 9...... To the Raptors....

Johanvil
11-13-2012, 08:23 PM
Hey guys don't worry about the poor FG percentage this season.It's down to the lack of training camp.Oh wait...

BlueCollarColts
11-13-2012, 08:24 PM
if Lance plays well this year, I say we have him start at the PG, George at the 2, Granger at 3, West at 4, Hibbert (if he learns how to make a lay-up) at the 5 and have Hill be a spark plug off the bench with Green

LoneGranger33
11-13-2012, 08:24 PM
George Hill has played better in the 2nd half.

tfarks
11-13-2012, 08:25 PM
We only have one option here. Stephensen can play point, George Hill can't.

PG Lance
SG George Hill

It works.. Hill can play his shooting guard, and Lance can create some shots.

I don't even see this being debatable at this point. Lance is the only one who can create.

cdash
11-13-2012, 08:25 PM
We really don't have anyone to break down defenses (besides Lance) or create their own offense off the dribble (besides Lance). That's part of the reason (Lance) is such a breath of fresh air. Say what you will about Collison, but at least the guy could create offense for himself.

Eleazar
11-13-2012, 08:25 PM
Where the **** was the foul ref?

cdash
11-13-2012, 08:26 PM
if Lance plays well this year, I say we have him start at the PG, George at the 2, Granger at 3, West at 4, Hibbert (if he learns how to make a lay-up) at the 5 and have Hill be a spark plug off the bench with Green

Part of the reason Lance is playing better is because he isn't playing point guard.

Mr_Smith
11-13-2012, 08:26 PM
The Colts are going to dominate this city for A LONG time

Funny thing is, it was supposed to be the other way around before either season started

1984
11-13-2012, 08:26 PM
George Hill sucks.

crunk-juice
11-13-2012, 08:26 PM
damn its so much easier to watch when you dont care lol

try it out

BlueCollarColts
11-13-2012, 08:26 PM
HOW THE **** IS THAT A FOUL??????????????????????

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 08:26 PM
Vogel is going to get a tech.

BlueCollarColts
11-13-2012, 08:28 PM
switch Hill and Stephenson in the lineup

notque
11-13-2012, 08:28 PM
I'm hoping beyond hope Brian Shaw picks up a folding chair and hits Vogel over the back to take over the team.

BlueCollarColts
11-13-2012, 08:29 PM
HOW THE **** DID LANCE TOUCH THAT?????????

1984
11-13-2012, 08:29 PM
Refs suck.

crunk-juice
11-13-2012, 08:29 PM
wow what an idiot why would you throw a baseball in a basketball game

where did he even get one

1984
11-13-2012, 08:29 PM
George Hill really sucks.

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 08:30 PM
Lance touched it.

cdash
11-13-2012, 08:30 PM
Hill is being asked to do too much. This is not his game. Not making excuses for the guy, but he's an efficiency guy, a third or fourth option. Right now he's being asked to do too much on the offensive end. It's not his strength and it's making him look bad.

BlueCollarColts
11-13-2012, 08:30 PM
Lance Stephenson is our best player, no lie

LoneGranger33
11-13-2012, 08:30 PM
I'm hoping beyond hope Brian Shaw picks up a folding chair and hits Vogel over the back to take over the team.

Why would Shaw do any better? I mean, if he's already Associate Head Coach, don't you think he has enough influence on this squad to make a difference?

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 08:31 PM
Great now Green is in ....

1984
11-13-2012, 08:31 PM
Are we shooting free throws? No way. I don't believe it.

1984
11-13-2012, 08:31 PM
Great now Green is in .... Amen.

odeez
11-13-2012, 08:31 PM
Man if we didn't have West, what would we do?

notque
11-13-2012, 08:32 PM
Why would Shaw do any better? I mean, if he's already Associate Head Coach, don't you think he has enough influence on this squad to make a difference?

No assistant gets to put in his offense. Brian Shaw would obviously run the Triangle..

cdash
11-13-2012, 08:32 PM
Great now Green is in ....

6th man of the year be patient he will be awesome amazing leaper he gets it now........

cdash
11-13-2012, 08:32 PM
Man if we didn't have West, what would we do?

Tank for Cody Zeller.

MiaDragon
11-13-2012, 08:33 PM
Lolz cant even hit FT's

notque
11-13-2012, 08:33 PM
Great entry pass by Stevensen! Every time up, he should have the ball.

LoneGranger33
11-13-2012, 08:34 PM
Tank for Cody Zeller.

Mason Plumlee. They're more valuable if you collect them all.

1984
11-13-2012, 08:34 PM
Friends, the refs truly suck.

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 08:34 PM
Kleiza used to be good.

odeez
11-13-2012, 08:35 PM
UGH DJ!

cdash
11-13-2012, 08:35 PM
Mason Plumlee. They're more valuable if you collect them all.

Official nomination for post of the year.

rock747
11-13-2012, 08:35 PM
dj augustine is what we replaced collison with.... let that soak in.

notque
11-13-2012, 08:35 PM
Mason Plumlee. They're more valuable if you collect them all.

It worked for Hansbroughs!

LoneGranger33
11-13-2012, 08:35 PM
Chances of a fight tonight?

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 08:36 PM
I can't believe the bench is bringing them back.

crunk-juice
11-13-2012, 08:36 PM
Official nomination for post of the year.

who put you on the nomination committee

LoneGranger33
11-13-2012, 08:36 PM
It worked for Hansbroughs!

Hey, he's making his 'throws tonight.

1984
11-13-2012, 08:36 PM
Vogel MUST install an offense. This simple offense theory is destroying the Pacers. There is a reason we have no stability on offense. The common denominator is: system. Don't get me wrong, I believe Vogel is a good coach and must be in our longterm plans. BUT. His offensive theory is terrible.

BlueCollarColts
11-13-2012, 08:37 PM
leave this bench line-up in for the rest of the game, they look better than the starters

notque
11-13-2012, 08:37 PM
Another great entry pass from Stephensen! We DO have one guy who can do that successfully!

odeez
11-13-2012, 08:37 PM
Best thing about Lance's game is the way he pushes the ball, if he can tighten up those passes at times ... he gets up the floor so much faster than Hill.

BlueCollarColts
11-13-2012, 08:38 PM
nothing you can do about that shot, but DAMNIT!!!

cdash
11-13-2012, 08:38 PM
who put you on the nomination committee

That post was so good I shouldn't even have to nominate it.

notque
11-13-2012, 08:38 PM
Forget even winning, I just hope we score 80 points tonight....

1984
11-13-2012, 08:38 PM
I can't take it. I'm watching Doomsday Preppers. At least that will give me hope for the future.

rock747
11-13-2012, 08:38 PM
i'd take smush parker over dj augustine

Johanvil
11-13-2012, 08:38 PM
Of course they would score the 3 at the end.Just **** off with that ****.

MiaDragon
11-13-2012, 08:39 PM
Vogel MUST install an offense. This simple offense theory is destroying the Pacers. There is a reason we have no stability on offense. The common denominator is: system. Don't get me wrong, I believe Vogel is a good coach and must be in our longterm plans. BUT. His offensive theory is terrible.

He's had more than enough time, its time for him to go.

cdash
11-13-2012, 08:39 PM
Another great entry pass from Stephensen! We DO have one guy who can do that successfully!

I love that he knew he had to put touch on an entry pass to Mahinmi. Anything besides a lob and Ian isn't catching it :laugh:

LuckSwagger
11-13-2012, 08:39 PM
Eventually we're going to catch fire and go on a 5-0 run to get this thing down to single digits.

Anthem
11-13-2012, 08:39 PM
Logged in to comment on Lance's entry passing. Quality stuff.

The rest of the game is awful, but the entry pass was solid.

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 08:39 PM
Ok so I'm ready for West Iso's for the whole 4th quarter and a win.

notque
11-13-2012, 08:40 PM
Logged in to comment on Lance's entry passing. Quality stuff.

The rest of the game is awful, but the entry pass was solid.

Several of them! They are seriously difficult passes, and he's threading them. He's passing and creating shots.

How can we not start him at point?! Seriously!

1984
11-13-2012, 08:40 PM
I can't take it. I'm watching Doomsday Preppers. At least that will give me hope for the future.

I'm giving this team two minutes of the fourth quarter to be competitive, or I'm turning it to NatGeo.

LoneGranger33
11-13-2012, 08:40 PM
That post was so good I shouldn't even have to nominate it.

I already have a 1,118 word acceptance speech ready to go.

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 08:41 PM
I love that he knew he had to put touch on an entry pass to Mahinmi. Anything besides a lob and Ian isn't catching it :laugh:

So true is not even funny :laugh:

owl
11-13-2012, 08:41 PM
i'd take smush parker over dj augustine

Or B Hansbrough

rock747
11-13-2012, 08:42 PM
Conrad Brunner‏@1070Bruno

Fun with numbers: Raptors led by 10 at half, then shoot 5-18 in 3rd to see their lead dwindle to, um, 11?

LoneGranger33
11-13-2012, 08:42 PM
A scary thought - John Lucas III with D.J. guarding him.

cdash
11-13-2012, 08:42 PM
This offense is brutal to watch.

1984
11-13-2012, 08:43 PM
Ian teases us with good plays followed by bad plays...

odeez
11-13-2012, 08:43 PM
Nice BLK!