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90'sNBARocked
11-13-2012, 11:53 AM
http://www.hoopsworld.com/breakout-coming-for-indys-paul-george/


Before the season had even started for the Indiana Pacers, and long before the bad news came out about Danny Grangerís knee costing him at least three months, the expectations for third-year swingman Paul George were already pretty astronomical.

Considered to be one of the most promising young players in the entire league, George has been presented a perfect opportunity to break out in Grangerís absence. However, early in the season, the reviews have been mixed. George has scored in double digits in each of the teamís first seven games, but heís also had some atrocious shooting nights to get there.

ďItís frustrating,Ē George said, ďIím not knocking down open shots. Iím getting good looks, and itís just frustrating because I know I can shoot the ball well. But itís something that Iím working on, just letting go and having fun and playing.Ē

With all the pressure on him to succeed, however, itís has proven challenging to just kick back and be easy about things. George knows that the best players in the league take on those expectations, and thatís exactly what he is trying to do.

ďOf course I want that pressure,Ē George said. ďA lot of guys my age, I donít t think they would approach the game the way that I would. At the end of the day, I do want to be an All-Star. I do want to be the best player I can be. But most of all, I just want to win. Whether thatís scoring 15 points and 10-12 rebounds or 20-plus points a night, at the end of the day, with the team that I am surrounded by, I just want to win.Ē

So far, though, wins have been hard to come by for the Pacers, who are only 3-4 through their first seven games. George admitted that his own struggles have played a part in that, but mostly he just intimated that players werenít clicking with each other yet, nor has the team figured out how to play without Granger.

ďWeíre just finding the chemistry and right units to click together, and thatís going to come with time,Ē George said. ďA lot of new faces. Itís just a little different. We werenít expecting Danny to go down and be out as early as he is.Ē

But again, Grangerís absence is supposed to mean opportunity for George. With the teamís previous top scoring option down, now is the time for the protťgť to become the master.

ďWhen itís all said and done, thatís the role I want to fill,Ē George said. ďIíve got time to grow into that, and there are a lot of great options around me, so itís been easy for me to come into my own because I got players that can help me and mentor me.Ē

It will be easier to remain patient if the team starts figuring out how to win some more games, which, at the end of the day, really is what matters for a team many hoped would be the second-best in the East this year.

ďWe are set up to be a winning program, and itís kind of frustrating that itís not happening, more so than me being a breakout player,í George said. ďBut if it takes me being a breakout player, I am going to work and rise to that level.Ē

The Indiana Pacers can ask nothing more.

vnzla81
11-13-2012, 12:18 PM
Ok so before anybody comes to tell us that Paul George has been a disappointment let me tell you that Paul George stats wise is at least one of the top 7 small forwards in the whole NBA.

8th on scoring at 14.3ppg. 6th on rebounds at 8.4 rpg. 15th on field goal % at .429%

21th on 3 point % at .333. 7th on APG with 3.4apg. 17th on steals per game 7th in blocks per game

7th in double doubles.


Again I know some people want him to be a 20ppg player so they can be happy but the fact is that Paul George is playing really well and the amazing part is that he can still get better.

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/double-doubles/position/small-forwards

By the way here are Danny's numbers from last year if you want to compared them:

http://m.bkref.com/m?p=XXplayersXXgXXgrangda01.html&t=2.

Eleazar
11-13-2012, 12:21 PM
As I said in another thread (before the Wizards game) if George was hitting the same percentage as he was last year he would be averaging 17ppg.

ErikD.
11-13-2012, 12:28 PM
“Of course I want that pressure,” George said. “A lot of guys my age, I don’t t think they would approach the game the way that I would. At the end of the day, I do want to be an All-Star. I do want to be the best player I can be. But most of all, I just want to win. Whether that’s scoring 15 points and 10-12 rebounds or 20-plus points a night, at the end of the day, with the team that I am surrounded by, I just want to win.”Personally, I like hearing this part. It may seem like it's just the right thing to say or whatever. But, that's more than just a fast, one-liner. I believe the guy means it.

naptownmenace
11-13-2012, 12:34 PM
Ok so before anybody comes to tell us that Paul George has been a disappointment let me tell you that Paul George stats wise is at least one of the top 7 small forwards in the whole NBA.

8th on scoring at 14.3ppg. 6th on rebounds at 8.4 rpg. 15th on field goal % at .429%

21th on 3 point % at .333. 7th on APG with 3.4apg. 17th on steals per game 7th in blocks per game

7th in double doubles.


Again I know some people want him to be a 20ppg player so they can be happy but the fact is that Paul George is playing really well and the amazing part is that he can still get better.

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/double-doubles/position/small-forwards

By the way here are Danny's numbers from last year if you want to compared them:

http://m.bkref.com/m?p=XXplayersXXgXXgrangda01.html&t=2.

The most important stat, IMO, is PER. More than anything else, PER shows how effective a player is an how efficient his production is.

Paul's PER so far is 13.26. That's below the league average and below his average from last year. He's been in a slump due to poor shooting but especially because of all the turnovers he made during the first 6 games.

The good news is that he had a good all around game on Saturday against the Wizards and he could be starting to make the adjustment. Having a few extra days off for practice should help as well. If he could just stop turning the ball over and attack the basket more (without turning the ball over). Also he needs to learn how to score out of the pick and roll and from post-up situations.

Sookie
11-13-2012, 01:02 PM
PER is skewed towards big men because so much emphasis is placed on shooting percentage. (Something that isn't particularly amazing in Paul's game right now.) It's a stat that sounds good but is a little overused to judge players.

I think people also need to remember that PG is way ahead of schedule for where the Pacers thought he would be in 3 years.

Derek2k3
11-13-2012, 01:09 PM
PER is skewed towards big men because so much emphasis is placed on shooting percentage. (Something that isn't particularly amazing in Paul's game right now.) It's a stat that sounds good but is a little overused to judge players.

I think people also need to remember that PG is way ahead of schedule for where the Pacers thought he would be in 3 years.

"Those guys with their bow-ties that have never played the game."

Hollinger's PER is...like any other stat, a semi-useful indicator of performance. However, like Sookie worte, it is skewed towards shooting percentages. Also, usage is reasonably important, and it doesn't adequately measure things like "hockey assists", steals/blocks/rebounds. I've always thought it was too skewed towards scoring.

Paul has really started some nice plays this season that he wouldn't get any statistical credit for. Driving, kicking, then having the extra pass made for an open three is something that the driver never gets credit for.

Tom White
11-13-2012, 01:17 PM
Ok so before anybody comes to tell us that Paul George has been a disappointment let me tell you that Paul George stats wise is at least one of the top 7 small forwards in the whole NBA.

8th on scoring at 14.3ppg. 6th on rebounds at 8.4 rpg. 15th on field goal % at .429%

21th on 3 point % at .333. 7th on APG with 3.4apg. 17th on steals per game 7th in blocks per game

7th in double doubles.

How does 8th + 6th + 15th + 21st + 7th + 17th + 7th + 7th work out to top 7?

When you look at 8th in scoring, then at 15th & 21st in the field goal %'s, it only tells me he is shooting more than some of the other SF's. Perhaps he also gets more free throw attempts than others?

TheDavisBrothers
11-13-2012, 02:12 PM
How does 8th + 6th + 15th + 21st + 7th + 17th + 7th + 7th work out to top 7?

When you look at 8th in scoring, then at 15th & 21st in the field goal %'s, it only tells me he is shooting more than some of the other SF's. Perhaps he also gets more free throw attempts than others?

He actually gets to the FT line very rarely, 1.7 times a game, which is the biggest hole in his game right now if you ask me. He needs to start atttacking the hoop, not only more often, but smarter. He is a great open court dunker, no doubt, but he is not a good finisher in traffic. He needs to take it to the hole with more purpose, sometimes I feel like he doesn't really know what to do once he gets in the lane unless he has an open hoop. He needs to have better control to be able to avoid charges, but to draw contact inside the cylinder. He also has to finish with more authority in the half court, for a guy that athletic it seems like he gets his shot blocked at the rim way too often. Taking it strong will not only help with his inside scoring, but it will also greatly help in getting his FT attempts up...

ColeTheMole
11-13-2012, 02:32 PM
How does 8th + 6th + 15th + 21st + 7th + 17th + 7th + 7th work out to top 7?


I bet it does work out around top 7, because maybe someone is ahead of him in scoring but maybe 34th in rebounds or something of the sort. He is top 21 in all of those categories. That is how he works to top 7.

3rdStrike
11-13-2012, 02:32 PM
Ok so before anybody comes to tell us that Paul George has been a disappointment let me tell you that Paul George stats wise is at least one of the top 7 small forwards in the whole NBA.


He's a SG, regardless of what you want to call him. Being X doesn't necessarily mean you aren't Y. Him being above average doesn't necessarily mean he isn't disappointing in important areas.

And for as much as I like reading these quotes from PG (he and Lance have been my favorite players on the team for a few yrs now), I've heard it all before. Weeks ago, months ago, this offseason, etc. He talks a great talk, I'd just like him to understand that it wouldn't kill him to take more shots, especially inside where he can earn free throws.

90'sNBARocked
11-14-2012, 04:18 PM
I think we have to all look at PG in possibly a different light. He may never turn into the dominant scorer we despreatley need, but his all around game cant be measured statistically. While watching the Raptors/Pacers game last night I saw Demar DeRosen abuse Lance a few times in a row, then Vogel switched and put PG on DeRosen, and PG shut him down. PG is an above average defender and rebounder , whose shooting will get better, we all want him to be like Reggie but he is much more like a young Derrick McKey

If we appreciate PG for what it is and look beyond the statistics, we will have more good things to say about him than bad

cdash
11-14-2012, 04:25 PM
Show that meanstreak. Be aggressive. This team needs you, right now. Step up and assert yourself. Walk up to Vogel and tell him to put the team on your shoulders. Start being a leader in the locker room. Stop talking the talk and start walking the walk, Paul.

Pacergeek
11-14-2012, 04:33 PM
Ok so before anybody comes to tell us that Paul George has been a disappointment let me tell you that Paul George stats wise is at least one of the top 7 small forwards in the whole NBA.

8th on scoring at 14.3ppg. 6th on rebounds at 8.4 rpg. 15th on field goal % at .429%

21th on 3 point % at .333. 7th on APG with 3.4apg. 17th on steals per game 7th in blocks per game

7th in double doubles.


Again I know some people want him to be a 20ppg player so they can be happy but the fact is that Paul George is playing really well and the amazing part is that he can still get better.

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/double-doubles/position/small-forwards

By the way here are Danny's numbers from last year if you want to compared them:

http://m.bkref.com/m?p=XXplayersXXgXXgrangda01.html&t=2.

If you play fantasy basketball, Paul has been a monster so far. In real life basketball, I think Paul has been slightly above average

Eleazar
11-14-2012, 04:54 PM
Paul just hasn't been shooting well. Yeah in the first few games he had some turnover problems, but that can happen at the beginning of the season. Those have been cut back to just 2 in each of the last few games. He has been one of the best defenders at his position, and has done better getting through screens. His rebounding is great. His dribbling is much improved from last year, not great but good. His assists are even up. He is averaging 2 ppg more than last year, while shooting extremely poorly. If he was shooting half decently he would be scoring the way people want him to.

Out of everyone only Lance is shooting even close to as well as they did last year, and he has far surpassed his shooting last year. Even Hansbrough is shooting worse (as hard as that is to believe).

cdash
11-14-2012, 04:59 PM
I think people also need to remember that PG is way ahead of schedule for where the Pacers thought he would be in 3 years.

How do you figure that? I think he is exactly where they figured he would be in 3 years.

vnzla81
11-14-2012, 05:13 PM
How do you figure that? I think he is exactly where they figured he would be in 3 years.

And that's not a bad thing, he is only 22 years old, I think he is like 3 years away to hit his prime, again to me the problem is not Paul George, the problem here is that the Pacers didn't do a good job in getting an scorer or shooters.

Eleazar
11-14-2012, 05:20 PM
I agree on needing a shooter, and I said the same thing last year. Although I think if they knew Lance was going to improve so much they most likely would hove gone after a shooter instead of Green. Not having someone you can trust to make every wide open shot they have, even if they are below average at everything else, is an important role this team has been missing off the bench.

clownskull
11-14-2012, 05:22 PM
He actually gets to the FT line very rarely, 1.7 times a game, which is the biggest hole in his game right now if you ask me. He needs to start atttacking the hoop, not only more often, but smarter. He is a great open court dunker, no doubt, but he is not a good finisher in traffic. He needs to take it to the hole with more purpose, sometimes I feel like he doesn't really know what to do once he gets in the lane unless he has an open hoop. He needs to have better control to be able to avoid charges, but to draw contact inside the cylinder. He also has to finish with more authority in the half court, for a guy that athletic it seems like he gets his shot blocked at the rim way too often. Taking it strong will not only help with his inside scoring, but it will also greatly help in getting his FT attempts up...

i think perhaps the biggest reason he doesn't get to the line more often is that he has been spending too much time chucking up 3's. if you take a look at every game since his 1st game this season, just under half his shots are from downtown. that is simply too many. hard to get to the line when nearly half of your shorts are from long distance.

Trophy
11-14-2012, 05:54 PM
I agree on needing a shooter, and I said the same thing last year. Although I think if they knew Lance was going to improve so much they most likely would hove gone after a shooter instead of Green. Not having someone you can trust to make every wide open shot they have, even if they are below average at everything else, is an important role this team has been missing off the bench.

The FO was really high on Green, regardless.

He was a player we were looking for.

vnzla81
11-14-2012, 06:08 PM
i think perhaps the biggest reason he doesn't get to the line more often is that he has been spending too much time chucking up 3's. if you take a look at every game since his 1st game this season, just under half his shots are from downtown. that is simply too many. hard to get to the line when nearly half of your shorts are from long distance.

I thought people wanted Paul George to replace Danny, jacking up 3's seems about right to me.

CJ Jones
11-14-2012, 06:17 PM
i think perhaps the biggest reason he doesn't get to the line more often is that he has been spending too much time chucking up 3's. if you take a look at every game since his 1st game this season, just under half his shots are from downtown. that is simply too many. hard to get to the line when nearly half of your shorts are from long distance.

I honestly believe all the charges his rookie year scarred him. Ever since he's been really indecisive going to the rim. I wish he'd just start charging into people again until he learns how to avoid them because right now he so soft and lost when he gets in the paint. He's my favorite player, and kills me to see him play so scared.

xIndyFan
11-14-2012, 06:18 PM
. . . I'd just like him to understand that it wouldn't kill him to take more shots, especially inside where he can earn free throws.

Me too. I keep waiting and waiting for paul to finally start using the 4 inch height advantage he has. So far, like everything else in his game, flashes of good play, but mostly not quite there. :sigh:


The FO was really high on Green, regardless.

He was a player we were looking for.

I suspect both Gerald and Ian are guys that Kevin Pritchard's analytics identified as good fits. I've read stuff that he's big on that kind of thing.

Magic P
11-14-2012, 06:19 PM
My problem with PG is that he hasn't mastered anything yet offensively. You can't count on him doing any one thing well. Rip Hamilton mastered fifteen foot jump shots. Leave Ray Allen open for three, goodnight. Tracey McGrady attacking the basket good luck stopping that. PG doesn't do any one thing consistently well he's scared to dunk on people and he has the talent to, it's frustrating watching him.

He should get ten points a game just from slashing to the basket alone.

Pacer Fan
11-14-2012, 06:23 PM
So, if Paul could go into a game hitting his shot, then they will keep feeding him. But, if he misses a few shots and turns the ball over, then he is going to clam up. This, this is a coaching issue. He, they can't have it both ways. A shooter shoots and a scorer scores, so feed Paul the freakin rock 40 times and attempt 20 times, have the bigs get position and rebound. Get on with it.

To be great, one has to attempt to be first!

cdash
11-14-2012, 06:27 PM
And that's not a bad thing, he is only 22 years old, I think he is like 3 years away to hit his prime, again to me the problem is not Paul George, the problem here is that the Pacers didn't do a good job in getting an scorer or shooters.

No not at a bad thing at all.

CJ Jones
11-14-2012, 06:48 PM
So, if Paul could go into a game hitting his shot, then they will keep feeding him. But, if he misses a few shots and turns the ball over, then he is going to clam up. This, this is a coaching issue. He, they can't have it both ways. A shooter shoots and a scorer scores, so feed Paul the freakin rock 40 times and attempt 20 times, have the bigs get position and rebound. Get on with it.

To be great, one has to attempt to be first!

Exactly. People are expecting too much, too soon from Paul. We want him to kill it offensively, but the coaches aren't asking him to do any more than he has in the past. He still the 4th option with about the same usage rate as last year.

It's funny how when people make excuses for Paul they get shot down quickly, but then the same people are quick to blame our wings and Danny being gone for Hibbert's struggles. :laugh: good stuff.