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View Full Version : NBA top ten power forwards and top ten NBA centers SI.com



vnzla81
10-15-2012, 03:24 PM
Not sure if I agree with Aldridge and Josh Smith that low.


1 Love
2 Dirk
3 Blake
4 Bosh
5 KG
6 Aldridge
7 Gasol
8 Amare
9 Josh Smith
10 Duncan.


http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/lists/top-10-power-forwards-kevin-love-dirk-nowitzki-blake-griffin-100312#tab=photo-title=Tim+Duncan%252C+San+Antonio+Spurs&photo=31357167

vnzla81
10-15-2012, 03:29 PM
Top ten center:

1 Howard
2 Bynum
3 Gasol
4 Chandler
5 Noah
6 Al Jefferson
7 Greg Monroe
8 Cousins
9 Brook Lopez


10Roy Hibbert, Indiana Pacers He doesn't jump like Javale McGee. He doesn't score like Nene, rebound like Marcin Gortat or block shots like Andrew Bogut. Yet Hibbert does everything well enough to get the nod over those more physically gifted centers, a testament to his work ethic and steady improvement. In his fourth NBA season, the 7-foot-2 Hibbert completed his rise from big stiff to All-Star and got a max contract to boot.

Sandman21
10-15-2012, 03:30 PM
Griffin at 3 is ridiculous if you ask me.

Major Cold
10-15-2012, 03:38 PM
I would out DA at 3 and KG at 4. Or switch them. Blake at 5. Bosh or Gasol at 6. Josh Smith at 7 and Amare at 8.

Centers
Lopez scores great, but he is not the all-around player that Hibbert is. Nene could beat him out if he was healthy. I would put Cousins ahead of Monroe on pure play.

BRushWithDeath
10-15-2012, 03:41 PM
There are at least 5 guys after Griffin who should be ahead of him.

pacer4ever
10-15-2012, 03:41 PM
Aldridge underrated like always I could debate him being #1 on the list #6 is a joke. Same with Duncan at #10 his #s will be down because they save him but he should be higher and probably on the C list same with KG they both play more C than PF now and still have a ton of game left.


Cousins at #8 is a joke have him as my #2 but the others Cs are about right 3-10 can go in just about any order IMO not much difference.

Unclebuck
10-15-2012, 03:44 PM
Does Kevin Love play any defense? I mean is his defense even as good as Dirk's. Blake doesn't play much defense either

I remember back in the day the power forward position was defense first.

hackashaq
10-15-2012, 04:30 PM
Does Kevin Love play any defense? I mean is his defense even as good as Dirk's. Blake doesn't play much defense either

I remember back in the day the power forward position was defense first.

Love played very solid D last year.

Anyway, since this is basically a wishlist and not a real ranking based on what positions these guys actually play.... my top 10s would be:

Top 10 PFs:
1. Love
2. Dirk
3. Aldridge
4. Pau
5. Bosh
6. Griffin
7. Al Horford
8. Duncan
9. KG
10. Monroe

Top 10 centers:
1. Howard
2. Bynum
3. Marc Gasol
4. Tyson Chandler
5. Duncan
6. Pau
7. KG
8. Noah
9. Bosh
10. Cousins

Derek2k3
10-15-2012, 04:34 PM
Lol at Griffin #3 and Noah #5. And for that matter, here's a hearty laugh for Lopez at #9

BillS
10-15-2012, 04:40 PM
Top 10 centers:
1. Howard
2. Bynum
3. Marc Gasol
4. Tyson Chandler
5. Duncan
6. Pau
7. KG
8. Noah
9. Bosh
10. Cousins

OK, wait, you are taking Bosh AT CENTER over Hibbert?

Derek2k3
10-15-2012, 04:42 PM
OK, wait, you are taking Bosh AT CENTER over Hibbert?

Any time you can take a thin, 6/11 finesse player and start him at the 5 over a stronger, 7/2 guy, you have to do it.

BRushWithDeath
10-15-2012, 04:47 PM
I'm taking Bosh over Hibbert at center if that is where I have to play him. Comfortably.

hackashaq
10-15-2012, 04:49 PM
Bosh is a much better offensive talent, his D skillset is different but overall defensive quality is similar, he can give much more minutes, and he did an admirable job overall at 5 last year. So, yes.

Heisenberg
10-15-2012, 04:51 PM
Man I hate these lists. Players don't play in a vacuum. And yes, I'd say the same thing if Roy were #1.

Pace Maker
10-15-2012, 05:50 PM
I'd put Hibbert above Noah and Lopez. Not sure about Monroe, haven't seem him play much.

spreedom
10-15-2012, 06:27 PM
When will people stop calling Tim Duncan a power forward? It's mind-boggling. He hasn't played primarily as a four since Rasho left.

Bricklayer
10-15-2012, 06:50 PM
It's a miracle of miracles that we were a top five team last year with only two players at the bottom of these highly scientific and unbiased reviews... I wonder where our starting five would rank in terms of plus/minus against the other teams...

hackashaq
10-15-2012, 07:04 PM
It's a miracle of miracles that we were a top five team last year with only two players at the bottom of these highly scientific and unbiased reviews... I wonder where our starting five would rank in terms of plus/minus against the other teams...

We have plenty of talent, none of our starters was bad. Also, you've only seen 3 rankings. Granger is ranked #7 among SFs, but vnzla isn't going to make a pro-Granger thread. :laugh:

Kstat
10-15-2012, 07:27 PM
Does Kevin Love play any defense? I mean is his defense even as good as Dirk's. Blake doesn't play much defense either

I remember back in the day the power forward position was defense first.

You dont remember correctly.

The best power forward in the NBA from 1989-1994 could not play a lick of defense.

NapTonius Monk
10-15-2012, 07:51 PM
Does Kevin Love play any defense? I mean is his defense even as good as Dirk's. Blake doesn't play much defense either

I remember back in the day the power forward position was defense first.

http://l.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/OTb1_38yavnicVhy1iMwxw--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7cT04NTt3PTYzMA--/http://media.zenfs.com/en/blogs/sptusnbaexperts/88982378.jpg

pacers74
10-15-2012, 08:20 PM
Hibbert will be a top 5 center after this year. I wouldn't trade him for anyone in the top ten. I also think West will suprise everyone and be close to a top ten after this year. He was a top ten guy before his injury.

graphic-er
10-15-2012, 08:34 PM
The idea that cousins, monroe, and most laughable Lopez are above Hibbert is truly saddening, since when have these 3 guys been the offensive and defensive focal point for a 50+ win team (adjusted for lock out). I just think to be named top ten at anything you actually have to bring the wins.

Pacergeek
10-15-2012, 08:35 PM
I don't want to sound like a homer, but if you watched the 2012 playoffs, David West has to be ranked ahead of Blake Griffin. Whomever made these rankings is obviously a Pacer hater. You cannot convince me that Brook Lopez is a better player than Big Roy

Kstat
10-15-2012, 08:49 PM
Not this again.....

BRushWithDeath
10-15-2012, 08:49 PM
I don't want to sound like a homer, but if you watched the 2012 playoffs, David West has to be ranked ahead of Blake Griffin. Whomever made these rankings is obviously a Pacer hater. You cannot convince me that Brook Lopez is a better player than Big Roy
Then you should have stopped after the bold.

And I'm obviously not much of a Griffin fan

Kstat
10-15-2012, 08:50 PM
The idea that cousins, monroe, and most laughable Lopez are above Hibbert is truly saddening, since when have these 3 guys been the offensive and defensive focal point for a 50+ win team (adjusted for lock out). I just think to be named top ten at anything you actually have to bring the wins.

...that's awfully self serving.....

shags
10-15-2012, 08:54 PM
The funny thing about the power forward list is that Bosh, Garnett, Aldridge, and Duncan will start at center for there teams this season.

Then again, it's also possible Monroe starts at power forward for his.

Pacergeek
10-15-2012, 09:02 PM
Then you should have stopped after the bold.

And I'm obviously not much of a Griffin fan

LOL bro. Griffen stunk it up the playoffs. He was on the bench to close out a tense game 7. I'm not trying to hate on BG, but one could argue that West is better. Forget the dunking and the Sports Center highlights

Pacerized
10-15-2012, 09:04 PM
The only centers on that list that I'd say are clearly better then Hibbert are Howard, Bynum, Gasol. If Bynum continues with injury issues this year he has to be taken out of the top 5 and I'm not even sold on Howard being his old self until I see him play for a season. IMO Roy is a top 5 center now. Placing Noah at 5 and Hibbert that low kills any credibility for the ranking.

vnzla81
10-15-2012, 09:07 PM
Not this again.....

:laugh: I don't think he is the only that believes that by the way.

spreedom
10-15-2012, 09:40 PM
Who does Nikola Pekovic have to kill to get on that list?

No seriously. He'll kill someone.

vnzla81
10-15-2012, 09:42 PM
You dont remember correctly.

The best power forward in the NBA from 1989-1994 could not play a lick of defense.

Malone?

Young
10-15-2012, 10:06 PM
Malone?

Charles Barkley

naptownmenace
10-15-2012, 10:16 PM
You dont remember correctly.

The best power forward in the NBA from 1989-1994 could not play a lick of defense.

Charles Barkley didn't play any defense? I totally disagree.

hackashaq
10-15-2012, 10:53 PM
Who does Nikola Pekovic have to kill to get on that list?

No seriously. He'll kill someone.

haha I think he might (kill someone). He needs to start with Dwight Howard and then work down the list.

hackashaq
10-15-2012, 10:54 PM
Charles Barkley didn't play any defense? I totally disagree.

he played it quite well when he wanted to. He just didn't want to most of the time.

Lance George
10-15-2012, 11:05 PM
Anyone who watched Tyson Chandler in this past postseason and still has him ranked as the fourth-best center in the league has zero credibility.

http://oi46.tinypic.com/2219jt.jpg

Your fourth-best center in the league, ladies and gentlemen.

Derek2k3
10-15-2012, 11:29 PM
Anyone who watched Tyson Chandler in this past postseason and still has him ranked as the fourth-best center in the league has zero credibility.

http://oi46.tinypic.com/2219jt.jpg

Your fourth-best center in the league, ladies and gentlemen.

But, but, 44% shooting is pretty good for a C. And he, uh, changes the game. In ways that don't show up in stats. Or wins. It's just...a feeling! KNICKS

spreedom
10-16-2012, 12:02 AM
Charles Barkley didn't play any defense? I totally disagree.

Charles Barkley even says that Charles Barkley didn't play any defense.

spreedom
10-16-2012, 12:03 AM
Anyone who watched Tyson Chandler in this past postseason and still has him ranked as the fourth-best center in the league has zero credibility.

http://oi46.tinypic.com/2219jt.jpg

Your fourth-best center in the league, ladies and gentlemen.


Anyone who completely dismisses the ability of a player based on a five-game series against the eventual NBA champions has zero credibility.

When Chandler's on the court, he's the real deal. Deserving of every accolade (even if the Mavs secretly got better defensively after he left).

Pace Maker
10-16-2012, 12:22 AM
I find it amusing how the media overrates Griffin to hell and PD underrates him to hell. Is he that hard to rank? lol

King Tuts Tomb
10-16-2012, 12:23 AM
Kind of a stupid list. The explanations are a little fuzzy as to why one guy ranks about another.

I'm surprised at the Blake hate in this thread. He's played two years in the league, averaged 21 and 11, is a hard worker and great teammate to go along with being an athletic freak. I'd easily put him over Dirk on this list.

hackashaq
10-16-2012, 12:39 AM
I find it amusing how the media overrates Griffin to hell and PD underrates him to hell. Is he that hard to rank? lol

I think most of PD will say he's somewhere in the 2nd tier alongside Bosh, Aldridge, Pau and several others but behind Love and Dirk. We can disagree on the exact spot, but I think most agree on the tier.

But of course, there has to be one or two West > Blake statements. It would be dull without those.

Heisenberg
10-16-2012, 12:46 AM
Pau's on the decline sure, but holy hell is that dude disrespected these days. A paid professional ranking him below Aldridge, Bosh, and Blake is just awful. KG's got the intangibles argument and is still an extremely elite defender, but I'd still take Pau.

Lance George
10-16-2012, 02:20 AM
Anyone who completely dismisses the ability of a player based on a five-game series against the eventual NBA champions has zero credibility.

Top-tier players don't lay eggs when it matters most. I'm sorry you can't comprehend that.

mattie
10-16-2012, 02:22 AM
Love's number's are absolutely ridiculous, but still I wonder why his team doesn't perform better than it does. I sometimes wonder if Love's numbers aren't actually reflecting his effect on the court. Is his defense poor? I honestly wouldn't know how to rank him. I'll admit though as I said before, his numbers are easily the best of any 4 in the league. I do not want to call him the best 4 though.

Blake I think is in the same boat. Though his numbers aren't as great as Love's, they're still really high, but you wonder if he's as good as the numbers.. I've watched Blake more so I think he's an easier player to understand. Outstanding performance in transition allows for him to get a lot of easy baskets, but he isn't able to take over and dominate a game like you'd expect someone with his scoring average. (and most people who do score that much can dominate a game). His defense appears to be pretty poor most of the time as well.

15th parallel
10-16-2012, 02:27 AM
Pau's on the decline sure, but holy hell is that dude disrespected these days. A paid professional ranking him below Aldridge, Bosh, and Blake is just awful. KG's got the intangibles argument and is still an extremely elite defender, but I'd still take Pau.

This is true. Pau is very much undervalued around the league. His numbers are still impressive even if he's on the declining part of his career, and is still the one of the best PFs in the league. He's the second option on the elite Lakers team, so I'd say he deserves the top 5.

Kstat
10-16-2012, 02:43 AM
Love has been on a crap team his entire career. They were on pace to make the playoffs last year before their only other good player tore up his ankle.

Eleazar
10-16-2012, 02:54 AM
Love's number's are absolutely ridiculous, but still I wonder why his team doesn't perform better than it does. I sometimes wonder if Love's numbers aren't actually reflecting his effect on the court. Is his defense poor? I honestly wouldn't know how to rank him. I'll admit though as I said before, his numbers are easily the best of any 4 in the league. I do not want to call him the best 4 though.

Blake I think is in the same boat. Though his numbers aren't as great as Love's, they're still really high, but you wonder if he's as good as the numbers.. I've watched Blake more so I think he's an easier player to understand. Outstanding performance in transition allows for him to get a lot of easy baskets, but he isn't able to take over and dominate a game like you'd expect someone with his scoring average. (and most people who do score that much can dominate a game). His defense appears to be pretty poor most of the time as well.

I am of the opinion if you have one of the best 5 PFs or Cs in the league you should have a team that is capable of making the playoffs. That is why I question if Love is really a top PF or just a really good one who is on a team where there is no one else inflating his numbers.

To me Griffin is the Vince Carter of the PF position. He will wost likely put up great stats for most of his career, but they will mostly be hollow.


I just went to the link ad saw KGs picture. Haha, he looks bat **** crazy there.

Jose Slaughter
10-16-2012, 03:24 AM
If you're the best player on a bad team shouldn't the other teams D be focused on you, diminishing your impact and stats.

If they're focused on you and you still put up good numbers, maybe you're better than the stats lead us to believe.

Heisenberg
10-16-2012, 03:29 AM
If you're the best player on a bad team shouldn't the other teams D be focused on you, diminishing your impact and stats.

If they're focused on you and you still put up good numbers, maybe you're better than the stats lead us to believe.Danny being the obvious outlier assuming this is a true argument.

Kstat
10-16-2012, 03:33 AM
Love's team WAS good last year until Rubio went down. People forget that.

hackashaq
10-16-2012, 04:10 AM
so in 04-05 when the Lakers sucked, Kobe wasn't a top 5 SG? or does that requirement apply to big men only?

BillS
10-16-2012, 09:32 AM
Anyone who completely dismisses the ability of a player based on a five-game series against the eventual NBA champions has zero credibility.

But the Pacers' results against the eventual NBA champions are at the heart of pretty much every criticism of them as a team. Funny, that.

Naptown_Seth
10-16-2012, 11:24 AM
There are at least ALL guys after Griffin who should be ahead of him.
My fix. ;)

I love Griffin and his speed/power combo is deadly, but his total game is not well rounded and a guy like Aldridge is a beast compared to him. The passing and low block play of Gasol, the all-around game of Smith, the post offense and agility of Amare, Duncan's perfectly pure fundamentals game that makes the hard look easy....just a bunch of guys with less PR but easily as much or more impact on games.


As for Kevin Love, he might be one of the greatest rebounders ever when it's all done. Not Troy "steal uncontested boards" great, but "excuse me but I'll be taking this rebound position from you now" great. And he has the outside touch to boot.

I think he plays smart enough defense to not get in trouble, even though he is not a defensive player himself. He doesn't chase or try to do more than he reasonably could which means he often doesn't get out of position. This gives his teammates a chance to help him out.

Naptown_Seth
10-16-2012, 11:31 AM
If you're the best player on a bad team shouldn't the other teams D be focused on you, diminishing your impact and stats.

If they're focused on you and you still put up good numbers, maybe you're better than the stats lead us to believe.
This was the point I brought up at the PD party.

If I quote the +/- statistic then people say "oh, but that's all about who you are playing with, they make you look better or worse". But if we talk about rebounds or scoring then suddenly you get this massive benefit from playing with crappy players.

Make up you freaking minds stat-haters, either playing with Shaq makes it easier to have a good 3P% or playing without him does. Either playing with Nash means you'll get more open looks and have a higher FG% or you are better off playing without him.


Sure if you go by POINTS ONLY then being the star on a team and taking 500 shots a night you will get points, but your FG% will suck, your PPS will suck, your FTAs per possession will suck, your rebounds and steals will suck, everything that is non-volume related will look horrible because your crappy teammates are keeping you from getting the best possible looks or situations.

The star player that has to help everyone on defense is going to be more tired on offense. The rebounder fighting inside will be tanked when it comes to scoring. The shooter that constantly has to get his own shot is going to be screwed when it comes to quality looks. He'll never get to take a play off and watch another guy work the post or run off screens or break someone down off the dribble. It's always him doing those things.


And somehow as a way of dismissing players on losing teams this gets turned into "oh, he had it easy because he was ON A BAD TEAM?" That make no sense in any possible way.

Playing against bad teams helps you, not being on one.

Naptown_Seth
10-16-2012, 11:45 AM
Then you should have stopped after the bold.

And I'm obviously not much of a Griffin fan
There is almost something to it though because West is dramatically more skilled in the low block scoring moves area, as well as the fadeaway from the triple threat. Griffin explodes when he can find space, but West can score without space, even stepping through doubles pretty effectively.

Blake is obviously faster and more athletic and this gives him a clear advantage on boards and blocks. But he's not a great defender himself and is lacking in low block scoring moves.

I like Griffin actually but he's got the size of Love with more athletic ability and has yet to use it nearly as well as Love does. If he gets there then he'll shoot to #1 on this list. He could be Kemp in his prime if he puts it together.

Kstat
10-16-2012, 11:48 AM
Those things are all true....

...and 30 out of 30 NBA GMs would laugh their asses off if you asked the which player they would rather have, including bird or Walsh.

This is like extolling the virtues of rik smits as a free throw shooter and high post threat in pick and roll situations over Shaquille

Yes there are things he does better. Just don't imply the ridiculous notion that he's the better player.

Love vs griffin is and will be a fantastic and ongoing debate. Either of them vs David west is silly.

The funny thing is I am a HUGE fan of David west. I was a huge fan of dale Davis too, back in the day. But I never lost my marbles and decided he was a top-5 power forward at any point.

vnzla81
10-16-2012, 11:55 AM
Kstat I told you that more people thought that West is better than Griffin :laugh:

hackashaq
10-16-2012, 03:36 PM
It's funny, if Griffin was 6'6 with super long arms and big butt, and played the way he does, everyone would be talking how he's the next Round Mound of Rebound. Instead, he has a ripped 6'10 body with penguin arms which make him about as limited as the above but opens him up to criticism. How can a guy who looks like that not dominate on D? He has no reliable go-to move! He look like Bron but he no block transition shots!

Sure, he's not a complete player yet. But those aren't fake points or imaginary rebounds or assists or efficiency. Strength, quickness, jumping ability, handle, passing, hustle, and actual brains. I don't know that since Barkley we've seen a PF as good at all of those. Maybe if you count LeBron as PF, he has a comparable combination.

Yes, Griffin desperately needs to work on his shot, and then his D and post moves will need work too. But clearly, he's near the very top right now at his position, with potential to develop into an MVP type one day.

mattie
10-16-2012, 03:49 PM
I can't believe anyone thinks West is anywhere near Griffin. That's ridiculous.

docpaul
10-16-2012, 03:55 PM
Going forward, methinks we're in a fair amount of danger filling the 4 effectively. Looking at this list and this conversation makes that even more clear.

spreedom
10-16-2012, 08:06 PM
Top-tier players don't lay eggs when it matters most. I'm sorry you can't comprehend that.


Opposite of thanks for that crazy logic.