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Psyren
10-02-2012, 11:13 PM
Mike Wells
Indianapolis Star
http://blogs.indystar.com/pacersinsider/


Here are some tidbits from the first day of practice:

–The starters picked up where they left off last season. It was like they played Game 6 against Miami two days ago. That’s how well they clicked together on the court. And before you say Miami beat the Pacers in that game, just know the Pacers outscored the Heat by 58 in the series when they had all five starters on the court together.

–Lance Stephenson definitely worked on his jump shot during the offseason. He’s shooting it with a lot more confidence instead of pounding the ball into the ground trying to beat his man off the dribble.

–George Hill is looking to assert himself even more on offense. He made sure everybody was involved in the offense, but he also picked his spots to be aggressive.

–Gerald Green is more than a leaper. He’s got a nice looking jump shot. Expect him to be the focal point of the offense with the second unit.

–Speaking of the second unit, D.J. Augustin will make sure the offense runs smooth in the second unit. He was thinking pass first when they scrimmaged in the halfcourt. Augustin started 142 of the 282 games he played with the Charlotte Bobcats.

–I’d be shocked if Sam Young didn’t make the roster. Coach Frank Vogel put Young with the starters when they shut Danny Granger down for the final hour or so of practice to rest his left knee. The main reason Vogel put Young with the starters is because he wants the second unit – Augustin, Green, Lance Stephenson, Tyler Hansbrough and Ian Mahinmi – to play together as much as possible. Still, the Pacers like Young’s toughness.

–Pacers PR ace David Benner made sure to point out that he didn’t see Blake Ahearn miss a shot during a workout last week. It’s not often that I agree with my guy Benner, who I must say is one of the best in the league at his job, but he was right. I only saw Ahearn miss two shots during the morning and evening practice sessions. He’s competing with Sundiata Gaines to be the third point guard on the roster.

–Vogel did a lot of talk about “what playoff teams” do when they were going through different drills. Tuesday was just the start. He’ll remind his team that throughout the entire season.

–The Pacers will practice twice Wednesday, once Thursday, twice Friday and likely only once Saturday.

imawhat
10-03-2012, 12:41 AM
Right where we left off...that's music to my ears.

If healthy we'll probably have a strong start to the season.

wintermute
10-03-2012, 04:38 AM
Also good to hear that Granger can practice, even if limited. Guess his injury really isn't serious.

Like everyone else, I'm excited about Gerald Green. Talent was never his issue. Hope he's really found his game.


Right where we left off...that's music to my ears.

If healthy we'll probably have a strong start to the season.

Yeah. On paper, our talent level isn't that great, but IMO chemistry accounted for a big part of our success last year. Not unreasonable to think it would carry over.

Sparhawk
10-03-2012, 10:27 AM
So pumped.

The sky is the limit for this team.

mattie
10-03-2012, 10:39 AM
The sky is the limit for this team.

Too bad the Heat left footprints on the moon..

:halo:

glazedham42
10-03-2012, 11:20 AM
Too bad the Heat left footprints on the moon..

:halo:

http://troll.me/images/joseph-ducreux/i-see-what-you-did-there-good-sir.jpg

QuickRelease
10-03-2012, 12:15 PM
http://troll.me/images/joseph-ducreux/i-see-what-you-did-there-good-sir.jpg:laugh: I can't wait for October 12. Even the pre-season is exciting!

WhoLovesYaBaby?
10-03-2012, 01:19 PM
The Pacer's have an excellent starting unit that should be even better this year. That is no secret. Augustin running the offense and not looking to score is good news. He is a miserable shooter (except oddly enough he does hit the 3 at a half decent clip). I am trusting that the Pacers made good acquisitions for the bench. If so, they are going to seriously challenge for the Central Division title. And have a shot at dethroning the Heat, maybe a long shot, but a shot.

picasso
10-03-2012, 01:28 PM
Im loving this. Team is focused and no longer fooling around. Vogel has also changed in a great way.
He was more of a fan his first year in a half. Team is hungry and wants more success. Something I
want from my team. Team knows what it has to do to get it done.

Pacemaker
10-03-2012, 01:29 PM
I'm rooting for Ahearn to make the team we need a deadly shooter ala Novak!

imbtyler
10-03-2012, 02:26 PM
I'm rooting for Ahearn to make the team we need a deadly shooter ala Novak!

I really think Gerald Green is going to be our reliable perimeter assassin.

Johanvil
10-03-2012, 03:01 PM
If the second team consists of DJ,Lance,Green,Tyler and Manhimi, isn't it a bit weak defensively?I'm talking especially about the 2 guards and Tyler.That's on paper of course and if he plans to have that team coming off the bench.

Psyren
10-03-2012, 03:22 PM
If the second team consists of DJ,Lance,Green,Tyler and Manhimi, isn't it a bit weak defensively?I'm talking especially about the 2 guards and Tyler.That's on paper of course and if he plans to have that team coming off the bench.

Yes, it is.

One way to instantly fix that is to replace Lance with Sam Young who is a very good perimeter defender.

Strummer
10-03-2012, 04:04 PM
More from Wells, for what it's worth.


What I’ve like about Green so far – other than his dunks – is his outside shot. The same goes for Stephenson. He’s shooting the ball like he knows he’s going to make it. He’s also playing under control.
link (http://blogs.indystar.com/pacersinsider/2012/10/03/pacers-just-a-little-more-bench-talk/)

MvPlumlee
10-03-2012, 04:33 PM
If the second team consists of DJ,Lance,Green,Tyler and Manhimi, isn't it a bit weak defensively?I'm talking especially about the 2 guards and Tyler.That's on paper of course and if he plans to have that team coming off the bench.

Mahinmi is the only one who can play good defense and he easily picks up fouls... I don't believe our bench will look the same at the end of the season

More from Montieth
http://www.nba.com/pacers/news/improved-bench-key-pacers-growth

Former team president Larry Bird had decided to take him with the 11th pick, but Charlotte intercepted him at No. 9. Augustin's agent had told him when the eighth selection came up that he was going to the Pacers. The tap on the shoulder from Charlotte president Michael Jordan came as a shock, because the Bobcats had not worked him out before the draft.


Hansbrough is said to have sharpened his skills, adding a left hand to his offensive game.

Hicks
10-03-2012, 04:48 PM
It sounds like we'll need our second unit to answer scores with more scores rather than slowing teams down.

CableKC
10-04-2012, 02:17 AM
It sounds like we'll need our second unit to answer scores with more scores rather than slowing teams down.
I think that what Day 2 in Training Camp should ease your concerns about scoring off the bench:

http://blogs.indystar.com/pacersinsider/


Pacers: Just a little more bench talk

2:51 PM, Oct. 03, 2012 | Written by Mike Wells | 0 Comments

Lance Stephenson runs drills during the Pacers rookie/ free agent camp on Thursday, July 5, at Bankers Life Fieldhouse. Chet Strange / The Star

I thought we were done talking about the second unit until at least the first preseason game next season.

Coach Frank Vogel changed my thought process after practice today.

Vogel, unsolicited, couldn’t stop gushing about Gerald Green and Lance Stephenson playing together with the second unit.

Vogel raved about the duo’s athleticism and their ability to get to the basket in the open court. He feels very confident that they won’t have a problem scoring with those two in the game.

I got an up close look at Green’s athleticism during practice Tuesday when he snuck along the baseline and caught an oop from D.J. Augustin for a dunk. It was like Green, a former dunk champion, paused in the air to wait for the ball to catch up to him before dunking it in.

What I’ve like about Green so far – other than his dunks – is his outside shot. The same goes for Stephenson. He’s shooting the ball like he knows he’s going to make it. He’s also playing under control.

Of course this is only practice. But if the past few days have been any indication, you won’t have anything to worry about offensively with the bench.

Green and Stephenson’s defense, however, is a different story.

We’ll save that for another day.
My guess is that Wells saw your post and decided to ease your concerns ;)

Hicks
10-04-2012, 02:28 AM
Actually, it was the opposite; I had read his blog and that drove me to consider that the bench probably isn't going to be good defensively, but they might have the relative amount of firepower needed to answer with more buckets if/when the opposing team scores on them. They just need to break even when they're out there; our starters will be responsible for building leads.

Mad-Mad-Mario
10-04-2012, 08:07 AM
One upside to our bench trying to run with other teams is that those teams will be expending more energy. So if they try to use their starters against our bench our starters can rejoin the game fresh going against tired legs

Sparhawk
10-04-2012, 09:12 AM
Actually, it was the opposite; I had read his blog and that drove me to consider that the bench probably isn't going to be good defensively, but they might have the relative amount of firepower needed to answer with more buckets if/when the opposing team scores on them. They just need to break even when they're out there; our starters will be responsible for building leads.

And I'm ok with that. Completely ok. Last season the second unit defense was shaky, but they couldn't score at all! If the Pacers have the lead, bench comes in and matches point for point, I'd call that a victory over what we saw last season.

Hopefully other teams benches won't be as solid, so they won't be able to score as well as our bench.

Again, all this is practice talk...but I do think it will carry over!

PacersHomer
10-04-2012, 09:52 AM
Most teams don't have great defensive 2nd units, so I'm not too concerned. I think the bench is going to be really, really fun to watch.

Marlin
10-04-2012, 09:59 AM
I really think Gerald Green is going to be our reliable perimeter assassin.

Gotta say, I'm really curious to see what he can do with our team. Excited might be a better word, as I saw more than a few Nets games this past season (fantasy purposes and all, don't bash me) and he really stepped up and improved his game. Everyone and his mother know he's a high flying, uber athletic dude, but he has developed a smooth jump shot...ok, nothing Ray Allen-esque, but that's a rare combination you look for in a starter, and we can say we have it coming off the bench.

Assuming he keeps it up, and that would be very important because his bench scoring is absolutely needed, it's gonna be an interesting spot to keep an eye on, indeed.

After the opener here in my country, I can't wait for NBA preseason. Yeah, I'm that basketball doped :nerd:

Freddie fan
10-04-2012, 10:23 AM
My hope is that the second unit gives good effort on defense, even if it isn't particularly good on defense. I think that for the Pacers to be a good defensive team (and they need to be a good defensive team), everyone who plays needs to give good effort on defense.

Tom White
10-04-2012, 12:17 PM
It sounds like we'll need our second unit to answer scores with more scores rather than slowing teams down.

Or, hopefully, to make other teams answer our 2nd units own scoring.

dal9
10-04-2012, 04:16 PM
More from Montieth
http://www.nba.com/pacers/news/improved-bench-key-pacers-growth

Hansbrough is said to have sharpened his skills, adding a left hand to his offensive game.

= 1. drive right
2. punch defender in face with left hand.
3. throw up righthanded shot from hip.

Sparhawk
10-04-2012, 08:22 PM
= 1. drive right
2. punch defender in face with left hand.
3. throw up righthanded shot from hip.

I have serious doubts that Tyler learned how to use his left hand in one offseason. I doubt he'll ever be able to use it. He isn't going to get better.

daschysta
10-04-2012, 09:02 PM
http://www.indystar.com/article/20121003/SPORTS04/210040328/Pacers-forward-David-West-making-most-training-camp

West sounds like he's going to have a great season! He really was a different player the final 2 months of the season and in the playoffs than he was most of the year, if we have late season West all year long we're in for a great year of Pacers basketball!

pizza guy
10-04-2012, 10:04 PM
Most teams don't have great defensive 2nd units, so I'm not too concerned. I think the bench is going to be really, really fun to watch.

This is what I was thinking. Most teams aren't going to have a bench that can really play defense that well. The Bulls might be the only ones who could call their bench defense a strength. If Green, DJ, and Lance can be as dynamic as these reports make them sound, we won't have to worry about their defense.

What's really strange is that I honestly don't know what to expect from this team, as far as playoffs or ceiling. I like the guys we retained as starters, and the guys we added for the bench. But I'm very skeptical that it's going to be enough to unseat Miami - and we'll have New York and Brooklyn and Atlanta to deal with as well. And who knows what Chicago will be without Rose. Lots of optimism, but lots of questions.

Someone start the season already.

BlueNGold
10-04-2012, 10:33 PM
Yes, the bench basically has a good starting PG coupled with aggressive scorers. They should be really good with Ian in the middle on D.

Strummer
10-04-2012, 11:58 PM
Yes, the bench basically has a good starting PG coupled with aggressive scorers. They should be really good with Ian in the middle on D.

I agree. And I think the main concern with the bench was improving the ability to guard against the pick and roll. I heard that mentioned several times. I think Ian and Miles were brought in specifically for that reason.

Hicks
10-05-2012, 11:35 AM
Ian was known to be foul-prone before. If he's having to cover for a lineup of average-to-bad defenders, that could be a real issue. Unless Miles is ready for some real time; if so, you can have 3 centers.

Trader Joe
10-05-2012, 12:03 PM
If Miles isn't ready to play this season, then there is jus tno hope for him. He is already 24.

KennerLeaguer
10-05-2012, 12:32 PM
Too bad the Heat left footprints on the moon..

:halo:

That's a great response. And a bit true too.

Mad-Mad-Mario
10-05-2012, 12:54 PM
Ian was known to be foul-prone before. If he's having to cover for a lineup of average-to-bad defenders, that could be a real issue. Unless Miles is ready for some real time; if so, you can have 3 centers.

Hes been improving on that every year though. Not unfair to expect Ian to have improved further.

Ace E.Anderson
10-05-2012, 01:26 PM
If Miles isn't ready to play this season, then there is jus tno hope for him. He is already 24.

He can't even legally rent a car yet. Though I agree it's crucial for him to show SOMETHING this season (since we used a 1st rd pick on him) he's got some time to learn and improve while playing behind a few veteran players.

I think preseason will give us a BIT of an idea of what he can bring to the court..if anything

Trader Joe
10-05-2012, 01:31 PM
24 is ridiculously old for an NBA rookie.

Eleazar
10-05-2012, 01:33 PM
He can't even legally rent a car yet.

Actually he can, it is the companies who have set the 25 years old limit not the government.

pacergod2
10-05-2012, 01:57 PM
It might be old, but at the same time having that much more maturity than other guys starting in the league at 18, which will help him with the lifestyle of the NBA (I'm looking at you Hassan Whiteside). He should be able to work his way into a better role by the end of his rookie deal, which puts him at about 28 and at the beginning of the prime of his career. Plus, he's athletic and big. They don't grow on trees. I really like the pick even if it isn't a "swing for the fences" type of pick.

I look forward to a long career for him as a rotational big. Every team would love to get a rotational big with a late first round pick, let alone a player that will be on their roster for more than their rookie contract as end of bench fodder. I really like the pick.

pacer4ever
10-05-2012, 02:02 PM
If Miles isn't ready to play this season, then there is jus tno hope for him. He is already 24.

Dude can't play anyone with half a brain saw that in the 8 years (seemed like it lol) at Duke.

Trader Joe
10-05-2012, 02:13 PM
Dude can't play anyone with half a brain saw that in the 8 years (seemed like it lol) at Duke.

I agree with you, I'm just saying if he doesn't magically become better this year, then it's not going to happen at all. I mean think how much crap Hansbrough took for his age coming out of UNC and he was actually younger than Miles and a much more accomplished player.

pacer4ever
10-05-2012, 02:30 PM
I agree with you, I'm just saying if he doesn't magically become better this year, then it's not going to happen at all. I mean think how much crap Hansbrough took for his age coming out of UNC and he was actually younger than Miles and a much more accomplished player.

No kidding this isn't like JO who was a 7 year vetern when he was 24. Miles did nothing year in and year out in college. I still don't see what NBA skill he has very soft and plays weak. If Miles was 18 or 19 and just stunk it up one year in college I could at least get the logic(I still wouldn't agree much). Miles is Andre Drummond w/o the defense and poential so pretty much all he brings is 6 fouls IMO unless a miracle happens. Conrad Brunner had me rolling the other day on the Dakich show mocking the pick it was lol.

LoneGranger33
10-05-2012, 02:30 PM
24 is ridiculously old for an NBA rookie.

Don't tell that to Pablo Prigioni.

Psyren
10-05-2012, 02:54 PM
No kidding this isn't like JO who was a 7 year vetern when he was 24. Miles did nothing year in and year out in college. I still don't see what NBA skill he has very soft and plays weak. If Miles was 18 or 19 and just stunk it up one year in college I could at least get the logic(I still wouldn't agree much). Miles is Andre Drummond w/o the defense and poential so pretty much all he brings is 6 fouls IMO unless a miracle happens. Conrad Brunner had me rolling the other day on the Dakich show mocking the pick it was lol.

Well, Miles at least is halfway intelligent. He has that going for him, even if it doesnt help on the court.

Drummond is as dumb as they get.

Hicks
10-05-2012, 06:05 PM
If Miles isn't ready to play this season, then there is jus tno hope for him. He is already 24.

You can rarely ever count on a rookie. That's all I'm saying. Jeff Foster had no role on the 2000 team.

CJ Jones
10-05-2012, 07:05 PM
I agree with you, I'm just saying if he doesn't magically become better this year, then it's not going to happen at all. I mean think how much crap Hansbrough took for his age coming out of UNC and he was actually younger than Miles and a much more accomplished player.

More accomplished obviously, but I saw Miles do more legit NBA type moves in summer league than I've seen throughout Tyler's entire 3 years here. Miles showed nice form on his jumper, he put the ball on the floor without walking (seemed like really good footwork for a big), showed a nice running hook which will be impossible to block with his size and athleticism. I'm not sure if he can do all this versus NBA comp, but I hold at hope.

I have some questions about his aggressiveness on the boards and defense like others, but I like what I've seen so far. If we can just turn him into 15-20 mpg backup, the versatility he'd bring to our frontcourt could be very helpful.

CJ Jones
10-05-2012, 07:15 PM
No kidding this isn't like JO who was a 7 year vetern when he was 24. Miles did nothing year in and year out in college. I still don't see what NBA skill he has very soft and plays weak. If Miles was 18 or 19 and just stunk it up one year in college I could at least get the logic(I still wouldn't agree much). Miles is Andre Drummond w/o the defense and poential so pretty much all he brings is 6 fouls IMO unless a miracle happens. Conrad Brunner had me rolling the other day on the Dakich show mocking the pick it was lol.

I'm not seeing the comparison. Miles showed decent form on his jumper, good footwork, and finished with force on offense. You can tell he's been well coached. Drummond, while looking great defensively, looks like a train wreck on offense, and he looks soft a charmin around the rim. Some of the shots he threw up had me in tears.

pizza guy
10-06-2012, 12:32 AM
Figured I'd just add this here rather than making a new thread for it.

http://www.indycornrows.com/2012/10/5/3463038/pacers-training-camp-pacers-compete-to-win-in-scrimmage

Fun little feel-good read. Only question I had was about Danny not playing in this team scrimmage. But, I'm guessing he played in the first half and was out in the second half because they're trying to go easy on his knee.

CableKC
10-06-2012, 02:06 AM
I'm not seeing the comparison. Miles showed decent form on his jumper, good footwork, and finished with force on offense. You can tell he's been well coached. Drummond, while looking great defensively, looks like a train wreck on offense, and he looks soft a charmin around the rim. Some of the shots he threw up had me in tears.
About Plumlee's jumpshot.....according to IndyCornRows:

http://www.indycornrows.com/2012/10/5/3463038/pacers-training-camp-pacers-compete-to-win-in-scrimmage


- Rookie Miles Plumlee is plenty big and active to help when needed in the front court. I wish someone would've warned me about his jumper. Scared the hell out of me, kind of like Elaine dancing on Seinfeld. But, he made the first shot I saw him take, a baseline 17-footer. Billy Keller worked with Plumlee after practice and he did make a bunch of shots although they appeared to defy physics with that form.

Just to give you an idea about Plumlee's jumpshot looks like ( according to IndyCornRows ), here is a point of reference:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-4XhWrTtOAt4/UBAd3s0QK5I/AAAAAAAAByY/Awyvz1GW1dI/s1600/elaine-seinfeld-dance_o_GIFSoup_com.gif

I'm trying to figure out how Plumlee can properly shoot the ball while kicking his feet out like that :confused:

CJ Jones
10-06-2012, 12:38 PM
About Plumlee's jumpshot.....according to IndyCornRows:

http://www.indycornrows.com/2012/10/5/3463038/pacers-training-camp-pacers-compete-to-win-in-scrimmage



Just to give you an idea about Plumlee's jumpshot looks like ( according to IndyCornRows ), here is a point of reference:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-4XhWrTtOAt4/UBAd3s0QK5I/AAAAAAAAByY/Awyvz1GW1dI/s1600/elaine-seinfeld-dance_o_GIFSoup_com.gif

I'm trying to figure out how Plumlee can properly shoot the ball while kicking his feet out like that :confused:

lol... ok maybe it's not perfect form, but he shot it with confidence, he had good rotation on the ball, and it went in. That's all that matters. He's clearly a much more polished offensive player than Drummond. Drummond will be a force defensively, but he looks like another Ben Wallace on offense.

Clearly P4E thinks he's worthless, but I'm not seeing it. I think he can play in this league. I'm not concerned with his college numbers. People that get paid to evaluate our players liked him, that's enough for me. I don't pretend to act like I know more than they do.

BlueNGold
10-07-2012, 07:18 PM
Based on his game, I do expect him to be better than Tyler. He has hops and fairly strong guy...and will get up on the rim on occasion. Man, I need a new avatar...

Sparhawk
10-08-2012, 10:20 AM
Based on his game, I do expect him to be better than Tyler. He has hops and fairly strong guy...and will get up on the rim on occasion. Man, I need a new avatar...

Yes you do. And I expect Plumlee to be better than Hans. That's not saying much though. I don't see Plumlee as being that much better defensively, much worse offensively, but a much better rebounder. The most positive news is that Plumlee won't get blocked in the post all the time or through up complete crap shots trying to sell he got fouled.

Pacers are pretty damn solid everywhere but backup PF. Pacers will have the best bench in the least, so that should be ok if we are weak at PF.

West, don't you dare get injured.

Naptown_Seth
10-08-2012, 11:56 AM
I agree with you, I'm just saying if he doesn't magically become better this year, then it's not going to happen at all. I mean think how much crap Hansbrough took for his age coming out of UNC and he was actually younger than Miles and a much more accomplished player.
AND it also means that he was a much older player than his NCAA competition, and wasn't getting it done. Age differences prior to perhaps 23-25 are a huge factor. I've been reading the book Outliers which has one section detailing the massive advantage age can have in creating star players (in that case just 8-10 months when talking about kids 8-12 range).

At 18 you might still be growing and are likely still stabilizing hormones (ie, chemically driven to be less reasonable), but by 24 most of that should be long gone. So then how are you getting better?

1) Getting bigger - done growing by 24, maybe NBA conditioning could help I suppose but that's also on the player

2) Emotional maturity - done by 24 normally

3) Better mental training - the dude was at Duke, Frank isn't teaching him how to win in the NBA better than Coach K was teaching him how to win in the NCAA

Miles would appear to have had a massive advantage over the typical Wake or Clemson 18-19 year old Freshman. He just lost all those advantages and yet people are expecting a big change?

This isn't even anti-Miles because I'll support anyone that wants to try and obviously you just never know, but the truth is that statistics of human behavior suggest that normally you actually do have a pretty good idea of how things are going to go. This is exactly why most superstars are picked in the top 10 spots of the draft...people knowing how things will probably go.

In fact I think most busts are driven by people looking to buck the indicators and look for some counter-intuitive example or they try to project development that just isn't realistic to expect (ie, less than 30% chance let's say). These GMs and scouts sell themselves on an idea they want to be true.

Strummer
10-08-2012, 01:04 PM
much worse offensively

Did you get to see Miles play in the summer league? Just curious, your expectations sound like all the stuff people were saying on draft night. When I saw him play in the summer league I was stunned. He was a much different player than I expected. His offensive potential is a lot higher than Tyler's. Mile's is more than a dunker. Just curious if you got to see him play.

Sparhawk
10-09-2012, 09:55 AM
Did you get to see Miles play in the summer league? Just curious, your expectations sound like all the stuff people were saying on draft night. When I saw him play in the summer league I was stunned. He was a much different player than I expected. His offensive potential is a lot higher than Tyler's. Mile's is more than a dunker. Just curious if you got to see him play.

I watched. I wasn't impressed at all. He def won't get blocked down low like Hans, so that's a positive. As long as he sticks to quick put backs and thunderous dunks, then I'll be happy.

CJ Jones
10-09-2012, 02:40 PM
I watched. I wasn't impressed at all. He def won't get blocked down low like Hans, so that's a positive. As long as he sticks to quick put backs and thunderous dunks, then I'll be happy.

He got All Summer League... what more can he do? Yeah it's summer league, but after watching him play he doesn't seem anything like how he was portrayed by the draft pundits and PD scouts.

Here's to Miles proving his doubters wrong :cheers:

Naptown_Seth
10-09-2012, 03:33 PM
Summer league CAN ONLY PROVE ONE THING - are you non-NBA capable. It can not verify your ability to play in the league. If you struggle in summer ball then you probably aren't going to cut it, barring some crazy outlier that I can't even think of. If you excel it simply means you passed the test for not failing already.

Tons of guys look good in that slop, some are players, most are not. Guys like Paul or Danny or Roy may just do "okay" in summer ball, but they never flop. But plenty of busts do look good in summer ball.



Miles may make it, but summer ball doesn't prove a thing in the positive. Miles isn't just showing up doubters, he needs to prove his previous output was a massive underachievement on his part rather than an indication of his talent level. He put up the C- at the NCAA level, not the doubters. He earned the questions on his game. If you want people to think you are good, then be good.

Strummer
10-09-2012, 03:59 PM
Miles may make it, but summer ball doesn't prove a thing in the positive.

I don't think anyone expected him to prove himself in summer league. That would be asking a bit much. But what you can do in summer league is show off your skill set and your potential. Miles showed that he has a ton more game than anyone on PD gave him credit for. He greatly exceeded my expectations. That's all he could hope to achieve in the summer league and he did it. So everyone should be hopeful.

True, he hasn't shown anything in the NBA yet. But he also hasn't played a single game in the NBA yet. So I think we should just wait a bit on that. Take one challenge at a time. What I've seen so far was summer league. He looked promising. So far so good. That's all we should ask for.

Sparhawk
10-09-2012, 04:46 PM
I don't think anyone expected him to prove himself in summer league. That would be asking a bit much. But what you can do in summer league is show off your skill set and your potential. Miles showed that he has a ton more game than anyone on PD gave him credit for. He greatly exceeded my expectations. That's all he could hope to achieve in the summer league and he did it. So everyone should be hopeful.

True, he hasn't shown anything in the NBA yet. But he also hasn't played a single game in the NBA yet. So I think we should just wait a bit on that. Take one challenge at a time. What I've seen so far was summer league. He looked promising. So far so good. That's all we should ask for.

He is supposed to a be a plus rebounder, yet I didn't see that. Hey the jury is still out. While I think the Pacers should have taken PJIII, which was a no brainer, if Plumlee even comes close to a Foster type player, I'll be more than happy. Right now, I don't see it, and when the GM says he won't be ready for a year or two...for a guy that's already old for a rookie, my confidence plummets. If you wanted a guy that won't be ready for a couple of years, they most def should have gone for PJIII who has tons more upside.

Anthem
10-09-2012, 08:17 PM
Tons of guys look good in that slop, some are players, most are not. Guys like Paul or Danny or Roy may just do "okay" in summer ball, but they never flop. But plenty of busts do look good in summer ball.
Paul George was pretty bad in summer league.

Sparhawk
10-09-2012, 09:35 PM
Paul George was pretty bad in summer league.

Shooting % wise, but you could tell the talent was there.

I don't take much stock in SL, but you can at least get a sense if a player has some talent. I was excited about OJ, but that dude made poor decision after poor decision, mostly trying to force things to go his way. Haven't heard much from him since. Is he signed or will he even be signed?

Really?
10-10-2012, 08:56 AM
has there been a Wells day 2 yet?

Really?
10-10-2012, 09:04 AM
Figured I'd just add this here rather than making a new thread for it.

http://www.indycornrows.com/2012/10/5/3463038/pacers-training-camp-pacers-compete-to-win-in-scrimmage

Fun little feel-good read. Only question I had was about Danny not playing in this team scrimmage. But, I'm guessing he played in the first half and was out in the second half because they're trying to go easy on his knee.

Looks like Tyler is beating West out for the starting spot... I joke I joke

Sparhawk
10-10-2012, 10:37 AM
Looks like Tyler is beating West out for the starting spot... I joke I joke

From what I've been reading, Pendergraph has looked real good and might take minutes from Hans.

Really?
10-10-2012, 11:24 AM
From what I've been reading, Pendergraph has looked real good and might take minutes from Hans.

Yeah, have not really been up on the Pacers since the beginning of training camp, but I heard similar stuff about Jeff P last off season as well, so we will see.