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View Full Version : What are we expecting from Tyler this year?



Anthem
10-02-2012, 08:57 PM
I was gone all summer, so I missed any updates. I assume he's healthy, since we haven't heard otherwise. Right now, I'm hoping for a 3-man big rotation (starters plus mahini) with Granger picking up some occasional PF minutes. Is there any reason to think he'll be better this year? He's gotten worse (or perhaps "solved") the longer he's been in the NBA.

Or am I being unreasonably pessimistic?

QuickRelease
10-02-2012, 09:02 PM
Dribble, Bull Rush, Charge...in that order :D

QuickRelease
10-02-2012, 09:02 PM
Seriously though, I think he'll settle into a more defined role that fits him, and have better success.

Hicks
10-02-2012, 09:04 PM
He has to completely prove himself this year. As of now, I'm expecting more of what we got last year.

Cousy47
10-02-2012, 09:14 PM
I thin we are too pessimistic about Hans based on a tough season of change. Lost his first real starting job in his career, lost his paint banging to Fosters' back and started being used very badly on defense. We had Hans setting PnR screens at the 3pt line, and on too many occasions getting the ball back from the runner outside the paint and with no time. Maybe if we go back to using him as DWest replacement and getting West's shots he can contribute to the team. If not, we need to move him to SF or trade him to a team where he can play his natural position, paint banger, rebounder, put back guy who draws fouls; JMO, of course.

Strummer
10-02-2012, 09:22 PM
I'm expecting big things out of Tyler. Cause Frank had faith that he could turn him around. So I'm gonna have faith that he did until I see otherwise. It's a good chance to see what the coaching staff is capable of.


"Tyler needs an offseason," Coach Frank Vogel said. "He's a guy I'd like to work with more than any player on our team this summer. With the motor that he has, if he ever develops the game, the skill-set, the moves and the counter-moves someone like David West has, really the sky's the limit for what he can do.

"Since he's been drafted he hasn't had an offseason to work with the coaching staff whether it's injuries or the lockout or whatever. He has a tremendous area for growth in terms of developing his skill set and his moves."

link (http://www.nba.com/pacers/news/player-review-2012-tyler-hansbrough)

So let's wait and see what new tricks Tyler has learned. And if we get the same old Tyler then we can all be disappointed. But if he's trying counter-moves and things we haven't seen from him before then we should all be encouraged.

Cousy47
10-02-2012, 09:38 PM
I think we are being a little rough on Tyler based on last year's performance. He lost his first starting job EVER, then lost his best paint mate when Foster went down. Under the revamped play calling we went to, Hans seemed to be used to set PnR screens above the 3 pt. line, giving him no shot. When the plays broke down from over dribbling, Hans got the ball back out of position and with no time to make a basketball move before shooting. Thus his average and confidence went down. Once you lose the confidence in the short jump shot, your game is easy to defend. Hoping he reverts back to his time as the Head Goon or the last starter and plays his game with confidence. If not, the Ps should start finding him a home he fits into. The last half of 2011, IMO, he had not place to fit into the Pacers offensive. Thoughts?

PacersHomer
10-02-2012, 10:02 PM
My expectations could not be lower.

Pacers24Colts12
10-02-2012, 10:11 PM
Lou Amundson?

Psyren
10-02-2012, 10:34 PM
My expectations could not be lower.

Agreed

cdash
10-02-2012, 10:35 PM
Improvement. He's been taking a beating around here (rightfully so, he was awful all last season), and he doesn't seem like the type that just rolls over and dies. He seems like a worker. If he is willing to listen and work with the coaching staff, I think he could be a solid big off the bench. Frustrating at times to be sure, and his defense likely will be pretty poor, but I think he's better than what he showed last year.

Brinocerous
10-02-2012, 11:09 PM
I would be happy to see an end of spazz-ball. I love to see him getting after it on the glass, but his head plays faster than his body can go on O. If he can consistently play under control and figure out when to kick it out faster, he might not cause quite the nausea I had every time he set foot on the court at the end of last year.

gummy
10-02-2012, 11:09 PM
I thought Vogel's quote about wanting to work with Tyler was interesting when I first saw it. But did coach actually get to work with him, or did he go back to NC as usual?

If he stayed in Indy and worked with our staff, I wouldn't be surprised to see some noticeable improvement.

If he didn't, I wouldn't be surprised to see more of the same.

Speed
10-02-2012, 11:34 PM
He's a PF who shoots 40% and is a poor rebounder if you take out rebounding his own misses. He has no counter moves, like Coach said. He doesn't read the offense or defense well, evident by the assist watch to start every season and watch his rotations, teammates cover for him often. He struggles against length on both sides of the ball. He plays aggressive, but not intuitive or with purpose or results.

He really only brings two things to the table 1.) he's physical and aggressive 2.) he gets to the line. This is the big leagues, you can't get by on just that.

PS how can you play all your life and have no ability to use your left hand around the basket. Its to the point I question whether he even works on his game very hard. He has better physical tools than his the skills he's developed.

It's harsh, but when you see a guy get figured out by opposing teams and then not add anything, it makes you wonder.

So ya, I'm not asking for much, but I'd like a PF who can rebound and shoot high 40s offensively.

Here's Tyler, going over his left shoulder with his right hand around the basket. Can hit 17 footer.

Last question, how can you be as aggressive and physical as he is an not be an offensive rebounding machine, sans his own misses.

Sorry its just really frustrating he doesn't improve.

Anthem
10-02-2012, 11:40 PM
I'm expecting big things out of Tyler. Cause Frank had faith that he could turn him around. So I'm gonna have faith that he did until I see otherwise. It's a good chance to see what the coaching staff is capable of.

link (http://www.nba.com/pacers/news/player-review-2012-tyler-hansbrough)

So let's wait and see what new tricks Tyler has learned. And if we get the same old Tyler then we can all be disappointed. But if he's trying counter-moves and things we haven't seen from him before then we should all be encouraged.

Yeah, I'm just kinda waiting for an article that says he's done that. Show me one counter-move and I'll be hopeful.

vnzla81
10-02-2012, 11:51 PM
I thought he was on a commercial with Josh Smith but it looks like the commercial hired a white guy that looks like Tyler and has the Pacers jersey on, has anybody seen the commercial yet?

Strummer
10-03-2012, 12:38 AM
PS how can you play all your life and have no ability to use your left hand around the basket. Its to the point I question whether he even works on his game very hard. He has better physical tools than his the skills he's developed.


The man was college player of the year. That's not something they hand out to scrubs. He developed the skills he needed to succeed at that level. Now he's at a new level. I'd say the odds are that he'll develop the skills he needs to succeed at this level. Is it a certainty? Of course not, but I'm willing to give him a chance.

Trader Joe
10-03-2012, 12:39 AM
I'm thinking he ends up losing his spot at some point this season.

imawhat
10-03-2012, 12:45 AM
I still can't believe he had such a poor season. He was going strong until he got hit in the head.

I'm hoping he finds his groove...it's a short leash.

Strummer
10-03-2012, 12:50 AM
Yeah, I'm just kinda waiting for an article that says he's done that. Show me one counter-move and I'll be hopeful.

I agree, it would be nice if the local paper covered the team. Oh well. But we're so close to finding out if he's improved. We should know in ten days or less. So no real need to speculate. I'm going to assume that the coaching staff helped him work on the skills that he needs. Why wouldn't everyone assume that? I'm going to be hopeful until I have reason not to be.

Kuq_e_Zi91
10-03-2012, 12:54 AM
It could depend on if Plumlee is ready to backup Hibbert at the 5. That'll shift Mahinmi to the 4, which will eat into Tyler's minutes, especially if he plays like last season.

gummy
10-03-2012, 01:10 AM
The man was college player of the year. That's not something they hand out to scrubs. He developed the skills he needed to succeed at that level. Now he's at a new level. I'd say the odds are that he'll develop the skills he needs to succeed at this level. Is it a certainty? Of course not, but I'm willing to give him a chance.

Yeah, me too. However, the idea that he just needs time to adjust to the pro level was a lot more appealing after his first year and after his second year. If he hasn't improved overall this season, reasoning like this isn't going to fly at all this time next season.

I'm rooting for him. He's a Pacer. When he has those little flashes of very good, he's fun to watch. But at this point I am not expecting much and I'm glad we have some players on the bench that will be able to eat into his time if necessary.

Strummer
10-03-2012, 01:54 AM
Yeah, me too. However, the idea that he just needs time to adjust to the pro level was a lot more appealing after his first year and after his second year. If he hasn't improved overall this season, reasoning like this isn't going to fly at all this time next season.


But that's where I'd point to Vogel's quote. About this being the first chance that Tyler's gotten to work with the coaches over the summer. If Tyler doesn't improve then we may have to point our fingers at the coaches too.

I'm just hoping that watching West play game after game last season made a big impression on Tyler. West has the kind of game that Tyler needs to develop.

If Tyler doesn't improve this season, then I'm not expecting him to be back. There are better ways to spend the money. And personally I think Miles is a better long term option. I loved the quickness and length that he showed in the summer league. It's going to be fun to see how it plays out.

gummy
10-03-2012, 02:35 AM
But that's where I'd point to Vogel's quote. About this being the first chance that Tyler's gotten to work with the coaches over the summer. If Tyler doesn't improve then we may have to point our fingers at the coaches too.

I'm just hoping that watching West play game after game last season made a big impression on Tyler. West has the kind of game that Tyler needs to develop.

If Tyler doesn't improve this season, then I'm not expecting him to be back. There are better ways to spend the money. And personally I think Miles is a better long term option. I loved the quickness and length that he showed in the summer league. It's going to be fun to see how it plays out.

We don't actually know if Tyler did work with the Pacers' coaches over the summer. Vogel made it clear that he wanted to work with Tyler, but the team can't force a player to stay in Indy over the summer. If Tyler didn't spend some significant time working with team staff over the summer, that's on him.

West is absolutely the kind of player Tyler needs to model himself after. I hope it made an impression on him too.

Edit: Looks like he spent at least part of his time at Chapel Hill working out with the strength and conditioning coordinator there - that's what he has done in years past as well. http://www.goheels.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=3350&ATCLID=205562962

Maybe those of you who are on Twitter could ask Mike Wells if Tyler spent much time in Indy this summer.

Strummer
10-03-2012, 04:01 AM
Maybe those of you who are on Twitter could ask Mike Wells if Tyler spent much time in Indy this summer.

Coaches can also travel to meet with the players. Players shouldn't feel like they have to be in Indy year round. I know they cover what they want players to work on during the exit interviews. They probably provide them film too, I'd hope. Then it's just a matter of periodically meeting with the players to see how they're doing. Or sometimes the team goes the extra mile like when the Pacers brought in Bill Walton to tutor Roy. There's no reason things like that can't happen in North Carolina if that's where Tyler wants to spend his summers.

sportfireman
10-03-2012, 05:55 AM
http://drunkathlete.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/tyler-hansbrough-40-1jpg.jpg

Heisenberg
10-03-2012, 06:33 AM
To settle into his Greg Kite goon role.

Unclebuck
10-03-2012, 09:01 AM
I'm done discussing it. We'll see.

pacergod2
10-03-2012, 09:37 AM
Effectively handing towels to Jeff Pendergraph.

*astrisk*
10-03-2012, 09:51 AM
I'm expecting Tyler to be a nice 4 Mil dollar expiring contract to be shopped around the league along with a combination of other servicable players to a contender in the West for a 1st rounder and a garbage expiring.

He's good enough to help a team out off the bench late in the year and in limited minutes in the playoffs. A team desperate enough for some depth might give up a first for Tyler and DJ if Lance has matured his game enough where he can help out at point and Young, Green/Plumlee are able to pick up the slack at the vacated SG and PF Minutes. I like DJ so far, but if we can steal somebodies first, knowing he and Tyler won't be re-signed next year. We gotta do that... Especially with D-Wests contract looming.

Just my take...

Major Cold
10-03-2012, 10:19 AM
Everything he was coming into the NBA has been scouted and contained. He has to be a better midrange shooter and rebounder. Defensively he has to rotate quicker.

I say he becomes a better shooter and that is it. And that is not what we need alone.

Pacer Fan
10-03-2012, 10:24 AM
To hit his 15'-18' shot at a much better efficiency. To block out his man and rebound better. To hopefully pass the ball and find a way to average 3 assist per 40 minutes. To be a beast in the paint more often. To slam the rock with attitude, like he did on Amare. To take advantage of every minute played like a veteran and not a one dimensional black hole.

Sparhawk
10-03-2012, 10:25 AM
I hope his leash is short. Lance never really gets a chance, yet Tyler is trotted out like he's earned it. He's played pretty bad.

I would rather see Plumlee just for the fact that he can rebound. Green, Lance and DJ will score for the second unit, so a black hole guy like Tyler isn't really needed.

mattie
10-03-2012, 10:58 AM
Coaches can also travel to meet with the players. Players shouldn't feel like they have to be in Indy year round. I know they cover what they want players to work on during the exit interviews. They probably provide them film too, I'd hope. Then it's just a matter of periodically meeting with the players to see how they're doing. Or sometimes the team goes the extra mile like when the Pacers brought in Bill Walton to tutor Roy. There's no reason things like that can't happen in North Carolina if that's where Tyler wants to spend his summers.

It's not expected at all. I think Vogel was pretty clear on that.

However if a young player really needs to improve to create a future in the league, than giving up vacationing in the summer to workout with specific coaches is what it takes. That's the difference between successful players and the guys who seem to flounder.

You can bet Derrick Rose's summer before his MVP season wasn't a vacation. He spent the summer in california with one of the best off-season coaches in the country. Rose new that down the line when he wants to party in cancun, or LA or wherever he would have the opportunity, but at such a young age he was out to prove himself, and he did.

(obviously the point of that story wasn't a comparison between Tyler and Rose's talent, but their work ethic)

I wouldn't blame Tyler either if he didn't want to work out all summer with Vogel. However, I know what I would do if I was in danger of losing a roster spot..

vnzla81
10-03-2012, 11:12 AM
I have a feeling that Tyler is going to come out kicking some a**, he is finally going to have a point guard that can actually pass the ball, how many times we saw where he was by himself under the rim and never got the ball? Tyler is also pretty good at running down the court with the point guard but as always he never got the ball, I expect Augustin to make Tyler a better player, he better get ready because some passes are going to hit him in the face.

docpaul
10-03-2012, 11:23 AM
I have almost zero expectations for Tyler this year.

In some ways, I'm hoping my little tiny contribution might allow him to actually play up to his capabilities. ;)

I think he choked under expectations... remember, some had him listed as MIP and 6th man of the year last year heading into the season? :)

If he doesn't produce this year, his future in the NBA is in serious jeopardy. So, I think we'll see a closer representation of what we actually have with him this year.

Sink or swim time, Tyler. But I for one, have no expectations. :D

pacergod2
10-03-2012, 11:30 AM
I really like Tyler, a whole lot actually. I love his hustle. I love his aggressiveness and toughness. I think he actually moves pretty well without the ball as well. I just think he doesn't always make the smart play. Is he trying to prove too much by taking every shot that hits his hands or what? I'm not sure where his head is at to be honest. Does he think that passing to his teammates is a weakness? Does he think that he can dunk over anybody in the NBA? I don't know.

I broke down Tyler a week or two ago, but there are a couple of things I would like to see from him in condensed form:

Ball movement
More arc on his jump shot
Passing out of the post when he gets in trouble
Don't get too far under the basket with the ball in his hands
Waiting for the pick to be set before he rolls (a lot of that was on Collison setting up picks)
Roll to the basket more instead of settling forthe jumper
Set more post to post picks

OK... so I think Tyler could see a lot of improvement in his game due to Augustin being a better PG. DC did not do a very good job of setting up or defending pick and rolls. I don't know why the two of them couldn't get on the same page. I think Hans could be an elite pick setter in the NBA. He just is too focused on getting his shot from 17 feet than setting up the rest of the team.

I tell you that we can get what we got last year from Tyler right now from Pendergraph, with someone who will finish around the rim. If Hansborough doesn't seem to grow as a player, then I'd rather see Pendergraph earlier in the season. I think I'd even like to see some minutes from Plumlee if it continues.

Strummer
10-03-2012, 11:36 AM
However if a young player really needs to improve to create a future in the league, than giving up vacationing in the summer to workout with specific coaches is what it takes. That's the difference between successful players and the guys who seem to flounder.


Oy. So now he's "vacationing" in NC instead of putting in hard work? I just don't get why people like to assume the worst about players. Especially not when the player has a proven history of success.

What it comes down to is that we don't know how Tyler spent his summer. I prefer to have faith in Tyler and Vogel's coaching staff until I see differently. There's no good reason not to. Time will tell whether they accomplished anything or not. I'd rather wait and see the results instead of jumping on the hate bandwagon. (Of course, even if he doesn't improve, I'm not going to hate him or the coaches or the front office. That's just silly.)

We should have our answer fairly soon. And if we see improvement then we'll have to be patient to see if he can sustain it throughout the season. Hopefully he'll turn into a solid, consistent player that will make all of us happy.

mattie
10-03-2012, 11:56 AM
Oy. So now he's "vacationing" in NC instead of putting in hard work? I just don't get why people like to assume the worst about players. Especially not when the player has a proven history of success.

What it comes down to is that we don't know how Tyler spent his summer. I prefer to have faith in Tyler and Vogel's coaching staff until I see differently. There's no good reason not to. Time will tell whether they accomplished anything or not. I'd rather wait and see the results instead of jumping on the hate bandwagon. (Of course, even if he doesn't improve, I'm not going to hate him or the coaches or the front office. That's just silly.)

We should have our answer fairly soon. And if we see improvement then we'll have to be patient to see if he can sustain it throughout the season. Hopefully he'll turn into a solid, consistent player that will make all of us happy.

I'm not hating chill. lol

JEM
10-03-2012, 01:20 PM
Needs to make open jumpers this year for starters.. Missed many open looks last season.

WhoLovesYaBaby?
10-03-2012, 01:29 PM
I'm on the fence about him. If he is smart, he will improve his rebounding, defense, and FG%. Because he is in a contract year. His next contract depends on what he does now. Which is no news to anyone here.

The alternative is that he loses minutes and sits the bench. Possibly he is trade bait because of his expiring deal.

I prefer to think that he is smart and improves this year. At least I hope so. If he improves and plays like he did against the Bulls 2 years ago, we will have a very potent bench.

WhoLovesYaBaby?
10-03-2012, 01:31 PM
Oy. So now he's "vacationing" in NC instead of putting in hard work? I just don't get why people like to assume the worst about players. Especially not when the player has a proven history of success.

What it comes down to is that we don't know how Tyler spent his summer. I prefer to have faith in Tyler and Vogel's coaching staff until I see differently. There's no good reason not to. Time will tell whether they accomplished anything or not. I'd rather wait and see the results instead of jumping on the hate bandwagon. (Of course, even if he doesn't improve, I'm not going to hate him or the coaches or the front office. That's just silly.)

We should have our answer fairly soon. And if we see improvement then we'll have to be patient to see if he can sustain it throughout the season. Hopefully he'll turn into a solid, consistent player that will make all of us happy.

It is for sure that the coaching staff isn't stupid. They know Hans weaknesses and you can bet they are trying to rectify them. If they can't, he will sit and someone else will play.

Mr_Smith
10-03-2012, 02:45 PM
I expect the same predictable robotic movements down in the post and getting called for traveling alot, but obviously I hope he shows me that I'm wrong.

Sollozzo
10-03-2012, 02:50 PM
Not much.

gummy
10-03-2012, 03:21 PM
Coaches can also travel to meet with the players. Players shouldn't feel like they have to be in Indy year round. I know they cover what they want players to work on during the exit interviews. They probably provide them film too, I'd hope. Then it's just a matter of periodically meeting with the players to see how they're doing. Or sometimes the team goes the extra mile like when the Pacers brought in Bill Walton to tutor Roy. There's no reason things like that can't happen in North Carolina if that's where Tyler wants to spend his summers.

I realize that. The overall point is - we don't know whether or not Tyler made himself available to our coaches over the summer or alternatively, if he has focused on the things emphasized in his exit interview. I would like to know those things before I place significant blame on the coaching staff for Tyler's lack of development this year (if indeed that is how it turns out). Best case scenario, he comes out looking good and makes all this discussion moot.

So I'll amend my statement to ask if someone on Twitter can ask Wells if Tyler worked out with Pacers coaches over the summer.

However, I do think that given what a disappointment Tyler has been so far, it would be better for him to stay in Indy where he could have complete access to his coaches for the entire summer, rather than having the coaches coming to him periodically. Really, it doesn't even have to be with our coaches, necessarily. There are other great coaches for hire out there. I just don't want him working with UNC coaches summer after summer since that approach hasn't worked so far (I acknowledge that we don't know that he has *only* worked with UNC coaches this summer. But we do know that he spends at least part of his summer with them). I wish we got more info about what the players are doing workout wise during the off-season.

Ugh, October always feels soooo long. I'm ready to stop speculating and start seeing how this is all going to play out on the court!

Sandman21
10-03-2012, 03:24 PM
I'd be happy if he "accidentally" broke Dunleavy's nose for that childish crap Dun pulled last season.

Mackey_Rose
10-03-2012, 03:27 PM
Needs to make open jumpers this year for starters.. Missed many open looks last season.

If you average his 3 seasons in the NBA, his eFG% on jump shots is .341 for his career. Last season he finished with an eFG% on jump shots of .326, which is not hugely different from his career average.

He's open for a reason.

Those missed looks last season were not some startling new development that can be attributed to a bad year. At some point, you have to call a spade, a spade. He isn't a good shooter. He takes a ton of shots, and some of them go in, but that doesn't make him a good shooter. Defenses leave him open, because they know it is unlikely he's going to make it anyway. If he was a smart player, he would stop shooting so much, but he won't, because that's all he's ever known.

I'm hoping he's improved his relationship with God, so that at least when he's rooted to the ground under the basket, and he flings those horrid one-handed, over-the-shoulder prayers, that seem destined to break the backboard, more of them actually get answered and go in.

Obviously, I have extremely high hopes.


http://www.82games.com/1112/11IND10.HTM
http://www.82games.com/1011/10IND11.HTM
http://www.82games.com/0910/09IND10.HTM

Sollozzo
10-04-2012, 09:59 PM
I saw Psycho T and his brother at Champs downtown tonight.

Hicks
10-04-2012, 10:08 PM
Croshere didn't sound optimistic about him on the Grady show today.

BlueNGold
10-04-2012, 10:26 PM
I think we will see him in a new uniform soon. While he is my avatar, I'm not a big fan so I'm fine with that. I was hoping he would turn out to be Jeff Foster plus good offense, but I was sorely disappointed. I expected him to be money from midrange, but quite frankly I didn't follow him in the NCAA's. He's not shown he can drain it...and unless that changes he needs to go. Plumlee will help more in the paint IMO.

pizza guy
10-04-2012, 10:59 PM
Not expecting much, but hoping we get some of those flashes of brilliance we've seen a few times on a more consistent basis. The addition of DJ, Greene, and maybe an improved Lance, PLUS the fact that the minutes for bench players will be reduced, gives me hope that his strengths will be strengthened and his weaknesses can be hidden.

If nothing else, make him a goon. Bring him in just to scare Dwayne Wade. And, yeah, like Sandman said, he could "accidentally" bump Dunleavy's nose.

BRushWithDeath
10-05-2012, 07:16 AM
I expect improvement. Marginal improvement but he'll be better than he was last year. There's nowhere to go but up.

Speed
10-05-2012, 07:53 AM
Croshere didn't sound optimistic about him on the Grady show today.

Ya, I was gonna post this. Joe asked if Tyler had gotten better. I'm going from memory here. Austin goes, er, um, er um, er....you have to use him to his strength in the pick n roll, not dump it in the post and hes' not a stretch 4. He then very nicely said that he didn't see much difference in Tyler's game. Its segment 6 here..

http://www.1070thefan.com/podcast/Episodes.aspx?PID=2160

Also, here's a Montieth article on Pacers.com saying this.

"The returning reserves haven't been replaced. Hansbrough is said to have sharpened his skills, adding a left hand to his offensive game."

http://www.nba.com/pacers/news/improved-bench-key-pacers-growth

Anthem
10-08-2012, 09:55 PM
Pacers.com has a new article up... "Pacers Preseason: Pacers expect more from Tyler Hansbrough" I expect a royalty check soon for that headline.

http://www.indycornrows.com/2012/10/8/3475876/pacers-preseason-tyler-hansbrough

There's not a single thing in the article about Tyler improving. Players have been back for a week, that's plenty of time to write a puff piece. No talk him shooting well from midrange, or going left, or defending and rebounding. No statement about one particular play where Tyler was effective. Several statements about getting better by adding other players. All from the Pacers' official website.

This is a kiss-of-death article. If there was management interest in keeping him, some of those things would be mentioned. This article is paving the way for letting Tyler walk.

Strummer
10-08-2012, 10:13 PM
Pacers.com has a new article up... "Pacers Preseason: Pacers expect more from Tyler Hansbrough" I expect a royalty check soon for that headline.

http://www.indycornrows.com/2012/10/8/3475876/pacers-preseason-tyler-hansbrough


Ummmm, that doesn't look like it's from Pacers.com to me.

Hicks
10-08-2012, 10:25 PM
That's Indy Cornrows

vnzla81
10-08-2012, 10:26 PM
That's not Pacers.com that's somebody's opinion on indycornrows.

Peck
10-08-2012, 11:08 PM
I just listened to the pod cast with Austin about Tyler.

Ouch...

DGPR
10-08-2012, 11:28 PM
I don't expect Tyler to be back after this year, and that's even if he makes it through the whole season here. His only real contribution is scoring and he certainly isn't very efficient at doing that.

Anthem
10-09-2012, 07:21 AM
Ummmm, that doesn't look like it's from Pacers.com to me.


That's Indy Cornrows


That's not Pacers.com that's somebody's opinion on indycornrows.
As I was reading IndyCornrows this morning, I thought "Wait, did they rip this off Pacers.com?" Then I went to Pacers.com for the original and realized.... the original was on IndyCornrows. But I figured I could sneak on here and correct it... I mean how many people would have seen the article since I posted it?

Stupid question. Don't you people sleep?

cgg
10-09-2012, 07:28 AM
Stupid question. Don't you people sleep?

No, we don't.

Rogco
10-09-2012, 09:12 AM
I think part of our problem with Tyler is we expected to much from him last year (ok, it wasn't good either, but I'll explain). Our second unit last year was pretty bad, and an extra expectation was put on Tyler to help carry that load. When Foster went down, he was put in an awful position of being an untalented player trying to be a scorer on a fairly bad second unit in an undersized front line. Tyler is best when he is expected to create nothing, hustle like hell, put the fear of God into some opposing players, get called for a couple charges, travel twice, and get to the foul line 6 times. Hopefully adding a more facilitating pg to the second unit will help get Tyler open looks in the 10-15 foot range (I believe that can be his game). Also, there will be more size on the back-up front line with Miahinmi, which should take some pressure off of Tyler. And with Green possibly emerging as a definitive number one scoring option on a second unit, this should limit Tyler to more of a role player (I.E., hustle, get fouled, play angry, hit a couple open mid-range jumpers.) All of this should make Tyler a better player by default.

Or he could look exactly the same as last year, but since I'm feeling optimistic about the team I might as well feel optimistic about the entire team.

BillS
10-09-2012, 09:28 AM
Stupid question. Don't you people sleep?

Sleep is for the Weak and Sickly.

Speed
10-09-2012, 11:50 AM
I do think the indycornrows article has a legit thought about Tyler playing along side a real center. His best ball was the end of the season, two seasons ago, when he played along side Roy with the starters. Hopefully if he plays with Mahinmi, he gets the right match up and they both aren't trying to exist in the same role. If Austin can't muster some polyanna smoke to blow while he's working FOR the Pacers, I'm not optimistic though. I just really can't understand how good he played two seasons ago after the allstar break and I honestly don't remember one game like that last year. Where's that guy at?

Major Cold
10-09-2012, 12:04 PM
The excuses stop this year. If a college star cannot play effectively on a team with resources, then the pick was botched. I was skeptical throughout his time here. I knew his surge would be scouted. He has yet to add anything. His footwork is mechanical, like a box shifting on a moving truck.

If he does not improve, then what hope can I have for Plumlee. Granger and Hibbert are really the only for sure great picks. Paul George is a good pick. But it would be a great pick if he was selected by us ahead of the Clippers and Utah. I think Bird did well with the Free Agency and not overreacting by making a move too quick for all the wrong reason. But the draft, IMO, he is subpar.

So why was he allowed to make the Plumlee pick if he is not here to be held accountable to the pick?

Rogco
10-09-2012, 12:55 PM
The excuses stop this year. If a college star cannot play effectively on a team with resources, then the pick was botched. I was skeptical throughout his time here. I knew his surge would be scouted. He has yet to add anything. His footwork is mechanical, like a box shifting on a moving truck.

If he does not improve, then what hope can I have for Plumlee. Granger and Hibbert are really the only for sure great picks. Paul George is a good pick. But it would be a great pick if he was selected by us ahead of the Clippers and Utah. I think Bird did well with the Free Agency and not overreacting by making a move too quick for all the wrong reason. But the draft, IMO, he is subpar.

So why was he allowed to make the Plumlee pick if he is not here to be held accountable to the pick?

I think if you were to look at Bird's drafting during his time here and compare it to all the other teams, he would easily rank in the top 5 over that time period. Sure I'm skeptical about Plumlee, but Granger, Hibbert, George and getting Hill are all great picks and/or moves. Plus still have to see on Lance, Plumlee and OJ.

Cousy47
10-09-2012, 01:53 PM
I'm looking for some improvement and maybe some new moves that will make him more tradable around the trade deadline, mid season. IMO, the lack of offense other than Hans on the 2nd unit last ear hurt his game. I wonder about the amount of damage the Dunleavy hit to his head did him. Seemed to me his game faltered after that especially while wearing the goggles. 2 years ago with Roy, Danny, Paul and Darren on the floor there was no way to "plan" for Tyler and his energy. With Lou and DJones, not too diffucult to shut down the non- passing PF position Tyler neds to spend more floor time with the starters running the same kinds of plays DWest does, imo, otherwise we need to start shopping him around.

gummy
10-09-2012, 03:26 PM
Sleep is for the Weak and Sickly.

And concussions are just headaches! :cheers:

dal9
10-09-2012, 07:11 PM
I think we will see him in a new uniform soon. While he is my avatar, I'm not a big fan so I'm fine with that. I was hoping he would turn out to be Jeff Foster plus good offense, but I was sorely disappointed. I expected him to be money from midrange, but quite frankly I didn't follow him in the NCAA's. He's not shown he can drain it...and unless that changes he needs to go. Plumlee will help more in the paint IMO.

:notamused:

"what exactly do you mean 'plus good offense' "

Naptown_Seth
10-10-2012, 10:34 AM
They tried to move Tyler for cap space and couldn't. The discussion ends right there because it says everything about the league opinion on him at this point. Enough excuses. I caught a lot of hell for my scouting opinions of his game and I've yet to see anything proving those opinions wrong except for "I don't think he'll get the foul calls at the NBA level", and I think that skill is fading as refs adjust to his game.

They will move him or let him walk at the end of the season. I expect his game to look identical to what it's looked like for 6-7 years now. If you want to look west at sunrise hoping "today is the day" then go ahead, optimism and hope are nice. But I won't be joining you.

Tyler is a hard worker and puts out great effort. I'm not debating his qualities as a human being. I'm evaluating his ability to excel in the NBA environment only. Give me his money and I'll bust my a** even more, but I'll still suck at the end of the day, and tenfold more than Tyler.



Drafrting by Bird. Don't mix FA moves/trades with drafts.

Hibbert at 17 is awesome.

Granger and Paul George were picked where most draft experts thought they should go. In fact Granger seemed like a steal that night, falling due to knee worries. TBird told the entire PD draft group BEFORE the pick that PG was the guy to get, and he did it for free instead of NBA GM salary.

If you take Leonard then it's a good draft. We don't know for sure that without the Hill deal Bird would have done that. That might have been the Spurs request only.


Shawne, White (trading picks to get) was awful.

Tyler was awful (esp if you could have let Chicago take him and moved to their 2 picks, pulling Holiday and Blair/Chase/S Young)

Bayless trade was awful because Bird turned that into NOTHING. You traded Rush for Lou and let Lou walk, you let JJack walk, you let Josh walk. You had a HR deal where you got 3 solid bench players with one pick, but turned it into no players within a few years.

Plumlee was awful because you could have got him in round 2. Bird overspent (ditto Tyler).

They traded the 07 pick for Al Harrington (plus cash and taking on Edwards). Bad trade, unknown draft choice.

Harrison pick was not good, though that was mentality mostly. OTOH Varejao went with the very next pick.

I have it at
A Roy
B Granger
B George
C Rush (I'm a Rush fan still)
D Tyler
D Plumlee
F Williams/White

For a solid C average.

Trader Joe
10-10-2012, 10:51 AM
I've always wondered if something in the Hansbrough draft happened like what occurred with Augustin. Where someone else was targeted and they got picked earlier than expected. Hansbrough just seems like a panic pick at 11. Take the established college name even though his ability to translate to the NBA is questionable.

Anyway, I go back to last year's preseason when people were saying HAnsbrough would push West for the starting job....ha....ha

Trader Joe
10-10-2012, 10:53 AM
They tried to move Tyler for cap space and couldn't. The discussion ends right there because it says everything about the league opinion on him at this point. Enough excuses. I caught a lot of hell for my scouting opinions of his game and I've yet to see anything proving those opinions wrong except for "I don't think he'll get the foul calls at the NBA level", and I think that skill is fading as refs adjust to his game.

They will move him or let him walk at the end of the season. I expect his game to look identical to what it's looked like for 6-7 years now. If you want to look west at sunrise hoping "today is the day" then go ahead, optimism and hope are nice. But I won't be joining you.

Tyler is a hard worker and puts out great effort. I'm not debating his qualities as a human being. I'm evaluating his ability to excel in the NBA environment only. Give me his money and I'll bust my a** even more, but I'll still suck at the end of the day, and tenfold more than Tyler.



Drafrting by Bird. Don't mix FA moves/trades with drafts.

Hibbert at 17 is awesome.

Granger and Paul George were picked where most draft experts thought they should go. In fact Granger seemed like a steal that night, falling due to knee worries. TBird told the entire PD draft group BEFORE the pick that PG was the guy to get, and he did it for free instead of NBA GM salary.

If you take Leonard then it's a good draft. We don't know for sure that without the Hill deal Bird would have done that. That might have been the Spurs request only.


Shawne, White (trading picks to get) was awful.

Tyler was awful (esp if you could have let Chicago take him and moved to their 2 picks, pulling Holiday and Blair/Chase/S Young)

Bayless trade was awful because Bird turned that into NOTHING. You traded Rush for Lou and let Lou walk, you let JJack walk, you let Josh walk. You had a HR deal where you got 3 solid bench players with one pick, but turned it into no players within a few years.

Plumlee was awful because you could have got him in round 2. Bird overspent (ditto Tyler).

They traded the 07 pick for Al Harrington (plus cash and taking on Edwards). Bad trade, unknown draft choice.

Harrison pick was not good, though that was mentality mostly. OTOH Varejao went with the very next pick.

I have it at
A Roy
B Granger
B George
C Rush (I'm a Rush fan still)
D Tyler
D Plumlee
F Williams/White

For a solid C average.


George pick could still turn into an A, but as of right now I pretty much agree.

Though I think I would maybe give the Granger pick an A. Remember, Gerald Green dropped too, and many people wanted Green that night.

Strummer
10-10-2012, 11:11 AM
...
...
...
...
For a solid C average.

That was a lot to type just to say he has some hits and some misses, just like every other GM. You could have just said the Pacers had the 5th best record in the NBA last year so it's obvious he's done a stellar job.

Major Cold
10-10-2012, 01:08 PM
That was a lot to type just to say he has some hits and some misses, just like every other GM. You could have just said the Pacers had the 5th best record in the NBA last year so it's obvious he's done a stellar job.
He is not saying he didn't do a stellar job.

Look George and Granger were easy picks to make. Sure we could have picked Gerald Green or Ed Davis, but most people didn't think" Wow what a surprise pick by Bird".

They did that with Williams, Tyler, and Plumlee. And we pretty much know the results.

Bird did a lot for this franchise. His FA pick ups were good for this team. His willingness to sign Danny to a good contract was great. Getting rid of Murphy was a plus. But he is average at best on draft night.

Drafting is a C
Other duties B+
Inheriting a future stock of a team graded at D+
Overall grade A IMO

Major Cold
10-10-2012, 01:09 PM
I think if you were to look at Bird's drafting during his time here and compare it to all the other teams, he would easily rank in the top 5 over that time period. Sure I'm skeptical about Plumlee, but Granger, Hibbert, George and getting Hill are all great picks and/or moves. Plus still have to see on Lance, Plumlee and OJ.
Name 25 drafters that he is better and why.

Strummer
10-10-2012, 01:18 PM
They did that with ... and Plumlee. And we pretty much know the results.



You must be clairvoyant.

Speed
10-10-2012, 01:39 PM
Indystar article today says Pendegraph is pushing for Tyler's minutes at the back up PF. I'd quote and link it but I'm not a Indystar subscriber, but its in the print edition.

Major Cold
10-10-2012, 02:01 PM
You must be clairvoyant.
You know maybe it doesn't take clairvoyance to see that it was a bad pick. If there are no big men after him that pan out....THIS YEAR. Then I will drop it. It bothered me when it happened, and then I let it go. But with Tyler failing, and people in the Pacers organization saying it will be 2 years till Miles might contribute...Lets just say I am not willing to give Bird thumbs up for the pick.

If Miles is slightly worse than Foster, then it is a great pick. If he is no better than McRoberts in his last year here, then I say its a botched pick if there is someone clearly better than him. And in all honesty we can have to say that the odds are not in his favor.

Anthem
10-20-2012, 08:21 PM
While I couldn't see the game tonight, I was excited to hear Slick say that Tyler's added the ability to go left. The should help his scoring options considerably.