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Sollozzo
09-14-2012, 12:30 PM
Scroll down to the bottom of the page. Most of them appear to be taken in the mid 90's, though a few are clearly from the 80's. Several show the curtain they used to hang.

http://ballparks.phanfare.com/2414480#imageID=38729981

Speed
09-14-2012, 12:55 PM
Man that place was loud back in the day!

Unclebuck
09-14-2012, 01:13 PM
I always liked the look from the outside. And since the court was basically on level 3 - the building looked really big from the outside. Many people mistaked it for the dome back in the day.

I thnk they changed the seats from orange to blue in '95 so all those pictures are before then.

MSA was certainly louder than the Fieldhouse -

Another thing I liked about MSA was the seats in the lower level between the baselines or the first 10 rows or so of the upper level were great seats. Nothing at the filedhouse compares because of the slope at MSA - very steep, so you were close to the floor, but higher up and had a great view. The fieldhouse you might be very low but the angle isn't as good because you are further away from the court.

Best seat ever was about 12-15 rows up at MSA right at midcourt - nothing at the fieldhouse comes close

pacergod2
09-14-2012, 01:21 PM
Anybody else get chills?

Speed
09-14-2012, 01:21 PM
Yep, literally not a bad seat in the house, I'd often sit in the corners, as far back as the wall and it was still awesome!

Sollozzo
09-14-2012, 01:28 PM
I still remember my first two games at MSA in the 1995-1996 season when I was a very young kid. The first was in November 1995 against the Kings when the teams got into a big brawl. That's the game where Dale Davis was fighting Michael Smith. The second was about a month later against the Clippers. Smits dropped a career high of 44 that stood for the remainder of his career. Those were a couple of eventful games to see for a young fan like me who was going to his first Pacer games.

Roaming Gnome
09-14-2012, 01:33 PM
Yep, literally not a bad seat in the house, I'd often sit in the corners, as far back as the wall and it was still awesome!

Yep, I remember slapping on that metal mesh wall in the upper corners trying to create a few more decibels in an utter sea of noise!

Sollozo, thanks for pointing us to that site... I believe his pics are the first I've seen of the original Arco Arena (Before the current building) where the Kings played for their first couple seasons in Sac. There are not too many pics of the inside of that place and a few others floating around the internet.

Hoop
09-14-2012, 01:33 PM
I can't believe I'd already forgot how a lot of MSA looked. MSA was great!

I saved all the MSA pixs, wish the coyright crap was not there.

Roaming Gnome
09-14-2012, 01:44 PM
I still remember my first two games at MSA in the 1995-1996 season when I was a very young kid. The first was in November 1995 against the Kings when the teams got into a big brawl. That's the game where Dale Davis was fighting Michael Smith.

I never seen anyone get hit on top of the head like that.... It was cartoon like!
Dale Davis... Legendary!

Sollozzo
09-14-2012, 01:47 PM
I never seen anyone get hit on top of the head like that.... It was cartoon like!
Dale Davis... Legendary!


I'm pretty sure that was the biggest fight in NBA history as far as suspensions handed down up until the brawl. Can anyone confirm that?

Unclebuck
09-14-2012, 02:05 PM
Yep, literally not a bad seat in the house, I'd often sit in the corners, as far back as the wall and it was still awesome!


I can't go that far. IMO once you got about 20 rows up into the upper section the seats were horrible - felt dangerous because of the steep slope.

Because it was also a hockey arena the seats behind the baskets were really far back away from the court. You had no leg room at all.

The concourses were terrible. Having to walk up 6 flights just to enter the building - horrible.

Also the A/C sucked

Unclebuck
09-14-2012, 02:08 PM
I'm pretty sure that was the biggest fight in NBA history as far as suspensions handed down up until the brawl. Can anyone confirm that?

I doubt it. As far as suspensions it was probably the fight in Phoenix between the Knicks and Suns. There were actually two fights http://breadcity.org/2009/07/13/knicks-vs-suns-1993/

Actually there used to be a lot of fights.

There was also a pretty bad one in a playoff game at Atlanta in the early 90's



Edit: no, i am wrong.


http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2701111
In an unprecedented move, the NBA suspends 16 players for fighting during the Pacers-Kings game in Indianapolis. Forward Dale Davis of the Pacers and Michael Smith of the Kings received the greatest penalties -- both received two-game suspensions without pay and $20,000 in fines. The pair fought with 2:43 left in the third quarter of the Kings' 119-95 victory. Kings center Duane Causewell was suspended for one game without pay and fined $7,500 because he left the bench and did not try to break up the bench-clearing fracas in which punches and choking took place. The 13 other players, including Pacers star Reggie Miller, received one-game suspensions and $2,500 fines for leaving the bench areas. The Kings penalized: Tyus Edney, Byron Houston, Sarunas Marciulionis, Olden Polynice, Lionel Simmons and Walt Williams. The Pacers penalized: Travis Best, Adrian Caldwell, Duane Ferrell, Fred Holberg, Mark Jackson, Miller and Dwayne Schintzius.

Sollozzo
09-14-2012, 02:10 PM
The NBA suspended 16 players Saturday for fighting during Friday night's game between the Indiana Pacers and the Sacramento Kings, the largest number ever suspended from one incident.

NBA spokeswoman Teri Washington said it was the league's largest mass-suspension ever.

http://www.chron.com/CDA/archives/archive.mpl/1995_1307663/nba-suspends-16-pacers-kings.html

Tom White
09-14-2012, 02:12 PM
Yep, literally not a bad seat in the house, I'd often sit in the corners, as far back as the wall and it was still awesome!

How about the floor seats behind one of the baskets? You know, the end where they would set up about 8-10 rows of folding chairs on the end of the floor used for hockey? Those had to be horrible seats.

Also, the outdoor concourse on the sixth (I think it was sixth) level and the ramps would always get covered in ice and snow and be slick as heck in winter storms.

I know numerous bands did not like to perform there because of how the huge equipment had to be loaded the the court level, and circuses hated it for getting the animals to that level as well.

Unclebuck
09-14-2012, 02:20 PM
I don't mind the good memories of MSA - but lets not forget the bad ones also.

I hated those ramps.

Speed
09-14-2012, 03:04 PM
Yep, I remember slapping on that metal mesh wall in the upper corners trying to create a few more decibels in an utter sea of noise!

Sollozo, thanks for pointing us to that site... I believe his pics are the first I've seen of the original Arco Arena (Before the current building) where the Kings played for their first couple seasons in Sac. There are not too many pics of the inside of that place and a few others floating around the internet.

Excellent, during a playoff game my hands had bruises from banging that waffle metal wall.

Speed
09-14-2012, 03:05 PM
I don't mind the good memories of MSA - but lets not forget the bad ones also.

I hated those ramps.

I'm pretty sure I spent the better part of my teens and 20s walking up those ramps.

Naptown_Seth
09-14-2012, 03:51 PM
The NBA suspended 16 players Saturday for fighting during Friday night's game between the Indiana Pacers and the Sacramento Kings, the largest number ever suspended from one incident.

NBA spokeswoman Teri Washington said it was the league's largest mass-suspension ever.

http://www.chron.com/CDA/archives/archive.mpl/1995_1307663/nba-suspends-16-pacers-kings.html

So the Pacers were part of the worst NBA brawl twice. Freaking 90's gangsters, that's why I hated that Reggie/Rik/Dale era.

;)

Naptown_Seth
09-14-2012, 03:57 PM
I don't mind the good memories of MSA - but lets not forget the bad ones also.

I hated those ramps.

But the two worst things were the concourse as you mentioned and trying to leave if it was pretty full and you were in the high side seats. Everything exited the same concourse level so your best bet would be to work your way down and then over an aisle and even then it would take forever.


I rarely had good seats in those days, though the corner behind the baseline seats were a huge steal, running $6-7 in the early 90s for just above the concourse. My two great seats were a friend getting is into his dad's seats, center about row 4-5 (state senator) for a Spurs game around 94 maybe, and my wife getting me 3rd row at the baseline (side) where I saw Shawn Kemp show one of the nastiest spins to dunk that I've ever witnessed.

I recall as a kid seeing Gervin light them up for 50+ I think, maybe 79-80 era? I should check BBRef.

Sollozzo
09-14-2012, 03:58 PM
MSA has to be one of the most bizarre arenas ever. Has there ever been another arena that was elevated above a city street?

I can't believe that the site has been a parking lot for 11 years now. Apartments are always springing up downtown, and you would have thought something would eventually have been built.

Sollozzo
09-14-2012, 04:04 PM
Here's the link for the Smits 44 point game I was talking about. Even though I was only 8, I can still remember Reb Porter announcing his career high.

44 pts on 20-29 shooting for the Dunking Dutchman.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/199512100IND.html

Hoop
09-14-2012, 04:25 PM
I was at the Pacer vs Kings game, that was one heck of a fight. Not as big as that one, but fights happened all the time in the NBA, it wasn't as big of deal as it is now days.

I had a real good view of some of it, Antonio Davis had 2 Kings on the ground beating the tar out of them. A.D. didn't even get suspended cause he wasn't on film.

imawhat
09-14-2012, 04:35 PM
MSA has to be one of the most bizarre arenas ever. Has there ever been another arena that was elevated above a city street?

I can't believe that the site has been a parking lot for 11 years now. Apartments are always springing up downtown, and you would have thought something would eventually have been built.

There was a high rise condo project in the works, but that fell through in about 2008 or 2009...maybe earlier.



There's no question that the Fieldhouse is a much better arena, but I'm probably one of the rare few that prefer MSA over the Fieldhouse.

Major Cold
09-16-2012, 10:48 PM
You guys are romantisizing the past. The Fieldhouse was an immediate upgrade more so than the RCA to Lucas Oil. The Fieldhouse has less blind spots, less steepness, better concourse, entries and exits are smoother, and a way better courtside feel.

With that said, some of the greatest Pacer moments happened in MSA.

idioteque
09-17-2012, 06:53 AM
You guys are romantisizing the past. The Fieldhouse was an immediate upgrade more so than the RCA to Lucas Oil. The Fieldhouse has less blind spots, less steepness, better concourse, entries and exits are smoother, and a way better courtside feel.

With that said, some of the greatest Pacer moments happened in MSA.

I don't know, MSA, when it was torn down, was still adequate for an NBA arena. Not great by any means, but adequate in terms of amenities. Heck, MSA in 1998 was probably nicer than the Bradley Center in 2012, which says something about our owners' commitment to our franchise. I also go to the Verizon Center every year and it may be marginally nicer than MSA, but not really (it does lack those awful ramps). As far as sight lines, my grandparents season tickets at MSA and BLF are basically in the same part of the arena. I liked the MSA seats better because my grandparents' seats are on the far left side of the arena, and I feel like at MSA the sight line was better, it was just a bit more fluid whereas at BLF you really feel segmented off to one side. JMO.

As far as the RCA Dome is concerned, that place was way out of the sync with the standard for NFL stadiums (admittedly much higher than NBA arenas) and needed to go. I've never been to Lucas Oil so I can't speak for it, but I remember my last game at the Dome and thinking wow this place is a dump compared to other NFL facilities they have to tear it down to keep the team in Indy.

indygeezer
09-17-2012, 07:44 AM
The NBA suspended 16 players Saturday for fighting during Friday night's game between the Indiana Pacers and the Sacramento Kings, the largest number ever suspended from one incident.

NBA spokeswoman Teri Washington said it was the league's largest mass-suspension ever.

http://www.chron.com/CDA/archives/archive.mpl/1995_1307663/nba-suspends-16-pacers-kings.html

Combine that with the brawl and ....THE FIGHT.....from the ABA days and we're one bad assed team.

HickeyS2000
09-17-2012, 11:30 AM
I was at the Pacer vs Kings game, that was one heck of a fight. Not as big as that one, but fights happened all the time in the NBA, it wasn't as big of deal as it is now days.

I had a real good view of some of it, Antonio Davis had 2 Kings on the ground beating the tar out of them. A.D. didn't even get suspended cause he wasn't on film.

I was at the game too. It was one of my first. I remember the next day a national newspaper had a cartoon clip of AD and DD with boxing gloves on, and the entire Kings roster on the ground beat-up. It was AWESOME! I have looked for that picture many many times but cannot find it. Anyone else see this?

Naptown_Seth
09-18-2012, 05:34 PM
I disagree. MSA was not adequate. The food concourse alone was a no-go. You could fit maybe 6-7 people from a food window to the other side of the hall, total. This meant that you couldn't really walk around the concourse to get to other food areas or the bathrooms without fighting through crowds. After seeing Houston and Charlotte (Summit and the Hive, not the new arenas) where they had huge food areas broken off to the side of the concourse and wider walking areas in general I realized just what a craphole MSA was.

And as much as I thought the ticket window area was cool due to the view and angled windows, that space was super small and would be a joke if they tried to fulfill the amount of ticket sales they often do at Conseco before a game.

MSA had solid acoustics for an arena, had a great location and had a coolness factor for having Market St run under it. But everything else sucked.


Well, you did get wait service to your seat with courtside seating (first 6-9 rows or something) that's gone now, replaced with the Best Locker Room I suppose (which is way too small for busy nights).

ChicagoJ
09-18-2012, 11:53 PM
I'm sorry, MSA was badly undersized. Its a good thing there was never an emergency evacuation.

Everything about the Fieldhouse was a major upgrade.

I also don't get the knock on the Bradley Center, but I primarily go there to see Springsteen and its a great place for that. As for basketball, well its still better than The UC or any hockey arena with its lousy sightlines beyond the baseline.

Unclebuck
09-19-2012, 08:44 AM
I always heard that MSA was great for concerts. Never been to a concert there myself so I don't know

billbradley
09-19-2012, 08:46 AM
I've seen a few folks raggin' on the ramps.

I loved the ramps! Everyone screaming, honking and going crazy. Those ramps after wins are some of my favorite Pacers memories.

BillS
09-19-2012, 10:07 AM
I've seen a few folks raggin' on the ramps.

I loved the ramps! Everyone screaming, honking and going crazy. Those ramps after wins are some of my favorite Pacers memories.

They exit honking from the Virginia St. garage after Fever wins. Really got to get Pacer fans to do the same thing after wins.

Hicks
09-19-2012, 12:10 PM
They exit honking from the Virginia St. garage after Fever wins. Really got to get Pacer fans to do the same thing after wins.

They do. Or at least they have before; it's been a while since I've left a game immediately afterward and also having parked in the garage. But I recall numerous Pacer wins at Conseco with honking cars after the game.

IndyJones
09-19-2012, 12:22 PM
It did seem huge from the outside. When I was a kid and used to go to Disney on Ice and stuff there, I actually thought they had different rooms for basketball and ice skating and such.

Eddie Gill
09-19-2012, 12:33 PM
I love looking at old pics of MSA. If anyone has any others or knows of other good online collections they are I would love to see them. I was pretty little during the MSA days so my memories of the place is a little hazy. Speaking of hazy, I remember that place getting really smoky after all the fireworks and whatnot.

naptownmenace
09-21-2012, 11:35 PM
You guys are romantisizing the past. The Fieldhouse was an immediate upgrade more so than the RCA to Lucas Oil. The Fieldhouse has less blind spots, less steepness, better concourse, entries and exits are smoother, and a way better courtside feel.

With that said, some of the greatest Pacer moments happened in MSA.

Thank you! I felt the exact same way about MSA. I loved going to the games but I really disliked the arena. All The ramps and stairs were a major pain and once you reached your level, you had to wade your way through the narrowest concourse I have ever seen. Once you made it inside the auditorium, you had to climb up those ridiculously steep steps to reach your seats. For years they didn't even have hand rails.

I was so incredibly happy the first time I stepped into the Fieldhouse. A new building was way overdo and the Fieldhouse is still considered one of the best arenas in the world. I also think the sight lines are much better at than they were back at MSA. JMO

threein73
09-22-2012, 11:41 AM
I loved MSA, I have lots of great memories there, both ABA and NBA, but of course the Fieldhouse is phenomenal... Man I'm getting old, as a youngster I went to the first game ever at MSA, a thrilling OT win against the defending NBA champion Bucks, and I was at the first game at the Fieldhouse... wow, I remember when MSA was being built and the Pacers were telling the fans about how great and modern it was going to be, and now it is a parking lot, etc.. man, I AM old! (but still a Pacers nut)

duke dynamite
09-24-2012, 03:50 PM
I remember getting scared to death walking up those stairs from the floor. When I was a kid, that was a really steep climb. I was so afraid of falling down.

It was good for what it was, nostalgia. I keep telling myself with the Home Court shop actually IN the Fieldhouse, it could be worse still at MSA, you actually had to leave the building and go under the garage to get there. I'd hate to be the type of person I am with that kind of a climb down there.

On a side note, my dad's company was contracted during the renovations back in 1995, how he'd have to get harnessed to the rafters to do electrical work while being upside down. I couldn't do it.

Larry Staverman
09-24-2012, 08:08 PM
The worst thing about Market Square was the lower level bathrooms...one on each side. If you were trying to hold it after pounding a few cold ones and the game was close with a lot of time outs at the end you had to go during the action because if there was a time out it was 30 deep for about 6 urinals and you would miss more game action waiting in line at the time out. The women's was worse as their line was even deeper and much slower.

One cool thing about Market Square was if you didn't have a ticket you could flash a stub from a previous game at the gate real quick and get through and go to Market Square Gardens and grab a window seat and 4 people only had to spend $40 minimum to drink and watch the game.

My brother used to flirt with the girl at the lower level liquor counter and tipped her well and she would save the end of each bottle used and add it to the measured shot and mix him super strong drinks for normal price.

We also had a couple parking spots in front of the city market that weren't legal spots but we parked there for years and could get there 10 minutes before tip and park right out front and walk right in.

Coopdog23
09-25-2012, 09:07 AM
Miss that place. Similar to the RCA Dome, loud place and it had some great memories