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Psyren
09-06-2012, 05:55 PM
http://www.nba.com/pacers/news/pacers-sign-blake-ahearn-sam-young-sundiata-gaines

INDIANAPOLIS – The Indiana Pacers announced Thursday they have signed free agents Sam Young, Sundiata Gaines and Blake Ahearn to contracts. Per club policy, terms of the contracts are not released.

Young is a 6-6 small forward/shooting guard who has played three NBA seasons with the Memphis Grizzlies and Philadelphia 76ers. He has career averages of 6.6 points per game and 1.8 rebounds per game. He was a second-round pick (36th overall) of the Grizzlies in the 2009 NBA Draft.

Gaines is a 6-1 point guard who was undrafted out of Georgia in 2008. He has played with Utah, Minnesota, Toronto and New Jersey with career averages of 5.1 ppg and 2.2 assists per game. He has played 113 games in the NBA. Ahearn was undrafted in 2007 after playing at Missouri State. A 6-2 guard, Ahearn has 19 games NBA experience with Miami, San Antonio and Utah with a career average of 2.5 ppg. He has also played in Europe and the NBA D-League where in 2011-12 he was the league’s leading scorer at 23.8 ppg. He is also the D-League’s all-time leader in points.

Heisenberg
09-06-2012, 05:59 PM
All camp contracts I assume. Like Sam Young's game, would actually be comfortable with him playing regular rotation minutes.

diamonddave00
09-06-2012, 05:59 PM
Sam Young is an intresting signing. Gaines and Ahearn don't excite but Young , I like for at least a camp look.

graphic-er
09-06-2012, 06:00 PM
ugh, still thin on the front line! Why do we need all these guards? We only have 3 bigs, need a 4th.

FlavaDave
09-06-2012, 06:01 PM
I remember watching Sundiata Gaines play and thinking "That guy's a decent basketball player".

Ace E.Anderson
09-06-2012, 06:04 PM
Somply a matter of Filling out our roster. I see Young making the team easily. Good defender, and is athletic. Gaines is prob insurance in case of injury.

J7F
09-06-2012, 06:05 PM
ugh, still thin on the front line! Why do we need all these guards? We only have 3 bigs, need a 4th.

???

West, Roy, Tyler, Ian, Miles...

I'm ok with all 3 signings... Nothing special there but all 3 are 3rd stringers playing 3rd string... Sam is probably the most intriguing...

Ace E.Anderson
09-06-2012, 06:07 PM
ugh, still thin on the front line! Why do we need all these guards? We only have 3 bigs, need a 4th.

? Do you mean 3 bench bigs? I agree we could use another big for depth, but idk who's available that's better than/would compliment what we already have.

Nuntius
09-06-2012, 06:07 PM
I like Sam Young. He is a big swingman with good athleticism. I recall that he was quite liked by Memphis fans. So, I like the pickup.

I also like the signing of Blake Ahearn. He is too reliable of a FT shooter for me not to like.

As far as Sundiata Gaines is concerned. Well, I am not thrilled about that signing. But if the price is low then I won't complain. As far as I know he is not a negative presence at least.

Goyle
09-06-2012, 06:08 PM
I remember watching Sundiata Gaines play and thinking "That guy's a decent basketball player".

Yup, same with Young. If Lance isn't ready either one will fill in fine.

Heisenberg
09-06-2012, 06:09 PM
? Do you mean 3 bench bigs? I agree we could use another big for depth, but idk who's available that's better than/would compliment what we already have.

There's a certain spray tanner that loves trailing for 3s and stealing boards available.

PR07
09-06-2012, 06:10 PM
Sam Young has a pretty good chance to make the team. He'd instantly become our best perimeter defender off the bench and is probably the only true SF we have as a reserve.

graphic-er
09-06-2012, 06:10 PM
???

West, Roy, Tyler, Ian, Miles...

I'm ok with all 3 signings... Nothing special there but all 3 are 3rd stringers playing 3rd string... Sam is probably the most intriguing...

I do not consider Tyler as a big, he can't protect the rim. Neither can West. But West is a defined asset, where Tyler is lucky to be receiving playing time.

idioteque
09-06-2012, 06:42 PM
Surprising that we were able to get Sam Young in what was probably a camp deal. Thought his stock was higher.

Psyren
09-06-2012, 06:46 PM
Surprising that we were able to get Sam Young in what was probably a camp deal. Thought his stock was higher.

I was surprised too.

I think he has a real chance to make the roster.

wintermute
09-06-2012, 07:07 PM
I like Gaines and Sam Young, both tough defensive-minded players. Gaines had a nice rookie season with the Jazz but has kind of tailed off since. Ahearn, well, I suppose he could be useful as a shooting specialist.

Hypnotiq
09-06-2012, 07:11 PM
Good camp bodies these guys. good job KP and Donnie

I like Sam Young because we do have an opening for another wing bench player.

Gaines im pretty meh on 3rd stinger guard at best

Ahearn have not really seen him play.

pacer4ever
09-06-2012, 07:27 PM
I love Gaines as a 3rd pg good defender terrible on offense. But at least he has a skill we need. Sam Young not sure if I like he hasn't been heathly but he is worth a look.

beast23
09-06-2012, 07:39 PM
Does any of this possibly mean that Lance will not be given the same opportunities under Walsh/Pritchard that he had under Bird/Morway?

sportfireman
09-06-2012, 07:43 PM
???

West, Roy, Tyler, Ian, Miles...

I'm ok with all 3 signings... Nothing special there but all 3 are 3rd stringers playing 3rd string... Sam is probably the most intriguing...

We also have Jeff P.

sam kaiserblade
09-06-2012, 07:43 PM
When I saw the title of this thread I was hoping the Pacers had signed Alex Young. I wanna see him make the league.

pacer4ever
09-06-2012, 07:45 PM
Does any of this possibly mean that Lance will not be given the same opportunities under Walsh/Pritchard that he had under Bird/Morway?

Lance will be the backup SG from all reports it's his to lose. Vogel has already said Lance is his backup SG and a key to the team next year. Obviously if he sucks in camp im guessing that can change but from reports he will be given every chance to show he belongs as a scorer off the bench this is a make or break year for him is what Wells thinks.

Constellations
09-06-2012, 08:02 PM
I approve of this.

daschysta
09-06-2012, 08:09 PM
Young isn't a bad player, he's athletic and a good defender, he was actually quite good his first 2 years in Memphis putting up 8 ppg in only 16 minutes while playing good defense, if he's healthy he should make the roster, and may get playing time if Lance doesn't make good on his opportunity to impress. Gaines wouldn't be a horrible 3rd stringer in case DJ or George gets injured, but nothing to get excited about.

Could've signed much worse end of the benchers/ camp bodies on the cheap.

Speed
09-06-2012, 08:28 PM
Anyone remember when Sam Young was working out in Indy before the draft? He did the vertical jump test, where you have all of those little blinds to knock and then they measure how high you jumped??? Well one of them slice the inside of his arm open with a nasty gash, IIRC. He taped it up, went to the next workout. Dudes tough, if anything.

I'm all over Sam Young getting a fair shot, not just to be 15th guy, but to really have a chance to contribute. I've always liked him, even back in college. He's a plus defender, bulldog at the wing, fits the whole smashmouth identity. Won't give you alot of offense, but I could see him being a Tony Allen type, if he continues to show his value. I agree, very surprising on training camp contract.

Heisenberg
09-06-2012, 08:39 PM
I remember Young getting hurt at his workout here at draft time. If I remember it right he said the pole went into his arm and he was literally hanging there from it.

edit: he got hurt the day before up in Toronto


He twisted his body as he leapt, and a screw on the vertical-leap pole pierced his arm. Rather than risk tearing any muscle, the Raptors personnel removed the screw from the pole, left it in Young’s arm and took him to the hospital to have it dislodged.

http://triblive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/s_625050.html

shags
09-06-2012, 09:09 PM
That's a pretty impressive haul for training camp contracts. If I remember correctly, Ahearn was given a small amount of guaranteed money (http://hoopshype.com/articles/sierra/pacers-to-sign-blake-ahearn), so that probably gives him an edge to making the roster. And Young started on that Memphis team two years ago who beat the Spurs and took the Thunder to 7 games.

LG33
09-06-2012, 09:12 PM
Adding Blake Ahearn and Sam Young will make our team look so much older than it is.

Isaac
09-06-2012, 09:18 PM
Sam Young is as good a wing defender as Dahntay Jones, I hope he makes the team.

J7F
09-06-2012, 09:37 PM
I do not consider Tyler as a big, he can't protect the rim. Neither can West. But West is a defined asset, where Tyler is lucky to be receiving playing time.

Ah... so you meant more of a post presence... Not literal...

I don't know that there were any ligitimate options in the post left...And I apologize if I'm getting mixed up on who it was but I'm pretty sure I saw earlier that you wanted Blatche... And I agree he is full of talent and potential but as a fan of the Pacers I have a real hard time trusting in a potential head case... I most likely have never really given Lance as much of a chance as I regularly would with a young prospect of ours because of how he started off... But I'm really trying to change that with him this year...

And KMart is still out there and he can still play... But I couldn't root for such a d-bag...

Nuntius
09-06-2012, 09:47 PM
ugh, still thin on the front line! Why do we need all these guards? We only have 3 bigs, need a 4th.

Pendergraph is still on our team.

Besides, we had Fesenko last year but Vogel never used him. My guess is that he thinks that our front line is fine.

Frankly, with Ian and Miles backing up Roy, I'd say that we're ok.

TMJ31
09-06-2012, 09:59 PM
I like it.

First of all, why NOT?!

But secondly, with Gaines, I do remember seeing him have a few really solid performances in the past.
I would not at all be opposed to him being a 12th+ man on the Pacers.

PGisthefuture
09-06-2012, 10:37 PM
So to be clear, does anybody know if these are just camp signings or we actually signed them? I like them all to be honest. Gaines could replace A.J. and be a good defender, I feel like Sam Young has to have actually been signed to the team because he is the best out of the 3 by far and would replace what Dahntay did, and it doesn't hurt to have a shooting specialist on your bench in Ahearn.

Hypnotiq
09-06-2012, 10:46 PM
So to be clear, does anybody know if these are just camp signings or we actually signed them? I like them all to be honest. Gaines could replace A.J. and be a good defender, I feel like Sam Young has to have actually been signed to the team because he is the best out of the 3 by far and would replace what Dahntay did, and it doesn't hurt to have a shooting specialist on your bench in Ahearn.

Dont think there is a enough roster spots for them all.

we have 13 people under deals now and can only add 2 more i think unless rules have changed

PGisthefuture
09-06-2012, 11:06 PM
Dont think there is a enough roster spots for them all.

we have 13 people under deals now and can only add 2 more i think unless rules have changed

Yeah, I haven't looked in awhile, but I thought we had around 13 people. I wouldn't mind having Sam Young at all tho.

pacer4ever
09-06-2012, 11:15 PM
Dominic McGuire is a free agent we should of signed him a month ago. I like him much better than Young.

graphic-er
09-06-2012, 11:38 PM
I will say that Sam Young will probably make this team with no problems. He is a lock down defender with playoff experience. He is the new Dante Jones.

Brad8888
09-06-2012, 11:48 PM
I would hope he is better than that.

Dahntay's reputation as a defender took a big hit for me while he was with the Pacers. Even with the truly defensive minded Vogel in charge, Dahntay didn't get much burn. I suspect that was because of both his black hole style of offense, as well as his primary defensive tactics being grabbing jerseys, pushing lower backs with his off hand, and generally taking chances that frequently failed, all while getting called for a higher number of fouls than others might due to his reputation with the officials of being Bruce Bowen lite.

If Sam Young moves his feet and has the quickness to stay in front of his man, which he likely does, and can do so without the contact, he is already a better defender than Dahntay in my opinion.

Psyren
09-06-2012, 11:51 PM
Maybe Im remembering incorrectly (very likely), but I thought I heard teams could now carry 16...

Someone please enlighten me.

BornReady
09-06-2012, 11:56 PM
Did we sign Orlando Johnson yet?

PGisthefuture
09-07-2012, 01:09 AM
Maybe Im remembering incorrectly (very likely), but I thought I heard teams could now carry 16...

Someone please enlighten me.
I'm almost 100% sure that that is not true.

Did we sign Orlando Johnson yet?
Yes.

Trader Joe
09-07-2012, 01:15 AM
I may be wrong, but as a second year player I think Young actually got a starter's job with a pretty good Memphis team for a bit. Really interesting pickup. He would seem to be smart insurance if Lance were to struggle.

Heisenberg
09-07-2012, 01:23 AM
I may be wrong, but as a second year player I think Young actually got a starter's job with a pretty good Memphis team for a bit. Really interesting pickup. He would seem to be smart insurance if Lance were to struggle.

He did, but by default. Rudy Gay went down so he had to play. He didn't necessarily "earn" it. But he did well in his role. Pretty sure the reason he got dumped by Memphis was a money move, they were just a bit over the tax threshold so just dumped him and maybe another guy or two to get under it.

Guy's an NBA player, when he was on the trading block I wanted us to take him for free (read: 2025 2nd rounder or whatever). The only way I think he doesn't make the roster is if he's not healthy. DJ, Green, Lance, and Young is a pretty deep bench front 3 rotation with some promise. It ain't gonna happen but if they went and signed Kenyon Martin I'd be pretty pumped.

Speed
09-07-2012, 05:59 AM
It ain't gonna happen but if they went and signed Kenyon Martin I'd be pretty pumped.

He's a guy I keep coming back too. I wish I knew more about him. Not as a player, but as part of a team and off the court. I think he's still a very very good tough, physical player that other guys don't mess with, under almost any circumstance. I don't know if this comes from his physical prescence, on the court, or his persona off the court. I'm finding it hard to articulate it.... I don't want a guy that his own teammates are scared of him, if that makes any sense. I do, want a player, who the other teams won't mess with.

MvPlumlee
09-07-2012, 07:43 AM
Adding Blake Ahearn and Sam Young will make our team look so much older than it is.
In street clothes, everybody will think a couple of our players wanted their daddies sitting close to them.

If they fill in all 15 spots, I would put my money on those two.

They might bring in another big body for camp, but it is very unlikely he will make the cut, unless he can play the 3.
I count 4 players who can play the 5, 6 players the 4, only 3 the 3, 5 the 2 and also only 3 the 1.
A veteran PG and a strong SF is where I think our biggest deep bench gaps situate.

repole
09-07-2012, 08:22 AM
Ugh, Gaines is awful. I followed the Nets last year, there isn't a single fan from that side that would have anything positive to say about Sundiata. He tries to do way too much.

Coopdog23
09-07-2012, 08:43 AM
who?

owl
09-07-2012, 09:33 AM
who?


So is Fesenko not even on the camp roster? It seemed like he could contribute.

Coopdog23
09-07-2012, 09:36 AM
So is Fesenko not even on the camp roster? It seemed like he could contribute.

he was more of just being on the team if Roy, Tyler, or Lou go injured.

Speed
09-07-2012, 09:39 AM
Point guards (2) - George Hill, DJ Augustine
Wings (5) - Paul George, Danny Granger, Gerald Greene, Lance Stephenson, Orlando Johnson
Bigs (5) - David West, Roy Hibbert, Ian Mahimni, Tyler Hansbrough, Plumlee

That is 12 guys who will be on the roster, unless there's a trade.

Too much depends on Lance Stephenson with this scenario, not that he can't do it, its just not proven.

So, that leaves these guys trying to fill the last spots.

Jeff Pendergraph, Sam Young, Sundiata Gaines, and Ahearn.

You have to have a 3rd point guard, that is either Gaines or Ahearn. So that is one of the spots, imo. This puts you at 13.

If Lance isn't ready and Orlando Johnson is a rookie, you need another wing. I think thats Sam Young, imo, you could do alot worse. This puts you at 14.

You should try to have 6 bigs, just for injuries. You can look at the break down between Centers and PFs on the existing team and you have enough guys who supposedly can play either position, at times. Roy, Mahinmi, Plumlee at center. D West, Hansbrough, and Mahinmi at PF. So you are okay there. I think they keep Pendergraph too, though, just to have enough bodies. Also, they love Pendergraph in the lockeroom and how hard he works, so that helps him. (I'm skeptical of this, since he looked okay to bad in summer league, but still). That is 15.

I think they'd rather not carry 15 and keep only 14 to keep flexibility if they want to make a move going forward. However, with the structure of the team I think they keep all 15 and the only decision is between Gaines and Ahearn. I think that comes down to how bad Ahearns defense is or how great his shooting is. I think Gaines is the pick since he's just a solid all around proven 3rd NBA caliber Point Guard.

Wildcard #1 - Lance looks like he's ready for a break through season and they feel like you don't need to carry those extra guys as insurance.

Wildcard #2 - Sam Young is the only one out of those 4 that has an actualy chance to beat out guys in front of him and be a rotation player. Gaines/Ahearn are #3 Point Guards, not beating out Hill and DJ Augustine. Pendergraph isn't beating out the rotation bigs in front of him. Sam Young has to beat out Lance and Orlando to start to get minutes in a 10 man rotation...that doesn't seem impossible, at all.

Final Roster going into the first game would look like this, I think (pending other moves, of course).

Point guards (3) - George Hill, DJ Augustine, Sundiata Gaines
Wings (6) - Paul George, Danny Granger, Gerald Greene, Lance Stephenson, Sam Young, Orlando Johnson
Bigs (6) - David West, Roy Hibbert, Ian Mahimni, Tyler Hansbrough, Miles Plumlee, Jeff Pendergraph

J7F
09-07-2012, 09:45 AM
Point guards (2) - George Hill, DJ Augustine
Wings (5) - Paul George, Danny Granger, Gerald Greene, Lance Stephenson, Orlando Johnson
Bigs (5) - David West, Roy Hibbert, Ian Mahimni, Tyler Hansbrough, Plumlee

That is 12 guys who will be on the roster, unless there's a trade.

Too much depends on Lance Stephenson with this scenario, not that he can't do it, its just not proven.

So, that leaves these guys trying to fill the last spots.

Jeff Pendergraph, Sam Young, Sundiata Gaines, and Ahearn.

You have to have a 3rd point guard, that is either Gaines or Ahearn. So that is one of the spots, imo. This puts you at 13.

If Lance isn't ready and Orlando Johnson is a rookie, you need another wing. I think thats Sam Young, imo, you could do alot worse. This puts you at 14.

You should try to have 6 bigs, just for injuries. You can look at the break down between Centers and PFs on the existing team and you have enough guys who supposedly can play either position, at times. Roy, Mahinmi, Plumlee at center. D West, Hansbrough, and Mahinmi at PF. So you are okay there. I think they keep Pendergraph too, though, just to have enough bodies. Also, they love Pendergraph in the lockeroom and how hard he works, so that helps him. (I'm skeptical of this, since he looked okay to bad in summer league, but still). That is 15.

I think they'd rather not carry 15 and keep only 14 to keep flexibility if they want to make a move going forward. However, with the structure of the team I think they keep all 15 and the only decision is between Gaines and Ahearn. I think that comes down to how bad Ahearns defense is or how great his shooting is. I think Gaines is the pick since he's just a solid all around proven 3rd NBA caliber Point Guard.

Wildcard #1 - Lance looks like he's ready for a break through season and they feel like you don't need to carry those extra guys as insurance.

Wildcard #2 - Sam Young is the only one out of those 4 that has an actualy chance to beat out guys in front of him and be a rotation player. Gaines/Ahearn are #3 Point Guards, not beating out Hill and DJ Augustine. Pendergraph isn't beating out the rotation bigs in front of him. Sam Young has to beat out Lance and Orlando to start to get minutes in a 10 man rotation...that doesn't seem impossible, at all.

Final Roster going into the first game would look like this, I think (pending other moves, of course).

Point guards (3) - George Hill, DJ Augustine, Sundiata Gaines
Wings (6) - Paul George, Danny Granger, Gerald Greene, Lance Stephenson, Sam Young, Orlando Johnson
Bigs (6) - David West, Roy Hibbert, Ian Mahimni, Tyler Hansbrough, Miles Plumlee, Jeff Pendergraph

I thought Pendy was guaranteed?

wintermute
09-07-2012, 10:06 AM
I thought Pendy was guaranteed?

Yup, guaranteed $1.5m. Doesn't mean we won't cut him if the need arises, but I would think someone else would have to blow the coaching staff away for him to lose his spot.



You have to have a 3rd point guard, that is either Gaines or Ahearn. So that is one of the spots, imo. This puts you at 13.


That's my thinking as well, but TPTB seem to think that either Lance or OJ can fill the 3rd PG spot, if summer league is any indication.

Right now my money's on Gaines, but it all depends on how they perform in camp obviously.

I think our wing rotation is ok if Augustin plays heavy minutes at PG with George Hill switching over to SG for a chunk of time. Obviously not everyone agrees with this line of thinking.

pacergod2
09-07-2012, 10:18 AM
Also, these guys are signed to training camp deals, which entails typically getting about $50k in guaranteed money on a league minimum deal. They have incentive to come to your camp and try out. If they fail to make the roster, they take their $50k and go play in the DLeague or Europe. If they make the team, they jump up to about $800k which is more than they'd make anywhere else and they get their opportunity on an NBA roster.

IMO, I think we sign Young. The dude is an ox. He is super strong and he's athletic. He needs to improve his shot, which is why I don't think he has stuck on a team. If he can make our roster, it gives him some more opportunity to improve his offensive game and its versatilty. He is very good as a defender and rebounder for his position. I'd like to see him play a little more SF than SG personally. If anything, he can give us a couple more hard fouls on LeDouche.

Trophy
09-07-2012, 10:35 AM
I love the Sam Young signing.

He's the perfect wingman to have on the team and to put in the rotation if needed. He filled in well for Memphis in the 2011 playoffs when Rudy Gay was out.

Same with Gaines. He'd be a great third string PG to fill in if needed. We'll see if he can beat out Ahearn for the final roster spot.

Speed
09-07-2012, 10:39 AM
Devil's advocate thoughts:

The biggest thing that I think Sam Young would have going against him is his lack of offense and the second unit. When I've watched Sam, I felt like that his jumper was all that was missing to make him a legit rotation wing, on a good team. The Pacers second unit, in its pure form, looks to me like it will struggle offensively.

As it stands, you have Mahinmi at Center who has no skills to get a shot other than finishing and a set shot thats supposed to be improved. Tyler who without getting into it isn't going to generate offense, consistently. Gerald Green who from most reports isn't a shot creator and is more a knock down jumper guy (not what I saw last year, but reports are saying that). Lance who has Point Guard handles, but his decision making is inconsistent. DJ Augustine, he can get his shot or get someone else one. Alot depends on Lance. I think they'll try to go through him quite a bit, hearing Coach Vogel interviewed at the summer league.

So here's my concern for Sam Young, if he is needed to play, ya he helps you defensively and physically, but if your biggest weakness on the bench is offense, he's of almost no help to the overall production based on that need. You are almost better off with hot/cold Barbosa who can carry you in stretches, offensively.

Its like if you got spaghetti noodles, but not enough gravy (sauce), then if someone gives you more noodles, that doesn't really help the meal taste any better, you need some gravy!

Major Cold
09-07-2012, 11:39 AM
I would rather have Adray Blatche, but you can't remove his knucklehead to receive the player.

Sam Young could be the only player to crack the rotation, since we lost Jones.

Nuntius
09-07-2012, 11:43 AM
Dominic McGuire is a free agent we should of signed him a month ago. I like him much better than Young.

I'd be interested in him as well. Limited scoring but he is an amazing rebounder.

Nuntius
09-07-2012, 11:47 AM
Ugh, Gaines is awful. I followed the Nets last year, there isn't a single fan from that side that would have anything positive to say about Sundiata. He tries to do way too much.

That's exactly what I gather from the Nets RealGM board as well. I used to read some game threads there mainly to see what people wrote about Johan Petro :-p

Naptown_Seth
09-07-2012, 12:03 PM
I loved Sam Young as a sleeper in that draft and I think he's met expectations. Coming out he had one of the nastiest up-fakes (his arm length helps) and a solid nice short/on the move jumper touch. He has never had 3pt range which keeps him from being a regular starting SG, but inside the arc he's a solid scorer (but not a scoring machine/instant offense, ie not a 6th man).

He completed 10-11 on 3 solid to strong months which gave every indication that he was on his way to solidifying his role as a 7-8th man bench scorer, something you would expect out of a guy finishing his 2nd season. Then came last season which was a disaster. In part he was never the right fit for the wing rotation that Memphis and Philly already had in play, but other than that I didn't get the drop in production.

If it was just circumstantial then the Pacers just got 15-18 minutes of bench scoring with better defense than Barbosa and better shot selection (less shot hogging) as well. He should be able to outplay Orlando Johnson IMO.

pacergod2
09-07-2012, 12:44 PM
Devil's advocate thoughts:

The biggest thing that I think Sam Young would have going against him is his lack of offense and the second unit. When I've watched Sam, I felt like that his jumper was all that was missing to make him a legit rotation wing, on a good team. The Pacers second unit, in its pure form, looks to me like it will struggle offensively.

As it stands, you have Mahinmi at Center who has no skills to get a shot other than finishing and a set shot thats supposed to be improved. Tyler who without getting into it isn't going to generate offense, consistently. Gerald Green who from most reports isn't a shot creator and is more a knock down jumper guy (not what I saw last year, but reports are saying that). Lance who has Point Guard handles, but his decision making is inconsistent. DJ Augustine, he can get his shot or get someone else one. Alot depends on Lance. I think they'll try to go through him quite a bit, hearing Coach Vogel interviewed at the summer league.

So here's my concern for Sam Young, if he is needed to play, ya he helps you defensively and physically, but if your biggest weakness on the bench is offense, he's of almost no help to the overall production based on that need. You are almost better off with hot/cold Barbosa who can carry you in stretches, offensively.

Its like if you got spaghetti noodles, but not enough gravy (sauce), then if someone gives you more noodles, that doesn't really help the meal taste any better, you need some gravy!

Great points, but I will say this... Our second unit got destroyed in the playoffs when we had to bring in our second unit defensively. Their offense didn't even come close to what they gave up defensively. I would have felt so much better about bringing in Sam Young and Green than Jones and Barbosa, especially against Lebron and DWade. At this point I would say that Green and Young are both as good or better defensively than Jones, and nobody is as bad defensively as Barbosa. Our second unit defense this year will be markedly better. I didn't see very good offensive efficiency last year at any point from our reserves outside of a few games where Barbosa and Collison got hot. And that is all on the individual, not within a team concept of some sort.

I fully expect our second unit to be better both offensively and defensively once we get our rotations solidified next year.

Mad-Mad-Mario
09-07-2012, 01:08 PM
If Young if the guy I am thinking of, then I would definitely like to see him make the final roster. Should watch some film of him to see, but I am so damn lazy right now.

Ace E.Anderson
09-07-2012, 02:24 PM
Great points, but I will say this... Our second unit got destroyed in the playoffs when we had to bring in our second unit defensively. Their offense didn't even come close to what they gave up defensively. I would have felt so much better about bringing in Sam Young and Green than Jones and Barbosa, especially against Lebron and DWade. At this point I would say that Green and Young are both as good or better defensively than Jones, and nobody is as bad defensively as Barbosa. Our second unit defense this year will be markedly better. I didn't see very good offensive efficiency last year at any point from our reserves outside of a few games where Barbosa and Collison got hot. And that is all on the individual, not within a team concept of some sort.

I fully expect our second unit to be better both offensively and defensively once we get our rotations solidified next year.


To add to your point, when you have a starting line up that includes double digit scorers at every position, scoring off the bench isn't AS necessary. Between our starting 5, Augustine and Green you have 7 players that are probably capable of being double digit scorers if necessary. When you add Hansbrough, you have an 8th player that has averaged double digits at some point within his career.

I would much rather have strong defenders coming off the bench, as opposed to having offensive minded players that are defensive liabilities (I.E Barbosa) You can sprinkle a Sam Young and/or a Mahinmi with a variation of our starters, and not lose TOO much offensively, while still being able to match-up defensively.

You can NEVER have too many athletic wing defenders to throw at a Lebron, Wade, D.Rose, Paul Pierce, Joe Johnson, etc.

J7F
09-07-2012, 02:39 PM
Of course if Frank the tank doesn't go with the hockey substitution approach this year I really see near endless possible 5 man units that we can throw together that are well balanced both offensively and defensively...

NapTonius Monk
09-07-2012, 07:34 PM
If Young if the guy I am thinking of, then I would definitely like to see him make the final roster. Should watch some film of him to see, but I am so damn lazy right now.

Here ya go!

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/ZAGKK1zk55o" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen=""></iframe>

CableKC
09-07-2012, 07:55 PM
Yup, guaranteed $1.5m. Doesn't mean we won't cut him if the need arises, but I would think someone else would have to blow the coaching staff away for him to lose his spot.
There is no way that a Team and Front Office that closely watches the SalaryCap and Financial situation would cut a guaranteed Player....even if he is just sitting at the end of the bench in a suit. Unless 2 of the 3 Players brought in COMPLETELY outplays everyone in Training Camp and totally impresses Vogel.....I doubt that Pendegraph is cut.

I think that Young is the best Player of the 3....but if Vogel thinks that Lance is good enough to fill AJs shoes the "break in case of emergency PG", then I'd think ( and hope ) that Young is the one that is kept.

If Vogel thinks that Lance is better suited to play at the wing positions at SG....then I'd think that Gaines is the guy that will be kept.

PGisthefuture
09-07-2012, 10:07 PM
Here ya go!

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/ZAGKK1zk55o" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen=""></iframe>

Man, we would be so athletic if we end up signing him...

CableKC
09-07-2012, 11:22 PM
Its like if you got spaghetti noodles, but not enough gravy (sauce), then if someone gives you more noodles, that doesn't really help the meal taste any better, you need some gravy!
Great....now you made me hungry.

Bball
09-08-2012, 02:19 AM
Its like if you got spaghetti noodles, but not enough gravy (sauce), then if someone gives you more noodles, that doesn't really help the meal taste any better, you need some gravy!

Unless the cook likes noodles and doesn't care much for gravy... then you might not get the gravy you crave....

kent beckley
09-08-2012, 02:05 PM
I like bringing competition into training camp.

Pendy, Lance, and OJ are definitely not garunteed anything if they get their butts beat in camp. They are all on 1 year deals and would be easy to release.

dal9
09-08-2012, 03:05 PM
if young can play dahntay jones D off the bench, then great signing...since the mahini trade we are down a bench wing defender who can reasonably match-up against other teams' starting 2/3s.

BornReady
09-08-2012, 03:36 PM
Unless the cook likes noodles and doesn't care much for gravy... then you might not get the gravy you crave....

Aye who in the right state of mind doesn't like GRAVY!?

Hicks
09-08-2012, 03:50 PM
Yeah, Young seems like a younger Dahntay Jones to me.

Naptown_Seth
09-09-2012, 09:49 PM
1:23 he shows the up fake I'm talking about it. He crushed people with it while at Pitt and it was the one quality that I scouted as being 100% NBA capable, or in other words something he could do that would beat most NBA competition. They might have only put one on his highlight reel here, but it's his go-to move on offense. He drives to the rim or he'll step to the side for the short jumper, and as I said he has nice touch on lateral moving shots.


My only fear is that something has gone awry with him based on last year. Hidden injury, attitude, other??? But he could be a steal for the Pacers.


Here ya go!

<iframe src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/ZAGKK1zk55o" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="315" width="420"></iframe>

MillerTime
09-09-2012, 10:10 PM
I would rather have Adray Blatche, but you can't remove his knucklehead to receive the player.

Sam Young could be the only player to crack the rotation, since we lost Jones.

he signed with the Nets...Nets starting 5 is looking really good with Williams, JJ, Wallace, Blatche and Lopez

Cactus Jax
09-09-2012, 10:28 PM
he signed with the Nets...Nets starting 5 is looking really good with Williams, JJ, Wallace, Blatche and Lopez

Humphries is starting over Blatche for sure.

PGisthefuture
09-09-2012, 11:38 PM
In case anyone was wondering, according to all the major sports websites we have signed all 3 of them to a one-year deal. I'm guessing it comes down to Gaines and Ahearn at the end of training camp, one of them will likely be cut. Glad that we got a guy to replace what Dahntay did in Young.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/features/rumors

Pacers finalize three deals
6:24
AM ET
Indiana Pacers
RECOMMEND0COMMENTS0EMAIL

The Indiana Pacers have made training camp more competitive by signing Blake Ahearn, Sundiata Gaines and Sam Young on Thursday, reports The Indianapolis Star. The contracts are likely for just one season and not fully guaranteed.

Ahearn and Gaines will compete with Lance Stephenson for the third point guard spot on the team behind George Hill and D.J. Augustin.

Young can play the shooting guard and small forward positions and his main competition at those spots are Stephenson and Gerald Green.

The Pacers now have 16 players under contract and either Ahearn or Gaines will likely be the last cut close to opening night to get the roster down to the 15-man limit.

-- Nick Borges

Heisenberg
09-10-2012, 11:01 PM
Some Sam Young stuff

http://www.indysportslegends.com/2012/09/10/agent-new-pacer-sam-young-ready-help-playoff-team/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=agent-new-pacer-sam-young-ready-help-playoff-team


Young and agent Joel Bell had maintained a steady dialogue with Indiana after free agency opened July 1. The Pacers announced Young’s signing Sept. 6.

“He thought it was a great fit because of the way their team is structured and the way they play,” Bell said. “It seemed like a great situation.”

Among other options, Bell said Indiana offered Young an opportunity to continue to swing back and forth between small forward and shooting guard.

“He thinks of himself as a guy that’s ready to help a team that’s already pretty good and help them have a great season,” Bell said.