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View Full Version : This Talk About Shipping Hansbrough.....



presto123
07-06-2012, 04:48 PM
Where are all the Tyler defenders? I was never one of them but it seems they have all disappeared from this forum.

Eleazar
07-06-2012, 04:52 PM
Where are all the Tyler defenders? I was never one of them but it seems they have all disappeared from this forum.

That can happen when you perform as he did last season.

Sparhawk
07-06-2012, 04:54 PM
Um, I thought there was a rumor that Tyler might be traded. Headline is a bit misleading.

Ownagedood
07-06-2012, 04:54 PM
Ya I really think he should be gone as well. Could have been a huge piece of our team last year and was a no show.

redfoster
07-06-2012, 04:58 PM
I don't see any way he survives past the trade deadline. I don't think we will offer him another contract unless it is insanely cheap for us. He's a one-dimensional guy who isn't even really good at his one thing.

WhoLovesYaBaby?
07-06-2012, 04:59 PM
Where are all the Tyler defenders? I was never one of them but it seems they have all disappeared from this forum.

I was a defender until his awful end of the season and playoff performances. His playoff foul on Wade, whom i dont like at all, was inexcusable. Even Vogel said so. I still think he needs another year. But at the same time, I think he is going to want a larger contract than he is worth after next season. At this point, I would rather he stay and improve, but would not be heartbroken if he left.

Sparhawk
07-06-2012, 05:04 PM
All I can hope for is that Hans is simply packed with DC or someone else for a player(s)/pick. I really don't want to have to see him fumble and ***** things up on the court anymore.

He'd be a nice enforcer type player, but only if he was your 3rd PF.

troyc11a
07-06-2012, 05:26 PM
The shortened/condensed season obviously had a negative effect on Tyler's high octane approach to the game. He started out well but ran out of gas the second half of the season. I expect Tyler's play to be a lot better this coming season.

BRushWithDeath
07-06-2012, 05:29 PM
His playoff foul on Wade, whom i dont like at all, was inexcusable. Even Vogel said so.

********. That was the only thing he did all year that I liked.

BlueNGold
07-06-2012, 05:32 PM
I'm pretty surprised at how ineffective Hansbrough has been in the NBA. I never expected a lot. Really I didn't. But I expected a very solid backup 4 and I'm not sure he's even that. The problem is that his ability seems to be limited to one-on-one offense and with his size, it simply doesn't work in the NBA. He was devastating in the NCAA because most teams didn't have anyone big enough to stop him but the NBA is loaded with guys taller and quicker who can simply shut down his style of play. FWIW, he isn't much taller than Granger and Danny isn't going in the paint and dominating either. Paul George wouldn't be able to play that game either. Nobody, except maybe Foster if he had the skills. Hans really needs to sharpen his midrange game and work on the boards or he is an end of the bench player.

mildlysane
07-06-2012, 05:33 PM
I thought for sure he would develop some sort of shot at the rim in addition to for the "bump into the nearest player and toss the ball, semi-sidearm, at the rim, in hopes it either goes in or knocks the rim off the backboard" shot. When that didn't happen, I conceded that I was wrong about him and people like Seth were right about him. He does hustle, though.....but so do fat people at buffet lines.

BlueNGold
07-06-2012, 05:37 PM
I thought for sure he would develop some sort of shot at the rim in addition to for the "bump into the nearest player and toss the ball, semi-sidearm, at the rim, in hopes it either goes in or knocks the rim off the backboard" shot. When that didn't happen, I conceded that I was wrong about him and people like Seth were right about him. He does hustle, though.....but so do fat people at buffet lines.

I suspect he will be more effective if he plays for garbage buckets only. The problem is, those types of guys usually bring it on defense. Tyler is only so-so defensively. So, to be even a good backup 4 he needs to get better at hitting shots. He needs an Antonio McDyess type of midrange game...but he's simply not shooting it that well. He's been accustomed to simply barging into the paint. Recall how badly he was blocked his first year. At least that's not happening now.

J7F
07-06-2012, 05:38 PM
The last great game I saw from Tyler was the 2nd preseason game vs. CHI... It was also the last game before David joined us... I always wondered why he shrank so much when we got West...

joew8302
07-06-2012, 05:44 PM
At least Tyler has shown us SOMETHING in the past. Sure, he had a terrible season, but he has shown glimpses.

What I don't understand about this forum is that some people are sky high on Lance, but are willing to give up on Tyler. IMO it makes no sense.

aamcguy
07-06-2012, 05:50 PM
I was a Hansbrough defender in the season. But it is the offseason and there are at least 6 or 7 guys available out there who are better than him right now, and some still have room to improve as well.

Honestly, he is a consitent midrange jumper away from being an impactful bench player. As it is, he is wildly inconsistent and just had a season long slump. When you have to pay salary + team assets (like a trade midseason), I don't think marginal upgrades are worth it when the player is capable of it. But I think signing a better new player to let the old go a season later is fine as well.

31andonly
07-06-2012, 05:55 PM
Where are all the Tyler defenders? I was never one of them but it seems they have all disappeared from this forum.

I'm one of them and I'm still defending him...just too busy with my job at the moment to post more frequently here ;)

No, seriously, he's had his problems but I still think he's one of the better backup PFs in the league and we would regret it if we traded him some day.
I like his energy, hustle, mid-range shot and his ability to draw fouls.

IMO letting him go would only make sense if we ship him along with DC for a good PG. On the other side that would probably make Plumlee, Pendergraph or Amundson or whoever fill his role. Meh...

I'd hate to see him go..

Justin Tyme
07-06-2012, 06:05 PM
At least Tyler has shown us SOMETHING in the past. Sure, he had a terrible season, but he has shown glimpses.

What I don't understand about this forum is that some people are sky high on Lance, but are willing to give up on Tyler. IMO it makes no sense.


Not me! I feel the same about both and ...............the Bird Boys need a new nest ASAP.

Young
07-06-2012, 06:06 PM
I think Tyler is one of the most frustrating players on the Pacers.

Given all his limitations he still has something that I think we all admire and love to see in players...his motor. The guy goes all out on every play. I have never watched Tyler play and questioned his desire or toughness. You may not classify this as a skill but it is a desirable trait in any athlete in any sport. This is what got Tyler to the NBA and this is what will keep him in the NBA at the very least as a 12-15 man.

That style of play is also what makes Tyler so frustrating. I think he is the type of player who has trouble playing a small part in a team. If he is to stick in the NBA as a regular rotation player he needs to become more efficient without losing the aggressiveness. As others have said he needs to develop a consistent mid-range jump shot. He also needs to find away to finish in traffic. He is usually one of the smaller big men on the court and he has to be able to finish among the others in the paint. In addition to those things he needs to play within the offense. He is no long the best player on the court like he was in college. He has to accept a lesser role.

I understand the desire to trade Tyler but we should also be realistic. People want him traded because he hasn't shown much. However since he hasn't shown much why would any other team offer anything of value for Tyler? They won't. Also, I believe most would agree that Tyler has the ability to become a quality player off the bench. This will depend on Tyler improving his mid-range jump shot in addition to playing within the team. We should also remember that Tyler is still on his rookie contract so it is not like he the Pacers are using a lot of salary cap space on him. When considering those things I would elect to keep Tyler.

Pacergeek
07-06-2012, 06:19 PM
I was too once a supporter, but I have since turned on him. He just needs to lose that whole "scorer" mentality. He had the green light to shoot this year, was supposed to be instant offense off the bench, but failed miserably in his role. Seems like the offense would slow down whenever Tyler touched the ball. The end result was all too often a turnover, or a missed jump shot. He could be good if he stopped caring about scoring. Needs to learn there are numerous other ways to impact a basketball game besides scoring

Jon Theodore
07-06-2012, 06:22 PM
I've been a Tyler supporter and I would love nothing more than for him to have a successful career. Tyler needs 25+ minutes a game to be successful and he just can't consistently get those minutes on this team...or any other "winning" team.

PR07
07-06-2012, 06:54 PM
I just feel like we'd be selling low on him, which is always a mistake.

greengirl33
07-06-2012, 07:50 PM
Always wanted to ask this about Hansbrough. I don't watch college basketball so I was wondering if he had these ear infection-vertigo-headache issues before he got into the pros. My dad has suffered from vertigo for over 20yrs at this point and has had his share of good and bad days. I could not imagine dad even attempting to be as physical as a sports player, never mind the professional level.

I could be very wrong and appologies if this was discussed before but I just can't help thinking there is more of an issue there besides Tyler's game didn't transfer from college to pro.

xIndyFan
07-06-2012, 08:32 PM
Let me defend tyler, sorta.

It seems that the league has figured him out. That much seems obvious. But he still has a chance to make the needed adjustments. During preseason, he did some things with his left hand. Like Paul George's post game, I didn't see much of it during the season. That would be a good place to start. Both with the dribble and shooting inside. I think guys are camping on his right hand inside. and some kind of counter move inside. Thought he looked better seeing the game this year. Especially in the playoffs. Don't know if he had more assists or not, but he seemed to be more aware of the rest of the players. Any improvement there would be a plus.

Tyler's got some work to do, but none of the things he needs to work on are things that can't be done.

He's always going to be undersized, so defense inside is going to be a problem. kinda like DC, guys are always going to be able to shoot over him, it seems.

His game is fixable. That's what summer is for, I hope.

3rdStrike
07-06-2012, 10:26 PM
What I don't understand about this forum is that some people are sky high on Lance, but are willing to give up on Tyler. IMO it makes no sense.

Really? :laugh: Okay.

1. Tyler Hansbrough is 26 years old already. Lance Stephenson is five years younger.
2. Tyler Hansbrough has had ample opportunity to prove himself. Lance Stephenson hasn't (yet).
3. Tyler Hansbrough is undersized, all the time. Lance Stephenson is not.
4. Tyler Hansbrough has no strengths that have translated (or look like they will ever translate) well to the NBA. Lance Stephenson is by default the best playmaker on the team (for the little it's worth, it means he does something better than everyone else), and could fill a colossal need as a slasher.

Hansbrough has proven he's a huge liability on both sides of the ball, and we just don't know what Stephenson is yet because we haven't seen enough. Dunno what part is confusing you.

eldubious
07-06-2012, 11:00 PM
He is and will always be better than Plumlee, whom I've already gave up on.

joew8302
07-06-2012, 11:00 PM
Really? :laugh: Okay.

1. Tyler Hansbrough is 26 years old already. Lance Stephenson is five years younger.
2. Tyler Hansbrough has had ample opportunity to prove himself. Lance Stephenson hasn't (yet).
3. Tyler Hansbrough is undersized, all the time. Lance Stephenson is not.
4. Tyler Hansbrough has no strengths that have translated (or look like they will ever translate) well to the NBA. Lance Stephenson is by default the best playmaker on the team (for the little it's worth, it means he does something better than everyone else), and could fill a colossal need as a slasher.

Hansbrough has proven he's a huge liability on both sides of the ball, and we just don't know what Stephenson is yet because we haven't seen enough. Dunno what part is confusing you.

I am not following you whatsoever. Stevenson is the best playmaker on the team, plays a position of need and gets virtually no significant minutes? Something isn't adding up.....

If Lance is this talented why is he not seeing the floor? It is not like Kobe Bryant, Chris Paul and Russell Westbrook are playing in front of him.

Pacersalltheway10
07-07-2012, 12:51 AM
Tyler had been pounded every game with no calls. The refs adjusted to him. He played the same game he did in the season before last year but the league adjusted to him. That's why he said he was working on other areas of his game.

MiaDragon
07-07-2012, 12:55 AM
He is and will always be better than Plumlee, whom I've already gave up on.

LMAO you and me both brother.

mildlysane
07-07-2012, 01:05 AM
Tyler had been pounded every game with no calls. The refs adjusted to him. He played the same game he did in the season before last year but the league adjusted to him. That's why he said he was working on other areas of his game.

I hope so. If he would just learn a few moves in the post, he would be tons better. Maybe he should go and try and work out with Tim Duncan in the off season like Roy did.

WhoLovesYaBaby?
07-07-2012, 01:11 AM
********. That was the only thing he did all year that I liked.
It was old school ball that isn't allowed any longer. I didn't care that he fouled Wade, I cared that he affected the team.

Cactus Jax
07-07-2012, 01:17 AM
There's no point in shopping Hans alone, he'd probably get a 2nd round pick atm. Maybe a late 1st round pick from the Heat or Thunder or something. He's got virtually no trade value.

WhoLovesYaBaby?
07-07-2012, 01:19 AM
Really? :laugh: Okay.

1. Tyler Hansbrough is 26 years old already. Lance Stephenson is five years younger.
2. Tyler Hansbrough has had ample opportunity to prove himself. Lance Stephenson hasn't (yet).
3. Tyler Hansbrough is undersized, all the time. Lance Stephenson is not.
4. Tyler Hansbrough has no strengths that have translated (or look like they will ever translate) well to the NBA. Lance Stephenson is by default the best playmaker on the team (for the little it's worth, it means he does something better than everyone else), and could fill a colossal need as a slasher.

Hansbrough has proven he's a huge liability on both sides of the ball, and we just don't know what Stephenson is yet because we haven't seen enough. Dunno what part is confusing you.
Hoss, if he was as good as you fantasize; he would be playing.

He's immature and he is clueless on the court most of the time. With the drafting of Johnson, he may also be out of a job.

WhoLovesYaBaby?
07-07-2012, 01:21 AM
There's no point in shopping Hans alone, he'd probably get a 2nd round pick atm. Maybe a late 1st round pick from the Heat or Thunder or something. He's got virtually no trade value.

No, not a lot. I would have to agree. His field goal percentage alone would scare off most teams. I would have taken a low 1st or high 2nd round pick in this years draft for him. Mainly because he is coming up for a contract and will want more than he is worth, so would be lost to the team anyway.

stew
07-07-2012, 02:15 AM
The last great game I saw from Tyler was the 2nd preseason game vs. CHI... It was also the last game before David joined us... I always wondered why
he shrank so much when we got West...

I believe his numbers are down this year because he no longer play with the 1st unit. Tyler cannot really cannot create his own shot and playing with the 2nd unit reduces his open looks ...

cdash
07-07-2012, 02:16 AM
I believe his numbers are down this year because he no longer play with the 1st unit. Tyler cannot really cannot create his own shot and playing with the 2nd unit reduces his open looks ...

Not sure I buy this. He has always created his own shot--even in college. When I say "created his own shot," I mean getting to the free throw line. That is his game. First or second unit has little to do with it imo.

3rdStrike
07-07-2012, 10:57 AM
Hoss, if he was as good as you fantasize; he would be playing.

He's immature and he is clueless on the court most of the time. With the drafting of Johnson, he may also be out of a job.

Hoss? Explain, please.

Two people quoted my post in its entirety and didn't read it at all, instead pretending something else was written, something glowingly positive about Lance Stephenson. At least now I know why the guy on page 1 was confused, must be something going around.

To help you out here, I never said Lance Stephenson was good or "as good." You quoted me, look at what you quoted. I simply said that we do not know what he is yet.

I gave him faint praise and I not only qualified but tempered that twice, by immediately saying "by default" and "for the little it's worth." If you want to argue the point I made then let's do it. Show me a better playmaker on the team (if you say DC it'll be a short exchange) last year. It doesn't mean Lance is good, so much as it means the team was that bad when it comes to playmaking (see the Heat series). That's what phrases like "by default" and "for the little it's worth" suggest. Not great, not good, not the best in the world.

speakout4
07-07-2012, 11:21 AM
If we had coaches that were any good they would teach Tyler how to max out his skills. The fact that he still plays his college game and regressed says something about how we prepare players. Tyler needs some intensive coaching then we can see if he can adjust his game. Perhaps it won't help but we can't give up on him just yet.

pwee31
07-07-2012, 11:29 AM
I've always been a fan of Hansbrough. I think a lot of teams need a guy with his type of energy. I think last year he played a little to quickly and out of control though. He didn't get foul calls that he usually gets, and due to rushing, his mid range shot was not as consistent. I stillmthink he can be a good player. Just has to play his game, work on a few moves, and his left hand. Plus the team has to put him in good positions to be successful, and not just pick and roll. Post him up whennhe has mismatches, etc..

15th parallel
07-07-2012, 12:53 PM
I think he just played out of his comfort zone. You see him pass more, take more outside shots, and does not get plays inside. Plus getting hacked so hard without much of foul calls he's getting.

It's more of a design by the coaching staff to have him play that way apparently. Probably they're worried about his condition of getting physically harmed when he played the way he was laying 2 seasons ago. Too much pick and pop while most of his points before came from being a chaotic bruiser inside the paint. And I think because lots of people complain about him being a black hole so he's passing more and being less aggressive offensively.

And to be fair to him, as a bench player he's I think the second best in the team in terms of FTAs and have a very solid FT% (correct me if I'm wrong). In that respect he's still a valuable guy. I still give him chance to improve given that most of his offseason have been unfortunate so far (shin injury, vertigo, lockout).

A-Train
07-07-2012, 01:26 PM
Good lord, enough talk about Tyler's "motor" and "energy". Seriously? Like guys who try hard are rare in the NBA?

You don't get to the NBA, for the most part, unless you "try hard". Great, Tyler tries hard. That attribute, on its own, may get you by at the college level, but the next level demands effort AND skill.

Oh, and I love how his lack of production is due to coaching. Okay.

I think we've seen Tyler's level of skill, and it doesn't translate to the pro game.

Rogco
07-07-2012, 02:08 PM
I still think Tyler's ok, but have been surprised by just how un-athletic he looks when jumping. It's amazing to me how often he gets blocked or the ball gets stripped while he's going up. I always think he's been fouled, then I see the replay and it is most often clean.

He also seems kind of short.

speakout4
07-07-2012, 02:12 PM
Good lord, enough talk about Tyler's "motor" and "energy". Seriously? Like guys who try hard are rare in the NBA?

You don't get to the NBA, for the most part, unless you "try hard". Great, Tyler tries hard. That attribute, on its own, may get you by at the college level, but the next level demands effort AND skill.

Oh, and I love how his lack of production is due to coaching. Okay.

I think we've seen Tyler's level of skill, and it doesn't translate to the pro game.
yep Tyler has no NBA skills, shouldn't even have been drafted, never showed anything at this level that anyone would interpret as ability, and has fooled everyone who thinks he could have been a pro. i get it. Get rid of this imposter as soon as possible.

A-Train
07-07-2012, 02:24 PM
yep Tyler has no NBA skills, shouldn't even have been drafted, never showed anything at this level that anyone would interpret as ability, and has fooled everyone who thinks he could have been a pro. i get it. Get rid of this imposter as soon as possible.

He won't be the first bust at the pro level. No shame in that.

Oh, and he shouldn't have been drafted as high as he was, just like Plumlee shouldn't have been drafted as high as he was.

OlBlu
07-07-2012, 02:31 PM
Where are all the Tyler defenders? I was never one of them but it seems they have all disappeared from this forum.

I have seen him do some very good things and some not very good things. I think playing on this second unit was difficult for him. I think he will rebound from last year and be better this year with a little better second unit. He has no trade value so we might as well see if he can improve a bit........:cool:

A-Train
07-07-2012, 02:37 PM
Here's the thing to think about with Tyler.... When push comes to shove in the ECF, or the Finals, can he step up and contribute?

Eleazar
07-07-2012, 03:09 PM
Good lord, enough talk about Tyler's "motor" and "energy". Seriously? Like guys who try hard are rare in the NBA?

You don't get to the NBA, for the most part, unless you "try hard". Great, Tyler tries hard. That attribute, on its own, may get you by at the college level, but the next level demands effort AND skill.

Oh, and I love how his lack of production is due to coaching. Okay.

I think we've seen Tyler's level of skill, and it doesn't translate to the pro game.

If that was actually true people wouldn't have loved Foster so much. Yes, it isn't an uncommon trait, but it isn't an ubiquitous trait either. It isn't so much about what players do before they get to the NBA, as what they do once they are here. Did it look like Wade was trying hard in games 3 and 4? JO when he wouldn't practice, was he trying hard? Players who play at 100% for as long as they possibly can are not common. With the exceptions of Jones and Hansbrough you would be hard press to find a Pacer who received a decent amount of playing time, and played 100% all of the time. Every team has a few, but most players don't play as hard as they can all of the time.

Hicks
07-07-2012, 03:29 PM
Here's the thing to think about with Tyler.... When push comes to shove in the ECF, or the Finals, can he step up and contribute?

Unless he masters his mid range shot... no.

If he does, the door is still open. He actually has a decent first step, but that doesn't matter when the defense is giving him 2 or 3 steps as they sag off.

A-Train
07-07-2012, 04:01 PM
Unless he masters his mid range shot... no.

If he does, the door is still open. He actually has a decent first step, but that doesn't matter when the defense is giving him 2 or 3 steps as they sag off.

Just a midrange shot? With his current level of rebounding? That will be enough to justify his role as the back up PF on this team? On a championship level team?

If it's not clear yet, I think Tyler is being given too much leeway. I think we need to look at what he brings with a fresh perspective.

mrknowname
07-07-2012, 04:21 PM
if he could play against boozer every game, he'd be a perennial all star

OlBlu
07-07-2012, 04:23 PM
if he could play against boozer every game, he'd be a perennial all star

Wouldn't everybody? :cool:

Heisenberg
07-07-2012, 04:32 PM
There's a large difference in Hansbrough's and Foster's balls-out-edness. Foster did it in a controlled manner understanding his limitations as a players while maximizing his few true gifts. Hansbrough just runs around like a retarded chicken with his head cut off playing the exact same way he has since he was 16 years old.

speakout4
07-07-2012, 05:24 PM
There's a large difference in Hansbrough's and Foster's balls-out-edness. Foster did it in a controlled manner understanding his limitations as a players while maximizing his few true gifts. Hansbrough just runs around like a retarded chicken with his head cut off playing the exact same way he has since he was 16 years old.

That's why he needs serious coaching soon.

A-Train
07-07-2012, 05:28 PM
That's why he needs serious coaching soon.

If only he had spent four years at a major college program, learning under an elite college coach, before entering the NBA...

vnzla81
07-07-2012, 05:29 PM
There's a large difference in Hansbrough's and Foster's balls-out-edness. Foster did it in a controlled manner understanding his limitations as a players while maximizing his few true gifts. Hansbrough just runs around like a retarded chicken with his head cut off playing the exact same way he has since he was 16 years old.

"Retarded chicken with his head cut off" that makes non sense :laugh:

mildlysane
07-07-2012, 05:59 PM
Yeah he hustles....but just for hustle's sake. If he doesn't produce while "hustling", then does it really matter that he is hustling? I, too, think a consistent mid-range shot would help him tremendously, but I think he needs some post moves. If he has a defender on his back, he should have several moves to choose from to get to the basket. All he does is bumrush the paint and flicks the ball over his shoulder. As a defender, that isn't hard to figure out. As it stands, his game is predicated on how the refs are calling the game....period. If he had some moves, he would take the refs out of the equation. He really needs a bigman coach. Or maybe go the other direction and focus all that hustle on banging the boards and defense, ala DRodman. Heck, if he could learn to read the D better and learn to pass, then he would be alot better. Maybe he will improve and we will all eat some crow someday.

A-Train
07-07-2012, 06:04 PM
4.4 rebounds per game last year. This from a guy whose biggest attribute is his "hustle", "energy"?

Sorry, I'm not buying it.

He should be doing one thing and one thing only when he comes into a game.... Grab every single rebound.

Jon Theodore
07-07-2012, 06:11 PM
My father and I were discussing Hansbrough today and he told me when Tyler was drafted he was shocked about being drafted so high and made a comment along the lines of "I'm laughing all the way to the bank, i'll play a few years in the NBA (play out his rookie contract) and then probably play overseas." My dad seems to think even Tyler doesn't believe he can be a consistent NBA player. I don't believe this (Tyler admitting such) is true, can anyone else remember reading an article like that? I don't believe it...hoping someone can clarify.

A-Train
07-07-2012, 06:14 PM
My father and I were discussing Hansbrough today and he told me when Tyler was drafted he was shocked about being drafted so high and made a comment along the lines of "I'm laughing all the way to the bank, i'll play a few years in the NBA (play out his rookie contract) and then probably play overseas." My dad seems to think even Tyler doesn't believe he can be a consistent NBA player. I don't believe this (Tyler admitting such) is true, can anyone else remember reading an article like that? I don't believe it...hoping someone can clarify.

Your father, and Miles Plumlee's father, are probably in agreement on this issue.

Eleazar
07-07-2012, 06:24 PM
My father and I were discussing Hansbrough today and he told me when Tyler was drafted he was shocked about being drafted so high and made a comment along the lines of "I'm laughing all the way to the bank, i'll play a few years in the NBA (play out his rookie contract) and then probably play overseas." My dad seems to think even Tyler doesn't believe he can be a consistent NBA player. I don't believe this (Tyler admitting such) is true, can anyone else remember reading an article like that? I don't believe it...hoping someone can clarify.

I have a hard time believing that. I could imagine him being surprised being draft so high because his stock was so low, but not because he thought he wasn't good enough for the NBA.

A-Train
07-07-2012, 06:53 PM
I have a hard time believing that. I could imagine him being surprised being draft so high because his stock was so low, but not because he thought he wasn't good enough for the NBA.

Him being surprised by being drafted so high is the point, just like Plumlee this year. We're taking guys WAY above their market value. That's the issue here.

clownskull
07-07-2012, 06:54 PM
when i think of the negatives so far, i think of things like:

his assist rate is terrible. when he gets the ball and you can almost be certain he will not give it up and attempt a shot whether it is a good or bad one. i think nba defenses picked up on that a while ago and he hasn't figured out that they know this about him.

i have seen him this past season where he gets some pretty decent minutes out there (like 18-22 or so) and after all that, he ends up with like 1 or 2 rebs. that is just not acceptable for someone playing that spot.

when his shot isn't falling, it seems like he just sort of turns off and the rest of his game disappears.

i remember some pacer commercials that were run during the late season and playoffs where they mentioned his critics complaints- too short and unathletic and proceeded to tell us how he has proven them wrong and is a can-do, get the job done kind of guy. problem was though- this season, his criticisms looked pretty spot-on.

i doubt he has much trade value right now so we may just have to hope he can make those adjustments folks have talked about. he really needs to develop some decent post moves and not just the barrel into the lane and throw up an ugly heave and hope he gets fouled or the shot somehow falls in. there are times out there when those ugly heaves airball or clank so badly- it is kind of embarrassing to watch.

i think if he is going to have a viable career in the league he needs to make adjustments with developing some real post shots and get his mid-range game to a reliable level like west has and improve his passing or else he is going to be in trouble.

speakout4
07-07-2012, 09:31 PM
If only he had spent four years at a major college program, learning under an elite college coach, before entering the NBA...
If it ain't broke don't fix it. It wasn't broke in college.

WhoLovesYaBaby?
07-08-2012, 05:01 PM
Hoss? Explain, please.

Two people quoted my post in its entirety and didn't read it at all, instead pretending something else was written, something glowingly positive about Lance Stephenson. At least now I know why the guy on page 1 was confused, must be something going around.

To help you out here, I never said Lance Stephenson was good or "as good." You quoted me, look at what you quoted. I simply said that we do not know what he is yet.

I gave him faint praise and I not only qualified but tempered that twice, by immediately saying "by default" and "for the little it's worth." If you want to argue the point I made then let's do it. Show me a better playmaker on the team (if you say DC it'll be a short exchange) last year. It doesn't mean Lance is good, so much as it means the team was that bad when it comes to playmaking (see the Heat series). That's what phrases like "by default" and "for the little it's worth" suggest. Not great, not good, not the best in the world.

I don't want to tell you what to do, or upset you any more than you are, but you may think about making your points a wee bit more clearly.

Hoss.

WhoLovesYaBaby?
07-08-2012, 05:07 PM
Your father, and Miles Plumlee's father, are probably in agreement on this issue.

I have heard recent reports that his mother likes him.

LoneGranger33
07-09-2012, 12:05 AM
Ya'll gotta admit that his steal and "And 1" dunk against the Bulls two years ago was one of the top Pacer highlights of the decade.

Heisenberg
07-09-2012, 12:08 AM
Ya'll gotta admit that his steal and "And 1" dunk against the Bulls two years ago was one of the top Pacer highlights of the decade.
And his February in 11/12. Dude went for 20+ 7 times. Destroyed the Knicks for 29 and 30 in a home and home. Where'd that guy go?

wintermute
07-09-2012, 06:47 AM
If only he had spent four years at a major college program, learning under an elite college coach, before entering the NBA...

Hey, big men take longer, or so I've heard ;)

I'm disenchanted with Tyler H too, but what I don't understand is why people keep comparing Miles Plumlee to him. They seem like radically different players. One is an overachiever in college, the other an underachiever. One gets by with mediocre physical tools, the other has only his physical tools going for him. If you're unhappy with Tyler (which most of us are), shouldn't you be happy with Plumlee, a diametrically opposite type of player? Or do people think that since they're both big white dudes from big name NCAA programs, that automatically outweighs their differences?

Also, shouldn't there be different standards for being drafted #13 vs being drafted #26. Right?

DgR
07-09-2012, 09:13 AM
Tyler's 2nd year has been disappointing. The league has definitely figured him out and adjusted to his play. Now, the onus is on him to improve his game in order to present different challenges to the league and become a threat again.

If he's a smart guy, if he's a highly motivated guy with a good work ethic, I think he can become a good backup PF.
I think he CAN do the necessary adjustments to become effective in th NBA, it's definitely within the realm of possiblity.

The way I see it, it's completely in his hands and will be determined by his own desire to improve and how much work he will put into his game.

mildlysane
07-09-2012, 10:10 AM
Tyler's 2nd year has been disappointing. The league has definitely figured him out and adjusted to his play. Now, the onus is on him to improve his game in order to present different challenges to the league and become a threat again.

If he's a smart guy, if he's a highly motivated guy with a good work ethic, I think he can become a good backup PF.
I think he CAN do the necessary adjustments to become effective in th NBA, it's definitely within the realm of possiblity.

The way I see it, it's completely in his hands and will be determined by his own desire to improve and how much work he will put into his game.

3rd

Unclebuck
07-09-2012, 10:53 AM
I don't recall seeing any credible rumors of the Pacers trading Tyler. In fact I don't recall seeing any rumors about the Pacers trading Tyler.

I have not given up on Hansbrough at all. he still is a very important part of our smashmouth approach. Maybe he's only a 15 minute per game off the bench type player on a very good team. No crime in that. But I think he's better than that.

His physicalness and energy IMO cannot be overlooked. he's very valuable to our team and I don't expect him to be traded anytime soon.

I saw real signs of him improving his passing ability - several really nice passes in the heat series. Also he's our best big defender in stayin in front of his man in one-on-one situations. Tyler has very good lateral movement for a guy his size - much better than ahny of our other big guys.

Seemed to me he was thinking too much this past year, he never seemed comfortable, and never seemed as though he found his groove.

Unclebuck
07-09-2012, 11:03 AM
He won't be the first bust at the pro level. No shame in that.

Oh, and he shouldn't have been drafted as high as he was, just like Plumlee shouldn't have been drafted as high as he was.

This is a Tyler thread, but just to comment on Plum. can we wait until he at least plays a summer league game - brother.

On Tyler, he was the 13th pick in the first round. His production through three seasons (remember he missed most of his first season due serious injury/health problems) is pretty good for a 13th pick. Even if he stays at the level he played at this past season, he still would not IMo be a bust. He'd be about typical for a 13th pick