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Dr. Awesome
06-28-2012, 02:47 PM
Every year at the draft everyone has debates on the forum about certain players. I thought it would be fun if everyone listed 5 players they think are overrated and 5 players they think our underrated. Then we can come back down the road and see who was on the right track.

5 Overrated:
Tyler Zeller - He has a place in the NBA, I just don't think he will be as good as everyone seems to think.
John Henson - I see him as a poor mans Ed Davis. He'll block shots, but until he adds some weight he will get bullied.
Austin Rivers - I just don't see him being great at anything at the next level. At most I think he's a solid backup who can put points on the board.
Jeremy Lamb - I don't think its anything he has done wrong, I just don't see it. I don't know why.
Dion Waiters - I think he will end up being a hollow stats guy. He's going to score, but will his play make his team better? I don't know.

5 Underrated:
Kendall Marshall - Bet no one saw that coming haha. The guy makes EVERYONE on his team better. He makes offensively inept people turn into weapons.
Meyers Leonard - I love the guy. I think he's a project, but will ultimately be a lot better than Tyler Zeller.
Terrence Ross - I can't figure out why this guy isn't a top 7 pick. I love his game.
Moe Harkless - I think over the course of his career he will be a lot better than many of the people picked before him.
Jared Sullinger - This years DeJuan Blair. However, Sullinger is leagues above Blair in talent. It all comes down to health, but I'd take the chance on him.

Steagles
06-28-2012, 02:50 PM
Every year at the draft everyone has debates on the forum about certain players. I thought it would be fun if everyone listed 5 players they think are overrated and 5 players they think our underrated. Then we can come back down the road and see who was on the right track.

5 Overrated:
Tyler Zeller - He has a place in the NBA, I just don't think he will be as good as everyone seems to think.
John Henson - I see him as a poor mans Ed Davis. He'll block shots, but until he adds some weight he will get bullied.
Austin Rivers - I just don't see him being great at anything at the next level. At most I think he's a solid backup who can put points on the board.
Jeremy Lamb - I don't think its anything he has done wrong, I just don't see it. I don't know why.
Dion Waiters - I think he will end up being a hollow stats guy. He's going to score, but will his play make his team better? I don't know.

5 Underrated:
Kendall Marshall - Bet no one saw that coming haha. The guy makes EVERYONE on his team better. He makes offensively inept people turn into weapons.
Meyers Leonard - I love the guy. I think he's a project, but will ultimately be a lot better than Tyler Zeller.
Terrence Ross - I can't figure out why this guy isn't a top 7 pick. I love his game.
Moe Harkless - I think over the course of his career he will be a lot better than many of the people picked before him.
Jared Sullinger - This years DeJuan Blair. However, Sullinger is leagues above Blair in talent. It all comes down to health, but I'd take the chance on him.
That is why I am so high up on him. The Pacers NEED to get him tonight. NEED TO.

Ownagedood
06-28-2012, 03:00 PM
Every year at the draft everyone has debates on the forum about certain players. I thought it would be fun if everyone listed 5 players they think are overrated and 5 players they think our underrated. Then we can come back down the road and see who was on the right track.

5 Overrated:
Tyler Zeller - He has a place in the NBA, I just don't think he will be as good as everyone seems to think.
5 Underrated:
Kendall Marshall - Bet no one saw that coming haha. The guy makes EVERYONE on his team better. He makes offensively inept people turn into weapons.
Meyers Leonard - I love the guy. I think he's a project, but will ultimately be a lot better than Tyler Zeller.
Jared Sullinger - This years DeJuan Blair. However, Sullinger is leagues above Blair in talent. It all comes down to health, but I'd take the chance on him.

Strongly agree on these points.. Idk where so many ppl are getting their love of Tyler Zeller from.. He's a regular rotational player in the NBA. Nothing special at all about him.

Then I agree on the underrated guys as well. Leonard has a ton of potential, the only thing I question is if his work ethic is good or not. I take him way before I take Zeller though. Sullinger is very skilled, easily one of the best players in the Big Ten, the best basketball conference in america.. Injuries are the only concern.

BornReady#6
06-28-2012, 03:09 PM
5 overrated:
MKG
Harrison Barnes
Andre Drummond
Meyers Leonard
John Henson

5 underrated
Damian Lillard
PJIII
Kendall Marshall
Royce White
Terrance Jones

PacersHomer
06-28-2012, 03:15 PM
5 overrated
Tony Wroten
Thomas Robinson
Tyler Zeller
John Henson
Draymond Green

5 underrated
Kendall Marshall
Jeremy Lamb
Scott Machado
Royce White
Perry Jones

Really?
06-28-2012, 03:20 PM
Every year at the draft everyone has debates on the forum about certain players. I thought it would be fun if everyone listed 5 players they think are overrated and 5 players they think our underrated. Then we can come back down the road and see who was on the right track.

5 Overrated:
Tyler Zeller - He has a place in the NBA, I just don't think he will be as good as everyone seems to think.
John Henson - I see him as a poor mans Ed Davis. He'll block shots, but until he adds some weight he will get bullied.
Austin Rivers - I just don't see him being great at anything at the next level. At most I think he's a solid backup who can put points on the board.
Jeremy Lamb - I don't think its anything he has done wrong, I just don't see it. I don't know why.
Dion Waiters - I think he will end up being a hollow stats guy. He's going to score, but will his play make his team better? I don't know.

5 Underrated:
Kendall Marshall - Bet no one saw that coming haha. The guy makes EVERYONE on his team better. He makes offensively inept people turn into weapons.
Meyers Leonard - I love the guy. I think he's a project, but will ultimately be a lot better than Tyler Zeller.
Terrence Ross - I can't figure out why this guy isn't a top 7 pick. I love his game.
Moe Harkless - I think over the course of his career he will be a lot better than many of the people picked before him.
Jared Sullinger - This years DeJuan Blair. However, Sullinger is leagues above Blair in talent. It all comes down to health, but I'd take the chance on him.


That is why I am so high up on him. The Pacers NEED to get him tonight. NEED TO.

To both of you, which offensively inept people did he turn into weapons?

BornReady#6
06-28-2012, 03:22 PM
I agree machado is wayyyyy underrated!!

Really?
06-28-2012, 03:24 PM
Also as far as Zeller, I do not think most believe he will be a dominate player or anything like that, but he has more than a quality starter potential. He is versatile and can help at the 4 or the 5, he is really good in transition, he is a smart basketball player, he has size, and he knows how to use his abilities to be productive. He is a guy that should be a productive starter for many years down the road.

He fits what this team needs out of a big, and I think that is why most would be willing to trade up and take him, I also like him for those reasons but I would go in a different direction if I traded up.

Dr. Awesome
06-28-2012, 03:25 PM
To both of you, which offensively inept people did he turn into weapons?

John Henson for one.

Watching Harrison Barnes play with Marshall, then watching him play without Marshall is like watching two completely different players. Barnes is a talented scorer anyway, but Marshall magnifies that. Thats what the Pacers need, someone who can make the other players better, and he can do that.

In an interview a UNC player(I forgot who) said that often times Marshall will have the ball in their hands before they even knew they were open. His vision is amazing.

IndyPacer
06-28-2012, 03:28 PM
Strongly agree on these points.. Idk where so many ppl are getting their love of Tyler Zeller from.. He's a regular rotational player in the NBA. Nothing special at all about him.


I'm not the biggest fan of Zeller as a player, but I think he would be a fantastic fit on this team. He can be a regular contributor at backing up both PF and C. It's almost like getting two picks in one. He also does have a unique gift of being extremely quick for a 7-footer. If the trade for #10 happens and Lillard is not there (he won't be), I'd have to consider Zeller for what an improvement he could be over our backup situation at 4 and 5.

Jeremy
06-28-2012, 03:31 PM
The only player I think is over-rated is Anthony Davis because he is immature and I don't see him as an upcoming superstar like most people do. He can't score yet without assists except for a jump shot here or there, and he is very thin. I don't see him putting on weight either.

Really?
06-28-2012, 03:39 PM
John Henson for one.

Watching Harrison Barnes play with Marshall, then watching him play without Marshall is like watching two completely different players. Barnes is a talented scorer anyway, but Marshall magnifies that. Thats what the Pacers need, someone who can make the other players better, and he can do that.

In an interview a UNC player(I forgot who) said that often times Marshall will have the ball in their hands before they even knew they were open. His vision is amazing.

Ok,

I fill you are right on with Marshals vision, but I would not say Henson is a weapon, also I think Barnes play with Marshall on the floor and with him off may be more due to them not having a backup point. Don't get me wrong, I do feel he is a good point guard and he will have the ability to be good if put on the right team, but on most teams he will probably just be decent and I think we are one of those teams he will just be decent on.

Really?
06-28-2012, 03:42 PM
The only player I think is over-rated is Anthony Davis because he is immature and I don't see him as an upcoming superstar like most people do. He can't score yet without assists except for a jump shot here or there, and he is very thin. I don't see him putting on weight either.

He has only been playing in the post for 1 year, he is 220 now and just finishing his freshman year, he has been improving his hook shot, and he has tons of potential. You can not deny his influence on the defensive side of the ball.

All of the things you said are basically things he can work on and easily improve.

Dr. Awesome
06-28-2012, 03:45 PM
Ok,

I fill you are right on with Marshals vision, but I would not say Henson is a weapon, also I think Barnes play with Marshall on the floor and with him off may be more due to them not having a backup point. Don't get me wrong, I do feel he is a good point guard and he will have the ability to be good if put on the right team, but on most teams he will probably just be decent and I think we are one of those teams he will just be decent on.
You can go back to last year with Larry Drew(who by college standards is a decent PG) and still see the difference. It is night and day.

John Henson is not a weapon, but Marshall put him in position to be successful on offense.

Slick Pinkham
06-28-2012, 06:10 PM
to me, Drummond is going to be a waste. Athleticism is irrelevant if you do not know how to play and do not care much about learning. Others overrated: Rivers, Wroton, Leonard, Moultrie

underrated: Barnes, Harkless, Marshall, White, Jenkins

Kstat
06-28-2012, 06:32 PM
Ed Davis has 20+ lbs of muscle that Henson does not.

Also, I might lose my mind the next time I read someone say that an 18 year old kid is a doomed bust because he's immature.

He's EIGHTEEN YEARS OLD. He should have been in highschool last season, and was barely coached in his only college season because Calhoun was too busy fighting both the NCAA and his poor health.

Holy ****, that is stupid. I've never seen so many people foolishly giving up on a guy with Drummond's talent because he's an 18 year old that acts like an 18 year old.

Wow, his fundamentals are poor....unlike most kids not even a year into adulthood?

Lance George
06-28-2012, 06:43 PM
OVERRATED

Anthony Davis. I'm not saying he's not the best prospect in the draft, but I think people have overestimated both his ceiling and the likelihood of him reaching said ceiling. I don't see the scoring ability most seem to, and his slight frame makes me wonder how well his rebounding and defense will translate.

MKG. Ho-hum athleticism, and his game screams out "tweener," which is almost always a bad sign (see: Derrick Williams, Michael Beasley, etc.).

Harrison Barnes. Extremely one-dimensional. Strikes me as more of a picks 8-14 talent, rather than top-five, which is where DX has him.

Jeremy Lamb. As one-dimensional as Harrison Barnes, but with lesser scoring ability and physical gifts. To me, his upside is Nick Young territory, which isn't worth a lottery pick.

Fab Melo. Zero offensive talent, and he's a surprisingly lousy rebounder. He's big and he can block shots, whoopty-****in'-doo.


UNDERRATED

Royce White. Enormous skill-level, adequate size and athleticism, and he comes across both intelligent and mature in interviews. He also upped his game against top-tier competition.

Tony Wroten. Probably one of the top-five or so players in the draft in terms of star potential. Size, skills, and tons of untapped potential.

Quincy Miller. 6'10" and productive across the board. He's got everything most lottery picks have, yet is being ranked in the late 1st to early 2nd.

Scott Machado. Not the most physically impressive guy in the world (short and chubby [NBA standards]), but it's hard to ignore a guy who put up 14/10/5, shot great percentages, all while leading a group of nobodies to the NCAA Tournament (albeit the play-in round) Currently being projected as a late second-round pick, I'd love to see his make a move to land him. He'd be fun to watch in the upcoming summer leagues.

Tyshawn Taylor. Big enough to play shooting guard (6'4", 177 lb.), and skilled enough to play the point. He should find a home in the NBA, even if it's as a scorer off the bench.

Kstat
06-28-2012, 06:44 PM
Royce White might actually be the worst player picked in the entire first round. His game translates horribly to the NBA, and he isn't exactly a hard worker.

Lance George
06-28-2012, 06:59 PM
Ed Davis has 20+ lbs of muscle that Henson does not.

DraftExpress: Pre Draft Measurements (http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/?page=&year=All&source=NBA+Draft+Combine&sort2=ASC&draft=0&pos=4&sort=4)

Coming into the league...

Davis: 227, 10.0% body-fat
Henson: 216, 8.6% body-fat

I'm not sure where you learned to count, but that's an 11-pound differential, not "20+," and Davis measured slightly fatter than Henson, so those 11 pounds aren't even all muscle. In terms of muscle-mass coming into the league, there's about a seven-pound differential. I highly, highly doubt seven pounds of muscle is the difference between the making and breaking of an NBA career.

Kstat
06-28-2012, 07:06 PM
Is Ed Davis in this draft? Who cares what his combine weight was 2 years ago?

Not only does he have 15-20 lbs in Henson, but he has more muscle packed on to his frame, hence the difference.

If Henson ever gets to 235 lbs, he'll be an all star. My problem is his lack of muscle, not his game.

Lance George
06-28-2012, 07:13 PM
Is Ed Davis un this draft? Who cares what his combine weight was 2 years ago?

Nit inky does he have 15-20 lbs in Henson, but he has more muscle packed on to his frame, hence the difference.

Is there any evidence Davis has actually put on all this muscle mass or is it all talk? Furthermore, even if it's true, it's not fair to judge Henson's weight coming into the league vs. Davis' weight after a year of NBA weight training. If Davis can (assuming he did) put on muscle, there's no reason to believe Henson can't, too.

Kstat
06-28-2012, 07:18 PM
...because Ed Davis and John Henson are only a year apart?

Davis is sitting around 235 right now, and he wasn't a featherweight to begin with. At least not on henson's level.

Lance George
06-28-2012, 07:22 PM
...because Ed Davis and John Henson are the same age?

Davis (6.5.89) is a year-and-a-half older than Henson (12.28.90).

Kstat
06-28-2012, 07:25 PM
Yeah, I erred there. There's a good year between them.

Still, Ed Davis was at no point a stick figure. Undersized yes, but not anorexic.