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Derek2k3
06-27-2012, 10:32 AM
No surprise here. Picked up his $2.9M option, per ESPN Insider



Dahntay Jones owns a $2.9 million player option for next season and Tuesday he exercised it.

"He had a great time the last year," agent Mark Bartelstein told Chris Tomasson of Fox Sports Florida. "We'll see what the future holds. He's excited."

Now that Jones is under contract for next season, he can now be traded before July 1. The Pacers can also use the amnesty provision on him if the teams wants to increase their 2012-13 cap room.

Should the Pacers keep him, Jones will provide depth at shooting guard and small forward.

-- Nick Borges

Interesting, the Pacers get to use the amnesty twice :rolleyes:

Sparhawk
06-27-2012, 10:44 AM
Jone's salary isn't that much and he's a skilled defender to have off the bench. Yeah, he has his problems, but I don't have any issues with Jones. Or trade him with DC or Hans.

Brad8888
06-27-2012, 10:45 AM
At least this allows the Pacers the most flexibility possible prior to the draft. Some team might take a chance on him for a higher first round pick in the late teens.

JB24
06-27-2012, 10:57 AM
At least this allows the Pacers the most flexibility possible prior to the draft. Some team might take a chance on him for a higher first round pick in the late teens.

Ask yourself, would you honestly trade the 18th or 19th pick in the draft for a 31 year old Dahntay Jones?

clownskull
06-27-2012, 11:29 AM
Jone's salary isn't that much and he's a skilled defender to have off the bench. Yeah, he has his problems, but I don't have any issues with Jones. Or trade him with DC or Hans.

yeah, he really isn't getting paid much so using amnesty would be a waste. it wasn't wasted on posey though. posey was a waste of a player and ditching him via amnesty was pretty sweet.

Brad8888
06-27-2012, 12:29 PM
Ask yourself, would you honestly trade the 18th or 19th pick in the draft for a 31 year old Dahntay Jones?

I wouldn't, personally. I thought there was something significantly wrong with him as a player or Denver would never have simply let him go and thought his contract was outrageous.

With that said, he is starting to become more valuable as a trading asset because his contract is nearing its end. When he gets hot, he can score, and there is a perception that he can defend (though he actually is not very good at that IMO because of his grabbing, etc. that the officials key in on every time he is on the floor).

ksuttonjr76
06-27-2012, 01:19 PM
No complaints. Personally, I like Jones as a player, and he always seem willing to accept whatever role he's given on the team. I just hate when his teammates puts him in a situation where he feels that he has to be the #1 option on the second unit.

Otherwise, I'm all for this.

Peck
06-27-2012, 01:25 PM
I like Dahntay Jones for what he is. I never considered this a bad free agent signing.

Derek2k3
06-27-2012, 01:54 PM
I wouldn't, personally. I thought there was something significantly wrong with him as a player or Denver would never have simply let him go and thought his contract was outrageous.

With that said, he is starting to become more valuable as a trading asset because his contract is nearing its end. When he gets hot, he can score, and there is a perception that he can defend (though he actually is not very good at that IMO because of his grabbing, etc. that the officials key in on every time he is on the floor).

That perception has been confirmed over and over, a great example of which was against the Knicks when Melo was going off...Dahntay came in and shut him down. It was beautiful.

I like Dahntay's attitude, energy, willingness to get dirty, etc.

If he sticks around, I'm happy.

Regarding the amnesty, the Pacers can't use it again. That was my point, they used it on Posey already.

Steagles
06-27-2012, 02:09 PM
No surprise. Hopefully he acts more professionally off the court (to fans) but not abad $2 million spent.


Sent from #PacerNation using Tapatalk

Indyfan505
06-27-2012, 03:02 PM
he played solid last year 2 million isnt much for a decent bench player

Eleazar
06-27-2012, 04:48 PM
The strange thing about Jones is he has become a much better player since coming here than you would have expected from a player his age. Usually by that time the player is who he is, he might become smarter but his skills stay about the same. Jones on the other hand has steadily improved many aspects of his game to go along with becoming a smarter player. He still has huge flaws, especially on the offensive end, but I feel like he has improved a lot on that end for his age.

Jeremy
06-27-2012, 04:53 PM
Ugh, he should have just left and went to a title contender.. Too bad money talks.

Day-V
06-27-2012, 10:07 PM
El Pacero must be thrilled.

Anthem
06-27-2012, 10:12 PM
Glad to have him back.

ECKrueger
06-27-2012, 11:54 PM
I personally love Dahntay. He is a good teammate, and he's worked on his game a lot too. I think he is at least a minor reason Lance hasn't gotten in trouble. Plus, he has really worked on the 3 ball and not taking as many bad shots I think. Just seems to me he knows he is a good cheerleader/role player, and has embraced that.

pizza guy
06-28-2012, 12:01 AM
Good. I like Dahntay quite a bit. This last season was a good one for him. He really embraced his role, his teammates, and the fans here - not to mention the momentum the team built was expressed through Inferno's celebrating on the bench. He's a fun guy to have around and seems to fit in perfectly here.

PR07
06-28-2012, 12:26 AM
He's a useful player to have on your bench, and he seems like a good teammate overall with his overall energy and toughness. His defense on Wade and Rose the past two playoffs has been pretty impressive.

ChicagoJ
06-28-2012, 12:50 AM
Hey, who would turn down the opportunity to be the highe$t paid 12th man in the league? Dhantay can be a turnover-prone ball hog who$e one defen$ive $kill - battery - ha$ become a "foul" again, but he'$ not $tupid. Nobody else hA$ thought of giving him a guaranteed, multi-year contract, he'$ not giving that up.

3rdStrike
06-28-2012, 12:58 AM
Ask yourself, would you honestly trade the 18th or 19th pick in the draft for a 31 year old Dahntay Jones?

Wasn't Shane Battier traded for the #8 pick? Yep, Rudy Gay. I thought that was terrible at the time (and worse now), but there were no objections from the experts.

CJ Jones
06-28-2012, 01:06 AM
That perception has been confirmed over and over, a great example of which was against the Knicks when Melo was going off...Dahntay came in and shut him down. It was beautiful.

I like Dahntay's attitude, energy, willingness to get dirty, etc.


While I really like Dahntay on the team, and I have no problem with his contract... I agree with Brad on his D. He's nowhere near the defensive stopper he once was. Still capable though. One thing that does bug me is the chair pull he's been doing seemingly once a game the last year or two. I think it's worked maybe twice that I can remember (the one on Wade was epic though).

IMO we only have a couple tough minded guys on our roster, and he's one of them. That, along with his constant support from the bench and the mentoring he does for our young players makes me glad he'll be with us for another year and hopefully longer.

edit: his offense was surprisingly good this year too (decision making, 3 point shooting impressed me)

jeffg-body
06-28-2012, 01:10 AM
I like Dahntay myself on our team. We could do a lot worse. He knows his role on this team and seems to be a good teammate.

CJ Jones
06-28-2012, 01:12 AM
Hey, who would turn down the opportunity to be the highe$t paid 12th man in the league? Dhantay can be a turnover-prone ball hog who$e one defen$ive $kill - battery - ha$ become a "foul" again, but he'$ not $tupid. Nobody else hA$ thought of giving him a guaranteed, multi-year contract, he'$ not giving that up.

Is 2.9 mil really that over paid? He was a starter for a playoff team when we signed him.

Heisenberg
06-28-2012, 03:06 AM
I'd rather have the extra ~3 mil, but whatever. Dahntay reigned himself in in the handful of spot minutes he got and did his job. There were plenty of times I was screaming play Inferno instead of Barbosa. Keep that up, coupled with being an ultimate towel waver teammate, keep Lance's ego in check type dude, whatever. Bigger fish to fry. Dahntay's TJ Ford with 5% of the expectations but 100% of the "teammateness." From what I can tell anyway, from all my time in the locker room.

Remember him pulling the chair on Wade in I think game 4? Hell, that was worth it alone, ain't my money.

Cactus Jax
06-28-2012, 03:18 AM
I may not have liked T.J. Ford's style of play, (and a lot of that may have to do with JOB) but the dude was a class act all the way past his time with the Pacers.

As far as Inferno, I would love the extra 3 million to insure Hibbert/Hill, and spend minimum on a reserve, but gotta deal with the cards dealt.

Pacerized
06-28-2012, 08:31 AM
I'd rather have the cap space then Jones. I don't know what he'd net but I'd take a late 2 cd. round pick for him. If we really had to I'd throw in the 2cd to move him but only if we already had a deal where we needed the cap space.

Ace E.Anderson
06-28-2012, 09:39 AM
If we had more offensive firepower within the second unit, D.Jones would be the perfect compliment. Above Average defender, good in transition, and has become a good corner 3-pt shooter. I just think his skills do not completely mesh well with our style of play.

If he were on a team like OKC for example, I think his talents would be maximized.

Overall however, you can do a lot worse. Plus you can't overlook the energy and companionship he seems to bring to our bench.

Justin Tyme
06-28-2012, 09:40 AM
People talk about they'd rather save Dahntay's salary, well the samething can be said about Stephenson.

Well, I guess Bird can watch his "pet project" play summer league next month. LOL!

Cubs231721
06-28-2012, 09:54 AM
People talk about they'd rather save Dahntay's salary, well the samething can be said about Stephenson.

Well, I guess Bird can watch his "pet project" play summer league next month. LOL!

A big difference in degrees on that. The Pacers gain less than 400,000 by cutting Lance, and that's only if they replace him with a rookie making the minimum. A player with 1 year experience making the minimum would save the Pacers a little more than 100,000. With Dahntay, they could save about 2.4 million if they replaced him with a rookie making the minimum. That would have changed their available cap room much more than cutting Lance ever would.

BringJackBack
06-28-2012, 09:55 AM
I think that Dahntay's had a nice four years here. Came here and started for a while and being the third guy behind Granger and Hibbert during our struggling years, couldn't get any minutes for JOB the next year but had a big 12 points in our playoff win that season, and this year he came in and knew his role and did the very best with it while developing an outside shot. Plus his defense on Wade.

He's just came in and has witnessed the culture change, and has been a part of it too. I have no problem with him excercising his option, and if he wants to re-sign with us I'd be okay with that too if he wants to be our fourth/fifth wing.

Justin Tyme
06-28-2012, 10:41 AM
A big difference in degrees on that. The Pacers gain less than 400,000 by cutting Lance, and that's only if they replace him with a rookie making the minimum. A player with 1 year experience making the minimum would save the Pacers a little more than 100,000. With Dahntay, they could save about 2.4 million if they replaced him with a rookie making the minimum. That would have changed their available cap room much more than cutting Lance ever would.


Stephenson's salary for 12-13 is $870,000 and $930,000 for season 13-14 totaling 1,800,000 mil. Both years are unguaranteed. If Stephenson is not waived on or b4 7/15/2012 his salary becomes guaranteed. Overall cutting Stephenson now can save the Pacers 1,800,000 vs 2.9 mil of Dahntay.

Dahntay has produced more in a couple dozen games or less last year than Stephenson has in "2 years!" Dahntay is more than worth the million dollar difference between their salaries.

With Bird gone, maybe the FO will see Born Ready isn't the player some feel he is, and waive him for the savings or use him for trade fodder.

Speed
06-28-2012, 01:02 PM
Wells mentioned in his Indystar chat that Dahntay and DC as being the main guys on the block tonight and during the trading period. I hadn't heard D. Jones as being shopped.

http://www.pacersdigest.com/showthread.php?73421-Mike-Wells-LIVE-CHAT-on-Indy-Star-(12-1p)

Comment From Trent
Whos on our trading block tonight for the draft?
12:36

IndyStarSports:
Dahntay and Collison. Danny's name will likely come up at some point, too
12:37

Comment From Mitchell
Do you think Dauntay Jones could be traded for second round pick? so we could draft Robbie Hummel
1:00

IndyStarSports:
I wouldn't necessarily say Hummel. But I do see Dahntay getting traded at some point. Tonight or next week
1:00

ChicagoJ
06-28-2012, 01:09 PM
What is the vet's minimum for somebody with 9 year's experience? I don't know, but $2.9 million less that amount equals the amount Jones is overpaid.

EDIT - looked it up. Last season it was $1.2 million for a 9-year vet and $1.4 million for a 10-year vet. So he's overpaid by at least $1.5 to $1.7 million, and that doesn't even factor if you could replace him with a younger 12th man that would be lower on the salary scale.


Is 2.9 mil really that over paid? He was a starter for a playoff team when we signed him.

Playing 18 minutes a game. Yes, the PA announcer introduced him before 71 games, but that vastly overstates his role on that Denver team. He was their eighth-most important player he just was a starter to fix a different chemistry problem in the starting lineup and they still had no interest in resigning him to a guaranteed, multi-year contract.

(See, I can disappear from PD for long stretches but the soapbox remains the same!! :D )

ECKrueger
06-28-2012, 01:11 PM
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/CW_TIcH9yjc" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Speed
06-28-2012, 01:18 PM
Dwade, have a seat, might be my highlight of the years. I was drawn to that like a moth to a flame, it was like the scene from JFK when they are going over the Zapruder film in court. Back and to the right, back and to the right.

Naptown_Seth
06-28-2012, 01:22 PM
I like Dahntay Jones for what he is. I never considered this a bad free agent signing.
I think it's varied based on what Sutten referred to (overshooting due to role), but this last year his role was matched perfectly to his skill. I think most of us wanted to see more of him in the playoffs in fact.

I saw him around town last week which I take to mean that he enjoys and expects to be here next season.



You mean...

Back and to the floor, back and to the floor.
They should put it on a loop with music and show it at timeouts next year.

No, seriously this should happen.

WhoLovesYaBaby?
06-28-2012, 01:25 PM
Ask yourself, would you honestly trade the 18th or 19th pick in the draft for a 31 year old Dahntay Jones?

Isn't it amazing what some overzealous fans can come up with? But in his defense, we have seen some pretty boneheaded moves by GM's (Pacer's first round Jordan pick for a long worn out Tom Owens?).

Justin Tyme
06-28-2012, 01:28 PM
Wells mentioned in his Indystar chat that Dahntay and DC as being the main guys on the block tonight and during the trading period. I hadn't heard D. Jones as being shopped.

http://www.pacersdigest.com/showthread.php?73421-Mike-Wells-LIVE-CHAT-on-Indy-Star-(12-1p)



Comment From Trent
Whos on our trading block tonight for the draft?
12:36

IndyStarSports:
Dahntay and Collison. Danny's name will likely come up at some point, too
12:37

Comment From Mitchell
Do you think Dauntay Jones could be traded for second round pick? so we could draft Robbie Hummel
1:00

IndyStarSports:
I wouldn't necessarily say Hummel. But I do see Dahntay getting traded at some point. Tonight or next week
1:00


If Dahntay could garner a 31-38 pick, that would be great. There is going to be some interesting talent to be had in that range.

PR07
06-28-2012, 01:28 PM
I'm kind of surprised we're shopping Dahntay so hard, must be purely a playing time/salary issue because I don't see how it could hurt having a guy who can come off the bench and seriously D up the likes of Rose and Wade.

WhoLovesYaBaby?
06-28-2012, 01:28 PM
Keep Jones?
Trade Jones?
Amnesty Jones? (which is real tempting if only to save $$).

I am totally uncaring what they do with him. He did provide nice 3pt shooting in the beginning of the year. But Barbosa cut his minutes later on. He's cheap so keep him. He's attractive as a trade add in, so trade him. Or do the amnesty thing. What's the diff?

Cubs231721
06-28-2012, 01:32 PM
Stephenson's salary for 12-13 is $870,000 and $930,000 for season 13-14 totaling 1,800,000 mil. Both years are unguaranteed. If Stephenson is not waived on or b4 7/15/2012 his salary becomes guaranteed. Overall cutting Stephenson now can save the Pacers 1,800,000 vs 2.9 mil of Dahntay.

Dahntay has produced more in a couple dozen games or less last year than Stephenson has in "2 years!" Dahntay is more than worth the million dollar difference between their salaries.

With Bird gone, maybe the FO will see Born Ready isn't the player some feel he is, and waive him for the savings or use him for trade fodder.

First I will admit I'm not a big fan of Stephenson. But IMO the arguments you presented have a couple of flaws.

People potentially wanted to get rid of Dahntay for cap saving because this is the year the Pacers have cap room. Having Jones exercise his option has taken away some of that cap room. Using Stephenson's salary for next year is irrelevant because unless the Pacers make a change to their roster over that time, they won't have cap room then. So the fact that Lance is getting paid 500,000 over the rookie minimum next year will not make a difference to what sorts of moves the Pacers can make. Jones not exercising his option and Lance getting cut are definitely different when looking at the cap room for this year. Jones would have saved 2.4 million off the cap, while Lance would only save 400,000.

Second, while it is important to look at past production, projecting past production automatically into the future is a tough exercise. That's especially true when the past production came from a 31 year old veteran versus a raw 20 and 21 year old player. I would agree that Jones did much more than Lance did. Will the same be true for the next couple years? That's hard to say. Jones should be declining, and Lance should be heading towards his prime (even if his prime isn't very good, which I believe it won't be, he still will likely incrementally improve). The gap between them could start closing very quickly.

And really overall the point isn't to compare the two on the basketball court. Stephenson doesn't make much sense to waive for cap space unless the Pacers feel he can't be an NBA player because he's essentially making 3rd year minimum money, and it would be hard to find too many options that would make less. Jones makes significantly more than that, so people are naturally going to look much harder at him when looking for extra cap money to use this offseason. That's why when talking about cap room, people are going to bring up Jones but not bring up Stephenson.

Justin Tyme
06-28-2012, 01:36 PM
I'm kind of surprised we're shopping Dahntay so hard, must be purely a playing time/salary issue because I don't see how it could hurt having a guy who can come off the bench and seriously D up the likes of Rose and Wade.


If the Pacers are drafting a wing, it could be a PT issue. Maybe a situation to get Stephenson more PT.

If it's a salary issue, then a trade of Dahntay will need to be with a team who can send back salary w/o the Pacers having to take back a player.

The Sleeze
06-28-2012, 01:42 PM
If the Pacers were to trade Dahntay for a 2nd rounder would they get a trade exception? If so could they turn around and use that in a S&T for Gordon?

Justin Tyme
06-28-2012, 02:01 PM
First I will admit I'm not a big fan of Stephenson. But IMO the arguments you presented have a couple of flaws.

People potentially wanted to get rid of Dahntay for cap saving because this is the year the Pacers have cap room. Having Jones exercise his option has taken away some of that cap room. Using Stephenson's salary for next year is irrelevant because unless the Pacers make a change to their roster over that time, they won't have cap room then. So the fact that Lance is getting paid 500,000 over the rookie minimum next year will not make a difference to what sorts of moves the Pacers can make. Jones not exercising his option and Lance getting cut are definitely different when looking at the cap room for this year. Jones would have saved 2.4 million off the cap, while Lance would only save 400,000.

Second, while it is important to look at past production, projecting past production automatically into the future is a tough exercise. That's especially true when the past production came from a 31 year old veteran versus a raw 20 and 21 year old player. I would agree that Jones did much more than Lance did. Will the same be true for the next couple years? That's hard to say. Jones should be declining, and Lance should be heading towards his prime (even if his prime isn't very good, which I believe it won't be, he still will likely incrementally improve). The gap between them could start closing very quickly.

And really overall the point isn't to compare the two on the basketball court. Stephenson doesn't make much sense to waive for cap space unless the Pacers feel he can't be an NBA player because he's essentially making 3rd year minimum money, and it would be hard to find too many options that would make less. Jones makes significantly more than that, so people are naturally going to look much harder at him when looking for extra cap money to use this offseason. That's why when talking about cap room, people are going to bring up Jones but not bring up Stephenson.


At some point, the salary has to match the production. 1 mil is nothing for the better production Dahntay will give you than Stephenson. You are looking at this strictly as a cap savings issue. I'm not. It only costs 1.1mil to have Dahntay for next year if Stephenson is waived. An extra mil cap space is nothing this year. It isn't going to cost the Pacers some big FA or not being able to re-sign Hibbert or Hill. I'd much rather have Dahntay's veteran leadership and etc this year than worry about an extra 1 mil cap space generated by keeping Dahntay over waiving Stephenson.

Where was your concern last year over capspace when the Pacers gave an injured Foster a 3 mil deal for 2011-12?

Cubs231721
06-28-2012, 02:51 PM
At some point, the salary has to match the production. 1 mil is nothing for the better production Dahntay will give you than Stephenson. You are looking at this strictly as a cap savings issue. I'm not. It only costs 1.1mil to have Dahntay for next year if Stephenson is waived. An extra mil cap space is nothing this year. It isn't going to cost the Pacers some big FA or not being able to re-sign Hibbert or Hill. I'd much rather have Dahntay's veteran leadership and etc this year than worry about an extra 1 mil cap space generated by keeping Dahntay over waiving Stephenson.

Where was your concern last year over capspace when the Pacers gave an injured Foster a 3 mil deal for 2011-12?

Here's an example. Let's say the Pacers want to throw a max offer at Gordon this offseason (I tend to doubt that, but we don't know for sure what the Pacers plans are). If Jones had declined his option, the Pacers would have had enough money to do so. Now, they would have to figure out some other way to clear space. Waiving Stephenson won't give them enough money either. In that case, the extra 2 million (and it is 2 million. Stephenson's salary for next year doesn't matter in trying to get space for signing a player this year) would matter quite a bit.

So it really does depend on what the Pacers plan to do with their available cap space. If they plan to just add a couple small priced bench players, then Jones coming back is very helpful as extra depth. If they want to free up money to go after a big name player, Jones's salary is a deterrent. Stephenson is irrelevant either way since both his salary and his contributions are so tiny.

As for Foster, the Pacers were almost certainly never going to spend all their cap space last year, so signing Foster was just a money thing out of the Simons pocket. The Pacers had the room during the year to take on Barbosa's big salary and still had several million left over to take on somebody else if they needed to. That's even after they gave West 10 million. That's a big difference from this year, where they have 10-11 million in space to start with.

Justin Tyme
06-28-2012, 03:19 PM
Here's an example. Let's say the Pacers want to throw a max offer at Gordon this offseason (I tend to doubt that, but we don't know for sure what the Pacers plans are). If Jones had declined his option, the Pacers would have had enough money to do so. Now, they would have to figure out some other way to clear space. Waiving Stephenson won't give them enough money either. In that case, the extra 2 million (and it is 2 million. Stephenson's salary for next year doesn't matter in trying to get space for signing a player this year) would matter quite a bit.




So it really does depend on what the Pacers plan to do with their available cap space. If they plan to just add a couple small priced bench players, then Jones coming back is very helpful as extra depth. If they want to free up money to go after a big name player, Jones's salary is a deterrent. Stephenson is irrelevant either way since both his salary and his contributions are so tiny.

As for Foster, the Pacers were almost certainly never going to spend all their cap space last year, so signing Foster was just a money thing out of the Simons pocket. The Pacers had the room during the year to take on Barbosa's big salary and still had several million left over to take on somebody else if they needed to. That's even after they gave West 10 million. That's a big difference from this year, where they have 10-11 million in space to start with.



Get back with me when Dahntay's contract is the reason the Pacers don't have enough money to sign a player.

You don't care about the 3 plus mil Foster got, b/c the Pacers didn't need it! Just a money thing out of Simon's pocket. LOL!