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View Full Version : Frank Vogel needs minor change for the system



funk31
03-17-2012, 08:54 PM
I'm almost 20 year Pacers fan from Mongolia. I've watched a lot of games this year like todays game against Knicks.

First of all Pacers looking really promising as their records shows for relatively young team.

In last couple of seasons under JOB, Pacers played a lot of 3 point shooting, running game and pick n rolls. Then this year under coach Frank Vogel, they play almost entirely post game.

I don't understand why they only plays one way extremely. Play in the post, get to the line etc 'smash mouth' basketball is great, but they needs to include some JOB style plays into.

Because of that, Pacers have no answer for great 3pt shooting teams like Miami Heat, Orlando Magic and Knicks featuring Novak&JR Smith.

Every time they enter into opponent zone, they constantly feed the ball to the post, then defenders are all set in the post. Pacers don't shoot the ball from outside then turnover.

They need some pick n roll plays and 3pt shooting for dismantle defense that will support the post play. Every team that play against Pacers know they will feed the ball to Hibbert, West or slash to the rim.

I think that is the reason why Hibbert, West, Hans are struggling. They don't have support from outside. One player can have bad timing, but for all of front court it's systematic problem.

LoneGranger33
03-17-2012, 08:56 PM
I'm impressed that you're able to keep up with the team from Mongolia.

MiaDragon
03-17-2012, 09:02 PM
Nothing minor about it, he needs to make drastic changes. Then you have another problem, his in ability to make any semblance of in game adjustments. How long did it take him, watching DC being abused by Lin " The Flooper", to put Hill on him, 6 or 7 minutes left in the 4th. Come on Frank YOU need to be the game changer.

Sandman21
03-17-2012, 09:21 PM
Frank needs to have a real training camp for one.

BlueNGold
03-17-2012, 09:53 PM
Frank needs to have a real training camp for one.

A compressed schedule to boot.

I think Frank's done a great job getting us near .600 after nearly 4 years around .400.....and while better ball movement would help us and make more open threes possible, JOb ball isn't the answer.

Yes, we need someone to move that ball to create an open three at times. But that doesn't work well with our current starting line-up. We need a pass first PG to make best use of a player like Hibbert...and West too. Also, Granger isn't the type to distribute much. He's all about launching shots.

D-BONE
03-17-2012, 09:53 PM
Brian Shaw era many not be that far off if we don't get things back on track soon.

BlueNGold
03-17-2012, 09:56 PM
Brian Shaw era many not be that far off if we don't get things back on track soon.

Frank's not going anywhere for awhile. Brian probably deserves a head coach job, but look at our record...and compare that to Jim O'Brien. Frank's going to take about 2 years to win as many games as Jim did in 3 1/2.

TheDavisBrothers
03-17-2012, 10:30 PM
Frank's not going anywhere for awhile. Brian probably deserves a head coach job, but look at our record...and compare that to Jim O'Brien. Frank's going to take about 2 years to win as many games as Jim did in 3 1/2.

The talent on this team is a lot better/ more developed then it was back then. I hate O'Brien as much as the next guy and I love Vogel's passion and personality, but I think Vogal's overrated on this board, because after having such a terrible coach for a long time, anything looks like a great improvement...

adamscb
03-17-2012, 11:43 PM
im surprised this hasnt been talked about more, but leandro barbosa will be a great addition to the perimeter, especially off the bench.

Sherlock
03-18-2012, 05:17 AM
Our starter possess below average passing ability.
Both of our wing player are below average ball handler.
Both of our bigs are slow and not strong rebounder. Hibbert are better, but the combination of these two are below average.
Out PG are small, and often defense slack, and not passing well.

Combination of these factors, a good team defense can take away our 1st and 2nd offensive choices.

When we are forced to execute the offense on-on-one, the chance of winning the game is the chance of Granger hit his perimeter shots.

BlueNGold
03-18-2012, 07:33 AM
The talent on this team is a lot better/ more developed then it was back then. I hate O'Brien as much as the next guy and I love Vogel's passion and personality, but I think Vogal's overrated on this board, because after having such a terrible coach for a long time, anything looks like a great improvement...

I would say the talent is better and more developed, but I don't think we know how good of a coach Vogel is going to be yet. Not without a preseason and any time to practice during a compressed schedule. He can clearly motivate but he has not had time to work with the guys and teach. So, while he may be an average NBA coach or even below average, I don't think that judgment can be made at this point. It's like he has to sit his class down for a test before being allowed to lecture. Not exactly fair to the teacher.

McKeyFan
03-18-2012, 07:36 AM
Welcome to the board. Keep posting.

D-BONE
03-18-2012, 08:12 AM
Talent on this roster is light years beyond anything JOB ever worked with. Hell, I'm starting to think JOB may have worked a miracle making Granger look as good as he did offensively during most of his tenure. Only area that might have been better under JOB was PG when we had Jack. Some will claim it's more or less a wash. I'd say Jack was somewhat better.

mildlysane
03-19-2012, 07:46 PM
I still think we need to work on our pick n roll offense AND defense. We are horrible in both of these areas.

Steagles
03-20-2012, 08:42 AM
The Pacers also need http://www.wheresweems.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/RondoIndiana.jpg but it won't happen. How can you keep up with the Pacers from there? Thats awesome!