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Hibbert
03-16-2012, 02:59 PM
http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/7695876/nba-early-look-top-free-agents-2012

Now that the trade deadline has passed, it's never too early to look at the next wave of player movement: 2012 free agency. Chris Paul, Derrick Rose, Kevin Love, Russell Westbrook and Dwight Howard have all been taken off the market, but there are plenty of big names -- young and old -- on the summer's list.

With apologies to Gerald Wallace, Nicolas Batum, Ray Allen, Ersan Ilyasova, Jeremy Lin and O.J. Mayo, here are the top 10 free-agent targets this summer along with their contract status.

1. Deron Williams | Age: 27 | 2011-12 PER: 21.4 | FA type: Player option
Williams

Now that Dwight Howard is off the board, all eyes will be on Williams this summer. And rightfully so. Don't sleep on this guy just because he played on a bare-bones roster this season; he's one of the top dozen or so players in the game. Yes, he's in the midst of a down year on 2-pointers, but he can still bring a stronger package than almost every point guard. Just to remind everyone how good he is, he casually scored 57 points on 29 shots the other day. He will be looking for a max offer from somebody, and he's earned it. And he's been adamant he won't pull a "Dwight" and opt in. He's hitting the market.

2. Brook Lopez | Age: 23 | PER: 22.3 | FA type: Restricted
Lopez

If you come from the school of thought that players don't become injury-prone overnight, then Brook Lopez is the guy for you. Battling a litany of foot/ankle injuries this season, Lopez has played just a handful of games during his contract season. There's little chance that the Nets don't reel Lopez back this offseason, but he'll be one of the many big names in a center-heavy crop of free agents. His rebounding struggles are a legitimate concern going forward, but few players can rival his offensive skill set at the center position. It's not the case with Williams, but as Lopez is a restricted free agent, the Nets will have the last say when it comes to his future home.

3. Ryan Anderson | Age: 23 | PER: 22.4 | FA type: Restricted
Anderson

It's unlikely that the Magic will let go one of the best young players in the game, but there's a tiny chance that someone gives Anderson an outrageous offer that even his current team won't find palatable. Anderson might not be a household name, but consider him a lesser version of Kevin Love. Anderson is the league's premier 3-point shooter and despite his habitat on the perimeter, he also boasts one of the top offensive rebounding rates in the league. It's hard to imagine the Magic letting this youngster go, but it's no secret that NBA GMs have a soft spot for stretch 4s. He won't be underpaid for long.

4. Steve Nash | Age: 38 | PER: 22.0 | FA type: Unrestricted
Nash

Can you imagine if Nash played on a contender rather than spending his time in NBA purgatory (also known as the Phoenix Suns)? The magic is still there even as he approaches 40 years young. He owns the top effective field goal percentage in the league, the top assist rate in the league and arguably the top make-everyone-around-him-better rating the game has ever seen. It's almost a crime that a talent of his caliber hasn't played with an All-Star since Amare Stoudemire in 2009-10. Nash won't play at this level forever (we think), and you can expect multiple contenders will be bidding for his services even though he's one of the oldest players in the sport.

5. Roy Hibbert | Age: 25 | PER: 18.7 | FA type: Restricted
Hibbert

Would you be interested in a 7-foot-2 center with legitimate offensive skills? Get in line. Though he may not move like Derrick Rose out there, Hibbert has made big strides from a skills standpoint as he seems hell-bent on grabbing every rebound available to him this season. He's averaged 15.3 points and 11 rebounds per 36 minutes this season while blocking his fair share of shots (eighth in block rate). He's still got some work to do defensively, but he's a willing passer and, from every indication, a great locker-room presence. As far as productive young centers go, Hibbert is one of the best of a dying breed.

6. Eric Gordon |Age: 23 | PER: 17.0 | FA type: Restricted
Gordon

Gordon's long-term value has taken a nosedive this season, but he'll still find a home on this list. Even though the Hornets have been tight-lipped on the exact nature of his latest knee injury, it's easy to forget that he's still just 23 years old and can get back on track before he hits his prime. Is he the franchise player the Hornets can build around? There were questions about that before his serious injury, and now those concerns are validated. However, he ranked as the league's top young shooting guard just a season ago and he has the talent to reclaim that status. But will his body let him?

7. Nicolas Batum | Age: 23 | PER: 17.9 | FA type: Restricted
Batum

Part of the impetus for the Portland contract purge at the deadline was to clear enough cash to comfortably build around Batum once he becomes a free agent this summer. The rare wing player who can stroke it from downtown and average a steal and a block per game, Batum is a perfect hyper-efficient complementary piece for a contender. The Blazers won't be there any time soon, but Batum is young enough to endure the rebuilding years and still develop into the lockdown defender every playoff team covets. No, he won't be a No. 1 option, but he could be a Tayshaun Prince-type player for a title team some day.

8. Kevin Garnett | Age: 35 | PER: 20.6 | FA type: Unrestricted
Garnett

Just a couple of years and a knee injury ago, it seemed like everyone was ready to stick a fork in this Hall of Famer's career. Well, reports of his demise have been greatly exaggerated. As Garnett rolls into the other side of age 35, the numbers on his stat line haven't fallen off in recent years. In fact, he's still a knockdown mid-range shooter and an above-average rebounder at his position. He's not the all-world defender he once was, but there's a reason the Celtics have been about five points better defensively with him on the floor. There's still plenty of gas left in the tank.

9. Tim Duncan | Age: 35 | PER: 21.2| FA type: Unrestricted
Duncan
It feels wrong to imagine Tim Duncan in another uniform other than San Antonio's black and silver, but that doesn't mean it can't happen. Duncan controls his destiny this upcoming summer and there will be plenty of teams angling for his services. Like Garnett, Duncan's career isn't on life support. If you think it is, consider that Pau Gasol, Josh Smith and DeMarcus Cousins still look up at Duncan in the PER rankings. He's lost a few steps defensively and he can't be counted on for 35 minutes a night anymore, but he can still be an integral part of a contender.

10. JaVale McGee | Age: 24 | PER: 19.7 | FA type: Restricted
McGee

The ultimate wild card. It will be fascinating to see how McGee responds to George Karl's guidance for the rest of the season in Denver, because few players have a higher physical ceiling than this 7-foot pogo stick. He's a block vulture of the highest degree, so he still needs some serious polishing on the defensive end. We always like to say that some players could use a change of scenery, and considering his upside and the toxic environment in Washington, McGee qualified as one of those players. Someone will gamble on his extraordinary physical tools, but his basketball IQ might always hold him back from reaching his potential.

CableKC
03-16-2012, 03:35 PM
Do we have enough cap space to offer a MAX Contract to Deron taking into consideration that Hibbert will likely have to be paid?

I can see the Knicks throw Marsh-Melo under the bus ( which would be funny ) and offer him in exchange for a S&T of DWill....but if we have an Organization that is willing to spend to get a Top Tier PG...then I'd want to AT LEAST try to make a run at DWill if it is at all possible.

I just want to know that the FO at least tried to make a run at him.

Aw Heck
03-16-2012, 03:39 PM
Do we have enough cap space to offer a MAX Contract to Deron taking into consideration that Hibbert will likely have to be paid?

I think so. The Pacers would probably just have to renounce Barbosa and Foster (he's going to retire anyway) as free agents and I would imagine that would be enough to sign Deron to the max.

Barring a very good showing from the Pacers in the playoffs, I don't see Deron signing here though. I could see the Knicks doing a S&T for him like you mentioned or he'll probably go to Dallas.

yoadknux
03-16-2012, 03:50 PM
Do we have enough cap space to offer a MAX Contract to Deron taking into consideration that Hibbert will likely have to be paid?

No, we don't. If we sign Hibbert then we could offer a $10m contract or something to Deron.
The only way of getting both Deron and Hibbert this summer is if we trade D-West or Granger.

Haywoode Workman
03-16-2012, 03:53 PM
Who I like for the pacers, in order:

1. Deron Williams
2. Steve Nash
3. Eric Gordon
4. Tim Duncan
5. Ray Allen
6. Gerald Wallace
7. Kevin Garnett
8. OJ Mayo

Obviously, I'd be absolutely ecstatic if we signed just one of those top 4 guys, and I think any combination of 2 of those guys could make us legitimate contenders. Unfortunately, I have a feeling we won't be seeing any of these guys in pacers unis.

I also have a sneaking suspicion Ryan Anderson will be that next "massively overpaid toxic contract that some unlucky team is dying to get rid of".

Haywoode Workman
03-16-2012, 03:56 PM
No, we don't. If we sign Hibbert then we could offer a $10m contract or something to Deron.
The only way of getting both Deron and Hibbert this summer is if we trade D-West or Granger.

Pretty sure we can go over the cap to sign hibbert, even if we do sign a player for the max.

Aw Heck
03-16-2012, 03:57 PM
No, we don't. If we sign Hibbert then we could offer a $10m contract or something to Deron.
The only way of getting both Deron and Hibbert this summer is if we trade D-West or Granger.
But we have Hibbert's Bird rights. So we can go over the cap to sign him.

Or did that change in the new CBA?

BringJackBack
03-16-2012, 03:59 PM
But we have Hibbert's Bird rights. So we can go over the cap to sign him.

Or did that change in the new CBA?

As long as we sign Deron before we re-sign Hibbert we can do that, as I've always thought that's been along the lines of our intentions for this summer... Go after the big dogs (Well only Deron is left), then go after Steve Nash or EJ.

CJ Jones
03-16-2012, 04:04 PM
Ryan Anderson #3? WT_

Pig Nash
03-16-2012, 04:09 PM
I think we'd have to renounce him to do that, Hibbert would have a cap hold, yes?

Aw Heck
03-16-2012, 04:09 PM
I just hope Hibbert and his agent are patient this offseason and give the Pacers time to court and sign a major free agent. I'd hate to see him sign an offer sheet early on in free agency and then the Pacers are forced to match, eliminating their ability to sign anyone major.

BringJackBack
03-16-2012, 04:12 PM
Anybody think that there's an outside chance we could sign KG for fairly cheap (As in, around MLE) to become our third big next season and play around 30 mpg against bench players?

There are going to be the guys who 'Would quit watching the Pacers if they got KG" and would be "Disgraced"... But there is no doubt that he is still a very talented player on both sides of the court, and he is a locker room staple.

I'm neutral to it but never really considered it as an idea, just throwing this out there.

LetsTalkPacers
03-16-2012, 04:13 PM
i wouldnt trade for Nash just because of his age like some people are. With that said I would LOVE LOVE LOVE to sign him to a reasonable contract this offseason.

CableKC
03-18-2012, 03:12 AM
I'm not concerned about Nash's age.....the guy is like Ray Allen and Reggie when it comes to conditioning. I'd hope to sign him to a 2 year deal...which coincides with Granger's contract. With that said..I would still prefer to have a decent Backup PG to fall back on if there is a need for him to slow down. I would be comfortable signing him if we don't have to give up DC and re-sign GH.

PGisthefuture
03-18-2012, 03:53 AM
I would like to see Nash here next year as well, but I don't see it happening with George Hill and DC on the roster. This sounds crazy, but I wonder if us signing Barbosa and getting Lou was to attract Nash? :laugh: I doubt it, but if you really think about it Nash probably loved playing with those guys and would interest him more when deciding on a team to sign with.

Infinite MAN_force
03-18-2012, 03:48 PM
I would like to see Nash here next year as well, but I don't see it happening with George Hill and DC on the roster. This sounds crazy, but I wonder if us signing Barbosa and getting Lou was to attract Nash? :laugh: I doubt it, but if you really think about it Nash probably loved playing with those guys and would interest him more when deciding on a team to sign with.

George Hill can play most of his minutes at the 2 guard if necessary, and Collison can play a lot of minutes at the backup spot. Nash is getting up there in years obviously, so I actually think having a lot of options at the position is a good thing. It means we don't have to rely on a guy pushing 40 to play too heavy of minutes.

Shade
03-18-2012, 04:31 PM
:lol: @ Ryan Anderson. Dude is Troy Murphy 2.0.

Shade
03-18-2012, 04:33 PM
Nash would be an amazing consolation prize if/when we lose out on Deron. He would make this team much better.

CableKC
03-18-2012, 05:02 PM
George Hill can play most of his minutes at the 2 guard if necessary, and Collison can play a lot of minutes at the backup spot. Nash is getting up there in years obviously, so I actually think having a lot of options at the position is a good thing. It means we don't have to rely on a guy pushing 40 to play too heavy of minutes.
Clearly...as a Starting PG....we have some concerns about DC...but as a backup PG...id be far more comfortable with him in that role. If we are able to retain DC and get Nash at the same time for a 2 year contract...I'd love that. Technically, the same could be said and done for DWill...and would love to at least make a run at him with a MAX contract...but I doubt that he comes to Indy over playing with Amare and Tyson in MSG...or with Dirk in his hometown.

as Shade and KStat suggests...Nash would be a good consolation prize and IF he can be had for 2 years....he could continue to make a run until Granger bolts as a UFA in 2014-2015.

croz24
03-18-2012, 05:39 PM
Sign and trade for Gordon... Danny + our 2012 1st for EJ. Try to bring in a big time point guard and your lineup is set. Likely won't happen and I can't stand Deron Williams the person, but...

Williams
Gordon
George
West
Hibbert

...is about as legit as it gets in the East for an overall lineup.

able
03-18-2012, 05:48 PM
Sign and trade for Gordon... Danny + our 2012 1st for EJ. Try to bring in a big time point guard and your lineup is set. Likely won't happen and I can't stand Deron Williams the person, but...

Williams
Gordon
George
West
Hibbert

...is about as legit as it gets in the East for an overall lineup.


Yep, cause you're sure to get 80/82 games from Gordon.



oh wait, he only averages 18 games per season?? we really want him ??

croz24
03-18-2012, 06:39 PM
Yep, cause you're sure to get 80/82 games from Gordon.



oh wait, he only averages 18 games per season?? we really want him ??

Problem is, you don't know if he'll be playing 82 games or 18 games next season. And to act like it's a guarantee he won't stay healthy is foolish considering the Pacers are in clear need of a talent upgrade. Pacers are in a position where they must do something or take a chance on a player with elite talent.

Smits Happens
03-18-2012, 06:59 PM
Problem is, you don't know if he'll be playing 82 games or 18 games next season. And to act like it's a guarantee he won't stay healthy is foolish considering the Pacers are in clear need of a talent upgrade. Pacers are in a position where they must do something or take a chance on a player with elite talent.

I think there is a lot of truth to that. Small market teams like the Pacers will always have a difficult time truly contending, unless they bottom out and get lucky with a No. 1 draft pick. Just being smart as the Pacers have been can get you only so far without a superstar. I really think at some point you need to gamble a little and take a calculated risk or two if you want to make a legitimate run at a title.

croz24
03-18-2012, 07:52 PM
I think their is a lot of truth to that. Small market teams like the Pacers will always have a difficult time truly contending, unless they bottom out and get lucky with a No. 1 draft pick. Just being smart as the Pacers have been can get you only so far without a superstar. I really think at some point you need to gamble a little and take a calculated risk or two if you want to make a legitimate run at a title.

Anything factor people just don't seem to get is that the Pacers are NOT a guarantee to stay here forever. Continuing to be a bottom dweller in attendance could very well spell the doom of this franchise in Indiana. So yes, I strongly believe bringing in an Eric Gordon would do much more in the way of bringing in some fans than Granger.

Pacerized
03-18-2012, 10:48 PM
Just by going with rough numbers froom hoopshype, we're at 34 mil next year without cap holds but including D Jones 3 mil player option. It would be really nice if Jones decided to opt out but I doubt that he will. Add in Hibberts 3 mil cap hold and Hills 3 mill cap hold and we're still at around 40-41 mil. That leaves enough of room to sign a max contract free agent like Williams. If we were to pull that off it leaves just enough room to sign Hibbert to something in the 12 mil range and put us just under the LT with our 1st. round pick. We'd have to let Hill walk if we were to stay under the LT though.
If we were to sign Nash to something like D West money that would leave room for Hill and perhaps another rotation player. We can always pursue a trade for D Jones or even trade DC for a pick.
What kind of money do you guys think Kaman and Nash will merit? Could they both be had for less then 20 mil? A move like that might just be enough to give us a 2 year window while still keeping our young core.

Larry must already have a plan to jump on as soon as free agency starts. It's his last chance for a long time.

CableKC
03-18-2012, 11:06 PM
Sign and trade for Gordon... Danny + our 2012 1st for EJ. Try to bring in a big time point guard and your lineup is set. Likely won't happen and I can't stand Deron Williams the person, but...

Williams
Gordon
George
West
Hibbert

...is about as legit as it gets in the East for an overall lineup.
Wow...you'd trade Granger AND A 1st for EJ?

He's not worth that much.....

xIndyFan
03-18-2012, 11:09 PM
. . . What kind of money do you guys think Kaman and Nash will merit? Could they both be had for less then 20 mil? A move like that might just be enough to give us a 2 year window while still keeping our young core. . ..

in general, i expect FA salaries to be high next summer. lots of teams have cleared cap space to bid on dwight howard. gm's with cap space are like sailors with money. both have to spend it as fast as possible.

vnzla81
03-18-2012, 11:12 PM
I hope the Pacers go hard at Kris Humpries, he could be our starting power forward of the future, good D and a double double machine.

troyc11a
03-18-2012, 11:25 PM
I dont know what he will get offered, but I like Kevin Garnett. He brings toughness and his numbers are not in decline. He can play the 4-5, bring attitude and competiveness that this team lacks. Not to mention a championship mentality. I would not sign him long term but he would be well worth a David West type contract. Especially for 15/8 every night.

TheDavisBrothers
03-18-2012, 11:33 PM
I dont know what he will get offered, but I like Kevin Garnett. He brings toughness and his numbers are not in decline. He can play the 4-5, bring attitude and competiveness that this team lacks. Not to mention a championship mentality. I would not sign him long term but he would be well worth a David West type contract. Especially for 15/8 every night.

:vaderno:

I'm sorry but you were asking for it!
I HATE Kevin Garnett with a passion and would cringe having that @$$ hole on our team!

Hibbert
03-18-2012, 11:45 PM
KG is 35 right now playing in his 16th season. SIXTEENTH season. He will want more than a 1 year contract and Larry is the type of guy who wouldn't take that risk. No and thank you.

Pacerized
03-18-2012, 11:50 PM
KG is 35 right now playing in his 16th season. SIXTEENTH season. He will want more than a 1 year contract and Larry is the type of guy who wouldn't take that risk. No and thank you.

I really don't want Garnett either but what is the max # of years players over 36 can sign for?
Nash, Duncan and Garnett all will be in over 36 this summer.
I'd be happy offering Nash a 2 year deal and he's 38.

beast23
03-18-2012, 11:58 PM
Anything factor people just don't seem to get is that the Pacers are NOT a guarantee to stay here forever. Continuing to be a bottom dweller in attendance could very well spell the doom of this franchise in Indiana. So yes, I strongly believe bringing in an Eric Gordon would do much more in the way of bringing in some fans than Granger.

Well, if it's fans you are worried about, then forget Gordon and sign Oden. He would only cost pennies on the dollar compared to Gordon, is also a local and would play nearly as many games as Gordon next year.

graphic-er
03-19-2012, 12:59 AM
I hope the Pacers go hard at Kris Humpries, he could be our starting power forward of the future, good D and a double double machine.

I support this message. Hump has proven himself for 2 years now that he is a strong player at the 4 position.

jeffg-body
03-19-2012, 01:10 AM
I hope the Pacers go hard at Kris Humpries, he could be our starting power forward of the future, good D and a double double machine.

I will double with that. The kid has improved by leaps and bounds these past two seasons.

CableKC
03-19-2012, 03:05 AM
I hope the Pacers go hard at Kris Humpries, he could be our starting power forward of the future, good D and a double double machine.
I was all for going after Humphries last season....as he's purely a rebounding Big Man. However, my guess ( and I admit that I could be wrong ) is that his scoring doesn't come from the way that West gets his scoring ( such as from mid range jumpshot and his smart inside game ) but from put backs....much like how Foster gets what little scoring that he gets. Are you comfortable with a PF that is basically a slightly better scoring version of Foster?

Downtown Bang!
03-19-2012, 06:01 AM
Humphries has become a nice player but doesn't have elite size, length or athleticism. Think a smoother Tyler H. with a much better nose for the basketball.

The rebounding numbers are nice but for the price he will command Humphries does little for me when I think of what type of player needs to be playing next to Hibbert.

DB

BringJackBack
03-19-2012, 06:28 AM
I mean... Defensively, rebounding wise, and offensively... Kevin Garnett is exactly what we need as a big man. A tough guy, a legendary defensive player with offensive abilities.

KG is known as a douchebag around the league... But my friend made a good point. Just like how Joakim Noah and Reggie Miller are players who fans of opposing teams love to hate, so is Kevin. To New York, Reggie is a douche.

If we could lock KG up for 2 years, that would be ideal for me, and our big man rotation would be set, and it would be Roy's responsibility to become consistent if we want to have the best big man rotation in the league.

I was neutral a couple of days ago, but now it seems like it wouldn't be a bad idea... Better than going after a big man with a massive contract and injury issues such as Andrew Bogut or Chris Kaman in the offseason.

troyc11a
03-19-2012, 06:59 AM
I mean... Defensively, rebounding wise, and offensively... Kevin Garnett is exactly what we need as a big man. A tough guy, a legendary defensive player with offensive abilities.

KG is known as a douchebag around the league... But my friend made a good point. Just like how Joakim Noah and Reggie Miller are players who fans of opposing teams love to hate, so is Kevin. To New York, Reggie is a douche.

If we could lock KG up for 2 years, that would be ideal for me, and our big man rotation would be set, and it would be Roy's responsibility to become consistent if we want to have the best big man rotation in the league.

I was neutral a couple of days ago, but now it seems like it wouldn't be a bad idea... Better than going after a big man with a massive contract and injury issues such as Andrew Bogut or Chris Kaman in the offseason.

I cant stand Garnett. He is one of my least favorite players but he has the exact pedigree we need: plays 4-5, toughness, attitude, championship mettle; 15/8 a game.
As far as his age goes, I would like to see a DWest type contract. 2 years with a club option for the 3rd @ similar money! It would be a steal and he would be playing on a team that would contend. And guess what? I still believe this team would have some money left over to get extra scoring help.

Justin Tyme
03-19-2012, 07:12 AM
Humphries has become a nice player but doesn't have elite size, length or athleticism. Think a smoother Tyler H. with a much better nose for the basketball.

The rebounding numbers are nice but for the price he will command Humphries does little for me when I think of what type of player needs to be playing next to Hibbert.

DB


Humphries has athleticism. I was surprised by it in his last game against the Pacers. He plays good "D" too. I don't see it being a problem playing next to Hibbert.

Your right about what his cost will be, HIGH!

Justin Tyme
03-19-2012, 07:23 AM
The 2 FA PF that interest me is Ilyasova and Humphries, but I can see both going for a high salary. This makes be go back to who I campaigned for after the lockout.... VAREJAO. He plays BOTH the 4 and 5, he brings energy, rebs, AND PLAYS "D". Plus he has a reasonable contract for doing such.

A couple young players that interest me is JJ Hickson and Earl Clark. I can see both being available this off season. Both are athletic and long. JJ can play both the 4 & 5 as he did so for the Cavs. Clark can play both forward positions.

Pacerized
03-19-2012, 10:30 AM
This summer will be our last chance in free agency for a very long time. I'm sure Bird has a plan just like he did last summer with Nene and West.
Whatever he does I hope he goes all out for a championship move. Williams might be that move. If not Nash and Kaman combined might be. We don't need to spend our money on another 4, if we're going to bring in a big man it should be a player that's a 5 first and a 4 second. The fact that we didn't land Kaman before the trade deadline doesn't change the fact that he would really help this team as would Nash. If we brought in Humphries I think we'd have to trade West while we could.
Whoever Larry brings they need to be starters or players that merit 30 minutes per game. We don't need any more bench players.
It would be really nice to go into next season with the expectation that anything short of playing in the finals would be a disapointment. With the right free agent move that's possible.

Justin Tyme
03-19-2012, 10:44 AM
Fans/posters keep saying they want another PG for the Pacers. The names Rhondo, D'will, and Nash are the names that seem to be the only PG that are acceptable. You want no less than instant gratification from a top premier PG. Well, the chances of that happening is slim and next to none. So what is the next option? Logically, it should be a PG that can get his teammates involved, one who makes them better, one who has good court vision, one who has size, can play decent "D", one who can make passes to to other players for a score, and one who can makes defenses play honest by being able to score himself.

Now, might I suggest there is a player that is like that in the coming FA this summer. Most have no clue who I've just described, b/c he isn't a sexy PG like Parker or Westbrook. As a matter of fact, he isn't even a starter. Then neither was Lowry until the last few years. Lowry played behind Brooks who was touted as Houston's future PG. No, it's not Brooks either, but he does play for Houston and is starting for an injured Lowry.

Yes, I talking about Dragic. There will be some who will say he's been nothing but a b/u PG. Yes, but who the starting PG? Just remember he was Nash's b/u at Phoenix. Who is going to take Nash's job away from him? He's filling in quite well for the injured Lowry at the present time. Bird likes to shop off the rack in the bargain basement, well here is the bargain on the rack who is only making 2 mil now. How many quality PG not on a rookie contract is making 2 mil? I can't think of one.

My feeling is you bring him in and give him the opportunity to be the starting PG. If DC beats him out as the starter, which I don't antiicipate, you have a good quality b/u PG. As a starter, he can do the previously forementioned things at a reasonable salary. JMOAA

Hibbert
03-19-2012, 11:09 AM
Dragic goes left every time I watch him play, once teams figure that out he won't be putting up those numbers every night. I think he'd be a solid backup but definitely not our starter, I'd rather keep Collison.

Hibbert
03-19-2012, 11:12 AM
The one thing that I don't like about getting Barbosa is that we had to give up a second rd pick this year rather than next year. Guys like Draymond Green, Robbie Hummel, and Henry Sims are all guys who we would of had a shot of getting with our second rd pick this year. I think all of those players will be solid NBA players for years to come.

troyc11a
03-19-2012, 11:15 AM
I hope Bird stays away from long term contracts. Why risk cap trouble to sign guys that are risks? A 2-3 year deal for reasonable money sounds great if the player is not a bonifide superstar like Williams.
I havent seen a player mentioned on this board yet who I would like to see a big contract go too. Just my opinion.

Gamble1
03-19-2012, 12:10 PM
The 2 FA PF that interest me is Ilyasova and Humphries, but I can see both going for a high salary. This makes be go back to who I campaigned for after the lockout.... VAREJAO. He plays BOTH the 4 and 5, he brings energy, rebs, AND PLAYS "D". Plus he has a reasonable contract for doing such.

A couple young players that interest me is JJ Hickson and Earl Clark. I can see both being available this off season. Both are athletic and long. JJ can play both the 4 & 5 as he did so for the Cavs. Clark can play both forward positions.
I go back to what I said before the lockout too and there is no way Cleveland gives up Vaj for the same reasons you stated.

I wouldn't mind Ilyasova for a reasonable contract or Hump. Both would be nice but nothing that would put the Pacers over the top.

A reasonable backup center would be Perkins. He would be a cap casuality now that Westbrook is signed.

Justin Tyme
03-19-2012, 12:14 PM
Dragic goes left every time I watch him play, once teams figure that out he won't be putting up those numbers every night. I think he'd be a solid backup but definitely not our starter, I'd rather keep Collison.


Dragic has been in the NBA for years. If that is his way, don't you think other teams would have figured it out my now? Even if he does, it apparently doesn't stop him from succeeding.

Hibbert
03-19-2012, 12:17 PM
Before this year he started eight games in his past four years and never averaged more than twenty minutes a game until this year. I somehow doubt opposing teams spent much time scouting him over the past few years...

Justin Tyme
03-19-2012, 12:22 PM
I go back to what I said before the lockout too and there is no way Cleveland gives up Vaj for the same reasons you stated.

I wouldn't mind Ilyasova for a reasonable contract or Hump. Both would be nice but nothing that put the Pacers over the top.

A reasonable backup center would be Perkins. He would be a cap casuality now that Westbrook is signed.



Cleveland was interested in trading both Varejao and Sessions. They traded Sessions, but from what I can tell Varejao's injury, which is keeping him out for the rest of the season, put a damper on any trade interest for him. It looked like Cleveland wanted to rebuild with youth.

Hibbert
03-19-2012, 12:30 PM
Darren Collison has played 381 more minutes than Goran Dragic so far this year (equivalent to about 8 games) yet Dragic has 9 more turnovers than Collison does on the year. This guy is horribly turnover prone and last year only four guards fouled more often than him. He's not a good outside shooter and shoots too many threes. Also for being a guard he is a horrible FT shooter.

Justin Tyme
03-19-2012, 01:55 PM
Darren Collison has played 381 more minutes than Goran Dragic so far this year (equivalent to about 8 games) yet Dragic has 9 more turnovers than Collison does on the year. This guy is horribly turnover prone and last year only four guards fouled more often than him. He's not a good outside shooter and shoots too many threes. Also for being a guard he is a horrible FT shooter.


I don't mean to come off gruff, but I knew when I mentioned Dragic someone would pick him to death! If it aint D'Will, Nash, Rhondo, etc, the pg isn't worth considering. Let us overlook Nash can't play "D", Rhondo with his attitude and shooting problems, etc b/c we need a top premier pg and only one of those will work. Let's just forget Dragic's positives and concentrate on his negatives. Just look at the glass as half empty instead of half full.

INTERESTING

Last 6 game stats as starters:

Dragic 16 pts... 13 asts... 50% FG... 38% 3pt... 81% FT... 3.8 TO

DC 10.6 pts... 3.5 asts... 42% FG... 25% 3pt... 77% FT... 2.8 TO

Not bad for a player who is supposedly so poor at doing so many things!

I'll be the 1st to admit Dragic isn't perfect, but ask me which I'd rather have as the engine that runs the machine? I'm just pointing out what I feel is a genuine alternative at PG that is a more realistic option to be able to acquire than the sexy PGs that others dream about getting. JMOAA

Nuntius
03-19-2012, 02:52 PM
Darren Collison has played 381 more minutes than Goran Dragic so far this year (equivalent to about 8 games) yet Dragic has 9 more turnovers than Collison does on the year. This guy is horribly turnover prone and last year only four guards fouled more often than him. He's not a good outside shooter and shoots too many threes. Also for being a guard he is a horrible FT shooter.

Goran is a good PG. He is doing just fine as a starter in Houston. He is a streaky 3 point shooter and a bad FT shooter for a PG but he can run an offense very well. He is more turnover prone than DC but that's because they play a different style of a PG.

Goran is a distributor. He is aggressive, he is trying to make things happen and he takes more risks. That's why he has more assists and TOs than DC.

DC is an initiator. He plays mostly off the ball and can be trusted to not turn the ball over. He does not make things happen because he does not take a lot of risks.

Both play pass first for their teams but Goran is much more suited for this role (although he played combo in Europe).

A comparison between the do does no justice to either of them. Different styles of PG yield different results and numbers. What matters is what suits your team more.

At the moment, I have no idea what kind of PG suits the Pacers.

troyc11a
03-19-2012, 03:09 PM
I don't mean to come off gruff, but I knew when I mentioned Dragic someone would pick him to death! If it aint D'Will, Nash, Rhondo, etc, the pg isn't worth considering. Let us overlook Nash can't play "D", Rhondo with his attitude and shooting problems, etc b/c we need a top premier pg and only one of those will work. Let's just forget Dragic's positives and concentrate on his negatives. Just look at the glass as half empty instead of half full.

INTERESTING

Last 6 game stats as starters:

Dragic 16 pts... 13 asts... 50% FG... 38% 3pt... 81% FT... 3.8 TO

DC 10.6 pts... 3.5 asts... 42% FG... 25% 3pt... 77% FT... 2.8 TO

Not bad for a player who is supposedly so poor at doing so many things!

I'll be the 1st to admit Dragic isn't perfect, but ask me which I'd rather have as the engine that runs the machine? I'm just pointing out what I feel is a genuine alternative at PG that is a more realistic option to be able to acquire than the sexy PGs that others dream about getting. JMOAA

I think some folks on here just like to argue. Dragic would be a Barbosa type pickup. Would this move clinch a title for the Pacers - no; But he would be a solid pickup. I wouldnt get very excited, but that doesnt mean it wouldnt help the team.

Hibbert
03-19-2012, 03:53 PM
I don't mean to come off gruff, but I knew when I mentioned Dragic someone would pick him to death! If it aint D'Will, Nash, Rhondo, etc, the pg isn't worth considering. Let us overlook Nash can't play "D", Rhondo with his attitude and shooting problems, etc b/c we need a top premier pg and only one of those will work. Let's just forget Dragic's positives and concentrate on his negatives. Just look at the glass as half empty instead of half full.

INTERESTING

Last 6 game stats as starters:

Dragic 16 pts... 13 asts... 50% FG... 38% 3pt... 81% FT... 3.8 TO

DC 10.6 pts... 3.5 asts... 42% FG... 25% 3pt... 77% FT... 2.8 TO

Not bad for a player who is supposedly so poor at doing so many things!

I'll be the 1st to admit Dragic isn't perfect, but ask me which I'd rather have as the engine that runs the machine? I'm just pointing out what I feel is a genuine alternative at PG that is a more realistic option to be able to acquire than the sexy PGs that others dream about getting. JMOAA

Justin, calm down. I wasn't picking on you or Dragic. I understand you like him and were implying that he'd be worth taking a look at, I never said that I disagreed with you on that. I said for this Pacers team, he is not the answer. You gave me stats on the last six games he has played which happened to be games he has started but that is too small of a sample size and you have to know that those six games in Houston would not be the same had he started six games for the Pacers. Two totally different teams, two totally different systems.

I have never once mentioned us and the possibility of getting a superstar PG and I never will. This summer we have a shot at upgrading our PG but I seriously doubt that we do due to a lot of different things. I know our roster will look a little different next year cause we will make a splash in the FA market over the summer and possibly add a rookie through the draft, that is unless we trade away our pick.

By the way, Dragic is a very solid defender he just fouls too much and until he can fix that it will limit him on the defensive end. I wouldn't mind having him on our team but not as our starter, I still am in favor of rolling with DC and seeing how/if he can improve. He is a deadly three point shooter but is currently not allowed to shoot many but when and if that ever changes, I think a lot of Collison's haters will come around to the idea of him being our starting PG.

pacergod2
03-19-2012, 04:08 PM
I would approve of a Dragic signing. I just wish we could see Hill as the starting PG before the end of the season. He is the best option we have overall. DC is a backup PG. Not a starter. He would be the best backup in the league. Broken record.

We will have to make a decision on Hill. I could honestly see us bringing him back, but we may elect to rescind his Bird Rights to open up room to sign a player, then sign him with cap space, then extend Hibbert. JMO.

Could someone do me a favor and paste the Larry Coon article that followed up the article in the OP, please?

Nuntius
03-19-2012, 04:13 PM
I think that Goran would be a good combo with DC. I'd like him as well but as others said it would be a move very similar with the Barbosa signing.

Nuntius
03-19-2012, 04:16 PM
The one thing that I don't like about getting Barbosa is that we had to give up a second rd pick this year rather than next year. Guys like Draymond Green, Robbie Hummel, and Henry Sims are all guys who we would of had a shot of getting with our second rd pick this year. I think all of those players will be solid NBA players for years to come.

I wanted to hold on to both picks as well. However, Barbosa was worth more than that so I had no problem with the trade.

vnzla81
03-20-2012, 11:46 AM
http://www.foxsportsohio.com/03/19/12/Early-look-at-NBAs-free-agent-class/landing.html?blockID=691274&feedID=8888


If you’re an NBA team looking for a little extra veteran help, this could be a good summer for you.

If you’re nowhere near the playoffs, well, then free agency might be a little tougher.

That’s because the biggest names hitting the open market this summer also tend to be some of the league’s oldest players. Included in that group: Phoenix’s Steve Nash, and Boston’s Kevin Garnett and Ray Allen.

While those names may sound better suited to participate in a chess match at a retirement home in 2013, each continues to play at or near an All-Star level.

Nash still scoots around the floor like a soccer player in baggy shorts and high tops, finding the open man and burying perimeter shots.

Garnett remains a staunch defender, top-notch competitor and underrated rebounder.

And even Spike Lee would tell that Ray Allen still got game. That’s especially the case when it comes to Allen’s ability to free himself for open shots, then coolly knock ’em down.

All three are among the latest class of free agents whose contracts expire at the end of the season, freeing them to sign with any team.

But those belonging to the NBA’s senior crowd aren’t the only ones drawing attention from general managers. Far from it. Younger players such as New Jersey’s Deron Williams and Kris Humphries, Portland’s Nicolas Batum and Indiana’s Roy Hibbert can also become available.

Of course, that’s no longer the case with who was expected to be the biggest potential free agent prize — Orlando’s Dwight Howard. As you know, he picked up the option on his contract last week, guaranteeing him at least one more season with the Magic.

Here’s a look at what’s left, with “PO” indicating players who can opt out of their deals (or pick up the player option), “R” indicating restricted free agents whose current team can match any offer, and “UR” indicating unrestricted types who can bolt for any team:

POINT GUARDS

1. Deron Williams, Nets (PO). Likely to test the market after it became clear the Nets won’t land Howard in time for their first season in Brooklyn.

2. Steve Nash, Suns (UR). He loves Phoenix and it loves him. But it may be time for both to move on.

3. Jason Terry, Mavericks (UR). Hard to envision him anywhere but Dallas.

4. Kirk Hinrich, Hawks (UR). Still one of top two or three backcourt defenders. Sure would look good in Bulls uniform again.

5. Jason Kidd, Mavericks (UR). Another member of the slightly over-the-hill gang. Time to retire?

Others: Andre Miller, Nuggets (UR); D.J. Augustin, Bobcats (R); Jameer Nelson, Magic (PO); Raymond Felton, Trail Blazers (UR); George Hill, Pacers (R); Jeremy Lin, Knicks (UR); Mo Williams, Clippers (PO); Aaron Brooks, Suns (R).

SHOOTING GUARDS

1. Eric Gordon, Hornets (R). Missed almost the entire season with an injury. Hornets will offer him more than anyone else and he’s said to be cool with the idea of staying.

2. Ray Allen, Celtics (UR). Would be the perfect Maverick or Spur.

3. Nick Young, Clippers (UR). Has the rest of the season with a good team to earn a big payday.

4. O.J. Mayo, Grizzlies (R). Constantly mentioned in trade rumors, may be time to leave on his own.

5. Jamal Crawford, Trail Blazers (UR). Blazers unable to deal him at deadline.

Others: Landry Fields, Knicks (UR); Carlos Delfino, Bucks (UR); J.R. Smith, Knicks (PO); Courtney Lee, Rockets (R); Rudy Fernandez, Nuggets (R); Jodie Meeks, 76ers (UR).

SMALL FORWARDS

1. Nicolas Batum, Trail Blazers (R). You would think he’d be back, but Blazers will be undergoing offseason facelift. So could be as good as gone.

2. Michael Beasley, Timberwolves (R). So-so season. More likely to be signed and traded than to leave via free agency.

3. Gerald Wallace, Nets (PO). Fantastic hustle player and rebounder. Question is, what direction will Nets take in July?

4. Grant Hill, Suns (UR). Nearing 40, but still scoring in double figures and playing smart.

5. Matt Barnes, Lakers (UR). Lakers ready to let him leave despite intangibles he offers.

Others: Alonzo Gee, Cavaliers (R); Steve Novak, Knicks (UR); Anthony Tolliver, Timberwolves (UR); Jeremy Evans, Jazz (UR); Dahntay Jones, Pacers (PO).

POWER FORWARDS

1. Kris Humphries, Nets (UR). Inconsistent, but when he’s good, he’s very good. Could mean big bucks when July rolls around.

2. Kevin Garnett, Celtics (UR). Reportedly OK with going to a younger team on the rise if he’s not back in Boston. Imagine Garnett on the Thunder.

3. Ryan Anderson, Magic (R). Career year as do-it-all type who can really shoot.

4. Tim Duncan, Spurs (UR). Not what he once was, but still a champion who can put together the occasional big night. That’s worth a lot.

5. Antawn Jamison, Cavaliers (UR). Another older guy. Can still offer a team anywhere from 18-to-30 points a night.

Others: Carl Landry, Hornets (UR); Brandon Bass, Celtics (PO); Jason Thompson, Kings (R); J.J. Hickson, Kings (R); Kenyon Martin, Clippers (UR); Anthony Randolph, Timberwolves (R); Troy Murphy, Lakers (UR).

CENTERS

1. Roy Hibbert, Pacers (R). Second-best center in East. Would be a shocker if Pacers let him get away.

2. Brook Lopez, Nets (R). Plays hard, plays smart, has skills. Will get serious consideration from lots of teams, but likely to stay right where he is.

3. Chris Kaman, Hornets (UR). When healthy, he’s a big help. Contenders want him.

4. JaVale McGee, Nuggets (R). Very gifted and getting a fresh start. Future depends largely on these last 20-25 games.

5. Spencer Hawes, 76ers (UR). Starting-caliber center who is loved by his teammates. The former is rare in today’s NBA.

Others: Nazr Mohammed, Thunder (UR); Marcus Camby, Rockets (UR); Kwame Brown, Bucks (UR); Aaron Gray, Raptors (UR); Mehmet Okur, Trail Blazers (UR); Joel Przybilla, Trail Blazers (UR); Greg Oden, (UR).

owl
03-20-2012, 12:29 PM
Is Jeremy Lin worth taking a run at? The Pacers certainly have the cap available. New York does not.

I Love P
03-20-2012, 12:33 PM
Hibbert is going to get overpaid.

ensergio
03-20-2012, 12:47 PM
Intriguing.


Is Jeremy Lin worth taking a run at? The Pacers certainly have the cap available. New York does not.

RLeWorm
03-20-2012, 12:51 PM
Is Jeremy Lin worth taking a run at? The Pacers certainly have the cap available. New York does not.

the highest teams can offer him is the league avg which is i think around 5-6 mil. I think its like the Gilbert Arenas rule. so NY will prolly match any offer that comes his way. He should just take the qualifying offer to become a UFA next year

spreedom
03-20-2012, 12:52 PM
Is Jeremy Lin worth taking a run at? The Pacers certainly have the cap available. New York does not.


I think they can match any offer and due to the Gilbert Arenas rule, he can only get something like 2 years, $11M. I might be slightly off on those figures but I know that he's considered almost a mortal lock to stay on New York.

sopgy
03-20-2012, 01:34 PM
Hibbert is going to get overpaid.

My gut agrees and I think he will get overpaid, but there at least there are 4 other centers who might lessen the demand for Hibbert. He won't be the only young improving center on the market.

CENTERS

1. Roy Hibbert, Pacers (R). Second-best center in East. Would be a shocker if Pacers let him get away.

2. Brook Lopez, Nets (R). Plays hard, plays smart, has skills. Will get serious consideration from lots of teams, but likely to stay right where he is.

3. Chris Kaman, Hornets (UR). When healthy, he’s a big help. Contenders want him.

4. JaVale McGee, Nuggets (R). Very gifted and getting a fresh start. Future depends largely on these last 20-25 games.

5. Spencer Hawes, 76ers (UR). Starting-caliber center who is loved by his teammates. The former is rare in today’s NBA.

TheDavisBrothers
03-20-2012, 01:46 PM
I thought Jamal Crawford had a player option? He's more then likely gonna opt out, but still...

ballism
03-20-2012, 06:27 PM
the highest teams can offer him is the league avg which is i think around 5-6 mil. I think its like the Gilbert Arenas rule. so NY will prolly match any offer that comes his way. He should just take the qualifying offer to become a UFA next year

he'd still be restricted next year then. he can't get unrestricted till 2014 unless the Knicks decide to cut him loose.

Lin's realistic options after the season would be either (A) to take a Knicks offer of up to midlevel; or (B) hope that some team significantly under the cap makes a better offer; in which case the Knicks would probably match it --- but they can't make that offer themselves until a third team is involved.
The most he can get (if another team like the Pacers is involved) is 4 years with 2 years at (roughly) midlevel + 2 years at max. Slightly over 4 years / 40 mil.

Tbh, I think the Pacers should get involved either way. If anything, it may screw up the Knicks long term. Before Hibbert/Hill are re-signed, Pacers will be able to offer Lin the max salary allowed in years 3 and 4 or very close to it.
There's little chance that the Knicks don't match it. But will Lin ever be worth max salary on the floor? It would restrain the Knicks significantly in the future.
It's similar to what Kevin Pritchard pulled off with Paul Milsap and the Jazz, but even more restraining than that (and Milsap is also a better player at least for now).
The risk here isn't big. And anything that hurts the Knicks is worth doing IMO. :devil:

oz_pacer
03-21-2012, 03:27 PM
What about kendall marshall could we trade up and get him?

CableKC
03-21-2012, 03:42 PM
I think they can match any offer and due to the Gilbert Arenas rule, he can only get something like 2 years, $11M. I might be slightly off on those figures but I know that he's considered almost a mortal lock to stay on New York.
I think that Teams should just send him an overpaid contract and then watch the Knicks match it...just to push the Knicks further into LT territory :D

But the Simon's won't do that...they don't mess with other Teams RFA.

CableKC
03-21-2012, 03:59 PM
There's little chance that the Knicks don't match it. But will Lin ever be worth max salary on the floor? It would restrain the Knicks significantly in the future.
It's similar to what Kevin Pritchard pulled off with Paul Milsap and the Jazz, but even more restraining than that (and Milsap is also a better player at least for now).
The risk here isn't big. And anything that hurts the Knicks is worth doing IMO. :devil:
That's why we brought KP in.....right?

But as I just mentioned....the Simon's don't mess with other Team's RFA. My guess is that they wouldn't even go this far ( even knowing that they will match ) if it meant screwing with the other Team's Salary Cap.

owl
03-21-2012, 04:13 PM
It said on the list he was a UFA. Apparently that is not correct.