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Peck
11-13-2004, 01:21 AM
tell players to suck it up & be ready to play???

Look, I understand injury's & I understand not playing in pain.

I understand that we don't want guys making small injurys into large ones.

But what good does it do if the players that are left on the floor are getting injured because they are overplaying or even in J.O.'s case & Austins case playing through pain & injury.

Look I saw Pollard limp off after the Min. game. But you can't tell me he couldn't have done 3-5 emergency min. in a game like last night?

Fred Jones couldn't play last night but is gonna play tommorrow? Come on you mean he couldn't cover 4-8 min. of play last night?

Bender? Come on, it's time to play. It's rough seeing J.O. go out there night after night in some form of pain or limping or something & this guy won't even come to the games. I've seen Jordan play in the finals with a damn fever. I think it's time for the coaching staff to take a tougher demeanor with the guy. He could still go in & help out in the post even with bad knee's for 5 min. a game.

I give a pass to Foster because he has had surgery.

Miller & A.J. also get a free slide because of bookend casts.

John Edwards was delivering a baby so I can understand that.

But Bender, Pollard & Fred should have been in uniform trying to help the team.

Cactus Jax
11-13-2004, 01:33 AM
Playing with any sort of sickness is pretty much torture. You feel about 100 degrees warmer than it really is, it's harder to breathe, and your body gets very weak after a short period of time.

I consider in terms of basketball, a flu or fever, much worse for things like a small sprain of some sort.

TheSauceMaster
11-13-2004, 02:34 AM
Playing with any sort of sickness is pretty much torture. You feel about 100 degrees warmer than it really is, it's harder to breathe, and your body gets very weak after a short period of time.

I consider in terms of basketball, a flu or fever, much worse for things like a small sprain of some sort.

So what your saying is Bender's illness is more threating ? I mean JO is putting the whole season on the line and if he keeps tweaking that foot it's going to give out eventually ..then we have No JO period ..again tell me why Bender shouldn't be playing?

How many folks goto work sick each day because they have too and are not getting paid millons , he gets paid no matter what.

I'm with Peck on this one , some of these guys and Especially Bender need to hunker down and play. I don't want to hear it when JO hurts himself and is out for months and you all keep making excuses for Bender and his Softness

Cactus Jax
11-13-2004, 02:45 AM
Playing with any sort of sickness is pretty much torture. You feel about 100 degrees warmer than it really is, it's harder to breathe, and your body gets very weak after a short period of time.

I consider in terms of basketball, a flu or fever, much worse for things like a small sprain of some sort.

So what your saying is Bender's illness is more threating ? I mean JO is putting the whole season on the line and if he keeps tweaking that foot it's going to give out eventually ..then we have No JO period ..again tell me why Bender shouldn't be playing?

How many folks goto work sick each day because they have too and are not getting paid millons , he gets paid no matter what.

I'm with Peck on this one , some of these guys and Especially Bender need to hunker down and play. I don't want to hear it when JO hurts himself and is out for months and you all keep making excuses for Bender and his Softness


I'm not making excuses, I'm speaking from a little bit of experience from the past. JO is a warrior and if he's out for any period of time I know hr has a serious injury.

And there's a HUGE difference between working and getting every ounce out of yourself for 20-30 minutes in Bender's sake.

There's a reason that Jordan's flu game is held in such high regard and it's not all because it was Jordan who did it. Plus I'm sure his prior injuries aren't 100%, so they aren't risking anything.

Merz
11-13-2004, 02:48 AM
I've gone to my crappy 8 dollar an hour job with a migraine headache several times.

I've played basketball for my team with a sprained ankle and with a flu (not at the same time, of course). These guys have got to play.
Some players on this team are pissing me off worse than I've ever been pissed off at anyone before.

This has been a crappy week for any Pacer fan.
Hopefully this is our worst point of the season.

GET TO WORK!!!

Anthem
11-13-2004, 03:27 AM
Well, we can't tell Foster, Reggie, or AJ to suck it up. They're definitely out.

Pollard, I dunno. I guess he tweaked the back pretty good.

Bender, I think we all agree on.

What's up with John Edwards missing the game with "personal reasons?" Are we cutting him or not?

tseramid
11-13-2004, 08:03 AM
Edwards was attending the birth of his first child. I think we can give him a pass on that one.

MSA2CF
11-13-2004, 08:15 AM
Different players have different thresholds for pain. I don't think anyone may attempt to push them over that line. It's a judgement call on the player's part, and I will not blame any player on this team (so far this season) for not playing through an injury.

ABADays
11-13-2004, 09:04 AM
I think it's a matter of trying to get people the healthiest they can be for the long haul. This will take getting some hits on the early games. But last night should not have been one of them.

Unclebuck
11-13-2004, 09:08 AM
I stay out of this type of discussion mainly because I don't have the slightest idea who should play and who shouldn't so I never criticize any player either way.

McKeyFan
11-13-2004, 09:55 AM
I find it ironic that the one game Edwards would have seriously contributed he's out for personal reasons. (Attending his girlfriend's birth). I'm not so quick as the rest of ya'll to give him a carte blache pass. The kid will be fine if he gets there 12 hours later.

Just think if another guy had fouled out? What would we have done? Maybe tomorrow night AJ and Reggie should dress. At least they could play defense with one hand if only four guys are on the court.

sweabs
11-13-2004, 09:56 AM
All I know is I have played numerous games (basketball, swimming, soccer, hockey, volleyball) while sick with the flu, fever's, etc.

Maybe it was just the way I was brought up - but I know that once I was in the heat of competition, your sickness no longer bothers you. It's all a mental thing.

I remember swimming in National's up here, and I was sick that weekend. But it was a NATIONAL meet...so I had to go out there and perform, and ended up swimming some of my best races...even getting Personal Bests in some events and won 2 silvers.

I'm just saying...I think Bender has to suck it up and go out there and play.

Mourning
11-13-2004, 10:01 AM
Sorry, but I DO think getting a child IS a good reason to get a game off. As ridiculous as it may sond there is a life after basketball too. It's also not a play-off game either, so too bad we lost , I'm more than sure we will beat them next time we will meet them ... lets move on to the game against the Knicks tonight!

Regards,

Mourning:cool:

grace
11-13-2004, 10:04 AM
I find it ironic that the one game Edwards would have seriously contributed he's out for personal reasons. (Attending his girlfriend's birth). I'm not so quick as the rest of ya'll to give him a carte blache pass. The kid will be fine if he gets there 12 hours later.

As someone who has worked in a NICU you can never guarentee how even a "normal" delivery will go. Would you really want to be in Philly and get a call telling you your baby is in ICU or worse?

Jose Slaughter
11-13-2004, 10:14 AM
I find it ironic that the one game Edwards would have seriously contributed he's out for personal reasons. (Attending his girlfriend's birth). I'm not so quick as the rest of ya'll to give him a carte blache pass. The kid will be fine if he gets there 12 hours later.

Just think if another guy had fouled out? What would we have done? Maybe tomorrow night AJ and Reggie should dress. At least they could play defense with one hand if only four guys are on the court.


You could not be more wrong on this.

I have just one child & I was there at his birth. It turned out that that was the most important event I've had in my life. I would not have missed being there for anything, especially my work.

There are several other fathers that post here too.

I doubt any of them felt they needed to be at work that day & not there to see the birth of a child.

Bball
11-13-2004, 10:40 AM
I'm starting to think Bender just needs to be cut to make a point to the rest of the team and league...

...and to stick a fork in what has to be one of the most overly hyped yet unfulfilled careers and trades in Pacer history. A major bust on several levels.

Edwards and Pollard not playing I don't have a problem with considering the circumstances. Back injuries are what they are and you treat them with respect.

OTOH, Bender just didn't wake up with the flu before the game. He's had it a couple of days and I'm sure has received treatment. He could've at least be ready to play in an emergency scenario.



-Bball

Dab
11-13-2004, 10:47 AM
...Bender reportedly could have played Friday, but the decision was made to be cautious with him in case O'Neal reinjured his left foot and was not available tonight...

http://www.indystar.com/articles/6/194404-9756-036.html

DisplacedKnick
11-13-2004, 11:00 AM
...Bender reportedly could have played Friday, but the decision was made to be cautious with him in case O'Neal reinjured his left foot and was not available tonight...

http://www.indystar.com/articles/6/194404-9756-036.html

WTF?

Let me get this straight - you think JO, your all-star, 3rd-in-MVP-voting franchise player could re-injure himself.

So instead of sitting him and letting him get fully healed you rest your 2nd-string scrub washout and take a chance on losing your entire season? Keeping Jon Bender healthy (which is an exercise in futility anyway) is more important than keeping Jermaine O'Neal healthy?

You guys have some folks in serious need of a brain.

Tom White
11-13-2004, 11:03 AM
[quote=Dabney]...Bender reportedly could have played Friday, but the decision was made to be cautious with him in case O'Neal reinjured his left foot and was not available tonight...

This is the first time in a while that I have posted here, but I had to respond to this. Does this mean that, in the Pacers thinking, they were willing to risk a re-injury to JO, but not to poor little JB? Is the indystar writer actually accurate in what he is saying?

DisplacedKnick
11-13-2004, 11:04 AM
Returning to Peck's original statement, I LOVED this David Harriosn quote:

First-round draft pick David Harrison was nursing a sore right shoulder and sprained left ankle but gave no thought to sitting out, given the Pacers' depleted roster.

"I have to play," he said, smiling.

"Maybe on my second or third contract I can be hurt."


I wonder who he's referring to?

Hicks
11-13-2004, 11:06 AM
I think all can start being well if Fred, Pollard, and Bender all play tomorrow.

MagicRat
11-13-2004, 11:33 AM
I find it ironic that the one game Edwards would have seriously contributed he's out for personal reasons. (Attending his girlfriend's birth). I'm not so quick as the rest of ya'll to give him a carte blache pass. The kid will be fine if he gets there 12 hours later.

I guess I really shouldn't've taken this whole past week off......

3Ball
11-13-2004, 12:30 PM
I think the time to suck it up is in the playoff, or when you're at a really important juncture in the season. November is the time where you make sure you don't re-injure youself. I wish JO had stayed out longer. I would rather scrape by, win 40 games, make the 8th seed, and then roar into the playoffs healthy and rested. Far better than selling out to win 61 games only to be banged up and exhausted come May.

TheSauceMaster
11-13-2004, 01:04 PM
I find it ironic that the one game Edwards would have seriously contributed he's out for personal reasons. (Attending his girlfriend's birth). I'm not so quick as the rest of ya'll to give him a carte blache pass. The kid will be fine if he gets there 12 hours later.

Sorry I don't agree with that I have been lucky enough to be there for all 3 of my kids birth's and it was a joy that nothing was more important than my children's birth.

I would hated for me not to be there and something critical happen , wife or child died but a basketball game was more important :confused: NOT !!!!!!!!

McKeyFan
11-13-2004, 11:14 PM
For the record, I just said I wasn't ready to give Edwards an immediate pass without some question. I was at my son and my daughter's birth, so I understand the phenomenon. It wasn't but about a generation ago that most fathers were anywhere near the birthing room.

And I know this isn't war, but soldiers don't get to fly home for childbirth.

And I understand that there is life beyond playing basketball. But that's just it: Edwards hasn't played any basketball, and this game may have been his one chance to do so. That's what I find so ironic.

Having given it some more thought, I have this inconclusive conclusion:

If it's daughter, she will forever love him for giving up his big chance to watch her be born. If it's a son, he will always be bummed that his Dad missed his one chance to really play in an NBA game. :cool:

Will Galen
11-14-2004, 12:36 AM
I stay out of this type of discussion mainly because I don't have the slightest idea who should play and who shouldn't so I never criticize any player either way.

You really think any of the guys on here making judgement calls know who should play?

Will Galen
11-14-2004, 12:45 AM
...Bender reportedly could have played Friday, but the decision was made to be cautious with him in case O'Neal reinjured his left foot and was not available tonight...

http://www.indystar.com/articles/6/194404-9756-036.html

WTF?

Let me get this straight - you think JO, your all-star, 3rd-in-MVP-voting franchise player could re-injure himself.

So instead of sitting him and letting him get fully healed you rest your 2nd-string scrub washout and take a chance on losing your entire season? Keeping Jon Bender healthy (which is an exercise in futility anyway) is more important than keeping Jermaine O'Neal healthy?

You guys have some folks in serious need of a brain.


It's not that guys on here are lacking in brain power. It's the fact they belong to a forum and like to express their opinion. Not knowing what's going on doesn't stop them either.

ChicagoJ
11-14-2004, 01:08 AM
When my mom was in labor 35 years ago last month, Dad said in the "Father's room" at St. Francis, listening to the Pacers play an ABA preseason game on the radio.

See, you can have both, but you've got to be willing to work for it. :D

Anthem
11-14-2004, 01:17 AM
I was watchng Game 1 of Nets/Pacers 15 minutes before I got married.

sweabs
11-14-2004, 01:22 AM
I was watchng Game 1 of Nets/Pacers 15 minutes before I got married.

You're lucky it wasn't Game 5.

You might have had to delay things...:devil: