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View Full Version : How much do the Pacers miss George Hill?



Ace E.Anderson
02-13-2012, 02:56 PM
I don't post new threads very often, but I am surprised this question hasn't already been asked. The team is 3-5 in the 8 games that George Hill has missed this season. It'd be easy to think that we could easily replace a 10 ppg bench scorer, but I believe it goes well beyond that.

Aside from being probably our most consistent outside shooting threat, Hill is one of our best on ball defenders as well. We have really missed his defensive presence on the perimeter during this 3-game losing streak (Hinrich, Conley, Lawson all caused our team problems)

We are giving up 90.5 ppg in the games he played, and 96.75 ppg in the games he's missed. I know it's a small sample size, but I think it's enough of a difference to take note of.

So the question is simple, how much are the pacers missing George Hill?

kielbeze
02-13-2012, 03:06 PM
I would agree with you. I have not heard a whole lot being said about him being out. I think his absence has more effect than you might think because of the defense he brings to the table with the second unit. He has not exactly been explosive scoring this year but his shots are usually very timely.

Trader Joe
02-13-2012, 03:19 PM
A lot.

Hicks
02-13-2012, 03:26 PM
Yeah, it is kind of weird how this isn't getting discussed more. I'm guilty of it as much as anyone, and my initial reasoning as to why is that, well, we're more used to a Pacers team WITHOUT George Hill than we are one WITH him. You have last year's core still out there playing, along with D West, and it still, to me, registers as "normal" even with George missing.

But he brings a lot to this team, and with him I wouldn't be shocked if we were to have at least two more wins right now. Between the defense he plays and how he sometimes can erupt for bursts of shooting/scoring, that could have been enough to tip the scale in the last two losses.

He is our best bench player, and probably as good as our starters.

graphic-er
02-13-2012, 03:27 PM
Like the deserts miss the rain.....

picasso
02-13-2012, 03:31 PM
Yup we sure do miss him..

He brings a swagger/leadership to the second unit and first at times..

I sure do miss his clutch threes to bring us back or extend our leads..

His defense as well.. Collison has been getting abused on this losing streak.

Cheese louise the man can't seen to guard anyone at times.

Trader Joe
02-13-2012, 03:32 PM
I'm just wondering where all the people that were laughing at him getting likely getting 7 million-ish this summer are at.

Dr. Awesome
02-13-2012, 03:36 PM
Not as much as they miss Reggie Miller.

Sparhawk
02-13-2012, 03:40 PM
I have felt since the beginning of the season that the ONLY guy you don't want getting hurt on the bench is GH. And he got hurt.

Hope Bird plans on making a move or two. Our bench isn't as deep as we all thought. Hans struggles are very disconcerting.

Unclebuck
02-13-2012, 03:41 PM
They miss him very much, and yet I hope they are cautious about bringing him back. if they wait until after the allstar break that is fine by me.

One of the biggest myths about this years Pacers is that they are so deep. False, they have 7 players and through 7 they are balanced and pretty good, but after 7 they are pretty poor for a playoff team. So when one of the top 7 goes down that is huge. I was singing this tune since the start of the season, but mainly the media hasn't caught on yet.

imbtyler
02-13-2012, 03:48 PM
You know Buck's speaking the truth when I thank him. We should be able to last until after All-Star break without him, but I would rather we didn't have to. However, these last six games shouldn't be incredibly difficult if we can manage to beat the Heat. We have enough strengths that we can out-power many of the remaining rosters. I hope to see that we do.

Until then, the Pacers FO (Bird, Morway, Pritchard) need to be looking at their trade options because, if GH is still out, we're not going to get very deep into the playoffs. I'm sure he won't be out that long, though.

Sparhawk
02-13-2012, 03:53 PM
You know Buck's speaking the truth when I thank him. We should be able to last until after All-Star break without him, but I would rather we didn't have to. However, these last six games shouldn't be incredibly difficult if we can manage to beat the Heat. We have enough strengths that we can out-power many of the remaining rosters. I hope to see that we do.

Until then, the Pacers FO (Bird, Morway, Pritchard) need to be looking at their trade options because, if GH is still out, we're not going to get very deep into the playoffs. I'm sure he won't be out that long, though.

Bird and co should be looking to make some moves. The point guard position is our weakest link right now for starters. Bench is another issue, but I think you take care of starters first.

Hicks
02-13-2012, 04:33 PM
They miss him very much, and yet I hope they are cautious about bringing him back. if they wait until after the allstar break that is fine by me.

One of the biggest myths about this years Pacers is that they are so deep. False, they have 7 players and through 7 they are balanced and pretty good, but after 7 they are pretty poor for a playoff team. So when one of the top 7 goes down that is huge. I was singing this tune since the start of the season, but mainly the media hasn't caught on yet.

So which one isn't worthy of your "top 8"? Jeff, or Tyler? I would think Jeff, but with how much Tyler has disappointed, I could see it the other way as well.

Big if's, but if Jeff can play aside from back-to-backs and Tyler pulls his head out of his butt, I like our top 8 very much.

Trader Joe
02-13-2012, 04:37 PM
Jeff doesn't play nearly enough to ever be considered a part of a big anything. He's like the really funny uncle that only shows up to Christmas every 5-8 years.

Suaveness
02-13-2012, 04:39 PM
I'd say Jeff is as important to the bench as anyone else. The difference between him playing and Lou playing is huge. The few games Jeff has played he's made a difference.

Eleazar
02-13-2012, 04:42 PM
They miss him very much, and yet I hope they are cautious about bringing him back. if they wait until after the allstar break that is fine by me.

One of the biggest myths about this years Pacers is that they are so deep. False, they have 7 players and through 7 they are balanced and pretty good, but after 7 they are pretty poor for a playoff team. So when one of the top 7 goes down that is huge. I was singing this tune since the start of the season, but mainly the media hasn't caught on yet.

I disagree, we just have a bench players who aren't being used properly. As a unit the bench isn't very exciting because it isn't a balanced bench without Hill, especially with Hasnbrough struggling to score.

naptownmenace
02-13-2012, 04:53 PM
On a 1 out of 10 scale - 8.

He really is great with the second unit. Much better defense than you get from Price and Lance and he knows how to take care of the ball.

Sparhawk
02-13-2012, 04:58 PM
On a 1 out of 10 scale - 8.

He really is great with the second unit. Much better defense than you get from Price and Lance and he knows how to take care of the ball.

That's so true. Hill does not turn the ball over often for as much as he handles it. I still think he's better off the ball than trying to distribute. Pretty good defender.

ejwallace
02-13-2012, 05:17 PM
I say about as much as this....

http://ux1.eiu.edu/~ejwallace/Misc/Dorthy.jpg

Pacer Fan
02-13-2012, 05:20 PM
Pacers losing 4 of the last 5 pretty much sums this thread up!!

next please!

skyfire
02-13-2012, 06:42 PM
He is by a wide margin the Pacers perimeter player with the highest basketball IQ. He is a fantastic glue player to complement the rest of the players we have playing on the perimeter. I agree that we'd likely have a couple more wins had he not been hurt.

PR07
02-13-2012, 06:48 PM
He's been missed a lot. Having him means another starting caliber player who can eat a lot of minutes. Plus, his defense is exceptional and he can score.

beast23
02-13-2012, 06:53 PM
They miss him very much, and yet I hope they are cautious about bringing him back. if they wait until after the allstar break that is fine by me.

One of the biggest myths about this years Pacers is that they are so deep. False, they have 7 players and through 7 they are balanced and pretty good, but after 7 they are pretty poor for a playoff team. So when one of the top 7 goes down that is huge. I was singing this tune since the start of the season, but mainly the media hasn't caught on yet.

For sure. The biggest thing that I see about Hill being injured is that it throws the entire second unit off balance. Having Hill available to the second unit makes all the difference in the world to their effectiveness. He causes the defense to react and shift to him and probably even causes better spacing to be available to Tyler.

Do we miss Hill. Yes, terribly.

I was one individual that thought that 7M was way too much to be paying for a non-starting backcourt player. I still do. But... we are going to have to come up with a means to appease him, because we absolutely need him, or a player just like him.

jeffg-body
02-13-2012, 07:05 PM
We miss GH a ton. I'll give AJ some praise for trying but at the end of the game DC is gassed from playing so much that he is getting torched. GH fills that void that AJ and Lance have tried to fill but they just cannot get it done. We need GH back and he does deserve that 7ish a year.

spazzxb
02-13-2012, 07:16 PM
I have felt since the beginning of the season that the ONLY guy you don't want getting hurt on the bench is GH. And he got hurt.

Hope Bird plans on making a move or two. Our bench isn't as deep as we all thought. Hans struggles are very disconcerting.

Loosing GH is especially bad since he backs up 2 positions. Its almost like loosing 2 guys when considering lineups. My only real complaint about him is that I don't like him playing next to DC (to small on defense).

CableKC
02-13-2012, 07:21 PM
So which one isn't worthy of your "top 8"? Jeff, or Tyler? I would think Jeff, but with how much Tyler has disappointed, I could see it the other way as well.

Big if's, but if Jeff can play aside from back-to-backs and Tyler pulls his head out of his butt, I like our top 8 very much.
My 7 are what I refer to as the "Starting 7".....DC/PG/Granger/West/Hibbert/GH/Hansbrough....I like what Inferno and Foster do...but they are IMHO...Role Players that should be brought in during the Playoffs to fill specific roles...when we need defense and some energy.

I know that that may sound crazy....but I think that the Pacers are in a unique position to get at least 1 ( hopefully 2 ) Players to get quality Players that could fill out the 8th or 9th Player spots in the rotation. Yes, having Inferno and Foster as the 9th to 11th Players in the rotation maybe a luxury...but that's what I want...a bench that is deep enough where we have very good Players like Inferno and Foster come in when they are truly needed.

CableKC
02-13-2012, 07:23 PM
Jeff doesn't play nearly enough to ever be considered a part of a big anything. He's like the really funny uncle that only shows up to Christmas every 5-8 years.
Yeah....but he's also the uncle that everyone looks forward to seeing that shows up during Christmas and brings all the reallly nice and expensive gifts.

We just need Foster to show up in April, May and ( God willing ) June. He's the type of Player that you can "plug into the lineup" and play.

Pacer Fan
02-13-2012, 07:25 PM
Just because the Pacers do not have anyone else coming off the bench that is worth a crap does not mean Hill is worth 7mil per year. There are a bunch of equivalents around the league at his age with his production coming off the bench that are in the 4mil per year area.

This doesn't mean he doesn't have value to our team, but unless he comes back and shows something more then his past NBA career, he is simply not worth 7mil.

BlueNGold
02-13-2012, 08:30 PM
More than they miss Brandon Rush...

Hicks
02-13-2012, 08:46 PM
Just because the Pacers do not have anyone else coming off the bench that is worth a crap does not mean Hill is worth 7mil per year. There are a bunch of equivalents around the league at his age with his production coming off the bench that are in the 4mil per year area.

This doesn't mean he doesn't have value to our team, but unless he comes back and shows something more then his past NBA career, he is simply not worth 7mil.

Who do you see as 4m equivalents that are not on rookie deals?

Pacer Fan
02-13-2012, 09:47 PM
Who do you see as 4m equivalents that are not on rookie deals?

Go here http://www.hoopsworld.com/nba-salaries
Or here http://www.shamsports.com/content/pages/data/salaries/index.jsp

Go thru the teams and you will find 1 to 3 players per team generally that will be getting paid 3 to 5 mil per year that is a role player, A 6th to 8th man off the bench, depending on position.

I'll throw some names up I know of off the top of my head. You'll have to do your own leg work.

Morrow, Sessions, Jordan Farmar, Luke Ridnour, Daniel Gibson, Tony Allen, Lowery, JJ Barea...this is just a sample and I didn't get into other positions like a Millicic or Pekovic. 3 to 5 mil is the mid level exception area.

I can only think of a few that are in that 7 to 8 mil area... Mo Williams, JJ Reddick, Paul Millsap, Devin Harris, Arron Afflalo...I don't put Hill in these guys category and yet Harris, Reddick, Williams are overpaid and some would say Afflalo got a righteous contract, we will see how bloated it is in due time.

Derek2k3
02-13-2012, 09:50 PM
Looking back, I think the Pacers miss him about 2-3 wins worth. I honestly believe the Pacers beat Denver/Memphis with him, and quite possibly Orlando. His 10 points/defense/clutch play would have made a huge difference in all of those losses.

3-5 could easily have been 7-1.

pwee31
02-13-2012, 10:02 PM
I think they miss him mote due to the other options. Stephenson and Price have gotten a lot more minutes. Though Price played well last game, the Pacers miss Hill on both ends of the floor. I know Lance is young and has played better, I would just like to see him do more. I mean the guy is playing SG and can't hit a spot up jumper. This is fine if he's a defensive specialist and that's not the case. Without Hill, we pretty much have the same backcourt as last year without Rush and Dunleavy, and that's not good once Collison and Paul George go to the bench. Even Granger to some extent.

We need Hill back, and I still feel we need to add another wing somehow as well as a big. We only have 13 on the roster, and w/ Hill and Foster missing time, only 11 dressed, 10 as Pendergraph simply just suits up for garbage time.

Hopefully having a spot or 2 available comes in handy sooner or later

Ace E.Anderson
02-13-2012, 10:28 PM
Go here http://www.hoopsworld.com/nba-salaries
Or here http://www.shamsports.com/content/pages/data/salaries/index.jsp

Go thru the teams and you will find 1 to 3 players per team generally that will be getting paid 3 to 5 mil per year that is a role player, A 6th to 8th man off the bench, depending on position.

I'll throw some names up I know of off the top of my head. You'll have to do your own leg work.

Morrow, Sessions, Jordan Farmar, Luke Ridnour, Daniel Gibson, Tony Allen, Lowery, JJ Barea...this is just a sample and I didn't get into other positions like a Millicic or Pekovic. 3 to 5 mil is the mid level exception area.

I can only think of a few that are in that 7 to 8 mil area... Mo Williams, JJ Reddick, Paul Millsap, Devin Harris, Arron Afflalo...I don't put Hill in these guys category and yet Harris, Reddick, Williams are overpaid and some would say Afflalo got a righteous contract, we will see how bloated it is in due time.

Your using Marrow, Sessions, Farmar, Ridnour, and Gibson for your argument? Hill is better than all of those players you just mentioned. You could even argue that he's better/more well rounded than reddick, williams and Harris as well. I don't necessarily think he deserves 7-8 million, but I think he's better than most of the players you just named. Just my opinion

Unclebuck
02-13-2012, 11:22 PM
So which one isn't worthy of your "top 8"? Jeff, or Tyler? I would think Jeff, but with how much Tyler has disappointed, I could see it the other way as well.

Big if's, but if Jeff can play aside from back-to-backs and Tyler pulls his head out of his butt, I like our top 8 very much.

I can't include Jeff because even before the season I figured he'd play maybe 20 games. Tyler is one of the 7 and even though he has struggled, he's hugely important to our goal of playing smash mouth basketball, and the physical tone he sets I don't think can be overlooked

Hicks
02-13-2012, 11:23 PM
I can't include Jeff because even before the season I figured he'd play maybe 20 games. Tyler is one of the 7 and even though he has struggled, he's hugely important to our goal of playing smash mouth basketball, and the physical tone he sets I don't think can be overlooked

Has Tyler let you down at all this year? I've found him mostly underwhelming.

He's starting to remind me of Croshere in that Cro was a guy who seemed to give you more when you played him big minutes, yet less when you limited his minutes (of course I mean that beyond the obvious of less minutes meaning less opportunities). This is opposed to a guy like Jeff who gave you good minutes no matter how few or many.

Unclebuck
02-13-2012, 11:24 PM
I disagree, we just have a bench players who aren't being used properly. As a unit the bench isn't very exciting because it isn't a balanced bench without Hill, especially with Hasnbrough struggling to score.

How should the bench players be used?

ejwallace
02-13-2012, 11:34 PM
How should the bench players be used?

I too would like to see more of the bench rotated in throughout the game instead of playing two separate units....

Eleazar
02-13-2012, 11:43 PM
I too would like to see more of the bench rotated in throughout the game instead of playing two separate units....

This.

Pacer Fan
02-13-2012, 11:50 PM
Your using Marrow, Sessions, Farmar, Ridnour, and Gibson for your argument? Hill is better than all of those players you just mentioned. You could even argue that he's better/more well rounded than reddick, williams and Harris as well. I don't necessarily think he deserves 7-8 million, but I think he's better than most of the players you just named. Just my opinion

I'm not using them as an argument at the time, however, those name drops was drops off the top of my head...go check the rest of the league as I posted and you'll see.

Hill's play and numbers beg to differ. They don't lie. Very inconsistent player and the Spurs knew this or they would have kept him. And don't say they got rid of him cause they couldn't afford his new contract as many around here have said. He is still cheap this year and he could have been dealt this summer by the Spurs, but they didn't want him. Also, their cap is fine this summer to have resigned him as Duncan 21mil is off the books. You should go back to last year on him and see how bad he was. Also, he laid an egg in the playoffs against Memphis. Guess you didn't watch that series?

Hill is a tweener that doesn't have court vision and is to short for alot of 2 Guards. He averages 9.3 ppg, 1.6 apg, 2.8 rpg in 25 minutes. per 15.3

Sessions 10 ppg, 5.7apg, 3.2rpg in 28 minutes. per 15.5
Morrow 13.7 ppg 1 apg 2.8 rpg in 29 minutes. per of 14.52, & one of the best 3p shooters in the league.
Farmar 11 ppg, 3.6apg, 1.7rpg in 22 minutes with a per of 19.07 way over average and better then anyone on the Pacers.

Now to say those guys aren't in the same category is wrong.

I would rather have Morrow and Farmar off the bench for 8mil then Hill for 7.5mil as reported he wants.

And I'd love to have Sessions, dude as skillz!

With this said, I like Hill a lot, I just think he should have taken the offer that LB gave him. It was more then I feel he is worth.

BlueNGold
02-13-2012, 11:53 PM
Our problem is that we really aren't that deep when Foster and George Hill are out...and Tyler isn't playing well. Pendergraph might add some athleticism, but he's planted on the bench.

So...I'd be fine with separate rotations like we did in the 90's because it can be very successful. But as it stands, we cannot count on our bench much. Paul George is now a starter and quite frankly our bench with the injuries is actually a weakness.

Derek2k3
02-14-2012, 12:26 AM
Our problem is that we really aren't that deep when Foster and George Hill are out...and Tyler isn't playing well. Pendergraph might add some athleticism, but he's planted on the bench.

So...I'd be fine with separate rotations like we did in the 90's because it can be very successful. But as it stands, we cannot count on our bench much. Paul George is now a starter and quite frankly our bench with the injuries is actually a weakness.

:laugh:

Every time I hear "Pendergraph" and "athleticism" I remember his vicious missed dunk that first game. Poor guy. :laugh:

Unclebuck
02-14-2012, 09:39 AM
Has Tyler let you down at all this year? I've found him mostly underwhelming.

He's starting to remind me of Croshere in that Cro was a guy who seemed to give you more when you played him big minutes, yet less when you limited his minutes (of course I mean that beyond the obvious of less minutes meaning less opportunities). This is opposed to a guy like Jeff who gave you good minutes no matter how few or many.


I think he's been fine, and if he were playing or had to play 35 minutes a game I think he would be a lot better. He needs to get into a rhythm, he needs to get a feel for the game. He's not like Jeff. But Tyler does bring the effort, intensity and attitude whether he plays 2 minutes or 40.

The problem for Tyler is that David West is just better, and Roy has been playing well, so Tyler's minutes are not what they were in the second half of the season last year. Also Jeff and Tyler as a combo are much better than Lou and Tyler. Jeff helps Tyler, not too sure why, but those two are really good together. Jeff and Tyler complement each other where as Lou and Tyler seem to compete against each other (not on purpose, but just with their style of play)

graphic-er
02-14-2012, 09:55 AM
Hill is a tweener that doesn't have court vision and is to short for alot of 2 Guards. He averages 9.3 ppg, 1.6 apg, 2.8 rpg in 25 minutes. per 15.3

Sessions 10 ppg, 5.7apg, 3.2rpg in 28 minutes. per 15.5
Morrow 13.7 ppg 1 apg 2.8 rpg in 29 minutes. per of 14.52, & one of the best 3p shooters in the league.
Farmar 11 ppg, 3.6apg, 1.7rpg in 22 minutes with a per of 19.07 way over average and better then anyone on the Pacers.

Now to say those guys aren't in the same category is wrong.

I would rather have Morrow and Farmar off the bench for 8mil then Hill for 7.5mil as reported he wants.

And I'd love to have Sessions, dude as skillz!

With this said, I like Hill a lot, I just think he should have taken the offer that LB gave him. It was more then I feel he is worth.

I'd like to have Sessions as well. He has bounced around a couple losing teams now. I think he could be had for a 2nd round pick and Lance. That would be real depth off the bench.

graphic-er
02-14-2012, 10:01 AM
Has Tyler let you down at all this year? I've found him mostly underwhelming.

He's starting to remind me of Croshere in that Cro was a guy who seemed to give you more when you played him big minutes, yet less when you limited his minutes (of course I mean that beyond the obvious of less minutes meaning less opportunities). This is opposed to a guy like Jeff who gave you good minutes no matter how few or many.



I think he's been fine, and if he were playing or had to play 35 minutes a game I think he would be a lot better. He needs to get into a rhythm, he needs to get a feel for the game. He's not like Jeff. But Tyler does bring the effort, intensity and attitude whether he plays 2 minutes or 40.

The problem for Tyler is that David West is just better, and Roy has been playing well, so Tyler's minutes are not what they were in the second half of the season last year. Also Jeff and Tyler as a combo are much better than Lou and Tyler. Jeff helps Tyler, not too sure why, but those two are really good together. Jeff and Tyler complement each other where as Lou and Tyler seem to compete against each other (not on purpose, but just with their style of play)

I think Tyler is just a one trick pony. When he is hitting that mid range jumper his entire game opens up, become a more engaged defender. When he isn't he shrinks down to the worst player on the floor. Becomes a terrible defender, wont' rebound, wont' box out. Its amazing to see how bad he gets when he can't contribute on the score board.

Unclebuck
02-14-2012, 10:48 AM
I think Tyler is just a one trick pony. When he is hitting that mid range jumper his entire game opens up, become a more engaged defender. When he isn't he shrinks down to the worst player on the floor. Becomes a terrible defender, wont' rebound, wont' box out. Its amazing to see how bad he gets when he can't contribute on the score board.


So you don't give him anything for playing hard, being physical, playing smash mouth basketball. That means nothing - his one trick is his mid range shot?

graphic-er
02-14-2012, 11:02 AM
So you don't give him anything for playing hard, being physical, playing smash mouth basketball. That means nothing - his one trick is his mid range shot?

What i am saying is that when he isn't hitting that shot he isn't even smash mouth.

Derek2k3
02-14-2012, 11:44 AM
Has Tyler let you down at all this year? I've found him mostly underwhelming.

He's starting to remind me of Croshere in that Cro was a guy who seemed to give you more when you played him big minutes, yet less when you limited his minutes (of course I mean that beyond the obvious of less minutes meaning less opportunities). This is opposed to a guy like Jeff who gave you good minutes no matter how few or many.

Yeah, I'd agree that he's been underwhelming.

I mean, he's putting up 8 shots/game, and shooting 39%. That's tough.

As of late he's been playing better though, seems like the eye injury messed him up a bit.

But, like has been said before, he's had games where he oddly seemed out of it, not playing solid d etc...those games have seemed to start disappearing though, so maybe he's just a slow starter. He seems to have gone away from wildly driving into the lane and getting those shots/fouls up, something that made him invaluable last season. It's like someone tried to tweak his game and teach him how to pass or something, it's all thrown off. When he's being aggressive with the ball and going to the rim, he's contributing. Whether he scores or not, IMO.

BRushWithDeath
02-14-2012, 12:17 PM
I mean, he's putting up 8 shots/game, and shooting 39%. That's tough.

As of late he's been playing better though, seems like the eye injury messed him up a bit.

I've actually thought Tyler has played better recently. He's not taking as many bad shots. He's made quite a few good passes.

But I'm not sure I understand the eye injury excuse that gets thrown around so regularly.

He's been shooting at basically the same clip all season. Up to and including the Philly game he was 37 of 94 which is 39%. Since that game, he's hit 46 of 119. 39%.

His free throw shooting as actually improved slightly since the shot to eye. 78% before, 82% after.

I could be wrong but whatever is going on with Tyler wouldn't appear to be related to the hit to his eye in any way.

crunk-juice
02-14-2012, 12:17 PM
so we're just gonna act like Hill doesnt suck in half his games

Hicks
02-14-2012, 12:46 PM
so we're just gonna act like Hill doesnt suck in half his games

Is that supposed to mean we don't very much miss the other half?

Derek2k3
02-14-2012, 01:12 PM
so we're just gonna act like Hill doesnt suck in half his games

24 MPG, 9ppg, 45% shooting, 1.2 steals/game, leadership.

Sorry he doesn't average 19ppg on 60% shooting. That isn't what the team misses. They miss having someone who plays great defense, isn't intimidated by big moments, and can consistently knock down jumpers with that second unit. Without him? AJ(trick or treat), Lance (Can't shoot), Dahntay (shouldn't shoot :laugh:) Tyler (15-18 feet and in) Lou/Jeff (Nothing to see here).

You see it every game, when that second unit gets out there they pack the paint. Especially when PG gets in foul trouble early (Like, every other game:rolleyes:).

All in all, after his early struggles he has really made a big difference. Don't know what you're expecting out of your 6th/7th man.

Peck
02-14-2012, 02:16 PM
Has Tyler let you down at all this year? I've found him mostly underwhelming.

He's starting to remind me of Croshere in that Cro was a guy who seemed to give you more when you played him big minutes, yet less when you limited his minutes (of course I mean that beyond the obvious of less minutes meaning less opportunities). This is opposed to a guy like Jeff who gave you good minutes no matter how few or many.

That is an excellent analogy.

I hadn't really thought about it in that context but now that you have pointed it out this is almost exactly how I feel about it.

Pacer Fan
02-14-2012, 02:23 PM
I'm getting :confused:here....It's a Hill thread and you guys are talking about Hill and Tyler, yet He is only being used and I don't know who he you mean...:confused:

graphic-er
02-14-2012, 02:25 PM
I've actually thought Tyler has played better recently. He's not taking as many bad shots. He's made quite a few good passes.

But I'm not sure I understand the eye injury excuse that gets thrown around so regularly.

He's been shooting at basically the same clip all season. Up to and including the Philly game he was 37 of 94 which is 39%. Since that game, he's hit 46 of 119. 39%.

His free throw shooting as actually improved slightly since the shot to eye. 78% before, 82% after.

I could be wrong but whatever is going on with Tyler wouldn't appear to be related to the hit to his eye in any way.

You know whats wrong with him...
He is too indecisive. The dude pump fakes or jab steps like 3 times before he actually decides what to do.

Unclebuck
02-14-2012, 04:18 PM
What i am saying is that when he isn't hitting that shot he isn't even smash mouth.


OK, but on that we disagree

CableKC
02-14-2012, 08:01 PM
According to Brunner....It looks like GH has started to take his first steps towards recovery.

http://tbt.blogs.nba.com/


Indiana sixth man George Hill will miss his eighth consecutive game with a chip fracture in his left ankle. The Pacers have 3-4 without him. Hill has begun light on-court work but Vogel said there still is “no definitive timetable” for his return.

I'm thinking that we should just wait until after the ASB for GH to return.