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View Full Version : MarShon Brooks drops 48 points in NYC tourney debut, wows crowd



90'sNBARocked
07-20-2011, 11:11 AM
http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/nets/2011/07/marshon-brooks-drops-48-points-in-nyc-tourney-debut-wows-crowd


If this is what a rusty and cramping MarShon Brooks can produce, the Nets got themselves a dynamic offensive player with a star personality.

Of course, you have to consider the level of competition – and last night at the Nike Pro-City tournament it waslmostly below NBA level. Still, you also have to consider that Brooks, the Nets’ first-round pick last month, hadn’t played in weeks and was stepping on an unfamiliar court with an unfamiliar team.

That he took over immediately is a testament to his confidence. It only took two possessions for his teammates to realize who should command the ball. Brooks missed his first couple shots but kept on firing, finishing with 48 points on 17-of-32 from the field with six 3-pointers. His final line also included: five rebounds, five fouls, one assist, five turnovers, one block, 6-of-12 from 3-point and 8-of-9 from the foul line.

Battling a calf cramp that started early in the second half, Brooks won over the Manhattan crowd with his swag, skill and determination.They gave him the first and last ovation of the evening, as he outscored notable opponents Jamario Moon (25 points) and John Lucas III (28).

It was a street-ball atmosphere inside the Baruch College gym, and Brooks fit the part – sometimes dribbling down the court like Skip to My Lou, sometimes embarrassing the opponent with a crossover, sometimes converting a 3-pointer with a hand in his face, and once throwing down a tomahawk jam.

There were two very noticeable -- and positive -- qualities: Brooks is very competitive, and he can create his own shot.

The big drawback for Brooks was that he failed to finish. He missed several opportunities to hit his 50th point, including a 3-pointer with one second remaining in overtime that doomed his team to a 125-123 defeat.

Despite the defeat, a crowd of autograph seekers bigger than for that of any other swarmed Brooks after the game. Many were wearing Nets gear. One doctored his #9 Yi Jianlian jersey by writing “Brooks” on the back with tape and paper (Brooks will wear #9 whenever the season starts).

This tournament -- and others like it -- represent Brooks’ Summer League. He hasn’t been paid a dime by the Nets or the NBA, but he needs to counterbalance his frequent NBA2K11 video gaming with real basketball activity. According to his agent, Seth Cohen, Brooks will play in another New York City tournament next week.

There is no consideration to sign a deal overseas.

“If I would have signed my contract, maybe I would have thought about it,” said Brooks. “But with no contract signed, I don’t even want to take a chance.”

Before the lockout, Brooks worked out with the Nets’ other draft pick, Jordan Williams, in Santa Barbara, Calif., where he also met up with Jazz players Al Jefferson and Derrick Favors.

Following the lockout, Brooks said he hasn’t done much except “playing 2K11 and doing pushups.”

And at times last night, he played like it was a video game.

before anyone says it , yes I know it is not NBA competition etc etc. , but I really wanted the Pacers to grab this guy. He is the anti Brandon Rush and is everything I wish Brandon could be . I really think this kid is going to havbe an above average NBA career. Also on the Nets he will probably start next to D Will

Kid Minneapolis
07-20-2011, 11:16 AM
Ya, I don't often get on these trainrides, like people did with all the Jerryd Bayless crap a few years ago (I never saw in him what other people did), but I just have this feeling that Brooks is going to make us REGRET passing on him.... Everything I watched about this guy just told me he's going to be an offensive stud in this league...

ksuttonjr76
07-20-2011, 11:30 AM
Tsk...I hope he ends up bust, so I don't have to tell people "I told you so".

Ownagedood
07-20-2011, 11:45 AM
I agree with both of you... I thought for sure we were taking him when he was available. He seems to have a great skill set for the offensive side and we really need a finisher. But George Hill wasn't a bad result either. I just hope Brooks isn't a star. :(

Dr. Hibbert
07-20-2011, 11:45 AM
I can't BELIEVE he slipped as far as he did. Madness! Sparta! Seriously, I thought there was a fantastic chance the Pacers would take him at 15. So to not even go in the first round...wow.

Ownagedood
07-20-2011, 11:52 AM
I can't BELIEVE he slipped as far as he did. Madness! Sparta! Seriously, I thought there was a fantastic chance the Pacers would take him at 15. So to not even go in the first round...wow.
Actually he was picked 25th by the Celtics.

BRushWithDeath
07-20-2011, 12:06 PM
I'm really happy we didn't take him.

I just cannot imagine having to type that stupid capital S in his name for the next few years.

pacer4ever
07-20-2011, 12:45 PM
Tsk...I hope he ends up bust, so I don't have to tell people "I told you so".

He wont be a bust IMO but he will be a really inefficient scorer who doesn't play defense. Kind of like Jordan Crawford and how he played for the Wiz last year. A guy you dont want on your team if you want to play team basketball and all he does is iso and doesn't pass.

Speed
07-20-2011, 12:47 PM
My favorite line was "He missed several opportunities to hit his 50th point, including a 3-pointer with one second remaining in overtime that doomed his team to a 125-123 defeat."

Was it a Winning or 50 points choice? He did have an assist, so theres that. I'm guessing Marshon likes him some Marshon.

90'sNBARocked
07-20-2011, 12:56 PM
After years of the passitivity of one Brandon Rush, I would welcome a player with Marshon's penchulance to put it up

:)

pacer4ever
07-20-2011, 12:58 PM
After years of the passitivity of one Brandon Rush, I would welcome a player with Marshon's penchulance to put it up

:)

Nick Young and JR Smith are both free agents

The Sleeze
07-20-2011, 01:08 PM
I'm pretty sure that Nick Young and Paul George are good friends too.

<iframe width="560" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/8YNXzwxrt2s" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

pacer4ever
07-20-2011, 01:14 PM
I'm pretty sure that Nick Young and Paul George are good friends too.

<iframe width="560" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/8YNXzwxrt2s" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>


Thats fine and all but he is a RFA and he was the Wizards leading scorer pretty sure they will try to keep him. I was making a point that inefficient scorers are easy to find.

Sparhawk
07-20-2011, 01:24 PM
32 shots to just 1 assist. I just don't like that ratio at all.

Not a player comparison, but even a guy like Kobe averages about 5 assists while shooting 20+ times a game.

It's just a game though. He was still high on my list of players I wanted the players to draft.

Gamble1
07-20-2011, 01:28 PM
After years of the passitivity of one Brandon Rush, I would welcome a player with Marshon's penchulance to put it up

:)
The guy had 5 turnovers. I think Brooks is going to alright player but I aslo see him coughing up the ball a lot.

Heisenberg
07-20-2011, 01:29 PM
Are people really making career projections based on a ProAm game?

BillS
07-20-2011, 01:30 PM
I always thought there would be nothing that would beat Summer League for potential crazy hype without significant value.

Clearly, I was wrong :zip:

(and yes, I know the OP was trying NOT to go over the top. But the thread will get there, oh, yes, precious...) :lol:

90'sNBARocked
07-20-2011, 01:33 PM
Nick Young and JR Smith are both free agents

LMAO

Nice one, so is Jmmal Crawford :)

90'sNBARocked
07-20-2011, 01:34 PM
The guy had 5 turnovers. I think Brooks is going to alright player but I aslo see him coughing up the ball a lot.

ya tought to tell

I guess I just love the "alpha dog" personality

pacer4ever
07-20-2011, 01:34 PM
Are people really making career projections based on a ProAm game?

No but i did watch about 5 Providence games on espn3 predraft and I didn't see him pass once. I wanted no part of him for the Pacers. I think i have a decent feel for his game. But he will probably pass more in the NBA with all the talent around him.

pacer4ever
07-20-2011, 01:40 PM
LMAO

Nice one, so is Jmmal Crawford :)

ur making my point for me lol

90'sNBARocked
07-20-2011, 01:49 PM
ur making my point for me lol

I was , and was adding Jammal to the list

:)

DocHolliday
07-20-2011, 02:21 PM
I loves me some rec league ball hogs.

Reginald
07-20-2011, 03:02 PM
I always thought there would be nothing that would beat Summer League for potential crazy hype...

I thought people bought into the MarShon hype when he set the all-time Big East single-game scoring record, finished the 2011 NCAA season as the nation's second leading scorer and destroyed Alec Burks during pre-draft workouts, but maybe that was just me.

Somebody quick, refresh my memory here: during crunch time in the Bulls playoff series, when FREAKING NOBODY wearing blue & gold wanted to put the team on his shoulders and take the big shot, did you find yourself saying, Man, what we need right now is a team player?

I feel like I'm on a college football recruiting board after a stud has turned my team down and everyone is trying just a little too hard to convince themselves we "dodged another bullet".

Kid Minneapolis
07-20-2011, 04:06 PM
Cracks me up when someone dominates competition anywhere he goes, but "he won't translate to the NBA". Base on what? His domination of everyone at his level? Ya... what a crappy trait to have. A scorer scored? He's not a passer, and he didn't pass? He's not as good as Kobe Bryant yet??? WTF?!?!?! I don't want him!

At some point in time, this team is going to need an alpha male, go-to, fearless scorer to get us to the next level. A team full of versatile team players still has holes to fill.

Brooks may not become that, but of everyone that came out of that draft, IN MY OPINON... he best fits the bill. I don't expect the guy to become a lock-down defender (he might though). I don't expect the guy to get 10 rebounds a game. I don't expect the guy to get 5 assists/game. I just expect the guy to take over games offensively and get his team late-game buckets when they need them.

Constellations
07-20-2011, 04:17 PM
Sounds like he shoots alot.

indyaway
07-20-2011, 04:17 PM
At some point in time, this team is going to need an alpha male, go-to, fearless scorer to get us to the next level. A team full of versatile team players still has holes to fill.

I think many on this board probably want that alpha male as the coach, with the team on the floor sporting crew cuts, passing at least 5 times, and running the picket fence.

Gamble1
07-20-2011, 04:23 PM
Cracks me up when someone dominates competition anywhere he goes, but "he won't translate to the NBA". Base on what? His domination of everyone at his level? Ya... what a crappy trait to have. A scorer scored? He's not a passer, and he didn't pass? He's not as good as Kobe Bryant yet??? WTF?!?!?! I don't want him!

At some point in time, this team is going to need an alpha male, go-to, fearless scorer to get us to the next level. A team full of versatile team players still has holes to fill.

Brooks may not become that, but of everyone that came out of that draft, IN MY OPINON... he best fits the bill. I don't expect the guy to become a lock-down defender (he might though). I don't expect the guy to get 10 rebounds a game. I don't expect the guy to get 5 assists/game. I just expect the guy to take over games offensively and get his team late-game buckets when they need them.

Lets be fair here. He dominated his competition for one year and his team had a losing record with his dominating performances. Now I don't blame him for having a losing record but I think its fair to be a tad bit critical of his game. Brooks IMo can just as easily lose you a game as he can win one for you.

Personally I would take George Hill 10 out of 10 times and he doesn't refer to himself in the third person.

90'sNBARocked
07-20-2011, 04:25 PM
I am excited to see how he plays out as well

ksuttonjr76
07-20-2011, 05:00 PM
Cracks me up when someone dominates competition anywhere he goes, but "he won't translate to the NBA". Base on what? His domination of everyone at his level? Ya... what a crappy trait to have. A scorer scored? He's not a passer, and he didn't pass? He's not as good as Kobe Bryant yet??? WTF?!?!?! I don't want him!

At some point in time, this team is going to need an alpha male, go-to, fearless scorer to get us to the next level. A team full of versatile team players still has holes to fill.

Brooks may not become that, but of everyone that came out of that draft, IN MY OPINON... he best fits the bill. I don't expect the guy to become a lock-down defender (he might though). I don't expect the guy to get 10 rebounds a game. I don't expect the guy to get 5 assists/game. I just expect the guy to take over games offensively and get his team late-game buckets when they need them.

I was more impressed with wide range of moves. Oddly enough...I can't find any of the draft day threads.

EDIT:
Found one.

http://www.pacersdigest.com/showthread.php?p=1256099#post1256099

Ryan
07-20-2011, 05:08 PM
and all he does is iso and doesn't pass.

???????????????????

Watch games, not highlights bro.

pacer4ever
07-20-2011, 05:13 PM
???????????????????

Watch games, not highlights bro.

i do the games i watched he didnt pass I watched about 5 on espn3.

I watched Marquette and Providence and Jimmy Butler made him so inefficient

Ryan
07-20-2011, 05:27 PM
saying all he does is iso is like saying all reggie miller did was dunk. honestly.

pacer4ever
07-20-2011, 05:32 PM
saying all he does is iso is like saying all reggie miller did was dunk. honestly.
i disagree with that but
no i mean he can spot up and shoot but he primarily was scoring in iso 1v1. It may of been a hyperbole of me. But he primarily scorers via isos

Ryan
07-20-2011, 05:34 PM
so does lebron james.

providence college isnt duke. he didn't have 4 other dudes drafted with him. why pass to guys who are bagging groceries now? just so scouts can say "LOOK! HE CAN PASS!" ?

xBulletproof
07-20-2011, 05:36 PM
saying all he does is iso is like saying all reggie miller did was dunk. honestly.

I feel like I could be going out on a limb here, but I'm going to guess Brooks iso's more than 5 times a year.

pacer4ever
07-20-2011, 05:39 PM
so does lebron james.

providence college isnt duke. he didn't have 4 other dudes drafted with him. why pass to guys who are bagging groceries now? just so scouts can say "LOOK! HE CAN PASS!" ?

I know he played on a ****** team that is why i said his pass ability should improve at the next level because the talent level is better. But Alec Burks played on a ****** team as well and he showed he was unselfish and a prolific scorer i mean there is a fine line. I mean Marshon played like the dude off Celtic pride lol.


The Iso part is fine scoring in iso is something you need on a team. But you cant just be a black hole unless you are as good as LBJ .(this is the problem i have with Dantay Jones)

90'sNBARocked
07-20-2011, 05:42 PM
i disagree with that but
no i mean he can spot up and shoot but he primarily was scoring in iso 1v1. It may of been a hyperbole of me. But he primarily scorers via isos

Isnt that exactly what Bird and company said we desperately needed , and a big reason why we went after OJ Mayo?

90'sNBARocked
07-20-2011, 05:43 PM
also I know it was only a workout but didnt Brooks eat up Alec Burks?

pacer4ever
07-20-2011, 05:46 PM
Isnt that exactly what Bird and company said we desperately needed , and a big reason why we went after OJ Mayo?

you are missing my point. Finding a guy who can score 1v1 is easy there are 5 free agents right now who can do that. Like i said i feel Marshon will be a successful NBA player and be a decent inefficient scorer like Jordan Crawford. But those guys are a dime a dozen and we can get 1 via free agency. That has been my point all along i didn't want Brooks because you can find a player like that pretty easily.

pacer4ever
07-20-2011, 05:49 PM
also I know it was only a workout but didnt Brooks eat up Alec Burks?

:laugh::laugh:


sorry that's all i can do at that comment

90'sNBARocked
07-20-2011, 05:52 PM
you are missing my point. Finding a guy who can score 1v1 is easy there are 5 free agents right now who can do that. Like i said i feel Marshon will be a successful NBA player and be a decent inefficient scorer like Jordan Crawford. But those guys are a dime a dozen and we can get 1 via free agency. That has been my point all along i didn't want Brooks because you can find a player like that pretty easily.

No I understand your point fam, its just I disagree with the 1 on1 statement. I mean if you are talking about a player who can go one on one in the NBA with effectiveness, that is rare , and I would like to know who you think aare the 5 free agents

Jamal Crawford is not that, he is more of a catch and shoot guy

90'sNBARocked
07-20-2011, 05:55 PM
:laugh::laugh:


sorry that's all i can do at that comment



It was reported here that at Pacers draft workouts he ate Burks up ( unless I am confusing Burks with Klay Thompson)

pacer4ever
07-20-2011, 05:59 PM
No I understand your point fam, its just I disagree with the 1 on1 statement. I mean if you are talking about a player who can go one on one in the NBA with effectiveness, that is rare , and I would like to know who you think aare the 5 free agents

Jamal Crawford is not that, he is more of a catch and shoot guy

lol Jamal Crawford can go 1v1 all day. He is very good off the dribble and a very good catch and shoot player he can do both.

Crawford can create his own shot with the best of them

Nick Young

JR Smith

J.J Barea

Rodney Stuckey

Marcus Thornton

Aaron Brooks




<iframe width="425" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/ViOiG47OpNQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

pacer4ever
07-20-2011, 06:00 PM
It was reported here that at Pacers draft workouts he ate Burks up ( unless I am confusing Burks with Klay Thompson)

Pacers didnt workout Burks


it was the Charlotte one but workouts are irrelevant and i have always thought that

90'sNBARocked
07-20-2011, 06:24 PM
lol Jamal Crawford can go 1v1 all day. He is very good off the dribble and a very good catch and shoot player he can do both.

Crawford can create his own shot with the best of them Maybe

Nick Young NO I disagree

JR Smith NO I disagree

J.J Barea Yes but he is a PG body and liability

Rodney Stuckey Would give you that, although KStat might have an opinion

Marcus Thornton Havent seen enough

Aaron Brooks yes but he is a PG

I think when I think of iso guys at the two I am thinking about guys who can beat their man off the dribble not launch a 25 footer . Also create vs dominate is different no?



<iframe width="425" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/ViOiG47OpNQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe> vvv

90'sNBARocked
07-20-2011, 06:25 PM
Check out this tidbit, via ESPN Stats and Info: Brooks put up 24.6 points and 7.7 grabbed rebounds per game last year, becoming the only Division 1 player to average 24+ points and 7+ boards.

Read more NBA news and insight: http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=20242#ixzz1Sge2kac7

Ryan
07-20-2011, 06:25 PM
Pacers didnt workout Burks


it was the Charlotte one but workouts are irrelevant and i have always thought that

So he shot a hole in your argument but because "workouts are irrelevant" to YOU, the point has no validity?

OKAY.

CableKC
07-20-2011, 06:31 PM
Anyone have any highlights of GH?

Cuz I only care about Players that are on the Pacers roster...not Players that we passed on or aren't on the Team.

SMosley21
07-20-2011, 06:47 PM
"and last night at the Nike Pro-City tournament it waslmostly below NBA level"

That's all I needed to read. Wake me up when he drops 48 in the NBA and not in some pickup game against guys who would be lucky to make a D-League team.

pacer4ever
07-20-2011, 07:25 PM
vvv

so OJ Mayo can create for himself but Nick Young or JR Smith cant?:confused:


I guess we agree to dis agree

Shade
07-21-2011, 09:27 AM
Brooks is who I wanted in the draft. I'm happy with Hill, but we're going to regret not making a move to get MarShon, as well.

BRushWithDeath
07-21-2011, 10:04 AM
Brooks is who I wanted in the draft. I'm happy with Hill, but we're going to regret not making a move to get MarShon, as well.

As much as we regret not keeping Bayless?

90'sNBARocked
07-21-2011, 11:13 AM
I think Brooks ends up better than Bayless and has a similar career to Kevin Martin

DocHolliday
07-21-2011, 11:36 AM
I think Brooks ends up better than Bayless and has a similar career to Kevin Martin

...and I think he ends up as a chump with a career similar to Bo Kimble.

pacers74
07-21-2011, 11:50 AM
I am in the camp that I will wait and see what he can do in the NBA not in a Nike Pro-City tournament. He might turn out to be a stud, but I am not ready to appoint him that yeat.

ChristianDudley
07-21-2011, 12:21 PM
Just like when Marco Belinelli was wowing fans at the Las Vegas Summer League right after he was drafted--I don't get all that excited over players that do amazingly well in summer leagues and other tournaments as all that counts is what happens in real games, and more times than not, the young players that have games like these either don't get much playing time to start out in the pros or they just don't pan out for whatever reason. It's nice to hear he's having success already against some (I'm assuming) decent competition.

pacer4ever
07-21-2011, 12:32 PM
I think Brooks ends up better than Bayless and has a similar career to Kevin Martin

If any GM though that he would of went top 5 in the draft not 27th. Not saying that it isn't possible but it isn't likley

Gamble1
07-21-2011, 12:37 PM
???????????????????

Watch games, not highlights bro.
You want real numbers?

30% of Brooks possesions were iso plays and 20% percent were in transition which is a lot. He ranks the highest in the NCAA in iso plays and he is below average with .847 ppp.

The 20% transition posessions increases his overall efficency to 3rd overall. In half court sets though he ranks 7th overall.

Read more NBA news and insight: http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=20242#ixzz1Sge2kac7 (http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=20242#ixzz1Sge2kac7)
This defiantly isn't pace adjusted which IMO is a pretty big deal in factoring in rankings like this. Your looking at the 8th fastest paced team in the NCAA. Thats incredibly high when you factor in that there is something around 350 division 1 basketball teams.

Edit: IF I remember right Danny was also a the highest scoring/rebounder to and his team rank around 211 in pace.

90'sNBARocked
07-21-2011, 01:50 PM
...and I think he ends up as a chump with a career similar to Bo Kimble.

LOL at the Bo Kimble reference

anyone remember Alfredrick "The Great" Hughes from Loyloa ?

90'sNBARocked
07-21-2011, 01:52 PM
If any GM though that he would of went top 5 in the draft not 27th. Not saying that it isn't possible but it isn't likley

Thats kind of a fair point but then you could point to examples like

Danny Granger, Gilbert Arenas, Carlos Boozer, Manu Ginobli etc.

Heisenberg
07-21-2011, 02:08 PM
Thats kind of a fair point but then you could point to examples like

Danny Granger, Gilbert Arenas, Carlos Boozer, Manu Ginobli etc.
Or....Kevin Martin himself, who went 26th

pacer4ever
07-21-2011, 02:21 PM
Thats kind of a fair point but then you could point to examples like

Danny Granger, Gilbert Arenas, Carlos Boozer, Manu Ginobli etc.


If any GM though that he would of went top 5 in the draft not 27th. Not saying that it isn't possible but it isn't likley

;)

Kid Minneapolis
07-21-2011, 02:54 PM
...and I think he ends up as a chump with a career similar to Bo Kimble.

This guy can become a great player and you'll always root against him. It's like you want him to fail, just to prove you're right.

thefeistyone
07-21-2011, 02:55 PM
My old soccer coach used to always call a couple strikers on the team "idiot strikers". Players that played with no sense, but it was kind of a good thing.

That's kind of how I view MarShon Brooks. He's just a straight up scorer, he doesn't take good shots and he's going to make a lot of mistakes and turnovers. However, if he's the only idiot scorer on your team it sometimes works out.

That's my anology, every team needs a good idiot

pacer4ever
07-21-2011, 03:06 PM
My old soccer coach used to always call a couple strikers on the team "idiot strikers". Players that played with no sense, but it was kind of a good thing.

That's kind of how I view MarShon Brooks. He's just a straight up scorer, he doesn't take good shots and he's going to make a lot of mistakes and turnovers. However, if he's the only idiot scorer on your team it sometimes works out.

That's my anology, every team needs a good idiot

That is how i played soccer i was a striker and just scored. But why would he call them idiots did they always make the wrong play or sumin???

Shade
07-21-2011, 03:58 PM
As much as we regret not keeping Bayless?

There's still a good chance Bayless has a better career than Rush.

thefeistyone
07-21-2011, 04:44 PM
That is how i played soccer i was a striker and just scored. But why would he call them idiots did they always make the wrong play or sumin???

He used it more as a compliment, it wasn't a bad thing. In soccer sometimes no sense is good sense. Common sense wouldn't be diving head first into a group of defenders. Ignoring that is sometimes a positive.

Maybe not the best analogy for brooks, but that's what i think of when i see pure scorers that take 35 shots to score 25 points. You can put Jimmer on that list too. Pulling up from 30 feet is never a good shot, but it worked out ok for him.

SkipperZ
07-22-2011, 10:11 AM
There's still a good chance Bayless has a better career than Rush.

I think this is pretty much a certainty

BRushWithDeath
07-22-2011, 12:41 PM
I think this is pretty much a certainty

It's been more or less a dead heat offensively with Brandon the better defender at this point in their careers.

I wouldn't call it a certainty. Possible, absolutely.

To this point that trade is a massive win for us. Bayless would have to turn into a star for us to regret it. I don't see that happening.

tikitomoka
07-22-2011, 08:39 PM
Pacers didnt workout Burks


it was the Charlotte one but workouts are irrelevant and i have always thought that
but, man, summer leagues are where its at!

pacer4ever
07-22-2011, 09:14 PM
but, man, summer leagues are where its at!

no college film is where it is at if you are scouting for the NBA. I mean look at 1 workout or 3 years of college film? :laugh: pretty easy choice.


and summer leagues are irrelevant good way to stay in shape but they dont matter at all.

SycamoreKen
07-23-2011, 12:38 AM
I always chuckle when some of you dismiss the summer league games as meaningless. If they mean nothing why do teams pay for them? If the league is losing money why not fold them up? Ask the Spurs about Gary Neal and where they first caught a glimpse of what he could bring.

I guess if he becomes Martin, a good 3rd guy on a championship team then that isn't too bad, but don't we already have a couple of those already?

Ryan
07-23-2011, 02:24 AM
no college film is where it is at if you are scouting for the NBA. I mean look at 1 workout or 3 years of college film? :laugh: pretty easy choice.


and summer leagues are irrelevant good way to stay in shape but they dont matter at all.

college film made a lot of ****** nba players get drafted real early.

joew8302
07-23-2011, 02:49 AM
If any GM though that he would of went top 5 in the draft not 27th. Not saying that it isn't possible but it isn't likley

Wait a minute, you apply this logic to Brooks, yet Lance is a "lottery type" talent? weird.

Kemo
07-23-2011, 03:20 AM
My old soccer coach used to always call a couple strikers on the team "idiot strikers". Players that played with no sense, but it was kind of a good thing.

That's kind of how I view MarShon Brooks. He's just a straight up scorer, he doesn't take good shots and he's going to make a lot of mistakes and turnovers. However, if he's the only idiot scorer on your team it sometimes works out.

That's my anology, every team needs a good idiot

LOL for some reason when I read your post, the 1st name that popped into my head was Stephen Jackson ..

dunno why, maybe it was the words idiot and scorer in the same sentence... heh



.

Heisenberg
07-23-2011, 01:49 PM
Stop acting like it was Rush for Bayless. I'd do Rush + Jack + McBob for Bayless + Diogu any time you want. We absolutely won that deal.

BillS
07-23-2011, 02:39 PM
I always chuckle when some of you dismiss the summer league games as meaningless. If they mean nothing why do teams pay for them? If the league is losing money why not fold them up? Ask the Spurs about Gary Neal and where they first caught a glimpse of what he could bring.

"not meaningless" doesn't mean "100% reliably predictive".

The meaning is in the interpretation of the results based on factors that include competition level, difference between league and team play, and difference in priorities/expectations.

It's the people who automatically equate a breakthrough performance in summer league with proof that the player will bean NBA great that cause the problem.

Summer leagues have value in the negative (if a guy can't hack it there he isn't going to hack it at all) and as a very low-level baseline for performance (if a guy turns out to do well in the summer league he can PROBABLY make it at least as a bench player in the NBA). They can give an idea of what someone's raw tendencies are. They are not predictors of success in the regular season.

Shade
07-24-2011, 11:38 AM
Stop acting like it was Rush for Bayless. I'd do Rush + Jack + McBob for Bayless + Diogu any time you want. We absolutely won that deal.

Jack is gone, and so likely is McBob. All that we have left to show for the trade is Rush.

BringJackBack
07-25-2011, 12:13 AM
Jack is gone, and so likely is McBob. All that we have left to show for the trade is Rush.

And Portland has NOTHING to show for that trade, because they traded him for a late first round draft pick.

Kraft
07-25-2011, 01:46 AM
Jack is gone, and so likely is McBob. All that we have left to show for the trade is Rush.

This sort of logic doesn't work for me, and fans use it all the time.

Jack played 82 games for the Pacers. McRoberts played 147 games. That is something, even if those weren't great years.

Did the Pacers get nothing out of the 11th pick in the '87 draft? I mean, that player isn't here anymore, either. That's the extreme, I know, but that's essentially the extremist talk that fans use when trying to win an argument.

Just because a title wasn't won during a player's time with the Pacers doesn't make that time worthless. Jack turned in a lot of solid minutes. McRoberts has as well, though I'm not the biggest fan.

The Pacers got meaningful return from that trade. Who won it? Who cares?

Shade
07-26-2011, 05:47 AM
This sort of logic doesn't work for me, and fans use it all the time.

Jack played 82 games for the Pacers. McRoberts played 147 games. That is something, even if those weren't great years.

Did the Pacers get nothing out of the 11th pick in the '87 draft? I mean, that player isn't here anymore, either. That's the extreme, I know, but that's essentially the extremist talk that fans use when trying to win an argument.

Just because a title wasn't won during a player's time with the Pacers doesn't make that time worthless. Jack turned in a lot of solid minutes. McRoberts has as well, though I'm not the biggest fan.

The Pacers got meaningful return from that trade. Who won it? Who cares?

The Pacers had a lot of success with Reggie. Jack and McBob, though? Not so much.

Since86
07-26-2011, 10:03 AM
The Pacers had a lot of success with Reggie. Jack and McBob, though? Not so much.

Would the Pacers have had more success with Bayless instead, or would they have continued to suck?

Let's not act like the reason why the Pacers weren't any good is because of Jack/McBob, but rather because the whole roster wasn't any good. Bayless doesn't change that fact.

When Bayless starts even matching the production that Jack gave, then we can talk. But obviously Jack is a better player now, and it's not even a question about who was better then.

Isaac
07-26-2011, 04:21 PM
LOL for some reason when I read your post, the 1st name that popped into my head was Stephen Jackson ..

dunno why, maybe it was the words idiot and scorer in the same sentence... heh



.

Marshon Brooks wishes he could be anything like Stephen Jackson. He's a lot more like Larry Hughes.

daschysta
07-26-2011, 04:52 PM
Marshon Brooks wishes he could be anything like Stephen Jackson. He's a lot more like Larry Hughes.

I don't see the defensive instincts in brooks that hughes showed off in washington.

At best he's a jordan crawford/ nick young imo. High volume shooters that can be lights out when their on, but continue to shoot when they are in slumps as well.

SycamoreKen
07-29-2011, 02:00 AM
"not meaningless" doesn't mean "100% reliably predictive".

The meaning is in the interpretation of the results based on factors that include competition level, difference between league and team play, and difference in priorities/expectations.

It's the people who automatically equate a breakthrough performance in summer league with proof that the player will bean NBA great that cause the problem.

Summer leagues have value in the negative (if a guy can't hack it there he isn't going to hack it at all) and as a very low-level baseline for performance (if a guy turns out to do well in the summer league he can PROBABLY make it at least as a bench player in the NBA). They can give an idea of what someone's raw tendencies are. They are not predictors of success in the regular season.

I agree with you completely. Some people over blow the play of players in the summer leagues. I would still rather have our young guys on a summer league team than whatever they are doing now. Some structure is better than none. What happens outside of the games is more important anyway.

Major Cold
07-29-2011, 08:11 AM
I can't believe this thread is not buried by now. It is going to be a long offseason.