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Hicks
07-08-2011, 10:13 AM
So says Mike Wells on Twitter.



The Pacers are in the process of hiring former Portland GM Kevin Pritchard, according to multiple sources.




Its unclear what Pritchard's role will be w the Pacers but he'll work under President Larry Bird and GM David Morway, according to sources


This is just weird to me. So he's beneath both Bird and Morway, but this (you would think) creates the potential for a 3-headed monster. Also, I would think this is a step towards Bird exiting, but I thought a guy like Pritchard would only want to be head duck wherever he went? He's going to stick around and be Morway's GM if David becomes president? Really?

BPump33
07-08-2011, 10:14 AM
stevekylerNBA

According to Pacer sources... Larry Bird's role will decrease this year and Pritchard and Morway will handle all aspects of operations

pacer4ever
07-08-2011, 10:14 AM
I was trying to post a thread it wouldn't let me

but im happy

Pacers24Colts12
07-08-2011, 10:14 AM
Good deal. Now if Larry decides to leave, we have a GM in waiting.

Swish
07-08-2011, 10:15 AM
Don't we already HAVE a GM?

pacer4ever
07-08-2011, 10:16 AM
Don't we already HAVE a GM?

Come on, now he is working under Morway it is great to have more eyes and ears working with Bird and Morway

MyFavMartin
07-08-2011, 10:17 AM
Larry's paving his way to working on his golf game and fishing.

Oh wait, this is Indiana: fishin'.

BPump33
07-08-2011, 10:17 AM
This is definitely confusing. I assumed Larry was getting out soon, but what does this mean for Morway?

pacer4ever
07-08-2011, 10:18 AM
This is definitely confusing. I assumed Larry was getting out soon, but what does this mean for Morway?

he is staying i would think

BPump33
07-08-2011, 10:18 AM
he is staying

I know, I can read. I mean in the future. They are both going to want to be top dog.

Hicks
07-08-2011, 10:19 AM
stevekylerNBA

According to Pacer sources... Larry Bird's role will decrease this year and Pritchard and Morway will handle all aspects of operations

Wow, so Bird's finally actually reduced to being "Boomer for adults".

Well, that should make Bird "haters" happy, I guess.

So it's going to be a two-headed monster of Morway and Pritchard.

I dunno, guys, I don't have a good feeling about this. Morway alone, fine, I guess. Pritchard, ditto. I have some concerns with both individually. But together? Doesn't this just seem like a bad idea if there's even a half-way decent chance of them butting heads over a disagreement?

On paper, this seems like a great group to have running your favorite team, but I'm worried about the pieces fitting together.

pacer4ever
07-08-2011, 10:19 AM
I know, I can read. I mean in the future. They are both going to want to be top dog.

he will be either GM or head of BBall

Hicks
07-08-2011, 10:22 AM
All of this change. Just imagine what it would be like without the lockout right now, too. I think today would normally be the first day free agents can sign with somebody.... Le sigh.

Brad8888
07-08-2011, 10:23 AM
For me, this indicates that Bird is taking the next step and getting ready to put his ownership group together to buy the Pacers from Simon.

ensergio
07-08-2011, 10:23 AM
I like it. Is Kevin Pritchard. Four years ago, he was the hottest name in the NBA.

microwave_oven
07-08-2011, 10:25 AM
It gives us another person to call teams for trades. He also has relationships with other GM's, which is a good thing. As long as there is a clear role for each (Prichard knows he will be under Morway) then this shouldn't be a problem.

The problem with having Bird come in with Walsh (two-headed monster) was that there wasn't a clearly defined role for either. That's why it didn't work out.

I see this as a very good thing.

Hicks
07-08-2011, 10:26 AM
I like it. Is Kevin Pritchard. Four years ago, he was the hottest name in the NBA.

Which is why I'm somewhat excited.

However,

1) Same guy was fired a year ago.

2) Same guy known for being a egotistic jerk.

pacer4ever
07-08-2011, 10:28 AM
Which is why I'm somewhat excited.

However,

1) Same guy was fired a year ago.

2) Same guy known for being a egotistic jerk.

which is irrelevant if you are good at your job. just win baby winning cures all

Hicks
07-08-2011, 10:30 AM
which is irrelevant if you are good at your job. just win baby winning cures all

It is absolutely relevant. If you want to make a trade, you're making a phone call to another human being. Pissing them off isn't going to help with that. I thought I even recall him taunting people on the phone. Hopefully it was more of a playful thing that's been misrepresented. If not, however, .... :uhoh:

Hicks
07-08-2011, 10:30 AM
Also, he won't have Paul Allen's money to toss around here, either.

Hicks
07-08-2011, 10:31 AM
As my stream of consciousness continues: He also is the guy who picked Oden over Durant, and re-signed Brandon Roy's knees. And thought Travis Outlaw was the bee's knees.

Day-V
07-08-2011, 10:32 AM
2) Same guy known for being a egotistic jerk.

Could say the same thing about the guy who fired him.


EDIT: Just read this article the other day about him and his deal with Portland. Check it. (http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/06/pritchard-talks-paul-allen-choosing-oden-over-durant/)

pacer4ever
07-08-2011, 10:32 AM
As my stream of consciousness continues: He also is the guy who picked Oden over Durant, and re-signed Brandon Roy's knees.

and knew Brandon Roy had a knee issue

http://www.oregonlive.com/blazers/index.ssf/2010/11/blazers_president_larry_miller_1/3450/comments-2.html

Durant should have been the pick i mean it wasn't consensus for Oden i though they were gonna take Durant pre draft but they didnt . But if Oden was healthy i don't know how big the difference would be.

BRushWithDeath
07-08-2011, 10:34 AM
This has been in the works for sometime. From January:


I can say with a decent amount of certainty that Pritchard will have a role with the organization next year.

What that means for Bird or Morway I do not know.

But knowing quite a bit about KP, my guess is that his ego wouldn't do well working for or with Bird/Morway.

http://www.pacersdigest.com/showthread.php?p=1148083#post1148083

BPump33
07-08-2011, 10:35 AM
This has been in the works for sometime. From January:

As soon as I read the Wells tweet I remembered you posting this.

Ozwalt72
07-08-2011, 10:36 AM
For me, this indicates that Bird is taking the next step and getting ready to put his ownership group together to buy the Pacers from Simon.

That's possible. And that would make me very happy.


Come on, now he is working under Morway it is great to have more eyes and ears working with Bird and Morway

For sure.



I dunno, guys, I don't have a good feeling about this. Morway alone, fine, I guess. Pritchard, ditto. I have some concerns with both individually. But together? Doesn't this just seem like a bad idea if there's even a half-way decent chance of them butting heads over a disagreement?


Well, Morway's mainly a cap and salary guy, Contract negotiations, how do we make this trade work? He does have input on personnel, but you gotta think Larry's top dog in that regard.

Pritchard probably steps in to Larry's role (even if title, chain of command is different). Evaluating talent, in the league and in the draft, and making trades.

Remember, Pritchard worked with the Pacers a bit unofficially last year. There's probably a pretty good idea on whether he meshes with Morway.

Brad8888
07-08-2011, 10:37 AM
This has been in the works for sometime. From January:



http://www.pacersdigest.com/showthread.php?p=1148083#post1148083

Would he work for Bird if Bird is getting an ownership group together to buy the franchise?

BRushWithDeath
07-08-2011, 10:40 AM
Would he work for Bird if Bird is getting an ownership group together to buy the franchise?

I don't know why not.

But I don't have any knowledge of anything like that being on the horizon.

BPump33
07-08-2011, 10:41 AM
I don't know why not.

But I don't have any knowledge of anything like that being on the horizon.

Is it your understanding that Pritchard will take over as President of Basketball Ops (or whatever title) and Morway will be the GM?

If Larry does step away as Kyler suggested, I just want to know who will have final say in the front office. I don't mean Simon, either.

Hicks
07-08-2011, 10:43 AM
Could say the same thing about the guy who fired him.


EDIT: Just read this article the other day about him and his deal with Portland. Check it. (http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/06/pritchard-talks-paul-allen-choosing-oden-over-durant/)

I'll check that out in a second; thanks.

I've heard that the guy who fired him has a bad reputation, too, now that he's fired that other guy who just joined up with the Bobcats.

That makes me feel better, but I thought I read that Pritchard was known for busting people's balls on the phone (GMs/Presidents of other franchises).

wintermute
07-08-2011, 10:45 AM
Pritchard is one of the top advanced stat guys around.

Does this mean we're moving from an era where Bird is the top talent evaluator, to one where we are more stats-based?

It's intriguing anyway.

Heisenberg
07-08-2011, 10:47 AM
I don't know why some people are confused. It's always been my understanding that Morway's a numbers guy, contracts and business side stuff, and Larry handles the talent. Just replace Larry with Pritchard.

Unclebuck
07-08-2011, 10:48 AM
as the second post in this thread mentiones, obviously Bird is stepping back is how i would phrase it

BPump33
07-08-2011, 10:49 AM
I don't know why some people are confused. It's always been my understanding that Morway's a numbers guy, contracts and business side stuff, and Larry handles the talent. Just replace Larry with Pritchard.

I agree with you, but Wells said Pritchard would work under Bird AND Morway. That could just mean for this "season" I suppose. I thought if we brought him in, it would be to take over for Larry and be above Morway.

troyc11a
07-08-2011, 10:50 AM
and knew Brandon Roy had a knee issue

http://www.oregonlive.com/blazers/index.ssf/2010/11/blazers_president_larry_miller_1/3450/comments-2.html

Durant should have been the pick i mean it wasn't consensus for Oden i though they were gonna take Durant pre draft but they didnt . But if Oden was healthy i don't know how big the difference would be.

I understand hanging the Roy issue on him. But to blame him for the Oden pick is not fair. There is not a GM in the league that would have taken Durant over Oden. Oden was looked at as a franchise saving Center while Durant had potential. Nobody saw Durant blowing up like he did. Nobody!

Pacerized
07-08-2011, 10:50 AM
I'm happy to have Pritchard and his talent join the staff but I hope Bird continues to call the shots. Pritchard was agressive as a GM and I like that but I like Bird's patience to ensure we don't waste our hard earned cap space. I really hope Bird sticks around for several more years and this isn't a quick way out for him.

Unclebuck
07-08-2011, 10:51 AM
As my stream of consciousness continues: He also is the guy who picked Oden over Durant, and re-signed Brandon Roy's knees. And thought Travis Outlaw was the bee's knees.


I will never fault him for re-signing Roy

pacergod2
07-08-2011, 10:51 AM
I think as BRush said he was hired in January. Larry and Herb have been pretty proactive in making changes to the franchise. I think it absolutely has to be that Morway moves up to President and Pritchard comes in as GM the following year. This to me says that Bird will be done after this year. Also, I think it would create an ego battle if Pritchard comes in immediately and becomes president. Plus, I think Pirtchard wants to work, which gives him a good young team to take over. He really did well putting talent together in Portland, but I can guarantee that he will be a bit more prudent here with Larry, Herb, and Morway already here.

edit: Wow there were a lot of posts since I started typing. A lot of my points were already said.

Hicks
07-08-2011, 10:51 AM
This is also the guy who was around for this embarrassment, too:

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-milespritchard011709

Adrian Wojnarowski
Yahoo!Sports


The bully-boy bluff ends now because the Portland Trail Blazers always were without the guts to file a lawsuit over Darius Miles. Their threatening email had been a desperate final act of a franchise awash in arrogance. Blazers officials hoped the threat of Paul Allen’s riches could scare the NBA. Mostly, it made everyone laugh.

For whatever hollow intimidation they used to try to stop the signing of Miles, Blazers officials understood this: They were the last people who would’ve wanted to go under oath about the behind-the-scenes machinations of Miles’ injury retirement. Only the Blazers would’ve been on trial. Only they would’ve had to answer the most uncomfortable of questions.

From leaked drug tests and public proclamations of private medical records to trashing Miles to rival executives and daring to claim him off waivers to stash him away on the inactive list, Portland’s front office acted in bad form and bad faith. Yes, the Jail Blazers lived again.

So sure, go ahead and sue the Memphis Grizzlies for signing a player to a 10-day contract who had 13 points in a quarter on LeBron James, then 10 points and seven rebounds in 14 minutes on the Utah Jazz. Miles played his 10th game of the season on Friday night, and this saga finally is over. His $18 million goes back on Portland’s salary cap, and the Blazers deserve the return of every cap-clogging cent.

It isn’t a matter of whether Miles can play in the NBA again, but how well and how long. If he’s just a 10-day contract player, well, he’s the best of those available on the market. When his deal ends Monday, several league executives told Yahoo! Sports they’ll contact his agent about signing him.

Memphis is expected to offer Miles a second 10-day contract, but there could be better opportunities for him.

“I’m pleased with the production Darius has had, especially considering that he’s been off the court for over a year and a half,” Miles’ agent, Jeff Wechsler said by phone on Saturday. “He’s shaken the rust off, and he’s been very productive in the games that he’s played.”

The irony of it all, of course, is that Miles has turned into an improbable teacher to the Blazers, giving them some lessons on professionalism and humility. Yes, he had been immature for most of his career. He had made terrible mistakes. Only now, he has grown up. After having him with the Celtics in the preseason, the Boston Celtics’ Danny Ainge and Doc Rivers believe it. So does more and more of the league now.

Through it all, Miles never wished ill will on Portland. His comeback never has been about costing them salary-cap space on his injury retirement case. Management wanted out of his $48 million contract in Portland and found a way. All along, Miles told the Blazers he would try to play again. He honored his word.

And the better he has looked, the worse it has reflected on Portland GM Kevin Pritchard. As much as anyone, this mess has exposed him. He wanted to be the star in the good times in Portland, wanted all the bouquets and bows for his work on the job. He started to believe his own clippings, his own mythology, and he thought he could get away with anything.

From the start, Pritchard stumbled into the one rabid NBA market where a general manager can aspire to celebrity. Portland declared Pritchard the Golden Boy, the Gambler, and played songs about him on the radio. Never once did he seem embarrassed. Never did he do much but furiously feed the rush to declare him a genius.

He bragged of draining three cell-phone batteries a day. He bought high-risk stocks, and he never laid up on a par-5. He loves those little details about himself getting into the papers. True? Who knows? It sure made for a fast-rising legend, though. He wanted everyone to believe that he worked harder and longer and smarter. Maybe he thought it all portrayed a confidence, but it mostly masked an insecurity.

He had taken the San Antonio Spurs’ computer scouting programs and made them bigger and better. “Kevin’s baby,” the local paper said the Blazers called it in their offices. Rip City wanted a hero to make the Jail Blazers go away, and Pritchard indulged himself in it all.

Portland owner Paul Allen gave Pritchard the biggest stack of chips to bring to the table, and Pritchard flaunted them to everyone. He stockpiled draft choices like Reagan did nuclear warheads, buying up millions of dollars worth of picks from cash-strapped teams over the past several seasons. He never has been afraid to rub that advantage into the faces of his peers. The Blazers still haven’t been to the playoffs under him, but any opposing GM on the wrong side of a deal with Portland is considered to have been Pritch-slapped.

It’s strange, but every transaction in Portland has been treated like a validation of Pritchard’s genius. Now, his apologists are blaming Paul Allen and president Larry Miller for the Miles mess, only it doesn’t work like that. Pritchard is the face of the franchise because he made it that way.

Pritchard has mismanaged the Miles situation from the beginning. Once the league doctor agreed that Miles’ knee injury was a career-ender, Pritchard’s dubious intentions came tumbling out of him.

“Two doctors said Darius had the worst microfracture injury they had ever seen,” he publicly said. “They would never have him play basketball, and the odds of having knee replacement surgery [are] high. I hear that, and as a general manager, I didn’t want it on my conscience – that I had a kid have to go through a knee replacement surgery.

“That’s a pretty major surgery. They saw [two bones] and replace [the knee]. It’s a bad deal.”

His conscience, huh? Those were words directed at the rest of the league, trying to tell every other team that Miles was too far gone for them to consider bringing back. He must have believed people were stupid. All around the NBA, it made everyone think: Pritchard sounds scared that Miles isn’t done at all. Why else would he be trying so hard to convince everyone otherwise?

Bad enough that Pritchard spoke out of turn on a player’s medical condition and possibly violated privacy laws, but it was clear that a campaign to frighten away potential teams was under way. From there, it went underground. If the Blazers couldn’t scare people on Miles’ knee, it wasn’t long, league executives say, until Portland turned to his character.

Pritchard has a great eye for talent, but that’s just the start of constructing a contender, a champion. The greats of his profession understand the humbling nature of the job – genius today, bum tomorrow – and mostly stay in the shadows, deflecting praise on coaches and players. Once you try to make yourself the star in the good times, you’re asking for trouble when they go bad. So now, his hubris has been Pritch-slapped into silence, and maybe in the long run, it’s the best thing that could’ve happened to the Blazers. Maybe they needed this sobering reminder of reality.

Portland loses cap space now, and it loses some respect. All that arrogance, all those threats and a 27-year-old that Kevin Pritchard and his posse had dismissed as character-free, as the last holdout of the Jail Blazers, taught them a lesson.

Yes, the Jail Blazers made a comeback this season.

Only this time, they wore suits.

Hicks
07-08-2011, 10:53 AM
This was the article written prior to his firing last year:

Adrian Wojnarowski
Yahoo!Sports

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-trailblazers032210



As executives of Vulcan Inc. discussed the pros and cons of firing Portland Trail Blazers general manager Kevin Pritchard last summer, the discussion found its way to this conclusion: Pritchard had proven to be a solid senior-level scout, but largely incapable of running the organization.

Vulcan, the Blazers’ parent company, had watched Pritchard embark upon several selfish and destructive bents, and strong sentiment existed to fire him. Owner Paul Allen and the Vulcan executives no longer trusted him to put the franchise before his own ambitions. The list of transgressions that troubled Vulcan always came back to similar themes: Pritchard’s thirst for public adulation, money and power.

Inside and outside the organization, Pritchard harped on how much more Portland coach Nate McMillan made than him. He complained to friends, rivals and relative acquaintances, and that played an immense part in the gulf that exists between the front office and coach.

When negotiations became contentious with star Brandon Roy(notes), Pritchard didn’t stand firm with the limits of ownership’s offer. What’s more, Pritchard tried to cozy up to Roy by selling the notion that it was the two of them together trying to get the contracts they deserved from owner Paul Allen. For the unparalleled resources Allen has provided Pritchard to remake the roster – millions in dollars to purchase draft picks, packaging them in trades or stockpiling prospects overseas – Vulcan was beyond irate that Pritchard still couldn’t present a united front when Allen decided to make a financial stand.

It reeked of Pritchard’s desperation and immaturity, and eventually inspired team president Larry Miller to usurp Pritchard in the talks for Roy’s eventual five-year, $82 million deal. Pritchard would go around the NBA, and surprise peers with questions that included, “How much do you make?” before launching into diatribes about how he couldn’t understand why he was so poorly compensated in Portland, especially in comparison to McMillan.

Allen and Vulcan ultimately decided to strip some power and autonomy from Pritchard, but decided to keep trotting him out to the things he most loved: news conferences and public appearances.

“They left him the public face, but essentially he was neutered,” a league source with direct knowledge of the talks said.

Privately, Vulcan executives wish they had gone further and fired him, sources say. That now appears to be a matter of time, especially with the way Pritchard’s agent, Warren LeGarie, has publicly gone ballistic on the Blazers organization. After Miller pushed to fire assistant GM Tom Penn after a recent nasty, personal exchange in Portland – the culmination of resentment that lingered from a contract leverage ploy with Minnesota – Pritchard finds himself isolated within the organization and devoid of allies.

Since Penn’s firing, LeGarie has encouraged Pritchard to resign, sources say. Pritchard contemplated the possibility, but has ultimately decided to go in a completely different direction. Pritchard has requested a meeting with Vulcan officials, and is expected to speak with them this week.

After several days of scorched earth by his agent, sources say Pritchard is desperate to find a way to save his job. After months of listening to LeGarie tell him he’d be in great demand on the market, Pritchard is finding that might not be the truth.

“Pritch has figured out that all those jobs that Warren promised him aren’t there,” one GM said.

Yes, Pritchard had lost his support within Vulcan, and LeGarie’s public assailing of Allen and franchise officials has only deepened the resolve within the Blazers to fire him. Miller has increased his influence on the basketball side over the past year, including taking a prominent role not only in the Roy and LaMarcus Aldridge(notes) talks, but he also has become involved in much smaller matters, like ironing out a deal for second-round draft pick Patty Mills.

In some ways, Miller, a former Nike executive, has started work on the job. Miller’s plan is to hire a GM, but still keep a strong hand in the day-to-day basketball operations.

“The transition away from this regime has already started,” one source with knowledge of ownership’s plans said.

Looking back, maybe Allen should’ve just let Pritchard leave for the Minnesota Timberwolves when he wanted to go interview with them. Pritchard wanted to talk with them, a source close to him says, but Allen refused to grant permission. Pritchard and LeGarie hatched a plan to push Penn for the job, who never seriously considered taking it. After all, the control of basketball operations in Minnesota belongs to the owner’s son-in-law, Rob Moor, who acts as team president.

Once Penn leveraged Minnesota for an offer to take back to Portland, league sources say the three of them – LeGarie, Pritchard and Penn – exaggerated the package and control offered Penn as GM. Still, Portland gave Penn a raise and a new contract. For a brief time, this thrilled Pritchard. He believed this was a way to backdoor into a new deal for himself. If Vulcan had taken care of his assistant, they would feel compelled to take care of him.

Only, Vulcan told him to get lost. Portland ownership had already spoken with Minnesota’s team president and believed it had been duped into an excessive deal for Penn. This is business as usual with LeGarie. It wouldn’t be long until LeGarie became combative with Portland ownership, and all hell broke loose in the past week when the agent went public with columnist John Canzano of The Oregonian.

Now, LeGarie has overplayed Pritchard’s hand in Portland, ripped his bosses, and here’s Pritchard’s dilemma: Does he stand strong with LeGarie on his scorched-earth policy, or dump the agent and throw himself upon Allen’s mercy?

Through it all, here was the most fatal flaw of Pritchard: He let himself be convinced that ownership would value him on par with McMillan. It isn’t the case. With Vulcan’s offices in Seattle, most executives have a long history and respect for McMillan back to his coaching and playing days with the Sonics. So far, McMillan has been unwilling to sign a contract extension past the 2011 season, but that would likely change with Pritchard out of the picture.

McMillan is a dutiful pro, never interested in intramural politics or fighting battles behind the scenes. He has been around the league a long time, and privately never believed that Pritchard’s DNA showed staying power.

“Kevin was in a constant battle to position himself to get credit away from Nate for whatever success they were eventually going to have there,” one NBA executive friendly with both said. “Nate knows enough not to flap his gums and pound his chest – especially when your team hasn’t even won a playoff series yet. He’s secure in himself, in a way that Pritchard never knew how to be.

“If Kevin just kept his mouth shut, cut out all the arrogance and insecurity, I think he probably would’ve had his extension a long time ago.”

Heisenberg
07-08-2011, 10:53 AM
I agree with you, but Wells said Pritchard would work under Bird AND Morway. That could just mean for this "season" I suppose. I thought if we brought him in, it would be to take over for Larry and be above Morway.
That's exactly the way I see it playing out. Pritchard feels out the franchise for a year, as the season goes on he has more and more input, then after the year Larry walks into the sunset and Pritchard's in charge.

PacerGuy
07-08-2011, 10:53 AM
As my stream of consciousness continues: He also is the guy who picked Oden over Durant, and re-signed Brandon Roy's knees. And thought Travis Outlaw was the bee's knees.

Oden has been derailed by injury - you can not forsee everything Greg has gone through. Yes, there were some concerns, but the doctors OK'd him, & he was thought to be a "once in a generation-type" talent ath the C position. Besides, there were some questions on Durant being a 7' SG (see J.Bender). Hindsight is awsome, but there were many more Oden supporters then Durant supporters at the time.

POR knew about the knees & P.Allen & his $ wanted Roy. KP has stated he/ the team did what he did with full knowledge of the risk.

Outlaw was solid, & they loved his blue-colar style, but they did not re-sign him for the $ NJ gave him, so seems the Nets GM is even worse.

I noticed you did not mention KP getting Roy from Min in the first place, nor trading for Aldridge w/ the bulls - NEITHER deal was a money grab, but was a talent steal @ the top of the draft! Look, EVERY GM has their duds, but KP did take POR from the "Jail-Blaxzers" to a highly respected team.

PS. Doesn't he have IN ties (Noblesville?)

Ozwalt72
07-08-2011, 10:54 AM
There is not a GM in the league that would have taken Durant over Oden. Oden was looked at as a franchise saving Center while Durant had potential. Nobody saw Durant blowing up like he did. Nobody!

Wrong?

It was a pretty heated debate on whether to go Oden or Durant. You don't have that kind of debate over the top 2 picks if one's a franchise center and the other....just some guy with potential.

pacer4ever
07-08-2011, 10:55 AM
I understand hanging the Roy issue on him. But to blame him for the Oden pick is not fair. There is not a GM in the league that would have taken Durant over Oden. Oden was looked at as a franchise saving Center while Durant had potential. Nobody saw Durant blowing up like he did. Nobody!

I disagree on Durant i mean i remember that draft and many GMs liked Durant more than Oden. I mean that may have been the last draft besides this one without a consensus #1 Oden and Durant were neck and neck. Just like Irving and Dwill were this year many GMs preferred Derrick Williams over Irving. But many GMs liked Irving due to playing pg. Same debate IMO this year Dwill might be the better player but Irving plays the position people Covet.

Unclebuck
07-08-2011, 10:56 AM
I seem to remember that it appeared that it was around 75% in favor of Oden and 25% in favor of Durrant being the number 1 pick. I stated at the time that I would have taken Durrant, but I'm always biased against taking the big guy for this very reason - injuries.

BPump33
07-08-2011, 10:57 AM
Wells is about to be on 1070 with Grady.

Heisenberg
07-08-2011, 10:58 AM
Instead of this turning into Oden v. Durant, let's talk about how Pritchard's trade happy self is going to land us Eric Gordon.

pacer4ever
07-08-2011, 11:00 AM
I will never fault him for re-signing Roy

How cant you? They said they knew he had a bum knee. Which was never gonna be the same again from what doctors said. It also caused pain every time he jumps and lands on his knees.

Ozwalt72
07-08-2011, 11:02 AM
How cant you they said they knew he had a bum knee.

I think his point is that Roy's talent was worth the risk.

I think, though, that Paul Allen's buddies have that franchise in as big a mess as I've seen. Cho, Pritchard....was either guy really the problem there?

Heisenberg
07-08-2011, 11:02 AM
Oh, and Pritchard, you trade Paul George then I'm gonna....send you a really, really nasty email. Lotta f-bombs.

Unclebuck
07-08-2011, 11:02 AM
How cant you? They said they knew he had a bum knee. Which was never gonna be the same again from what doctors said.


Roy is the franchise. it would have been like the pacers not re-signing Reggie back in 1999. Unless the injury is such that it is a 100% sure thing that the player is done, you re-sign him.

Trader Joe
07-08-2011, 11:03 AM
Should be interesting, that's about all we know for certain. Pritchard will keep it interesting.

Ozwalt72
07-08-2011, 11:04 AM
Also, I don't see Pritchard being nearly as trade happy with us as he was with Portland. He doesn't have the money to make those type of risks and buy all sorts of picks anymore.

And I don't see anything guaranteeing Pritch is gonna be "the guy" after Bird retires. So even if he found a way to go all trade crazy, there's gonna be someone over him saying, "Nah, dude."

pacer4ever
07-08-2011, 11:05 AM
Roy is the franchise. it would have been like the pacers not re-signing Reggie back in 1999. Unless the injury is such that it is a 100% sure thing that the player is done, you re-sign him.



The Trail Blazers were aware that Brandon Roy had bad knees when they drafted him in 2006, and they knew he had no meniscus left in either knee when they gave him a five-year, $82 million maximum contract last summer, team president Larry Miller said on Thursday.

Roy, 26, is sitting out the second of three consecutive games tonight because of swelling and pain in his left knee. Roy revealed last week that after his 2008 surgery on his left knee, and the 2010 surgery on his right knee, he no longer had meniscus in either knee.

http://www.oregonlive.com/blazers/index.ssf/2010/11/blazers_president_larry_miller_1.html

no way in hell i would of resigned Reggie with no meniscus. I mean every time he jumps or moves his knees hurt. Just bad business. I understand how hard it would be because he is the franchise. I mean they are in a siuation that we were in with JO terrible business move Now Roy will proably be hated in Portland after his career is done for being so over paid for so long like JO. I would offer him a deal for some money but no way in hell a max level deal

Unclebuck
07-08-2011, 11:06 AM
here is a good article about the Blazers decision to re-sign Roy

http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/02/blazers-were-aware-of-roys-knee-issues-when-they-signed-him-to-a-max-contract/related/

BPump33
07-08-2011, 11:06 AM
I wonder if Pritchard will want to bring Oden in here to let him try and prove himself. Not advocating for or against it, just interesting to think about.

imawhat
07-08-2011, 11:11 AM
This article popped up a couple days ago and is now relevant to this thread.

http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/06/pritchard-talks-paul-allen-choosing-oden-over-durant/

Pritchard talks Paul Allen, choosing Oden over Durant (http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/06/pritchard-talks-paul-allen-choosing-oden-over-durant/)

Kurt Helin (http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/author/kurthelin/)
Jul 6, 2011, 3:09 PM EDT


Kevin Pritchard was the hottest general manager in the league, the guy who changed the culture in Portland from the “Jail Blazers” to a young team on the rise.
Then he got fired. Abruptly. Reportedly because owner Paul Allen and his tight circle didn’t like Prichard and the credit he was getting for turning around the team. (So, Portland hired Rich Cho, who made some smart moves but lasted one year and got fired again by Allen, leaving a lot of people around the league wondering what is going on up in the Northwest.)
Prichard went on The Game sports talk radio in Portland (http://www.750thegame.com/) recently and talked about a lot of things (via Sports Radio Interviews (http://sportsradiointerviews.com/2011/07/06/kevin-pritchard-nba-lockout-portland-trailblazers-nba-draft-greg-oden-vs-kevin-durant/)). Including what it was like to work with Paul Allen (one of the co-founders of Microsoft).

“He’s very complete in that he wants you to do the work and get to a certain place and then he’s going to challenge it…. He provided a lot of value with that and I learned a lot. He’s very demanding. Every single day, in the seven and a half years I was there, I’m not sure there were many days that we didn’t communicate at least by e-mail or by phone, but he’s very interested and I welcomed that. We had developed a great relationship the first four or five years I was there and we had an ability to talk pretty quickly and get down to the main issues, but he’s demanding and he’s tough.”
Pritchard was known as a very good drafter (he maneuvered to get Brandon Roy (http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=NBA&id=1256) and LaMarcus Aldridge (http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=NBA&id=1249) in the same draft). He also selected Greg Oden (http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=NBA&id=1357) over Kevin Durant (http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=NBA&id=1358), and he talked about that choice.

The overwhelming thing that we got from everybody we talked to was (Oden) doesn’t care if he scores or does anything, but he’s about winning. We had been really trying to change our culture for guys who really put the team first, not care about stats, and really be about winning. We thought he was the pick at the time. We did the same thing with Durant. They said he’s gonna be the best scorer in the league, he’s going to be an amazing player, and he’s gonna win. We just felt like Greg was going to be that guy that just doesn’t lose basketball games. Right before he got hurt we were talking as a management group and we were like man doesn’t it feel like this is becoming a little bit like Greg’s team because in the locker room after a loss he would get really, really upset and he demands out of his teammates probably more than any other player I’ve been around other than Larry Bird. When he lost, he let his teammates knows what they have to do the next game.
Oden’s body betrayed him, and the question is should Pritchard and the Blazers said they saw it coming. But you year a lot of revisionist history from team executives now about how they would have taken Durant — that’s crap. Almost to a man front offices at the time said they would have taken Oden.

Day-V
07-08-2011, 11:13 AM
This article popped up a couple days ago and is now relevant to this thread.

http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/06/pritchard-talks-paul-allen-choosing-oden-over-durant/

Pritchard talks Paul Allen, choosing Oden over Durant (http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/06/pritchard-talks-paul-allen-choosing-oden-over-durant/)

Kurt Helin (http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/author/kurthelin/)
Jul 6, 2011, 3:09 PM EDT


Kevin Pritchard was the hottest general manager in the league, the guy who changed the culture in Portland from the “Jail Blazers” to a young team on the rise.
Then he got fired. Abruptly. Reportedly because owner Paul Allen and his tight circle didn’t like Prichard and the credit he was getting for turning around the team. (So, Portland hired Rich Cho, who made some smart moves but lasted one year and got fired again by Allen, leaving a lot of people around the league wondering what is going on up in the Northwest.)
Prichard went on The Game sports talk radio in Portland (http://www.750thegame.com/) recently and talked about a lot of things (via Sports Radio Interviews (http://sportsradiointerviews.com/2011/07/06/kevin-pritchard-nba-lockout-portland-trailblazers-nba-draft-greg-oden-vs-kevin-durant/)). Including what it was like to work with Paul Allen (one of the co-founders of Microsoft).

“He’s very complete in that he wants you to do the work and get to a certain place and then he’s going to challenge it…. He provided a lot of value with that and I learned a lot. He’s very demanding. Every single day, in the seven and a half years I was there, I’m not sure there were many days that we didn’t communicate at least by e-mail or by phone, but he’s very interested and I welcomed that. We had developed a great relationship the first four or five years I was there and we had an ability to talk pretty quickly and get down to the main issues, but he’s demanding and he’s tough.”
Pritchard was known as a very good drafter (he maneuvered to get Brandon Roy (http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=NBA&id=1256) and LaMarcus Aldridge (http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=NBA&id=1249) in the same draft). He also selected Greg Oden (http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=NBA&id=1357) over Kevin Durant (http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=NBA&id=1358), and he talked about that choice.

The overwhelming thing that we got from everybody we talked to was (Oden) doesn’t care if he scores or does anything, but he’s about winning. We had been really trying to change our culture for guys who really put the team first, not care about stats, and really be about winning. We thought he was the pick at the time. We did the same thing with Durant. They said he’s gonna be the best scorer in the league, he’s going to be an amazing player, and he’s gonna win. We just felt like Greg was going to be that guy that just doesn’t lose basketball games. Right before he got hurt we were talking as a management group and we were like man doesn’t it feel like this is becoming a little bit like Greg’s team because in the locker room after a loss he would get really, really upset and he demands out of his teammates probably more than any other player I’ve been around other than Larry Bird. When he lost, he let his teammates knows what they have to do the next game.
Oden’s body betrayed him, and the question is should Pritchard and the Blazers said they saw it coming. But you year a lot of revisionist history from team executives now about how they would have taken Durant — that’s crap. Almost to a man front offices at the time said they would have taken Oden.



Haha, posted that on Page 1. ;)

Pacerized
07-08-2011, 11:14 AM
I wonder if Pritchard will want to bring Oden in here to let him try and prove himself. Not advocating for or against it, just interesting to think about.


I think Oden's career is over, however if the entire season is lost and the next season starts in 2012 that should answer any questions about Oden's ability to return. If he still can't play by Oct. 2012, I'd think everyone would give up on him. Of course if the season is lost it kind makes Portland's decision to give him the qualifying offer a good one. They lose nothing due to the lockout, and may still have Bird rights if Bird rights still exist.

BoomBaby33
07-08-2011, 11:15 AM
Wells just mentioned Vogel is interviewing Jim Boylen for the 3rd asst (on the grady and big joe show on 1070) That would be very good!

imawhat
07-08-2011, 11:15 AM
Haha, posted that on Page 1. ;)

Oops! I should've clicked that link.

Foul on Smits
07-08-2011, 11:21 AM
It is absolutely relevant. If you want to make a trade, you're making a phone call to another human being. Pissing them off isn't going to help with that. I thought I even recall him taunting people on the phone. Hopefully it was more of a playful thing that's been misrepresented. If not, however, .... :uhoh:

I think his work with the Jailblazers speaks for itself.

wintermute
07-08-2011, 11:24 AM
If Pritchard were given a free hand, I'd expect huge improvements in our stat-based scouting and international scouting, both of which are relatively weak areas for the Pacers IMO.

Here's some snippets from a Pritchard article from Sloan Sports Conference in 2010. It's a long, rambling article, so I won't post the whole thing. But I think it's revealing of his philosophy and methods.

http://www.blazersedge.com/2010/3/9/1363919/the-blazers-brain-trust-has-its-day



How do Blazers coaches and players incorporate the study of advanced statistics on a daily basis? You might remember Nate McMillan told me that advanced statistics are something that he has access to but that he prefers breaking down video tape. When asked whether he used stats to guide offseason personnel moves or in-season adjustments, Pritchard leaned more heavily towards the former. But he did say, "I do believe there's huge value in applying [stats] to the coaching staff" and he spoke of "educating coaches" regarding the tendencies of their own players and opponents.

As for the players, I've mentioned this year that both Brandon Roy and Nicolas Batum seem particularly interested in the pregame scouting reports prepared for them by the team. Discussing that interest, Pritchard said that it varied from player to player but that the biggest concern is ensuring that management, coaching staff and players are all on the same page when it comes to the potential offensive and defensive adjustments that might be suggested by the numbers. "I think it's all individual dependent. Some players love as much data as they can get," Pritchard said. "The data is available, our assistant coaches know it. The biggest key going forward is making sure everyone is speaking on the same level." This thought echoed what a number of other executives and observers -- including Simmons -- mentioned throughout the day: that statistical analysis only has value if it is communicated cleanly from source to players.




Of all the panelists, Pritchard seemed to place the most value on the draft process as a way to improve his team. "The draft has been very important for us," he stated emphatically. The main reason? Rookie scale contracts. Because rookies are paid according to a specific, relatively modest scale, there is a great benefit to having a number of contributors on their rookie deals simultaneously. As I mentioned yesterday, the Blazers have 5 members of their rotation -- Cunningham, Jeff Pendergraph, Jerryd Bayless, Rudy Fernandez and Nicolas Batum -- who will combine to make less than a single veteran, Joel Przybilla, who might not actually suit up at all due to injury. The combined impact of those players, both on the court and on the books, is almost immeasurable.

It might be helpful to view players on their rookie deals as the prototypical "undervalued asset" from Michael Lewis's Moneyball. In that book, Lewis writes that 10 years ago the Major League Baseball market generally undervalued the ability to draw walks. Players that could regularly draw walks, get on base and eventually be driven in by their teammates were significantly easier and cheaper to acquire than their impact on wins and losses suggested they should be. In the current NBA market, where a team might sell off a second round draft pick and think nothing of it, that draft pick and the salary owed to it has become undervalued. If you can find a rookie who is ready to contribute immediately and is locked into a certain salary structure, his contributions per dollar spent will almost certainly exceed an average NBA veteran who requires a substantially higher salary. "Sometimes you have a great talent but it doesn't make sense with the contract," Pritchard lamented. This helps explain why the team has opted to pass on veteran acquisitions in the past and instead honed in on NBA-ready, 4-year college players such as Cunningham and Pendergraph when filling out its roster.

That search for value has guided the Blazers' recent free agency and trade moves too. Put simply, the Blazers are engaging in a form of risk assessment: The more a potential acquisition might cost, the more potential damage he can do to the team's salary cap flexibility. Mark Cuban praised the Blazers moves over the last few years, stating simply, "Who you are not picking up is as telling as who you are picking up."



As the panel began to draw to a close, Pritchard repeated two points made earlier in the day by Bill Polian, the highly-respected architect and President of the Indianapolis Colts. First, that statistical analysis can be very effective in reinforcing an organizational philosophy. Polian pointed out that he might evaluate a nose tackle totally differently than the New England Patriots and that the two teams' systems were so different and complicated that trying to swap players from one team to another would be an almost meaningless exercise. "We all see certain [statistical] things that are very important to us. It may be different for Denver," Pritchard repeated. "If we're about A, B,C, D and E [statistically] and those things trickle down to what we do [on the court as a team and off the court as an organization], that helps us have the best data. It doesn't mean that's the best data for Denver too. It just means that data is best for us."

Second, that statistical analysis cannot guarantee victories but it can go a long way to establishing a winning organization. Polian stated the best talent evaluators in the NFL really only succeed about 55% of the time despite all of the elaborate measurement techniques they use. Pritchard stated that he believed the success rate was similar in the NBA and that building a team built for long-term success versus building a title team was comparable to playing the stock market. "It's sort of like the S&P 500. You can beat the S&P 500 every year but if you're trying to be #1 in our sport, you have to take huge risks."

BRushWithDeath
07-08-2011, 11:26 AM
I think his work with the Jailblazers speaks for itself.


He took a team full of criminals and miscreants and brought them back to being a playoff team but not a true contender.

Or exactly the spot the Pacers are in right now only without a player nearly as good as Aldridge or a healthy Roy.

Hicks
07-08-2011, 11:28 AM
Nobody saw Durant blowing up like he did. Nobody!

Of course people did.

Hicks
07-08-2011, 11:29 AM
I will never fault him for re-signing Roy

He knew he had a bad knee (the one that's already ended his time as a star player), and he not only offered Roy more money than the owners told him to, he's alleged to have been coercing WITH Roy so that they both might get lucrative new contracts at the time (Pritchard was fishing for an extension of his own).

Heisenberg
07-08-2011, 11:32 AM
I have no idea what really happened with Pritchard in Portland but after them dumping Cho for no reason and a lot of stuff you hear their fans say about their ownership group on BlazersEdge I take any rumors outta Portland with a pretty big grain of salt.

Hicks
07-08-2011, 11:32 AM
I think his point is that Roy's talent was worth the risk.

I think, though, that Paul Allen's buddies have that franchise in as big a mess as I've seen. Cho, Pritchard....was either guy really the problem there?

It's a risk when you think there's a chance his knee is done. It's just dumb when you KNOW his knee is done.

imawhat
07-08-2011, 11:32 AM
That concerns me a bit. He let personal dissatisfaction get in the way of his professionalism.

Paul Allen is more spendy than Simon.

BPump33
07-08-2011, 11:32 AM
Wells made it pretty clear that for this season Pritchard would be working under Bird and Morway, but the question all season will be what happens in the chain of command once Larry officially leaves.

Hicks
07-08-2011, 11:33 AM
Roy is the franchise. it would have been like the pacers not re-signing Reggie back in 1999. Unless the injury is such that it is a 100% sure thing that the player is done, you re-sign him.

And from everything I've come across on it, this is as close to 100% as you can get short of his leg falling off.

pacer4ever
07-08-2011, 11:34 AM
Of course people did.

I mean he was arguably the #1 prospect that year 6'11 and could score at will in college and had a freakish standing reach and wingspan like a center.(i mean that is as rare as a 7fter like greg. I mean i assume Portland thought Durant and Oden would be superstars.

Smits Happens
07-08-2011, 11:35 AM
He took a team full of criminals and miscreants and brought them back to being a playoff team but not a true contender.

Or exactly the spot the Pacers are in right now only without a player nearly as good as Aldridge or a healthy Roy.

You know, if Oden and Roy were healthy, I actually that's a team that could have been a contender.

Hicks
07-08-2011, 11:37 AM
I think his work with the Jailblazers speaks for itself.


I hope you and everyone else realizes that I'm not trying to be balanced right now when it comes to Pritchard: I'm just trying to analyze his cons.

Yes, he has his positives; no doubt about it.

Hicks
07-08-2011, 11:38 AM
If Pritchard were given a free hand, I'd expect huge improvements in our stat-based scouting and international scouting, both of which are relatively weak areas for the Pacers IMO.

But I thought we'd already hired (I don't know his name) one of the top advanced stat guys out there already; a couple of years ago, I think?

BPump33
07-08-2011, 11:38 AM
http://eye-on-basketball.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/22748484/30520342

Posted by Matt Moore

Kevin Pritchard has surprisingly been out of pro basketball for a bit. The assistant GM and later General Manager of the Blazers' resurgence was known for his uncanny ability to create beneficial trades that netted good young asset after good young asset for Portland. He was fired in 2010 for, well, whatever it is Paul Allen fires people for (also known as the Cho Effect). Perhaps his most notable mistake was drafting Greg Oden over Kevin Durant, which wouldn't have been so bad were the Basketball Gods not have it in for Oden. Or at least his knees.

Pritchard didn't pop up in a new position right away, fueling talk that it was his stubborn approach and "arrogant" attitude as several Portland reports suggested that talked his way out of a job. But it would appear that his time in purgatory has come to an end. Mike Wells of the Indianapolis Star reports that the Pacers are "in the process of hiring" Pritchard to work with President of Basektball Operations Larry Bird and General Manager David Morway.

Pritchard has worked with the Pacers in the past, including in the past year. He's very tight with that organization so this isn't really a shock. It's conceivable that with Larry Bird very much on the fence about his future past this season, that Pritchard could be being put in line to take the reins once Bird retires. Morway would head to the President of Basketball Operations position and Pritchard would then handle GM duties.

It gives the Pacers a more forward-thinking element in the front-office compared to Bird's very old school approach. And having someone who can handle the media without looking like he wants to stab all of them can't hurt either. The Pacers in the past 30 days have hired the coach that helped get them to the playoffs and about as impressive a five-game series loss to the top overall seed as you can find, the former assistant coach under Phil Jackson in L.A., and Pritchard. The infrastructure is there. The talent core is there (even if a star is still missing). Now they just need a season to test the new engine.

Ozwalt72
07-08-2011, 11:40 AM
But I thought we'd already hired (I don't know his name) one of the top advanced stat guys out there already; a couple of years ago, I think?

And Pritchard isn't the guy to do the math behind the statistics. He's the guy that uses those statistics.

Heisenberg
07-08-2011, 11:41 AM
Seriously guys, screw this lockout. I'm pretty damn excited, whole new era on the horizon.

Young
07-08-2011, 11:42 AM
I am excited that the Pacers have been able to recruit some quality people in Brian Shaw and Kevin Pritchard. Brian Shaw could easily be a head coach and KP has proven himself worthy to be a general manager. This says a lot about this organization.

I feel great about a lot of the players the Pacers have. I really believe this team is close to being one of the best teams in the league. When the Pacers were one of the best teams in the league they had depth and that is what they need again.

A lot of good pieces are in place. Most are still on their rookie contracts. The difficult part will be keeping everyone together. The new CBA might make it impossible for the Pacers to keep some of the guys.

KP got things done while he was in Portland. Overall I think he did a good job. It is easy to say what he should have done after the fact but I think most GMs would have done the same things as KP as far as draft Oden and re-sign Roy.

I have some concerns with how everyone will work together but I do trust Larry's judgment. Most coaches usually improve from each job to the next and I hope that KP does the same moving from one front office to another.

Ozwalt72
07-08-2011, 11:42 AM
It's a risk when you think there's a chance his knee is done. It's just dumb when you KNOW his knee is done.

Did they? They knew this player was done, yet gave him a massive contract? I can't believe that.

wintermute
07-08-2011, 11:43 AM
But I thought we'd already hired (I don't know his name) one of the top advanced stat guys out there already; a couple of years ago, I think?

That was Kevin Pelton, who did some consulting for us.

I think it's different though when it's a key member of the front office who's a stat guy. Like Morey in Houston. Or Cuban driving advanced stats in Dallas. Not the same sort of emphasis that a part-time consultant can give you.

Unclebuck
07-08-2011, 11:43 AM
And from everything I've come across on it, this is as close to 100% as you can get short of his leg falling off.


maybe now, but they re-signed him two years ago. Sure they new he had knee problems, but it doesn't seem to me that they knew the extent of the knee problems two years ago

They did not know two years ago that his knee was done

http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/02/blazers-were-aware-of-roys-knee-issues-when-they-signed-him-to-a-max-contract/related/


Pritchard told listeners (http://twitter.com/#!/JohnCanzanoBFT/status/86944110308622336) that the Blazers were aware of Roy’s knee issues (read: meniscus=over, long-term implications= very yes) prior to the signing and elected to grant Roy the extension anyway.

The decision seems curious at this point, because Roy has missed so much time and had surgery on his knees now, and there have been questions about whether Roy will still be able to play even five years down the line. But if we back up to 2009, it seems less crazy. Roy had just come off his best season in 2008-2009, and looked every bit the franchise star.

Pritchard said part of the decision to re-sign Roy was based off of his free-agent eligibility the following year. If Roy had stayed healthy in 09-10, he would have garnered a longer-term contract for the max, so in reality, the Blazers were getting a deal there. Second, Pritchard revealed that the portion of Roy’s contract that isn’t guaranteed was used to purchase a secondary insurance option, which covers Roy in entirety. As such, that mitigates the financial impact of having to pay Roy that contract, though the money counts against the cap all the same.

BRushWithDeath
07-08-2011, 11:46 AM
You know, if Oden and Roy were healthy, I actually that's a team that could have been a contender.

I agree.

Ozwalt72
07-08-2011, 11:46 AM
My guess is that while the long term medical outlook on Roy was bad, they had information saying that he could play at his All Star level for at least over half the contract. Or maybe they were looking ahead to the amnesty clause in the next CBA to potentially be able to knock him off the cap. It definitely won't hurt Paul Allen any.

Hicks
07-08-2011, 11:47 AM
Did they? They knew this player was done, yet gave him a massive contract? I can't believe that.

I think the information that tells me he was done was known, but I don't think they wanted to believe it. Roy was so important to them.

imawhat
07-08-2011, 11:47 AM
We've had more exciting changes and progress in the past four months than the past three seasons combined.

BPump33
07-08-2011, 11:48 AM
WojYahooNBA

As @MikeWellsNBA reports, Pacers hiring ex-Portland GM Kevin Pritchard in front office. He'll be Dir. of Player Personnel, sources say.

WojYahooNBA

Pritchard will work under President Larry Bird and GM David Morway. Pritchard and Bird go back to the Boston Celtics together.

Unclebuck
07-08-2011, 11:48 AM
I think the information that tells me he was done was known, but I don't think they wanted to believe it. Roy was so important to them.


Read the articlew I just posted a few posts back. They didn't know two years ago that his knees were done, he was coming off his best season

imawhat
07-08-2011, 11:53 AM
Read the articlew I just posted a few posts back. They didn't know two years ago that his knees were done, he was coming off his best season


Even if Pritchard knew, these are the risks you take if you're Portland, or Indiana, or Minnesota. You're not luring in big free agents, so the only way you build into contention is through the draft and trades. And if you're in Portland's position, you're not building anything through the draft.

The potential loss of Roy to free agency might be the bigger risk to the franchise than the potential loss of Roy to injuries.

Dr. Hibbert
07-08-2011, 11:55 AM
Pacers definitely serious about building on their recent foundation, assembling a championship contending squad within the next three or four years. If Larry's original three year plan was to make the playoffs again, Larry's/Pritchard's next three year plan should be building a legitimate contender.

wintermute
07-08-2011, 11:55 AM
I am excited that the Pacers have been able to recruit some quality people in Brian Shaw and Kevin Pritchard. Brian Shaw could easily be a head coach and KP has proven himself worthy to be a general manager. This says a lot about this organization.



I agree. Not too long ago, the Pacers were mired in mediocrity. And before that, we were the Jail Pacers!

Now, it seems like we've turned the corner and are attracting quality front office and coaching talent. Could quality players be next? Exciting to think about.

BPump33
07-08-2011, 11:56 AM
WojYahooNBA

Pacers have an excellent scouting staff, and that's a strength of Pritchard's. Will be interesting to see if, at all, chemistry is affected.

WojYahooNBA

Pritchard's now in enviornment where owner isn't going to buy a draft pick for $3M every time you want to move up. This is the real world.

Hicks
07-08-2011, 11:56 AM
WojYahooNBA

As @MikeWellsNBA reports, Pacers hiring ex-Portland GM Kevin Pritchard in front office. He'll be Dir. of Player Personnel, sources say.

WojYahooNBA

Pritchard will work under President Larry Bird and GM David Morway. Pritchard and Bird go back to the Boston Celtics together.

More from WojYahooNBA:


Pacers have an excellent scouting staff, and that's a strength of Pritchard's. Will be interesting to see if, at all, chemistry is affected.

Well, if Pritchard's heading up our scouting department, that's a great place to use him, I think.

pacer4ever
07-08-2011, 11:57 AM
Read the articlew I just posted a few posts back. They didn't know two years ago that his knees were done, he was coming off his best season


The Trail Blazers were aware that Brandon Roy had bad knees when they drafted him in 2006, and they knew he had no meniscus left in either knee when they gave him a five-year, $82 million maximum contract last summer, team president Larry Miller said on Thursday.

Roy, 26, is sitting out the second of three consecutive games tonight because of swelling and pain in his left knee. Roy revealed last week that after his 2008 surgery on his left knee, and the 2010 surgery on his right knee, he no longer had meniscus in either knee.

http://www.oregonlive.com/blazers/in..._miller_1.html

no way in hell i would of resigned Reggie with no meniscus. I mean every time he jumps or moves his knees hurt. Just bad business. I understand how hard it would be because he is the franchise. I mean they are in a situation that we were in with JO terrible business move Now Roy will probably be hated in Portland after his career is done for being so over paid for so long like JO. I would offer him a deal for some money like MLE money but no way in hell a max level deal
__________________



That is a terrible move by Pritchard that makes me :puke: if i am a Blazer fan!!!!!!

docpaul
07-08-2011, 12:01 PM
This is very exciting indeed. The fact that we're attracting this level of leadership talent is a very, very good sign indeed.

Neither Bird nor Morway are data guys. This is where basketball is headed, and so having him behind the scenes is fantastic, IMO.

Take a look at this post:

http://www.pacersdigest.com/showthread.php?p=1201676&



FWIW, I talked with someone pretty high in the organization recently, and when asked directly, they had the following opinions:

1) It's clear that Morway would like to continue working for the Pacers, but it's almost certain that he will not be retained after this year

2) The chances of Pritchard coming in as GM are "50:50"

3) Bird continues to keep his cards close to his chest as to whether he'll come back or not, and most people in administration don't know one way or the other

4) If we make the playoffs this year, there's a "strong chance" that Vogel will be retained, especially in a lockout constrained circumstance.

5) The Collison trade was almost 100% Morway's doing. Bird said he liked Collison, Morway took care of the rest. In fact, this is typically how trades go down. Bird states the talent that would help rebuild the team, and Morway finds a way to make it work.

Was neat to get into some of these specifics. Remember, this is an opinion from someone in the org, not fact.


Looks as if most all of this is coming to fruition.

BPump33
07-08-2011, 12:03 PM
WojYahooNBA

Huge time for Pacers. Strong young roster. Great pickup in George Hill. Salary cap space. They have a real chance to make a move in East.

Man, I love reading stuff like this.

graphic-er
07-08-2011, 12:04 PM
I knew this would happen, seem all too easy for them to just say Pritchard was just scouting for them on that West Coast road trip. Who does that? And why would it even be reported? And why haven't we heard about similar things in past years.

I'm a happy Pacer fan now. He is a really good GM and he is gonna help turn all that cap space into some really creative trades for a good PF.

Since86
07-08-2011, 12:11 PM
http://www.oregonlive.com/blazers/in..._miller_1.html

no way in hell i would of resigned Reggie with no meniscus

Reggie? No, but then again we're talking about Reggie in the 90s and if you even tore your ACL it was a pretty devestating injury that might even end your career.

But this is the 2000's and meniscus replacement surgery is pretty common, and isn't that big of a deal.

They can give you two completely brand new (to you atleast) menisci if you injury both beyond repair.

The damage he's done to his knees are fixable, but he continues to inflict more damage, which IMO means it's more of a mechanics issue more than merely his body breaking down for some reason.

These aren't cut and dry scenarios. They're fixable, but sometimes it just doesn't work out.

Say Portland went the other way, and let Roy walk. What would have happened if he would have stayed healthy?

Obviously Portland thought the reward was bigger than the risk. But let's not act like he's had a career ending injury and Portland was just too dumb to acknowledge it.

pacer4ever
07-08-2011, 12:13 PM
UB this is what a no meniscus does.......

but having no meniscus means that he has nothing to absorb any shock to the knee,

so best case scenario is he can play part time at 80% IMO


really you cant put your team in cap hell like that. I don't care if it was Jordan with the Bull who had the same problem. This is a move that potentially ruined the Blazers championship hopes. You just cant give him a big contact that is one of the worst contracts of all time. Because the BLAZERS KNEW WHAT THEY WERE GETTING INTO. Whats the point of having a team doctor if your just gonna ignore him?

BPump33
07-08-2011, 12:15 PM
MikeWellsNBA

Pritchard is one of the people Jim Morris called about when looking at potential replacements for Bird a few months ago.

notque
07-08-2011, 12:16 PM
Thanks guys, every time I get excited for good news, PD is there to let me know why it's actually terrible news.

:buddies:

ECKrueger
07-08-2011, 12:24 PM
oh Paul haha


Who that? RT @RonMo30: Pritchard is a nice addition for the pacers

Brad8888
07-08-2011, 12:33 PM
Looks like these things are what Bird and Simon were talking about when he went to LA to meet him. He must have wanted to know if Simon would be willing to spend the rest of the money it would take to get a coaching staff and front office, not just if he would be willing to spend the cap space in the face of continuing losses so the team could become elite.

The more I read from what else is being posted with respect to articles about Pritchard, the less I like how he does what he does, (almost seems like Kelvin Sampson somehow) and the more desperate the hire seems. That said, with Pritchard having the green ties to Bird from the past, the hire totally fits how Bird has done pretty much everything throughout his tenure here.

I guess we will have to see how Pritchard and the coaching staff are able to handle the high level of expectations that will be present when they are finally able to legally take action after the lockout to make the final push for elite talent.

Ozwalt72
07-08-2011, 12:34 PM
oh Paul haha

I'm not sure Paul should really care about who the director of player personnel is.

BPump33
07-08-2011, 12:35 PM
MikeWellsNBA

Pritchard's contract is for 1 year and he's being brought in to help scout and in free agency since the Pacers will be under the salary cap.


I think this is very interesting.

Ozwalt72
07-08-2011, 12:36 PM
MikeWellsNBA

Pritchard's contract is for 1 year and he's being brought in to help scout and in free agency since the Pacers will be under the salary cap.


______________


Very interesting.

Almost a working audition for Larry's spot.

CableKC
07-08-2011, 12:38 PM
WojYahooNBA

Huge time for Pacers. Strong young roster. Great pickup in George Hill. Salary cap space. They have a real chance to make a move in East.

Man, I love reading stuff like this.
Yeah...no kidding.....we're finally pumped and excited for a season now that there is going to be some major changes to the Organization and now we have no clue when that season will start. :banghead:

Just more proof that the Basketball gods hate Pacers Fans. :suicide4:

McKeyFan
07-08-2011, 12:39 PM
What did Pritchard do with the Celtics?

BPump33
07-08-2011, 12:40 PM
What did Pritchard do with the Celtics?

Played there with Bird.

BPump33
07-08-2011, 12:40 PM
WojYahooNBA

As for Pritchard, he deserves this chance and those who know him well say he's been truly humbled in past year. He will help Indiana.

Ozwalt72
07-08-2011, 12:40 PM
What did Pritchard do with the Celtics?

Played for a year or two.

Edit: Correction, 11 games.

PR07
07-08-2011, 12:41 PM
I don't have a problem with the move. Pritchard is one of the better GM's in the NBA (his track record proves that), and I look at it as having another voice or opinion, and not necessarily another decision maker.

Since86
07-08-2011, 12:42 PM
In continuing along the lines of my previous post.

Considering that Portland has since offered Oden, what, 9mil next season when he's played in all of 40 games for his entire career, I think we can conclude that Paul Allen is the one behind the financial decisions, and not Pritchard.

Brandon Roy's injury is a toss-up, really. It could have went either way.

Oden getting that offer shows that Allen is willing to pay out a little for the risk, seeing as how Pritchard wasn't involved in that decision.

But please, carry on.

CooperManning
07-08-2011, 12:42 PM
What did Pritchard do with the Celtics?

Played 11 games at backup PG.

PR07
07-08-2011, 12:45 PM
Honestly, I think 85% of the GM's would've taken Oden.

Didn't Bird try to trade up in the draft to take Brandon Roy dangling Harrington and our pick?

Really?
07-08-2011, 12:49 PM
All I have to say is E X C I T E D for next season... and beyond

Hicks
07-08-2011, 12:59 PM
WojYahooNBA

As for Pritchard, he deserves this chance and those who know him well say he's been truly humbled in past year. He will help Indiana.

I really, really hope this is true.

Sandman21
07-08-2011, 01:02 PM
Cmon now! All this good stuff happening to us all of a sudden, and theres a freaking lockout!

STERRRRRRRNNNNNNNN!

Taterhead
07-08-2011, 01:06 PM
This off season has been absolutely great for us. I wanted Adelman too, but other than missing out on him it's been much better than I expected. And we ain't even started the fun part yet.

Shaw is a great hire. He is gonna be a great voice in the locker room. Looking at him, I see a very good head coach someday. So to have him as a lead assistant is quite a coup. He is as good as we could ask for in that position.

And Boylen is too. He has a ton of experience and has worked under some great head coaches in the league. The Lakers were supposed to hire him around the end of June. I'm not sure what happened with all that but he is an elite defensive coach, no question. He is a little bit of a character too, he even has his own "best of" youtube video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HS_IQ3dGxA4

In watching the video you can see why Boylen didn't work out with Utah. He is obviously not good with the media and doesn't strike me as a great recruiter. However, this guy will make Danny Granger play defense, I promise you. And he will be great for Roy Hibbert too. I think our defensive potential goes through the roof with this guy on the staff.

Pritchard is also as good a GM as there is available, and his track record supports that statement. People questioning the decision to take Oden over Durant are just practicing revisionist history. It wasn't even a question at the time. Everybody would of taken the guy they were calling the next Bill Russell. Durant was looked at as a project. There were questions over what position he would play. Durant has been better than expected and Oden has been hurt constantly, it's not fair to blame Pritchard for that. I believe that if Oden and Roy hadn't been hurt over the last few years it very well could've been Portland beating Miami last year. Outside of the injuries, that team has been built masterfully and Pritchard was a big reason for it.

Sparhawk
07-08-2011, 01:06 PM
Great hire to me.

Justin Tyme
07-08-2011, 01:08 PM
After reading 116 posts, the one thing that jumped out at me is the part about how KP likes players on rookie contracts. If he has any imput into trades, I could see more youth in the future.

AND hopefully he can find Rush a new home! Along with Posey. Maybe turn them into some picks. :)

Justin Tyme
07-08-2011, 01:12 PM
However, this guy will make Danny Granger play defense, I promise you. And he will be great for Roy Hibbert too. I think our defensive potential goes through the roof with this guy on the staff.


This is far more exciting to me than the Kevin Pritchard news!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

adamscb
07-08-2011, 01:13 PM
so the way i see it, next season the transition of power will begin from bird to pritchard, while morway will remain as the "numbers guy". that's pretty exciting news, i dont care if he re-signed brandon roy or drafted oden over durant, no GM's record is spotless.

Hibbert
07-08-2011, 01:14 PM
He also turned Tyrus Thomas and Viktor Khryapa into LeMarcus Aldridge. And also turned Darrell Arthur and Joey Dorsey into Nicholas Batum. This guy is crazy smart and Im glad we got him on our side. He was rumored to be taking over Donnie Walsh in NY. Looks like we are just grooming Pritchard to take over as the team's president of basketball operations in the future with Bird leaving soon. Great pickup! Btw......every other GM on that draft night would of taken Oden over Durant.

docpaul
07-08-2011, 01:23 PM
Pahahaha... Taterhead's video rocks.

I'm going to LOVE this guy. Perfect.

BringJackBack
07-08-2011, 01:25 PM
I am very supportive of this hire. I like it.

DGPR
07-08-2011, 01:26 PM
I remember watching the 2007 draft and everybody just drooling over Oden. One of the analysts actually said Oden will win more championships than Durant, but Durant will win more scoring titles.

LetsTalkPacers
07-08-2011, 01:27 PM
Yeah...no kidding.....we're finally pumped and excited for a season now that there is going to be some major changes to the Organization and now we have no clue when that season will start. :banghead:

Just more proof that the Basketball gods hate Pacers Fans. :suicide4:
I think David Stern setup this entire lockout thing just to screw with the Pacers. He knew we would be turning the corner strong, and wanted to nip it in the bud.

Speed
07-08-2011, 01:27 PM
Pritchard is relentless in pursuing trades, to the point it can be annoying, uber agressive, though. Perfect guy to beat every bush when you have all the components to make serious hay on the trade market. Great pick up, especially on a 1 year deal, if he hasn't been "humbled" you've lost almost nothing.

LetsTalkPacers
07-08-2011, 01:28 PM
All these hires like Shaw, Pritchard, Vogel are exciting and all. But I want to know the answer to my most concerning question this offseason....

Who will replace Stacey Paetz?

Hibbert
07-08-2011, 01:31 PM
Do you also remember how the Blazers wound up with Brandon Roy? By trading Randy Foye and cash to the T-Wolves for him. Not too bad.....

Ozwalt72
07-08-2011, 01:31 PM
nip it in the butt.

http://public.wsu.edu/~brians/errors/nip.html

Major Cold
07-08-2011, 01:32 PM
All these hires like Shaw, Pritchard, Vogel are exciting and all. But I want to know the answer to my most concerning question this offseason....

Who will replace Stacey Paetz?


I hope you are kidding...Seriously I hope so...Cause with the Paetz love around here I have a hard time deciphering your tone through text-base communication.

Major Cold
07-08-2011, 01:33 PM
Do you also remember how the Blazers wound up with Brandon Roy? By trading Randy Foye and cash to the T-Wolves for him. Not too bad.....


I also like how they got Aldridge for Tyrus Thomas and Selfolosha. Great trade.

LetsTalkPacers
07-08-2011, 01:36 PM
I hope you are kidding...Seriously I hope so...Cause with the Paetz love around here I have a hard time deciphering your tone through text-base communication.
Why wouldnt I be serious? Does it really matter what coaches, FO, players you have. If you dont have a good sideline reporter than all is lost. Hiring a replacement for this position is key in the Pacers success.

LetsTalkPacers
07-08-2011, 01:36 PM
http://public.wsu.edu/~brians/errors/nip.html (http://public.wsu.edu/%7Ebrians/errors/nip.html)
just for you

xBulletproof
07-08-2011, 01:39 PM
Thank you Hicks for saving me from having to do all the realistic expectations thing on Pritchard. I'm not ecstatic about the hire, but there are many worse options to be had. If he replaces Bird I will be okay with that. I will just hope that the Oden and in particular Brandon Roy decisions are on Paul Allen. Which is entirely possible, I will concede.

I hope Simon is willing to buy a couple of picks late in the first round. Even if Paul Allen bought them, Pritchard nailed the choices.

Speed
07-08-2011, 01:45 PM
Bottom line, Pritchard is really good at what they are asking him to do for the Pacers, thats a win.

We'll see what happens after this year, but for now, nice job!

Major Cold
07-08-2011, 01:50 PM
just for you
I laughing on the inside I promise

vnzla81
07-08-2011, 02:04 PM
Cool, I like it :D


Edit: let's hope he is the one with the phone at the trade deadline.

CableKC
07-08-2011, 02:12 PM
Pahahaha... Taterhead's video rocks.

I'm going to LOVE this guy. Perfect.
Really?

After seeing that video...my first inclination is to make sure that the Pacers hires a guy that has the sole job of making sure that no Reporter's Microphone ends up in front of Boylen's face before, during or after a game.

CableKC
07-08-2011, 02:14 PM
Do you also remember how the Blazers wound up with Brandon Roy? By trading Randy Foye and cash to the T-Wolves for him. Not too bad.....
It helps to be in the right place at the right time...or more specifically...it helps that there are stupid Organizations out there that make stupid moves.

makaveli
07-08-2011, 02:17 PM
At the very least it (should) set up a smoother transition for when Bird leaves. Nothing worse than finally starting to turn the corner and then a new guy with a completely new philosophy comes in and knocks you back 5 years.

90'sNBARocked
07-08-2011, 02:20 PM
It means Bird is groming his replacement

Plain and simple

Also IMHO a FANTASTIC move

Pacers lookign really really sharp so far

stupid freakin lockout. Can't we just lock Billy Hunter and David Stern in a room and feed them nothing but beans, lock the door and say "we will unlock the door, once a deal is in place"

Ozwalt72
07-08-2011, 02:25 PM
stupid freakin lockout. Can't we just lock Billy Hunter and David Stern in a room and feed them nothing but beans, lock the door and say "we will unlock the door, once a deal is in place"

Put a shank in middle of the room and just see what happens.

Unclebuck
07-08-2011, 02:58 PM
Anyone else hear Mike Wells talk about Lance and how he went a couple of months not taling to anyone - teammates....Clark Kellogg.....

MnvrChvy
07-08-2011, 03:01 PM
http://public.wsu.edu/~brians/errors/nip.html

Bookmarked! I'm gonna waste way too much time in this book!

ilive4sports
07-08-2011, 03:23 PM
Anyone else hear Mike Wells talk about Lance and how he went a couple of months not taling to anyone - teammates....Clark Kellogg.....

When did this happen?

Unclebuck
07-08-2011, 03:29 PM
When did this happen?


he said it on the Micahel grady Show this morning.

Oh wait you probably want to know when didn't Lance speak to anyone, this past season, not sure exactly when. I was listening at work, so it was difficult to hear every single word, that is why I want to know if anyone else heard Wells

BPump33
07-08-2011, 03:35 PM
he said it on the Micahel grady Show this morning.

Oh wait you probably want to know when didn't Lance speak to anyone, this past season, not sure exactly when. I was listening at work, so it was difficult to hear every single word, that is why I want to know if anyone else heard Wells

Yeah, he basically said he ignored the media unless Kellogg was around. This summer he (Lance) has been approaching people and seems to be much more confident in himself.

He approached us at the softball game. He seemed happy and in a great mood.

Kegboy
07-08-2011, 03:37 PM
:dance::pepper::carrot::mango::pineapple:cucumber: :apple::dorange:

:thisisfun:
:thisisfun:
:thisisfun:
:thisisfun:
:thisisfun:

BPump33
07-08-2011, 03:51 PM
Pritchard hired by Pacers, but still available

Posted on: July 8, 2011 3:47 pm
Score: 194
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In a savvy move to bolster their basketball operations staff, the Pacers have reached a deal with former Trail Blazers general manager Kevin Pritchard to be their director of player personnel, sources familiar with the hire confirmed to CBSSports.com.

Pritchard, fired hours before the 2010 draft, will report to general manager David Morway, sources said, under a unique at-will arrangement that both sides can end at any time. Pritchard will be paid about $200,000 annually under the deal.

Pritchard will begin evaluating the roster and preparing for potential trades and the pursuit of free agents in advance of the eventual end of the lockout. With team president Larry Bird undecided about his long-term future, Pritchard's role could expand. But he also would be available to be considered for more permanent and higher-profile GM jobs as they become available.

One team thought to be a sensible landing spot for Pritchard was the Knicks, who elevated Glen Grunwald to the interim general manager position after team president Donnie Walsh stepped down last month. The arrangement comes with the understanding that Grunwald's contract will be extended for the 2011-12 season -- whenever that may be. Members of the coaching staff and some key members of the front office, such as vice president of basketball operations Jamie Mathews, director of pro scouting John Gabriel, director of pro player personnel Mark Warkentien, and regional scout Mark Hughes, also are expected to be retained for next season.

Coach Mike D'Antoni is entering the final year of his contract, and no indications have been given as to whether Madison Square Garden chairman James Dolan intends to offer him an extension.

Grunwald, 53, is a respected, behind-the-scenes executive who received a strong recommendation from Walsh. If the Knicks ultimately look outside the organization to bolster the front office, among those they are expected to consider are former Hornets GM Jeff Bower and Pritchard.

Pritchard, who was briefly a teammate of Bird's with the Celtics in the early '90s, goes home to the Pacers -- up the road from his Bloomington, Ind., birthplace -- at an exciting time for the organization. Indiana acquired guard George Hill from the Spurs on draft night, and the Pacers have a talented, young roster built around Danny Granger, Darren Collison and Roy Hibbert with only $37 million in committed salary for next season.

It was never clear why Pritchard, the driving force behind the Blazers' current run of success, was fired in the first place. His replacement, former Thunder executive Rich Cho, also has since been fired and landed on his feet with the Bobcats.

http://ken-berger.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/11838893/30522747


This is a very interesting arrangement.

pizza guy
07-08-2011, 04:15 PM
This is a very interesting arrangement.

Very innnnteresting indeed.

I like the move because it's more guys in our front office who have quality track records. The arrangement is a little weird, but whatever works I guess.

Gamble1
07-08-2011, 04:29 PM
Very innnnteresting indeed.

I like the move because it's more guys in our front office who have quality track records. The arrangement is a little weird, but whatever works I guess.
Aren't most deals like this anyway. IF you find something better you move on to a higher position. We pretty much gave up our rights that other teams had to get permission to talk to him and thats pretty much it.

Gamble1
07-08-2011, 04:42 PM
A devils advocate post on Realgm.


Jason Stern
2007
* took Greg Oden over everyone
* took Rudy when Aaron Brooks, Aaron Affalo, and Tiago Splitter were available
* took Petteri Koponen when Carl Landry & Glen Davis were available
* took Josh McRoberts when Marc Gasol and Aaron Gray were available
* took Taurean Green when Ramon Sessions was available
* traded Zach Randolph (future all-star) for Stevie Francis (bought out) and Channing Frye (later left via free agency)
* waived Darius Miles prematurely


2008
* traded Jarrett Jack, Brandon Rush, and Josh McRoberts to move up 2 places in the draft and for Ike Diagu
* took Jerryd Bayless when Jason Thompson, Brandon Rush, Anthony Randolph, Robin Lopez, Marreese Speights, Roy Hibbert, JaVale McGee, J.J. Hickson, Ryan Anderson, Courtney Lee, & Serge Ibaka were available
* traded away a chance to draft Omer Asik, Luc Mbah a Moute. and Goran Dragic
* extended Martel Webster while missing the entire season
* named Tom Penn vice president of basketball operations
* had his cap space plan collapse after Darius Miles successfully played in a dozen or so games


2009
* offered Hedo Turkoglu $50 million, 5 year contract
* gave Brandon Roy a max contract knowing the condition of his knees; publicly bad-mouthed ownership/upper management when upper management demanded a team option on the last year of his contract
* took Victor Claver when Omri Casspi, Rodrigue Beaubois, Taj Gibson, & Toney Douglas were available
* took Pendergraph and Cunningham when Sam Young, Dujaun Blair, Marcus Thornton, & Chase Budinger were available
* was involved in a power struggle where he lied to upper management in an attempt to have Tom Penn promoted


2010
* drafted Luke Babbitt over Eric Bledsoe and Kevin Seraphin
* drafted Elliot Williams over Landry Fields and Lazar Hayward
* fired

tikitomoka
07-08-2011, 04:51 PM
Yeah, he basically said he ignored the media unless Kellogg was around. This summer he (Lance) has been approaching people and seems to be much more confident in himself.

He approached us at the softball game. He seemed happy and in a great mood.
he really is a nice kid, just immature. i've never had a bad experience with him in the 8-10 times i've met him. even a couple weeks ago when i talked to him at the pro-am he seemed excited about the hill trade (in fact, he said he loved it), the new season, and finding his role on the team. he's one of those guys who you can't judge based on what you've heard from reporters.

naptownmenace
07-08-2011, 05:22 PM
Wrong?

It was a pretty heated debate on whether to go Oden or Durant. You don't have that kind of debate over the top 2 picks if one's a franchise center and the other....just some guy with potential.

I remember getting into an argument with my brother-in-law after the draft when I said that Kevin Durant should've been selected number 1. He's a big Ohio State fan though so there was no way he was going to believe that Kevin Durant would be better than Oden for Portland.

Those articles Hicks posted about KP were very interesting. I had no idea that much drama was swirling in Portland. When he got fired I was surprised and thought they made a major mistake. Maybe they did but after seeing their side of the argument I can understand why they parted ways. It sounded like a bad situation on both sides of the relationship.

SMosley21
07-08-2011, 05:38 PM
maybe now, but they re-signed him two years ago. Sure they new he had knee problems, but it doesn't seem to me that they knew the extent of the knee problems two years ago

They did not know two years ago that his knee was done

http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/02/blazers-were-aware-of-roys-knee-issues-when-they-signed-him-to-a-max-contract/related/


Pritchard told listeners (http://twitter.com/#!/JohnCanzanoBFT/status/86944110308622336) that the Blazers were aware of Roy’s knee issues (read: meniscus=over, long-term implications= very yes) prior to the signing and elected to grant Roy the extension anyway.

The decision seems curious at this point, because Roy has missed so much time and had surgery on his knees now, and there have been questions about whether Roy will still be able to play even five years down the line. But if we back up to 2009, it seems less crazy. Roy had just come off his best season in 2008-2009, and looked every bit the franchise star.

Pritchard said part of the decision to re-sign Roy was based off of his free-agent eligibility the following year. If Roy had stayed healthy in 09-10, he would have garnered a longer-term contract for the max, so in reality, the Blazers were getting a deal there. Second, Pritchard revealed that the portion of Roy’s contract that isn’t guaranteed was used to purchase a secondary insurance option, which covers Roy in entirety. As such, that mitigates the financial impact of having to pay Roy that contract, though the money counts against the cap all the same.

I say this in every thread where Roy or Pritch are brought up. Roy had just had a nearly MVP caliber season. They had no reason to believe that his knee was going to give him such severe problems right away. Hindsight is 20/20 people. Stop trying to act like they had some knowledge that Roy was going to deteriorate so fast.

idioteque
07-08-2011, 05:42 PM
I absolutely hate it when any GM is criticized for missing on a second round player that turned out to be a gem. If anything, EVERY GM should be criticized for "missing" on a guy like that so what's the point? Makes no sense.

CableKC
07-08-2011, 05:51 PM
If Pritchard were given a free hand, I'd expect huge improvements in our stat-based scouting and international scouting, both of which are relatively weak areas for the Pacers IMO.

Here's some snippets from a Pritchard article from Sloan Sports Conference in 2010. It's a long, rambling article, so I won't post the whole thing. But I think it's revealing of his philosophy and methods.

http://www.blazersedge.com/2010/3/9/1363919/the-blazers-brain-trust-has-its-day
After reading that, I really get the sense that KP is the type of FO guy that tries to make the most out of the $$$ that he has to spend.....whether it be towards spending $$$ to get an additional Draft Pick for a rookie that he recognizes can contribute ( given a short period of time ) over paying more for a vet that could contribute at the same level or even applying this towards spending $$$ on Free Agents. I don't get the sense that he will overpay for a Player unless he thinks that they are worth it in the long run. To me, he's the type to recognize and pursue high-value-type Players ( as long as they are within his price range ). For example, I would think that he'd consider the Bulls signing of Boozer a mistake given the level of production he provides vs. the impact of his hefty Contract on the Salary Cap. Boozer is solid...but he's not worth the $$$ spent to get him.

NOTE - The only move that I can see that would blow this theory out of the water is the decision to extend Brandon Roy given his knee problems. But I can see this as a mistake that is more of an anamoly as opposed to something that he does all the time.

To me, this is a good thing that can only help us in the long run.

Gamble1
07-08-2011, 06:07 PM
After reading that, I really get the sense that KP is the type of FO guy that tries to make the most out of the $$$ that he has to spend.....whether it be towards spending $$$ to get an additional Draft Pick for a rookie that he recognizes can contribute ( given a short period of time ) over paying more for a vet that could contribute at the same level or even applying this towards spending $$$ on Free Agents. I don't get the sense that he will overpay for a Player unless he thinks that they are worth it in the long run. To me, he's the type to recognize and pursue high-value-type Players ( as long as they are within his price range ). For example, I would think that he'd consider the Bulls signing of Boozer a mistake given the level of production he provides vs. the impact of his hefty Contract on the Salary Cap. Boozer is solid...but he's not worth the $$$ spent to get him.

NOTE - The only move that I can see that would blow this theory out of the water is the decision to extend Brandon Roy given his knee problems. But I can see this as a mistake that is more of an anamoly as opposed to something that he does all the time.

To me, this is a good thing that can only help us in the long run.
Well didn't he try to give Hedo 10mill/year contract. Thats over spending IMO.

Edit: He also signed 32/33 year old Andre Miller to a 3 year deal 7mill per.

Ozwalt72
07-08-2011, 06:25 PM
Edit: He also signed 32/33 year old Andre Miller to a 3 year deal 7mill per.

Of which the last year is unguarantee'd right? And still, for Miller that's a pretty solid price.

McKeyFan
07-08-2011, 06:26 PM
I wonder if Pritchard's advice was a part of the George Hill acquisition?

vnzla81
07-08-2011, 06:31 PM
I like how people complaint that Kevin signed Roy to too much money and knew that he has some knee issue but doesn't say anything about Danny receiving all that money and he is a guy who dropped all the way down to 17th because of knee issues and has missed few games because of it, we just got lucky that Danny's knee problem is not as bad as Roy's.

vnzla81
07-08-2011, 06:32 PM
Well didn't he try to give Hedo 10mill/year contract. Thats over spending IMO.

Edit: He also signed 32/33 year old Andre Miller to a 3 year deal 7mill per.

Not a bad deal for either player, Hedo was considered a pretty good player and Andre at 7mil is not that bad either.

daschysta
07-08-2011, 06:33 PM
Not even close to the same thing. Danny had proven his college knee issues were behind him, missing a game here and there is NOT the same thing as having a missing meniscus.

Plus danny doesn't make anywhere near max money, and probably could have gotten more, coming off of a 25.8 5 3 1+ 1+ season.

CableKC
07-08-2011, 06:34 PM
Well didn't he try to give Hedo 10mill/year contract. Thats over spending IMO.

Edit: He also signed 32/33 year old Andre Miller to a 3 year deal 7mill per.
Can't argue with the Hedo offer.....that was just a bad mistake.

As for Dre Miller....despite his age...he still put up solid #s as a Starting PG averaging 14ppg/5.4apg (2009-2010) and 12ppg/7apg (2010-2011) while missing only 1 game over the last 2 seasons. As Oswalt72 suggested...not bad if you ask me.

vnzla81
07-08-2011, 06:41 PM
Not even close to the same thing. Danny had proven his college knee issues were behind him, missing a game here and there is NOT the same thing as having a missing meniscus.

Plus danny doesn't make anywhere near max money, and probably could have gotten more, coming off of a 25.8 5 3 1+ 1+ season.

His knee issues are not behind him, he had the same issue two years ago during the season and could not practice for team USA because of it.

daschysta
07-08-2011, 06:44 PM
His knee issues are not behind him, he had the same issue two years ago during the season and could not practice for team USA because of it.

The severity isn't nearly the same. He has sat out minimal amounts of time, progressed as a player every single year, and sitting out practices of an optional game during the offseason are different situations.

Portland KNEW that this could happen to roy and payed him anyway, way different situation. Sure they probably thought that he wouldnt decline this fast, or that surgery would fix ti, but it's stilla far, far, bigger risk than we've ever taken with danny.

vnzla81
07-08-2011, 06:53 PM
The severity isn't nearly the same. He has sat out minimal amounts of time, progressed as a player every single year, and sitting out practices of an optional game during the offseason are different situations.

Portland KNEW that this could happen to roy and payed him anyway, way different situation. Sure they probably thought that he wouldnt decline this fast, or that surgery would fix ti, but it's stilla far, far, bigger risk than we've ever taken with danny.

Nobody is saying that his injury is the same as Roy's, what I am trying to say is that the risk has huge for 16 teams before the Pacers not to take him, here is an article from few years ago talking about his injury.


Apparently, the knee has been bothering him for a while, bad enough to cause him to miss workouts during the summer. He also says he’s been icing the knee during timeouts as of late. This might explain why his shooting has been off for quite a few games now.


http://pacejmiller.wordpress.com/2009/01/30/holy-crap-its-danny-grangers-knee/

Shade
07-08-2011, 07:09 PM
I can't believe neither grace nor Kegboy have commented on this yet... :lurk:

Strummer
07-08-2011, 07:20 PM
It feels like everyone is getting a little too excited about this. A one year deal that either side can cancel at any time?

That doesn't sound like he's in the long term plans. More likely he knew he couldn't get a GM job during the lockout. So he's found a place to try and stay relevant.

It'll be interesting to see how this plays out.

xBulletproof
07-08-2011, 07:26 PM
Nobody is saying that his injury is the same as Roy's, what I am trying to say is that the risk has huge for 16 teams before the Pacers not to take him, here is an article from few years ago talking about his injury.

84 million and the worse injury, or a rookie contract with a lesser injury?

The risk involved in these 2 decisions don't even go anywhere near the same category.

vnzla81
07-08-2011, 07:32 PM
84 million and the worse injury, or a rookie contract with a lesser injury?

The risk involved in these 2 decisions don't even go anywhere near the same category.

84mil for a guy who was one of the top 5 players in the NBA and not only that but almost an MVP? that was a non brainer, rookie contract with lesser injury? I don't get it :confused:

xBulletproof
07-08-2011, 07:47 PM
84mil for a guy who was one of the top 5 players in the NBA and not only that but almost an MVP? that was a non brainer, rookie contract with lesser injury? I don't get it :confused:

Top 5 is an obvious stretch. At no point has he been that. He didn't 'almost' win MVP either. He had 7 points in voting. Lebron won with over 1100 points. Dwight Howard was 5th with over 300 points. Roy had .... 7.

More to the point however Roy had multiple knee surguries as a pro BEFORE the extension. Including one to remove part of his cartilage. Don't tell me it was a no brainer and there was no signs it would be a problem soon, because there were.

ilive4sports
07-08-2011, 08:02 PM
I can't believe neither grace nor Kegboy have commented on this yet... :lurk:

Did you miss the first post on page 7?


EDIT: I knew that was going to happen. Originally said "this page" instead of page 7 and then this post became the first post on the new page....

Kegboy
07-08-2011, 08:21 PM
Did you miss the first post on page 7?


EDIT: I knew that was going to happen. Originally said "this page" instead of page 7 and then this post became the first post on the new page....

Eh, they say admins can't Ignore people, but I always knew I posted one skinny joke too many. Shade's had me ignored for at least 4 years now, and since no one quoted me, he was none the wiser.

Sandman21
07-08-2011, 08:22 PM
* traded Zach Randolph (future all-star) for Stevie Francis (bought out) and Channing Frye (later left via free agency)
So Pritchard moving a guy who clearly had become toxic and a poster child for the Jail Blazer era should be held against him?

QuickRelease
07-08-2011, 08:40 PM
After reading 116 posts, the one thing that jumped out at me is the part about how KP likes players on rookie contracts. If he has any imput into trades, I could see more youth in the future.

AND hopefully he can find Rush a new home! Along with Posey. Maybe turn them into some picks. :)
Any chance Boylen utilizes Rush to his strengths? I think he still can be a valuable player. I just don't think he's been maximized for effectiveness.

Strummer
07-08-2011, 09:19 PM
Video interview with Morway about Pritchard hiring.
http://www.nba.com/pacers/pacers_hired_kevin_pritchard_2011_07_08.html

Shade
07-08-2011, 09:22 PM
Did you miss the first post on page 7?


EDIT: I knew that was going to happen. Originally said "this page" instead of page 7 and then this post became the first post on the new page....

Oops...I just thought my vision was broken or something. :disturbed

Shade
07-08-2011, 09:23 PM
Eh, they say admins can't Ignore people, but I always knew I posted one skinny joke too many. Shade's had me ignored for at least 4 years now, and since no one quoted me, he was none the wiser.

Whoa...where did you come from?! :eek:

:devil:

BPump33
07-08-2011, 09:43 PM
Any chance Boylen utilizes Rush to his strengths? I think he still can be a valuable player. I just don't think he's been maximized for effectiveness.

I was thinking that maybe Shaw could finally light the fire for Rush, you know...if there's anything to light. Boylen could sure as hell motivate me, I know that.

Hicks
07-08-2011, 10:09 PM
Eh, they say admins can't Ignore people, but I always knew I posted one skinny joke too many. Shade's had me ignored for at least 4 years now, and since no one quoted me, he was none the wiser.

Oh, we can ignore you. You just can't ignore us. :devil:

imawhat
07-08-2011, 10:10 PM
Morway's phone was ringing in that interview. I wonder which GM was ready to trade one of their stars to us.

Lance George
07-08-2011, 10:26 PM
Can anyone present any evidence that it was known that Roy's knee injury would be a career-killer prior to his contract signing?

There was some concern, obviously. That's not the question. I wanna see evidence that anyone─doctors, GMs, analysts, fans, etc.─thought it was a bad move at the time because Roy's injury would inevitably doom his career, sooner rather than later.

I'm not buying it.

PacersPride
07-09-2011, 12:21 AM
This has been in the works for sometime. From January:



http://www.pacersdigest.com/showthread.php?p=1148083#post1148083

congrats. u still stand by the signature too not play Foster one more minute.

i about fell off my chair when i read that comment last season.

PacersPride
07-09-2011, 12:22 AM
if there were one guy i wanted replace Bird it was Pritchard. sucks too know Legend is moving on. Hope he does become owner for the Indiana Pacers.

I welcome Pritchard to the FO, another solid move by Legend.

AesopRockOn
07-09-2011, 02:18 AM
:thisisfun:
:thisisfun:
:thisisfun:
:thisisfun:
:thisisfun:

http://www.thecampussocialite.com/wp-content/uploads/rebecca-black-friday.png

Isaac
07-09-2011, 03:14 AM
Any chance Boylen utilizes Rush to his strengths? I think he still can be a valuable player. I just don't think he's been maximized for effectiveness.

I like the idea of giving Rush a full season with Vogel and the new staff. There is definitely untapped potential better than anything we could get back based on his trade value right now. Its a low risk move to keep him on the team, if it doesn't work out it doesn't really matter cuz we're not getting anything worthwhile for him in a trade this offseason.

A.B.Hollywood
07-09-2011, 03:17 AM
More to the point however Roy had multiple knee surguries as a pro BEFORE the extension. Including one to remove part of his cartilage. Don't tell me it was a no brainer and there was no signs it would be a problem soon, because there were.

I think KP also thought this wasn't a no-brainer. If you recall he took his sweet time to give this extension and took a LOT of heat for delaying it. People were constantly jumping on him for not doing this the first day he could. The rumor was that Paul Allen pushed this on KP. Here is a small excerpt on some of this from rotoworld.com:


Former general manager of the Blazers Kevin Pritchard said on Friday that the team was aware of Brandon Roy's knee issues when they signed him to a five-year, max contract extension worth $80 million prior to the 2009-10 season.
Pritchard was hesitant to sign Roy and that created a ton of negative press for him, and now we know why, in what sounds like a veiled shot at the team that fired him. Roy's knee has rendered him a longshot to start or play a full slate of games this year, and aside from one unlikely showing in the playoffs, his knee has reduced him to a shadow of his former self. Jul 1, 8:46 PM

http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nba/1256/brandon-roy

A.B.Hollywood
07-09-2011, 03:20 AM
Also anyone want to take a gander as to what would have happened in the OJ Mayo failed deal this past break if KP was running the show?

I obviously can't prove anything here but lets just call it an educated hunch that KP pulls this off.

Sandman21
07-09-2011, 03:45 AM
How? NO and/or Memphis screwed that up. It's not like Pritchard can slap someone through the phone into making a deal. (At least I don't think he can).

A.B.Hollywood
07-09-2011, 04:13 AM
How? NO and/or Memphis screwed that up. It's not like Pritchard can slap someone through the phone into making a deal. (At least I don't think he can).

There are plenty of reports that it was us that messed it up. But I can't help but think our chances would have gone up is all. Unless you are of the belief that this was completely out of our hands (which I am not).

CooperManning
07-09-2011, 04:43 AM
There are plenty of reports that it was us that messed it up. But I can't help but think our chances would have gone up is all. Unless you are of the belief that this was completely out of our hands (which I am not).

However it happened, I'm happy it did. Would rather have George Hill.

pacer4ever
07-09-2011, 04:54 AM
However it happened, I'm happy it did. Would rather have George Hill.

Mayo is a better player but Hill is a better fit with the intangibles for the team IMO.

daschysta
07-09-2011, 05:13 AM
Mayo is a better player but Hill is a better fit with the intangibles for the team IMO.

I'm not sure mayo is the better player. Hill averages around 16 ppg as a starter, and plays great defense, he's never had the green light mayo did early in his career. Since mayo has came off the bench he really hasn't played nearly as well as hill has.

pacer4ever
07-09-2011, 07:39 AM
I'm not sure mayo is the better player. Hill averages around 16 ppg as a starter, and plays great defense, he's never had the green light mayo did early in his career. Since mayo has came off the bench he really hasn't played nearly as well as hill has.

Hill aved 14ppg as a starter


Mayo aved 19ppg as a rookie and 18ppg his 2nd year. his minutes were severely reduced last year down to 26mpg(previous two years 38mpg)and he aved what Hill did who played more.

George Hill is a 10ppg scorer

while OJ is 16ppg scorer

and OJ has better per36 numbers also i think it is pretty obvious OJ is a more talented player. George Hills numbers look a lot like Rush's(which isn't bad you can never have to many defenders)

vnzla81
07-09-2011, 09:16 AM
Also anyone want to take a gander as to what would have happened in the OJ Mayo failed deal this past break if KP was running the show?

I obviously can't prove anything here but lets just call it an educated hunch that KP pulls this off.

No doubt about that, whoever signed Kevin must think the same thing because according to the article(previous post) that is going to be his job here.

wintermute
07-09-2011, 09:51 AM
and OJ has better per36 numbers also i think it is pretty obvious OJ is a more talented player. George Hills numbers look a lot like Rush's(which isn't bad you can never have to many defenders)

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=mayooj01&y1=2011&p2=hillge01&y2=2011&p3=rushbr01&y3=2011

Hill and Mayo's per game and per36 numbers look very similar to me, and a good notch above Rush's.

Mayo's rookie numbers are inflated for being one of the top options on a weak team. Check out Mayo's career usage numbers vs Hill's. As the Grizz have gotten better, Mayo's role has significantly reduced. Last season, the two played comparable roles for talented teams. Yet Mayo's usage is still higher while posting very similar numbers at lower efficiency.

Even if you don't buy this argument, Mayo's peak scoring is 17.5 ppg per36, while Hill's peak is 15.2 ppg per36. Not such a huge gap.

I think Cubits (Hill) is extremely underrated while Mayo is very much overrated.

Justin Tyme
07-09-2011, 10:13 AM
I also like how they got Aldridge for Tyrus Thomas and Selfolosha.


???

Sefalosha was drafted by Philly in 06 and then traded Stefalosha to Chicago for their 06 pick Carney. I stated then that Philly made a terrible trade. Sefalosha is a starter in OKC, and Carney lucky to be riding the bench somewhere.

Justin Tyme
07-09-2011, 10:43 AM
sucks too know Legend is moving on.


Speaking for yourself is fine, but just remember NOT everyone is a Bird FO fan. I'm just not sure Pritchard is the person to take over. That's why I like the 1 year deal. Hopefully, Pritchard can bring about some good trades for the Pacers when this lockout ever ends. Scarey thing is that Pritchard's 1 year deal could end b4 the lockout does.

Ozwalt72
07-09-2011, 10:46 AM
???

Sefalosha was drafted by Philly in 06 and then traded Stefalosha to Chicago for their 06 pick Carney. I stated then that Philly made a terrible trade. Sefalosha is a starter in OKC, and Carney lucky to be riding the bench somewhere.

What's your ???? about what Major Cold said?

Are you saying Aldridge for Tyrus Thomas and Sefalosha wasn't a win?

Because, uh, Sefalosha's not much better than Brandon Rush.

Edit: Wait, Sefalosha....it was Viktor Kryapa....

I've been messin up so damn much the last few days...'ima step away

Justin Tyme
07-09-2011, 11:16 AM
Its a low risk move to keep him on the team, if it doesn't work out it doesn't really matter cuz we're not getting anything worthwhile for him in a trade this offseason.


Seriously, how can you make that type of statement? Are you clairvoyant or have a crystal ball? If not, you have NO idea what Pritchard and Bird might be able to get in return for Rush. I understand that it is your opinion, but it's a pretty brash one. For once, I feel confident, with the addition of Pritchard, that the FO has the ability to make better trades in the future.

Justin Tyme
07-09-2011, 11:30 AM
What's your ???? about what Major Cold said?

Are you saying Aldridge for Tyrus Thomas and Sefalosha wasn't a win?

Because, uh, Sefalosha's not much better than Brandon Rush.

Edit: Wait, Sefalosha....it was Viktor Kryapa....

I've been messin up so damn much the last few days...'ima step away


Yes, I was pointing out Sefalosha wasn't part of the Aldridge deal.

IMO, Stefalosha isn't better than Rush. I could see JH taking over the starting SG job from Sefalosha next year.

Pacerized
07-09-2011, 12:05 PM
http://www.indystar.com/article/20110709/SPORTS04/107090327/Ex-Blazers-GM-Pritchard-joins-Pacers-front-office

I like the fact that Bird makes it clear Pritchard isn't being hired to replace him.

The Pacers spent time doing research on Pritchard. He was a consultant with the Pacers last season and traveled with the team for part of its West Coast trip in January. He, coincidentally, stopped traveling with the team before its game in Portland.
Pacers Sports & Entertainment president Jim Morris made calls around the league a few months ago asking about Pritchard as a possible front office candidate.
Bird and Morway recently spent several days having candid discussions with Pritchard about the direction the team is headed and how he could be a positive addition for them.
Bird said Friday that they are not bringing Pritchard in as his future replacement.
"That's not the case at all," Bird said. "I've known Kevin for a number of years and we're in the position to improve, and his knowledge will help us."
Bird, who wanted to retire at the end of last season, is not sure how much longer he'll remain as president. He and owner Herb Simon have agreed that they'll re-evaluate things on a year-to-year basis.
Pritchard, an Indiana native, and Bird were teammates with the Boston Celtics during the 1991-92 season.
Pritchard's addition adds to the recent moves the Pacers have made as they attempt to move up the standings in the Eastern Conference. They acquired Indianapolis native George Hill from San Antonio on June 23 and named Frank Vogel as coach earlier this week. Former Lakers assistant Brian Shaw will be Vogel's associate head coach, with Dan Burke and possibly Jim Boylen rounding out Vogel's staff.

Hicks
07-09-2011, 12:14 PM
Interesting. I was assuming the opposite.

Ozwalt72
07-09-2011, 01:38 PM
IMO, Stefalosha isn't better than Rush. I could see JH taking over the starting SG job from Sefalosha next year.

Some parts of his game, he's better..but yeah Rush is the superior player. What Sefalosha is, is a solid, consistent defender, good rebounder and active if not productive on offense.

oxxo
07-09-2011, 02:24 PM
Ugh. Not too happy about the news. I know I'm in the minority but I think Pritchard is highly overhyped/overrated. For example, why does he get sole credit for all the stuff that happened while he was ASSISTANT GM? Once he was promoted to GM what was his most notable decision? To draft Oden over Durant.

Hicks
07-09-2011, 02:53 PM
I'm much happier knowing he's here to just do what he does best (and not more): Scout and identify good deals.

PacersPride
07-09-2011, 06:10 PM
For once, I feel confident, with the addition of Pritchard, that the FO has the ability to make better trades in the future.

so your basically saying the following.

1) The Pacers FO has not made good trades the last 3 years?

a. Oneal deal (woulda taken Roy Hibbert alone for JO's broken down knees, not too mention Bird saved this franchise a :censored:ton of loot.
b. Collison for Murphy (if you cannot see this was as a win.. theres no hope for you)
c. Jack, McRob, Rush for Bayless/Diagu (may have not been a great trade but I like McRob way more than Diagu, and Jack played darn well while here)
d. Hill for a draft pick

Those are some pretty solid deals.

2. The only reason you can have any confidence this FO can make better trades in the the future is because Bird has given this Franchise the ability too do so.

3. What could Pritchard have done any differently with contracts like JO, Dunleavy, Murphy, Jackhole, Tinley??? c'mon man.. look at the 2008 roster, Jesus himself could not have done much with that garbage.

Bird did one helluva job turning this roster into something worth being confident about in only 3 years. Isnt that what most GM's are given too turn a sinking franchise around?

I will never get the criticism that Legend has recieved from the Pacer fans on here over the last 3 years. Yea you can :censored: about Obrien all u want.. but who else wanted too coach here, SVG didnt and I dont think alot of other top notch coaches did either.

Isaac
07-09-2011, 06:44 PM
Seriously, how can you make that type of statement? Are you clairvoyant or have a crystal ball? If not, you have NO idea what Pritchard and Bird might be able to get in return for Rush. I understand that it is your opinion, but it's a pretty brash one. For once, I feel confident, with the addition of Pritchard, that the FO has the ability to make better trades in the future.

I have a pretty good idea what Rush's trade value is. You don't need a crystal ball to realize that Rush isn't going to fetch anything of real value. His ceiling is higher than his value right now in a trade. That's pretty straightforward, and not my opinion, but simple fact.

Bball
07-10-2011, 01:24 AM
I'm much happier knowing he's here to just do what he does best (and not more): Scout and identify good deals.

If this team is having so much trouble making ends meet how about Simon hire someone capable of doing the job that apparently it now takes 3 people to do?

Oh well... this is confusing to say the least. Hard to say if it's good or bad without seeing things in action but surely SOMEONE in the front office is now redundant or totally marginalized.... or else how does this not become the 3 headed monster?

Heisenberg
07-10-2011, 01:31 AM
Have we ever had a "Director of Player Personnel" before?

Eleazar
07-10-2011, 02:04 AM
Have we ever had a "Director of Player Personnel" before?

Mel Daniels

Heisenberg
07-10-2011, 02:29 AM
Mel Daniels
So it was always a case of de facto nepotism? I like and appreciate Mel as much as the next guy, and sure it could be just a case of naivety, but I can't really tell someone what Mel ever actually DID. Besides be buddies with Donnie anyway.

presto123
07-10-2011, 03:04 AM
I got one thing to say: YYYYYYEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!! About time. I think players will be held accountable now for their on and off court actions. I think Pritch will bring a measure of stability to the team.

Heisenberg
07-10-2011, 03:15 AM
I got one thing to say: YYYYYYEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!! About time. I think players will be held accountable now for their on and off court actions. I think Pritch will bring a measure of stability to the team.Because if there's one thing Larry never did it's holding a guy accountable off the floor...or something. And count me in the group that appreciates a coaching staff dictating who sees the floor.

presto123
07-10-2011, 03:24 AM
As much as I like Frank I don't see him being a guy ruling with an Iron fist.

Heisenberg
07-10-2011, 03:30 AM
Doesn't take an iron fist, just common sense. BRush got sat, Posey FINALLY got sat, Hans went into the starting lineup, PG went into the starting lineup, Roy stopped getting yanked for missing a defensive rotation. I like Frank, really, REALLY do, but replacing a friggin moron like JOB has made him look exponentially better than he actually is.

presto123
07-10-2011, 03:36 AM
And that was Larry that held on to that moron til the bitter end when it was obvious what had to happen. Pritch would have shipped his *** out. Like I said I see Kevin as a no nonsense guy and this franchise desperately needs one.

Heisenberg
07-10-2011, 03:49 AM
If you don't see Bird as "no nonsense" I honestly don't know what to tell you. Too loyal, too patient, unwilling to gamble (despite plenty of them), sure. But giving a guy that completely turned around the culture of this franchise, which JOB ABSOLUTELY DID, one last chance to capture the hearts and minds, I'm sorry, it's just obtuse. JIM O'BRIEN DESERVED HIS OPTION, and then he blew it.

Justin Tyme
07-10-2011, 12:48 PM
so your basically saying the following.


Did I say anything negative about those deals in my post?

What I said was "the ability to make better deals." You are saying there weren't better deals available. Basically, I'm saying the addition of Pritchard will ENHANCE the Pacers FO make deals that they might not have the expertise of being able to do.

What team did the Pacers make the deal to trade Bayless to? Who was the GM of that team? IIRC, many were upset that Bird didn't get a 2nd round pick out of that trade. Portland had the #33 & #36 picks. The Pacers could have picked up Mario Chalmers, DeAndre Jordan, or Mbah a Moute. Pritchard, as a good negoiator didn't give up those picks. With Pritchard in the Pacers FO, I can see getting better deals. He seems to have a knack for getting good deals. Thus my statement.

PacersPride
07-11-2011, 01:21 AM
Did I say anything negative about those deals in my post?



For once, I feel confident, with the addition of Pritchard, that the FO has the ability to make better trades in the future.




"For once, I feel confident" is your exact words, which imply too me you were not confident in Legends ability too make solid trades. seems pretty self explanatory what u meant. maybe u did not say anything specifically, but those were the trades that were made, soo tell me why you have zero confidence in the FO when the evidence suggest Legend does indeed make solid deals.?

as far as what else may have been on the table, who knows, but all we can go on is the deals that were made.. and i would say all 4 of those trades were solid deals.

The deal with NO's that fell through because the NBA owned hornets were nixed from making deals i do not believe falls on Legends shoulders. so in essence, 5 solid deals if that one went through, and Pacers resign McBob.

I would say its kinda obvious your not going too give Legend any credit for the strong rebuild and the current opportunity the Pacers have with all the young players and talent.

Pacers have enuff cash too bring in another superstar, my fingers are crossed its Gordon. if not, then the new CBA, may greatly impact teams and Pacers may benefit as much as anyone.

I would not mind seeing the Pacers compile draft picks in a deal or two, much like teh Cheatriots organization.

nvrthelss, i dont find much fault with Legend and what he has accomplished in 3 years with this team, and i believe it should be noted he was wise/patient enuff too let the contracts expire knowing full well a new CBA could benefit the Pacers.

not many GMs could have exhibited that kind of patience, many would be overly hasty and that could result in terrible trades. Pritchard, if Bird leaves is the guy i wanted too take over as well, but he is at the same time somewhat risky in some of the moves he makes. Im sure he will do fine b/c the position the pacers are in at this time, but had Pritchard been in charge the last 3 years, who knows.

i just cant really say the pacers would be in a much better position. Legend is still human and u cant turn water into wine... although for the most part some could say he has with the JO, & Murphy deals.

who knows, maybe if Dunleavy were not hurt midseason, another deal gets made. Dunleavy was rumored in the NO's deal before the injury.

until i hear substantial evidence otherwise, I think Bird has done one heck of a job giving this fanbase reason for hope and optimism.

i really believe we are one all-star away, too add to this core.

doesnt Bird at least get credit for bringing in Pritchard..?

presto123
07-11-2011, 01:39 AM
If you don't see Bird as "no nonsense" I honestly don't know what to tell you. Too loyal, too patient, unwilling to gamble (despite plenty of them), sure. But giving a guy that completely turned around the culture of this franchise, which JOB ABSOLUTELY DID, one last chance to capture the hearts and minds, I'm sorry, it's just obtuse. JIM O'BRIEN DESERVED HIS OPTION, and then he blew it.



C'mon dude....everybody and their mother knew what had to happen long before it did. Being too patient is nonsense. Unwilling to gamble is nonsense. With everything Lance has done to disrupt the team and locker room he is still here. I'm as big a Bird fan as there is but I can't wait for a change.

McKeyFan
07-11-2011, 07:52 AM
If you don't see Bird as "no nonsense" I honestly don't know what to tell you. Too loyal, too patient, unwilling to gamble (despite plenty of them), sure. But giving a guy that completely turned around the culture of this franchise, which JOB ABSOLUTELY DID, one last chance to capture the hearts and minds, I'm sorry, it's just obtuse. JIM O'BRIEN DESERVED HIS OPTION, and then he blew it.

Not sure how you reconcile this with post #220 (which I thanked).

Loyalty is great, but coaching a team is at least 50 percent of the equation, even if JOB did indeed change the culture successfully.

The evidence was all there when Bird extended JOB that the bball side of the equation was severely lacking. Not to fire him a year later revealed that Larry Bird has a blind spot. I don't care how many rings he has.

I've theorized for years that the "no nonsense" player Larry Bird is different from the BBall Exec Larry Bird. When it comes to relationships (Artest, JOB, etc) Bird can be a softie, and it clouds his judgement.

JB24
08-01-2011, 06:42 PM
Toronto narrowing its list of GM candidates
Don't expect any movement on the Toronto general manager's search for a couple of weeks. Team president Bryan Colangelo was in Europe last week and won't start whittling down his group of candidates until the middle of the month. Sixers GM Ed Stefanski, former Hornets GM and coach Jeff Bower and Spurs assistant GM Dennis Lindsey are among the candidates, but former Blazers general manager Kevin Pritchard is also believed to be in the hunt and is a strong candidate. Pritchard took a player personnel job with the Pacers earlier this summer, but has an out in his deal that would allow him to leave if a GM job became available.

http://www.nba.com/2011/news/features/david_aldridge/08/01/morning-tip-labor-meeting-august/index.html?ls=iref:nbahpt1

rexnom
08-01-2011, 07:44 PM
Umm...I'd rather hold on to KP.

spreedom
08-02-2011, 09:22 AM
Umm...I'd rather hold on to KP.


Well duh, but it appears that it isn't entirely up to us.

Sandman21
10-08-2011, 05:20 PM
Pritchard is staying!

AlexKennedyNBA Alex Kennedy
Ed Stefanski is expected be hired as the next general manager of the Toronto Raptors, according to league sources.
22 minutes ago

Scot Pollard
10-08-2011, 05:38 PM
Pritchard will be OUR next GM I'm sure and David Morway will be promoted to president of basketball operations. (If/when Bird leaves.)

We have a quality GM already here in Pritchard so there's no reason to go find someone else again if/when Bird goes.

rexnom
10-08-2011, 07:38 PM
Nice.

pacer4ever
10-14-2011, 04:27 PM
Pritchard is staying!

AlexKennedyNBA Alex Kennedy
Ed Stefanski is expected be hired as the next general manager of the Toronto Raptors, according to league sources.
22 minutes ago
not so fast Stefanski wont be there next GM. Kevin is still among the top candidates.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-wojnarowski_raptors_gm_search_101411

Sandman21
10-14-2011, 05:23 PM
I still think Bower is higher on their wishlist than Pritchard is if Stefanski doesn't end up getting the gig.

Sandman21
10-14-2011, 05:37 PM
In the past several days, sources said, this development has caused former New Orleans Hornets GM Jeff Bower to re-emerge at the forefront of the search. Another candidate that shouldn’t be ruled out, sources said, is Indiana Pacers executive Kevin Pritchard, former GM of the Portland Trail Blazers.

Considering that Bower left New Orleans over a year ago, I'd would think that hole has been filled, even for a team owned by the league. :D

Wasn't the new GM there the guy who claimed the player that Bower signed just before he left failed his physical even though he was fine (Luther Head I think)?

pacer4ever
10-14-2011, 05:46 PM
Considering that Bower left New Orleans over a year ago, I'd would think that hole has been filled, even for a team owned by the league. :D

Wasn't the new GM there the guy who claimed the player that Bower signed just before he left failed his physical even though he was fine (Luther Head I think)?

My bad. Why would TOR want him? That guy ruined the Hornets signing bad deal after bad deal. Posey, Ariza, Peja the list goes on and on. My buddy worked with the Hornets with that guy and got fired along with him as the video coordinator.



also if Ed left did they already have a GM in waiting in Philly or who was taking over there?

Sandman21
10-14-2011, 05:58 PM
Ed hasn't resigned in Philly yet. If he doesn't get the gig in Toronto I assume he's going back at least for this year.

And Bower didn't do a half bad job with New Orleans. Of course CP3 also helps some.

docpaul
10-26-2011, 03:46 PM
Looks like Stefanski to Toronto is done:

http://twitter.com/#!/WojYahooNBA

WojYahooNBA Adrian Wojnarowski
Y! Sources: The Toronto Raptors are finalizing an agreement with Ed Stefanski to make him VP of Basketball Ops.
3 hours ago Favorite Retweet Reply

WojYahooNBA Adrian Wojnarowski
Stefanski will report to Raptors president/GM Bryan Colangelo, who will still run basketball operations.
4 hours ago

WojYahooNBA Adrian Wojnarowski
Stefanski still has to meet with Toronto ownership, but a formality. Deal could be announced by late week. Stefanski had been GM in Philly.
4 hours ago

WojYahooNBA Adrian Wojnarowski
Toronto is finalizing an agreement with Ed Stefanski to become Raptors Exec. VP of Basketball Operations, league sources tell Y!

http://tinyurl.com/6enpk3k



The Toronto Raptors are finalizing an agreement with former Philadelphia 76ers general manager Ed Stefanski to take over as the franchise’s executive vice president of basketball operations, league sources told Yahoo! Sports.

Stefanski, who was fired as the 76ers’ GM a week ago, will report to Raptors president-GM Bryan Colangelo, who will still have final say on basketball matters. Stefanski will ultimately replace Masai Ujiri, who left Toronto to become the Denver Nuggets GM last year.

Colangelo conducted a lengthy search and ultimately targeted Stefanski in recent weeks for the job. Former New Orleans Hornets GM Jeff Bower was the runner-up. San Antonio Spurs assistant GM Dennis Lindsey had been a strong candidate, too.

By adding Stefanski and possibly another assistant GM and scouts, the Raptors are restructuring their player personnel department. After missing the playoffs for three straight seasons, Colangelo and new coach Dwane Casey are working with two-year contracts. The Raptors picked one of the world’s top young centers, Jonas Valanciunas(notes), with the fourth pick in the June NBA draft, and he’ll play one season overseas before he’s expected to join Toronto for the 2012-13 season.

Stefanski had been replaced as the 76ers’ top decision maker a year ago by Rod Thorn, and the franchise’s new ownership ushered him out a week ago. Stefanski had the GM title in Philadelphia and New Jersey. With both teams, he was credited with the drafting of several good players, including Richard Jefferson(notes) and Jrue Holiday(notes).


Let's see what Pritchard will do for us this year!

DrFife
10-26-2011, 04:55 PM
Yeah, well, Holiday at #17 was a gift. :cry:

BRushWithDeath
10-27-2011, 12:22 PM
Let's see what Pritchard will do for us this year!

Any change in our win-loss record this season, be it positive or negative, will have absolutely nothing to do with Kevin Pritchard.

Hicks
10-27-2011, 12:37 PM
Any change in our win-loss record this season, be it positive or negative, will have absolutely nothing to do with Kevin Pritchard.

You thought he was suggesting otherwise?

BRushWithDeath
10-27-2011, 12:47 PM
You thought he was suggesting otherwise?

That was how I interpreted it.

I could be wrong.

wintermute
10-28-2011, 02:39 AM
Any change in our win-loss record this season, be it positive or negative, will have absolutely nothing to do with Kevin Pritchard.

I would hope that any basketball-related hire by the Pacers is made with an eye towards improving the W-L record. Maybe not right away, but certainly down the road (isn't Pritchard supposed to help with scouting?). If Bird and Morway could do the same job without his input, what would be the point of paying him?