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View Full Version : Here it is again, my one big concern about this team:



Hicks
02-07-2004, 07:54 PM
And I think for the second time, brought up by a Pistons fan:


I'm so god damn sick of people talking about this. "Rick Carsile is the best coach in the NBA" "Rick Carsile is gona lead the Pacer into the finals and Detroit will be bounced from the second round by NJ" "Rick Carisile is my lover and I ride his nose ever god damn night"

Thats fine. I hope you enjoy a coach who controls ever god damn **** thing your guys do on the court. You think your point guard is calling the shots? Haa haaa...no. Rick is making up for his sad sad basketball career. Larry Brown is teaching the players how to think the game. Under Rick, Billups' IQ as a point guard was somewhere around a -10. He's has become much more of a floor general under Brown this season. With Rick calling all the shots last year, you think Billups learned anything, becide pass the ball to RIP when coach tells him to? No.

So have fun with Rick indy. You'll probably make it to the finals this year, and next. And hey, you might win. But we'll be the team going after a dynasty.

Oh yea, BTW, you should learn that regular season dosnt mean ****. Because right now, your team is playing playoff type basketball every night. By the time the playoffs come, every team will be playing like you. Every team starts to defend better. Every time grinds it out better. Just because you're winning in the regular season dosnt mean anything. We almost got bounced last year because of Rick. And thats the truth. Dont get your hopes high.

Is he right, or were those Pistons rosters simply not capable of taking it up a notch? Will we be different?

And speaking of which, help me out: Did the Bird teams play playoff-style basketball all year or not?

MSA2CF
02-07-2004, 08:00 PM
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: That section you bolded on the Pistons fan's post was great.

It's obvious he's angry and he is trying to make any kind of point he can. Although he does have a point, usually, that doesn't scare me at all. I think we'll do just fine. We have lots of experience and better coaching this time. Just because we play playoff bball now doesn't mean we can't step it up in the playoffs. Even if the other teams raise their level, who says we won't raise ours. We're still the better team in the end. We will have gotten the best record in the East for a reason-because we beat the other Eastern teams...I wouldn't look too much into that guy's comments.

Sorry about my foolish rant. :P

edit: I think the Bird-era Pacers did play playoff bball each night.

Will Galen
02-07-2004, 08:28 PM
This Pacer team doesn't play playoff style basketball every night. No team brings it every night. Mostly they play harder in the second half of games, and up the intensity during the last few minutes.

The playoffs are when teams increase their intensity. Can the Pacer's increase theirs? Certainly.

Hicks
02-07-2004, 08:34 PM
You know, maybe the difference is we play playoff STYLE, whereas teams like the Riley Heat teams the those Piston teams normally played playoff INTENSITY. Meaning we play the game like we would/will in the playoffs, but those teams actually played with that extra high level of energy to compensate for something they were lacking.

Bball
02-07-2004, 08:36 PM
That highlighted part of text is one of the stupidest, most ignorant, worthless opinions that I have ever read.

OK, how's that for disagreeing?

The Pacers aren't actually playing each regular season game like it is life or death playoff basketball. That was a Zeke trait. Throw the kitchen sink at each individual game (to the point of outcoaching ourselves many times).

We ARE playing playoff style ball over the season: Tough defense and valuing every possession. But we are doing it consistently. Rick isn't changing the personell or tactics every quarter. When the Pacers get to the post season it shouldn't be a shock. The style of ball will be what they are accumstomed. It won't be like someone flushing the toilet in the middle of a hot shower (COLD water).

We will have a solid foundation built when the playoffs get here. If we get outplayed it won't be because we couldn't take it up a notch. It will be because a better team beat us.

Zeke, to me, coached a random willy nilly style and approached each game as if it was an elimination game. The team never learned to trust each other or their strengths and weaknesses because he was trying to fit the pieces together to get A win.... not long term winning. The only game that mattered was that night. The only moment that mattered was THAT moment. Sub players in and out trying to make every move a chess move. So when the playoffs came there was no foundation built. No consistency built from the season. That is when we had trouble taking it up notch.... and make no mistake we HAD to take it up a notch to compete in the playoffs because we rarely played that way all season.

The fact is, we might not 'take it up a notch' because we will already be where we need to be.

So I totally disagree with the poster's contention.

And if he thinks Larry Brown is running a free-wheeling playground basketball camp and is Mr Warmth then he is wrong about that as well.

-Bball

ABADays
02-07-2004, 09:09 PM
OK Hicks. Take a deep breath and repeat after me. "It's not going to happen. It's not going to happen!"

Unclebuck
02-07-2004, 10:45 PM
So have fun with Rick indy. You'll probably make it to the finals this year, and next. And hey, you might win. But we'll be the team going after a dynasty.




Damnit Rick Carlisle, you get us to the NBA Finals two years in a row and we might even win it all, but you still suck.



That is basically what this idiot is saying.

Unclebuck
02-07-2004, 10:50 PM
That highlighted part of text is one of the stupidest, most ignorant, worthless opinions that I have ever read.

OK, how's that for disagreeing?

The Pacers aren't actually playing each regular season game like it is life or death playoff basketball. That was a Zeke trait. Throw the kitchen sink at each individual game (to the point of outcoaching ourselves many times).

We ARE playing playoff style ball over the season: Tough defense and valuing every possession. But we are doing it consistently. Rick isn't changing the personell or tactics every quarter. When the Pacers get to the post season it shouldn't be a shock. The style of ball will be what they are accumstomed. It won't be like someone flushing the toilet in the middle of a hot shower (COLD water).

We will have a solid foundation built when the playoffs get here. If we get outplayed it won't be because we couldn't take it up a notch. It will be because a better team beat us.

Zeke, to me, coached a random willy nilly style and approached each game as if it was an elimination game. The team never learned to trust each other or their strengths and weaknesses because he was trying to fit the pieces together to get A win.... not long term winning. The only game that mattered was that night. The only moment that mattered was THAT moment. Sub players in and out trying to make every move a chess move. So when the playoffs came there was no foundation built. No consistency built from the season. That is when we had trouble taking it up notch.... and make no mistake we HAD to take it up a notch to compete in the playoffs because we rarely played that way all season.

The fact is, we might not 'take it up a notch' because we will already be where we need to be.

So I totally disagree with the poster's contention.

And if he thinks Larry Brown is running a free-wheeling playground basketball camp and is Mr Warmth then he is wrong about that as well.

-Bball


Great, great post Bball.

Brown and Carlisle are not that much different at least not in how their teams play. Carlisle and Nelson are very different.


The general point that guy is talking about has been discussed several times this season in this forum. One point no opne has made is that the Spurs play a playoff style throught the whole seaon and so do the lakers and last time I checked they won the last 5 titles. For that matter larry brown coaches a playoff style

Isiah style was just lupey


Winning in the playoffs comes down to a few things.

Ability to score when the defense knows every play you are going to run and has been defending it for 5 straight games.

Ability to get defensive stops late in games and the ability to get defensive rebounds late in games.

able
02-07-2004, 11:15 PM
As I see it and which was already worded better by someone else in a post on the same topic, players intensity (needs to) go up a few notches.
This results in "bigger" plays and numbers (see JO, Ron and Tins in the last one and Reg over his career minus the last one)
Secondly your starters play more minutes, rotations shorten and as we have all seen, our starting 5 is a devastating force, they can take any team down.

As for RC calling all the plays, yep he did so in the beginning, I hated it, the players hated it and I have a wee small feeling that even his boss thought he was overdoing it a bit, because what happened? Tins came "back" and showed RC that he is capable of running the offense the way the players like it and have a smooth running operation in the mean while.

Rick still calls plays, but also leaves a lot of plays to the players, as it should be. Perhaps Billups never had that much "eye" for the game to begin with :D

But with Tins at the point, and Ron besides him, I have no fear for that whatsoever.


:stupid:

ROCislandWarrior
02-08-2004, 01:54 AM
Secondly your starters play more minutes, rotations shorten and as we have all seen, our starting 5 is a devastating force, they can take any team down.

Very Very good point

and don't forget, One of the few subs we will use goes by the name of Al Harrington...one of the best 6th men in the leauge

This team will come focused this year. Jermaine and Reggie both want rings more than anything.

I can't wait

Anthem
02-08-2004, 04:09 AM
There's an easy response to that:

"We'll see, won't we?"

Charcoal Filtered
02-08-2004, 04:53 AM
Sort of interesting we always think a player will progress, but never think about the progression of a coach.

Think Rick might have learnt something from those defeats?

Let the Piston fans hate all they want because I am glad that Rick is the coach.

SycamoreKen
02-08-2004, 09:07 AM
So have fun with Rick indy. You'll probably make it to the finals this year, and next. And hey, you might win. But we'll be the team going after a dynasty.




Damnit Rick Carlisle, you get us to the NBA Finals two years in a row and we might even win it all, but you still suck.



That is basically what this idiot is saying.

And as much as many people on here love Brown, the last time I checked he had coached or prepared how many dynastys? Maybe one of his teams should actually WIN 1 title before his dynasty making takes place.

ABADays
02-08-2004, 09:17 AM
As I said the last time you posted this Hicks - players can alway kick it up a notch come playoffs.

sixthman
02-08-2004, 10:13 AM
Sort of interesting we always think a player will progress, but never think about the progression of a coach.

Think Rick might have learnt something from those defeats?

Let the Piston fans hate all they want because I am glad that Rick is the coach.

Excellent point. No doubt Carlisle will continue to grow as a coach.

Anyway, if the Pistons fans think their team belonged in the Finals last year on the basis of their talent, I think they are wrong. The Pistons went about as far as their talent would take them.

Suaveness
02-08-2004, 10:29 AM
You are right, they did not have much talent at all. Rick did a fantastic job of maximizing their talent and letting them perform at their true potential. Now, we have a team such is ours that is loaded with talent. Imagine if Rick is able to maximize talent here? We would do better and go farther than Detroit was able to.

DisplacedKnick
02-08-2004, 12:34 PM
I tend to wonder at anyone who labels Carlisle as a playoff flop.

His first year as coach Detroit got to the 2nd rd.

Last year they got to the ECF - despite having only 2 reliable scorers on the team - and were beat by a better team.

As for the playoff-style basketball comment by the original poster, that's a crock. Teams play like they practice and they play in the playoffs like they do in the regular season (for the most part). Does the intensity go up in the playoffs? Sure. But that doesn't change the type of basketball you play.