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ChicagoJ
10-05-2004, 12:17 PM
Now that training camp is starting...

For reasons that we don't really know, DW and Bird decided not to trade Ron this summer.

It could be that they (1) couldn't find a trade they liked, or it could be that they (2) believe he'll continue to make progress.

I've got to believe its choice (2). As much as Bird preaches team play and unselfishness as key characteristics of championship teams, I believe that if he and DW thought Ron could not continue to grow, and also grow quickly enough, they would've found some way to ship him out.

I know I'm PD's resident skeptic, and Ronnie is likely to give me a few more ulcers in the coming months/ seasons. But he's still here, wearing blue and gold.

After my summer of b!tc#ing about him, I'm now ready to shut up and watch for signs of growth, just like I did last season. I reserve the right complain if his actions warrant it, of course.

Now that camp is starting, I don't beleive he should be traded unless he clearly does something, either visibly or behind the scenes, that completely removes the team's trust in his ability to grow up.

Here's to the end of the off-season. :cheers: :boomer:

ChicagoJ
10-05-2004, 01:59 PM
I've thought about that (believe me).

But I think, as much as Bird was talking about teamwork and responding to pressure and such the other day, that if he thought Ron could still be a problem, he would've dumped Ron for whatever the best offer was that he could get and then put a nasty post-trade spin on it with some planted leaks to Montieth so that everybody would know just how bad he truly is/was.

Time will tell...

EDIT

Ooops. That last comment was the skeptic in me rearing his ugly head again. :p
Ooops

Unclebuck
10-05-2004, 02:07 PM
Maybe they realized that Ron Artest is simply too good to trade. As Ron said yesterday, unless you get Kobe, T-Mac, KG, TD or Shaq you won't get equal value. That is paraphrasing what Ron said yesterday, it was on one of the local TV sports reports.

I think the Pacers seriously looked into trading Ron, but after Al was traded, it made trading Ron less likely. I don't know if the pacers would have done the peja deal, sounded like they might have, thankfully that deal fell through.

sweabs
10-05-2004, 02:18 PM
:cheers:

Don't worry Jay - you'll have nothing to worry about :devil:

TheSauceMaster
10-05-2004, 04:59 PM
Well Ron has made it too a point where alot of people argued all summer he wouldn't , the only thing that can hurt Ron Artest and his Future as a Pacer is Ron himself, but he has more to Risk than just that and if he falls appart now , he might just ruin his career.

Ron has improved every year and I expect the same this year , I will be happy to eat my words if Ron Artest hasn't , but at this point I don't see that happening.

Like Bird said Ron wasn't the only one who fell appart during the playoff run ,Ron was just more Obvious that he was losing his composure. I really have to wonder and maybe this deserves another thread , How much did the first round layoff between rounds 1-2 for the Pacers , did it really hurt them more than it helped them ?

I would say Yes it was a large factor , the Pacers were firing on all cylinders and then you have that long of a layoff it's gonna be hard to pick that level of play back up , you lose alot of focus with long layoffs.

NewType
10-05-2004, 05:19 PM
I would say Yes it was a large factor , the Pacers were firing on all cylinders and then you have that long of a layoff it's gonna be hard to pick that level of play back up , you lose alot of focus with long layoffs.

I agree 100%. On top of it, both Al and JB were having breakout games in the Boston series. I think the decision for Rick to start Cro during the ECF didn't sit well with Al as he felt he had a great series (Boston) under his belt - thus we are getting the whole "Rick didn't trust me" comment from Al now

Sollozzo
10-05-2004, 05:24 PM
I'm a believer that if the Kings had decided to grant Peja's wish to be traded, the Pacers would have traded Artest for him in a heartbeat.

Roy Munson
10-05-2004, 05:37 PM
I'm a believer that if the Kings had decided to grant Peja's wish to be traded, the Pacers would have traded Artest for him in a heartbeat.

I strongly agree.

Hicks
10-05-2004, 05:41 PM
I also agree with that.

TheSauceMaster
10-06-2004, 12:48 AM
I'm a believer that if the Kings had decided to grant Peja's wish to be traded, the Pacers would have traded Artest for him in a heartbeat.

I'll break the trend , I strongly disagree:devil:

Suaveness
10-06-2004, 01:02 AM
I'm a believer that if the Kings had decided to grant Peja's wish to be traded, the Pacers would have traded Artest for him in a heartbeat.

I'll break the trend , I strongly disagree:devil:




I agree with you.

NewType
10-06-2004, 01:41 AM
I don't think we will bite without hesitation. It will definitely begin the talk, but I'm not 100% convinced that DW and LB have decided to give up on Ron.

indygeezer
10-06-2004, 07:54 AM
JAy...I too shall commit to what you said in your original post. PLAY BALL!




I also think that they would have if they could have.

DisplacedKnick
10-06-2004, 08:19 AM
Well, as to the layoff between rds 1 and 2, I don't buy it. Boston may have been the worst playoff team since I have been following the NBA.

The Heat were another story. That was NOT a 42-win team. That was a 50-plus win team that started the season horribly, then found their rhythm in January and stormed into the playoffs. The tough defense they played would have made them a tough out for anyone and would have made anyone's game look rough.

I can live with that argument for game 1, but not past that. In fact, I thought playing a tough, physical but undermanned team like the Heat was perfect to prep them for Detroit (or NJ if they had gotten through). It would show them the intensity they had to maintain throughout the ECF, as well as the importance of valuing each possession.

Then came game 5.

The Pacers are following a perfect progression. It's not 100% but I'd say 80% or more of the time it works this way:

1) A team builds themself up to being an excellent regular-season team but hasn't learned how to win in the playoffs. To an extent, that was Indy's 02-03 season though in their case you can add "down the stretch" to "the playoffs."

2) The team has to make at least one deep playoff run to find out what it's about and what it really takes to win in the playoffs. Detroit's getting to the ECF in 2003 was the perfect prep - and they had the same problem (even worse) than the Pacers, getting swept by NJ that year (and not really competitive the last 2 games). And Game 5 of the ECF showed me the Pacers just weren't ready - they played a throwaway game when no team can afford to throw a game away.

3) The team takes what it learned and becomes a title contender. I think that's where the Pacers are right now. I won't say Indy will beat Detroit and get to the finals but I think they're ready to. Both teams improved in the offseason and we could be looking at an absolute war. But I don't think we'll see a 20-pt loss again.

Should be a fun season for Pacers fans.

Hicks
10-06-2004, 10:53 AM
That post got me pumped up for the season to start. Nice one, DK.

McKeyFan
10-06-2004, 12:17 PM
I'm a believer that if the Kings had decided to grant Peja's wish to be traded, the Pacers would have traded Artest for him in a heartbeat.

I'll break the trend , I strongly disagree:devil:




I agree with you.



I agree with all the above.

Sollozzo
10-06-2004, 12:54 PM
I think alot of people don't think the Pacers would have traded Artest for Peja because they themselves think that Artest is better and they are huge Artest fans. It doesn't matter who we fans think is better, it's about what Larry Bird thinks.

We all know Larry likes Peja, and has been frustrated with Ron. Some of you honestly believe the Pacers would have declined Peja for Artest? How? They still have to think that Artest could be a timebomb, and Peja would have been the best player they could have ever gotten for Artest.

I myself would rather have Ron, but it doesn't matter who I would rather have. It's about what Larry Bird thinks, and I think Bird would have traded Artest for Peja without thinking twice about it.

Anthem
10-07-2004, 12:29 AM
I'm a believer that if the Kings had decided to grant Peja's wish to be traded, the Pacers would have traded Artest for him in a heartbeat.

I'll break the trend , I strongly disagree:devil:




I agree with you.



I agree with all the above.


I agree with everything said in this thread.


Absolutely. I couldn't agree more.

ChicagoJ
10-03-2005, 02:46 PM
sounds familiar, doesn't it?

I guess I have to do this every year at this time.

Well, its a new season and its the same old story. Its time for me to shut up for a short period of time about "the knucklehead" and the fact that he destroyed "our team" AGAIN just so that I can have some enthusiasm about the new season.

:boomer:

Unclebuck
10-03-2005, 02:54 PM
Jay, I was reading this very thread earlier today. It is interesting

VF21
10-03-2005, 03:01 PM
I think the Pacers seriously looked into trading Ron, but after Al was traded, it made trading Ron less likely. I don't know if the pacers would have done the peja deal, sounded like they might have, thankfully that deal fell through.

I would have done the Peja deal in a heartbeat...and never looked back.

If Ron Artest can keep it together and play the kind of ball he's capable of playing, you guys are in really good shape for the upcoming season. I would loved to have seen him in a Kings uniform. I look at it this way: Peja is flash, Ron is substance - with a creamy nitroglycerin center. Keep him from exploding and you'll do fine.

Frank Slade
10-03-2005, 03:02 PM
Kind of gives you goosebumps on some of the statements made unknowingly what lay ahead. Well new year , new outlook...new uniforms, new atittude...new outcome.. :pray:

heywoode
10-03-2005, 03:07 PM
sounds familiar, doesn't it?

I guess I have to do this every year at this time.

Well, its a new season and its the same old story. Its time for me to shut up for a short period of time about "the knucklehead" and the fact that he destroyed "our team" AGAIN just so that I can have some enthusiasm about the new season.

:boomer:

WOW. It took me reading post number two to figure out that this thread wasn't started TODAY....

Yes, it does sound familiar. Hopefully this is the year of CALM and FOCUS!

fwpacerfan
10-03-2005, 03:40 PM
Very eerie!

It seems to me that the Pacers brass have a phobia about trading a player who ends up being a star in this league. The worst thing to happen in their mind would be to let Artest or Bender go and then for them to get their act together and become a superstar. I'm not sure if I like this or not. I believe in sticking with your players but at what point do you cut bait and let them go? On one hand I'd like to say "aloha" to these guys but on the other hand I look at Walsh's track record and realize he is the best in the business.

DisplacedKnick
10-03-2005, 04:06 PM
WOW. It took me reading post number two to figure out that this thread wasn't started TODAY....


It took me reading my own post and thinking, Wait a minute - I didn't post on this thread!

Then I looked at the dates. Of course last Oct I was still a Ron supporter.