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View Full Version : The Official Danny Granger Appreciation Thread



Shade
04-17-2011, 08:38 AM
I've noticed a recurring theme that, when a player fails to live up to a fan's expectations, that player tends to become a scapegoat. Everything good he does on the floor is virtually ignored, and all the bad things he does are put under a microscope. I noticed this especially with Jermaine O'Neal, and now, Danny Granger has become "that guy."

No, Danny is not a "superstar" in the same echelon as LeBron James, Dwight Howard, etc. In fact, he's even regressed a bit from a couple of seasons ago (I put a lot of blame for that on He Whose Name Shall Not Be Written, but that's a rant for another time), but for the 17th pick in the draft, he's still a hell of a player.

I'm just trying to keep things in perspective before we move on to the "Paul George isn't a superstar, please trade him" era.

brewpopps
04-17-2011, 09:05 AM
Pretty lame that we have to have an "appreciation" thread to add to the drama of this team. No thanks.

Kaufman
04-17-2011, 09:10 AM
shadely,

this is an interesting concept you bring up - singling out players that don't meet expectations. to some degree these players - JO and Granger deserved and deserve criticism.

my question - Why do you think Reggie never became a scapegoat?

while i personally think danny granger bears a lion's share of some of the shortcomings related to this team, i have no qualms admitting that he has some redeemable qualities as witnessed in the second half of yesterday's match. for this i have no problem in showing appreciation.

your buddy,
kauffie.

ensergio
04-17-2011, 10:16 AM
I've noticed a recurring theme that, when a player fails to live up to a fan's expectations, that player tends to become a scapegoat. Everything good he does on the floor is virtually ignored, and all the bad things he does are put under a microscope. I noticed this especially with Jermaine O'Neal, and now, Danny Granger has become "that guy."

No, Danny is not a "superstar" in the same echelon as LeBron James, Dwight Howard, etc. In fact, he's even regressed a bit from a couple of seasons ago (I put a lot of blame for that on He Whose Name Shall Not Be Written, but that's a rant for another time), but for the 17th pick in the draft, he's still a hell of a player.

I'm just trying to keep things in perspective before we move on to the "Paul George isn't a superstar, please trade him" era.

Granger played a great, GREAT, game! I'm nothing but proud of him.

BringJackBack
04-17-2011, 10:23 AM
Thank you Shade.

I saw yesterday just how important Danny was to Chicago's defense. Every time he touched the ball he was pressured by Luol Deng and Joakim would take their side of the floor so that it would take away his drive. On top of that, a wing or point guard was ready to double Danny for when he put the ball on the floor.

When we get help for Danny, teams can't do that. When it's one on one, Danny will be a pain in the *** for NBA defenses.

Danny is going to make a name for himself over the next 6-10 years in the Playoffs.

idioteque
04-17-2011, 10:28 AM
shadely,

this is an interesting concept you bring up - singling out players that don't meet expectations. to some degree these players - JO and Granger deserved and deserve criticism.

my question - Why do you think Reggie never became a scapegoat?

while i personally think danny granger bears a lion's share of some of the shortcomings related to this team, i have no qualms admitting that he has some redeemable qualities as witnessed in the second half of yesterday's match. for this i have no problem in showing appreciation.

your buddy,
kauffie.

I wouldn't say Reggie was necessarily ever a scapegoat but some people did start calling for him to be traded in the years subsequent to our Finals run. I think really the only reason he wasn't traded before that is because guys back in the 90's weren't under as much fan scrutiny. Places like Pacers Digest where fans could meet up and dissect every aspect of every player's game simply didn't exist.

PacerDude
04-17-2011, 10:38 AM
my question - Why do you think Reggie never became a scapegoat?

He played his heart out, he never pointed fingers at anyone except himself, he kept working and getting better ............ he did everything that people who appreciate basketball expect.

The Jackson shimmy
04-17-2011, 10:43 AM
I'm by no means a knee-jerk, Granger defender. When it comes to
DG, at best, I'm an agnostic.

But, when considering the calls to trade him, contrasting that
to the lack of same with respect to Reggie Miller, I'll ask this:

Does anyone even remember the 'pre-Larry Brown' Reggie ? When
remembering his career, don't most probably think of him from 1995-
the early-2000's ?

Personally, I didn't care for him or his game at all until Brown showed
up and taught and forced him to expand his offensive game and play
hard on 'both ends'.

In Granger's defense, he is only in his 6th season which would
fall into the tailend of Reggie's pre-Brown zone.

Again, I'm no big DG fan. But he has plenty of time to evolve and
grow as a player. Hopefully, TPTB can find an HC who commands
enough respect (or instills enough fear via allocating playing time
based on playing 'the right way') to induce DG (and others on the
Pacers) to follow Reggie's career path.

Drewtone
04-17-2011, 11:20 AM
He played his heart out, he never pointed fingers at anyone except himself, he kept working and getting better ............ he did everything that people who appreciate basketball expect.

True enough, but I remember a lot of us over the years griping that he wasn't a vocal enough leader, and leading by example only got you so far.

Then he got grief for officially deferring to Jalen then the same with JO.

PacersHomer
04-17-2011, 11:38 AM
I'm not a Granger fan at all but posting all of this after yesterday's game is just odd timing. He didn't play great down the stretch but his defense was better than expected and he made some important baskets.

vnzla81
04-17-2011, 11:59 AM
I can't wait until we finally get a number 1 option so people can stop crying about Danny, again he is who he is and is the only thing he have, be happy that we at least have a Robin in place for the Batman to be added(trades or free agency) or Paul George development.

righteouscool
04-17-2011, 01:01 PM
I hate the trade Danny crap. Who are you going to trade Danny for that is better then he is? Danny is good enough to be right below the best players in the league.

One thing that I have noticed, and I put this completely on the coaches, (especially job) is that Danny is actually pretty good in the post. He's more PF then he is SG and for some reason the coaches always do iso plays for him, but expect for him to beat his man off the dribble off speed and dribbling ability. This is just setting him up to lose imo. Why they don't post him up more, especially at the end of games, I'll never understand. . .

Hicks
04-17-2011, 01:12 PM
The only reason to trade Danny is if you think you can get an equally good player at a position of greater need than SF.

Otherwise, you add more pieces to play with him and then enjoy the quality of your roster as it wins more than it loses.

Kaufman
04-17-2011, 01:25 PM
or for prospects / low number draft picks.


The only reason to trade Danny is if you think you can get an equally good player at a position of greater need than SF.

Otherwise, you add more pieces to play with him and then enjoy the quality of your roster as it wins more than it loses.

Trophy
04-17-2011, 01:28 PM
I want to add another star to play with Danny.

Paul has the potential to be a really good wing to play next to Danny and he hasn't been a bad option so far though he needs a lot of work.

If we want to bring in another star like Monta Ellis, Eric Gordon, etc. it might be difficult to not give up Danny to get a guy like that.

I'd still keep OJ Mayo in mind. He's a pretty realistic option and can get back to being the solid wing he was in his rookie years.

Hicks
04-17-2011, 02:23 PM
or for prospects / low number draft picks.

You think someone wants to give those up for Granger? Who would that be?

But even if you do, why would we want yet more rookies now? We have plenty of youth. It's time to start looking to acquire and develop some veteran players.

LetsTalkPacers
04-17-2011, 02:27 PM
I'm by no means a knee-jerk, Granger defender. When it comes to
DG, at best, I'm an agnostic.

But, when considering the calls to trade him, contrasting that
to the lack of same with respect to Reggie Miller, I'll ask this:

Does anyone even remember the 'pre-Larry Brown' Reggie ? When
remembering his career, don't most probably think of him from 1995-
the early-2000's ?

Personally, I didn't care for him or his game at all until Brown showed
up and taught and forced him to expand his offensive game and play
hard on 'both ends'.

In Granger's defense, he is only in his 6th season which would
fall into the tailend of Reggie's pre-Brown zone.

Again, I'm no big DG fan. But he has plenty of time to evolve and
grow as a player. Hopefully, TPTB can find an HC who commands
enough respect (or instills enough fear via allocating playing time
based on playing 'the right way') to induce DG (and others on the
Pacers) to follow Reggie's career path.
Very good point, that to be honest never occurred to me.

ilive4sports
04-17-2011, 03:27 PM
I'm one of Danny's biggest supporters on here. He gets a lot of undeserved hate on here and its ashame. Danny is not only a damn good basketball player, but he's been a good person too. It is very similar to the grief people gave JO, even though JO was a great player for us. I think its most likely due to not having the success we had with Reggie. And that doesn't really fall on Danny as this roster is finally turning into something that is decent. If we can get a good trade like Hicks said, then yes you do it. Its that way with any player. But right now Danny is our best player. That doesn't mean you need to crucify him for it. The fact is that right now, this roster is far from perfect. Its far from the potential it can reach. Right now Danny is our best player. In two years, he might not be our second best player. He's holding things together right now, keeping us from being a bottom dweller team. Some of you would rather that early lotto pick, but I like this playoff experience we are gaining much more.

BlueNGold
04-17-2011, 04:54 PM
There is a lot to like about Granger in both ability and how he goes about his business. If there weren't, he wouldn't have made the all-star team. He is, without a doubt, the franchise player on this particular team. With that said, I will leave it right there since this is an appreciation thread.

Kaufman
04-17-2011, 05:13 PM
You think someone wants to give those up for Granger? Who would that be?

But even if you do, why would we want yet more rookies now? We have plenty of youth. It's time to start looking to acquire and develop some veteran players.

Hmm, interesting point. I agree that we need to develop players - yes. But I think the only way to get a #1 option, which we clearly may never actually be successful at, would be through the draft or a young young raw player.

Who? Someone who needs a Robin-esque type of player. Maybe a strong defensive team who needs a scorer. Maybe a team like Portland in the early part of last decade who needed experience for inexperience (DD-JO).

I think personally Danny MIGHT hinder the development of the youth movement.

Kaufman
04-17-2011, 05:15 PM
In two years, he might not be our second best player.

Sell high, buy low?

ilive4sports
04-17-2011, 05:21 PM
Sell high, buy low?

I mean that someone like Paul George could very well end up being a better player than Danny. Honestly if Hibbert reaches his potential, he could be better than Danny too.

Eleazar
04-17-2011, 06:27 PM
I've noticed a recurring theme that, when a player fails to live up to a fan's expectations, that player tends to become a scapegoat. Everything good he does on the floor is virtually ignored, and all the bad things he does are put under a microscope. I noticed this especially with Jermaine O'Neal, and now, Danny Granger has become "that guy."

No, Danny is not a "superstar" in the same echelon as LeBron James, Dwight Howard, etc. In fact, he's even regressed a bit from a couple of seasons ago (I put a lot of blame for that on He Whose Name Shall Not Be Written, but that's a rant for another time), but for the 17th pick in the draft, he's still a hell of a player.

I'm just trying to keep things in perspective before we move on to the "Paul George isn't a superstar, please trade him" era.

If there is anyone on this team that gets hated on for not reaching his potential it isn't Granger, but Rush. The reason people "hate" on Granger is because we know he is better than he plays.

Kaufman
04-17-2011, 06:37 PM
I mean that someone like Paul George could very well end up being a better player than Danny. Honestly if Hibbert reaches his potential, he could be better than Danny too.

thats what i mean. if these guys end up being better than danny, its going to devalue danny. right now he is on a high.

Dr. Hibbert
04-17-2011, 06:38 PM
I was having an off-the-record conversation with an esteemed sportswriter at an event we were both working, talking about the Pacers. He said that Granger should be a better player than he is, but has just about the worst shot selection in the league. This was back in March. I watched Granger over the rest of that month and couldn't get that idea out of my head: bad shot selection. Granger really is prone to stretches where he takes a lot of terrible shots. He's good enough to see them in a lot of times, but he'll also go cold and continue taking bad shots.

I'm not saying this sportswriter is God of Basketball or that my opinion is any more or less correct than yours. But I really do believe that Granger has regrettable shot selection, and gets really selfish with the ball even when he's cold. That said, I have been impressed with his willingness to step up his defense to close out the season and hopefully into the playoffs here. My main gripe about Granger during the season was his refusal to play defense, when everyone knew he was a completely capable defender.

Trader Joe
04-17-2011, 06:44 PM
I don't know how anyone in their right mind can say Granger is a disappointment with the 17th pick.

Ransom
04-17-2011, 06:46 PM
Obviously what we need is to trade Danny for Pooh Richardson and Sam Mitchell. Then trade Tyler for Derek McKey and we're set for a title run!

Seriously though, love Granger, and he actually had a pretty darn good game yesterday if you'll recall.

Dr. Hibbert
04-17-2011, 06:50 PM
I don't know how anyone in their right mind can say Granger is a disappointment with the 17th pick.

Who said that? It can't be argued that he was anything but a steal at 17.

ilive4sports
04-17-2011, 07:55 PM
thats what i mean. if these guys end up being better than danny, its going to devalue danny. right now he is on a high.

Danny will still have a valuable role on this team. He is a great shooter and can be a great defender. With less of an offensive load his defense should pick up.

The Jackson shimmy
04-17-2011, 08:25 PM
I don't know how anyone in their right mind can say Granger is a disappointment with the 17th pick.

True. But that's pretty irrelevant '6 years into' his career.

Kaufman
04-17-2011, 08:47 PM
if his ego will be able to handle that, i'm all for it. but i'm not sure he will accept it.


Danny will still have a valuable role on this team. He is a great shooter and can be a great defender. With less of an offensive load his defense should pick up.

Scot Pollard
04-17-2011, 08:52 PM
I don't know about you guys but I love how MG, the Pacers PA announcer says Danny's name after he scores.

There's by DG appeciation there and MG too.

Danny is a huge player for us. We couldn't be where we are now if it wasn't for Danny scoring at will.

imbtyler
04-17-2011, 08:53 PM
Danny Granger is our best player, and deserves to remain with this team as much as the next player whom we drafted and grew and developed into a star player (ahem). After seeing his behavior on the court a few months ago (and since then), I've been turned off on keeping him around simply because he's not leader material, and his attitude is not that of a star-caliber player. He is able to bounce out of a slump mid-game, going from horrible play in the first half, to worthy-of-our-star-quality performance in the second half.

But do you really want to keep someone around who, at Danny's age and experience, can't lead an entire team of first-through-third-year players, with some exceptions? The core of this team is already much younger and less experienced than him, and it's going going to stay that way. If he can't step up into the position of leader, then we need to find someone (not Foster, Dahntay, or Posey) who can be our veteran and lead us properly.

Also, for someone who's been in the league for as long as Granger has, he needs to stop *****ing at refs on bad plays, stop slugging around the court, stop carrying his stupid emotions on his shoulders/sleeves, and just play basketball. You can watch him get hateful on the court and start playing a different kind of Granger basketball, one associated with crybabies and wimps. He needs to step up and realize that he's not a superstar, he's not getting superstar calls, unless he starts playing like a superstar. Nothing he does on the court shows evidence of deserving to be treated like a great player, when he can't even stop acting like a *****, and play professional basketball.

Granger deserves all the accolades given to him by PD. But as our only star player, he needs to start acting like one before he starts playing like one. I don't want to trade him as much as some do, but if we got a much younger, much more professional Steph Curry or Eric Gordon out of a trade using Granger, I think it would be better. Yes, I'd rather see them on the same team, because he's an asset I don't think we can afford to lose, but don't get attached to him just because you "have to" as a fan.

This is me looking past being a homer for once. I do appreciate Granger in all that he does for our team. Trust me. But if he doesn't get his attitude together, and focus his energy on playing, not *****ing at refs, then how is he any better than any other player we can get?

tflo
04-17-2011, 09:54 PM
I can remember Danny's first game in the NBA and his frist shot was a running jump shot that hit the backboard and went in. ( I might be wrong ). The announcers and the fans were so happy for him . We had so much expectations for him. I personally think he has answered . It is hard for me to believe that after this long and all what he has accomplished there is some Pacers fan dont think he is not good enough.

15th parallel
04-17-2011, 10:10 PM
if his ego will be able to handle that, i'm all for it. but i'm not sure he will accept it.

I'm sure he can accept that. I mean, when the offense started to focus on Roy, I have never heard Danny complained. Same when Tyler had his 20-pt consecutive scoring nights. He even said that if Mayo arrived in the team he wouldn't mind having another scorer to help him (no source, but I actually seen it in one article).

We have seen him defer to his teammates. We have seen games wherein he was not shooting as much as before and letting his teammates do the damage on offense. It is pretty obvious in game 1, with most of the points scattered on the other starters.

tflo
04-17-2011, 10:39 PM
The best quote I can think of is,Dont throw the baby out with the bathwater. Granger is one of the best SF. in the NBA, why trade him?

docpaul
04-17-2011, 10:44 PM
I've noticed a recurring theme that, when a player fails to live up to a fan's expectations, that player tends to become a scapegoat. Everything good he does on the floor is virtually ignored, and all the bad things he does are put under a microscope. I noticed this especially with Jermaine O'Neal, and now, Danny Granger has become "that guy."

No, Danny is not a "superstar" in the same echelon as LeBron James, Dwight Howard, etc. In fact, he's even regressed a bit from a couple of seasons ago (I put a lot of blame for that on He Whose Name Shall Not Be Written, but that's a rant for another time), but for the 17th pick in the draft, he's still a hell of a player.

I'm just trying to keep things in perspective before we move on to the "Paul George isn't a superstar, please trade him" era.

I just don't get it. The guy is the *only* veteran on the team capable of playing real minutes, is by anyone's definition one of the better starters in the league, has a reasonable contract, and is not a bonehead...

But if he doesn't carry the team, he has failed? I kind of feel bad for him in a way, but then when I think about his attitude, I don't think he's feeling sorry for himself. :) Give him some time, he'll continue to age like a fine wine IMO. Wait till he refocuses on his post game in the offseason... look out. :)

docpaul
04-17-2011, 10:49 PM
I really appreciated Danny's demeanor in the post-game conference.

Totally dissatisfied with the loss, no moral victories, yet engaging... shall we say, leader-like? :)

You all should go watch it if you have a chance.

cgehlhausen4
04-17-2011, 10:54 PM
So we are talking Danny Granger. They guy people want to think is a superstar. Thats the problem. Everyone expects him to be something he isn't. Hes a Good shooter and descent off the dribble. His defense is above average and his rebounding is descent. If you want him to be lebron, forget it. Hes close to Mello, with less offense but better defense. Granger could average nearly 26 points every year, like he did a couple years ago. His problem is a lack of a low post threat. Hibbert is descent. I love the guy, but for a man who is 7'2 he cant push hardly anyone around. If he gained some weight who knows what could happen. If he could be a legit, consistant 18ppg from the post scorer then I think Danny averages 25+ and shoots a better percentage. Danny Doesn't get great looks inside the arc. He will get open 3's often because of the way the offense is set up, but those aren't high percentage shots. If hibbert could control the paint like a Dwight Howard(or even 75% of a Howard) than danny would get alot of open looks and when he drives in defenders wouldn't be able to leave Roy to help him. Also the lack of talent around him hurts. Rush, I think could be a great player. He just seems to be lost. People play off of him to crowed the middle for Granger. Ya Rush will hit but not often enough and he needs to work on his driving. Collison is looking good and I believe he is the answer at point. Hes young and will only get better. He outplayed Rose for a quarter in game one. Tyler is looking great, but again hes a shooter. He can get some inside off the dribble but hes not a post player. All these shooters just crowed the mid and outer part of the court. That makes it hard to drive because you have no room to get a head of steam. My Wildcard is Paul George. I seen this guy play in college and at times in the season he looked great. He has excellent defense. He almost always has 3 steals a game. Hes got great size, speed and ups. He is a good shooter but i think he is just adjusting to the NBA. Now that hes starting he will get more confidence. I think in 4 years he can be one of the top players in the NBA, just by looking at his body and skill set. Thats if he has the right coach and system to learn. Being optimistic, Pacers in 7 games. Realistic, Bulls in 6. I hope we can pull a miracle this post season, but I cant wait to see what we do on the offseason. We are a couple pieces away from a legit contender. GO PACERS!

Hicks
04-17-2011, 11:38 PM
thats what i mean. if these guys end up being better than danny, its going to devalue danny. right now he is on a high.

But if that means Granger is our 3rd best player, GREAT! That probably means we're a very good team. Keep him in that scenario.

Kaufman
04-17-2011, 11:49 PM
if the chemistry is good, i agree.

tell you what - by location you have more access than do i. i'd like to know if you come into mike wells, or if you know yourself, "does danny disrupt the team's chemistry"?

i'm not suggesting he disrupts it intentionally. this is an honest question, not one borne of rhetoric.

Infinite MAN_force
04-17-2011, 11:54 PM
I was having an off-the-record conversation with an esteemed sportswriter at an event we were both working, talking about the Pacers. He said that Granger should be a better player than he is, but has just about the worst shot selection in the league. This was back in March. I watched Granger over the rest of that month and couldn't get that idea out of my head: bad shot selection. Granger really is prone to stretches where he takes a lot of terrible shots. He's good enough to see them in a lot of times, but he'll also go cold and continue taking bad shots.

I'm not saying this sportswriter is God of Basketball or that my opinion is any more or less correct than yours. But I really do believe that Granger has regrettable shot selection, and gets really selfish with the ball even when he's cold. That said, I have been impressed with his willingness to step up his defense to close out the season and hopefully into the playoffs here. My main gripe about Granger during the season was his refusal to play defense, when everyone knew he was a completely capable defender.

For three and a half seasons we had a coach that encouraged this sort of shot selection. I feel like this has already improved some under Vogel, and I hope it continues when the new coach (Vogel or whoever) has a chance to do a training camp and really hammer home some new offensive philosophies.

Anthem
04-17-2011, 11:59 PM
For three and a half seasons we had a coach that encouraged this sort of shot selection. I feel like this has already improved some under Vogel, and I hope it continues when the new coach (Vogel or whoever) has a chance to do a training camp and really hammer home some new offensive philosophies.
I absolutely agree.

Danny's shot selection has been bad this year and last, but I don't remember it being a problem before that. At one point, his excellent shot selection was one of his strengths.

I'm definitely with you that he's gotten better under Vogel, and I'd like to see what happens with more coaching.

EDIT: Wow, I said "this year and last" off the top of my head, but go look at the numbers:

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/danny_granger/career_stats.html

LA_Confidential
04-18-2011, 12:11 AM
Teams trade their best player for one of three reasons. Either they have cap problems, they fear losing them to free agency or the player is a knuckle head. We dont have any of those problems with Danny Granger.

The front office should be focused on building around what is already here. Bird will try to add as much as he can to this group while taking minimal losses. My only problem with Danny is that he isnt a "closer", besides that he is a complete player IMO.

I think we can move into ghe future with Danny as our best player but we must have someone on the team who is just as good but they must be a better closer.

Lebron=Best Heat Player
D Wade=Better Closer than Lebron.

Eleazar
04-18-2011, 12:14 AM
I think what a lot of you are missing is the reason people want to trade Granger. It isn't because he isn't living up to expectations, and no one wants to trade him just to trade him. What people see is a player who is not as good as he was 2 or 3 years ago who struggles with giving 100% effort. No one wants to trade him just to trade him, we want to get someone better for him.

vnzla81
04-18-2011, 12:16 AM
I think what a lot of you are missing is the reason people want to trade Granger. It isn't because he isn't living up to expectations, and no one wants to trade him just to trade him. What people see is a player who is not as good as he was 2 or 3 years ago who struggles with giving 100% effort. No one wants to trade him just to trade him, we want to get someone better for him.

Why would a team trade a better player than Danny for Danny? :confused:

Eleazar
04-18-2011, 12:24 AM
Why would a team trade a better player than Danny for Danny? :confused:

Because it would obviously not be Danny for (player of choice) straight up. It would be Danny + draft pick/Rush/whatever for (player of choice).

Evan_The_Dude
04-18-2011, 12:28 AM
I will never in my life complain about having a guy on my team that averages 20 points, plays good defense (thought he could be better there), and stays out of trouble. When we get or develop that other guy that teams have to really watch out for, then I will have that much more fun watching Granger play. Watch his shooting percentages go back up too.

LA_Confidential
04-18-2011, 12:34 AM
The Pacers will be like a Government Bail Out program for teams because of all the capspace we'll have. Lets see what happens with that before we go shipping Danny out.

Eleazar
04-18-2011, 12:37 AM
The Pacers will be like a Government Bail Out program for teams because of all the capspace we'll have. Lets see what happens with that before we go shipping Danny out.

I don't disagree, I don't want to trade Danny just to trade him, I only want to trade him to make the team better. Right now there are better ways to do that than trading Granger.

Unclebuck
04-18-2011, 08:28 AM
I think there are two separate issues here.

1) One involves the longterm impact on the team and whether he should be traded and if so when.
2) how well did he play Saturday. I thought he played very well on Saturday as did Tyler, Darren, Roy - the core of this team played very well

yoadknux
04-18-2011, 08:44 AM
I'm going to say what our management said recently: The only way I agree trading Granger is, if a superstar is involved, or a proven young player.
And I also think Danny played well considering how the bulls were focusing on him. Of course he wasn't perfect, he missed some clutch shots, but saying he's the reason we lost? More like, he's the reason we were close to winning. He didn't only shoot really, really well (50% from field, 4-8 from outside) but he puts pressure on their defense.
He didn't get to the line, true, but there are 2 reasons for that:
1) If I recall correctly, Vogel said that he didn't want his players attacking the rim, because they won't be getting the calls, or something like that
2) He had Noah and Deng forcing him to put the ball on the floor or pass it.

Trader Joe
04-18-2011, 09:53 AM
True. But that's pretty irrelevant '6 years into' his career.

JOB is that you? It's not irrelevant, he will always be the 17th pick out of a draft and his production so far has been well above anything most anyone predicted for him.

BillS
04-18-2011, 10:28 AM
my question - Why do you think Reggie never became a scapegoat?

Do you really not remember the furor after he didn't show up offensively against the Lakers?

Reggie didn't END as a scapegoat, but there were plenty of times he was thrown under the bus for a lot of people due to his streakiness and his lack of vocal or direct leadership.

He was usually taken off scapegoat status quickly because of his proven heroics when it mattered and because someone else stepped "up" to be much more egregiously at fault, but that's not to say he was never in the process of being led to the sacrificial altar...

Major Cold
04-18-2011, 10:39 AM
JOB is gone and now we have a new lightning rod.

http://bostonist.com/attachments/rickbang/lightning-rod.jpg

Eleazar
04-18-2011, 02:01 PM
JOB is gone and now we have a new lightning rod.

http://bostonist.com/attachments/rickbang/lightning-rod.jpg

I don't get why people just assume he is a "lightning rod", or why JOB was a "lightning rod". JOB was no "lightning rod" JOB was the sole reason this team didn't have a winning record, there was absolutely no other reason.

There may be some people who are just overreacting to the game, but no one is using him as a "lightning rod". Most of the complaints are valid complaints. (i.e. poor shot selection, lack of effort) Hell if he fixed those two problems he would be clearly better than Anthony and Pierce. That is why people are so hard on him. It is because we know he is better than he plays. Two years ago the only thing keeping people from saying he was better than Anthony was that Anthony had been doing it for longer. If someone goes out and plays like Danny did 2 years ago, then the following two seasons play like he has people are going to be a lot tougher on him because they know he is better than how he plays.