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View Full Version : Worried about DC's Offense at Crunchtime?



ptaylor2112
03-02-2011, 01:45 PM
Hey all - Longtime lurker...

Late in the 4th quarter against Golden State, Darren Collison made an ill-advised extra pass that resulted in a shot clock violation. It reminded me of another poor, late-game decision he made against Miami (I think he dribbled too far into the paint, causing a bad pass in the paint).

Now, I don't watch every minute of every game, but it got me wondering about how he runs the offense late in games. Are these errors just a product of his youth and inexperience? Or maybe I'm noticing something that isn't really there. I'd be interested in your thoughts.

Patrick

Mackey_Rose
03-02-2011, 01:49 PM
He also took (and missed) a terrible three-pointer with about 2 minutes left and more than 10 seconds on the shot clock. Taking bad shots, was what allowed Golden State back in the game.

The reason? Not sure, but low basketball IQ springs to mind.

Speed
03-02-2011, 01:52 PM
Welcome!

I think you are right, I can think of more than a handful of bad plays in crunch time and really only a game sealing 3 pointer early in the season that stands out as clutch.

Problem is when tries or feel he has to do too much.

There seems to be more of a direction now with getting the ball to Danny on the left wing in crunch time, so hopefully this starts to lead to some closing consistency for this group.

DC is still young, but he's not there in crunch time yet, for sure.

Pacer Fan
03-02-2011, 01:55 PM
He also took (and missed) a terrible three-pointer with about 2 minutes left and more than 10 seconds on the shot clock. Taking bad shots, was what allowed Golden State back in the game.

The reason? Not sure, but low basketball IQ springs to mind.

He has been benched quite abit at end of games. Even TJ was finishig games the 1st half the year. So, I hate to say it, but at this time and watching him all season. I have to agree with you. I hope he proves us wrong!!!

Sookie
03-02-2011, 01:59 PM
He's young, he's going to make some mistakes. Guys have to learn to win at this level.

I've seen him make some really good plays in crunch time too.

Dr. Awesome
03-02-2011, 02:45 PM
He's young, he's going to make some mistakes. Guys have to learn to win at this level.

I've seen him make some really good plays in crunch time too.

While I agree with this, I also believe AJ Price is very clutch for how young he is. I'd almost prefer to see him in that situation because he has made a lot of big shots(including college).

BRushWithDeath
03-02-2011, 02:57 PM
I'm more worried about his defense at all times.

It's not like the dumb plays he's making at the end of games aren't the same plays he's making early in the games. It's just more memorable then.

Eleazar
03-02-2011, 03:17 PM
I'm not worried about it right now, but if he is still making the same mistakes at the same frequency next year that is when I'll become worried.

Taterhead
03-02-2011, 03:25 PM
DC's decision making is what makes him a back up for us, IMO. His defense I could live with if he showed a better feel for the game. I love him as a player but I just don't like how he fits into the starting line-up at the moment.

Beyond that I love the idea of him being the focal point of the second unit. I just think he's best when he's looking for his own offense, and with the second unit I would feel way more comfortable letting him do that. I don't even think his production would slip much and he would get about the same minutes in the end. It would just be at different times in the game and against less talented players, which sets him up to be a big problem for the other team.

I've always believed a team needs about 8 starting quality players to win a championship anyways. DC could be the 6th man and be darn good at it. I don't want him to change the way he plays because he's good at what he does. But I also don't want to see him doing it at the expense of Danny Granger, Roy Hibbert and Paul George. And DC seems to have a rough time finding his offense and using it to create opportunities for them as well. They just don't seem to mesh well for some reason.

Trophy
03-02-2011, 04:14 PM
He just needs to slow down the offense and pass the ball for a good shot.

As he matures and has a better understanding at the point, he'll be a lot better.

I felt like in the previous offseason, he was getting adjusted to his new starting role and what the expectations are with this team. In the upcoming offseason, he's probably gonna work on more PG drills to become a better one.

He seems to be someone that will put in the extra work. He likes this team and knows his responsibilities.

This team freezes up in crunch time and they play like they don't care by taking bad shots.

NapTonius Monk
03-02-2011, 07:58 PM
We should offer a max deal to Deron Williams, then adjust from there if he takes it.

BRushWithDeath
03-03-2011, 01:58 AM
We should offer a max deal to Deron Williams, then adjust from there if he takes it.

He will get a max deal from somewhere a lot more appealing than here.

Naptown_Seth
03-03-2011, 02:33 AM
He also took (and missed) a terrible three-pointer with about 2 minutes left and more than 10 seconds on the shot clock. Taking bad shots, was what allowed Golden State back in the game.

The reason? Not sure, but low basketball IQ springs to mind.
I scouted his UCLA days as poor as a passing run-the-floor PG. You could say vision, and that does seem to be an issue, but he would often dribble away the shot clock with guys as good as Westbrook, Love and Moute on the court with him at the same time.

There is a reason Holliday looked more promising to me.



HOWEVER, I do agree from a GM viewpoint that you can't just thrash back and forth with your roster. You traded for him so unless something awesome comes along you need to stick with him for a bit and see how he might develop.

This is true for all these kids. Foster, Danny, Posey and DJones are about the only known final version as this point (assuming Dun/Ford are gone).

presto123
03-03-2011, 02:39 AM
If Collison keeps driving the lane without dishing he is going to lead the league in blocked shots. That is.......blocked shots coming right back in his face:laugh:

El Pacero
03-03-2011, 03:04 AM
To DC's defense, we barely have anyone who can drive inside so I think he takes it upon himself more than he should because of that. I do wish the DC / AJ rotation was a little more liberal, but it's good seeing Lance getting PT.

Hicks
03-03-2011, 12:05 PM
I'm concerned about his offense period right now. He no longer looks aggressive or confident when he shoots or drives, and he's apparently abandoning his mid range pull up jumper. It seems like he either tries to catch and shoot when his body language says he's not ready to shoot, or he's driving into too much traffic and taking a very low percentage shot.

I don't know what happened to the bounce in his step, so to speak, but he needs to get it back.

ptaylor2112
03-03-2011, 12:10 PM
I'm concerned about his offense period right now.

I watched the tail end of the first half last night, and thought the same thing.

BRushWithDeath
03-03-2011, 01:42 PM
I'm concerned about his offense period right now. He no longer looks aggressive or confident when he shoots or drives, and he's apparently abandoning his mid range pull up jumper. It seems like he either tries to catch and shoot when his body language says he's not ready to shoot, or he's driving into too much traffic and taking a very low percentage shot.

I don't know what happened to the bounce in his step, so to speak, but he needs to get it back.

I agree with all of this.

The problem is that as bad as his offense has been, his defense is still worse.

Sookie
03-03-2011, 02:06 PM
While I agree with this, I also believe AJ Price is very clutch for how young he is. I'd almost prefer to see him in that situation because he has made a lot of big shots(including college).

AJ was ridiculous with clutch shots at Uconn. (The 6OT being the major exception :laugh:)

He's also made quite a few big shots here, sparked a comeback ect..ect..So yea, I think we'd win more games with Price closing.

People laughed when I said I thought Price and Collison were about equal in terms of being a point guard. Collison's got more pure talent. But, to me, the PG spot is 99% mental and intangibles, and AJ's got that down in spades, already, as a second year player..(Think about this, he doesn't have his full speed and athleticism, and yet he can get himself to the free throw line as well, if not better, than any of our other guards. How? Because he's smarter than the player guarding him, and knows all of the little tricks and such. And he's a second year player who hasn't gotten a full season's worth of playing time. Think about how much more he's going to learn. )

At the end of the day however, if we are dead set at giving DC the starting PG spot, he needs to be finishing the games. My point was always "I don't know why we are dead set on DC."

And I like DC, I like his energy, his attitude, his ability to score. I think he has a lot of mental growing up to do at the PG spot. And obviously things like ability to see the court have to improve, but if we want to go with him, he needs to learn it. And that's one of the reasons why I've been very anti-bench Collison. We have him the starting spot, now let him work himself out.

However, it's really hurting the team at this point. He's not shooting well, he's not passing well, he's not defending well. AJ would most likely distribute even more with the starting lineup, is quite clearly the best defender we have at PG, and quite frankly, is about our only candidate for a leader right now. (Which our team really needs)

I'd still play which ever one is playing better more. But I think that at least, the ability to get the ball to Roy in good position, to defend well, and to bring some intangibles into the starting lineup would help. DC may also be able to get some confidence against the backups.

DrFife
03-03-2011, 02:27 PM
AJ was ridiculous with clutch shots at Uconn. (The 6OT being the major exception :laugh:)

He's also made quite a few big shots here, sparked a comeback ect..ect..So yea, I think we'd win more games with Price closing.

People laughed when I said I thought Price and Collison were about equal in terms of being a point guard. Collison's got more pure talent. But, to me, the PG spot is 99% mental and intangibles, and AJ's got that down in spades, already, as a second year player..(Think about this, he doesn't have his full speed and athleticism, and yet he can get himself to the free throw line as well, if not better, than any of our other guards. How? Because he's smarter than the playing guarding him, and knows all of the little tricks and such.)

At the end of the day however, if we are dead set at giving DC the starting PG spot, he needs to be finishing the games. My point was always "I don't know why we are dead set on DC."

And I like DC, I like his energy, his attitude, his ability to score. I think he has a lot of mental growing up to do at the PG spot. But if we want to go with him, he needs to learn it.

Sookie, your take on things makes me think that if AJ can improve his quickness & explosion 10% in the off-season, he will take over the starting position next year.

PacersFan1991
03-03-2011, 02:29 PM
He will get better, he is still young. But it is very frustrating to watch right now, especially when we are fighting for a playoff spot, and he makes the mistakes that he does.

McKeyFan
03-03-2011, 03:22 PM
Collison

1. Good scorer (when he's on)
2. Not a good distributor
3. Not a good defender


AJ

1. Good scorer
2. Decent distributor
3. Decent defender


Lance

1. Good scorer
2. Great distributor
3. Decent defender (maybe, jury still out)

I know Collison was a great trade and everything, but, Geez, all we gave up was Troy Murphy.

The evaluation above tells me AJ and Lance are the better options. And if Lance goes from Good to Great scorer, then the nod goes to Lance.

Psyren
03-03-2011, 03:33 PM
Collison

1. Good scorer (when he's on)
2. Not a good distributor
3. Not a good defender


AJ

1. Good scorer
2. Decent distributor
3. Decent defender


Lance

1. Good scorer
2. Great distributor
3. Decent defender (maybe, jury still out)

I know Collison was a great trade and everything, but, Geez, all we gave up was Troy Murphy.

The evaluation above tells me AJ and Lance are the better options. And if Lance goes from Good to Great scorer, then the nod goes to Lance.

Agreed.

I know it's far too early to say based on what we've seen, but Lance gives us something the other 2 don't.

Neither AJ or Darren can get into the lane at will. It happens, but they don't do it with ease. Lance can get himself into the lane and draw in the defense at will. That's huge for a team like us. His court vision is excellent, and all he needs to do is finish a tad better.

I hate to say it, but right now, Lance and AJ are the better option. DC is my 3rd string point guard based on recent play.

jeffg-body
03-03-2011, 05:37 PM
Remember all of these guys are very young. I am not worried a bit, I expected this with our young PG's. He will get better as time passes on. If he's still making the same turnovers and bad shots by next year at this time then I might be worried a little bit.

LA_Confidential
03-03-2011, 07:17 PM
I think we should rename this site flipfloppersdigest.

Day-V
03-03-2011, 07:30 PM
I'd still give the ball to DC over Danny in crunch time.