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Kstat
02-03-2011, 07:54 PM
http://www.nba.com/allstar2011/players/index.html

This will obviously be an incomplete list, because there are always late substitutions due to injury. We already know Yao will be replaced.

West:

Starters-

C: Yao Ming
PF: Kevin Durant
SF: Carmelo Anthony
SG: Kobe Bryant
PG: Chris Paul

Reserves-

Tim Duncan
Manu Ginobili
Dirk Nowitzki
Russell Westbrook
Pau Gasol
Deron Williams
Blake Griffin

East:

Starters-
C: Dwight Howard
PF: Amare Stoudemire
SF: LeBron James
SG: Dwayne Wade
PG: Derrick Rose

Reserves-
Rajon Rondo
Paul Pierce
Ray Allen
Kevin Garnett
Joe Johnson
Al Horford
Chris Bosh

Day-V
02-03-2011, 07:56 PM
If Kevin Love doesn't replace Yao, then it's a complete travesty.

pacer4ever
02-03-2011, 07:56 PM
Kevin Love better get in

pacer4ever
02-03-2011, 07:57 PM
Sry but Timmy shouldnt have gotten in

BringJackBack
02-03-2011, 07:58 PM
Kevin Love, Nene, David West and Lararcus Aldridge probably got snubbed, but it's tough, tough competition out west. I understand why they might not have got chosen.

Trophy
02-03-2011, 07:58 PM
They did a horrible job choosing.

There's a bunch of teammates in the All-Star game and a bunch of overrated selections, IMO.

pacer4ever
02-03-2011, 07:59 PM
Ray Felton should have gotten in over Bosh

Marlin
02-03-2011, 08:00 PM
Sry but Timmy shouldnt have gotten in

You could make an argument for ZBo above him. Assuming Love is replacing Yao.

Kstat
02-03-2011, 08:01 PM
A couple of early observations:

-Boston at 37-11 gets 4 all-stars, but San Antonio at 40-8 only gets two. A couple of things went against Tony Parker here. One, he plays in a deeper conference, and he also ran into perhaps the season of point guards in NBA history. It would have been difficult to justify four point guards when so many deserving big men were also on the bubble.

-Kevin Love is the odds on favorite to get selected by David Stern to replace Yao, but for obvious reasons, Blake Griffin should start.

Trophy
02-03-2011, 08:02 PM
I wanna know who's in the 3 point shootout.

Day-V
02-03-2011, 08:02 PM
The Ghost of Tim Duncan should not be in this game.

Kstat
02-03-2011, 08:05 PM
It was a conundrum. You can't justify only taking one spur, but you also can't justify taking four PGs. Duncan was the beneficiary of a numbers game.

Trophy
02-03-2011, 08:06 PM
Joe Johnson and Al Horford shouldn't be in it. I expected Josh Smith to be in it instead of those 2.

A lot of overrated players on decent teams are on this list.

The 2009 All-Star game was really good. They chose really good players no matter the team's record and Danny was one of them and he deserved it.

There were all different players representing different teams.

TinManJoshua
02-03-2011, 08:06 PM
6 teams representing the east? I mean, I know we're the weaker conference, but c'mon...

Kstat
02-03-2011, 08:07 PM
Horford and Johnson without a doubt both deserve to be in.

Marlin
02-03-2011, 08:11 PM
Joe Johnson and Al Horford shouldn't be in it. I expected Josh Smith to be in it instead of those 2.

A lot of overrated players on decent teams are on this list.

Joe Johnson should absolutely be on it. He's playing out of his mind, in January he probably played the best ball of his career, 27 ppg, 4.4 rbs, 5 ast, close to 55% from the floor.

I mean , I know he had a tough stretch before the injury, but he's gone on a tear since coming back.

Horford as been the anchor of that team, he deserves it as well.

Besides, if we really want to write in someone, let that be Boozer. Probably for Bosh, altough I understand why he's on that team.

Day-V
02-03-2011, 08:11 PM
It was a conundrum. You can't justify only taking one spur, but you also can't justify taking four PGs. Duncan was the beneficiary of a numbers game.

Valid point.



At first glance, I like the East's line-up more than the West's.

Cactus Jax
02-03-2011, 08:16 PM
First of all, it shows how weak the eastern conference is in terms of superstar players, that you could barely get a list of 12 to qualify this season, injuries had a part to do with it but still. I would only replace Joe Johnson with Boozer, just cause I think Booz is doing as good of a job on a better team, but maybe they wanted another guard.

As far as the west goes, I guess Ginobili had to make it but I had him off my list just cause of the sheer number of great players out west. Kevin Love better be Stern's pick, but Blake Griffin should actually start the game. Aldridge in Portland should feel snubbed as should Z Bo or Rudy Gay from the Grizzlies, them being over .500 out west is quite a feat.

As Kstat said Tony Parker was part of a number's game, as there's no way he makes it even over a Steve Nash type, there would have to be at least 2 injuries for him to make it.

The only thing Pacer related it might do is open a spot for Paul George in the Rookie Game w/ Blake I assume resting for the big show.

spreedom
02-03-2011, 08:38 PM
If Kevin Love doesn't make the team, I'm not watching the game. It's just complete stupidity that a guy averaging 20/16/3 with 45% on threes isn't one of the top reserves.

Is this year the best indication ever that name value comprises 70% of the vote (starters and coaches)? There's NO reason that Duncan or even Griffin should be in front of Love (much less Yao and Gasol).

Young
02-03-2011, 09:10 PM
I think Steve Nash should have made it. I don't care how many other points guards there are Westbrook/Deron Williams could play the two this game. Steve Nash is too good to not be an all star.

Rudy Gay and LaMarcus Aldridge are also deserving. The Grizzles are not a great team by any means but Rudy is a heck of a player. And what LaMarcus Aldridge is doing in the absence of Brandon Roy is amazing.

Kevin Love not making the team is a joke. I don't care if he replaces Yao the fact that he isn't already on the team is a joke.

There will always be the guys snubbed though. It's never going to be perfect. I still hate fans being able to vote the starters. If they had put Allen Iverson on the list he would be a starter.

Kstat
02-03-2011, 09:10 PM
Steve Nash would have been the 5th point guard behind Parker. He had zero chance of getting in.

Nash isn't the dominant force he once was and his team isn't winning anymore.

ECKrueger
02-03-2011, 09:18 PM
Just a thought, what if each team sent one player to the game?

pacer4ever
02-03-2011, 09:21 PM
Just a thought, what if each team sent one player to the game?

That would be really dumb there would be a lot of snubs. In baseball there are a lot more players so that really isnt that bad bad but in basketball it would be really dumb.

ECKrueger
02-03-2011, 09:25 PM
Yet most of this thread is complaining about the snubs.

pacer4ever
02-03-2011, 09:30 PM
Yet most of this thread is complaining about the snubs.

That would mean Andrea Barnyard would be an all star or better yet Boobie Gibson or whoever get in from Clevelend he would be the worst all star of all time :laugh:

Marlin
02-03-2011, 09:38 PM
That would mean Andrea Barnyard would be an all star or better yet Boobie Gibson or whoever get in from Clevelend he would be the worst all star of all time :laugh:
LOL, I've heard him called many different names, but that's the most far off, and yet funny, I've come to read. :laugh:

ECKrueger
02-03-2011, 09:45 PM
I agree there would be some bad players in, but personally I would rather see that. I think it is dumb how all star appearances mean so much to a players resume anyway. I would say every team has one at least some what deserving player.

Merz
02-03-2011, 09:54 PM
Instead of making sure each team gets a player for the game how about they at least make sure each team gets a representative in the weekend (whether it's the game, dunk, 3-point contest, etc.)

pacer4ever
02-03-2011, 10:05 PM
Instead of making sure each team gets a player for the game how about they at least make sure each team gets a representative in the weekend (whether it's the game, dunk, 3-point contest, etc.)

Thats not a bad idea. MLB has that rule to get small market teams players know like the Pirtes. I think teams like indy need the national exposure

pwee31
02-03-2011, 10:10 PM
I'm almost willing to be money that David Stern picks Steve Nash as the replacement to Yao

pwee31
02-03-2011, 10:11 PM
6 teams representing the East is really bad, but would you really pick any other player from one of the other 9 teams over a player that was selected?

ECKrueger
02-03-2011, 10:24 PM
Instead of making sure each team gets a player for the game how about they at least make sure each team gets a representative in the weekend (whether it's the game, dunk, 3-point contest, etc.)

Ok, that I can agree with.

Hicks
02-03-2011, 11:37 PM
I'm wowed at the sight of a rookie making the all-star team.

But, you know, he completely deserves it. I had no idea how good Blake Griffin would be. I really dismissed him in June of 2009 as a de facto #1 pick. I had no clue on him. He's amazing.

Day-V
02-03-2011, 11:47 PM
I'm wowed at the sight of a rookie making the all-star team.

But, you know, he completely deserves it. I had no idea how good Blake Griffin would be. I really dismissed him in June of 2009 as a de facto #1 pick. I had no clue on him. He's amazing.

I agree, he's an amazing player and totally deserves being on the All-Star team.




But I still do not consider him to be a rookie.

JB24
02-04-2011, 12:05 AM
Assuming Blake opts out of the Rookie-Sophomore game, i'm thinking the NBA replaces him with either PG or Ed Davis.

BRushWithDeath
02-04-2011, 07:59 AM
Kevin Love is a rich man's Troy Murphy. Hollow numbers.

Dece
02-04-2011, 08:17 AM
What a huge snub to Monta Ellis...and Rudy Gay for that matter. I hate the allstar game anymore, they never get it right.

ballism
02-04-2011, 08:23 AM
In one playoffs game, I'd still take Timmy over any of the PFs that got 'snubbed'. So I'm fine with that selection. He's not the most deserving player, but he is key part of the best team. I'm fine with that. It's not like Yao who got voted in while injured.
I will love to watch Timmy in there one more time. Kevin Love will have his chances. This isn't All NBA team selection, All Star weekend is just for fun.

ballism
02-04-2011, 08:44 AM
I'm almost willing to be money that David Stern picks Steve Nash as the replacement to Yao

But when you look at it, Nash has 17-11 while being heart and soul of a .500 team. His shooting numbers are amazing, and his team is surging. Nash deserves to be there. Personally, I'd take him over Deron Williams this year. Deron is the better defender, and he is also very important to his team, but even with him Jazz have been losing chemistry and focus, and are slipping more than any other team since X-mas; besides, Deron is way less efficient than Nash. Also, I'd take Nash over Timmy.

Love and Nash both deserve to be in, tbh. Same goes for Zach Randolph, who's putting up 21-14 the last couple months on a .500 team. Whichever is named by Commish, I'll be fine with the decision.
I just hope it's not Lamarcus Aldridge, he's been 25-10 for one month, and that is way less than what the other three have accomplished.

Trader Joe
02-04-2011, 12:03 PM
Kevin Love is a rich man's Troy Murphy. Hollow numbers.

Silly.

LA_Confidential
02-04-2011, 12:30 PM
That would mean Andrea Barnyard would be an all star or better yet Boobie Gibson or whoever get in from Clevelend he would be the worst all star of all time :laugh:

I have no doubt that either of them could win the 3 point shoot out. Oh yeah, Mo Williams was an All-Star last year or year before (dont remember exactly).

pacer4ever
02-04-2011, 02:19 PM
Kevin Love is a rich man's Troy Murphy. Hollow numbers.

u must not watch the twolves much

BRushWithDeath
02-04-2011, 02:27 PM
u must not watch the twolves much

NBA players, scouts, and coaches agree with me.

But no, of course I don't. Because they are terrible. Even with a guy putting up admittedly monster numbers.

pacer4ever
02-04-2011, 02:40 PM
NBA players, scouts, and coaches agree with me.

But no, of course I don't. Because they are terrible. Even with a guy putting up admittedly monster numbers.

K love doesnt play a ton of defense but he is a much better defender than Troy. Plus he can post up which troy can't do and he is a hell of a passer. Plus is a locker room leader watch 24 hrs with Kevin Love on NBA tv.

Justin Tyme
02-04-2011, 03:04 PM
Kevin Love is a rich man's Troy Murphy. Hollow numbers.


Is that right?

ROTFL!!! I'm just glad I wasn't taking a drink of tea when I read this. I'm not into cleaning a monitor, keyboard, and desk. Hollow numbers my ***. How could anyone make a statement comparing Love to Murphy. You lost some credibilty for that comment. Geez.

Justin Tyme
02-04-2011, 03:09 PM
I have no doubt that either of them could win the 3 point shoot out. Oh yeah, Mo Williams was an All-Star last year or year before (dont remember exactly).



Only b/c LeBron cried about Orlando having 3 players on the Allstar team and at the time Cleveland only had 2. Stern took care of it for King James.

spreedom
02-04-2011, 03:21 PM
NBA players, scouts, and coaches agree with me.

But no, of course I don't. Because they are terrible. Even with a guy putting up admittedly monster numbers.


That's even more ridiculous than the original statement. The more you defend this, the more foolish you will look.

BRushWithDeath
02-04-2011, 03:22 PM
Is that right?

ROTFL!!! I'm just glad I wasn't taking a drink of tea when I read this. I'm not into cleaning a monitor, keyboard, and desk. Hollow numbers my ***. How could anyone make a statement comparing Love to Murphy. You lost some credibilty for that comment. Geez.

He is clearly better than Murphy but he isn't nearly as good as the numbers say.

Again, players, coaches, and scouts agree with me.

Kstat
02-04-2011, 04:22 PM
Kevin love is a rich man's troy Murphy like Reggie Miller was a rich man's Steve Alford.

And no, coaches, players and scouts do not agree with you.

JB24
02-04-2011, 04:36 PM
Love is a fantastic rebounder, but i'm really not seeing why he's a bigger snub than Aldridge. He's on a terrible team in part of his equally terrible defense, doesn't command a double team in the post or when facing up, and hasn't shown the ability to carry a team on his back when they need him to. Aldridge, though he doesn't have the same propensity for rebounding, is at the very least an aware defender with considerable length and has at various times during the season literally carried an understrength Portland- and as a result has had the kitchen sink thrown at him and handled it well enough.

Kstat
02-04-2011, 04:39 PM
Ok, first off, Aldridge hasn't shown the ability to carry a team either. I'm not sure what that even means in this instance. Even without Roy, Aldridge has a lot more around him than love does.

Second, Kevin Love gets double teamed even when he doesn't have the ball. Every time a shot goes up, 2 guys are trying to shield him from the hoop, and he keeps coming up with the ball anyway.

Love's defense is also not terrible. That's silly.

JB24
02-04-2011, 04:57 PM
Love regularly has three bodies on him when he goes up for a rebound, which is what makes him such a great rebounder, but i'm not seeing that many teams doubling him when he has the ball in his hands. Aldridge has dealt with that quite a bit this season, and has become a much better passer out of the double team.

Ok, Love's defense is not terrible but it's bad. And Aldridge is at least solid at that end, so it's a significant difference.

And i've seen Portland go to Aldridge in several late game situations and seen him come through for the most part. Yet to see that from Love. Yeah, Minny are bad but they're not 15 games worse than Portland. Part of that has to be on Love.

spreedom
02-04-2011, 04:58 PM
He is clearly better than Murphy but he isn't nearly as good as the numbers say.

Again, players, coaches, and scouts agree with me.


I would love to see you qualify that with some kind of evidence. And the fact that he wasn't voted into the All Star game doesn't really count, considering that it only accounts for coaches' votes and the fact that none of them would have the opportunity to write "Kevin Love is a rich man's Troy Murphy" on their ballots.

Kstat
02-04-2011, 05:05 PM
Love regularly has three bodies on him when he goes up for a rebound, which is what makes him such a great rebounder, but i'm not seeing that many teams doubling him when he has the ball in his hands. Aldridge has dealt with that quite a bit this season, and has become a much better passer out of the double team.

Ok, Love's defense is not terrible but it's bad. And Aldridge is at least solid at that end, so it's a significant difference.

And i've seen Portland go to Aldridge in several late game situations and seen him come through for the most part. Yet to see that from Love. Yeah, Minny are bad but they're not 15 games worse than Portland. Part of that has to be on Love.

Minnesota would be much worse than Cleveland without Love. They are definitely 15 games worse than Portland on paper.

spreedom
02-04-2011, 05:09 PM
Minnesota would be much worse than Cleveland without Love. They are definitely 15 games worse than Portland on paper.


Yeah, Minnesota is nearly as bad as Cleveland, and that's with Kevin Love.

I don't think any of the other starters on Minnesota (except maybe Michael Beasley) would start on any other team in the entire league. Including Cleveland.

And their bench is simply awful.

BRushWithDeath
02-04-2011, 05:20 PM
Kevin love is a rich man's troy Murphy like Reggie Miller was a rich man's Steve Alford.

And no, coaches, players and scouts do not agree with you.



Like I said ... for some reason coaches/scouts don't have great respect for Love's game.
about 22 hours ago


Players feel the same way.


Troy Murphy was just a more familiar version of a numbers driven player who doesn't care about team success.

Kstat
02-04-2011, 05:28 PM
Who knew John Hollinger was a player? I don't see him naming any specific players or scouts there. He doesn't say if he's stating a fact or guessing.

But, by all means, go on and tie yourself to that very ambiguous quote from a guy that gets his basketball fix from a spreadsheet.

Mackey_Rose
02-04-2011, 05:35 PM
Love puts up fantastic (crazy in Love's case) numbers on a bad team, but defensively, he is a nightmare. How is a comparison to Troy Murphy so absurd? The only difference is that Love's numbers are better, and his team is even worse.

Nothing that BWD has said in this thread is wrong.

BRushWithDeath
02-04-2011, 05:36 PM
Who knew John Hollinger was a player? I don't see him naming any specific players or scouts there. He doesn't say if he's stating a fact or guessing.

But, by all means, go on and tie yourself to that very ambiguous quote from a guy that gets his basketball fix from a spreadsheet.

I have personally heard players say similar things about Love.

And disparage Hollinger all you like but he is connected and respected by many within the league.

Kstat
02-04-2011, 05:39 PM
Really? What NBA players are you on personal speaking terms with?

Love's two biggest fans on TV are Charles Barkley and Chris Webber-two of the best PFs of all time. Guys that know firsthand how hard it is do do what Kevin Love is doing. I'd say that trumps what John Hollinger and his spreadsheet has to say about him.

spreedom
02-04-2011, 05:44 PM
I think Love is slightly below average defensively. That does mean that it's the most glaring weakness, but he isn't among the worst defensive players in the league by any stretch. He just doesn't have any defensive help around him to help him out when he gets beaten.

And that Hollinger quote to me is just him saying "Kevin Love didn't make the All Star team."

Kstat
02-04-2011, 05:46 PM
Yep. Kevin love's defense is NOT terrible. Players, coaches, my barber, and the guy that sweeps my sidewalk all agree with me.

xBulletproof
02-04-2011, 05:53 PM
Really? What NBA players are you on personal speaking terms with?

I could be wrong, but if I recall correctly he works at a place that involves working with players. Don't know details, and I believe it's better that way.

I don't completely agree about Love, but I read a story about him being on the bench during his 30 point, 30 rebound game. A Wolves player said Love informed him he was going for the 30/30 at a time when he only had 14 points or something. He went out of his way to acquire the points for the 30/30 game in the 4th.

EDIT: I was wrong, he had 7 points at the time in the 3rd quarter when he said it.

.

Mackey_Rose
02-04-2011, 05:55 PM
I could be wrong, but if I recall correctly he works at a place that involves working with players. Don't know details, and I believe it's better that way.

You are not wrong.

Kstat
02-04-2011, 06:11 PM
So, he can answer my question: what NBA players is he on speaking terms with?

I don't care what he does for a living. Doesn't mean he can hide behind ambiguous babble. If you have so much inside knowledge, then name names. Otherwise, don't bring it up.

Justin Tyme
02-04-2011, 06:20 PM
Love is a fantastic rebounder, but i'm really not seeing why he's a bigger snub than Aldridge. He's on a terrible team in part of his equally terrible defense, doesn't command a double team in the post or when facing up, and hasn't shown the ability to carry a team on his back when they need him to. Aldridge, though he doesn't have the same propensity for rebounding, is at the very least an aware defender with considerable length and has at various times during the season literally carried an understrength Portland- and as a result has had the kitchen sink thrown at him and handled it well enough.



Aldridge was not having a good season until about a dozen games ago. If he had been playing like that all season then yes, but he hasn't. OTH, Z-Bo has been having a great year, and he deserves it more than Aldridge.

Kstat
02-04-2011, 06:33 PM
LaMarcus Aldridge is probably the 3rd most deserving PF left out, behind Love and then Randolph.

I'm amused that Love is supposedly not nearly as good offensively as Aldridge, yet he manages to average more points, and more assists....

Not to mention, if Kevin love did not pull down a single offensive rebound this season, he would still have more total rebounds than LaMarcus Aldridge...

BringJackBack
02-04-2011, 08:19 PM
Kevin Love made it.

Kstat
02-04-2011, 08:26 PM
Probably the easiest decision Stern has ever made.

spreedom
02-04-2011, 09:12 PM
Hopefully.

Cactus Jax
02-05-2011, 12:39 AM
I guess coach Pop gets to decide who starts. If he goes with his heart he'd probably pick Duncan, if he goes with the NBA appeal and brains of the game being in LA he'd pick Blake Griffin.

Kstat
02-05-2011, 02:20 AM
You'd think his heart would be with what a great story it would be for a clipper to start an all star game in LA, as opposed to tim duncan getting a token start in his 14th go around....

pacer4ever
02-05-2011, 02:23 AM
I guess coach Pop gets to decide who starts. If he goes with his heart he'd probably pick Duncan, if he goes with the NBA appeal and brains of the game being in LA he'd pick Blake Griffin.

i think stern gets to pick he will probly go with Blake for the reasons Kstat said

shags
02-05-2011, 09:00 PM
I think people are forgetting that the Lakers are the #1 tenant of Staples Center, not to mention the back-to-back defending NBA champions.

But Gregg Popovich knows both those things. That's why I'll be stunned if Pau Gasol isn't named the starter. Pop doesn't give a crap about how great a story it'd be if Blake Griffin starts.

Also, I think Tim Duncan gets the least amount of minutes of any All-Star. They've been monitoring his minutes all year, and Pop isn't going to waste them on a meaningless All-Star game.

Trader Joe
02-06-2011, 02:31 AM
Kevin Love is putting up numbers we haven't seen in 25 years.

I don't care how bad your team is, those aren't hollow numbers. Which was BWD's original claim. That was a silly statement to say the least.

As far as knowing people, I think BWD's ties are there, but unfortunately I don't think I can consider them far enough reaching outside of a couple players on the Pacers to really believe the overall opinion of most NBA players is that Love isn't respected.

And if coaches and scouts don't respect Love, well I think that is more an indictment on them than on Love.


20 and 16. 20 and 16. Troy Murphy could only have wet dreams about those numbers.

Mourning
02-06-2011, 05:23 AM
I'm just wondering why Ray Allen is on the East all-star team? Sure, he's a good player and a phenomenal 3point shooter and he plays on the Celtics, but come on, there has to be a better guard who didn't get selected.

ballism
02-06-2011, 05:52 AM
I'm just wondering why Ray Allen is on the East all-star team? Sure, he's a good player and a phenomenal 3point shooter and he plays on the Celtics, but come on, there has to be a better guard who didn't get selected.

Because he's the guy with the most minutes on the best team in the East? His efficiency numbers are crazy, he's healthy and consistent. I'm stunned how underappreciated Ray Allen is. If I had to take an All Star spot from the Celtics, it wouldn't be Ray.

On the other hand, who is there in the Eastern conference more deserving? Iguodala? Granger? Stephen Jackson? Jameer Nelson? Andrea Bargnani? Ray Felton? Maybe Boozer, if he hadn't missed so many games.

The only one who I think really deserves to be in is Andrew Bogut. The second best C in the league has to be in. But his team has been bad, and he's missed games. So it's a reasonable snub.

Kstat
02-06-2011, 07:19 AM
I'm just wondering why Ray Allen is on the East all-star team? Sure, he's a good player and a phenomenal 3point shooter and he plays on the Celtics, but come on, there has to be a better guard who didn't get selected.

There wasn't.

I'd have taken Allen over Piece and KG. He's been Boston's 2nd most important player this season.