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View Full Version : Donnie to replace l.Bird? M.Jackson as Coach?



PacerGuy
02-02-2011, 11:14 PM
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-knickswalsh020211

One league executive with strong ties to Walsh suggests: ďIf [Larry] Bird doesnít want to come back in Indiana, donít be surprised if Donnie ends up back running the team again. [Pacers owner] Herb Simon still loves him, and Donnie isnít ready to retire yet.Ē

http://matt-moore.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/22748484/27352641?source=rss_blogs_NBA

Berger continued, saying the Pacers will also be re-assessing their coaching position this off-season. "The first order of business will be hiring a new coach, who may very well be interim coach Frank Vogel. There's some other interesting names on the Pacers list though. Former Cavs coach Mike Brown, former Pacer Mark Jackson, and Jazz assistant Tyrone Corbin. Those three names are going to be in the mix, as well as a darkhorse, Hawks assistant Lester Conner, a little-known name around the league, but he was on the Pacers bench last season, and I think he's going to get some consideration."

-----------

-Loved Donnie, not sure I want him back though...
-Nothing excites me on the coaching front, as I'm not a Brown fan, though he'd be "OK". I want someone new - P.Ewing - w/ M.Jackson on his bench? Jackson should not get handed a head coaching job, IMO.

BringJackBack
02-02-2011, 11:15 PM
If either of the two come close to happening:


:vaderno:

ilive4sports
02-02-2011, 11:18 PM
Doubt Donnie is leaving NY. Not sure if Jackson wants to coach here either. I'd rather a more proven guy.

1984
02-02-2011, 11:25 PM
We're forgetting, Walsh is a New York man.

Lord Helmet
02-02-2011, 11:27 PM
Let's bring back Ronnie and JO, too!

Trophy
02-02-2011, 11:29 PM
There's a way better chance of Bird signing an extension.

No way would we bring Walsh back anyway. This is a completely different team and we've moved on from him and his jail cell team.

I doubt Simon wants him back. He's all for bringing back Bird and I think it's up to him.

...And Mark Jackson?
:50cent:

Sollozzo
02-02-2011, 11:29 PM
We're forgetting, Walsh is a New York man.


Yes, but I believe his wife still lives here. Indy is "home" to him I think.

pizza guy
02-02-2011, 11:34 PM
Doubt Donnie is leaving NY. Not sure if Jackson wants to coach here either. I'd rather a more proven guy.

Didn't Donnie wait for years and years to get an opportunity to run the Knicks? And, if he doesn't want to retire, why would he leave Amar'e and the possibility of Melo to come back to Indy?

I think Jackson has a spot in his heart for Indy, but he's a NY guy first as well. He might be a good choice from a PR perspective, but who knows if he'll be any good as a coach? I'd rather have the guy from Utah.

BringJackBack
02-02-2011, 11:37 PM
Based on how Vogel has done so far, I want him to be number one on Indiana's list. He's been THE coach that we have all wanted/needed. He has common sense, he studies film, he gets along with the players, he's confident, and he ran a 1-3 PnP with Darren and Danny to end the game (It didn't go down though) that officially made me really admire him.

PaceBalls
02-02-2011, 11:39 PM
Donnie did a fantastic job here up until the Murphy/Dunleavy trade. Who remembers the Pacers of the 80s?

I do.

ilive4sports
02-02-2011, 11:41 PM
Based on how Vogel has done so far, I want him to be number one on Indiana's list. He's been THE coach that we have all wanted/needed. He has common sense, he studies film, he gets along with the players, he's confident, and he ran a 1-3 PnP with Darren and Danny to end the game (It didn't go down though) that officially made me really admire him.

I'm not giving Vogel the job after two games. I've seen good stuff from him, I loved that 1-3 PnP, but he needs to get the defense on the right track.

BringJackBack
02-02-2011, 11:43 PM
I'm not giving Vogel the job after two games. I've seen good stuff from him, I loved that 1-3 PnP, but he needs to get the defense on the right track.

I'm certainly not either. I'm just saying he has deserved the first interview so far.

HC
02-02-2011, 11:58 PM
Personally I have no interest whatsoever in either of these scenarios coming to fruition.

PR07
02-03-2011, 12:20 AM
Mark Jackson might be okay, but Bird just spent the better part of what? 4 years? trying to get us out of all the long-term bad contracts that Walsh committed us to. That would be like Walsh getting rewarded for screwing up earlier.

Hoop
02-03-2011, 12:59 AM
There is only one way that this could ever happen.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v94/Hooping/HellFreezesOver.jpg

Jon Theodore
02-03-2011, 01:04 AM
Unless Donnie is out of his wheelchair, I don't want him running this team....I mean whats up Lebron.

cdash
02-03-2011, 01:15 AM
Based on how Vogel has done so far, I want him to be number one on Indiana's list. He's been THE coach that we have all wanted/needed. He has common sense, he studies film, he gets along with the players, he's confident, and he ran a 1-3 PnP with Darren and Danny to end the game (It didn't go down though) that officially made me really admire him.

This is very unlike you my friend. He's won two games against teams with a combined losing streak of 36 games, and we barely escaped from one of them. He's saying the right things, he seems to be able to communicate effectively with the players, but let's not get ahead of ourselves. He is young and unproven. He has spent his entire basketball career learning from Jim O'Brien, not a guy whose style meshed well with anyone around here. His rotations are nice, but make no mistake about it: Bird is dictating a lot of who plays and how long. Vogel, as most interim coaches are, is largely a management puppet. Don't get me wrong, I like him, but are you sure he is the guy to take us to the next level? I'm not so sure. I'd feel a lot more comfortable with an experienced coach.

Psyren
02-03-2011, 01:20 AM
I don't want either Donnie or Mark Jackson here.

I'm not saying I want Vogel back based on 2 games. However, too many people are immediately writing him off.

In my mind, at least right now, he is the coach and I'm not even thinking of trying to find another new one. I'm more than willing to give him his fair shot. If he works out and can turn things around, I think you'd be hard pressed not to bring him back.

I'll start to worry about a coach again if/when Vogel doesn't work out. We've had enough coach drama.

Give Frank his fair chance. Maybe, just maybe, he could be the answer. If not, we can worry at a later time.

spazzxb
02-03-2011, 01:27 AM
Why did we get rid of Lester again?

BringJackBack
02-03-2011, 01:32 AM
cdash:
This is very unlike you my friend.

I know. :blush:


He's won two games against teams with a combined losing streak of 36 games, and we barely escaped from one of them.

I understand the Raptors game being wrote off, but IMO the Cavs game has more merit than beating any other 20 win team (Such as Philly) on the road due to how hard they fought and how they actually thought that they were going to win it. I digress though, because it could be looked at the other way (The other way being, "They've lost 21 games in a row LOLOLOL").


He's saying the right things, he seems to be able to communicate effectively with the players, but let's not get ahead of ourselves. He is young and unproven. He has spent his entire basketball career learning from Jim O'Brien, not a guy whose style meshed well with anyone around here. His rotations are nice, but make no mistake about it: Bird is dictating a lot of who plays and how long. Vogel, as most interim coaches are, is largely a management puppet. Don't get me wrong, I like him, but are you sure he is the guy to take us to the next level? I'm not so sure. I'd feel a lot more comfortable with an experienced coach.

Hmm.. Great points. My point in the post you quoted though, is that if he keeps it up all season than I'm willing to give him the first interview and a puncher's chance of being brought back*.

He's just been an extension of an average fan so far.. And that is too refreshing. This honeymoon will be over, and we'll go on a 3-5 game losing streak, but at least we'll be seeing what should have been all along; Best players playing and the ball in Collison's hands while getting our bigs easy buckets. The best thing is how simple the offense is. About him being mentored by Jim; Overall, based on his comments, I think he found Jim to lack common sense. He's been doing what's best.

My overall point is that he's been getting our team to play at it's highest level possible. That may or may not end up in a good result for the team, but he's getting the best out of our guys right now. The players really seem to like him.

I think he MAY be a better option than Mike Brown. Just maybe. Only because I get a strange feeling that Mike Brown would wear on us because he doesn't always play the right guys and his offensive schemes are questionable. He sure would ooze all of the defensive potential out of us though.

Don't get me wrong though, if there were better coaches out there I'd love to bring them in over Vogel. B. Scott, Rick Adelman, Tom Thibadeau, or Nate McMillan (They say he'll be available, but let's get real. He won't be) are great coaches for us to pick up.. Mike Brown, Tyrone Corbin, and Mike Budenholzer (Or Mark Jackson :yuck:) are a step below them in my opinion.

So, assuming (Yeah I know the joke) that Vogel keeps it up (Which probably isn't the very smartest assumption to make), here's my list if I'm Bird when I'm interviewing coaches:

1. Vogel
2. Corbin
3/4. Budenholzer/Brown
5. The rest

*I should have made a bigger emphasis on the "First in line" thing I said. I didn't mean automatically give him an extension, I meant if he keeps it up, he deserves to be in the frontrunning list for our next head coach.

cdash
02-03-2011, 01:37 AM
I don't want either Donnie or Mark Jackson here.

I'm not saying I want Vogel back based on 2 games. However, too many people are immediately writing him off.

In my mind, at least right now, he is the coach and I'm not even thinking of trying to find another new one. I'm more than willing to give him his fair shot. If he works out and can turn things around, I think you'd be hard pressed not to bring him back.

I'll start to worry about a coach again if/when Vogel doesn't work out. We've had enough coach drama.

Give Frank his fair chance. Maybe, just maybe, he could be the answer. If not, we can worry at a later time.

...you do realize he has been labeled as the interim head coach, right? That means barring some sort of miracle finish, the job will be someone else's next season. He was not brought in to right the ship, he was promoted to do what Bird and management want him to do. Vogel isn't expected to be the long-term answer. People are writing him off (if you can even call it that) because he is an interim head coach.

cdash
02-03-2011, 01:40 AM
*I should have made a bigger emphasis on the "First in line" thing I said. I didn't mean automatically give him an extension, I meant if he keeps it up, he deserves to be in the frontrunning list for our next head coach.

Ahhh, fair enough. I am on board with him getting the first interview, and if things go well, with him being a candidate for the job. I thought you were kind of handing the reigns over to him. My mistake.

For what it's worth, I do like how he has handled things so far and do like the changes I've seen--but that defense absolutely must improve or we aren't going to beat many good teams.

BringJackBack
02-03-2011, 01:42 AM
I don't know if the defense has to do with the players or the coach though. We were playing stellar defense earlier in the season, but it faded away long before Vogel was handed the reigns.. Like way back in December.. I think it may be a talent problem more than anything (And Danny's defense has been atrocious.. Ask Mark and Slick).

cdash
02-03-2011, 01:46 AM
I don't know if the defense has to do with the players or the coach though. We were playing stellar defense earlier in the season, but it faded away long before Vogel was handed the reigns.. Like way back in December.. I think it may be a talent problem more than anything (And Danny's defense has been atrocious.. Ask Mark and Slick).

As with most things, it's a little bit of both I'm sure. Danny sure has regressed back to his lazy *** defense. In fact, his overall game has been pretty damn lazy. He's reverted back to chucking up a bunch of crappy contested jump shots a lot. Regardless, you can't give up 110+ points to a team as untalented as the Cavs. I don't care if they were at home trying to avoid history or not, that lineup should not score that many points against anyone.

BringJackBack
02-03-2011, 01:52 AM
Danny has really been pissing me off, not going to lie. But back to the defense; tonight we had a terrible time closing out on shooters, and I think most of it has to do with the defensive studs tio of Collison/Dunleavy/Granger who do a craptastic job of closing out on shooters.

On top of that, Hibbert has been a half-step slow on everything since the beginning of the season; He's been letting some guards drive at him with ease..

Hans and Josh are lacking in the defensive awareness department (Rush is too as a wing, but I'll get attacked if I don't put it in parenthesis).. What Ryan Anderson did to Tyler was gross.

Last but not least FOULING. We let them shoot 44 free throws..

What could Vogel have done? He could have probably went with George a bit more, even though somehow Anthony Parker was putting him to work, he could have told the players to never dig inside and just stay on the shooters, and he could have kept Mike and Collison off the court at the same time (Mike and Collison are a bad defensive punch, Sookie pointed that out earlier).

Psyren
02-03-2011, 02:06 AM
...you do realize he has been labeled as the interim head coach, right? That means barring some sort of miracle finish, the job will be someone else's next season. He was not brought in to right the ship, he was promoted to do what Bird and management want him to do. Vogel isn't expected to be the long-term answer. People are writing him off (if you can even call it that) because he is an interim head coach.

So, I assume you're not familiar with Leslie Frazier or Jason Garrett in the NFL?

Yes, I do realize he's been labeled as that. But you seem to be quite confident he won't be here. Do you have some inside information already making a guarantee he's gone?

Give him a chance. I know he could not be here. He also could be.

Right now he's the coach. I'll worry about next year when the time rolls around.

Isaac
02-03-2011, 03:15 AM
For the record I would LOVE Mike Brown. He deserves a shot at actually coaching a team, which he wasn't really doing with the LeBrons. He was an assitant coach to LeBron, but still managed everything very well.

thefeistyone
02-03-2011, 05:14 AM
Frank certainly gets an interview. I kind of like the guy and how he carries himself, but let's be honest. He's beat 2 bad teams and made some common sense rotation changes...He'll have a decent body of work when the season ends.

I've always been a little partial to Mark Jackson. I think he was the type of player that commonly makes a good coach. He's very smart, has good ethics, and is well liked by the pacers community. He does come with some risk as he would be a little raw as a coach. I would be ok with giving him a chance if Vogel doesn't pan out the rest of the season. Jackson would be better than Corbin IMHO and I'm not sure if you can take a whole lot from Mike Brown being able to coach Lebron for a few years.

As for Walsh...Let him go, we don't need or want him. He's had his time here, let him sign Melo and enjoy New York and retire.

wintermute
02-03-2011, 07:01 AM
If Woj is to be believed, the reason why Walsh might leave NY isn't because he doesn't like it there, it's because Isiah Thomas has the owner's ear and could be angling to get his old job back. See this:

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-knickswalsh020211

I don't think I'd want Donnie back for another tour here. I'd rather have some fresh blood.

15th parallel
02-03-2011, 07:38 AM
As much as I loved what Donnie did for the franchise, I think he's not a good option for the Pacers right now. The way he ended his tenure here was so bad, it had crippled the team for the past years, most notably the ludicrous contract of Tinsley.

I have a feeling that right now the owner still likes Bird and will be the first option if Bird chooses to come back to the FO next year.

Unclebuck
02-03-2011, 08:52 AM
Donnie's wife still lives in indy.

I just hope the pacers hire Mike Brown this summer. And you here reports how much Herb Simon likes Mike Brown - it makes sense

pwee31
02-03-2011, 08:54 AM
I prefer Bird to Walsh.

If it weren't for NY's big market, the Knicks would still be terrible. Walsh just lucked out that Amare didn't want to be Nash's sidekick, and Charlotte didn't want to pay Felton

indygeezer
02-03-2011, 08:56 AM
Donnie cleared out a ton of bad contracts for NY. He deserved exec of the year for that alone.

Mark Jackson? Are you kidding me? He considered himself too good to be an assistant....what has he done to earn or prove himself worthy of a HC position?

travmil
02-03-2011, 09:02 AM
We're forgetting, Walsh is a New York man.

I have no comment on your post or this thread. Just wanted to say that I laugh out loud every time I see your avatar. Top notch!

If there were a PD Forum Award category for Best/Funniest Avatar, I would vote for it hands down!

Unclebuck
02-03-2011, 09:07 AM
We're forgetting, Walsh is a New York man.

He gets back to Indiana whenever he can, his wife and a lot of his family still live in Indy.

He is getting older and is not in good health, he wants to get back here.

pacergod2
02-03-2011, 09:58 AM
I am going to stick with Bill Laimbeer. He's the guy I would like coaching this team. I would also prefer to have Bird back. It is his vision and what he put together.

I wouldn't hate Mike Brown, but I also don't think he is the best coach we could find. I think I would almost prefer Vogel to Brown, assuming Vogel continues to improve as a coach and gets comfortable with game management.

Day-V
02-03-2011, 10:10 AM
I'm surprised Mike Woodson hasn't been in the discussion in terms of taking over as coach.

LA_Confidential
02-03-2011, 10:23 AM
I am going to stick with Bill Laimbeer. He's the guy I would like coaching this team. I would also prefer to have Bird back. It is his vision and what he put together.

I wouldn't hate Mike Brown, but I also don't think he is the best coach we could find. I think I would almost prefer Vogel to Brown, assuming Vogel continues to improve as a coach and gets comfortable with game management.


This. I would absolutely LOVE to have Bill as the next HC. People like to poop on his coaching resume because he was a WNBA guy. He won 3 titles. Their aren't any super athletes in the WNBA so they have to rely heavily on fundamental basketball. That means the guy knows all about X's and O's.

Even though LEGEND may have hated his guts while they competed, Im sure he has some level of respect for Laimbeer as a competitor. And if you ask him, I doubt he wouldnt have wanted Bill on those Celtics teams.

Larry and Bill would be a PR Dream.

Day-V
02-03-2011, 10:25 AM
This. I would absolutely LOVE to have Bill as the next HC. People like to poop on his coaching resume because he was a WNBA guy. He won 3 titles. Their aren't any super athletes in the WNBA so they have to rely heavily on fundamental basketball. That means the guy knows all about X's and O's.

Even though LEGEND may have hated his guts while they competed, Im sure he has some level of respect for Laimbeer as a competitor. And if you ask him, I doubt he wouldnt have wanted Bill on those Celtics teams.

Larry and Bill would be a PR Dream.

Plus, I think Bill would LOVE working with a guy like Tyler. And vice versa.

threein73
02-03-2011, 10:30 AM
I certainly hope Vogel and the team do well enough the rest of the year to make Frank the front runner. However, if that is not the case I personally like Lester Conner of the possible names mentioned.

cdash
02-03-2011, 10:33 AM
So, I assume you're not familiar with Leslie Frazier or Jason Garrett in the NFL?

Yes, I do realize he's been labeled as that. But you seem to be quite confident he won't be here. Do you have some inside information already making a guarantee he's gone?

Give him a chance. I know he could not be here. He also could be.

Right now he's the coach. I'll worry about next year when the time rolls around.

I'm extremely familiar with both. This isn't the NFL.

I'm fairly confident he won't be the head coach here next year, yes. Am I guaranteeing it? Absolutely not. Obviously if I was privy to such information I wouldn't be posting here.

It's not me deciding whether to give the guy a chance or not. I'm on record saying that I like the guy. I just don't think he's going to be the permanent coach unless he reels off an amazingly impression record the rest of the season with a strong playoff showing.

graphic-er
02-03-2011, 10:39 AM
I am going to stick with Bill Laimbeer. He's the guy I would like coaching this team. I would also prefer to have Bird back. It is his vision and what he put together.

I wouldn't hate Mike Brown, but I also don't think he is the best coach we could find. I think I would almost prefer Vogel to Brown, assuming Vogel continues to improve as a coach and gets comfortable with game management.

Bill Laimbeer, I've not heard his name in the running for any other coaching position over the last couple years. Why this guy, why now?

DaveP63
02-03-2011, 10:45 AM
Let's wait until after game 82 and see what happens.

LA_Confidential
02-03-2011, 10:48 AM
Bill Laimbeer, I've not heard his name in the running for any other coaching position over the last couple years. Why this guy, why now?

I just think its because of his rep. Which could be more of a blessing than a curse for a team like ours. Whomever lands him as a HC will almost always deliver tough, hard nosed performances. Definately something we'll need to be successful.

Hell If Zeke can coach us with little to no resume, why cant Bill?

cdash
02-03-2011, 10:54 AM
Hell If Zeke can coach us with little to no resume, why cant Bill?

Because Zeke was a failure and we learned our lesson?

Plus Zeke was a big name, and he had ties to the state because he led IU to a national championship.

That being said, I wouldn't totally be against Laimbeer, but he certainly wouldn't be my first choice.

LA_Confidential
02-03-2011, 11:00 AM
Because Zeke was a failure and we learned our lesson?

Plus Zeke was a big name, and he had ties to the state because he led IU to a national championship.

That being said, I wouldn't totally be against Laimbeer, but he certainly wouldn't be my first choice.

Naw, I was talking about the Pistons disconnect. lol
I shoulda been clearer about that.

Young
02-03-2011, 11:39 AM
Donnie's record here speaks for itself.

However I like what Bird has done overall and I think he has earned the chance to come back.

Mark Jackson as coach? I'm not sold...at all. I think there are a lot better canidates.

pacergod2
02-03-2011, 12:24 PM
I think his demeanor would be phenomenal for this team. Also, basketball people who know him say he is brilliant. He coached women, and yes I find this to be a positive. He had to coach more and babysit less with the women. He would bring a better post mentality to this team as well. He would make rebounding and defense a priority. Plus, I think Laimbeer's competitive edge would rub off. He was always known as a great teammate. That is the kind of guy this team needs. To get these young guys to play as a team and with an edge. Focus on rebounding and defense, which is what wins playoff games. Clutch scoring as well, but I think we are going in the right direction with that already.

Tom White
02-04-2011, 09:30 AM
I think Jackson has a spot in his heart for Jackson.....

Fixed.

Roaming Gnome
02-04-2011, 10:27 AM
http://www.stevescottsite.com/nancy_reagan_just_say_no.jpg
to Mark Jackson... Why should I want a guy that feels he is too good to pay his dues in any craft, let alone one that few are successful at? Hell, at least I can say that Bill L has definately asked & put in the work to gain a shot in my eyes...

Graphic-er, Bill is currently an assistant in Minn. He has been seeking an NBA coaching gig for some time... His move to coach in the WNBA was to garner the attention to at least be considered as someone's assistant. From what I understand, Laimbeer was considered toxic and a shot in the WNBA was one of his few if not only avenue into the NBA coaching fraternity.

Just not interested in Donnie coming back, either...

Justin Tyme
02-04-2011, 01:56 PM
Donnie did a fantastic job here up until the Murphy/Dunleavy trade.


So you are dismissing the bringing back of Harrington? That isn't anything I would put in the fantastic column!

Justin Tyme
02-04-2011, 01:58 PM
Mark Jackson might be okay, but Bird just spent the better part of what? 4 years? trying to get us out of all the long-term bad contracts that Walsh committed us to. That would be like Walsh getting rewarded for screwing up earlier.


My 1st thought was Bird cleans up Walsh's mess, and Walsh comes back to create another one. No thanks pass.

jhondog28
02-04-2011, 02:00 PM
Pacers make the playoffs=Vogel is our coach

Pacers dont make playoffs=Mike Brown is our coach

Justin Tyme
02-04-2011, 02:25 PM
[QUOTE=Unclebuck;1154934]

Donnie's wife still lives in indy. /QUOTE]



My understanding is Mrs. Walsh didn't want to to NY with Donnie b/c of her family in Indy. The Walsh's and some family members live next door to each other. (Well, they use to years ago.) From what I heard, they are very close with one another, and have a real affinity for their dogs.

Justin Tyme
02-04-2011, 02:42 PM
Hell If Zeke can coach us with little to no resume, why cant Bill?

I don't believe in fixing other posters posts, but just substitute Bird's name for Zeke's name. Bird had less qualifications to coach than Lamibeer. I'm one who wouldn't be opposed to Lamibeer as a coach for the Pacers, BUT from all I've read Bird doesn't like Lamibeer.... that's putting it mildly. Now if Lamibeer had been a Celtic, he probably be Bird's next choice as the Pacers HC.