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PacersPride
01-10-2011, 06:49 PM
Which would you would prefer take place.? Pacers make the playoffs or earn a lottery selection.

Im torn because I want this team to gain some postseason experience and feel it would be beneficial for the team going forward along with a rise in fan support.

OTOH if we make the playoffs O'brien may be retained and it would likely be an early exit.

I think the team is still a year or two away, or more specifically a player or two away from being very competitive. I think it goes w/o saying we need a new coach.

I hate to see the pacers lose, and do not want to see us tank at all, but barring a trade that brings in some talent, this team is not going to compete for a championship this season.

therefore, i will rephrase the question as this, which is best for the franchise going forward? Playoffs or Lottery.?

Dr. Awesome
01-10-2011, 06:50 PM
I'd rather be in the playoffs, but we are going to be in the lottery.

Plus, the difference between making the playoffs and where we will be in the lottery is only a pick or two.

pwee31
01-10-2011, 06:54 PM
We've technically been in the lottery for the past few years, I'm ready for the playoffs to return to Conseco

xIndyFan
01-10-2011, 06:56 PM
playoffs

Swingman
01-10-2011, 07:01 PM
at this point, who cares?

If we are in the lottery, then we won't be getting a game changer anyway
If we are in the playoffs, then we likely won't be beating anyone.

We've been constantly stuck in the good enough to not get a good player and bad enough to not challenge for anything.

sportfireman
01-10-2011, 07:01 PM
Playoffs

hoops_guy
01-10-2011, 07:06 PM
Playoffs.. Because if we make the Playoffs that means that JOB isn't around and if JOB isn't around I'm a happy fan.

joew8302
01-10-2011, 07:09 PM
Lottery. Unless we are ready to win a title, or on a legitimate path to a title this will always be my choice.

BlueNGold
01-10-2011, 07:12 PM
Hmmm. As dysfunctional as this team is becoming, we might dip down low enough to get a top 5 pick...but I say playoffs for now.

If we are still stinking in March, it will be time to tank. No point getting a #10 pick when you can get a #4 or #5.

PacersPride
01-10-2011, 07:13 PM
There probably will not be much of a difference in the draft selection; but if it were something like 10th pick compared to 15th pick, that could be significant.

This team is not going to win in the playoffs, it would make much more sense to start playing the young guys, like AJ, Hansbrough, McBob, PG, Rush (start), and maybe even LS although im not a big fan of his. Maybe this is thinking from the top since we now finally see some minutes going to Hansbrough as a starter, and Price/ Lance are suiting up.

Preferably I want the pacers in the playoffs. but i think what would be best for the franchise is starting Rush, Hansbrough, playing PG, AJ, and even stephenson as opposed to Ford, Posey, Solo.. Foster and Dunleavy even might be better off not suiting up but a few minutes.

these are all things weve discussed before, but I dont get the point in playing vets unless were gonna contend, and i dont see us doing that. play the young guys and maybe get a top 10 pick is what i think is best for this franchise.

PacersPride
01-10-2011, 07:18 PM
i should have made the title of this thread, what is best for the franchise, playoffs or lottery. i think we all agree we want the pacers in the playoffs, but perhaps the lottery is what is best long term.

how long have we now been stuck between 10th and 17th picks. its getting frustrating to some degree. time to go with the young players and see what happens.

we are never going to acquire a top notch FA like Chris Paul or someone of that stature. tho i would hope Love would consider us if possible. Only way we ever get a stud like Dwight Howard is via the draft.

if ever there is a season to just play the young guys and hope for the best in the lottery this is it. get a stud in the draft and have tons of cap room.

with our luck, the nba will have a lockout and any potential blake griffen type players will stay in college.

Trophy
01-10-2011, 07:20 PM
This team isn't too far back and this have half a season to turn it around again.

Of course anyone would say playoffs because that's what teams play for.

Peck
01-10-2011, 07:23 PM
It's way to early for a thread like this really.

However I also can understand why you made it. We once again are in a free fall.

It's a real shame that the early season success didn't translate into all season long success.

PacersPride
01-10-2011, 07:30 PM
This team isn't too far back and this have half a season to turn it around again.

Of course anyone would say playoffs because that's what teams play for.

turn it around for what tho? the nets are gonna get stronger, the magic already have, and the knicks are looking like a playoff team. the east for the first time in forever might be better than the west when all is said and done.

Heat, Bulls, Magic, Celtics, Hawks, and Nets with Carmello are all going to have a better chance than us. There is 6 teams, and you still have the Bucks and Knicks who are competitive.

Im not a fan of Obrien but was not a proponent of firing him during the season, now however (barring a miracle run or significant trade) its time to cut him loose and play the young guys.

Trophy
01-10-2011, 07:33 PM
turn it around for what tho? the nets are gonna get stronger, the magic already have, and the knicks are looking like a playoff team. the east for the first time in forever might be better than the west when all is said and done.

Heat, Bulls, Magic, Celtics, Hawks, and Nets with Carmello are all going to have a better chance than us. There is 6 teams, and you still have the Bucks and Knicks who are competitive.

Im not a fan of Obrien but was not a proponent of firing him during the season, now however (barring a miracle run or significant trade) its time to cut him loose and play the young guys.

I don't care about the Nets or what they wind up doing and neither does anyone else trying to make the playoffs in the East.

I just want this team to be good and reach the playoffs and we can do it.

I want Jim gone as much as the next guy and know these losses don't go to waste.

It's ridiculous how some people are waving the white flag for the season already. We're still in the playoff picture and we actually have the best team in all 5 years of missing the playoffs.

pwee31
01-10-2011, 07:36 PM
at this point, who cares?

If we are in the lottery, then we won't be getting a game changer anyway
If we are in the playoffs, then we likely won't be beating anyone.

We've been constantly stuck in the good enough to not get a good player and bad enough to not challenge for anything.

We're capable of beating team though. Even though we'll likely not get out of the 1st round, making the playoffs would good for pretty much every party.

Shade
01-10-2011, 07:40 PM
As long as it's guaranteed that Jim is gone either way, I want the playoffs, no question.

If making the playoffs would cause Jim to be retained, then bring on the tank.

PacersPride
01-10-2011, 07:40 PM
I don't care about the Nets or what they wind up doing and neither does anyone else trying to make the playoffs in the East.

I just want this team to be good and reach the playoffs and we can do it.

I want Jim gone as much as the next guy and know these losses don't go to waste.

we can reach the playoffs but i dont see us doing much except maybe winning a game or worse getting swept. if we bring in a guy like david west or can make another trade this team can get better in a hurry. this might be the last time we are in the lottery for awhile, and would really like to see us acquire someone who can be a stud one day.

normally i would say playoffs, but with the cap space, and hopefully a new coach, along with additional experience as this team matures, now is good a time as any to play the young guys and maybe land a top 5 pick.

playing the young guys may mean more losses but they would not be "wasted."

PacersPride
01-10-2011, 07:45 PM
As long as it's guaranteed that Jim is gone either way, I want the playoffs, no question.

If making the playoffs would cause Jim to be retained, then bring on the tank.

i wouldnt call it tanking.. but more like developing the younger talent. there has to be a reason O'brien started Hansbrough, and it sure the hell wasnt cause Jim suddenly had an intelligent thought cross his mind for once. Stephenson is now dressing as well..

something tells me those decisions were made by Bird, not Obrien. not to mention, PG is getting playing time as well.

with the east only getting stronger, its better for the franchise to play the young guys and see where we end up in the lottery. from espn's report there are some potential studs at the PF position i would like to see us acquire. signing david west next year and bringing in a new coach could get us back to the playoffs for the next 5 years... if were gonna get a stud in the draft.. nows the time.

either way, im glad to see Hansbrough & George getting some PT.

Trophy
01-10-2011, 07:47 PM
we can reach the playoffs but i dont see us doing much except maybe winning a game or worse getting swept. if we bring in a guy like david west or can make another trade this team can get better in a hurry. this might be the last time we are in the lottery for awhile, and would really like to see us acquire someone who can be a stud one day.

normally i would say playoffs, but with the cap space, and hopefully a new coach, along with additional experience as this team matures, now is good a time as any to play the young guys and maybe land a top 5 pick.

playing the young guys may mean more losses but they would not be "wasted."

So you have no confidence in the young guys and I don't think you understand what I meant when I said "wasted"?

Sounds like something Jim would say.

All what matters is that you actually get into the playoffs and know you're in the right direction.

Also cap space doesn't change whether you make the playoffs or not. If we really want to use the cap space on a decent player, we will.

hoops_guy
01-10-2011, 07:56 PM
Our younger players are significantly better than our vets.

Collison >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> TJ
Rush and George > Dunleavy
Hibbert > Foster
Hans and Josh >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Posey

PacersPride
01-10-2011, 08:06 PM
So you have no confidence in the young guys and I don't think you understand what I meant when I said "wasted"?

Sounds like something Jim would say.

All what matters is that you actually get into the playoffs and know you're in the right direction.

Also cap space doesn't change whether you make the playoffs or not. If we really want to use the cap space on a decent player, we will.

your right, forgot for a moment our young players are better than most of the vets (foster when healthy is better than any of our young frontcourt players).

i presume you meant that we were trying to win and thus the losses would not be in vain. i think we would still be trying to win with the young guys also, regardless, young players are going to make mistakes so i guess i was assuming a few more losses but most likely we would end up with virtually the same record.

i firmly believe we are headed in the right direction, and that entails the dismissal of obrien this upcoming offseason. your also correct that cap space does not change regardless of whether we make the playoffs or not. what im saying is that this team will be making the playoffs going forward and not have an opportunity to acquire a stud in the lottery. considering we are not going to attact studs via FA, this would be an ideal time to get a top 5 pick and more more high talent player with potiential for our core going forward.

ksuttonjr76
01-10-2011, 08:20 PM
Playoffs. It shows our future new coach that he will have enough talent to make the playoffs despite a non-motivating coach.

jhondog28
01-10-2011, 08:27 PM
Our younger players are significantly better than our vets.

Collison >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> TJ
Rush and George > Dunleavy
Hibbert > Foster
Hans and Josh >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Posey

Right now they are not playing like it......

TJ is playing better than DC
Rush and Dun are equal
Foster has been playing better than Foster
I agree on Hans and Josh even though a piece of dandruff is more productive than Posey

DEEman
01-10-2011, 08:54 PM
Oh damn, what a sadness that we already have a topic like this in januari. One month ago nobody even thought about the lottery.. :(

Really?
01-10-2011, 09:44 PM
Lottery... With the talent of the teams in the East it will be a long time before we would be able to compete in the playoffs so the best thing for this year would be to stock up on as much talent as we can, and look forward to the future,~5 yrs down the road type future...

DGPR
01-10-2011, 09:52 PM
Right now they are not playing like it......

TJ is playing better than DC
Rush and Dun are equal
Foster has been playing better than Foster
I agree on Hans and Josh even though a piece of dandruff is more productive than Posey


If you like your point guard to pound the ball until there are 5 seconds on the shot clock left and then drive into the lane to get blocked, throw up a lame shot, or jump and throw the ball wildly to another player then yes TJ is playing better than DC hands down.

Eleazar
01-11-2011, 04:56 AM
At this point I don't give a damn either way. So I'm with Hicks, and I say **** both the playoffs and the lottery.

croz24
01-11-2011, 05:01 AM
doesn't matter. won't do anything in the playoffs if we get there and this year's draft is very weak so the lottery honestly won't help us much unless we got extremely lucky. unlikely...

xtacy
01-11-2011, 05:06 AM
As long as it's guaranteed that Jim is gone either way, I want the playoffs, no question.

If making the playoffs would cause Jim to be retained, then bring on the tank.

this.

PaulGeorge24
01-11-2011, 06:15 AM
We're falling while others are rising. We don't have a coach who can lift a team up during struggles.
Charlotte seems to be back in the playoff race and Philly has a coach in Doug Collins who'll keep them there as well.

We'll be in the lottery without having given significant PT to Paul George.

ballism
01-11-2011, 09:07 AM
Playoffs.. Because if we make the Playoffs that means that JOB isn't around and if JOB isn't around I'm a happy fan.

I don't understand this line of thinking, why playoffs=JOB isnt around?

As to the question, I'd say 1. high lottery, 2. playoffs. 3. late lottery.
I would love us to have a high pick, even if the draft is weak-ish. Even weak drafts have a Rudy Gay or LaMarcus Aldridge to be found.
Otherwise, I'll take playoffs. Simply because it's been too long, and low lottery picks are crapshoot anyway, no big difference from mid round.

Mackey_Rose
01-11-2011, 09:09 AM
I don't understand this line of thinking, why playoffs=JOB isnt around?

As to the question, I'd say 1. high lottery, 2. playoffs. 3. late lottery.
I would love us to have a high pick, even if the draft is weak-ish. Even weak drafts have a Rudy Gay or LaMarcus Aldridge to be found.
Otherwise, I'll take playoffs. Simply because it's been too long, and low lottery picks are crapshoot anyway, no big difference from mid round.

I think because he means it will be a cold day in Hell before we make the playoffs with this joker in charge.

ballism
01-11-2011, 09:12 AM
I think because he means it will be a cold day in Hell before we make the playoffs with this joker in charge.

Ahh ok, now i get it :)
I've gotten so used to the idea that JoB is here to finish the season, that whenever someone says 'Job isn't around' I assume 'after the season'.
It's so discouraging for small market owners to get a new coach now, since he would have to be paid during a possible lockout.

Unclebuck
01-11-2011, 09:20 AM
I always answer this question the same way: If the Pacers deserve to make the playoffs, then I want them in the playoffs. if they do not deserve it, then I do not want them in. The past 4 years they have not deserved it.

How do I decide if they "deserve it" simple - if they have a good enough record to get in.

bballpacen
01-11-2011, 09:46 AM
The last few years, I have been in favor of trying to get as high of a lottery pick as possible, tanking in other words... I hopes of fast tracking the rebuild... But with how the season started, and with some of the big road wins that we had, I think that the Pacers are(were) a playoff team, and one that would scare any first round foe...

Aside from a new coach and a PF, I believe that the team needs to experience a playoff atmosphere this year in order to take the next step... But I am feeling very pessimistic that we will make the playoffs this year...

Pacerized
01-11-2011, 10:00 AM
I agree with Peck that it's a little too early for this. If we've made no moves by the trade deadline to add a long term core player or two, then I'd say lottery. If we add one or two players then I'd say playoffs. I still think the odds are in our favor that a trade will happen and we'll make the playoffs.

Justin Tyme
01-11-2011, 12:06 PM
I voted it doesn't really matter, b/c of how this season has progressed.

Really?
01-11-2011, 12:25 PM
The draft isn't weak at all, it is just full of potential...lol all the mock drafts basically have the top ten players as freshman, a lot who haven't had time to mature into productive players...

Granted that there are no first year players like Kevin Durant, Carmelo or Oden production wise but the potential of the players in this draft is on the same level as they were when they came out.

The draft is more potential than production now days, teams trying to hit it big by drafting a guy with a lot of potential, and seeing as we need a home run to really compete I would say lottery over Playoffs this year...

ksuttonjr76
01-11-2011, 12:30 PM
Lottery... With the talent of the teams in the East it will be a long time before we would be able to compete in the playoffs so the best thing for this year would be to stock up on as much talent as we can, and look forward to the future,~5 yrs down the road type future...

We already got the talent. We just need someone who will know how to use it.

Hicks
01-11-2011, 12:34 PM
I've read people say "this draft is weak" for I don't know how many years straight now. I don't really pay attention to that anymore. Even if it's true, you can always be the team that gets one of the few better talents.

Scot Pollard
01-11-2011, 12:37 PM
this team is ridiculous and they truly blew it

no playoffs........thanks a lot pacers

i know i will not be renewing my tickets in a week and now you know why you have such little crowds

we dont want to see bad sports especially basketball in indy

ballism
01-11-2011, 12:42 PM
I've read people say "this draft is weak" for I don't know how many years straight now. I don't really pay attention to that anymore. Even if it's true, you can always be the team that gets one of the few better talents.

Indeed. Besides, the views towards this draft are so mixed so far. Some people say it's ultra weak. Thorpe thinks it's stronger than 2010. International class looks as good as ever. Then so much depends on lockout chances. Probably we'll still have a couple of All Star players out of it when it's all said and done. As usual.

PacersPride
01-11-2011, 06:14 PM
I always answer this question the same way: If the Pacers deserve to make the playoffs, then I want them in the playoffs. if they do not deserve it, then I do not want them in. The past 4 years they have not deserved it.

How do I decide if they "deserve it" simple - if they have a good enough record to get in.

the question (after clarification) is whats best for the franchise. Playoffs or lottery?

i see both sides, and miss the playoffs as much as anyone. but as a colts fan, making the playoffs doesnt really mean much to me, although maybe thats not a good comparison.

winning a championship is all that really matters, and this team is not even close.

PacersPride
01-11-2011, 06:28 PM
The draft isn't weak at all, it is just full of potential...lol all the mock drafts basically have the top ten players as freshman, a lot who haven't had time to mature into productive players...

Granted that there are no first year players like Kevin Durant, Carmelo or Oden production wise but the potential of the players in this draft is on the same level as they were when they came out.

The draft is more potential than production now days, teams trying to hit it big by drafting a guy with a lot of potential, and seeing as we need a home run to really compete I would say lottery over Playoffs this year...

we can also consider trading with our draft pick, we dont necessarily have to take any of the players with potential. if this team had say the 6th pick or even gets lucky and lands a top 3 selection, we can trade that pick and not have to worry about matching salaries.

thats why i think this is a good year to be in the lottery. i hate losing, and want the pacers in the playoffs, and want them to win every game, but the realist in me says hope for the lottery because next season we should be ready to compete and i dont see us missing the playoffs for a long time.

at the same time i think 5 years from now were gonna say we need that one player who gets us over the proverbial hump.. that is if we do not get that player now.

i think the core of the team can be solid. DC, Rush, PG, Hansbro, Roy, Granger... but we need another stud to compete in todays nba. considering our cap space will be gone in 2 seasons, and were looking at being a perrenial playoff team with more experience from our young core.. we need to get that player now.

only way to accomplish that is gonna be a high draft pick, or use that high pick for trade. now if kevin love comes to the blue and gold.. different story. all im saying is, we need to stockpile as much talent as possible while we can.

or else were gonna be stuck as a 6th seed for the next 10 years.

O'Bird
01-12-2011, 03:25 PM
Playoffs. The three-year plan involves building a playoff team from the draft and from conservative low-money trades, that is an attractive destination for a star free-agent (or perhaps even two).

It is essential to make the playoffs this season, and the team is on track to do that, even after the recent slump. Expected wins shows that they're a better team than their record, and good team defense usually pays dividends down the stretch; that they play excellent team defense (7th in the league as I write this) and are so young suggests that they'll get better at it; they lost the Spurs game but the defense was outstanding against the best offense in the league, and their defensive ranking actually went up - that's a very positive sign for the rest of the season.

You often hear things like "defense wins in the playoffs"; what you could also say is that you build good team play by demanding it first of all on the defensive end.

The re-building has not been easy, least of all for the coaching staff, but it's looking like they're getting a solid foundation.

I just don't understand the wish to be in the lottery. Larry says he expects to be in the playoffs every year. I'm with him. Let's move on.

.

Justin Tyme
01-12-2011, 03:40 PM
Playoffs. The three-year plan involves building a playoff team from the draft and from conservative low-money trades, that is an attractive destination for a star free-agent (or perhaps even two).

It is essential to make the playoffs this season, and the team is on track to do that, even after the recent slump. Expected wins shows that they're a better team than their record, and good team defense usually pays dividends down the stretch; that they play excellent team defense (7th in the league as I write this) and are so young suggests that they'll get better at it; they lost the Spurs game but the defense was outstanding against the best offense in the league, and their defensive ranking actually went up - that's a very positive sign for the rest of the season.

You often hear things like "defense wins in the playoffs"; what you could also say is that you build good team play by demanding it first of all on the defensive end.

The re-building has not been easy, least of all for the coaching staff, but it's looking like they're getting a solid foundation.

I just don't understand the wish to be in the lottery. Larry says he expects to be in the playoffs every year. I'm with him. Let's move on.

.


The words Pacers, playoffs, and O'Brien should never be used in the same sentence. As long as O'Brien is the coach, the words Pacers and playoffs are irrelevant.

Since86
01-12-2011, 03:48 PM
Ask me again in a month.

If they can get this ship turned around, and continue the style of play they played last night (and I don't mean they need to get the same results) then I'd say playoffs.

But if they go back to how they played the last month and a half, then lottery.

Really?
01-13-2011, 01:02 PM
We already got the talent. We just need someone who will know how to use it.

No, we don't have the talent...we are forcing ourselves to believe we have the talent to compete with some of these top teams.

We have some talented players but we are going to need to really get lucky in the draft to increase the talent on this team to a level that we can compete with even a team like Chicago.

As far as the trade, that would be a good idea if the person being traded wouldn't mind playing for the pacers or being in Indianapolis, chances are if we did try to trade our draft pick for a player who is really good, they would either not want to come, or they would not sign a contract extension when the time comes around.

Just my opinion, I doubt chris paul, deron williams, would want to stay around in indy... imo

and there are many reasons for that.