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View Full Version : Consistency: Where is it?



Nateorade
12-04-2010, 11:35 AM
Let me preface this by saying that I think that this Pacer team will make the playoffs this year.

To make the next step, the team needs to find some sort of identity. It seems like the Pacers go into the game not knowing who is going to step up. Individually, its easy to see that our players are not consistent. Look at the game logs for Dun Brush Danny DC and Big Boy Roy and its pretty clear that they can go off and have great games but they all struggle mightily at times.

I understand that every player struggles from time to time but until these guys settle into their roles and perform on a more reliable basis we will continue to be a 500 team.

Additionally, the team as a whole does not really have an identity. We win some games with our Defense (Heat, Lakers) and while our defense has improved we are far from a defensive team. Other games the Pacers revert back to their 09-10 self living and dying by the quick three.

The most disappointing part of this whole season has easily been the play of DC. I was expecting him to come in and perform at a consistent 18 ppg 9 apg level night in and night out. It infuriates me to see his potential being squandered. I understand that JOBs system does not lend itself to big assist numbers for the pg but I wish he could give DC a bit more freedom and control on the offensive end.

I feel that a consistent DC would make everyone else more consistent and would be the key to taking that next step. I hope that JOB gives him the chance to step up and he shows that he can be the leader of this team.

BringJackBack
12-04-2010, 11:54 AM
Here's the main things about this road trip to me:
Conditions- Danny has the flu and fatigue has set in for everyone especially Roy
We look TIRED. You could tell that because we stopped rebounding, stopped playing defense, and stopped hitting threes.

About consistency: I agree that we need an identity and all that. But our core is so young, especially DC and Roy, that consisntency and identity shouldn't really be expected. Inconsistency is just one of those woes that young teams go through. Heck, OKC lost to Toronto last night.

About DC: If played right I think that he is a much better point guard. He is in a slump, and he looks very tentative. I wasn't expecting anything close to 18 and 9 (He could probably come close to it in NO if he played starters minutes this year though). It comes down to that he is just too damn good not to play his game. Remember how good he was during that spurt in the end of the second quarter last game? That's the DC everyone in NO saw last season.

We need to get that DC to start playing for us.

Shade
12-04-2010, 12:05 PM
It's waiting for JOB to leave.

Young
12-04-2010, 12:10 PM
I think it's just part of growing pains with a young team.

Young teams are usually inconsistent.

The point guards are inconsistent. Roy has been inconsistent.

Hopefully things will get better but some inconsistent play has to be expected this year. Even nights like last night.

bballpacen
12-04-2010, 12:11 PM
BJB nailed it on the head, it is something that this team has to learn... They are just now truly starting to learn to win ball games, consistency hopefully will come by seasons end or next year at the latest...

Nateorade
12-04-2010, 12:33 PM
I agree that we are inconsistent because we are young.

Here is another question though: once they become more consistent what roles will players like B Rush have? What do you see Rush Granger Big Boy Roy and DC settling into?

Given JoBs system I see DC settling into 14 and 8
Granger going for 20-22 and 4-5 boards
Hungry Hungry Hibbert plopping in 16 or so big ones and snagging 9-10 boards
Rush will settle into a respectable 12-15 points

Obviously most of these guys average close to that with the exception of DC. Again I feel that if he can get to that level we will be a much better team.

pacers74
12-04-2010, 12:47 PM
This week will tell a lot about this team. We have 3 winnable games and Atlanta on next Saturday the second game of a back to back.

We play Toronto (8-11) on Monday, Milwaukee (6-12) on Wednesday, Charlotte (7-12) on friday, and Atlanta (13-7) on Saturday. If we are going to be a constitent team, and a playoff team, we need win the games against teams the have a worse record than us. If we go 3-1 next week than we will be back on track.

vnzla81
12-04-2010, 12:48 PM
I agree that we are inconsistent because we are young

The players that are getting all the minutes are not that young, I don't think this could be use as an excuse.

I don't think there is ever going to be any consistency as long as Jim is the coach, you can't have consistency when you never know who is going to start, when you never who is going to finish, when you never know who is going to play......................

pacers74
12-04-2010, 12:50 PM
The players that are getting all the minutes are not that young, I don't think this could be use as an excuse.

I don't think there is ever going to be any consistency as long as Jim is the coach, you can't have consistency when you never know who is going to start, when you never who is going to finish, when you never know who is going to play......................


I remember people saying the same thing when Isiah was coaching here.

bballpacen
12-04-2010, 01:02 PM
The players that are getting all the minutes are not that young, I don't think this could be use as an excuse.

I don't think there is ever going to be any consistency as long as Jim is the coach, you can't have consistency when you never know who is going to start, when you never who is going to finish, when you never know who is going to play......................
Collison is... Hibbert is... Rush is... At least in terms of NBA careers, which is what is young about this team... McBob is as far as PT... I think that it is a perfectly valid argument... I do want to see Obie and the Pacers go their separate ways this offseason, but I dont think that he can take all of the credit for all of the loses, and receive none of the credit when we win...

Kaufman
12-04-2010, 01:50 PM
Collison is... Hibbert is... Rush is... At least in terms of NBA careers, which is what is young about this team... McBob is as far as PT... I think that it is a perfectly valid argument... I do want to see Obie and the Pacers go their separate ways this offseason, but I dont think that he can take all of the credit for all of the loses, and receive none of the credit when we win...

Take it to another level ----

Granger, Dunleavy, Ford - the next couple of guys with big minutes - I consider them young in the sense of NBA experience with success and winning. The only guy who has really experienced success is Posey.

From that view, everyone is crazy young except Posey.

I would treat this team as I would a toddler or preschooler. Some good days, some very bad days. Similar to the teams of the late 80's.

Larry Staverman
12-04-2010, 05:43 PM
I remember people saying the same thing when Isiah was coaching here.

Then Bird took care of the problem, and fired him.......so Larry you know what to do.

cdash
12-04-2010, 05:46 PM
Our consistency is inconsistent.

croz24
12-04-2010, 05:51 PM
sorry but you can be young and play consistently tough. that is just not the case with this team and is a reflection of the coach. we've looked like 5 different types of teams out there this year. youth is just an excuse. there is no excuse to not playing solid, fundamental basketball imo.

Kaufman
12-04-2010, 05:57 PM
sorry - you are saying its the coach's fault we aren't consistently tough?

croz24
12-04-2010, 06:24 PM
sorry - you are saying its the coach's fault we aren't consistently tough?

it's the coach's responsibility to get the players prepared to play, as well as getting them to play mentally tough. the coach also decides who is on the court at any given moment in time, so of course much of it is on the coach.

Kaufman
12-04-2010, 06:37 PM
http://chronicle.augusta.com/images/headlines/122299/Oscar_Mayer_Bologna.jpg

Eleazar
12-04-2010, 08:01 PM
Individual inconsistency is something you see in young players, and is something that is on the individual.

If the whole team plays inconsistently then you have a coach that isn't getting the team physically and mentally prepared for every game.

MLB007
12-04-2010, 08:56 PM
It's waiting for JOB to leave.

That won't stop it, nor will it stop the whiners.

MLB007
12-04-2010, 08:59 PM
The players that are getting all the minutes are not that young, I don't think this could be use as an excuse.

I don't think there is ever going to be any consistency as long as Jim is the coach, you can't have consistency when you never know who is going to start, when you never who is going to finish, when you never know who is going to play......................

:bs:
It's basketball.
You go in, you play hard.
You take advantage of the opportunities when you get them.
THis is PRO sports.
That line of reasoning is high school.

Unclebuck
12-04-2010, 09:10 PM
Improvement is never a straight line

Every NBA team is inconsistant over an 82 game season. You just don't realize every team is inconsistant because you only follow the Pacers.

For example - do you realize the Raptors have beaten the following teams over the past 14 days:
Magic
Heat
Thunder
Celtics

My point is you can look at every team in the NBA and they are all inconsistant

Those are all teams that will win 50 plus games -

LA_Confidential
12-04-2010, 10:36 PM
As Far As Youth Is Concerned...That Is This Teams Blessing. Remember When We Had A Slew Of Vets Who Were Consistently Bad These Past Few Years?

As Far As Players Settling Into Roles...Roles Are Defined By A Coach and His Style Of Coaching. There Are About 11 Players on The Roster That Have 1 Role...Bomb Threes.

Unclebuck
12-06-2010, 10:22 AM
Of course the answer needs to be asked and answered. What specifically is inconsistant

You hope the defense and rebounding is consistant and it can be except for the 6 - 8 games every team just doesn't have enough energy to do a good job.

We all know shooting is inconsistant - especially outside shooting.

Younger teams are more up and down than veteran teams.

MyFavMartin
12-06-2010, 10:50 AM
Agree with others that the source of the inconsistency is our youth. Players like Danny have stepped up as leaders, which helps with the guidance and maturation process. It'll take time for the team to demonstrate more consistency, but JOB has this team playing hard and intensity is what you want to see in a team.

Seems that the Pacers always seem to be fast out of the gates and that's probably a testament to the management and coaching. Other teams will scout us and make adjustments. And our players will get a better handle on the system and its options and mature with playing time.

It would be interesting to know of player development of those guys at the end of the bench (Tyler, Stephenson, George), but the only way to know that is to sneak into practices or for them to get PT. Seems Tyler is progressing from what we've seen as is Solo. Would love to see PG later in the season demonstrating a non-rookie game.

daschysta
12-06-2010, 10:53 AM
Honestly I think fatigue was a huge factor in the last two games. We expended so much energy getting back into it in Utah, and Danny was clearly under the weather against phoenix, conflated with the fact that our core players are so young, and will naturally be inconsistant you have a perfect storm. Let's keep it in perspective though, alot of people were predicting this road trip to crush the team mentally and MAYBE win one game on the trip. I'll take two and two. What we do this week vs. some weaker competition with some home games will be much more telling imo.

However i think we need to give AJ a look, TJ hasn't played well at all the last few games, and Darren needs some more freedom on offense, he single handedly brought us back against utah and is consistantly our best or second best option in isolation. When I look at darren I see a guy that could average 20 ppg if he had some freedom to attack and make decisions. I'll live with a few turnovers if it means I can see the spectacular from him as well. He's certainly shown flashes of the ability to take over a game on the offensive end.