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View Full Version : Troy Murphy spends a lot of time on the bench for a guy making $12 million



vnzla81
11-17-2010, 12:31 PM
http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/11/17/troy-murphy-spends-a-lot-of-time-on-the-bench-for-a-guy-making-12-million/




Troy Murphy spends a lot of time on the bench for a guy making $12 million

Troy Murphy is making $12 million this season, the Nets big summer acquisition that was going to bring some scoring punch from the four. He was going to mentor Derrick Favors. He would be a big part of the franchise — for a year, then the franchise would try to go get someone they really want next summer when Murphy’s deal expired.

But Murphy is not contributing much — 4.4 points a game on 30 percent shooting with 5.2 rebounds. Which led to the dreaded “DNP-CD” against the Clippers — Murphy never got on the court because Avery Johnson didn’t put him in.

That’s a lot of money being paid to a guy to sit, so Johnson was asked why Murphy didn’t play by the New York Daily News:

“Troy wants to play. But right now, we’re trying to get to a starting rotation we can live with. Get a bench rotation we can live with. Just unfortunately the last two games, he’s totaled eight minutes and hasn’t been a major part of it.”
Ah, well, that really… um. We still don’t know.

Murphy is coming back slowly from injury, that is part of it. But a bigger part is that Derrick Favors has turned out to be good more quickly than expected, and Kris Humphries has completely outplayed Murphy. Both are rebounding much better, both are shooting at a higher percentage, both are more athletic. The result is they get the minutes and Murphy sits.

Still, that’s a guy you need to see if you can make work — Murphy can help a mundane Nets offense if he can get going. And part of that will be getting minutes. Otherwise he’s a $12 million 12th man.

Hicks
11-17-2010, 12:54 PM
I hope they weren't happy with Courtney Lee, for their sake.

ksuttonjr76
11-17-2010, 12:57 PM
That's interesting that he fell off like that. He would think he would be able to contribute AT LEAST defensive rebounding. Of course, I'll reserve my judgment when he's 100%.

pacer4ever
11-17-2010, 01:03 PM
ya i was watching clippers vs nets wish murphy would have played so Blake Griffen could abuse him. Pretty sad if kris hummphrys starts over u lol

MTM
11-17-2010, 01:08 PM
Is it fair to make the logical connection that either Avery Johnson is right about Murphy (that he not good enough to be playing, despite his salary), or JOB is right about Murphy (that he is an invaluable starter worthy of playing 35 mins a night), but that both can't be right?

cordobes
11-17-2010, 01:13 PM
It was pretty predictable New Jersey would end up regretting that trade. In all fairness to Murphy he was injured to start the season though. He'll eventually start playing.

Trophy
11-17-2010, 01:23 PM
I think Murph is just happy to be back in his home state of NJ.

Since86
11-17-2010, 01:47 PM
I still don't know why the trade is looked at another way for NJ other than getting another expiring.......

Let's face it. NJ was going struggle with or without Murphy. He isn't their long term answer, and that is blantantly obvious considering they drafted a PF.

He's there for shooting and there to help match salaries with Melo, so they don't have to give more up. He will be moved by the trade deadline, and it has nothing to do with his ability on the court.

vnzla81
11-17-2010, 01:56 PM
I still don't know why the trade is looked at another way for NJ other than getting another expiring.......

Let's face it. NJ was going struggle with or without Murphy. He isn't their long term answer, and that is blantantly obvious considering they drafted a PF.

He's there for shooting and there to help match salaries with Melo, so they don't have to give more up. He will be moved by the trade deadline, and it has nothing to do with his ability on the court.

I been thinking the same thing, they don't care to play him, they just wanted another expiring for the trade deadline, must of his value is because he is an expiring not because he is a double double machine.

pacer4ever
11-17-2010, 01:58 PM
I still don't know why the trade is looked at another way for NJ other than getting another expiring.......

Let's face it. NJ was going struggle with or without Murphy. He isn't their long term answer, and that is blantantly obvious considering they drafted a PF.

He's there for shooting and there to help match salaries with Melo, so they don't have to give more up. He will be moved by the trade deadline, and it has nothing to do with his ability on the court.

Not true why would the nuggets want murphy ?? woulnt u much rather just have the 11 mill in cap room remember NJ was way under the cap. They could have traded Favors st8 up and salries would have worked beacuse NJ had that much cap room. To me thats a lot more attractive then paying murphy to ride the pine in Denver.

DocHolliday
11-17-2010, 02:23 PM
Look at the bright side, if Murphy doesn't play much this year, he'll fly under the radar so the Pacers can re-sign him in the off-season! JOB will be reunited with his main weapon and the Pacers offense can be run again the way it was meant to be--with our fearless leader JOB at the helm, armed with a new contract!:happydanc:dance:

Go Pacers!!!

Since86
11-17-2010, 02:27 PM
Not true why would the nuggets want murphy ?? woulnt u much rather just have the 11 mill in cap room remember NJ was way under the cap. They could have traded Favors st8 up and salries would have worked beacuse NJ had that much cap room. To me thats a lot more attractive then paying murphy to ride the pine in Denver.

They don't want Murphy. At all. They want the cap space. No team is going to give up young talent for a player that wants out.

Did you not hear Melo's comment last night how he's not going to do the Nuggets like Bosh did the Raptors? Why in the world would a team like NJ, that can sign Melo outright, send Denver anything of value (value to their team)? They can just hold on to the trading pieces that Denver wants, and then just sign him in the offseason if Melo wanted to go there.

Troy Murphy is an asset because of his contract. Expirings get traded every single year and the team getting them have no desire to keep them longer than the contract.

EDIT: I'm sure the real value that Denver will want, if they take a player like Murphy back, is a draft pick. And I don't think NJ will have a problem giving up their 1st rounder for Melo, considering the implications if a lock out happens, if Melo say's he will sign an extension.

ballism
11-17-2010, 02:28 PM
To be fair on Troy, not only has he been below 100%, but also Avery's focus has been establishing toughness as part of their culture. He's been hard on everyone there over defense, and especially on Brook Lopez. Even publicly. He can't sit Lopez obviously, but sitting Troy is probably part of the message.

Just an example from one of many articles on this:

These not-so-friendly reminders are the price of playing for the Nets these days. They can be humbling, even verging on humiliating. Mr. Johnson spent one video session last week likening his team's toughness to that of tissue paper. Afterward, Mr. Lopez confessed, "He was practically looking at me." (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704312504575618792269780152.html?m od=googlenews_wsj)

Now, there's nothing positive about sitting because your coach is preaching toughness and defense, but it probably means that Troy isn't suddenly terri-bad - just very limited and certainly overpaid.

ballism
11-17-2010, 02:32 PM
They don't want Murphy. At all. They want the cap space. No team is going to give up young talent for a player that wants out.

Did you not hear Melo's comment last night how he's not going to do the Nuggets like Bosh did the Raptors? Why in the world would a team like NJ, that can sign Melo outright, send Denver anything of value (value to their team)? They can just hold on to the trading pieces that Denver wants, and then just sign him in the offseason if Melo wanted to go there.

Troy Murphy is an asset because of his contract. Expirings get traded every single year and the team getting them have no desire to keep them longer than the contract.

What he meant is that the Nets basically took Murphy into their cap space (IIRC). They could have saved that space and used it for trades as well. You can trade for Melo both with expiring and into cap space. Cap space trade would even be better in a way, since Denver would then get an exception for further trades and wouldn't have to pay anyone a salary.

pacer4ever
11-17-2010, 02:33 PM
They don't want Murphy. At all. They want the cap space. No team is going to give up young talent for a player that wants out.

Did you not hear Melo's comment last night how he's not going to do the Nuggets like Bosh did the Raptors? Why in the world would a team like NJ, that can sign Melo outright, send Denver anything of value (value to their team)? They can just hold on to the trading pieces that Denver wants, and then just sign him in the offseason if Melo wanted to go there.

Troy Murphy is an asset because of his contract. Expirings get traded every single year and the team getting them have no desire to keep them longer than the contract.

My point was they were 30 million under the cap this summer they didnt need to trade for murphy to get melo they could have just traded 2 prospects and that would of made nuggets happier than having to take 12 million $ murphy

Bball
11-17-2010, 02:37 PM
What??? You don't have to give a player in the last year of his contract big minutes??? You don't have to showcase him for a big midseason trade???

You can just put him on the bench and play the players that are part of your future?

Dayum... learn something new every day! ;)

vnzla81
11-17-2010, 02:38 PM
My point was they were 30 million under the cap this summer they didnt need to trade for murphy to get melo they could have just traded 2 prospects and that would of made nuggets happier than having to take 12 million $ murphy

Maybe Denver wants to use Murphy to get another piece and trade him to a team that would want to keep him after this year.

Since86
11-17-2010, 02:38 PM
My point was they were 30 million under the cap this summer they didnt need to trade for murphy toget melo they could have just traded 2 prospects and that would of made nuggets happier than having to take 12 million $ murphy

I know what your point is, but you didn't respond to what Melo said last night pubically, which I'm sure he said to TPTB a long time before yesterday.

He's not goint to do them dirty like Bosh, and just leave. He's going to make sure the Nugs get something back in return for him. NJ can retain pretty good cap space for another signing, by using the cap space freed up from Murphy alone. That will cover over half of what Melo will get, and they retain some of the cap space they already had. It's a win-win.

There's no such thing as too much cap space. Take a look at Miami......

Since86
11-17-2010, 02:40 PM
What he meant is that the Nets basically took Murphy into their cap space (IIRC). They could have saved that space and used it for trades as well. You can trade for Melo both with expiring and into cap space. Cap space trade would even be better in a way, since Denver would then get an exception for further trades and wouldn't have to pay anyone a salary.

No, not really. Because they've shed even more salary by sending out a player in Courtney Lee who was about to get another contract, because his rookie deal was up.

They will end up saving MORE money by trading for Murphy and then using him to get Melo.

Money that can be used either on a FA signing or be put towards another trade.

pacer4ever
11-17-2010, 02:43 PM
I know what your point is, but you didn't respond to what Melo said last night pubically, which I'm sure he said to TPTB a long time before yesterday.

He's not goint to do them dirty like Bosh, and just leave. He's going to make sure the Nugs get something back in return for him. NJ can retain pretty good cap space for another signing, by using the cap space freed up from Murphy alone. That will cover over half of what Melo will get, and they retain some of the cap space they already had. It's a win-win.

There's no such thing as too much cap space. Take a look at Miami......

If he really wanted to get them something he could of went to the gm without going public and would have got them full trade value. Also i heard he didnt want to weaken the team he goes to. so he would play out the season with the nuggets but that was what a source told an NBA insider.

ballism
11-17-2010, 02:50 PM
No, not really. Because they've shed even more salary by sending out a player in Courtney Lee who was about to get another contract, because his rookie deal was up.

They will end up saving MORE money by trading for Murphy and then using him to get Melo.

Money that can be used either on a FA signing or be put towards another trade.

If you trade a 1 mil expiring + 11 mil in cap space for a 12 mil expiring, you aren't saving money or getting more cap space... :p
If Troy is useless as player (which I don't agree), wouldn't Denver rather take 11 mil exception + 1 mil expiring?

This trade had nothing to do with more cap space for Nets. It was about getting a better player (or so they thought).

Since86
11-17-2010, 02:51 PM
I agree he shouldn't have went public, but really it was bound to happen. A player of his caliber wanting out, or even if the media THINKS he wants out, is really going to hurt the team looking to move him.

It is what it is, and the only thing they can do is try to get the most as possible. A big expiring contract, like Troy's, coupled with a 1st round draft pick is just that.

This discussion has evolved from why NJ took on Troy, into why Melo shouldn't have went public. That's not the issue.

Since86
11-17-2010, 02:53 PM
If you trade a 1 mil expiring + 11 mil in cap space for a 12 mil expiring, you aren't saving money or getting more cap space... :p
If Troy is useless as player (which I don't agree), wouldn't Denver rather take 11 mil exception + 1 mil expiring?

This trade had nothing to do with more cap space for Nets. It was about getting a better player (or so they thought).

You are when you plan on resigning the 1 million player. You really think that Lee wouldn't have been resigned by them after the trade they did to get him???????

Hardly.

And you cannot tell me they thought Murphy was better than he really is. Unless the Nets front office seriously doesn't watch, or scout any opponent, they knew exactly what they were getting. Everyone knew what type of player Indy was getting when the GS trade went down.

Did Murphy fail to meet expectations or play above them? I know he did exactly what I thought he was going to do.

Speed
11-17-2010, 03:03 PM
Rumors all summer that Lee wasn't working out in NJ and was out the door, way before this trade went down.

I heard it on the NBA ESPN podcast with Rusillo.

So I'd guess NJ was happy to get a year of what they thought/think Murphy could provide for a guy they weren't keeping anyway. Plus Murphy is still an expiring trade chip at the worst.

cordobes
11-17-2010, 03:07 PM
No, not really. Because they've shed even more salary by sending out a player in Courtney Lee who was about to get another contract, because his rookie deal was up.

They will end up saving MORE money by trading for Murphy and then using him to get Melo.

Money that can be used either on a FA signing or be put towards another trade.

He wasn't about to get a new contract, his rookie contract goes until 2013 (2 years + 1 year QO). He'll be making $1.2 millions + $2.3 millions in the next 2 years.

Are you saying they traded for Troy Murphy to dump Courtney Lee's rookie contract? If they didn't want to keep Lee, pretty much every team in the league would take him off their hands for free, with a trade exception or cap room.

They won't save a single dollar. Denver won't save a single dollar. The only difference is that they (or Denver) will be paying Murphy's contract. They could use the cap space to get the deal done.

ballism
11-17-2010, 03:08 PM
You are when you plan on resigning the 1 million player. You really think that Lee wouldn't have been resigned by them after the trade they did to get him???????

Hardly.

And you cannot tell me they thought Murphy was better than he really is. Unless the Nets front office seriously doesn't watch, or scout any opponent, they knew exactly what they were getting. Everyone knew what type of player Indy was getting when the GS trade went down.

Did Murphy fail to meet expectations or play above them? I know he did exactly what I thought he was going to do.

Lee's contract expires after this year (team option for the next), as is Murphy's.
Basically what you are saying now is:
1. Nets didn't like Murphy at all. They only thought of him as an expiring.
2. Nets liked C.Lee and would have kept him after this year.
3. Instead of letting C.Lee go, they gave him away for a player they didn't like, and are now paying 11 mil more of salaries for this year.
4. In the process, they save money and cap space.
5. Denver doesn't like Murphy at all, but Denver would rather take Murphy and pay him 12 mil, then get pure cap space exception.

This doesn't make sense. I think either me or you missunderstand something, but i can't figure out what. What am I missing? :p

Since86
11-17-2010, 03:21 PM
1. I think the Nets like Murphy fine. They realize what he is. A player that can come in for the right situations, who is highly overpaid and will be coming off the books.

2. The Nets weren't going to just let Lee walk away and not get anything in return. You always try to get something out of nothing if you can do it.

3. See above. They like Murphy just fine, and realize what he is as a player. He's an end to a means.

4. Yes.

5. Why would NJ just take on a player, even if it is Melo, and chew up all their cap space, when they can trade a small piece (Lee), for an even bigger piece (Murphy) which they can later use in order to land Melo?

Even if they don't land Melo, and Troy just walks away from the team, what does it hurt? You're in the exact same position, and you atleast tried to get the right pieces in place to get him.

ballism
11-17-2010, 03:29 PM
Ok, I can agree with what you say. I suppose I just took your previous post too directly.

They don't want Murphy. At all. They want the cap space.

Still don't understand your 5th point (Nets don't save any cap space by doing this), but lets not spend any more time on it.

5. Why would NJ just take on a player, even if it is Melo, and chew up all their cap space, when they can trade a small piece (Lee), for an even bigger piece (Murphy) which they can later use in order to land Melo?

cordobes
11-17-2010, 03:33 PM
5. Why would NJ just take on a player, even if it is Melo, and chew up all their cap space, when they can trade a small piece (Lee), for an even bigger piece (Murphy) which they can later use in order to land Melo?

I don't get this.

They don't need to trade the small piece for a bigger piece to use the bigger piece to land Melo. They didn't need Murphy to match salaries with Melo. They could have traded Lee (and something else) directly for Melo. Murphy's expiring just complicates things.

Unless your point is that Denver prefers Murphy to cap space. But that would mean that both Denver and New Jersey believe that Murphy at $12 millions is better than the cap space.

Since86
11-17-2010, 03:43 PM
You're getting too hung up on the present, IMHO.

Look at why NJ and Indy got into the mix. The Nets traded C.Lee for Murphy pretty much straight up. Why? What good does that do, when you just drafted a PF in Favors and you already acquired another PF in Kris Humphries in Jan?

IMHO, they didn't want to just let C.Lee walk away. So they traded him for some value in a rental/expiring. They now don't have to pick up his option, nor trade him for more salary.

NJ stepping in and taking Murphy, for C.Lee, is what made the whole trade dip in the Pacers favor. Without it, it doesn't get done, and it's just not that smart of a move if they weren't looking to use Murphy's contract in the future, because Murphy wasn't going to go in and establish himself as a future piece of their team.

They have to have a plan for Murph, other than resigning him, because I don't think they would want too. A team like SA will. A team that needs a shooter to come off the bench for spot minutes to knock down some threes and open up the floor for other players.

There's no place for Murphy on their roster. There wasn't then, and there isn't now. So basically you're saying they made the trade just to make it, or they thought they will resign him on the cheap, and I don't think they will.

There's no reason to add him, if they aren't looking to move him IMHO.

cordobes
11-17-2010, 03:44 PM
To be fair on Troy, not only has he been below 100%, but also Avery's focus has been establishing toughness as part of their culture. He's been hard on everyone there over defense, and especially on Brook Lopez. Even publicly. He can't sit Lopez obviously, but sitting Troy is probably part of the message.

Just an example from one of many articles on this:

Now, there's nothing positive about sitting because your coach is preaching toughness and defense, but it probably means that Troy isn't suddenly terri-bad - just very limited and certainly overpaid.

Every time I watched the Nets this season I've been annoyed by Lopez' (lack of) defense. Very soft and lazy defender. He jacks up lots shots (lots of midrange jumpers), looks for the weakside shot-block but contributes very little otherwise. I thought he was an overrated player last season and was expecting Avery to turn him into a solid contributor. So far, it hasn't happened. Very irritating player.

pacer4ever
11-17-2010, 04:19 PM
I don't get this.

They don't need to trade the small piece for a bigger piece to use the bigger piece to land Melo. They didn't need Murphy to match salaries with Melo. They could have traded Lee (and something else) directly for Melo. Murphy's expiring just complicates things.

Unless your point is that Denver prefers Murphy to cap space. But that would mean that both Denver and New Jersey believe that Murphy at $12 millions is better than the cap space.

This has been my point all along. Denver would have rather had a 12 million dollar trade exception than Murphy . That is why the 4 way deal with Utah fell thur they didnt want to take on AK47's salary. Avery Johnson Really coveted Murphy and his shooting ablity from what i heard at the trade press confernce. That would be stupid to add salary just to add it specialy in these econmic times they wanted murphy as a player. He was penciled in as the starter but as we all know coaches change there mind and other players step up and earn mintues.

Denver was trying to cut salary not add a 11 mill dollar murphy who woulnt be with them for thier future. It is much easier to make a deal when u are way under the cap which they were before they added Murphy.

cordobes
11-17-2010, 04:24 PM
This has been my point all along. Denver would have rather had a 12 million dollar trade exception than Murphy. Avery Johnson Really coveted Murphy and his shooting ablity from what i heard at the trade press confernce. That would be stupid to add salary just to add it specialy in these econmic times they wanted murphy as a player. He was penciled in as the starter but as we all know coaches change there mind and other players step up and earn mintues.

Denver was trying to cut salary not add a 11 mill dollar murphy who woulnt be with them for thier future. It is much easier to make a deal when u are way under the cap which they were before they added Murphy.

Yeps. They wanted Murphy to have him on the floor, they preferred him to the cap space. It had nothing to do with future deals - in fact, it hurt their position for possible future deals.

BringJackBack
11-17-2010, 05:21 PM
Without regards to this discussion, I just want to say hahahhahahahhahhhahahahhaahhahah!!!!!!

haahahahaha. We traded Troy Murphy for Darren Collison.

HAAHAHAHAHA. Anytime I'm down about this team all I have to think about is Troy Murphy being traded for Darren Collison. HA.

Anthem
11-17-2010, 06:14 PM
Pretty sad if kris hummphrys starts over u lol
If we had Murphy and Humphries available at PF, I'd want Humphries starting and getting most of the minutes.

I've not been thrilled with our PF play so far this season, but not once (NOT ONCE) have I ever thought "Wow, we're really missing Troy Murphy right now."

ballism
11-17-2010, 06:44 PM
Humphries was amazing in the Nets - Clippers game. The best defense on Griffin so far this year - maybe except Tim Duncan's. Nice stats as well. But other than that, he's kind of a more experienced Josh McRoberts.
If I was the Nets, I wouldn't want him playing heavy minutes no matter the opponent.
But hey, with Troy's injury and Avery's focus on defense, it's not surprising.

pacer4ever
11-17-2010, 07:34 PM
Humphries was amazing in the Nets - Clippers game. The best defense on Griffin so far this year - maybe except Tim Duncan's. Nice stats as well. But other than that, he's kind of a more experienced Josh McRoberts.
If I was the Nets, I wouldn't want him playing heavy minutes no matter the opponent.
But hey, with Troy's injury and Avery's focus on defense, it's not surprising.

Blake Griffen had argebly his best game as a pro vs SA. Vs NJ he has his worst performace as a pro he just had an off night in my eyes.

Shade
11-17-2010, 07:40 PM
Murphy never got on the court because Avery Johnson didn’t put him in.

So...what you're saying is...Avery Johnson is smarter than Jim O'Brien.

ballism
11-17-2010, 07:56 PM
Blake Griffen had argebly his best game as a pro vs SA. Vs NJ he has his worst performace as a pro he just had an off night in my eyes.

I thought Duncan's length really bothered him during that game tbh. I do remember one really impressive Griffin spin move while Duncan was directly on him but other than that... i thought stats for that game didn't really reflect how he matched up with Duncan.

As for Nets game, maybe. But Griffin's game is about energy at this point, not stats. He hustles, defends, chases people and boards. Stats may be off and it's no big deal, but when the energy is off, you are kind of looking for reasons - like with LeBron v. Celtics.

And Griffin seemed out of energy to me. Maybe he just had a bad sleep / bad mood etc. But Humphries was all over him, very physical, non-stop and he didn't really bother helping on other guys as much. So it just seemed more likely to me that Humphries drained Griffin quite a bit.

Naptown_Seth
11-17-2010, 08:04 PM
No, not really. Because they've shed even more salary by sending out a player in Courtney Lee who was about to get another contract, because his rookie deal was up.

They will end up saving MORE money by trading for Murphy and then using him to get Melo.

Money that can be used either on a FA signing or be put towards another trade.
But why not just trade Lee + pick for Melo since they were under the cap?

This wasn't really about cap space DIRECTLY, it was about postponing cap space for another year BUT still retaining something useful in the meantime.

And in that regard Troy has been a big disappointment.


And of course BBall made a laughingstock out of the whole "showcase expiring player" ala Rasho and Watson (and really Troy, Dun, TJ even though those weren't final seasons).


Troy was who we thought he was!

Shade
11-17-2010, 08:10 PM
Melo didn't want to go to NJ. That's why he's still in Denver (for now).

Naptown_Seth
11-17-2010, 08:13 PM
A frontline of Favors and Lopez might start to change his mind on that one. I'm impressed by how quickly Favors has picked up things because he was a pretty dumb NCAA player...well dumb in a raw, hasn't learned the game way.

It was a tough call between Favors and Cousins, but with Favors I was worried that Indy fans would be frustrated early on if the Pacers had acquired him somehow.

Since86
11-18-2010, 12:36 PM
This has been my point all along. Denver would have rather had a 12 million dollar trade exception than Murphy . That is why the 4 way deal with Utah fell thur they didnt want to take on AK47's salary. Avery Johnson Really coveted Murphy and his shooting ablity from what i heard at the trade press confernce. That would be stupid to add salary just to add it specialy in these econmic times they wanted murphy as a player. He was penciled in as the starter but as we all know coaches change there mind and other players step up and earn mintues.

Denver was trying to cut salary not add a 11 mill dollar murphy who woulnt be with them for thier future. It is much easier to make a deal when u are way under the cap which they were before they added Murphy.

This is the disconnect. You're taking Avery's words at face value. I am not. There is no way. I will NEVER believe Murphy is/was viewed as a long term player. Ever.

And NJ's new owner has the deepest pockets in the NBA. I don't think he'll hesitate to take on a salary like Murph's if he can flip it. And I say that, because I think he already has.

ballism
11-18-2010, 01:38 PM
I will NEVER believe Murphy is/was viewed as a long term player. Ever.


And noone is saying that. All he's saying is that it was a basketball move intended to make that team better this year.
Noone disagrees with what you are currently saying, just with what you said in previous posts.