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View Full Version : Is their another "star" to pair with Granger we can go after?



90'sNBARocked
10-14-2010, 01:36 PM
I think most of us agree that Granger needs another star by him to get us to that next level. I was curious to see if anyone had suggestions on a realstic target either this year or next, that would be considered a star to pair with Granger.

I was thinking Hortford but not sure if he is considerd a "star"

any other thoughts?

jhondog28
10-14-2010, 01:38 PM
Ricky Rubio

SMosley21
10-14-2010, 01:43 PM
We just traded for him, and his name is Darren Collison.


also,

HORFORD is the proper spelling

http://www.insidehoops.com/blog/?p=6612

After three seasons of increasingly productive play from center Al Horford, the Hawks have decided they want him for the long term.

The feeling is mutual for Horford, who said team officials and his agent, Arn Tellem, have started negotiations on a contract extension.

pacer4ever
10-14-2010, 01:48 PM
We just traded for him, and his name is Darren Collison.


also,

HORFORD is the proper spelling

http://www.insidehoops.com/blog/?p=6612

After three seasons of increasingly productive play from center Al Horford, the Hawks have decided they want him for the long term.

The feeling is mutual for Horford, who said team officials and his agent, Arn Tellem, have started negotiations on a contract extension.

yes Darren looks like a really special player. Also if roy can step his game up like last night. We should just wait for free agency next year. If PG24 devolpes he could be a star in 2 yrs and very good for a long time.

Unclebuck
10-14-2010, 01:50 PM
My hope is maybe the combination of Collison, Roy, Granger and George and with what will probably need to be an upgrade at power forward will be enough in another couple of seasons. Who knows if that will be championship caliber, but I could envision that being the core of a 50 win team, and if you get to that level then you tweak and see what you can do.

That is the theory anyways.

As a practical matter, I don't know if we are going to be able to get a player better than Granger and be able to keep this core together - unless we get crazy lucky in the draft

Trophy
10-14-2010, 01:51 PM
Ricky Rubio

We have Darren.

Heisenberg
10-14-2010, 02:02 PM
.....Larry Brown

pacers74
10-14-2010, 02:03 PM
I am pretty content to go with what we have until next summer. I would love for Bird to pull off another bolckbuster trade, but we already got one this summer and 2 is too much to ask for.
Horford's agent is in discussion with Atlanta brass for a new schedule, so he might not even be available next summer. If Josh and Tyler don't pan out this year, then maybe we go for Landry. We might also be looking to upgrade the SG position next summer if B.Rush is the same and George doesn't look ready to play.

Trophy
10-14-2010, 02:08 PM
Mike was kind of like the co-star in 07-08 and it looks like he's back himself.

Really?
10-14-2010, 02:11 PM
We have Darren.

Neither Rubio or Darren are close to star Quality... especially not rubio

Really?
10-14-2010, 02:21 PM
Also my goal for the Pacers are not to just win games but to bring us a/multiple championship... My guess is that to do this we will have to either hit it rich in the draft and get lucky by drafting a super star or do some monster trade that dramatically makes our team better.

For the next 5-6 years I don't really see many teams competing with the Lakers, Magic, Celtics, Heat, Thunder in the playoffs.

Just my view, to add to that most most rookies take atleast 3 to mature to being all star level players in the NBA anyways so yeah I guess I feel that we are a long way from having a team that can compete for a NBA championship.

But after saying all that it would be a good feeling just to see the Pacers in the Playoffs this year even if it isn't a championship

90'sNBARocked
10-14-2010, 02:23 PM
My hope is maybe the combination of Collison, Roy, Granger and George and with what will probably need to be an upgrade at power forward will be enough in another couple of seasons. Who knows if that will be championship caliber, but I could envision that being the core of a 50 win team, and if you get to that level then you tweak and see what you can do.

That is the theory anyways.

As a practical matter, I don't know if we are going to be able to get a player better than Granger and be able to keep this core together - unless we get crazy lucky in the draft

Maybe we save our cap space until 2012 and get someone from that class?

Robertmto
10-14-2010, 02:29 PM
Granger's a star?

Since86
10-14-2010, 02:31 PM
Wow a robermto sighting to bash Danny. You got your dig in, you can now return to your hole.

90'sNBARocked
10-14-2010, 02:32 PM
http://www.sbnation.com/2010/7/19/1561394/2011-nba-free-agents-rankings-carmelo-anthony
By Matthew O'Brien


THE PRIZE
1. Carmelo Anthony (ETO). Carmelo is to 2011 what LeBron was to 2010. Except next summer, there aren't a host of other veritable superstars available as well, like there was this past one. So if Carmelo does turn down Denver's standing extension offer -- potentially leaving tens of millions on the table if he waits for the new CBA -- every team with cap space and/or sign-and-trade assets will likely make a push for the former Syracuse star. The Knicks, of course, figure to be prominently involved.

THE GATORS
2. Al Horford (R). There's no way the Hawks will let Horford leave...but let's perform a thought experiment: Atlanta get waxed in the second round again next spring. After committing $119 million to Joe Johnson, will Atlanta send themselves into luxury tax hell with a pricey extension for Al Horford? They couldn't afford not to, which means Josh Smith might be on the market soon, as Atlanta might look to clear salary to make keeping Horford more palatable.

THE QUESTION-MARK BIGS
4. Greg Oden (R). What is an injury-prone, physically dominating, soon-to-be 23-year old center worth? That's the question the Blazers have to figure out, as they decide whether to keep Oden. When healthy last season, Oden put up All-Star caliber numbers, although the key here is "when healthy". How much will teams be willing to pony up for a player who's only played one of his first three seasons, assuming the Blazers don't extend him?

5. Yao Ming (U). What is an injury-prone, vertically imposing, soon-to-be 30 year old center worth? And one who happens to be a one-man marketing team in the most populous nation on the planet? Rockets GM Daryl Morey would be loath to let the Chinese big man walk, but if Yao's recurring foot problems revisit him, will Houston be forced to go in another direction next summer?

THE NEXT BEST
6. Tony Parker (U). Gregg Popovich is so infatuated with second-year guard George Hill that the Spurs were reportedly shopping Parker this summer to create more cap flexibility for themselves (at least before Richard Jefferson did them a gargantuan favor and inexplicably opted out of his $15 million for 2010). While Parker's lack of range on his shot limits him from reaching the pinnacle of NBA point guards, his still lightning-quick first step makes him a dangerous player, especially for an uptempo team (the Knicks, if they can't land Chris Paul?)

7. Marc Gasol (R). While the Grizzlies have (rightfully) gotten lambasted for essentially giving Pau Gasol away and instantly turning the Lakers into an mini-dynasty, Memphis did get something back in that much-lampooned trade: Pau's little brother, Marc Gasol. And as NBA cognoscenti can tell you, Marc developed into an indispensable contributor for the Grizzlies last season, averaging 14.6 points and 9.3 rebounds per game (and a PER of 19.3). It's hard to predict what a franchise that hands out $80 million to Rudy Gay, but then gets in a pissing match with Xavier Henry over $300k will do, but they should keep Gasol.

8. Caron Butler (U). Butler will soon be 30-years old and isn't quite good enough to justify his propensity for killing ball movement with an assortment of not-so-dizzying ball fakes, but he is still a quite useful player. He's a more than good enough scorer and tenacious rebounder; in the right system (and for the right price), that is plenty valuable.

9. Tim Duncan (ETO). There's no chance Duncan leaves the Spurs, but technically, he can become a free agent next summer if he wants to. Moving on, nothing to see here.

10. David West (ETO). West's future with New Olreans likely comes down to what their plans for Chris Paul are. If the cash-hemorrhaging Hornets decide to pull off a mega-deal for Paul, West will likely be gone as well, as they go into full cost-cutting mode. If they hold onto Paul, however, and try to convince him to stay (Paul is a free agent in 2012), they'd almost have to keep West and try to package their young talent for a bigger piece.

THE NOT QUITE ALL-STARS
11. Nene Hilario (ETO). Would you believe that Nene is only 27-years old? Dogged by knee injuries, Nene is nonetheless a tantalizing player when healthy: rugged in the paint, but also a versatile, skilled offensive player with a certain passing panache for a big man (at least in the non-Darko category of bigs). If Carmelo leaves Mile High, Nene very well might as well, assuming he can stay healthy.

12. Aaron Brooks (R). Daryl Morey has been stockpiling assets, so there's little chance he'll let the diminutive Brooks leave Houston without getting something in return. After striking out in free agency this summer (Chris Bosh had been their preferred target) and with Yao's future with the club so uncertain, it's even more imperative for the Rockets to land a superstar who can take their roster to contending status. Don't be shocked if Brooks is part of a sign-and-trade deal for someone like Carmelo or Chris Paul.

13. Jason Richardson (U). The former Michigan State star will be 31-years old next summer, so he's just on the downside of his career, but his accuracy from long range and versatile offensive game should make him an interesting option as a No. 3 or 4 scorer on a contender.

14. Carl Landry (U). Landry is Paul Milsap 2.0. Both were overlooked in the draft due to being undersized to play inside, but both have established themselves as tough rebounders with solid mid-range games. Expect Landry to command at least the full mid-level, if not more.

15. Mo Williams (ETO). There's suddenly one big reason less to stay in Cleveland. Williams was obviously distraught at "The Decision", but a season of running the show along with Antawn Jamison as the top two options for the Cavs might be enough to make Williams be the next to bolt from Cleveland

THE RESTRICTED ROLE PLAYERS
16. Jared Dudley (R). The former BC star has embraced his ultimate NBA destiny as a super-sub, lighting it up from deep off the bench, and being an all-around great chemistry guy. He'd be valuable to any number of contending clubs, and knowing the cheapness of Robert Sarver, it wouldn't be shocking to see the Suns let him walk if he gets a lucrative enough offer elsewhere.

17. Jeff Green (R). Russell Westbrook has emerged as the sidekick to Kevin Durant that people imagined Green would be, and that might make Green expendable for the Thunder. If Sam Presti can keep Green for around the mid-level, expect him to stay in Oklahoma City; if not, don't be surprised to see him suit up elsewhere.

18. Rodney Stuckey (R). Stuckey is big and he can certainly score, so look for the Pistons to hold onto him. Still, he won't be nearly as valuable if he has to move over to the two-guard spot, which is a distinct possibility given his embryonic playmaking skills.

19.WIlson Chandler (R). Depending on how much cap flexibility the Knicks want next summer, as they ostensibly pursue trades for Carmelo Anthony and/or Chris Paul, Chandler could either be part of a sign-and-trade or let go to maximize room under the cap.

20. Thaddeus Young (R). After a promising rookie campaign, Young regressed in his sophomore season with the Sixers. Maybe that was head coach Eddie Jordan's fault for under-utilizing him, but expect Philadelphia to wait until next summer before deciding whether to keep him or not.

21. Marcus Thornton (R). As with David West, Thornton's future hinges on what New Orleans does with Chris Paul. If the Hornets move their all-everything point guard, they could look to build around a backcourt of Thornton -- whom the team struck gold with in last year's second round -- and Darren Collison. If the Hornets elect to keep building around Paul and try to convince him to stay in New Orleans, Thornton would likely be their top tradeable asset, along with Collison. Regardless, Thornton figures to get quite a raise next summer.

22. Glen Davis (U). Alright, Davis won't be a restricted free agent, but he should be one of the top role players available next summer. With so much salary committed to the Big Three Four, don't be surprised if the another team outbids the Celtics for his services and promises him a starting spot. Although, with Garnett, Allen and O'Neal's salaries coming off the books after 2011, Boston could conceivably keep Big Baby if they're willing to accept one particularly onerous luxury tax season

Of the entire list the only potentials I see are David West and JAson Richardson, not sure if either is a 'Star"

Hibbert
10-14-2010, 02:34 PM
Also my goal for the Pacers are not to just win games but to bring us a/multiple championship... My guess is that to do this we will have to either hit it rich in the draft and get lucky by drafting a super star or do some monster trade that dramatically makes our team better.

For the next 5-6 years I don't really see many teams competing with the Lakers, Magic, Celtics, Heat, Thunder in the playoffs.

Just my view, to add to that most most rookies take atleast 3 to mature to being all star level players in the NBA anyways so yeah I guess I feel that we are a long way from having a team that can compete for a NBA championship.

But after saying all that it would be a good feeling just to see the Pacers in the Playoffs this year even if it isn't a championship

5 to 6 years from now the top teams to beat will be Oklahoma City, Sacramento, and Memphis. Lakers and Celtics wont be so good. I can see the Pacers in the playoffs next year and being a very good team 2-3 years from now.

90'sNBARocked
10-14-2010, 02:36 PM
http://www.nba.com/2010/news/features/art_garcia/08/01/future.free.agents/index.html
Art Garcia

Or we could save the money until 2012
2012
Headliners


Chris Paul (ETO): CP3 isn't a free agent now? Memos and warnings aside, courting clubs will spend the next two years lining up, a la LeBron. The question for the Hornets' new front office: Do they wait it out and risk losing the league's best point guard for nothing in return or, unlike Toronto and Cleveland, broker a deal to get value back?

Deron Williams (ETO): The league's other best point guard could hold Utah's competitive existence in the balance or build a legacy reminiscent of John Stockton. Money and where the Jazz stand in the Western Conference are sure to come into play.

Bring 'Em On

Gerald Wallace (ETO): First-time All Star last season will be 30 in two years. Has battled injuries and considering Charlotte's money-pinching ways, bet on a change of scenery.

Goran Dragic: Either he's ready to take over for Steve Nash in Phoenix or this crafty lefty will be sailing his own ship in different waters.

Kirk Hinrich: Goes from playing alongside/behind Derrick Rose in Chicago to doing the same with John Wall in Washington. Teams in need of a starting point will pursue Hinrich.

Andre Blatche: Blossomed last season, giving Washington an easy decision when it came to moving Brendan Haywood. Young centers equal serious cash.

Chauncey Billups: At 36, Denver's quarterback is in position for the contract that allows a graceful John Elway exit.

Ron Artest (ETO): No sense in predicting what's next. That's a task for the Lakers and Ron-Ron's psychiatrist.

Jason Terry: Dallas' former Sixth Man of the Year will be on the career backend at 35.

Ray Allen: Unclear if a market will exist for a Boston sharpshooter who will be 37.

Kevin Garnett: With his ring and legacy secure, will it be time to hang it up at 36? Boston hopes not.

Steve Nash: Captain Canada once said he could envision playing up to 40. He'll be 38 when the current two-year extension expires.

Jason Kidd: Dallas playmaker will be 39 and has to retire sometime, right?

Not Yet Free

Russell Westbrook: Locking up the multi-talented point guard is the new No. 1 order of business for GM Sam Presti in OKC.

O.J. Mayo: The Grizzlies did right by Rudy Gay. You have to expect a repeat performance for Mr. Mayo.

Brook Lopez: The prediction here is at least one All-Star berth for New Jersey's soft-spoken 7-footer in the next two years. Mikhail Prokhorov will pony up.

George Hill: Count on Hill assuming a much bigger role in San Antonio's scheme, if he hasn't done so already.

Danilo Gallinari: Plenty of room to shine with David Lee out of the picture and the attention given to Amar'e Stoudemire.

Robin Lopez: Doesn't have the ceiling of twin bother Brook, but hard-working Robin figures to be a more-than-serviceable big man for a long time.

Rudy Fernandez: Once seen as the next Manu Ginobili, this Spanish import has likely seen his last days in Portland.

JaVale McGee: One of the standouts of the recent Summer League is on everyone's radar now.


Man slim pickens there only Blatche I see as a possibilty

Looks like we will have to get lucky in the draft or through a trade

SMosley21
10-14-2010, 02:36 PM
For the next 5-6 years I don't really see many teams competing with the Lakers, Magic, Celtics, Heat, Thunder in the playoffs.


The Lakers have about 3-4 more years of a healthy Kobe playing at his current level. After that, they are done unless they pull in some major star to take his spot.

The Celtics have AT MOST 2 more years of being contenders. To say the core of their team is old is an understatement of epic proportions.

The Magic will continue to be contenders who won't win a championship unless they bring in a star to pair with Dwight. Vince Carter is not that guy.

It's too early to pretend that the Thunder are contenders.

Robertmto
10-14-2010, 02:37 PM
Wow a robermto sighting to bash Danny. You got your dig in, you can now return to your hole.

so, no?

Hibbert
10-14-2010, 02:39 PM
Jim O'Brien, if Pacers have not gotten Darren already, would press hard for Aaron Brooks and Mo Williams. Those two are perfect for what he wants, however JOB won't be here next year and we got our PG so none of this matters. If not re-signed, Jeff Green and Wilson Chandler would make nice additions.

Since86
10-14-2010, 02:42 PM
so, no?

Let me know when they change the name from All-Star to something else. Until then, you're nothing but a troll.

But I fully expect you to be around this year. Getting John Wall give you the confidence to come back and just talk trash?

90'sNBARocked
10-14-2010, 02:44 PM
No Javelle McGee will be that star

vnzla81
10-14-2010, 02:47 PM
There is this guy in New Jersey people say he is a double double machine I think we should go after him :D

Speed
10-14-2010, 02:55 PM
.....Larry Brown

Absolutely, he's worth 10-15 more wins if you could get him back, imo.

dohman
10-14-2010, 03:09 PM
The only player on the list worth getting is Jason Richardson. We need a drastic improvement at the SG position because rush and dun are simply not going to get the job done.

One brings the offense and the other brings the defense. The problem is we need both from one player. Let rush walk, sign dun for less money and try to sign Richardson to a 2 or 3 year deal.

It sucks that we have all this cash and no one to realistically go after. We are so close I can taste it. I just hope larry is patient with the money and does not do a impulse buy.

We need cash to resign hibbert. Hopefully josh can maintain his high level of play into the season. If he can do that we need a SG. I really wish we could use our exipirings to get the SG we want.


I can also see a deal around the trade deadline between the pacers and hawks to clear up cap room for horford.

Trophy
10-14-2010, 03:15 PM
Neither Rubio or Darren are close to star Quality... especially not rubio

I think Darren is going to be a star for us and will become a more well known player in the league.

graphic-er
10-14-2010, 03:20 PM
The only player on the list worth getting is Jason Richardson. We need a drastic improvement at the SG position because rush and dun are simply not going to get the job done.

One brings the offense and the other brings the defense. The problem is we need both from one player. Let rush walk, sign dun for less money and try to sign Richardson to a 2 or 3 year deal.

It sucks that we have all this cash and no one to realistically go after. We are so close I can taste it. I just hope larry is patient with the money and does not do a impulse buy.

We need cash to resign hibbert. Hopefully josh can maintain his high level of play into the season. If he can do that we need a SG. I really wish we could use our exipirings to get the SG we want.


I can also see a deal around the trade deadline between the pacers and hawks to clear up cap room for horford.

Isn't Richardson getting old. Like Darrell Armstrong old?

pacer4ever
10-14-2010, 03:21 PM
Isn't Richardson getting old. Like Darrell Armstrong old?

lol not quite that old lol

naptownmenace
10-14-2010, 03:23 PM
Unfortunately, no. I don't think anyone is interested in trading their "star" player to the Pacers. There might be some options around the trade deadline but I'm pretty sure that most teams are willing to go into the season with what they have right now.

The Pacers best chance to be a star player wears #55.

daschysta
10-14-2010, 03:26 PM
Granger's a star?

You think he isn't? His numbers certainly are, will you be saying the same thing if he puts up comparable numbers and we are in the playoffs? Would you be saying the same thing if we had won 2 more games 2 years ago and got to the playoffs? The team plays MUCH better when granger is in as opposed to when he is out, he makes the team win more, I don't know what else you are asking for. If he is healthy, and puts forth a bit more defensive effort he could easily be a top 15 player int he league.

Because the numbers are beyond reproach... He is a star. Winning now needss to happen to qualify him as m ore than just an all star level player.

graphic-er
10-14-2010, 03:28 PM
lol not quite that old lol

LOL I looked him up, he's 29!? I always thought he was older. I watched a special on the Phoenix Suns training camp last year and they talked about him like he was in his 30's and on the the tail end of his career.

Suaveness
10-14-2010, 03:32 PM
*there

daschysta
10-14-2010, 03:33 PM
I wish there were a way to bring Eric Gordon back home, IMO he is strong enough to defend slightly taller guys, and would be a dream for us on offense. However the days of fleecing the "joke" team of LA may be over, now that they have what looks to be a solid cornerstone in Griffin. I actually like their team quite alot.

Pacers4Life
10-14-2010, 03:36 PM
LOL I looked him up, he's 29!? I always thought he was older. I watched a special on the Phoenix Suns training camp last year and they talked about him like he was in his 30's and on the the tail end of his career.

he's 31 in January. Unfortunately i have nothing else to add to this thread. The previous posts speak for themselves... I don't think its gonna happen and if something does... it'll be something wild.

How dare anyone bash darrel armstrong

pacer4ever
10-14-2010, 03:38 PM
LOL I looked him up, he's 29!? I always thought he was older. I watched a special on the Phoenix Suns training camp last year and they talked about him like he was in his 30's and on the the tail end of his career.
lol ya he isnt real old and he can hit the 3 really well. He likes running in transition. If he didnt have a big contract i would take him.

graphic-er
10-14-2010, 03:49 PM
he's 30 in January. Unfortunately i have nothing else to add to this thread. The previous posts speak for themselves... I don't think its gonna happen and if something does... it'll be something wild.

How dare anyone bash darrel armstrong

Fixed, 1981- same year as me so he gonna be 30.

Trader Joe
10-14-2010, 04:05 PM
Wow a robermto sighting to bash Danny. You got your dig in, you can now return to your hole.

At least he's started out coming out again. Ever since he claimed that Granger "disappeared" in the 4th quarter and then was promptly presented with about 100 stats that suggested otherwise he hasn't been around much.

dohman
10-14-2010, 04:08 PM
He may not be a star and he may be getting up there in age but he is the best player in a pile of poop not named melo or horford.

We have all this cap space and no players to give it to worth going after. I hope larry doesnt spend it on the dantay jones and jeff fosters and trys to get a ace.

90'sNBARocked
10-14-2010, 04:18 PM
Isn't Richardson getting old. Like Darrell Armstrong old?

in basketball terms : kind of

he is 31

90'sNBARocked
10-14-2010, 04:20 PM
I wish there were a way to bring Eric Gordon back home, IMO he is strong enough to defend slightly taller guys, and would be a dream for us on offense. However the days of fleecing the "joke" team of LA may be over, now that they have what looks to be a solid cornerstone in Griffin. I actually like their team quite alot.

The Clippers will probably match, but on the other hand Donald Sterling, Clippers owner, has had a reputation for being notoriously cheap

Gordon is a RFA after 2011

graphic-er
10-14-2010, 04:21 PM
in basketball terms : kind of

he is 31

Or is he 29? Say NBA says he was born in 1981.

pacer4ever
10-14-2010, 04:23 PM
The Clippers will probably match, but on the other hand Donald Sterling, Clippers owner, has had a reputation for being notoriously cheap

Gordon is a RFA after 2011

Eric will get a huge offer sheet probly 5 yr 60 mill and clippers probly wont match. Unless Baron's contract is off the book by then.

BringJackBack
10-14-2010, 04:25 PM
Random question: Let's say that Gordon and George are both here in three years. Who's starting?

90'sNBARocked
10-14-2010, 04:26 PM
Or is he 29? Say NBA says he was born in 1981.

I think your correct, I think I was referring to the age he will be when he is an UFA in 2012 , 2 years form now, so that makes sense

I can also tell you from living in Pheonix the last two years prior to comming to Chicago, that Jason was a stud for the Suns, loved by the team and fans and one of the most consistent players next to Nash

Trader Joe
10-14-2010, 04:27 PM
Random question: Let's say that Gordon and George are both here in three years. Who's starting?

How did Eric Gordon get here? LOL

90'sNBARocked
10-14-2010, 04:27 PM
Eric will get a huge offer sheet probly 5 yr 60 mill and clippers probly wont match. Unless Baron's contract is off the book by then.

Could really go either way. I remeber when no one thought he would match the offer for Brand and he did,

how ironic he was lcuky that Philly took him

pacer4ever
10-14-2010, 04:29 PM
How did Eric Gordon get here? LOL

would have to be FA or trade of DG

BringJackBack
10-14-2010, 04:30 PM
How did Eric Gordon get here? LOL

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Random question: Let's say that Gordon and George are both here in three years. Who's starting?

I should have said suppose or what if.

pacer4ever
10-14-2010, 04:31 PM
Random question: Let's say that Gordon and George are both here in three years. Who's starting?

Eric played the point the other night for the clipps lol. I would put Paul at the 3 Eric at the 2 and hate to say it but trade danny for a young big. That is if Paul devolpes into what i belive he will delvope into.

Trader Joe
10-14-2010, 04:34 PM
Well, aside from the fact that I think we've all developed a serious case of "Shawne Williams syndrome" when it comes to PG's skills, I'd have to go with Gordon. I think he's about to have a huge, breakout year for the Clippers. He's got every skill you could want on offense, and is a very solid defender for his size.

graphic-er
10-14-2010, 04:42 PM
Well, aside from the fact that I think we've all developed a serious case of "Shawne Williams syndrome" when it comes to PG's skills, I'd have to go with Gordon. I think he's about to have a huge, breakout year for the Clippers. He's got every skill you could want on offense, and is a very solid defender for his size.

Break out year? The guy already averages 17pts a game, that would have be some break out man. You think he is going for 24 a game?

Trader Joe
10-14-2010, 04:42 PM
Break out year? The guy already averages 17pts a game, that would have be some break out man. You think he is going for 24 a game?

Yes, I think Gordon will end up being close to a 25 ppg scorer. There are any number of guys that can put up 16-17 ppg with the minutes Gordon will get this year. He has the tools to be an elite scorer, and I think he will be.

pacer4ever
10-14-2010, 04:44 PM
Yes, I think Gordon will end up being close to a 25 ppg scorer.

ya me to with griffen coming back he will ave 24 i think it will be much like DG33 year where he broke out. He is in amazing shape right now and has improved a lot.

1984
10-14-2010, 05:00 PM
Our best chance of acquiring a star comes from within. At this point, I think the players on the roster with, "star potential" are Collison, Hibbert, and George. Collison could become an immediate star, and this season relies heavily on him. Hibbert could become an all-star, but I don't think he has the ceilling to become a superstar. Rik Smits? Yes. David Robinson? No. George could become a star after a few years of development. I don't think he has the game experience to have signficant, immediate impact.

I invision the Pacers becoming like the Trailblazers of the late 1990's. They did not have superstars on their roster. Yet they had multiple players who were stars (Damon Stoudamire, Rasheed Wallace) and a roster that was deep with talented veterns (Jim Jackson, and Isaiah Rider). Granger is a better player than Rasheed Wallace was in the 90's and Collison could be better than Damon Stoudamire.

The issue, in my opinion, is not developing stars. While I love Indiana, we all have to agree that it is not a "destination" to many 20-something multi-millionaires. After all, as revealed in the LeBron-apocalypse, there are more "money-making opportunites in cities like New York or Los Angeles. Therefore the issue is developing depth. We cannot and will not attract Carmelo to Indianapolis and build a superteam comparable to LeBron, Dwayne, and Chris. What we can do, however, is build a team that is so deep it causes matchup problems through endurance and diversity for teams. That was the challenge the Trailblazers created.

IMO: The Lakers are the best team in the League for that reason. Not only do they have Kobe, Pau, Rob, Lamar, and Andrew; they also have a host of quality players on their bench. Phil Jackson has always been accused of pursuing stars, yet everywhere he goes young talent blossoms.

Depth, is the key to creating a long-term contender in Indiana.

Really?
10-14-2010, 05:04 PM
Let me clarify... the teams that I listed are the ones that will contend for championships with-in the next 5-6 years... meaning that the Celtics will have a shot this year but their time is running short... I think that the kings may be okay, but I would give a better chance for the clippers than the kings in 5 years but we will see...

Robertmto
10-14-2010, 05:05 PM
Stars dont lead teams to 40 win seasons while constantly taking bad shots.

1984
10-14-2010, 05:06 PM
Granger's a star?

Yes. A superstar? Perhaps not. People forget that there are two types of stars. Stars and superstars. I once heard someone add "super-nova" to the to the basketball-ictionary in order to describe Michael and Kobe.

Robertmto
10-14-2010, 05:08 PM
if star =/= superstar i agree. He'd be a good (not great) 2nd option somewhere

1984
10-14-2010, 05:13 PM
if star =/= superstar i agree. He'd be a good (not great) 2nd option somewhere

I agree with that. Danny is somewhere between a number 1 player and a number 2 player. Knowing that I am a homer, I must face the reality that he is probably a number 2.

With that being said, where do we find a number 1? I think that is a question that 20 or more teams ask every year. They waste their time looking for a superstar. Meanwhile, teams like the Pistons stock up on stars and win championships.

IMO.

dohman
10-14-2010, 05:35 PM
Danny Granger can score with anyone in the league. That automatically makes him a star.

A super star is someone who does it on both ends of the court every single night and a player that other teams are scared of.

90'sNBARocked
10-14-2010, 05:52 PM
A superstar can take a game over at anytime in my opinion

Granger is a star but not a superstar

What he is in realty is an exceptional scorer, almost like a 6'9 Ben Gordon

pacer4ever
10-14-2010, 05:57 PM
A superstar can take a game over at anytime in my opinion

Granger is a star but not a superstar

What he is in realty is an exceptional scorer, almost like a 6'9 Ben Gordon

Bgordon cant get to the rim as well as DG

90'sNBARocked
10-14-2010, 05:59 PM
Bgordon cant get to the rim as well as DG

I dont know man DG rarely seems to attack the rim anymore

dohman
10-14-2010, 06:03 PM
I dont know man DG rarely seems to attack the rim anymore

So your telling me he scores 25 ppg just off three pointers? Thats 8 threes a game! He will be passing uncle reggie pretty quickly

1984
10-14-2010, 06:10 PM
I dont know man DG rarely seems to attack the rim anymore

Danny does not penetrate like he should. That's because he has lost his aggressiveness and the system allows it. IMO, it would be unacceptable for any player with a high free throw percentage to not attack the rim. Statistically speaking, you are far more likely to win if your opponent is in foul trouble and your team shoots well from the charity stripe. Getting a player, especially a big man, in foul trouble breaks down a defense, and free shots are free shots.

Danny is not like Ben Gordon. Gordon is not a star and is not as diverse as Danny.

pacer4ever
10-14-2010, 06:10 PM
So your telling me he scores 25 ppg just off three pointers? Thats 8 threes a game! He will be passing uncle reggie pretty quickly

lol some peple just dont watch the games(or isnt watching the same on i am) lol he gets to the rim a lot. Some times he doesnt get to the rim as often as he should but he can get to the rim and does.

90'sNBARocked
10-14-2010, 06:11 PM
So your telling me he scores 25 ppg just off three pointers? Thats 8 threes a game! He will be passing uncle reggie pretty quickly

You do realize there is roughly 20 feet between the 3 point line and the rim

He has a great mid range game as well

I just dont see him drive agressively to the rim that much

daschysta
10-14-2010, 06:14 PM
Danny Shoots a respectable number of free throws, especially 2 years ago, when he was healthy. The FT numbers imply he gets to the rim more than your suggesting...

Getting fouled on a jumpshot doesn't account for most of them.

1984
10-14-2010, 06:19 PM
Danny Shoots a respectable number of free throws, especially 2 years ago, when he was healthy. The FT numbers imply he gets to the rim more than your suggesting...

Getting fouled on a jumpshot doesn't account for most of them.

Danny Granger averaged 6.9 free throw attempts per game where as Kevin Durrant, LeBron James, and Dwight Howard averaged over 10. Durant and James play on the perimeter, but attack the rim. That means, each game, Durrant and James have the opportunity to score in double figures on free throws alone. Imagine how that enables their team to win.

Don't get me wrong, I have a Granger jersey in the closet. I think the guy is amazing, but I hope he realizes what it takes to win.

1984
10-14-2010, 06:27 PM
Danny Granger averaged 6.9 free throw attempts per game where as Kevin Durrant, LeBron James, and Dwight Howard averaged over 10. Durant and James play on the perimeter, but attack the rim. That means, each game, Durrant and James have the opportunity to score in double figures on free throws alone. Imagine how that enables their team to win.

Don't get me wrong, I have a Granger jersey in the closet. I think the guy is amazing, but I hope he realizes what it takes to win.

Danny also shot 10 two point field goals per game (that means all shots within the perimeter, not necessarily those at the rim) and he shot 7 three point field goals per game (which lead the league).

Danny makes 10 two point attempts, 7 three point attempts, and goes to the free throw line 3 1/2 times per game.

1984
10-14-2010, 06:34 PM
I should add:

In Reggie Miller's best statistical year (89-90) he attempted 15.6 two point attempts per game, 4.41 three point attempts per game (and he was the greatest three point shooter of all time), and almost 8 free throw attempts per game.

graphic-er
10-14-2010, 07:09 PM
Danny Granger averaged 6.9 free throw attempts per game where as Kevin Durrant, LeBron James, and Dwight Howard averaged over 10. Durant and James play on the perimeter, but attack the rim. That means, each game, Durrant and James have the opportunity to score in double figures on free throws alone. Imagine how that enables their team to win.

Don't get me wrong, I have a Granger jersey in the closet. I think the guy is amazing, but I hope he realizes what it takes to win.

Players like lebron and carmelo and wade also dominate the ball. Our coach and his system does not let danny do the same.

1984
10-14-2010, 10:26 PM
In that case, all the more reason to not waste out time looking for superstars. If the "system" doesn't allow a player to dominate the ball why not look for depth first?

Anthem
10-16-2010, 08:21 PM
Was Reggie Miller a star?

1984
10-16-2010, 10:54 PM
Of course. He has the all-star games and MVP votes to prove it.

Star by regular season, superstar by playoffs.

Hicks
10-16-2010, 11:34 PM
What MVP votes?

Jose Slaughter
10-17-2010, 03:39 AM
Once we are under the cap it opens up greater options for trades. Teams will look at the Pacers knowing that we can take on more salary then we send out. Bird will take advantage of that & add the pieces to complete the re-building.

After that it will just be a matter of allowing the players to develope together.

Lance George
10-17-2010, 12:42 PM
Stars dont lead teams to 40 win seasons while constantly taking bad shots. Let's leave Gilbert Arenas out of this. We're not bailing you out of that atrocious, franchise-killing contract.

BringJackBack
10-17-2010, 01:58 PM
Let's leave Gilbert Arenas out of this. We're not bailing you out of that atrocious, franchise-killing contract.

:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

pacer4ever
10-17-2010, 06:50 PM
Let's leave Gilbert Arenas out of this. We're not bailing you out of that atrocious, franchise-killing contract.

it really isnt that bad he aved 22 and 8 last season b4 the gun thing. Ya he is a little overpaid but he is a real good player. ( But i dont want him here)

flox
10-17-2010, 07:04 PM
Arenas would be a good fit.

vnzla81
10-17-2010, 07:13 PM
Arenas would be a good fit.

GA from three years ago before the surgery, man I feel that I keep repeating the same thing over and over again, didn't you guys learn anything from JO, Tinsley, Foster and Bender?

NapTonius Monk
10-17-2010, 07:28 PM
I think the Atlanta scenario is real. They can't pony up for Johnson, Smith, and Horford, can they? Maybe they do. But if not, I say we push hard for Josh Smith.

NapTonius Monk
10-17-2010, 07:29 PM
Arenas would be a good fit.for the headcase era we (prayerfully) escaped from.

flox
10-17-2010, 08:12 PM
GA from three years ago before the surgery, man I feel that I keep repeating the same thing over and over again, didn't you guys learn anything from JO, Tinsley, Foster and Bender?
Eh. I don't want to think we are cursed injury team yet. I think we will have our Amare or Boozer or Martin at some point.

vnzla81
10-17-2010, 08:20 PM
Eh. I don't want to think we are cursed injury team yet. I think we will have our Amare or Boozer or Martin at some point.

We already did, their names are JO,Tinsley,Foster,Dunleavy,Marquis,Bender, etc, etc.

flox
10-17-2010, 08:22 PM
We already did, their names are JO,Tinsley,Foster,Dunleavy,Marquis,Bender, etc, etc.

No, they never healed as well as the people i listed did

vnzla81
10-17-2010, 09:03 PM
No, they never healed as well as the people i listed did

Boozer it out again, Amare is been out most of the time and Kmart looks like is finally getting healthy but who knows

pacer4ever
10-17-2010, 09:10 PM
Boozer it out again, Amare is been out most of the time and Kmart looks like is finally getting healthy but who knows

i heard k-mart is out till the all star break.

vnzla81
10-17-2010, 09:16 PM
i heard k-mart is out till the all star break.

I tought he was talking about Kevin Martin and I was confuse and called him Kmart

flox
10-17-2010, 10:06 PM
Boozer it out again, Amare is been out most of the time and Kmart looks like is finally getting healthy but who knows

Amare has played over 79 games in 3 out of the last 4 seasons.

What's your definition of healthy?

pacer4ever
10-17-2010, 10:10 PM
I tought he was talking about Kevin Martin and I was confuse and called him Kmart

O ya the Rocket's broadcasters call him K-mart to. But when i here K-mart i think of Kenyon Martin.

vnzla81
10-17-2010, 10:15 PM
Amare has played over 79 games in 3 out of the last 4 seasons.

What's your definition of healthy?

You are saying that those guys healed better than the ones from the Pacers



No, they never healed as well as the people i listed did

flox
10-18-2010, 12:59 AM
You are saying that those guys healed better than the ones from the Pacers

Yes they did. Amare is ahead of any of those players you listed healing wise. He's been more durable than Quis or Tinsley or O'Neal or Dunleavy or Foster in the past few seasons.