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View Full Version : Magnum Rolle Has Signed a 2 Year Contract



SMosley21
09-27-2010, 04:16 PM
According to Mike Wells....


Pacers have signed 2nd-rounder Rolle to a 2-yr contract. They'll have to trade, buyout or release player by end of Oct to get to 15 players
http://twitter.com/MikeWellsNBA/status/25717502963

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 04:18 PM
YES MAGNUM ROLLE LOVE THAT NAME LIKE HIS GAME

duke dynamite
09-27-2010, 04:19 PM
Somebody please tell me when I am going to get my box of Eggo's from Tinsley's contract.

Oh, that and please trade Brandon Rush.

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 04:20 PM
Somebody please tell me when I am going to get my box of Eggo's from Tinsley's contract.

Oh, that and please trade Brandon Rush.

o ya forgot his contract is off the books yess!

vnzla81
09-27-2010, 04:24 PM
Not yet, they got one year left

Pacers4Life
09-27-2010, 04:26 PM
This... is FANTASTIC news. 2 second round picks worth giving a damn about? Has that ever happened before? Remember on draft night when we draftedthat one guy... And Hollinger just laughed at us... whos laughing nowww?!

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/55678/DannyDunGWPHX.jpg

Mikes excited...

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 04:27 PM
Not yet, they got one year left

ok damm wish he was off the books. But he will be off the books for the year we have cap room.

MillerTime
09-27-2010, 04:28 PM
Great news. He'll be a good athletic PF off the bench.

I think we did such a great job in this year's draft; George, Stephenson (based on talent) and Rolle...great young additions to our team

graphic-er
09-27-2010, 04:29 PM
So then who gets cut, cause I don't see a trade happening. Unless we just throw in some filler as a 3rd party have to do a 2 for 1 then. Good buy Soloman Jones!

odeez
09-27-2010, 04:30 PM
Good for Magnum!

MillerTime
09-27-2010, 04:32 PM
So then who gets cut, cause I don't see a trade happening. Unless we just throw in some filler as a 3rd party have to do a 2 for 1 then. Good buy Soloman Jones!

I think we'll do a 2 for 1 or 3 for 2 trade.

There could be a chance we give Foster a really generous buyout offer and offer him a position in office

90'sNBARocked
09-27-2010, 04:32 PM
Does anyone think this has a bearing to Lance? or do you think its independent of Lance's situation?

MillerTime
09-27-2010, 04:33 PM
Does anyone think this has a bearing to Lance? or do you think its independent of Lance's situation?

I think Lance will remain a Pacer but under strict conditions. We signed him for 2 years already

graphic-er
09-27-2010, 04:36 PM
I think we'll do a 2 for 1 or 3 for 2 trade.

There could be a chance we give Foster a really generous buyout offer and offer him a position in office

Foster said in an interview that he has not plans of hanging up the jersey yet. He wants his kids to see him play for a while.

oz_pacer
09-27-2010, 04:36 PM
What about kirilenko for ford and a filler say dantahy he can play pf he can defend and if it doesnt work out his contract expires at the end of the year

Trader Joe
09-27-2010, 04:40 PM
...Waits on the other shoe to drop...

ChristianDudley
09-27-2010, 04:40 PM
As said above, I believe we'll keep Lance Stephenson, at least until he messes up again (God forbid). It really is looking like, to me, that Solo is going to be the odd man out along with Lance Allred in our training camp (of course Allred isn't under contract by us, just a filler guy in camp), UNLESS in the next few weeks we find a way to move T.J. or possibly either Rush or Dahntay (it would be really dumb imo to get rid of either of these 2 guys + getting rid of Ford is hard enough as is). So with T.J. getting told something about possibly getting some minutes this year with us and Solo having a real small contract, I'd put my money on Solo being the 16th player on our roster and therefore getting bought out.

Hicks
09-27-2010, 04:47 PM
I'm happy to see this. I wonder how we'll address cutting a spot. It's fun to dream about a trade, but I'm expecting us to cut Lance, TJ, or Solo. My guess is we'll wait until after Oct 19th (Lance's court date) to see how the winds appear to be blowing with him. If things go sour for him, maybe we cut bait. Otherwise, I'm looking at Solo.

Then again, maybe instead of cutting Solo we'll trade him for a future 2nd to some team that can absorb his salary.

HeliumFear
09-27-2010, 04:54 PM
What about kirilenko for ford and a filler say dantahy he can play pf he can defend and if it doesnt work out his contract expires at the end of the year


Why on earth would the Jazz do this?

BornReady
09-27-2010, 05:00 PM
OH WAWAWEWA!!! YAYYYY!!!
http://www.danafredsti.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/happy-dance.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_gr0oVAzFitM/SOln1cbuPhI/AAAAAAAAApM/Pghcds_N7HE/s320/snoopy_happy_dance.jpg
http://www.share-christmas.com/kids/countdown/santa_happy_dance_hg_clr.gif

jeffg-body
09-27-2010, 05:00 PM
Yes, maybe the is the preview to an upcoming trade or buyout.

ChristianDudley
09-27-2010, 05:04 PM
Yes, maybe the is the preview to an upcoming trade or buyout.

it would have to be now that we've signed our 16th player ;)

Peck
09-27-2010, 05:29 PM
I'll say one thing for Pacers management, they sure are Bold.

I mean they just forced their own hands of player movement by the end of pre-season.

I like it.

MyFavMartin
09-27-2010, 05:31 PM
Congrats to Magnum and thanks for the hardwork. Keep it up!

Now we'll see what TPTB do next. Got about a month, so don't expect anything too quick.

90'sNBARocked
09-27-2010, 05:39 PM
I'm happy to see this. I wonder how we'll address cutting a spot. It's fun to dream about a trade, but I'm expecting us to cut Lance, TJ, or Solo. My guess is we'll wait until after Oct 19th (Lance's court date) to see how the winds appear to be blowing with him. If things go sour for him, maybe we cut bait. Otherwise, I'm looking at Solo.

Then again, maybe instead of cutting Solo we'll trade him for a future 2nd to some team that can absorb his salary.


•Though T.J. Ford is relegated to backup status with Collison on board, he has not been marginalized. O'Brien said Ford's experience will be very important in the point guard rotation because Collison and A.J. Price are very young players and Lance Stephenson is a rookie. "We're so happy to have someone with T.J.'s experience to be part of that point guard corps," he said. "This is a situation T.J. can be a very important part of."


•Brandon Rush and Lance Stephenson both stood in front of the cameras and handled themselves well in their first interviews since their offseason issues. O'Brien made it clear both have much to prove both on and off the court.

curtosey of Pacers.com and Connrad Brunnner

Pure speculation on my part but it appers we might be keeping Lance

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 05:52 PM
Yes, maybe the is the preview to an upcoming trade or buyout.

we have until the end of presesaon lets just see who earns the spot.

Sookie
09-27-2010, 06:01 PM
I'm going to hope it's TJ. It'll be Lance if he's guilty. It'll more than likely be Solo if Lance's innocent.

I still hope it ends up being TJ. (I don't want his experience anywhere near AJ and Darren.)

Major Cold
09-27-2010, 06:55 PM
I think we will make a buy-out. We will hold onto our expiring to at least the trade deadline.

Larry Staverman
09-27-2010, 07:14 PM
I'm going to hope it's TJ. It'll be Lance if he's guilty. It'll more than likely be Solo if Lance's innocent.

Oct 19 is just his first appearance in court. The only way it is resolved then is if he pleads to a lesser charge or charges are dropped. No way he pleads to something that gives him jail time at that point.

If it goes to trial it will be after the first of the year at the earliest maybe after the season. Plan on Lance being on the roster opening night.

Trader Joe
09-27-2010, 08:17 PM
I'm reading that Lance Allred signed a contract too? So now we're two players over the limit?

Now we basically have to make at least one trade.

BRushWithDeath
09-27-2010, 08:31 PM
I'm reading that Lance Allred signed a contract too? So now we're two players over the limit?



Non guaranteed. Just for camp.

We do have 16 guaranteed deals though.

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 08:33 PM
Non guaranteed. Just for camp.

We do have 16 guaranteed deals though.

ya lance allred will be cut how many times do i have to tell different people lol. It is getting very annoying. We are allowed to have 20 people in camp. CHRIS kRAMER is in bucks camp but i doubt he will make the team. There are a lot of people who get training camp invites.

BRushWithDeath
09-27-2010, 08:37 PM
ya lance allred will be cut how many times do i have to tell different people lol. It is getting very annoying.

You've had to tell a lot of people anything about Lance Allred?

A lot of people know who Lance Allred is?

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 08:41 PM
You've had to tell a lot of people anything about Lance Allred?

A lot of people know who Lance Allred is?

not just lance but people saying we have to many players and such for camp. But ya aout 5 people have said that about lance allred. lol

Trader Joe
09-27-2010, 08:51 PM
You've had to tell a lot of people anything about Lance Allred?

A lot of people know who Lance Allred is?

Maybe he's close friends with Lance's family.

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 08:58 PM
Maybe he's close friends with Lance's family.

no lol just a lot of people heard about it because he is leaglly deaf.

BringJackBack
09-27-2010, 08:59 PM
James White
Josh McRoberts
AJ Price
Lance Stephenson
Magnum Rolle

Not bad in the 2nd. The only laughable one was White, if that was Bird's pick. And we're coming from a league where Hasheem Thabeet is drafted #2 and four point guards are drafted in the first round. As well as a college bench player drafted #29.

BRushWithDeath
09-27-2010, 09:00 PM
James White
Josh McRoberts
AJ Price
Lance Stephenson
Magnum Rolle

Not bad in the 2nd. The only laughable one was White, if that was Bird's pick. And we're coming from a league where Hasheem Thabeet is drafted #2 and four point guards are drafted in the first round. As well as a college bench player drafted #29.

McRoberts was drafted by Kevin Pritchard.

Pacers#1Fan
09-27-2010, 09:06 PM
Congrats to Magnum!

Nothing personal against Solo but hopefully he is the one on his way out. I still think we could get something semi-decent out of T.J. without cutting him and I'm hoping for the best with Lance.

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 09:09 PM
<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/8OTybeBsDz4?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/8OTybeBsDz4?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>



love the dunks and D

BringJackBack
09-27-2010, 09:11 PM
McRoberts was drafted by Kevin Pritchard.

I know that but I think that Bird saw him as a piece rather than a throw away like Portland did.

I shouldn't have said in the 2nd round. I should have said diamond in the rough.

Putnam
09-27-2010, 09:32 PM
Magnum Rolle is going to redefine the role of the NBA 15th man. I mean, this guy is going to make you forget all about names like Samaki Walker and Josh Powell and Sean Green.

What? You already forgot about them?


Eh, never mind.

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 09:33 PM
Magnum Rolle is going to redefine the role of the NBA 15th man. I mean, this guy is going to make you forget all about names like Samaki Walker and Josh Powell and Sean Green.

What? You already forgot about them?


Eh, never mind.

he will be in the rotation come season after this one maybe even this 1

I Love P
09-27-2010, 09:36 PM
Magnum Rolle = Channing Frye but with a better low post game.

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 09:38 PM
Magnum Rolle = Channing Frye but with a better low post game.

and way more athlethic and blocks shots. Channing has better range he can shoot the 3 they have a simalar body thats about it

BringJackBack
09-27-2010, 09:39 PM
Magnum Rolle = Channing Frye but with a better low post game.

Meh, I don't see it. Channing has a very consistent stand still three, and Magnum is a guy that will do a PnP or even come off screens.

I Love P
09-27-2010, 09:51 PM
Open up two pages and play these two videos side by side...then tell me what you think. Their shots are exactly the same....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8OTybeBsDz4

More dunks than jumpshots ^ but there are a few.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dggpNrSUfGw

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 09:53 PM
Magnum Rolle is going to redefine the role of the NBA 15th man. I mean, this guy is going to make you forget all about names like Samaki Walker and Josh Powell and Sean Green.

What? You already forgot about them?


Eh, never mind.

i would take rolle over mcbob any day

I Love P
09-27-2010, 10:09 PM
Over McRoberts? Please, McRoberts is a beast my man. I love Josh's game.

BringJackBack
09-27-2010, 10:10 PM
Why argue? We have both.

oz_pacer
09-27-2010, 10:11 PM
Why on earth would the Jazz do this?

They get a back up point gaurd for williams who was injured a bit last year and a good perimiter defender to play the likes of bryant roy and durant etc.

Major Cold
09-27-2010, 10:13 PM
Folks as much as I like the skill set, we have yet to see him in a NBA game. So let's take it easy and not over sell him. Cause when he doesnt earn pt, you'll think its justifiable to bag on the coach.

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 10:14 PM
Over McRoberts? Please, McRoberts is a beast my man. I love Josh's game.

are u serious mcbob is noting but an athlete. magnum can shoot and play in the post & PnR. Not to metition his shot blocking ablity .(mcbob can to) magnum is an athlete 2.

Sookie
09-27-2010, 10:16 PM
are u serious mcbob is noting but an athlete. magnum can shoot and play in the post & PnR. Not to metition his shot blocking ablity .(mcbob can to) magnum is an athlete 2.

We haven't seen him in an NBA game.

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 10:16 PM
Folks as much as I like the skill set, we have yet to see him in a NBA game. So let's take it easy and not over sell him. Cause when he doesnt earn pt, you'll think its justifiable to bag on the coach.

ive seen mcbob in an nba game and i dont like it. he is an athltic freak thats about it. But rolle wont get PT because JOB has a man crush on mcbob.

BRushWithDeath
09-27-2010, 10:30 PM
are u serious mcbob is noting but an athlete. magnum can shoot and play in the post & PnR. Not to metition his shot blocking ablity .(mcbob can to) magnum is an athlete 2.
ive seen mcbob in an nba game and i dont like it. he is an athltic freak thats about it. But rolle wont get PT because JOB has a man crush on mcbob.

Wow.

Anthem
09-27-2010, 10:32 PM
JOB has a man crush on mcbob.
Fixed.

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 10:32 PM
Wow.

did watch him last year??? i watched every game

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 10:36 PM
Over McRoberts? Please, McRoberts is a beast my man. I love Josh's game.

ya an athlitic beast LeBron is a basketball beast big differnce

BRushWithDeath
09-27-2010, 10:44 PM
A little effort at proper spelling and grammar would go a long way to people taking ridiculous statements like, "JOB has a mancrush on mcbob" or "i would take rolle over mcbob any day", seriously.

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 10:45 PM
A little effort at proper spelling and grammar would go a long way to people taking ridiculous statements like, "JOB has a mancrush on mcbob" or "i would take rolle over mcbob any day", seriously.

u have yet to state why u would take mcbob im waiting?

Pacers#1Fan
09-27-2010, 10:46 PM
ya an athlitic beast LeBron is a basketball beast big differnce

When the hell did this become about Lebron?

1 in 5,000 north Atlantic lobsters are born bright blue.

Charlie Brown's father was a barber

Just sayin...

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 10:47 PM
"Play McRoberts and Price!" thats a homer i want what is best 4 the team

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 10:48 PM
When the hell did this become about Lebron?

1 in 5,000 north Atlantic lobsters are born bright blue.

Charlie Brown's father was a barber

Just sayin...

was stating the differnce between good ball player and good phsyical ablities

BRushWithDeath
09-27-2010, 10:51 PM
"Play McRoberts and Price!" thats a homer i want what is best 4 the team

When that was originally written, it was what's best for the team.

And I've been called many things in my few years around here. But that's the first time I've been called a homer. Usually it's quite the opposite.

BRushWithDeath
09-27-2010, 10:53 PM
u have yet to state why u would take mcbob im waiting?

He's better. By a good margin.

Rolle may turn out to eventually be a rotation player. But he's not close to there yet.

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 10:53 PM
When that was originally written, it was what's best for the team.

And I've been called many things in my few years around here. But that's the first time I've been called a homer. Usually it's quite the opposite.

ok if im wrong ill man up, but i just see magnum fitting in better with DC2.

pwee31
09-27-2010, 11:03 PM
If no deal is done, I'm pretty sure Solo gets bought out

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 11:04 PM
If no deal is done, I'm pretty sure Solo gets bought out

i hope so

QuickRelease
09-27-2010, 11:11 PM
James White
Josh McRoberts
AJ Price
Lance Stephenson
Magnum Rolle

Not bad in the 2nd. The only laughable one was White, if that was Bird's pick. And we're coming from a league where Hasheem Thabeet is drafted #2 and four point guards are drafted in the first round. As well as a college bench player drafted #29.James White wasn't really laughable. Hindsight is 20/20, of course, but James White's failure was on James White. He had all the tools, but his mental makeup did him in. No problem with Bird taking a chance on him. It just doesn't seem he had the hunger to succeed.

HeliumFear
09-27-2010, 11:36 PM
They get a back up point gaurd for williams who was injured a bit last year and a good perimiter defender to play the likes of bryant roy and durant etc.

The Jazz recently signed Earl Watson to be their THIRD PG on the roster. Dahntay would be an overpaid bench player on the Jazz,and their front office isn't silly enough to make that mistake.

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 11:41 PM
The Jazz recently signed Earl Watson to be their THIRD PG on the roster. Dahntay would be an overpaid bench player on the Jazz,and their front office isn't silly enough to make that mistake.

ya they dont want to be the T wolves

MLB007
09-27-2010, 11:46 PM
I think we'll do a 2 for 1 or 3 for 2 trade.

There could be a chance we give Foster a really generous buyout offer and offer him a position in office

Uh, that's our leading rebounder you're showing the door..... :-o

pacer4ever
09-27-2010, 11:48 PM
Uh, that's our leading rebounder you're showing the door..... :-o

we need foster lol not as a front office man

oz_pacer
09-28-2010, 02:12 AM
The Jazz recently signed Earl Watson to be their THIRD PG on the roster. Dahntay would be an overpaid bench player on the Jazz,and their front office isn't silly enough to make that mistake.

oh i wasn't aware they'd signed earl i just thought they had invited him to training camp who are their other pgs gaines? miles?

i dont think jones would rot on their bench they lost a couple of wings this year

Indra
09-28-2010, 07:22 AM
Wow, I haven't really seen much footage of Rolle, but he has a very sweet J. He's not a sniper by any means, but he has great mechanics on his shot, and shoots a very pretty ball. He also has some good low post footwork. Overall, I'm pretty impressed!

Major Cold
09-28-2010, 07:58 AM
ive seen mcbob in an nba game and i dont like it. he is an athltic freak thats about it. But rolle wont get PT because JOB has a man crush on mcbob.


If you believe that then you weren't watching the "irrelevant" games.

Rolle might in fact be better than McBob, but the fact remains he still does not have the experience. And for the NBA, front court experience is needed. The quickness of the NBA is hard to adjust to. Rolle will have to adjust to that.

I really hope he is our Taj Gibson. But he was an exception and not the rule to rookie front court players.

And lets quit with the homer calling. That is Cass' job.

SMosley21
09-28-2010, 08:29 AM
ive seen mcbob in an nba game and i dont like it. he is an athltic freak thats about it. But rolle wont get PT because JOB has a man crush on mcbob.

Since when has O'Brien had a man crush on McBob? If you paid attention to the Pacers at all last season, you would know that it was quite the opposite. He blatantly tried to discredit McBob's talent when he performed well.

And you obviously haven't seen McBob play much if you think all he is, is an athletic freak. The guy is one of the top 3 passers on our team, and one of the better passing/ball handling big men that you'll find these days.

mildlysane
09-28-2010, 09:12 AM
<object height="385" width="480">


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love the dunks and D
After watching the video, I wish Bird would get Kevin McHale to work with Magnum. He has a few McHale-esque up-and-under moves that he does pretty well. If he had the master help him, he really could be a beast down low.

Speed
09-28-2010, 09:27 AM
I'm guessing that McBob really won't be the starter by opening day, I'd guess we'll be looking at Granger there at the PF.

Putnam
09-28-2010, 09:52 AM
I'm guessing that McBob really won't be the starter by opening day, I'd guess we'll be looking at Granger there at the PF.


If Granger starts with another forward, or with a line-up of three swingmen, can we please just call him a forward, and not an power forward? Can we please avoid the false presumption that a team must have each of five positions on the floor at all times.

'Cause if we don't begin the season with some mental flexibility, we're going to have as much hate for Danny Granger by January as we had for Troy Murphy. And that would be a shame.

Major Cold
09-28-2010, 10:58 AM
Offensively he can be a forward. But on defense, against Bosh, Garnett, Boozer, Gasol, and others, he is gonna have to have more power to guard them. More power rather than the SFs he would otherwise guard.

If that made any sense.

vnzla81
09-28-2010, 11:34 AM
If Granger starts with another forward, or with a line-up of three swingmen, can we please just call him a forward, and not an power forward? Can we please avoid the false presumption that a team must have each of five positions on the floor at all times.

'Cause if we don't begin the season with some mental flexibility, we're going to have as much hate for Danny Granger by January as we had for Troy Murphy. And that would be a shame.

I been saying the same thing about Posey, I have a feeling that many people are going to hate the guy at the end of the year.

NuffSaid
09-28-2010, 11:45 AM
Somebody please tell me when I am going to get my box of Eggo's from Tinsley's contract.

Oh, that and please trade Brandon Rush.

Why do you want to see him traded? He messed up one time, and granted sometimes that's all you get is one shot to prove yourself, but can you honestly say his mistake was any more aggregious than Stephenson's or even David Harrison's?

To put it in perspective, both Rush and Harrison got popped for marijuana use, but where Harrison refused to change his ways and disassociate himself from those around him who apparently were negative influences atleast Brandon Rush is trying to change. So, other than this once incident, why are so quick to want to see him gone? Is it just for this one incident or are there other factors involved?

As to signing Ultra Mangus aka Magnum PI aka Magnum Rolle, it's about time! Now, the question is how do we make room from him on the roster? I'm going with the consensus the Soloman Jones gets the ax. He didn't take advantage of the few opportunities he had last year and I doubt he'll show the coaching staff that much more of his game during training camp to warrant retaining him. Besides, his contract is cheap (just over $1.5M). Of course, Josh McRoberts' is cheaper ($885,120 for this his final year under contract w/the Pacers), but atleast you have some idea of what McRob can do, and he has shown marked improvements in his game compared to Solo. I think if it came down to it, mgmt would buy out Solo's contract before McRoberts.

mildlysane
09-28-2010, 11:59 AM
Why do you want to see him traded? He messed up one time, and granted sometimes that's all you get is one shot to prove yourself, but can you honestly say his mistake was any more aggregious than Stephenson's or even David Harrison's?

To put it in perspective, both Rush and Harrison got popped for marijuana use, but where Harrison refused to change his ways and disassociate himself from those around him who apparently were negative influences atleast Brandon Rush is trying to change. So, other than this once incident, why are so quick to want to see him gone? Is it just for this one incident or are there other factors involved?
He was busted 3 times for pot usage as a Pacer. Three mistakes, not one.

NuffSaid
09-28-2010, 12:32 PM
He was busted 3 times for pot usage as a Pacer. Three mistakes, not one.

By "one time," I'm referring to the mandatory 5-game suspension impossed by the league after popping positive 3 consecutive times for marijuana use. Until that happens, nobody not even the team knew of Rush's marijuana use. So, as far as the team or even the public is concerned, this IS the first indication of a real problem. But unlike David Harrison or Shawn Williams, at least Rush is apparently showing a strong willingness to do something more than just give lip service to the situation. Granted, it's 2 strikes too many on him personally; he should have made the switch in those he surrounds himself with or atleast began the process of changing his "recreational/stress reducing" habits after getting busted the second time - that should have been the wakeup call moment for him. But atleast he has shown contrition and a willingness to change. You gotta give him credit for that which was far more than David Harrison, Shawn Williams or even Marquis Daniels did.