View Full Version : Thoughts on USA Basketball...no this is not ripping on team USA

Roaming Gnome
08-15-2004, 04:34 PM
I wanted to start this on a new thread away from the Puerto Rico Vs. Team USA thread because I didn't want this to be lost in the shuffle of what I feel is misguided *****ing at the players and coaches.

Destroy all the people who turned down the invite(or the people who did the inviting, perhaps) if you gotta destroy anyone.

Why does it feel that no one saddles the operation of USA Basketball with doing the most harm to team USA in competing in int'l competition. USA Basketball is still stuck in 1992 and the rest of the world has moved on.

We need to start putting teams together that have multiple skill sets, not just NBA names that will draw interest to the casual fan. In int'l competition, we are not out there to entertain, we are out there to win for the USA! I am so damn tired of hearing this, "our players don't give a ****" crap. They have pride and a reputation for the game...it is OUR GAME .

Our players were dealt a bad hand before they even got on their first airplane! If I am going to blame anyone...I BLAME USA BASKETBALL for living in the past and not taking heed to what happened in 2002!

Was a center ever asked to be on this team? Tim Duncan is not a center, but Brad Miller, Theo Ratliff, and Etan Thomas are...and I'm almost sure if these guys were asked to represent the USA, they probably would do whatever was asked being lower tier players. Who is the selected perimeter shooters on this team? I know Ray Allen was originally selected, but when he pulled out, why wasn't Micheal Redd's phone not ringing off the hook, or some other noted outside shooter? Why guys that are marginal from the outside? Why cutters and slashers that can't perform against a zone? This was not a team built for team play...so why does everyone get bent out of shape at the players when this team plays like it was designed to!!! One on One as individuals! Maybe we shouldn't lay all the blame for 2002 on George Karl's doorstep!!!

Really this is as much an embarrassment for the NBA as anyone. Team USA represents the NBA as much as the US. I have to admit I often find myself rooting a little for the international teams that we play. I am sick of watching us roll "all-star" style teams.

What an awful game. By the way, I thought the officiating was very good. Obviously, different rules, but we aren't adjusting. Very fair and balanced officiating.

I do agree with this being an embarrassment, but the NBA is multinational and they are probably stroking themselves over guys like Arroyo as much as the kicking the US guys on our team. True embarrassement lies with USA Basketball and their "rolling out of the all-stars" mentallity! I will never say that I would root against the USA in anything, but I was truly embarrassed!

As for the officials...Did we watch the same game? We were getting bumped, hit, and slapped every time we went inside against Puerto Rico. I can understand this if the calls go both ways, but they clearly never seem to in Int'l competition! I don't buy it!!!!

08-15-2004, 04:50 PM
While I was watching the game i kep saying that team needs Ron Artest. But then I always say that.

Doug Collins made a great point during the game the best three point shooter they have on the team is Richard Jefferson and he was 46th in the NBA. That was the biggest problem.

08-15-2004, 05:02 PM
Well, to be fair they invited a better team, but when you lose Bryant, Garnett, McGrady, and I'm sure others, you're team won't look as good. If you give them either McGrady or Bryant, and I don't think we'd have a problem because either of them would light the other team up, zone or no zone.

08-15-2004, 05:18 PM
Yeah, they could win without assembling a balanced team if they had the top talent, but they don't (no Shaq, Kobe, TMac, Garnett, Kidd, etc. - only one player from the All-NBA first, second, or third teams). If you can't get the top talent, then you need to assemble a real team with a true PG, a center, and some shooters.

08-15-2004, 05:46 PM
I would like to suggest that we invite the Gold medal winner (assuming it's not us) to the US to play a game under NBA rules. Vastly different game. But then I blame the selection committee for the team as built. Superstars and street ballers instead of team oriented players. Even the true DREAM TEAM knew how to play as a TEAM.

This will not help the NBA in the credibility dept. at a time when fan apathy is growing (low TV ratings).

Roaming Gnome
08-15-2004, 07:25 PM
Someone mentioned Shaq...All I have to say is, Do you think Shaq would be effective with the FIBA officials? I don't think so, I think he would be sitting due to offensive fouls right off the bat.

As for the if's and but's of out tallent staying home...How about if USA basketball actually use a blueprint for the team instead of names like they did this year. This isn't 92 and the rest of the world could give a flying f%#k if it says USA on the front of the jersey...Too bad USA Basketball can't figure that out and put a team together no matter who withdrawls from the team. Make it a TEAM, not a collection of All-Stars...Like this team!

08-15-2004, 08:20 PM
Shaq did fine in international competition when he did play for team USA

Roaming Gnome
08-15-2004, 11:31 PM
I still feel that Shaq's rooting for position would be nearly outlawed by the FIBA Officials. When Shaq played for team USA before he was a lot younger and was one of the quickest and agile big men of the time.

Shaq of the early 90's played differently then the Shaq of today.

08-16-2004, 04:52 AM
i will say one thing in defense of the '92' team. they were not just a collection of names to draw interest. they actually did have balance. they had true centers like ewing and robinson and point guards like magic and stockton and guys who could slash and score like jordan and pipen and guys who could shoot threes like bird and mullin. that's balance baby! that team would thump the world like it did back in '92'.
i see some mention of guys like kobe and tmac and all i can say is those guys are the same type of player. they are slashers and scorers. we need less of those guys- less of them- not more.

if there is any positive to take from this it is that this will probably be the end of the all-star type of formula of where we take the most popular sports center guys available and look into building a team of guys who can play a particular role and play it well.

08-16-2004, 07:42 AM
This probably isn't the most popular idea, but why not invite the winner of the NCAA Tournament to play for the Gold? They'd be much more likely to agree, due to none of them having egos or the need to rest up from a grueling NBA season. They'd also play as a team, having spent the last 4 months (or few years!) practicing together, and would be used to zones and refs that call more violations and fouls. Finally, moving to the international 3 from the college 3 wouldn't be that big of a jump. We wouldn't be posting up a "Dream Team", but they'd be competitive, and they'd work together and not be an embarrassment.

08-16-2004, 10:29 AM
While I was watching the game i kep saying that team needs Ron Artest. But then I always say that.

UB, I was thinking the same thing. When we finally decided to increase our defensive pressure, we started to cut into the lead. RA would have been doing this the entire game which would have allowed our slashers to use their talents on fast breaks.

The down side?

All of the "ugly American" stuff that would have taken place immediately after RA decided to stop Carlos Arroyo's dominance by pulling down his shorts.


08-16-2004, 12:33 PM
I think this usa team is only 1 or 2 players away from winning the gold if they cant somehow win it with the team they have.

The international game has changed so much since the 1991 dream team. If u ever watched the 91 dream team they were just so much better than the international teams in every aspect of the game. The 91 dream team would force like 25-30 turnovers a game which led to easy baskets.

The current international teams have players who start on Nba teams and if there not on Nba teams there in Europe or there homeland playing basketball year round training for the olympics together. International teams have a big advantage when it comes to knowing ur team-mates, chemistry etc. The international players can only get better because guys like Arroyo who have learned from the best in Nba are coming back to there homeland and teaching to them what he has learned.

This usa team thats on the floor right now isnt the best Usa team that could be formed.

The real dream team would look something like this:

Pf- Garnett
Sf- Tmac
Sg - Kobe
Pg - Kidd

I don't think any international team could possibly beat that. And i dont think anyone would argue that.

But since theres injuries, players who have already won medals, declining for whatever reason they cant put the best team possible out on the floor. That means Larry Brown has to scramble at the end to find guys who will play.

This current team does have the best big man in the tournament and arguably the best player in the world Tim Duncan. But when ur best player is a big man YOU HAVE TO SURROUND HIM WITH SHOOTERS! This way it will force the D to spread the floor.

Instead Larry Brown surrounded him with athletes. Carmelo is a streaky shooter, Iverson is a streaky shooter, Lebron is a bad shooter, Jefferson is a bad shooter, Marbury is a streaky shooter, Marion is a bad shooter, Wade is a streaky shooter, Lamar is actually half decent. But they all are great athletes.

I think if this team was given 1 or 2 decent shooters instead of Emeka wasting his time on the bench or getting rid of Marion cause we already got like 5 guys like him on the team it would be dominating games.

Michael Redd was the 10th best scorer in the league, and probably the quickest and most effective 3pt shot in the league next to peja. Why was he not asked to go to the olympics? He would of had a 50 point game yesterday if they let him shoot wide open like Jefferson all day.

The exact same thing can be said for Brent Barry, Michael Finley, and the list of great shooters goes on. We need a few of these guys to open up the lane and make the defense work instead of just packin it in down low so Duncan cant even move.

I think this team would also be better off by adding some pass first pg's who can create something for other players. Ala Jason Williams, Andre Miller, instead of Marbury or Dwayne Wade who think score first.

I think the people who put together the team have to realize you cant just pick the 12 most well known basketball players and expect to win a game. You have to put together a team that has team players and you cant be worried about pickin guys based on how many jersey's there goin to sell.

08-16-2004, 02:05 PM
I think all Team USA needs is Reggie, outside shooting, NBA and Olympic vet

08-17-2004, 12:25 AM
I hope USA doesn't win a medal and gets there *** kicked.

And why? Because I hope USA basketball will then change.

Hopefully the coaching, etc. Players need to learn that hops and height will only take you so far. You have to be able to shoot first and formost. You also have to be able to make good passes that won't result in sloppy TO-prone play.

I really really hate And1 now. I think it has killed the basketball in USA. Before I never had a problem with it because if thats what people like to do and thats there thing then great. But now it has interfered with real basketball. Instead of playing the And1 Mixtape Tour on ESPN maybe they could do some old school shows on the NBA showing some really great players. Like Bob Cousy, Jerry West, Larry Bird, John Stockton, Reggie Miller, and so on. Maybe instead of showing all these highlight dunks show some great shooting too.

08-17-2004, 12:32 AM
And the NBA can help by replacing the stupid dunk contest with someelse.

Maybe replace it with a competition the HS McDonalds All American did. They paired one boy and one girl on a team and each team had a certain amount of time to shoot from diffrent spots. Each spot was worth so many points too. Anyone remember this?

Just a thought. And you can't say it wouldn't attract ratings because who wouldn't want to see what the dunk contest was replaced with?:p

Roaming Gnome
08-17-2004, 05:22 PM
And the NBA can help by replacing the stupid dunk contest with someelse.

Maybe replace it with a competition the HS McDonalds All American did. They paired one boy and one girl on a team and each team had a certain amount of time to shoot from diffrent spots. Each spot was worth so many points too. Anyone remember this?

Just a thought. And you can't say it wouldn't attract ratings because who wouldn't want to see what the dunk contest was replaced with?:p

Actually, the NBA did do this for a couple years in 00-01 and 01-02 . The game is called 2-ball and the whole experiment didn't go over too well, because they brought the Dunk Contest back to the All Star Saturday. Eventhough they got rid of 2-ball, they still didn't get rid of the WNBA out of All-Star Sat.

08-17-2004, 05:37 PM
My thoughts on USA basketball....they suck and deserve to lose