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Peck
08-09-2004, 03:57 AM
Last year I go away & they trade away Brad. This year they sign Eddie Gill. :neutral:

I guess that we can officially write Brewer out of the clubs future. If there ever was a screaming example of why the N.B.A. & the N.B.D.L. needs to have a farm system Jamison is it. Well, Bender as well but that is a differant story.

Jamison has skills, they are just so unpolished that I don't know if he will ever be able to hone them. Let's hope he gets a chance somewhere because if for no other reason the N.B.A. always need a man in a purple suit.

I can't tell you how dissapointed I am in the fact that we didn't try & get Brian Skinner here. He would be the perfect big man to bring off of the bench to help either Jeff or Jermaine. Oh well that's not the end of the world. Shaq being in Miami is the end of the world for me:cry:

Being in Florida for the past 2 weeks I can tell you he is the talk of the state & from listening to him speak I just more & more depressed. This is not the same Shaq as last season, this is a motivated Shaq who wants to prove that he is capable of winning without Bryant on his team. I know most of you think I'm nuts on this, but I'm very very afraid of the Heat now. :suicide:

Now that I've had some time to reflect on the trade of Al, I guess I've come to the conclusion that it was the best for everybody. Don't get me wrong, I wish Al was still here but after thinking more about Jackson I think he might be able to help us out a great deal. I just don't know right now where Fred Jones fits into the picture. I know he will be on the I.R.L. to start the season, but after that whoknows?

As to the other rumors that are our there. Specifically Ron for Peja.

I'm mixed on this. On court it's a mediocre (at best) trade.

However with Ron it's all the baggage he brings to the table.

I'll go ahead & say this now. If Ron weren't a problem with the team (both offcourt & chemistry wise) this trade would not even be considered.

Ron is capable of scoring 20 ppg & he is the D.P.O.Y. You don't trade that away unless you get a superstar in return or if the player is a problem.

Well, Peja is good, but he is no superstar. Ron is a problem & if this is the best the team can get for him, which I suspect it is, then the team has to pull the trigger.

I don't want this to become a Ron vs. J.O. show & I have a feeling that is what it will be coming to next season.

Do I think it's a straight up trade? Probably, however I wouldn't be suprised if the Maloofs weren't trying to get more from us because of Ron's baggage.

I'm not even 100% sure that they have decided that they will trade Peja. Sure he can cause problems for him but at the end of the day he is under contract with them so who knows?

I will say this though, we will go from being one of the toughest physical perimater defensive teams in the N.B.A. to one that is not so physical.

What makes this worse is that Shaq is in the East now. God help us.:bananadead:

After last season I was prepared to go into this season with the frontline intact. Now however we must do something withour center spot. Jeff Foster will foul out in 3 min. guarding Shaq & that will leav poor Jermaine with Austin Croshere on him.

It took me about 3 min. of watching David Harrison in that summer league game to decide that he won't be much (if any) help this season.

Dear God I just thought of this. Do you realize that with Shaq over here now that Scot Pollard is probably our best bet at bodying up to him.:shudder:

I don't know what we can do or if we can do anything to improve our center spot, but we desperately need to try.

***Late edit***

After I posted all of this I found todays star has a Q & A with Jermaine O'Neal. I thought this part was particularly interesting.

" Do you feel the team you have now can win it all?

A I sure hope so. I would love to see us get another big guy; another big strong guy who can score and give me some time to dance around and do my thing and not be the guy who's guarding the best post guy or trying to score every time. I'd love to play weak side and go get a couple of offensive rebounds and do stuff like that rather than coming down and having to bang against everybody and try to get the ball in there and score. That's hard on you.

I've been begging (Pacers CEO Donnie Walsh) and those guys, 'Please get a big guy. Please get a big guy.' My back won't be hurting as much, my legs won't be hurting. I love Jeff Foster . . . but we also have to have another big guy."

Seems Jermaine agrees with me.

What we really need is another big guy who can body up on defense, rebound, score inside & draw fouls, step outside & hit a face up jumper & pass.

Hmmmm......... seems I've read about players like that somewhere.:scream::banghead::banghead:

indygeezer
08-09-2004, 06:55 AM
Welcome back. I agree, we need another big (seems I've been screaming that since before the trade deadline :mad: Yes, I know exactly what you mean about Shaq, I was afraid he'd come in with a "mission" and those fears are going to be borne out.
SKinner would have been a good pick up but perhaps they've had this Artest/PJ thing in the back of their minds for a long while and wanted to see what happened there first. JO and Damp? Wasn't it JO and Jon Barry last year? JO isn't going to get his wish if it's Damp he wants. Too much $$$$ How to get another big??? That's the $64,000 question.

ABADays
08-09-2004, 09:23 AM
I kind of disagree. I think he will be "on a mission" only when playing against the Pacers, Pistons, Magic and maybe the Nets.

beast23
08-09-2004, 09:45 AM
Geez -

I don't know. From the article, it sounds like JO has spoken with Dampier quite a bit.

JO has even advised him to take Atlanta's MLE for a single year, if it's long term dollards he's interested in.

So, if you're Dampier and you've stated that playing for a winner is a priority, would you want to play for the Hawks for a year at $4.9M (the MLE) or play for the Pacers for a year at $2.5M (what is left of our MLE)?

From our perspective, that would then put us in a position where the best we can offer next season is a long-term contract starting at the MLE, whereas any other team with cap space could outbid us.

If we can't get him in a sign-and-trade, I'd do the one year and take our chances next summer.

sixthman
08-09-2004, 10:12 AM
Someone explain how our chances of landing Dampier next summer are any better than now. We still can't pay him more than the MLE, so a trade will have to be designed.

It all boils down to, if the Pacers want Dampier they will have to part with a player or two other teams want.

Right now that player appears to be Jon Bender.

Unclebuck
08-09-2004, 10:24 AM
Peck, great to have you back.

But you did a little selective editing. J.O went on to say that Dampier wants too much money and that we should not do that, that is why he is trying to talk Dampier into a one year deal.

I have said all along that if we could get Dampier on a 3 year or less contract I would be all for it.


Peck, I hate to get back into a discussion about Foster, but here it goes. If we assume Artest will be traded for Peja I contend that Foster becomes even more important. Foster's lack of offense will not be as noticeable with Peja on the court and without Ron the Pacers will need every good defender they can get. Without Ron and AL IMO Jeff becomes the Pacers best overall one-on-one defender.

Peck, I agree 100% on your Artest for Peja trade scenerio and your assessment of Peja.

My biggest fear is that the Pacers become a soft team. That scares me to death. If the starting lineup is Tinsley, Reggie and Peja, that worries me to no end. Yes I think Peja's defense is underrated, but it is not in the same ballpark as Ronnie's or even Al's. Who will guard James, Pierce, T-Mac, all the great scorers. Reggie? No way. Peja? I hope not.

I am getting sick to my stomach thinking about this.

Peck, instead of another big guy how about a small forward or guard who can defend somebody. Freddie can but how many minutes will he get. Jax is a good defender, but is he good enough.

What I loved about having Ron and J.O as the two best players on the team is that they are the two best defenders also. That is very rare, very rare indeed, and it reminds me of the Bulls of the 90's.

(just to clarify, Foster is a better one-on-one defender than J.O. But J.O is a better help defender and I suppose that J.O has a greater effect overall defensively on a game than Jeff does.

Do we really have to trade Artest.

MagicRat
08-09-2004, 10:33 AM
This is not the same Shaq as last season, this is a motivated Shaq who wants to prove that he is capable of winning without Bryant on his team.

Shaq must be motivated, because every time I seem him lately he's hitting the weights hard. The problem is that he's getting older and creaky. He's lucky some crazy genius invented the Icy Hot sleeve.....

McKeyFan
08-09-2004, 01:21 PM
oops

McKeyFan
08-09-2004, 01:24 PM
It all boils down to, if the Pacers want Dampier they will have to part with a player or two other teams want.

Right now that player appears to be Jon Bender.



Oh...Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it! Do it!:signit:

Peck
08-09-2004, 10:29 PM
Peck, great to have you back.

But you did a little selective editing. J.O went on to say that Dampier wants too much money and that we should not do that, that is why he is trying to talk Dampier into a one year deal.

I have said all along that if we could get Dampier on a 3 year or less contract I would be all for it.


Peck, I hate to get back into a discussion about Foster, but here it goes. If we assume Artest will be traded for Peja I contend that Foster becomes even more important. Foster's lack of offense will not be as noticeable with Peja on the court and without Ron the Pacers will need every good defender they can get. Without Ron and AL IMO Jeff becomes the Pacers best overall one-on-one defender.

Peck, I agree 100% on your Artest for Peja trade scenerio and your assessment of Peja.

My biggest fear is that the Pacers become a soft team. That scares me to death. If the starting lineup is Tinsley, Reggie and Peja, that worries me to no end. Yes I think Peja's defense is underrated, but it is not in the same ballpark as Ronnie's or even Al's. Who will guard James, Pierce, T-Mac, all the great scorers. Reggie? No way. Peja? I hope not.

I am getting sick to my stomach thinking about this.

Peck, instead of another big guy how about a small forward or guard who can defend somebody. Freddie can but how many minutes will he get. Jax is a good defender, but is he good enough.

What I loved about having Ron and J.O as the two best players on the team is that they are the two best defenders also. That is very rare, very rare indeed, and it reminds me of the Bulls of the 90's.

(just to clarify, Foster is a better one-on-one defender than J.O. But J.O is a better help defender and I suppose that J.O has a greater effect overall defensively on a game than Jeff does.

Do we really have to trade Artest.




I'm not really sure how you got that I wanted Dampier out of that post? It was another center that I was thinking of that fit those characteristics, someone say already in Sacramento.

But now that you mention it, because of my overwhelming fear of Shaq I don't think Dampier would be a bad thing. But like you said, the price has to be right.

Either way there is no way in hell that I feel good going into this season with Jeff Foster as our starting center. Read J.O.'s own statement & it shows that he states he has to guard the best low post player every game. If he were a Dale Davis player that would be great, but he is our star & we require him to be our dominate offensive player.

Dale Davis? Now that I think about it, even all these years later we still have not been able to replace Dale's presence on the court. That's not a jab at anybody, just my thoughts.

I'm scared of this potential trade though from the standpoint that we will be a very soft team.

Who will help bang down low now?

SoupIsGood
08-09-2004, 10:53 PM
The soft thing is the only fear I have about this trade too.

I liked the old Artest/Pollard for Marion rumor much better. No worry of being soft. Maybe I should start my own rumour. A 15-team trade bringing Magloire and Marion here.

Lineup of Tinsley-Jackson-Marion-O'neal-Magloire

These rumours are getting old, DO SOMETHING DONNIE! Argh