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RimBender
07-30-2004, 12:46 PM
The trade talk going on in this forum is basically non sense.

The Suns picked up Q and have Johnson, and some people are speculating that the Suns might trade Marion and his max contract to a team to fill their biggest need, a big man.

So why would they trade Marion for Artest when they have what they want/need.

Seen the article on hoopshype.com but couldn't get to the site to read the article cause im not a subscriber of the newpaper.:mad:

Mourning
07-30-2004, 12:51 PM
Ehmmm .... because, maybe, they think they could get Pollard from us, who worked quite fine in SacTown with another up-tempo team in the west.

Also they want to get space to give Amare a max-deal as soon as possible, Marions contract would make that VERY difficult for them.

Regards,

Mourning:cool:

RimBender
07-30-2004, 12:53 PM
I'm sure they will be first in line to trade for Pollard.
I mean who doesn't want him and his samuri haircut or whatever he has now, a mullet?

Mourning
07-30-2004, 01:01 PM
IF someone does not play well for us it doesnt AUTOMATICALLY make him a bad player. I remember a certain O'neal on a Portland bench sometime ago.

Now I KNOW we arent that strong at center as Portland was at PF, but still Pollard proved he could play pretty decent at Center for SacTown, in the West and up-tempo, I wouldnt assume he wont be able to do that sort of playing again. And Artest coming theire way only adds up the DPOTY with a long running and VERY sweet contract, while getting rid of a max-contract, while they need the room to sign just another in the near future and have JJ who they think could be a great player and has HUGE potential all of which you conveniently left out of your reaction.

Regards,

Mourning:cool:

JOneal7
07-30-2004, 01:03 PM
yeah they better give up JJ if they want ron ron...Marion sucks

RimBender
07-30-2004, 01:05 PM
LOL! I forgot Pollard was a 20 and 10 guy on the Kings. He is a player like JYD, just energy and hustle, no way would we get a Marion for him. He does suck, and was a waste of money/time for the Pacers.

blanket
07-30-2004, 01:11 PM
I'm sure they will be first in line to trade for Pollard.
I mean who doesn't want him and his samuri haircut or whatever he has now, a mullet?

Actually, the entire trade discussion involving Marion and Artest arose from reports that Phoenix had inquired about Pollard, and the Pacers allegedly then brought up the idea of expanding the possible trade to include Artest and Marion.

Don't underestimate the premium on big men in this league. Especially ones who will bring $6m off a team's payroll in 2 years.

RimBender
07-30-2004, 01:14 PM
....What are you talking bout, I was talking about them trading Marion for a big man.

Why would they want to trade for Pollard when they could get someone way more skillful. Marion for Pollard is like a joke. Never would i trade someone of Marions skill level for a play who plays like Mark Madsen.

Mourning
07-30-2004, 01:21 PM
Ever heard of actually reading someones post? Offcourse, Marion for Pollard straigt up is CRAZY, it wouldnt even be allowed according to league rules, thats why Artest is also included.

Regards,

Mourning:cool:

RimBender
07-30-2004, 01:24 PM
I'm sorry:blush:, I thought you were saying Marion for Pollard, why else would I be arguing.

Your second post had me all confused.

So your saying the Suns would trade Marion to us for Artest and Pollard?

Mourning
07-30-2004, 01:31 PM
yup! Sorry for my little irritated reaction btw, I'm very tired rightnow. I think we should atleast get future pick or one of their scrubs back though.

Regards,

Mourning:cool:

Ultimate Frisbee
07-30-2004, 02:46 PM
I saw this on the ESPN board and think it was a great post and well thought out...

We again trade 4 players... which changes the team drastically, and that might suck, but we'd get 2 great players in return...

http://forums.espn.go.com/espn/thread?threadID=283931&lastPostID=771826

"I like Marion, anyone who doesn't think he's an upgrade to Artest....might be right.

I know stats aren't everything, but Marion had better shooting percentages than Artest in every catagory, to who ever said ugly shot and bad percentages. He averaged more steal/game than Artest and twice as many blocks, to who ever said the defense we would be loosing. Phx is not good, but he didn't just rack up his points being the only scorer. Amare got hurt early, but Marbury was still there and Amere ended up playing 50+ games and averaging 20+ppg. Oh, yeah, Marion was 14th in the league in rebounding. That said, Artest goes to the line a little more, COULD improve his shooting percentages with better shot selection, plays as good of defense but more physical and is making ALOT less $$$.

I would do this trade, if we can also move Croshere, and Pollard. Theo Ratliff has $10mil, 1yr remaining and is 31 years old. He would not be along term answer but would provide great cap releif after next season. I think Portland might be interested in Fred Jones (not a real rumor, but I heard something early last season b/c he's from there, but the injury might make them suspicious). If we give PHX an almost equal player for half the sallary and a big body that they need even more than we do, we need a draft pick from them to sweeten the deal with Portland.

Gives:
PHX-Marion $11.3
Draft pick-$

Indy-Pollard $5.8
Artest $5.8
Croshere $8.2
Jones-$1.5

Portland-Ratliff-$10

Gets:
Phx-Artest $5.8
Pollard $5.8

Indy-Marion-$11.3
Ratliff-$10

Portland-Croshere-$8.2
Fred Jones-$1.5
Phx-1st

I know it's not real wise to trade a total of 5 members of a team, that was as successful as us, in one offseason. But, if you consider we traded 1 starter and five quality (or atleast not 13th man quality) bench players for 3 starters that ain't to bad and I don't think this trade is far fetched.

-Portland still has 3 players (if you include NVE's team option) making 8 figures and won't have to be on the payroll next ('05-'06) season. I think Croshere could be a nice compliment and change of pace type of player for Randolph. Croshere would be their only big man that can step outside. Suposedly the main reason they traded 'Sheed was because they wanted the team to be fan friendly and Jones is a home town boy.

-PHX gets a player that's almost of equal skill as the one they loose for half the price. And I did read that ESPN the mag writer thinks Marion will be on the block to clear space to sign Amare after next season. With Nash and Q-Rich they already have a couple decent sized contracts. They also get a big man who I think is probably earning about $4.2million too much by making $5.8 a year, but they can use him, they'll probably get 20 solid minutes, 5-7ppg, 5-6rpg, and half a block out of him. They give up a draft pick but I think they still have atleast one of the Knicks picks from the Steph trade.

Indy-We get a slight up grade at SF, a steadier hand and head and don't really loose anything defensivly. We take on a much bigger contract for only a slight upgrade but we also loose two terrible contracts. Loosing Jones sucks, but I don't think he would be as valuable to us this year, if he can't play PG I think James Jones will do just as well, maybe not as flashy, by season's end. And we get a tremendous shot blocker and otherwise servicable Center that might resign for a contract we can afford next season on the downside of his career or just leave us with $10million in cap space which would be cool too.

I'm big on this trade if it looks similar to this. I'd love to get Barbosa but highly doubt they would give him up. He's paid next to nothing and will probably sign cheap and take over for Nash in 4-5years.


peac.e"

blanket
07-30-2004, 02:59 PM
Indy might do it. Phoenix might do it. I can't imagine Portland doing it, though. They lose their only real center, a guy they traded for just last year and had a rejuvenation in Portland. They just signed Hassel, so they don't need another guard. And Croshere doesn't replace the hole that would be left at center, plus he's still making too much for too long for most teams (even Portland) to take on.

I think if we make a deal with Phoenix involving Marion and Artest/Pollard (perhaps including variations on draft picks, F. Jones, L. Barbosa, etc.), we're more likely to fill the open center spot with a free agent or a separate trade, but probably not for a starter, just a contributor.

Ultimate Frisbee
07-30-2004, 03:21 PM
Indy might do it. Phoenix might do it. I can't imagine Portland doing it, though. They lose their only real center, a guy they traded for just last year and had a rejuvenation in Portland. They just signed Hassel, so they don't need another guard. And Croshere doesn't replace the hole that would be left at center, plus he's still making too much for too long for most teams (even Portland) to take on.

I think if we make a deal with Phoenix involving Marion and Artest/Pollard (perhaps including variations on draft picks, F. Jones, L. Barbosa, etc.), we're more likely to fill the open center spot with a free agent or a separate trade, but probably not for a starter, just a contributor.

Yes, I agree, Portaland is least likely to do it... The only way that they would is if they were rebuilding and essentially giving up on next season (which they should)...

blanket
07-30-2004, 03:34 PM
Yes, I agree, Portaland is least likely to do it... The only way that they would is if they were rebuilding and essentially giving up on next season (which they should)...

Actually, Portland could do OK next year, maybe 7-8 seed. More importantly, they're collecting some big expiring contracts (more than $50m off the books next summer :o) in Damon Stoudemire, Shareef Abdur-Rahim, Nick Van Exel, and Theo Ratliff. Plus they have some young talent in Randolph, Telfair, Miles (if they can keep him). They should be in a pretty good position to reinvent themselves next summer, and taking on Croshere's contract would divert them from that master plan.