View Full Version : Wacky Trade Idea #5, not so wacky actually

07-24-2004, 12:03 PM
Indiana trades: C Scot Pollard (1.7 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 0.2 apg in 11.1 minutes)
SF Ron Artest (18.3 ppg, 5.3 rpg, 3.7 apg in 37.2 minutes)
Indiana receives: SF Shawn Marion (19.0 ppg, 9.3 rpg, 2.7 apg in 40.7 minutes)
Change in team outlook: -1.0 ppg, +1.3 rpg, and -1.2 apg.

Phoenix trades: SF Shawn Marion (19.0 ppg, 9.3 rpg, 2.7 apg in 40.7 minutes)
Phoenix receives: C Scot Pollard (1.7 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 0.2 apg in 61 games)
SF Ron Artest (18.3 ppg, 5.3 rpg, 3.7 apg in 73 games)
Change in team outlook: +1.0 ppg, -1.3 rpg, and +1.2 apg.


Due to Indiana being over the cap, the 15% trade rule is invoked. Indiana had to be no more than 115% plus $100,000 of the salary given out for the trade to be accepted, which did happen here. This trade satisfies the provisions of the Collective Bargaining Agreement.

I think that from a talent standpoint this is one of the most fair deals we're gonna get, aside from maybe Paul Pierce. A JO/Marion combo sounds good to me.

The one thing about Shawn that I don't know is his man-to-man defense. I'm pretty sure he has the body for it though. I know he's a pretty good shooter (46%, 36%from3), obviously a great rebounder for a 3 (9.4rpg), which would help us, and he even averages over 2 steals per game (#2 in the league last year) and 1.3 blocks per game. That's a hell of a talent.

Phoenix does this because Artest gives them the DPOY , and Pollard gives them another big body, which they're pretty short on. Doesn't hurt that supposedly a phoenix radio stations said Phoenix has interest in Pollard.

I would do this trade.

Roaming Gnome
07-24-2004, 12:15 PM
Actually, I'd find that more acceptable then any nonsense comming from Memphis, but the idea of trading Ron just turns my stomach.

At least we would be getting a star in return!

07-24-2004, 12:27 PM
I would LOVE to have Shawn Marion, he does everything. Matrix would be a great fit in the Pacers lineup, while we are losing SOME defensive power, we are gaining MORE offensive power.

I would love to keep Artest, but I'ma write LB and tell him I demand this trade or I will.....uhh...

Well if we have to trade Artest I would hope it is for Matrix or someone of his skill level.

Lord Helmet
07-24-2004, 12:59 PM
The trade ain't bad for the Suns.Don't trade Ron!!:mad:

07-24-2004, 01:06 PM
Eh. If we wanted someone like Marion, why didn't we just keep Al at the cheaper salary?

If we trade Ron for ANYBODY, I'm gonna have a hard time not finding a ladder so I can *****-slap Bird. :darkness:

07-24-2004, 01:21 PM
If we trade Ron for ANYBODY, I'm gonna have a hard time not finding a ladder so I can *****-slap Bird.

If Ron is traded it will be a collective decision by managment. Donnie signed Ron to a great contract, so he wouldn't "allow" Ron to be traded unless it was with good reason. And Bird loves Ron as a player, so it has nothing to do with that either.

07-24-2004, 01:23 PM
Eh. If we wanted someone like Marion, why didn't we just keep Al at the cheaper salary?

Because Al isn't nearly as good as Marion.

07-24-2004, 01:24 PM
Eh. If we wanted someone like Marion, why didn't we just keep Al at the cheaper salary?

If we wanted someone like Marion, we should have DRAFTED him.

07-24-2004, 01:33 PM
the only problem I have with this trade (or trading for Pierce for that matter) is having two max. contract players on one team. Given management's propensity for overpaying players to either keep them or lure them here, I think this would limit our ability to fill out the rest of the team with quality players over the term of those contracts. I like the idea of 1 player with a max. contract (J.O.), and the rest ranging from the mid-level on down to rookie-scale.

07-24-2004, 01:46 PM
I stated in another thread here, that I think Marion would be one of the very few players I could live with getting in return. Phoenix does it because they finally get wide-body that proved it can play atleast a little decently in the west and uptempo style. And lets not forget they get the DPOTY in Artest who also chips in bigtime offensively.

I think we deserve to get something of a future late 1st rounder from Phoenix though, we give up definitely more then they do and we in my view don't have to do this deal very neccessarily, while they ... well actually DO have to make a deal for some big guy and a good to great quality player with low salary in return for Marion.

THis is one of the best and fairest deals I think we could get, even though ... if we don't need too ... THAN keep Artest, I love the guy on our team.



07-24-2004, 01:51 PM
I would do that trade, Marion is a better scorer, rebounder, more athletic, better shooter, and he plays decent defense. Plus he's not crazy/insane. We would still be a good defensive team without Ron.

If we trade Artest for Marion, we would be set. Two 20 and 10 players in our frontcourt? :o

07-24-2004, 02:14 PM
Nice trade proposal, Hicks. Given the circumstances, I'd do this in a second. Don't know why the Suns would really want Polly though. Would you throw Freddie in there as an extra incentive?


That's a badass lineup. I also think Marion's rebounding ability could offset what we lose defensively. He averages 4 more rebounds per game than Ron, and we were getting killed on the boards in the playoffs.

07-24-2004, 02:16 PM
bp, the Suns would want Pollard because they're desperate for size. And my idea in the first place came from the supposed report that Phoenix may be interested in Scot.

So I just combined that with the notion of trading Artest for equal value.

Ultimate Frisbee
07-24-2004, 02:45 PM
fair... and acceptable...

A trade between my two favorite teams... At least that way I could still root for Artest :cool::cool:

Marion is a great defensive player as well, and probably has more talent than Artest on the offensive end.

Ultimate Frisbee
07-24-2004, 03:07 PM
I just looked on the ESPN boards to potentially see what Suns fans thought of the trade and again that indy dave00 character is reporting:


Okay a lil story here today on radio.

Pacers discussing a possible trade with Suns , yes Pollard is part of it .

But so are Shawn Marion and Ron Artest.

According to the often quoted "unnamed source ", Pacers and Suns discussing a MAJOR TRADE. Pacers would send Ron Artest, Scot Pollard and Fred Jones to Suns for Shawn Marion, Zarko Capbarkapa and Learnardo Barbosa.

Apparently this trade is in early stages , started out with Suns asking about Pollard . From there Artest and Marion were discussed.

Pacers wanting to acquire Dampier and so far being unable are trying to address a rebounding problem which Marion is far superior to Artest.

Not sure if the quote "source" is real , but makes for intresting thought. Salaries do actually match up . Even Artest/Pollard for Marion matches up.

This is probably a bunch of B.S. but thought i'd report it anyway.

07-24-2004, 03:12 PM
Yeah, it's likely BS until we hear it at least from a newsoutlet, but I hope this is true.

Looking at the profiles of the other 2, Barbosa is a near 40% 3point shooter. :drool: Cabarkapa would take Pollard's place as the seldom-used F/C guy who won't really play much.

07-24-2004, 03:15 PM
Ouch, giving them Freddie would hurt. However, if this Barbosa is a back up PG, and not half bad, I would do this trade. I'm not sure waht Barbosa plays though.

Ultimate Frisbee
07-24-2004, 03:18 PM
Barbosa is a PG and Cabarkapa is a 6'-11" SF/PF/C type player who is probably a lot like Bender (except with less potential)

07-24-2004, 03:18 PM
So, Hicks, how does it feel to be an "unnamed source"? :devil:

07-24-2004, 03:22 PM
Well whatever happens I think we DO NEED something more back than just Marion, we give too much up otherwise IMO.

They get basically everythign they want in this deal. A small contract, but BIG contributing player on the defensive AND the offensive end aswell as a big guy who fills the middle for them and has proven he can play decently with the fast paced teams in the west before he came to us.

We be getting a great offensive and defensive player back, BUT without some of the excessive luggage and on the other hand a BIG contract, so the least we should get is a late first rounder for next year or (preferably) one of there back up players at either the Center of F/C spot.

IF we don't ... maybe Francisco Elson might be a decent back up F/C as Denver has the PF and C spot filled more than it needs.



07-24-2004, 03:33 PM
Okay I've looked at these other player's profiles, and I would do this trade in a heartbeat. Barbosa I think could probably be a fine back up PG for us, Zarko can enjoy the IR, and the Artest for Marion swap I think is proabably a fair swap for both teams.

I just hope Freddie doesn't end up beinf a better player than Jackson, that would really suck.

Ultimate Frisbee
07-24-2004, 03:33 PM
Looking at the Pacers ESPN board, I think I found the "unnamed source" rumor starter:


"Phoenix radio show said something about Pollard to the Suns. Have you guys heard anything?"

07-24-2004, 04:05 PM
Pollard sucks! Pollard goes! Matrix comes! I love it!

07-24-2004, 04:15 PM
I'd like to keep this team together, but if Ron's gonna go, Marion would be a near-perfect replacement.

He's got Ron beat in every statistical category except assists [more steals even.] Certainly not the intimidating defensive presence Ron is, but from what I've seen he's no slouch on D. Foster/O'neal/Marion/Jackson/Tinsley is a capable defensive team.

I like Barbosa a lot. I like Freddie a lot too. Kind of a wash there, to me.

Two things:
1: If we were ever to get Shawn Marion, I refuse to call him "Matrix."
2: We're not going to get Shawn Marion.

07-24-2004, 05:07 PM
2: We're not going to get Shawn Marion.

You don't know that.

07-24-2004, 05:28 PM
the funny thing is, back in the '99 draft we could've picked Marion (9th pick) instead of Bender (5th pick) :o

07-24-2004, 05:33 PM
Makes sense.

Marion is on the block. The Suns need a center and Pollard would fit right in to there up tempo style.

BTW: People I know some don't want to trade Artest but do you actually think that DW or Larry Bird would make a dumb move? They know what goes on off the court and we don't. So basicly you gotta trust them to do the right thing.

07-24-2004, 07:46 PM
I only have a few seonds so I have to make this quick.

Two points

I have hread from more than one source that Marion
is available, very available

I also believe that Marion is somewhat overrated. He is not a primary offensive guy. He is not a guy you give the ball to and say create a shot for us, or draw a foul or create a shot for someone else. He cannot do those things. he is a finisher, if a teammate gets doubled or draws a second defender Marion can produce. By the way I think Bender is very similar, Bender is a finisher but not a creator.

07-24-2004, 10:58 PM
I don't know that I'd move Artest for Marion.

I'd move Bender for Marion, though. :devil:

07-24-2004, 11:25 PM
I agree with UB, I have never liked Marion's game.

And if we trade Ron, I don't think we will be as good. And I don't think we do any better this year.

07-25-2004, 01:43 AM
I don't know that I'd move Artest for Marion.

I'd move Bender for Marion, though. :devil:

You know, I just kinda threw this out the first time, but I've been pondering a bit. Bender and Artest are identical, salary-wise. If the Suns are really looking to move Marion, and he's "very available," then could they really expect to get the DPOY for him?

What could the Suns get for Marion?

07-25-2004, 01:52 PM
I wouldn't do the trade w/Freddie, but I'd do Ron and Pollard for Marion and a future first-rounder.

C - Foster/Harrison
PF - O'Neal/Croshere
SF - Marion/Bender/JJones
SG - Miller/Jackson/FJones
PG - Tinsley/Johnson/Wright

Maybe a three-way with the Warriors that also brings us Damp? Is there anyone Mully would want from Phoenix that's realistic? :shrug:

07-25-2004, 02:06 PM
I'm not sure that this would work, but how about:

:pacers: get:
Shawn Marion
Erik Dampier

:suns: get:
Ron Artest
Scot Pollard

:warriors: get:
Austin Croshere
Howard Eisley


07-25-2004, 02:29 PM
Sorry Shade, there is no way EVEN the Warriors are likely to fall into the trap called Howard Eisley, let stand into the double trap by adding Croshere;)

NOT EVEN the Warriors are this stupid, atleast that is what reason would dictate they are not ... on the other hand ... Adonal Foyle, 6 years and $42 mln???:o:o:o doesn't sound very reasonable either, now does it:rolleyes:.