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count55
02-18-2010, 02:27 PM
WojYahooNBA

Charlotte and Indiana in serious talks on deal that would send T.J. Ford to Bobcats for package that includes D.J. Augustine, source says.

http://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA/status/9297234367

IUfan4life
02-18-2010, 02:28 PM
who else would charlotte send over? mohammed?

Smoothdave1
02-18-2010, 02:29 PM
Make it happen, Bird!

tadscout
02-18-2010, 02:30 PM
:pray::pray::pray:

Speed
02-18-2010, 02:31 PM
Alright, now we're talking.

tadscout
02-18-2010, 02:31 PM
Make it happen, Bird!

:amen:

Pig Nash
02-18-2010, 02:31 PM
please please please.

90'sNBARocked
02-18-2010, 02:32 PM
http://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA/status/9297234367

it is so wrong of you to tease us :)

Speed
02-18-2010, 02:34 PM
As long as it doesn't include a 1st round pick from us, or Roy, or Danny. I'm on board. You need to pick up 7 million or so in salary?

d_c
02-18-2010, 02:34 PM
Salaries don't match. Bobs need to throw in extra salary and I'm guessing they want the Pacers to take on one of their undesirables.

My guess is the Bobcats will do the deal if the Pacers take on Diop (who's deal runs through 12'-13'). Salaries match if they do that, BTW.

My guess is Bird says no. One team's insistence that the other team take on an onerous contract are usually deal killers and it's why the Pacers haven't made any deals this deadline.

Speed
02-18-2010, 02:37 PM
Mohammed

Pacers
02-18-2010, 02:37 PM
This trade works:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yf7dbf7

:devil:

count55
02-18-2010, 02:37 PM
WojYahooNBA

Indiana-Charlotte discussions broad, sources say: Talks included Ford and Rush for Augustine, Nazr and Gerald Henderson. Not yet imminent.

odeez
02-18-2010, 02:38 PM
hey something, hope it works!

Hitman02
02-18-2010, 02:38 PM
This will make my day...IF it happens

btw, can we trade coaches with them too?:devil:

d_c
02-18-2010, 02:38 PM
Mohammed

That's what the Pacers are pushing for. If they could get him in the deal, they'd do it in a second.

The Bobs are most likely pushing Diop and if no deal happens, that's probably why.

duke dynamite
02-18-2010, 02:38 PM
WojYahooNBA

Indiana-Charlotte discussions broad, sources say: Talks included Ford and Rush for Augustine, Nazr and Gerald Henderson. Not yet imminent.
I would take it. I like Rush, but I think he'd fit better in a system coached by Brown.

d_c
02-18-2010, 02:39 PM
WojYahooNBA

Indiana-Charlotte discussions broad, sources say: Talks included Ford and Rush for Augustine, Nazr and Gerald Henderson. Not yet imminent.

If that's for real, the Pacers have to do that.

count55
02-18-2010, 02:40 PM
If that's for real, the Pacers have to do that.

Agree...can they get it done in time?

odeez
02-18-2010, 02:40 PM
http://espn.go.com/nba/

hmmm this is what Chad Ford is saying:

@chadfordinsider Latest: Bulls agree to send Ty Thomas to Bobcats. Cats gave up a first rounder to beat Knicks & Nuggets bids http://bit.ly/ESPNChicago

IUfan4life
02-18-2010, 02:41 PM
WojYahooNBA

Indiana-Charlotte discussions broad, sources say: Talks included Ford and Rush for Augustine, Nazr and Gerald Henderson. Not yet imminent.

am I the only one who says no to this deal?

Trophy
02-18-2010, 02:42 PM
I think Gerald Henderson would be a better fit here than Rush.

It's unfortunate to see Rush leave possibly. He would make a good SJax backup.

diamonddave00
02-18-2010, 02:42 PM
Maybe Bird can move Murphy to Kings for Thompson and Thomas. Now they the moved Martin's range and added Landry for inside play --- okay wishful thinking.

Will Galen
02-18-2010, 02:42 PM
WojYahooNBA

Indiana-Charlotte discussions broad, sources say: Talks included Ford and Rush for Augustine, Nazr and Gerald Henderson. Not yet imminent.

No money savings there but it brings in two young guys, and they all expire in two years.

BPump33
02-18-2010, 02:43 PM
am I the only one who says no to this deal?

I really like Brandon and do not want to give up on him, but from what I remember seeing of Henderson I think he makes it worth it.

Seth or someone,

Aren't Rush and Henderson pretty interchangeable?

count55
02-18-2010, 02:43 PM
am I the only one who says no to this deal?

Probably not, but I'm betting Bird & Morway like Henderson & Augustin better than Rush, and vice versa from Brown.

Mr. Sobchak
02-18-2010, 02:43 PM
Gerald Henderson is not better than Rush by a long shot, but if we can get Augustin while getting rid of Ford's contract we have to do this. Also, Nazr has been playing well for the cats this season...He's at least serviceable.

d_c
02-18-2010, 02:43 PM
Agree...can they get it done in time?

You can ask the league for an extension if two teams are still working on a viable deal.

FrenchConnection
02-18-2010, 02:44 PM
WojYahooNBA

Indiana-Charlotte discussions broad, sources say: Talks included Ford and Rush for Augustine, Nazr and Gerald Henderson. Not yet imminent.

I love "Not yet imminent" in the tweet that he twated. I would argue that "has to happen in the next 17 minutes" is the very definition of imminent.

odeez
02-18-2010, 02:44 PM
http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/64845/20100218/pacers_bobcats_in_talks_about_ford_augustin/

Update: Talks have centered around Ford and Brandon Rush for Augustin, Nazr Mohammed and Gerald Henderson.

It would be interest have Gerald Henderson, didn't he bust Tyler's nose, someone here has it for the Avatar, correct?

TMJ31
02-18-2010, 02:44 PM
I don't like sacrificing Rush so early on. He has shown flashes of being very special. For DJ Augustin? I don't know if I am so crazy about that.

TJ has played very well the last 3 games... His value may be as high as it will get, but at the same time we should not take the decision to trade him lightly. Jettisoning his contract does help though.

Speed
02-18-2010, 02:45 PM
Pacers have two 2nd rounders too. I'd give up either, if you Gerald Henderson back too. Diop in paying forward and I'd agree that is a likely deal breaker.

Under no circumstances do you give up the Pacers 1st rounder in this scenario. I think you still might trade it at the draft, but you can do much better with it then, when picks are worth the most. Plus, you still don't know if this year's pick is top 3.

Pacersfan46
02-18-2010, 02:45 PM
am I the only one who says no to this deal?

What's not to like? 2 young players and a contract that expires at the same time as Fords. It doesn't impede us in the 2011 summer, but it gives us a look at 2 young guys.

2 young guys they won't use, for one veteran guy we shouldn't be using. lol

-- Steve --

d_c
02-18-2010, 02:45 PM
I love "Not yet imminent" in the tweet that he twated. I would argue that "has to happen in the next 17 minutes" is the very definition of imminent.

If you are close to a deal, you can petition a league for an extension in your trade talks. It's happened before and it's not hard to do.

Speed
02-18-2010, 02:45 PM
am I the only one who says no to this deal?

Why? Rush?

able
02-18-2010, 02:45 PM
bad deal no way henderson and nazr are worth rush
if that is the cost to get rid of tj, it's bloody expensive

count55
02-18-2010, 02:45 PM
Young guys:

Hibbert
Hansbrough
Henderson
Augustin
Price
2010 1st Rounder
2011 1st Rounder

Next Year's PG's - Augustin & Price

Mohammed & Foster as cheap, expiring bigs to trade next year for maybe more picks, etc.

Gotta do this deal if it's up to Pacers.

count55
02-18-2010, 02:46 PM
If you are close to a deal, you can petition a league for an extension in your trade talks. It's happened before and it's not hard to do.


Thanks, man

diamonddave00
02-18-2010, 02:46 PM
Gotta remember both Augustine and Henderson were rumored as players Bird liked around draft time but were gone before he picked.

Henderson's dad is Bird's old teammate.

Speed
02-18-2010, 02:46 PM
Mohammed still has some game too. I looked at the game logs and he had a 21/20 game recently. Nice tutor for Roy to practice against.

d_c
02-18-2010, 02:47 PM
bad deal no way henderson and nazr are worth rush
if that is the cost to get rid of tj, it's bloody expensive

You're also getting Augustin. The Pacers would be trading 1 prospect away and getting 2 back. That's why the deal is good. I'd throw in both 2nd rounders if neccessary.

chrisjacobs7
02-18-2010, 02:47 PM
They better not be getting my hopes up for nothing at the 11th hour... make it happen Bird!

90'sNBARocked
02-18-2010, 02:47 PM
WojYahooNBA

Indiana-Charlotte discussions broad, sources say: Talks included Ford and Rush for Augustine, Nazr and Gerald Henderson. Not yet imminent.

Oh plesae please be true

able
02-18-2010, 02:48 PM
Mohammed still has some game too. I looked at the game logs and he had a 21/20 game recently. Nice tutor for Roy to practice against.

Only he will be starting with murphy and Roy will get the AJ treatment

Putnam
02-18-2010, 02:48 PM
Maybe Bird can move Murphy to Kings for Thompson and Thomas.


http://chud.com/articles/content_images/5/thomson_and_thompson.jpg



"We're patiently trying to make this team better."


"Yes, this team is trying our patience."




.

90'sNBARocked
02-18-2010, 02:48 PM
If we get Henderson

Seth will absolutely loose his freakin mind :)

pacers_heath
02-18-2010, 02:48 PM
HOW LONG TILL WE WILL KNOW?!!?

Trophy
02-18-2010, 02:49 PM
I'd prefer to keep Rush rather than get Henderson.

FrenchConnection
02-18-2010, 02:49 PM
Nice way for a rumor to drop right before the deadline so that we can be even more upset when nothing happens. Happens every year to both my winter teams (Pacers and Sabres) and the message boards jump off the proverbial bridge each time.

Speed
02-18-2010, 02:50 PM
I don't think we even know if Henderson is any good, both him and Augustine are 2 years younger than Brandon, though.

OakMoses
02-18-2010, 02:50 PM
Mohammed still has some game too. I looked at the game logs and he had a 21/20 game recently. Nice tutor for Roy to practice against.

He torched us earlier this season.

I love Rush and think there's a pretty good chance he's the best player involved in this deal, but I'd do it for sure. Augustine and Henderson are both potential starters down the road.

How much money does that save us for next year?

Speed
02-18-2010, 02:51 PM
Only he will be starting with murphy and Roy will get the AJ treatment

Probably.... theoritically though, he's the defensive match to both of those guys, for the short term, at least.

imawhat
02-18-2010, 02:51 PM
I'd rather we give them Head. Let's wait til end of year on Rush.

Putnam
02-18-2010, 02:51 PM
These are the best 10 minutes of the whole Pacers season.

Enjoy them, everybody.

Lance George
02-18-2010, 02:52 PM
http://twitter.com/wojyahooNBA


Charlotte and Indiana is close, but sources say not done. FIve players for now, including Ford and Rush for Augustine, Henderson and Nazr.
10 minutes ago from web

"Close" - sounds like a pretty good chance it gets done.

TMJ31
02-18-2010, 02:53 PM
These are the best 10 minutes of the whole Pacers season.

Enjoy them, everybody.

Lol!

At least it's something!

Speed
02-18-2010, 02:53 PM
He torched us earlier this season.

I love Rush and think there's a pretty good chance he's the best player involved in this deal, but I'd do it for sure. Augustine and Henderson are both potential starters down the road.

How much money does that save us for next year?

According to Hoopshype:

Nazr makes 6.4, 6.8
Henderson 1.9, 2.1
DJ 2.3, 2.5

TJ 8.5, 8.5
BRush 1.9, 2.0

So we actually lose money for next year.
11.4 incoming
10.5 outgoing

Of course, I rounded and I don't know if these numbers are correct.

gummy
02-18-2010, 02:53 PM
Watching Rush take steps toward becoming an elite defensive player has been one of the few bright spots for me this season. I won't be happy to see him go.

idioteque
02-18-2010, 02:54 PM
I hate this trade.

I am saying now that Rush will flourish with the Bobcats. This trade is a good career move for him if it goes down, I like the guy and he should be excited. He is completely incompatible with the system we run here.

I would keep what we have and just use Ford as a poor man's AI like we did last night against the Spurs for the rest of the season. I really don't like this. Henderson is not as good as Rush. Crap.

Pacersfan46
02-18-2010, 02:54 PM
How much money does that save us for next year?

I did it on hoopshype in my head in just a few seconds, but if I didn't screw up hurrying, I believe it'll cost us some money.

-- Steve --

d_c
02-18-2010, 02:54 PM
I'd rather we give them Head. Let's wait til end of year on Rush.

Of course you would. And you'd also make Charlotte hang up the phone. Come on.

OakMoses
02-18-2010, 02:55 PM
As an aside, Woj's book about Bobby Hurley Sr. is pretty good. It's called Miracle at St. Anthony.

travmil
02-18-2010, 02:56 PM
I'd prefer to keep Rush rather than get Henderson.

Sure if it was straight up I'd agree with this but you're getting Augustine as well as getting rid of TJ. Sign me up.

Speed
02-18-2010, 02:56 PM
These are the best 10 minutes of the whole Pacers season.

Enjoy them, everybody.

So sad, but true.

IUfan4life
02-18-2010, 02:56 PM
What's not to like? 2 young players and a contract that expires at the same time as Fords. It doesn't impede us in the 2011 summer, but it gives us a look at 2 young guys.

2 young guys they won't use, for one veteran guy we shouldn't be using. lol

-- Steve --

I just like Rush. Granted I have barely seen henderson or augustine play because brown hates young players.

It is a tough situation, you have to go give talent to get it.

Unclebuck
02-18-2010, 02:57 PM
you have 2 minutes

Someone is going to have to tell me who Henderson is

Augustin seems like an undersized decent point guard, who played well last season. Not a difference maker, but a nice point.

count55
02-18-2010, 02:57 PM
He torched us earlier this season.

I love Rush and think there's a pretty good chance he's the best player involved in this deal, but I'd do it for sure. Augustine and Henderson are both potential starters down the road.

How much money does that save us for next year?

None...it actually increases our payroll by about $1mm.

This is a talent deal:

Ford for Nazr

Rush for Henderson/Augustin

(And probably, removing a headache in Ford, and, maybe even Rush.)

pwee31
02-18-2010, 02:57 PM
Oh my god, I didn't expect to come to the digest 5 minutes before the deadline, thinking things were a done deal with no one moving, and then I see this.

I would personally love this trade. Sorry I like Rush, but I'm just not sure

d_c
02-18-2010, 02:57 PM
I hate this trade.

I am saying now that Rush will flourish with the Bobcats. This trade is a good career move for him if it goes down, I like the guy and he should be excited. He is completely incompatible with the system we run here.

I would keep what we have and just use Ford as a poor man's AI like we did last night against the Spurs for the rest of the season. I really don't like this. Henderson is not as good as Rush. Crap.

You'd be getting 2 prospects for the price of 1 and unloading a guy you don't want.

It's an excellent deal.

idioteque
02-18-2010, 02:57 PM
Neither Ford nor Rush are world beaters, but both can help you more than they hurt you if you use them properly.

I blame this trade on JOB!

diamonddave00
02-18-2010, 02:57 PM
Remember too Rush was rumored in the Felton/ fOSTER RUMOR.

MillerTime
02-18-2010, 02:57 PM
Not bad at all. I would love Henderson on this team

JB24
02-18-2010, 02:58 PM
Somebody's getting waived if these are the parameters- Head or McBob would be my guess.

Speed
02-18-2010, 02:58 PM
I hate this trade.

I am saying now that Rush will flourish with the Bobcats. This trade is a good career move for him if it goes down, I like the guy and he should be excited. He is completely incompatible with the system we run here.

I would keep what we have and just use Ford as a poor man's AI like we did last night against the Spurs for the rest of the season. I really don't like this. Henderson is not as good as Rush. Crap.

BRush could be Larry's Heavy D 2.0 in Charlotte. I think you have to still do this, the potential return is too good.

I like Earl tutoring DJ and AJ and Mohommed working with Roy.

IUfan4life
02-18-2010, 02:58 PM
These are the best 10 minutes of the whole Pacers season.

Enjoy them, everybody.

Hey... we beat the Celtics once

Mr. Sobchak
02-18-2010, 02:59 PM
I hate this trade.

I am saying now that Rush will flourish with the Bobcats. This trade is a good career move for him if it goes down, I like the guy and he should be excited. He is completely incompatible with the system we run here.

I would keep what we have and just use Ford as a poor man's AI like we did last night against the Spurs for the rest of the season. I really don't like this. Henderson is not as good as Rush. Crap.

Don't forget Augustin though..He played pretty well last year before going in LB's doghouse.. Check out his stats from last year:

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/dj_augustin/career_stats.html

ksuttonjr76
02-18-2010, 02:59 PM
Breaking News:

Brandon Rush ends the season averaging 19 PPG, 2.0 SPG, and 4.0 RPG while shooting an outstanding 45% from 3PT.

Leaving Indiana will be the best thing for Rush.

Speed
02-18-2010, 02:59 PM
.... I would miss BRush and I didn't realize I liked his game that much.

idioteque
02-18-2010, 02:59 PM
You'd be getting 2 prospects for the price of 1 and unloading a guy you don't want.

It's an excellent deal.

I understand that POV, but I think Rush is much better than both Augustin and Henderson, and I think Ford can be okay in some circumstances.

Maybe I am just overvaluing the hometown players too much. I know that is common.

pwee31
02-18-2010, 02:59 PM
update

http://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA



Indiana players believe trade is near, telling friends even that deal's done. Front offices still talking. Charlotte may need convincing.

purdue101
02-18-2010, 02:59 PM
latest tweet from Adrian.

"Indiana players believe trade is near, telling friends even that deal's done. Front offices still talking. Charlotte may need convincing.
less than a minute ago from web "

http://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA

Trophy
02-18-2010, 02:59 PM
2 minutes...2 ooah.

Justin Tyme
02-18-2010, 03:00 PM
I'm definately on board for this trade! I like getting Henderson and Augustin for an inconsistant Rush. We get RID of Ford too. Nazar Mohammed has been playing well while Chandler has been out.


DO IT LARRY!

duke dynamite
02-18-2010, 03:00 PM
Halftime show for next Thursday night is REVENGE!

http://assets.nydailynews.com/img/2008/02/06/alg_nc.jpg

Los Angeles
02-18-2010, 03:00 PM
when is the official deadline anyway?

duke dynamite
02-18-2010, 03:01 PM
http://twitter.com/wojyahooNBA
THIS MAKES ME EXCITED AND DEPRESSED AT THE SAME TIME!

pwee31
02-18-2010, 03:01 PM
hahaha man are we on it. Latest tweet posted like 5 times

FrenchConnection
02-18-2010, 03:01 PM
when is the official deadline anyway?

Now!

MillerTime
02-18-2010, 03:01 PM
Time is up :(

Its 3pm

Trophy
02-18-2010, 03:02 PM
We'd have 4 Blue Devils.

IUfan4life
02-18-2010, 03:02 PM
trade deadline special on espn2

Unclebuck
02-18-2010, 03:02 PM
OK, I guess Indiana Players believe it is a done deal.

Maybe this is why Ford has played the past two games, you know the all popular showcasing

avoidingtheclowns
02-18-2010, 03:02 PM
when is the official deadline anyway?

One minute ago... but it'll take hours for the deals to be approved by the league and announced I imagine.

idioteque
02-18-2010, 03:02 PM
Ad Woj: "Charlotte has been insisting that they won't do a deal here, and time is running out. One final Larry Bird-Michael Jordan showdown?"

tadscout
02-18-2010, 03:02 PM
Somebody's getting waived if these are the parameters- Head or McBob would be my guess.


My bet or hope rather is Head...

MillerTime
02-18-2010, 03:03 PM
Charlotte has been insisting that they won't do a deal here, and time is running out. One final Larry Bird-Michael Jordan showdown?

http://twitter.com/wojyahooNBA

Unclebuck
02-18-2010, 03:03 PM
if the front offices are still talking then they just missed the deadline, has to be turned into the league before 3PM

Oh well we can close this thread, It was fun while it lasted

d_c
02-18-2010, 03:03 PM
I understand that POV, but I think Rush is much better than both Augustin and Henderson, and I think Ford can be okay in some circumstances.

Maybe I am just overvaluing the hometown players too much. I know that is common.

You're overvaluinng hometown players in this case.

None of these guys have really proven anything other than either being inconsistent or not being able to get on the court.

chrisjacobs7
02-18-2010, 03:03 PM
@chadfordinsider: 'Latest: Hearing Pacers-Bobcat deal isn't happening.'

flox
02-18-2010, 03:03 PM
chadfordinsider

Pacers did talk to Bobcats about a T.J. Ford for D.J. Augustine and Nazr Mohammed deal, but talks fell apart in the last hour

Pacemaker
02-18-2010, 03:03 PM
Could D.J. be our solution to our point guard problems ?

Unclebuck
02-18-2010, 03:04 PM
I feel I'm reading everything three times, it is just me

pwee31
02-18-2010, 03:04 PM
BOOOO!! Guess it was fun while it lasted. Deadline is over.

Wonder what this will do to Rush's mind now

http://twitter.com/chadfordinsider


Latest: Hearing Pacers-Bobcat deal isn't happening. half a minute ago from web

d_c
02-18-2010, 03:04 PM
if the front offices are still talking then they just missed the deadline, has to be turned into the league before 3PM

Oh well we can close this thread, It was fun while it lasted

I mentioned before that you can petition a league for a time extension if you're close to a deal. That's probably what has happened.

Adrian W. is a reputable reporter and this trade sounds very plausible to me. Good if it happens.

Speed
02-18-2010, 03:04 PM
if the front offices are still talking then they just missed the deadline, has to be turned into the league before 3PM

Oh well we can close this thread, It was fun while it lasted

HA, move along nothing to see here...

Pig Nash
02-18-2010, 03:04 PM
Time is not the issue, we could petition more time from the league. But Chad Ford saying deal is dead.

MagicRat
02-18-2010, 03:05 PM
I feel I'm reading everything three times, it is just me

Los Angeles
02-18-2010, 03:05 PM
Remember that it was Charlotte that screwed us at the last minute with the Tinsley deal.

Unclebuck
02-18-2010, 03:05 PM
I vote this for thread of the year. only lived for about 15 minutes but it was jammed packed.

I wonder how the "Indiana players" would have or could have heard about it if it wasn't done.

idioteque
02-18-2010, 03:05 PM
I think if you are already in trade talks, you can apply to have the deadline briefly extended.

FrenchConnection
02-18-2010, 03:05 PM
BOOOO!! Guess it was fun while it lasted. Deadline is over.

Wonder what this will do to Rush's mind now

http://twitter.com/chadfordinsider

Yeah, that is not good at all. I wonder which team leaked it.

Unclebuck
02-18-2010, 03:06 PM
I mentioned before that you can petition a league for a time extension if you're close to a deal. That's probably what has happened.

Adrian W. is a reputable reporter and this trade sounds very plausible to me. Good if it happens.

I was just joking around

tadscout
02-18-2010, 03:06 PM
I feel I'm reading everything three times, it is just me

Los Angeles
02-18-2010, 03:06 PM
I feel I'm reading everything three times, it is just me

Smoothdave1
02-18-2010, 03:06 PM
You do this deal for the following reasons:

1. Get rid of Ford and his 8.5 million dollar contract next season
2. Bring back a guy in Nazr that can replace a guy like Foster and possibly Murphy to an extent
3. Bring in a young prospect point guard in Augustin
4. Bring in a young prospect in Henderson who is buried on Brown's bench

I think Bird & Morway look at Brandon and feel like he's just about reached his potential and may be a rotational guy, but won't be a 20ppg guy. Meanwhile, you bring in Augustin and Henderson who could very well make up our back-court for the next 10 years.

Justin Tyme
02-18-2010, 03:06 PM
Someone is going to have to tell me who Henderson is.


LOL! Sometimes you just amaze me. I'll let SETH fill you in on Henderson.

avoidingtheclowns
02-18-2010, 03:07 PM
Remember that it was Charlotte that screwed us at the last minute with the Tinsley deal.

Huh? You mean the Tinsley/Orlando deal? That was Rafer Alston and Houston.

d_c
02-18-2010, 03:07 PM
If this deal fell through, most likely it's because Charlotte wanted to include an undesirable like Diop instead of Mohammed.

It's just a guess, but it's often why deals like this fall through. One team wants to other to take on a longer running contract.

flox
02-18-2010, 03:07 PM
I doubt rush would have ever been a 20ppg guy

BornReady
02-18-2010, 03:07 PM
omg is there any chance chad ford is wronggg!?

pwee31
02-18-2010, 03:07 PM
http://twitter.com/Wells222


No Charlotte-Pacers deal, according to multiple sources. Wo

Why even get our hopes up? I'm f###ing hate our front office

Speed
02-18-2010, 03:07 PM
Man that was surprising then awesome and now sucks.

chrisjacobs7
02-18-2010, 03:07 PM
Just when I finally had accepted we wouldn't make a move, this rumor has to come out and build my hopes up only to crush them down...

Lance George
02-18-2010, 03:07 PM
http://twitter.com/wojyahooNBA


Indiana wanted desperately to move T.J. Ford -- and loved D.J. Augustine --- but it appears they've just run out of time, source says.
less than 20 seconds ago from web

90'sNBARocked
02-18-2010, 03:08 PM
These are the best 10 minutes of the whole Pacers season.

Enjoy them, everybody.

Followed by 3 months of pure torture :)

count55
02-18-2010, 03:08 PM
Huh? You mean the Tinsley/Orlando deal? That was Rafer Alston and Houston.

The owner supposedly nixed a Nazr-for-Tins deal, but I don't know the timing.

Smoothdave1
02-18-2010, 03:08 PM
Remember that it was Charlotte that screwed us at the last minute with the Tinsley deal.

Umm, wasn't it Houston that trumped our offer to Orlando? The supposed deal was Cook & Reddick for Tinsley and the Rockets came in and offered Alston.

Speed
02-18-2010, 03:08 PM
Larry Brown would have hated TJ Ford after one practice.

BRushWithDeath
02-18-2010, 03:08 PM
Charlotte said no. Ford and Rush are pissed.

MagicRat
02-18-2010, 03:09 PM
I'm f###ing hate our front office

RAARRRRRRRRRRR!
http://chaos.able-towers.com/%7Emagicrat/jimodill.jpg

Unclebuck
02-18-2010, 03:09 PM
LOL! Sometimes you just amaze me. I'll let SETH fill you in on Henderson.

LOL, I don't know anything about college players. if you stuck a gun to my head and said name a current college basketball player. I could name Wall and that would be it. I couldn't name a second one if my life depended on it, although there is probably a Jones or a Smith playing somewhere

Los Angeles
02-18-2010, 03:09 PM
Huh? You mean the Tinsley/Orlando deal? That was Rafer Alston and Houston.

Pretty sure it was Tinsley to Charlotte and at the very very last second charlotte pulled out, sticking us with the contract and no choice but to eventually waive him.

That was the famous Bird "I think I'm going to puke" statement.

I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure it was Charlotte.

SMosley21
02-18-2010, 03:09 PM
"Indiana wanted desperately to move T.J. Ford -- and loved D.J. Augustine --- but it appears they've just run out of time, source says."
http://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA/status/9298801475

Much like the Pacers on the court, they fiddle fart around the entire time, then try desperately to make a comeback at the last minute and end up failing.

pwee31
02-18-2010, 03:09 PM
http://twitter.com/Wells222



Pacers-Bobcats tried to work out a deal, which was first reported by @WojYahooNBA, but they couldn't reach an agreement

Speed
02-18-2010, 03:09 PM
Well, I guess Rush could go on his end of season tear and we'll all be happy.

That Pacers players comment was weird. Maybe it was Deiner needling some guys.

FrenchConnection
02-18-2010, 03:10 PM
http://twitter.com/Wells222



Why even get our hopes up? I'm f###ing hate our front office

Actually, I am happy to hear that Bird was trying right up to the deadline. But we should have never known about this.

BPump33
02-18-2010, 03:10 PM
So, what does this do to Brandon's confidence?

Unclebuck
02-18-2010, 03:11 PM
http://twitter.com/Wells222



Why even get our hopes up? I'm f###ing hate our front office

You do realize that Bird leaked this to the press at 2:45 just to bother us all

Speed
02-18-2010, 03:11 PM
So, what does this do to Brandon's confidence?

Maybe it helps it, since another team wanted him.

Roaming Gnome
02-18-2010, 03:12 PM
Back to your regularly scheduled programming... Already in progress!

Speed
02-18-2010, 03:12 PM
You do realize that Bird leaked this to the press at 2:45 just to bother us all

Maybe he got back from St. Elmos and read me calling him out about going to St. Elmos instead of working the phones and he leaked it to prove that he was trying.

idioteque
02-18-2010, 03:13 PM
It is pretty obvious that unless JOB is fired and someone comes in with plans to install a completely new offensive system, Rush will be traded in the offseason.

purdue101
02-18-2010, 03:13 PM
i can't say i'm terribly disappointed. i believe rush has the highest ceiling of any of the young players in that deal. ford for nazr was a wash as both expire next year.

Pacemaker
02-18-2010, 03:13 PM
Maybe it helps it, since another team wanted him.

Perphaps he doesn't knows what confidence is :confused:

Unclebuck
02-18-2010, 03:13 PM
Should be very interesting to see if Ford moves back to the end of the bench. if he does I would expect many of you will have to personally apologize to JOB

Speed
02-18-2010, 03:14 PM
There's not a system out there that will make him play consistently with confidence, poise, and aggression. That's on BRush, imo.

wintermute
02-18-2010, 03:14 PM
i would have hated to lose rush.

henderson and augustin would have been nice though.

90'sNBARocked
02-18-2010, 03:14 PM
You do realize that Bird leaked this to the press at 2:45 just to bother us all

Yep,

Fits the predesigned "we tried hard " speech

tadscout
02-18-2010, 03:15 PM
Folks... like d_c has been saying... it's most likely not our front office's fault that this didn't happen... This has Charlotte written all over it... they most likely wanted us to take Diop's bad contract (and taking that would counter the point of even trading Ford's contract... no matter how much I want to see him gone and either AJ playing).

Speed
02-18-2010, 03:15 PM
Larry says to Morway, look we are getting ripped for not doing anything, let's float this out there and then we can have press release about how hard we tried to make a move, so they at least think we are trying. Oh ya, pass the horsradish sauce, David.

Unclebuck
02-18-2010, 03:15 PM
There's not a system out there that will make him play consistently with confidence, poise, and aggression. That's on BRush, imo.

actually, I think Larry Brown might have been the best thing for him. Guess it could have worked either way.


Laughing at someone in this forum who slipped away for 30 minutes and returned to read this whole thread 30 minutes late

MillerTime
02-18-2010, 03:15 PM
i would have hated to lose rush.

henderson and augustin would have been nice though.

if we lost Rush and got back Henderson, I wouldnt mind

Justin Tyme
02-18-2010, 03:16 PM
LOL, I don't know anything about college players. if you stuck a gun to my head and said name a current college basketball player. I could name Wall and that would be it. I couldn't name a second one if my life depended on it, although there is probably a Jones or a Smith playing somewhere


LOL! You have to have heard of Wall's team mates Cousins and Patterson, right?

indygeezer
02-18-2010, 03:16 PM
I feel I'm reading everything three times, it is just me

Speed
02-18-2010, 03:17 PM
Well at least we'll get to see some more of the Watson/Ford backcourt now.

Unclebuck
02-18-2010, 03:17 PM
LOL! You have to have heard of Wall's team mates Cousins and Patterson, right?

I have now

BornReady
02-18-2010, 03:17 PM
i want augustin henderson :(
our future core woulda been far more sound

chrisjacobs7
02-18-2010, 03:17 PM
@tj_ford: 'Sorry but trade rumors was just trade talk... Still a PACER!!!!'

BPump33
02-18-2010, 03:18 PM
Does anyone else keep refreshing still hoping that everyone is wrong and it went through?

:(

Speed
02-18-2010, 03:18 PM
@tj_ford: 'Sorry but trade rumors was just trade talk... Still a PACER!!!!'

I think he just apologized for being a Pacer...

Unclebuck
02-18-2010, 03:18 PM
Well at least we'll get to see some more of the Watson/Ford backcourt now.

A serious question though. If Ford is benched and AJ is back getting regular minutes then I think we can assume that yes the Pacers were showcasing Ford. It is a possibility

BPump33
02-18-2010, 03:19 PM
@tj_ford: 'Sorry but trade rumors was just trade talk... Still a PACER!!!!'

He's happy about this? Well, that makes one person in this state.

pwee31
02-18-2010, 03:19 PM
Yo know I had calm myself down and was perfectly fine with the fact that we weren't making a trade and weren't moving Murphy

This last rumor really just took the wind out of my Pacer sails! I'm ticked off right now!

I didn't plan on going to another Pacers game this year, but I may go to one more just so I can tell Bird to his face thank you for making matter worse in Indiana

indygeezer
02-18-2010, 03:19 PM
Does anyone else keep refreshing still hoping that everyone is wrong and it went through?

:(

yes



Could this be the building blocks for a future trade?

Pacersfan46
02-18-2010, 03:19 PM
Sometimes I think some of you believe there's a conspiracy out there to convince the rest of us that there's no conspiracy.

-- Steve --

Justin Tyme
02-18-2010, 03:20 PM
This was a conspiracy by the Pacers FO so they can use their canned spiel about trying, but couldn't get a deal done tripe.

How much longer b4 the FO puts out their famous company line of trying.

wintermute
02-18-2010, 03:20 PM
actually, I think Larry Brown might have been the best thing for him. Guess it could have worked either way.


i think so too actually.


A serious question though. If Ford is benched and AJ is back getting regular minutes then I think we can assume that yes the Pacers were showcasing Ford. It is a possibility

certainly hope so.

d_c
02-18-2010, 03:20 PM
Folks... like d_c has been saying... it's most likely not our front office's fault that this didn't happen... This has Charlotte written all over it... they most likely wanted us to take Diop's bad contract (and taking that would counter the point of even trading Ford's contract... no matter how much I want to see him gone and either AJ playing).

It's just a theory, but it's usually a big reason trades don't happen and why the number of rumors are far greater than the number of trades that actually happen.

Otherwise, I have a hard time believing the Pacers would turn down Rush for Henderson and Augustin, given that Mohammed expires at the same time as Ford an is actually a little bit cheaper.

Charlotte is saying "We're giving you two prospects and you're only giving us one. You'll have to even this out by taking Diop instead of Nazr."

And Bird says "No way we are taking Diop". This kind of stuff happens all the time.

BRushWithDeath
02-18-2010, 03:21 PM
He's happy about this? Well, that makes one person in this state.

Hell no he isn't happy about this.

wintermute
02-18-2010, 03:22 PM
Could this be the building blocks for a future trade?

sure. we heard that charlotte wanted rush and ford last year too.

BPump33
02-18-2010, 03:23 PM
Hell no he isn't happy about this.

He shouldn't be, but the capitalized PACER with the exclamation points seems to tell a different story.

tadscout
02-18-2010, 03:23 PM
@tj_ford: 'Sorry but trade rumors was just trade talk... Still a PACER!!!!'

He sure didn't seem happy to be a Pacer at the Season Ticket holder event a week and a half ago... had such a blank look and wouldn't say a word (at least when I was near him in the autograph line... every other player would at least say hi, to even have a convo with you...).

SMosley21
02-18-2010, 03:24 PM
Does anyone else keep refreshing still hoping that everyone is wrong and it went through?

:(

Yes.

BRushWithDeath
02-18-2010, 03:25 PM
He shouldn't be, but the capitalized PACER with the exclamation points seems to tell a different story.

Would you rather his tweet say, "**** I'm stuck wth Dunleavy, Granger, and the rest of those incompetent ********. I can't wait to get out of that **** hole city and organization."?

SMosley21
02-18-2010, 03:25 PM
Random thought: Henderson would've given us 4 Duke Blue Devils on the roster.

BPump33
02-18-2010, 03:25 PM
Would you rather his tweet say, "**** I'm stuck wth Dunleavy, Granger, and the rest of those incompetent ********. I can't wait to get out of that **** hole city and organization."?

Yes.

I'm not arguing with you. He probably isn't happy, but the way he worded that tweet that's how it appears. That's all I was saying.

chrisjacobs7
02-18-2010, 03:26 PM
Would you rather his tweet say, "**** I'm stuck wth Dunleavy, Granger, and the rest of those incompetent ********. I can't wait to get out of that **** hole city and organization."?

I think if he wasn't happy he would've just kept quiet about the situation. The fact that he tweeted this pretty soon after the deadline makes it seem to me like he's happy... no clue why he would be though.

tadscout
02-18-2010, 03:26 PM
It's just a theory, but it's usually a big reason trades don't happen and why the number of rumors are far greater than the number of trades that actually happen.

Otherwise, I have a hard time believing the Pacers would turn down Rush for Henderson and Augustin, given that Mohammed expires at the same time as Ford an is actually a little bit cheaper.

Charlotte is saying "We're giving you two prospects and you're only giving us one. You'll have to even this out by taking Diop instead of Nazr."

And Bird says "No way we are taking Diop". This kind of stuff happens all the time.

I agree with your point of view...
Plus look at one of the press statements... it said Charlotte didn't want to do a trade at this time (or something like that)... so again it's them that was holding it up (probably Diop)... It wasn't Larry being gun shy like some here have suggested.

Wylder1324
02-18-2010, 03:26 PM
I hope this is the bulding block for something in the future to.....I could see it coming up during the draft again....especially if we end up with a pick outside of the top 5 and arent able to get the player we really want.

Major Cold
02-18-2010, 03:28 PM
actually, I think Larry Brown might have been the best thing for him. Guess it could have worked either way.


Laughing at someone in this forum who slipped away for 30 minutes and returned to read this whole thread 30 minutes late
:rockon2:

Unclebuck
02-18-2010, 03:30 PM
Actually haven't there been several trade rumors about Ford going to the Bobcats, for almost 2 years now.

SMosley21
02-18-2010, 03:30 PM
I don't think Ford tweeted that statement to show his happiness of lack of it. I think he did it to rub it in Pacers fans' faces. Like he was saying "hahaha! you guys are still stuck with me. Suck it!!" That's how it felt when I read it anyway.

tadscout
02-18-2010, 03:31 PM
Actually haven't there been several trade rumors about Ford going to the Bobcats, for almost 2 years now.

Seems like it...

count55
02-18-2010, 03:31 PM
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pwee31
02-18-2010, 03:32 PM
If the hangup was not taking Diop then I think that's utterly stupid! You get a young PG in the deal, and you pretty much swap young SG, you get rid of a player you don't want in the process, and you say no b/c Diop has 2 more years b/c of the player option. I know you don't want to take on terrible contracts, but you say you want a trade that makes the team better, and I think this was it!

Give me a f###ing break! You still have Murph, Dunleavy and Foster expiring. Diop is actually a decent backup center seeing that Foster back recovery is no given.

You get Augustine who could still be the PG of the future, you also get a young rookie who was a lottery pick?

I mean C'MON, let's be real here.

If it was that simple, then we Bird dropped the ball as usual. I thought this was exactly the type of deal Bird was looking for

Speed
02-18-2010, 03:34 PM
A serious question though. If Ford is benched and AJ is back getting regular minutes then I think we can assume that yes the Pacers were showcasing Ford. It is a possibility

I hope that is exactly what happens.

SMosley21
02-18-2010, 03:34 PM
http://twitter.com/IBJTheScore/status/9299355128


At 1ish p.m., Ford and Rush were telling family and friends the deal was as good as done. Now, it's looking like the deal is breaking down.

BRushWithDeath
02-18-2010, 03:34 PM
The hangup was Charlotte declining.

CableKC
02-18-2010, 03:35 PM
WojYahooNBA

Indiana-Charlotte discussions broad, sources say: Talks included Ford and Rush for Augustine, Nazr and Gerald Henderson. Not yet imminent.
I think that Seth just j*zzed in his pants ( can I say that on PD ?) :laugh:

Unclebuck
02-18-2010, 03:35 PM
Does any think that Augustin is the answer at point guard. he seems to me that he is a very good backup. It would have been interesting next season to see Augustin and price battle for the starting position. But from what I've seen of both, neither is the answer at point. at least it doesn't appear to be at this point in time

wintermute
02-18-2010, 03:35 PM
Actually haven't there been several trade rumors about Ford going to the Bobcats, for almost 2 years now.

well, there was a rumor that charlotte wanted ford for felton, back when we acquired ford.

then the rumor last trading deadline was tinsley, rush, foster for felton and mohammed. perhaps ford was in the mix too?

Unclebuck
02-18-2010, 03:36 PM
Their agents most have told them it was basically a done deal.

wintermute
02-18-2010, 03:39 PM
http://twitter.com/IBJTheScore/status/9299355128

At 1ish p.m., Ford and Rush were telling family and friends the deal was as good as done. Now, it's looking like the deal is breaking down.


it's going to be awkward for a while in pacer land...

pwee31
02-18-2010, 03:39 PM
My sources tell me that the deal died once Bird realized the Bobcats no longer had Adam Morrison to throw into the deal

CableKC
02-18-2010, 03:39 PM
Yes to Nazr....no to Diop....his contract absolutely sucks......he's owed $6 mil to $7 mil PER YEAR until 2012-2013. :pray:

BillS
02-18-2010, 03:40 PM
This was a conspiracy by the Pacers FO so they can use their canned spiel about trying, but couldn't get a deal done tripe.

How much longer b4 the FO puts out their famous company line of trying.

Yeah, because we all know they've been on vacation and every media outlet in the world made up all the rumors about the deals they were trying to work just so they can sit back and laugh at us.

Seriously, you don't think they were trying?

SMosley21
02-18-2010, 03:42 PM
it's going to be awkward for a while in pacer land...

As if that's going to change the team dynamic? We still suck. Maybe this makes us suck even worse, which increases our odds in the John Wall sweepstakes.

Speed
02-18-2010, 03:42 PM
http://twitter.com/IBJTheScore/status/9299355128

At 1ish p.m., Ford and Rush were telling family and friends the deal was as good as done. Now, it's looking like the deal is breaking down.

Wow, that's crazy.

Major Cold
02-18-2010, 03:43 PM
Augustin is a younger Ford, minus the hops and with a 36% 3pt ceiling. I saw Ford Augustin a lateral move. I saw Henderson slightly less proven than Rush. And Nazr as a throw in salary guy.

I am not upset that this deal did not happen and I would not have been upset if this trade happened.

will567
02-18-2010, 03:46 PM
Well with this bit of bad news I hold little hope that anything will happen this summer or next year. The expiring contracts that we have will be more valuable to the pacers then to other teams. Why? Because of the labor situation and fact who could these players help! I would also not get my hopes up for 2011. I think we are looking at a return of the 1980's pacers with years of poor teams.

MagicRat
02-18-2010, 03:46 PM
The good news is that it saves me the replacement cost of a youth size L #25 swingman jersey......cha-ching!

Unclebuck
02-18-2010, 03:47 PM
Honestly though from what I know of all the players involved. (Granted I know nothing about Henderson) this trade wouldn't made any real difference. So beyond the fun of making a trade and the discussion and getting rid of Ford, I don't really care that this trade didn't take place.

Interesting to learn that the pacers are willing/trying to trade Rusgh

BRushWithDeath
02-18-2010, 03:47 PM
Wow, that's crazy.

It was more wishful thinking than thinking the deal was already done. And it was more like 2:40 than 1:00.

Speed
02-18-2010, 03:48 PM
Augustin is a younger Ford, minus the hops and with a 36% 3pt ceiling. I saw Ford Augustin a lateral move. I saw Henderson slightly less proven than Rush. And Nazr as a throw in salary guy.

I am not upset that this deal did not happen and I would not have been upset if this trade happened.

I think this is about right, except you'd hope that DJ and Henderson maybe had big upside potential that surpasses those levels. But who knows.

pacergod2
02-18-2010, 03:52 PM
I agree that it was interesting that we were willing to deal Rush. But I could see it as an insistance from Larry Brown to include Rush. He is exactly the type of defensive wing that LB would be able to use effectively.

I could care less about this deal because I am not huge on Augustin. I do think that it might make things so awkward for Ford that he would consider opting out now. Maybe he thinks he could get a more favorable deal this off-season than he could after the new CBA, especially with all the teams that will have spare money.

Naptown_Seth
02-18-2010, 03:54 PM
if we lost Rush and got back Henderson, I wouldnt mind
I agree. This would have been a great trade, and I'm #1 on the Rush fan club list. Barring some nosedive off the face of playing ability, Henderson should be a better SG than Rush. He's also a strong defender, much more offensively aggressive, and very powerful going to the rim (he dunks in traffic regularly, or did at least). He's got a jump shot that has to at least be on par with Rush.

DJ was a kid I always liked but thought was too small. I like Bayless more because he has better handles and more size. Still I'd be fine with him here instead of Ford.

To me it would have been a nice upgrade at SG and would have helped smooth out the future direction at PG. Clearly you'd be working up Price and DJ.

Plus we all know Brown is a great guy to steal players from because he ruins their value for no good reason. He needed a defensive-minded SG who could score, so they traded for Jack....with Henderson just sitting there. Dumb.

BPump33
02-18-2010, 03:54 PM
http://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA

The Spurs have traded Theo Ratliff to Charlotte, source tells Y! Sports

Well, CHA made one trade.

indygeezer
02-18-2010, 03:56 PM
I think this deal fell thru because someone ran in and waived this morning's Kravitz column under Bird's nose.

BRushWithDeath
02-18-2010, 03:57 PM
I agree that it was interesting that we were willing to deal Rush. But I could see it as an insistance from Larry Brown to include Rush. He is exactly the type of defensive wing that LB would be able to use effectively.

I could care less about this deal because I am not huge on Augustin. I do think that it might make things so awkward for Ford that he would consider opting out now. Maybe he thinks he could get a more favorable deal this off-season than he could after the new CBA, especially with all the teams that will have spare money.

The odds of TJ opting out are the same as the odds Dunleavy ever returns anywhere close to his 2007 form. Which is to say not a chance in hell.

tadscout
02-18-2010, 03:57 PM
Well with this bit of bad news I hold little hope that anything will happen this summer or next year. The expiring contracts that we have will be more valuable to the pacers then to other teams. Why? Because of the labor situation and fact who could these players help! I would also not get my hopes up for 2011. I think we are looking at a return of the 1980's pacers with years of poor teams.

Do you realize that you can use cap space for more than free agents... it's very helpful in trades as well... so just don't look at the 2011 FA class and think that's our only option.

Also we have a full year now to unload all those upcoming expiring contracts for quality assets...

We have many options and paths to choose from to rebuild this team...

CableKC
02-18-2010, 03:58 PM
I was in a Conference call until 12:35pm PST / 3:35pm EST....saw the thread....STARTED READING THE THREAD FROM THE VERY BEGINNING TO THE END and in the span of 5 minutes....I went from

:dance: :dance: :dance: :dance: :dance: :dance: :dance:

:bgroovy::great::yay2:

:thisisfun:

to

:vaderno: :notamused: :picardriker:

:thisisnotfun:

I had an emotional roller coaster that was way too much for me to handle.....excuse me, I have something to do now.....:suicide4:

Naptown_Seth
02-18-2010, 04:01 PM
I really like Brandon and do not want to give up on him, but from what I remember seeing of Henderson I think he makes it worth it.

Seth or someone,

Aren't Rush and Henderson pretty interchangeable?
Rush was a bit smarter as a glue guy, floor spacing and awareness, but not by much. Henderson is a more explosive jumper/dunker, great driving to the rim. About equal in jump shooting. About equal in defense.

Overall I rate Henderson as a better prospect than Rush...and as I just mentioned, I really like Rush.


Maybe Tyler vetoed the deal because of the broken nose GH gave him. :)

Naptown_Seth
02-18-2010, 04:15 PM
you have 2 minutes

Someone is going to have to tell me who Henderson is
You don't even follow any of the draft threads at all?


Henderson was a Duke star and often had NCAA moments of Jordan like drives through traffic for monster dunks followed by soft twine ripping turnaround jumpers. Oh, and he loves getting up and defending guys, something TBird and I both agreed with.

He's been my target to steal from the idiot-Cats all season. The Brown-Jordan tandem has to be one of the worst combos for talent evaluation and use out there, at least young talent. I'd hit them up to trade away their draft pick 2 months into every season from now till forever.

Not draft night. They like their guys then.

My favorite thing was how Felton hit the doghouse and DJ was Larry's darling, and now Felton is great and DJ is in the doghouse.

Having lived through the Rose-Brown era it makes me laugh.



Those of you saying Henderson sucks, he didn't in college and you haven't seen him play in the NBA thanks to Brown. So how do you come to that conclusion?

Lance George
02-18-2010, 04:18 PM
Augustin is a younger Ford, minus the hops and with a 36% 3pt ceiling. I saw Ford Augustin a lateral move. I saw Henderson slightly less proven than Rush. And Nazr as a throw in salary guy.

I am not upset that this deal did not happen and I would not have been upset if this trade happened.

Augustin's a .415 career three-point shooter. That's near elite-level and quite a bit higher than anyone currently on the Pacers.

Thesterovic
02-18-2010, 04:19 PM
Augustin's a .415 career three-point shooter. That's near elite-level and quite a bit higher than anyone currently on the Pacers.

I don't really understand why no one likes him. He is actually alot like AJ only smaller with better shooting.

Unclebuck
02-18-2010, 04:21 PM
You don't even follow any of the draft threads at all?




I do after the NBA finals are over and then not really until about 24 hours before the draft. Now that I strain my brain I have a very vague memory of some Henderson guy in last years draft. Forgot about it pretty quick though

Lance George
02-18-2010, 04:21 PM
I don't really understand why no one likes him. He is actually alot like AJ only smaller with better shooting.

The comparison to Jameer Nelson is pretty strong. Same size, same average athleticism, same skill-set.

kester99
02-18-2010, 04:31 PM
The reactions some of us are having to TJ's tweet just show a good reason to stay away from tweeting. The emotional content just isn't there in what TJ sent out, and any conclusions we come to (about whether he was happy or not or whatever) are just coming out of our own brains.

I'd take it as a simple statement of fact...''still a Pacer!'...until shown otherwise. There's nothing there to indicate he's ahppy, sad, trying to be a jerk or anything else.

pacers_heath
02-18-2010, 04:40 PM
Would Augustin even really be our answer at PG any more so than Price? I know Augustin was a top 10 pick and Price was a late second rounder, but Brandon Rush was a no. 11 pick and I'd take Price over Rush in a heartbeat. I think Price was a steal and we are undervaluing him. Basically, I think Price can be just as good, if not better, than Augustin. I don't care what number pick he was.

pwee31
02-18-2010, 04:43 PM
OUCH!! 2 years in a row we're burned in the final 5-10 minutes of the deadline

http://twitter.com/Wells222


Bobcats called 10 minutes before the deadline saying they weren't going to do to the deal with the Pacers.

duke dynamite
02-18-2010, 04:45 PM
I wonder if Kegboy gets any royalties for the use of his likeness.

Justin Tyme
02-18-2010, 04:45 PM
Yeah, because we all know they've been on vacation and every media outlet in the world made up all the rumors about the deals they were trying to work just so they can sit back and laugh at us.

Seriously, you don't think they were trying?



There is a difference in trying and succeeding!

I just feel this last minute trade tripe was like the year Bird said he was going to get another pick for the lottery. Everyone was expecting a 1st. Instead Bird gets a 2nd from Miami and drafts Stanko. I have always said Bird picked up the 2nd to save face for his saying he was going to get another draft pick when he failed to get another 1st. You can agree or not, but I've always felt that.

Remember the year Bird said he was going to get this highly touted 3 pt shooter? Was that Kareem Rush or Travis Diener?

This just as well could be a face saving situation at the last moment to pacify the fans from the FO failure again. Lets face it, the Pacers FO has taken an extreme amount of heat this season for JOB, the play of the team, 18-35 record, etc. Up until that trade surfaced there was much disgust and anger in Pacer Land with the FO. With that "almost" trade, things aren't as quite bad as they were previously with the fans. The fans are more apt to swallow the "we tried" speech now.

Do I feel the Pacers were looking to help themselves, absolutely, but like I said there is a difference in trying and succeeding. The bottom line is failure, and the world is full of those that failed trying. Success is triumphing over failure, and the Pacers FO weren't successful... they failed. Not only did they fail the franchise, but they failed the fans.

PaceBalls
02-18-2010, 04:49 PM
Honestly though from what I know of all the players involved. (Granted I know nothing about Henderson) this trade wouldn't made any real difference. So beyond the fun of making a trade and the discussion and getting rid of Ford, I don't really care that this trade didn't take place.

Interesting to learn that the pacers are willing/trying to trade Rusgh

Trading Rush would be a horrible mistake IMO. I wonder if that is Jim pushing to trade Rush. How wrong would that be. Of course, this is all rumor/speculation. Rush may never have been offered at all. I doubt Larry will tell us.

PaceBalls
02-18-2010, 04:52 PM
OUCH!! 2 years in a row we're burned in the final 5-10 minutes of the deadline

http://twitter.com/Wells222


More like "whew".. Let's not trade off Rush please? Unless the goal is to make our team the ultimate worst defensive team ever. Might as well change our name from the Pacers to the Fluffy Bunnies.

CableKC
02-18-2010, 05:29 PM
More like "whew".. Let's not trade off Rush please? Unless the goal is to make our team the ultimate worst defensive team ever. Might as well change our name from the Pacers to the Fluffy Bunnies.
Seth would have to confirm.....but based off of what I read about Henderson before he was drafted was that he was a very solid perimeter defender. He was often defending the opposing Players better wing scorers in college. If anything....if it came down to BRush vs. Henderson.....I would only go witih BRush due to the experience....but I have a feeling that it would ultimately have been a minor "push" in favor of BRush in terms of perimeter defense. On the Offensive end....if Henderson is less passive but as effective...then I'd choose Henderson over BRush cuz of the balence that he brings on the offensive and defensive end.

Although I am disappointed that nothing went through....I'll tell you that I am happy that Bird really tried to make some change to the roster. I really hope that in the coming days...he's able to tell us the reason why the trade fell through. It really sounded like it would happen on the Pacers end...with the Bobcats pulling out at the last second.

Lance George
02-18-2010, 05:29 PM
There's no evidence that Diop was ever a part of any proposed deal, and if he was, we would've turned them down immediately. Diop's contract would not only cut nearly $7M off of our 2011 cap space, he actually has a player option for another year at $7.3M. There's a reason Bill Simmons ranked (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/100208/two) his contract fifth worst in the league.

It looks like Charlotte pussed out of an all-but-official deal in the last hour. Oh well. I hope their team implodes in the final two months.

CableKC
02-18-2010, 05:42 PM
There's no evidence that Diop was ever a part of any proposed deal, and if he was, we would've turned them down immediately. Diop's contract would not only cut nearly $7M off of our 2011 cap space, he actually has a player option for another year at $7.3M. There's a reason Bill Simmons ranked (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/100208/two) his contract fifth worst in the league.

It looks like Charlotte pussed out of an all-but-official deal in the last hour. Oh well. I hope their team implodes in the final two months.
Obviously, we know only as much as the Twitter posts were saying....but if it really looked close and then all of a sudden something happened to change this.....this is one of the reasons that seem the most logical to me that would explain some hesitancy on the part of the Pacers.

BRushWithDeath
02-18-2010, 05:44 PM
Obviously, we know only as much as the Twitter posts were saying....but if it really looked close and then all of a sudden something happened to change this.....this is one of the reasons that seem the most logical to me that would explain some hesitancy on the part of the Pacers.

The Pacers didn't hesitate. The Bobcats did, understandably, due to it being T.J. Ford.

CableKC
02-18-2010, 05:52 PM
The Pacers didn't hesitate. The Bobcats did, understandably, due to it being T.J. Ford.
I stand corrected....but I really thought that Brown had a profound interest in TJ Ford....he did right before the TJ/JONeal trade.....I don't see why he would be the reason. There's something else that is missing here that we just don't know.

BillS
02-18-2010, 05:59 PM
Do I feel the Pacers were looking to help themselves, absolutely, but like I said there is a difference in trying and succeeding. The bottom line is failure, and the world is full of those that failed trying. Success is triumphing over failure, and the Pacers FO weren't successful... they failed. Not only did they fail the franchise, but they failed the fans.

Harsh much?

So, do you trade for a pile of crap just so you can say you succeeded in a trade? Then you will have failed because you "settled". Seems like they are damned if they do and damned if they don't.

Smoothdave1
02-18-2010, 06:07 PM
Wells was on Kravitz & Eddie and said the whole thing came down to the Bobcats reluctancy to make another trade given that the team is/will be for sale. Plus, I guess the Bobcats thought that they could get more for Augustin and wanted to explore other options for players, picks, etc.

This trade shows that the Pacers seem to have possibly given up on Brandon and he doesn't appear to be one of the core pieces. I think they view Brandon as a journeyman two guard similar to Kareem Rush. He could be a rotational guy or a decent bench player, but may not be the player we thought he was. I think the Pacers look at Brandon and see that he'll be 25 this summer and question his desire and drive. He has shown flashes, but I am thinking that Bird and company would move him, if possible. Kravitz even said today that Rush has a million dollar basketball body and a ten cent brain.

BillS
02-18-2010, 06:08 PM
This trade shows that the Pacers seem to have possibly have given up on Brandon and he doesn't appear to be one of the core pieces. I think they view Brandon as a journeyman two guard similar to Kareem Rush. He could be a rotational guy or a decent bench player, but may not be the player we thought he was. I think the Pacers look at Brandon and see that he'll be 25 this summer and question his desire and drive. He has shown flashes, but I am thinking that Bird and company would move him, if possible. Kravitz even said today that Rush has a million dollar basketball body and a ten cent brain.

Or it could mean that you can't get a jar of honey for a bucket of poop, so you have to give up something of value.

tadscout
02-18-2010, 06:11 PM
Harsh much?

So, do you trade for a pile of crap just so you can say you succeeded in a trade? Then you will have failed because you "settled". Seems like they are damned if they do and damned if they don't.

I'm just starting to believe some here seriously believe there is a trade genie and if a gm go wishes his trade to him it'll come true... They are just pissed that Larry lost his genie lamp... :devil: :rolleyes:

Anyway... thanks for your common sense at least BillS :buddies:

90'sNBARocked
02-18-2010, 06:17 PM
Yo know I had calm myself down and was perfectly fine with the fact that we weren't making a trade and weren't moving Murphy

This last rumor really just took the wind out of my Pacer sails! I'm ticked off right now!

I didn't plan on going to another Pacers game this year, but I may go to one more just so I can tell Bird to his face thank you for making matter worse in Indiana

Pee Wee

I m not local man, but I have literally had dreams of doing that

You do that for me bro and I got a crispy 100.00 bill for ya :)

90'sNBARocked
02-18-2010, 06:25 PM
Does any think that Augustin is the answer at point guard. he seems to me that he is a very good backup. It would have been interesting next season to see Augustin and price battle for the starting position. But from what I've seen of both, neither is the answer at point. at least it doesn't appear to be at this point in time

I dont

I justed wanted the "rush" of a trade, feeling like a junkie who copped bad stuff


I dont think Felton is that good either

d_c
02-18-2010, 06:28 PM
There's no evidence that Diop was ever a part of any proposed deal, and if he was, we would've turned them down immediately. Diop's contract would not only cut nearly $7M off of our 2011 cap space, he actually has a player option for another year at $7.3M. There's a reason Bill Simmons ranked (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/100208/two) his contract fifth worst in the league.

It looks like Charlotte pussed out of an all-but-official deal in the last hour. Oh well. I hope their team implodes in the final two months.

Of course there is no evidence.

I'm just putting it out as a theory. One team's insistence of the other team taking on an onerous contract is often what keeps deals from happening. It happens all the time. It's just one theory/example as to why there was no trade. Bottom line is they couldn't come to an agreement.

Justin Tyme
02-18-2010, 06:30 PM
Harsh much?


Not really, just truthful. And if the truth hurts so be it.

ChicagoJ
02-18-2010, 06:37 PM
There is no evidence that the teams were ACTUALLY discussing a Ford/ Rush/ Henderson/ Augstine/ Nazr trade. That's just a rumor reported by some twats.

That may have been the Pacers' proposal, but what was the counter-offer?

I've got a hunch that someone from Indianapolis was on the phone, begging and pleading for Charlotte to accept that offer. That may be "in serious discussions" in Twatter-land, but I'm not sure it is "close" if the counter-offer really involved Diop. If that's what the Pacers rejected, then we should be glad there was no deal.

vnzla81
02-18-2010, 06:38 PM
I was not sure about this trade, we don't know how lucky the pacers could get in this draft and if they get the 1st,2nd or 3rd pick? :pray: then you have run the risk for the pacers to trade down because they have to many PG's, I wanted Ford gone but he was going to be package with Brush and I don't like that, he is by far the best defender on the Pacers right now, if he is gone who the hell is going to play D?:confused:, I like Augustin and Gerald but like I said the price was going to be to high for me.

Justin Tyme
02-18-2010, 06:40 PM
This trade shows that the Pacers seem to have possibly given up on Brandon and he doesn't appear to be one of the core pieces. I think they view Brandon as a journeyman two guard similar to Kareem Rush. He could be a rotational guy or a decent bench player, but may not be the player we thought he was. I think the Pacers look at Brandon and see that he'll be 25 this summer and question his desire and drive. He has shown flashes, but I am thinking that Bird and company would move him, if possible. Kravitz even said today that Rush has a million dollar basketball body and a ten cent brain.


So if this is true, I guess Rush wasn't all that "NBA ready", now was he? Who was it that picked/wanted Rush over better players.

Shade is probably smiling ear from ear upon hearing Rush was to be traded, or is ready to lead the march on Conseco with pitchfork in hand looking for Larry Legend.

vnzla81
02-18-2010, 06:41 PM
There is no evidence that the teams were ACTUALLY discussing a Ford/ Rush/ Henderson/ Augstine/ Nazr trade. That's just a rumor reported by some twats.

That may have been the Pacers' proposal, but what was the counter-offer?

I've got a hunch that someone from Indianapolis was on the phone, begging and pleading for Charlotte to accept that offer. That may be "in serious discussions" in Twatter-land, but I'm not sure it is "close" if the counter-offer really involved Diop. If that's what the Pacers rejected, then we should be glad there was no deal.

Mike wells from Indystar confirmed this trade he said that it was 100% real but the Bobcats owner turned down.

ChicagoJ
02-18-2010, 06:47 PM
So the Bobcats weren't willing to do it?

Hmmm... I'm willing to buy a new Porsche 911 for $10. See... I'm really trying hard to get a new sports car. If nobody here accepts my offer I'll go to BlueandGoldFans (ha!) and try there.

d_c
02-18-2010, 06:49 PM
So the Bobcats weren't willing to do it?

Hmmm... I'm willing to buy a new Porsche 911 for $10. See... I'm really trying hard to get a new sports car. If nobody here accepts my offer I'll go to BlueandGoldFans (ha!) and try there.

Sounds like they had a deal in place. Doesn't sound as if it was an issue of the Bobs including a bad contract. Just that the Bobs pulled out at the last minute for whatever reason. We'll never know.

vnzla81
02-18-2010, 06:54 PM
=d_c;962206]Sounds like they had a deal in place. Doesn't sound as if it was an issue of the Bobs including a bad contract. Just that the Bobs pulled out at the last minute for whatever reason. We'll never know

according to Mike W, the owner did not wanted to take into another contract because he is selling the team, maybe their numbers were different after they made the trade for Tyrus Thomas, is hard to know why:confused:

ChicagoJ
02-18-2010, 06:55 PM
I don't know if I believe that. You don't have a deal until you have a deal.

90'sNBARocked
02-18-2010, 06:56 PM
[QUOTE=Justin Tyme;962117]There is a difference in trying and succeeding!

I just feel this last minute trade tripe was like the year Bird said he was going to get another pick for the lottery. Everyone was expecting a 1st. Instead Bird gets a 2nd from Miami and drafts Stanko. I have always said Bird picked up the 2nd to save face for his saying he was going to get another draft pick when he failed to get another 1st. You can agree or not, but I've always felt that.



I agree wholeheartedly,

Its like at the last minute he makes "public" that they are in "serious" negotiations so that when no trade occurs

It will be "oh we were in serious negotiations , but we just didnt find a trade we liked

on a positive note, I will have absolutely zero expectations for this year and next

so cant be disdappointed anymore :buddies::buddies:

vnzla81
02-18-2010, 06:59 PM
I don't know if I believe that. You don't have a deal until you have a deal.

I am suspicious too, I could be that the pacers wanted to trow this out there so we the fans don't feel as bad, remember that they did the same thing last year, they had a deal that did not go through with who? the CHARLOTTE BOBCATS

d_c
02-18-2010, 06:59 PM
according to Mike W, the owner did not wanted to take into another contract because he is selling the team, maybe their numbers were different after they made the trade for Tyrus Thomas, is hard to know why:confused:

Well, we still don't know anything judging from that.

Ford and Nazr have the same contract length, though Ford does make a little bit more money. Rush is still on a rookie deal. We didn't hear any other names with long term deals going to Charlotte.

If what Wells said was true, then I guess there were other names involved we just didn't hear about.

avoidingtheclowns
02-18-2010, 07:05 PM
according to Mike W, the owner did not wanted to take into another contract because he is selling the team, maybe their numbers were different after they made the trade for Tyrus Thomas, is hard to know why:confused:

That seems odd considering the person acquiring the contracts is also the person trying to buy the team.

Brad8888
02-18-2010, 07:16 PM
If Jordan had completed this trade and had Brown teaching him, I am sure Brandon would have ended up a completely different player, because both Brown and Jordan would value his athleticism and college training and believe they could undo the damage that has been done to Brandon here and would have done what it took to maximize Brandon's development. I wouldn't have been surprised if they would have played Rush and SJax side by side at the wing positions. My guess is that neither Brown nor Jordan wanted Ford, even with us taking bad contracts back in return, but considered it due to the huge upside they would feel that Brandon has.