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View Full Version : O'Brien, Granger chat about 3s/DJones status



Trophy
01-12-2010, 02:06 PM
http://http://www.indystar.com/article/20100112/SPORTS04/1120344/1062/SPORTS04/O-Brien-Granger-chat-about-3s

(Mike Wells)


Indiana Pacers coach Jim O'Brien likes the 3-point shot, but even he realizes Danny Granger is too enamored with 3s.

O'Brien recently addressed the issue with his forward.

Granger went into Monday's game against the Toronto Raptors with 166 3-pointers attempted, which represents nearly half his shots (357) this season. He went 9-of-19 against the Raptors from the field, including 2-of-7 3s.

"Now we're playing with groups that are going to space the court, and as a result, when the ball goes to Danny and somebody is closing out on him, there's no reason for him to settle for a challenged 3 because the court is wide open now," O'Brien said.

Granger attempted 20 3-pointers, making seven, in his first two games back from a torn right plantar fascia.

Oklahoma City Thunder forward Kevin Durant mixed 3-point shooting and driving to the basket Saturday against the Pacers.

Durant scored 40 points on 12-of-18 shooting, including 2-of-2 on 3-pointers.

"(Granger) has to take advantage of more one-on-one situations," O'Brien said. "So we've had that discussion, and I don't mind 3s, but I'd like for him to mix it up and get to the foul line."

Not going there
O'Brien had no comment on whether players should be able to gamble on team flights.

The Washington Wizards and New Jersey Nets have banned gambling on team planes in the wake of the locker room incident involving Wizards guard Gilbert Arenas and guns. The incident reportedly began over a card game on a team flight.

"That's not something I'm going to discuss," O'Brien said.

Pacers front office officials have yet to discuss whether they should stop gambling on their plane.

"It wouldn't be good if it happened to us," point guard Travis Diener said. "It's something we do to pass the time. A bunch of guys play.

"We've never really had anything close to an argument. We're not playing for a lot of money. It's there for entertainment and to kill time."


Jones out of rotation

Dahntay Jones has gone from being a key rotation player to out of it.

Jones got his first DNP-CD of the season Monday.

"Dahntay is a great guy to have on the team. What I try to do, and it's nothing against Dahntay right now, I try to put guys on the court that can space the court," O'Brien said. "This basketball team needs to be a real threat on the perimeter in order to open the inside.

"Dahntay is a very tenacious player, but we struggle to space the court when he's out there. It doesn't mean the coaches decision not to play him is permanent."

Jones is more of a driver than a shooter. He is 13 percent (3-of-23) on 3-point attempts this season.

Etc.
Rookie F Tyler Hansbrough returned to the lineup after missing the previous seven games with an inner ear infection. He had four points and seven rebounds. . . . Benched PG T.J. Ford was on the active roster a game after being inactive for one game.

dohman
01-12-2010, 02:12 PM
That stinks for d.jones. He was a bright spot early in the season. I did not realize he was shooting that poorly from outside. Funny the DNP's are the ones that cannot shoot the three.

Shawne#4
01-12-2010, 02:58 PM
"Space the court" must be another way to say "Lose the game"

BillS
01-12-2010, 03:32 PM
"Space the court" must be another way to say "Lose the game"

Yeah, because it certainly didn't help us last night :rolleyes:

Tom White
01-12-2010, 03:46 PM
"Space the court" must be another way to say "Lose the game"

No. It is another way of saying SPACE THE COURT.

dohman
01-12-2010, 03:55 PM
Yeah, because it certainly didn't help us last night :rolleyes:

how many times can a beat up dog cross a interstate? It may happen a few times out of a 100.

Unclebuck
01-12-2010, 04:03 PM
I realize there is a lot of joking going on in this thread, but I hope some of you aren't suggesting that "spacing the court" is some almost science fiction pie in the sky theory that Jim O'Brien has chosen to thrust upon on Pacers fans.

Spacing the court is one of the very basic and most important principles in any halfcourt offense. Rick Carlisle believes in it as much as anyone as do all coaches for that matter. It ranks right up there with ball movement and player movement

McKeyFan
01-12-2010, 04:05 PM
Isn't spacing the court and perimeter shooting supposed to open up the low post? What does it matter if Roy is on the bench?

Unclebuck
01-12-2010, 04:35 PM
Isn't spacing the court and perimeter shooting supposed to open up the low post? What does it matter if Roy is on the bench?

Yes that is true a good low post player helps open the outside, and good outside shooting can open up inside as teams will be less likely to double down low, and teams will stay attached to good outside shooters. But spacing the court is important whether you have a low post threat or not. it is important in the passing game, in pick and rolls in any type of play with any type of personnel you might have.

CableKC
01-12-2010, 04:37 PM
I don't know about you.....but I'm sick of all this spacing cr*p that JO'B talks about....as if this is a reason to not play one of our best defenders and efficient scoring wing Players on the floor. Having a "drive and attack" wingman with a crappy 3pt shooting % didn't stop JO'B from playing Marquis last season....why would it stop with Inferno?

I really wonder if there is something else is going on. For all this +/- and spacing concerns that JO'B brings up.....there doesn't appear to be any logic, rhyme or reason as to why he plays certain players and not others....other then the fact that he will always default to players that he's most comfortable with.

To UBs point about Spacing the Court.....I get that it's a fundamental part of Basketball...but do you think that Inferno being a poor 3pt shooter is a sufficient reason to not play him? Sure, he can't help by making the 3pt shot....but let's completely ignore that he's a capable defender and has a willingness to drive to the basket to score in other ways. Believe me, I hate that he has tunnel vision at times....but I'd live with this if it meant that we'd actually have a solid perimeter and aggressive defender on the floor.

OakMoses
01-12-2010, 04:50 PM
I like Dahntay, but let's not act like he's a good fit in this offense. He had a lot of success early in the season, but it quickly became apparent that if you had to rely on him for any kind of scoring you were going to lose.

He stops the ball and player movement nearly as much as Ford does. He brings a lot more to the table on the defensive end, which earns him some minutes, but ultimately he's bad for the team offensively.

http://www.82games.com/0910/0910IND1.HTM

Check it out. The only players who make us worse offensively than D. Jones are Ford, Murphy, and S. Jones.

Unclebuck
01-12-2010, 05:01 PM
I don't know about you.....but I'm sick of all this spacing cr*p that JO'B talks about....as if this is a reason to not play one of our best defenders and efficient scoring wing Players on the floor. Having a "drive and attack" wingman with a crappy 3pt shooting % didn't stop JO'B from playing Marquis last season....why would it stop with Inferno?

I really wonder if there is something else is going on. For all this +/- and spacing concerns that JO'B brings up.....there doesn't appear to be any logic, rhyme or reason as to why he plays certain players and not others....other then the fact that he will always default to players that he's most comfortable with.

To UBs point about Spacing the Court.....I get that it's a fundamental part of Basketball...but do you think that Inferno being a poor 3pt shooter is a sufficient reason to not play him? Sure, he can't help by making the 3pt shot....but let's completely ignore that he's a capable defender and has a willingness to drive to the basket to score in other ways. Believe me, I hate that he has tunnel vision at times....but I'd live with this if it meant that we'd actually have a solid perimeter and aggressive defender on the floor.

I'm not going to disagree with you. However it did get TJ Ford benched, so it isn't an alltogether terrible thing.

Overall I like D. Jones mainly for the intangibles that he brings. Toughness, leadership.... but he does hold the ball too long and I know that drove the coaching staff nuts as he was taken out many times because he didn't move the ball or missed wide open players.

Plus wasn't there a lot of discussion that maybe Jones was perhaps, maybe one of the reasons why the player chemistry is poor this season. Maybe, perhaps Ford and Jones were the chemistry problems and maybe we have a happier group of players now that they are both sitting.

Disclaimer: This is all theory by me, just throwing it out there, and I don't mean to imply that Ford and Jones have the same impact on the team

Unclebuck
01-12-2010, 05:07 PM
I don't know about you.....but I'm sick of all this spacing cr*p that JO'B talks about....as if this is a reason to not play one of our best defenders and efficient scoring wing Players on the floor. Having a "drive and attack" wingman with a crappy 3pt shooting % didn't stop JO'B from playing Marquis last season....why would it stop with Inferno?

I really wonder if there is something else is going on. For all this +/- and spacing concerns that JO'B brings up.....there doesn't appear to be any logic, rhyme or reason as to why he plays certain players and not others....other then the fact that he will always default to players that he's most comfortable with.

To UBs point about Spacing the Court.....I get that it's a fundamental part of Basketball...but do you think that Inferno being a poor 3pt shooter is a sufficient reason to not play him? Sure, he can't help by making the 3pt shot....but let's completely ignore that he's a capable defender and has a willingness to drive to the basket to score in other ways. Believe me, I hate that he has tunnel vision at times....but I'd live with this if it meant that we'd actually have a solid perimeter and aggressive defender on the floor.

I'm not going to disagree with you. However it did get TJ Ford benched, so it isn't a terible thing

Shawne#4
01-12-2010, 05:40 PM
Yeah, because it certainly didn't help us last night :rolleyes:

I'm all for spacing the court if it leads to opening up the low post game and creating a good mix of plays within the offense. But the O'Brien system just frustrates me. Our form of "spacing the court" just seems to create more separation around the perimeter and allow more space to jack up some threes.

I'm firmly against the strategy of not playing your best players, as JOB did last night by giving Roy only 7 minutes and handing Jones and DNP. Sure, it'll work on some nights when the team is shooting well, but more often than not, I believe they will get beat with it. If the Pacers are going to space the court, I wish they would at least balance the threes with an inside game, much like we did in the Orlando game.

Brad8888
01-12-2010, 06:54 PM
Without ball and player movement with purpose, which is an aberration to O'B, the only way to space the court is with 3's. To compare what Carlisle believes and coaches regarding spacing, no matter where he has coached, to what O'B believes is laughable on O'B's best day.

Obviously, the better coached teams teach that spacing is achieved through ball movement and players moving without the ball with a purpose, that purpose being to get opposing defenses to commit and make mistakes and leave players unguarded for quality looks, whether those looks are at the rim or 25 feet away, within the flow of an offense that takes care of the ball, and generally is predicated on working the ball inside to the low post occasionally, and making the extra pass that generally is the one that produces the best quality look during a possession.

The "Quick" (yes I am aware that O'B does not call his the "Quick", Isiah did, but O'B infuriates me, especially when he demonstrates his ignorance by blaming DJones for the spacing problems when, in fact, his second favorite thing for players to do is to do what he has now told Danny to do and what Dahntay did offensively which is to make freelance drives into the lane to mix things up, which will produce more of the same standing around that failed earlier in the year) fails because it does not ever break the defense down. Ever. It only beats it to a given spot, and doesn't do so with regularity unless it is an All Star game.