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View Full Version : Who would you bench or diminish his time to give D.Jones sometime???



sportfireman
01-12-2010, 10:25 AM
With DJ disappearing from the rotation lately. I've been thinking who would I take away from to give DJ. For me it as to be Head I like him but lately he's starting to play a lil bit like dare i say it............ TJ. I've watched him and yes he does some good things but I believe DJ would bring a lil more toughness to the team. But don't get me wrong Head is a great offensive spark. But that's it a spark only not a flame, DJ has shown he can be a flame........ oh yeah but he can't shoot the three. Sorry DJ:cry:

Unclebuck
01-12-2010, 10:29 AM
I would play Head and Rush very little if at all and give those minutes to Jones. But I understand and accept O'Brien's explanation on why Jones isn't playing. As much as I like Jones, I have no problem with seeing how things work out with not playing him.

sportfireman
01-12-2010, 10:32 AM
I would play Head and Rush very little if at all and give those minutes to Jones. But I understand and accept O'Brien's explanation on why Jones isn't playing. As much as I like Jones, I have no problem with seeing how things work out with not playing him.

i didnt hear his explaination.......... do you mind telling me or showing if it linked somewhere? thnx in advance

NuffSaid
01-12-2010, 11:33 AM
No one. I wouldn't play D. Jones unless I had to. His offense isn't that great and he hasn't shown me that he's a better on-the-ball defender than either BRush or Granger. So, no. D. Jones would continue to sit and/or come off the bench if I had my way about it and would remain their until he was able to prove to me that he has development better ball control, a better read on the defense, and an ability to knock down open shots (12-15 ft).

Peck
01-12-2010, 11:38 AM
Defense is optional with our team.

Infinite MAN_force
01-12-2010, 11:38 AM
I would trade Murphy, Play Granger at the 4, and have Rush/Jones/Head/Dunleavy man the wing spots. Probably overall reducing head's minutes the most.

ChicagoJ
01-12-2010, 11:42 AM
Nobody. He's an eighth or ninth man in terms of minutes (even if he has been a token starter in the past). If somebody gets in foul trouble, then he might get more minutes. Otherwise, he sits. Just like any other eighth or ninth man... especially one that is a vet with little additional upside beyond his current skillset. If he were a first/second year player that was just staring to show signs of "getting it", then I would increse his minutes. As it is, an increase in minutes would stand in the way of doing exactly that with some of our younger players.

In two or three years, we may be wishing we'd given Luther Head a four-year contract and signed Dahntay to a one-year deal.

Unclebuck
01-12-2010, 11:50 AM
i didnt hear his explaination.......... do you mind telling me or showing if it linked somewhere? thnx in advance

http://www.indystar.com/article/20100112/SPORTS04/1120344/1088/SPORTS04/O-Brien-Granger-chat-about-3s

Jones out of rotation
Dahntay Jones has gone from being a key rotation player to out of it.

Jones got his first DNP-CD of the season Monday.

"Dahntay is a great guy to have on the team. What I try to do, and it's nothing against Dahntay right now, I try to put guys on the court that can space the court," O'Brien said. "This basketball team needs to be a real threat on the perimeter in order to open the inside.

"Dahntay is a very tenacious player, but we struggle to space the court when he's out there. It doesn't mean the coaches decision not to play him is permanent."

Jones is more of a driver than a shooter. He is 13 percent (3-of-23) on 3-point attempts this season.

ChicagoJ
01-12-2010, 12:45 PM
He may be a driver, but he's a lousy finisher and a marginal ballhandler. I'd rather have TJ Ford driving, and you all know how I feel about that.

Its too bad that Dhantay is letting Jim talk about his offense. Because that means he's less-than-neutral. Jeff Foster and Dale Davis were never a good offensive players at all but figured out how to be neutral. Dale could set screens. Jeff could grap ORs. Neither commanded the ball and neither f$#^ed up really bad when they did have it. There's a lesson for Dhantay in there somewhere. I think he's smart enough to figure out it.

vnzla81
01-12-2010, 12:49 PM
I would bench head, watson and Diener, neither one of this guys is part of the future and DJ has a long contract with this team so they better play him, plus his defense is good

Trophy
01-12-2010, 12:57 PM
We're packed with wingmen. I'd give Rush/Jones/Head equal time at SG and see who plays the best in the limited time they get.

I would probably pick Luther to lose time. He hasn't been confident in his shooting and his defense has been slipping.

Also, maybe we should move Brandon back at starting SG and see how he does with Earl.

PG Watson/Price
SG Rush/DJones
SF Granger/Dunleavy
PF Murphy/Hansbrough
C Hibbert/SJones

CableKC
01-12-2010, 03:49 PM
Wow....I am really surprised by the responses here.....Inferno went from a great pickup during the start of the season...heck, even a leader at times on the floor...to someone that can't even crack the lineup cuz his offensive game doesn't fit the style of a Coach that many of us wouldn't mind seeing gone.

I'm not saying that he's a savior or anything.....I'm just surprised that the opinion of Inferno has changed ( for some of you ) so much since the beginning of the season.

Ozwalt72
01-12-2010, 04:11 PM
Wow....I am really surprised by the responses here.....Inferno went from a great pickup during the start of the season...heck, even a leader at times on the floor...to someone that can't even crack the lineup cuz his offensive game doesn't fit the style of a Coach that many of us wouldn't mind seeing gone.

I'm not saying that he's a savior or anything.....I'm just surprised that the opinion of Inferno has changed ( for some of you ) so much since the beginning of the season.

Why should you be surprised that people's opinion of the player reflects his play? I mean, most of us went from thinking he was a solid defensive player with no offense to an above average guard defender with better than advertised offense....and now most of us are back to thinking he's a guy that should't be scoring.

Personally, for the price I think that he was an effective signing. It's a long season and I am willing to bet our opinions will change a few more times on Dahntay Jones.

PaceBalls
01-12-2010, 04:23 PM
I'd rather see Brandon and DJones play most of the minutes ahead of Dun and Murph, for pure defensive purposes. It would work especially well with a Hibbert low post strategy.

NuffSaid
01-12-2010, 04:28 PM
http://www.indystar.com/article/20100112/SPORTS04/1120344/1088/SPORTS04/O-Brien-Granger-chat-about-3s

Jones out of rotation
Dahntay Jones has gone from being a key rotation player to out of it.

Jones got his first DNP-CD of the season Monday.

"Dahntay is a great guy to have on the team. What I try to do, and it's nothing against Dahntay right now, I try to put guys on the court that can space the court," O'Brien said. "This basketball team needs to be a real threat on the perimeter in order to open the inside.

"Dahntay is a very tenacious player, but we struggle to space the court when he's out there. It doesn't mean the coaches decision not to play him is permanent."

Jones is more of a driver than a shooter. He is 13 percent (3-of-23) on 3-point attempts this season.
I read the above today as well before posting my comments to this thread. Thus, I say again...


No one. I wouldn't play D. Jones unless I had to. His offense isn't that great and he hasn't shown me that he's a better on-the-ball defender than either BRush or Granger. So, no. D. Jones would continue to sit and/or come off the bench if I had my way about it and would remain their until he was able to prove to me that he has developed better ball control, a better read on the defense, and an ability to knock down open shots (12-15 ft).
JOB is spot on regarding Dahntay Jones. He deserved his first DNP-CD; and until he can improve his game my hope is it's not his last.

CableKC
01-12-2010, 04:30 PM
I refuse to believe that Inferno ( just like McRoberts ) is so bad and detrimmental to the offensive end that they do not warrant any playing time. I understand that we are slowly ( yet surely ) getting back to a healthy lineup...but there has to be a way to balence the playing time out so that we aren't wearing out certain Players ( specifically ones that JO'B heavily leans on ) while not playing others enough that could help out.

bellisimo
01-12-2010, 04:37 PM
so we go out and get a so-called defensive specialists to a long term deal just so that he can sit on the bench?

had we not heard from O'Brien before that it was the defensive play of the players that would set their time? yet the recent comments about spacing the floor/etc have all been about offense...

I haven't watched the Ps this year - just going by what ya'll are saying/etc...This is just me thinking out loud more than anything else :)

NuffSaid
01-12-2010, 04:40 PM
Wow....I am really surprised by the responses here.....Inferno went from a great pickup during the start of the season...heck, even a leader at times on the floor...to someone that can't even crack the lineup cuz his offensive game doesn't fit the style of a Coach that many of us wouldn't mind seeing gone.

I'm not saying that he's a savior or anything.....I'm just surprised that the opinion of Inferno has changed ( for some of you ) so much since the beginning of the season.
I'm not.

I've always been in favor of playing the best players at their relative positions, as well as playing guys to their strengths, not their weaknesses. I'm also mindful of acquiring players who fit the coach's style of play. Dahntay has become know for his defense, not his offense. Even my wife who has become a "student of the game" in recent years has stated to me that the reason Dahntay was so effective early in the season was because opposing teams didn't know he was capable of driving and scoring from the elbow down. However, they also recognized that he's not that good of a shooter from the field. So, they defend him tight, taking away his ability to shoot the ball and, thus forcing him to drive the lanes where it's become very clear he doesn't have very good ball control and he won't stop on a dime, ala, Quis, and take the mid-range jumper in traffic.

So, no. I'd only use Dahntay sparingly but in particular in those instances where you need a defensive stop. He'd likely be a 3rd or 4th scoring option among the reserves and no higher than a 4th option among the starters if I were in JOB's shoes along the sideline.

Naptown_Seth
01-12-2010, 04:49 PM
I refuse to believe that Inferno ( just like McRoberts ) is so bad and detrimmental to the offensive end that they do not warrant any playing time. I understand that we are slowly ( yet surely ) getting back to a healthy lineup...but there has to be a way to balence the playing time out so that we aren't wearing out certain Players ( specifically ones that JO'B heavily leans on ) while not playing others enough that could help out.
The kicker in all this - who shoots the 3 better, McRoberts or Tyler? Who blocks more shots?

So do you need spacing and defense or not?

They aren't drawing fouls so JOB talks about Danny DRIVING THE BALL MORE...oops, DJ does that and it's a bad thing.


Look, DJ has slumped a bit and I think he's discouraged by the direction of the team and the leadership. He's been expressing just that for some time now. A lot of us thought he was talking about TJ when he was upset about guys being lazy.

So that might mean JOB can't play him as much just because his total output is down. But ultimately there is one very strong theme that continues to run through every JOB quote - SMALL is good, 3PT is good.

The rest is completely lip service, and not even that since Josh hit a few and still got benched.

Add to that Dun has finally hit some 3s but he's played quite a bit for a guy that teams could leave so far they'd need GPS to find him again and still count on him to miss the shot.

Why the F did Larry spend money on DJ if he has to be able to shoot the outside shot in order to play? If DJ has been playing weaker defense lately (I think there's a case for that) then just say that instead. Say "DJ is slumping, his defense hasn't been sharp enough to offset the offense, and we'll play it by ear for awhile". We're grown ups, we can handle the truth.



BTW, I loved the "adjust for defense by playing Troy at C instead of Roy". Yeah, that's what most teams think - "I need defense, someone get me Troy Murphy".

NuffSaid
01-12-2010, 04:52 PM
I refuse to believe that Inferno ( just like McRoberts ) is so bad and detrimmental to the offensive end that they do not warrant any playing time. I understand that we are slowly ( yet surely ) getting back to a healthy lineup...but there has to be a way to balence the playing time out so that we aren't wearing out certain Players ( specifically ones that JO'B heavily leans on ) while not playing others enough that could help out.
Sure there is. You use players based on what they bring to the table.

Example: Robert Horray in his later years wasn't a starter, but he was an effective catch-n-shot perimeter scorer. Same became true of Brent Barry as his career wound down.

JOB just has to realize that Dahntay Jones was brought in not so much to score the ball, but rather to be a solid lockdown defender - something he hasn't done very well yet either since acquiring him, IMO.

You use players based on what they bring to the hardwood. Dahntay's specialty should be demonstrating his defensive capability, not attempting to showcase his offense. Still, I'm sure that eventually JOB will find playing time for Dahntay. I just hope Dahntay realizes his weakness as clearly articulated by the coaching staff and that he works on his game, as well as sharpening his defensive skills for which he was brought here for in order to be a better asset to the team.

NuffSaid
01-12-2010, 05:05 PM
Naptown,

I couldn't have said it better myself.

I'm a "tell it like it is (TILIS)" kinda guy. So, I agree with your statment, "DJ is slumping, his defense hasn't been sharp enough to offset the offense, and we'll play it by ear for awhile," comment 100%. I'd much rather JOB makes such an honest statement (because Dahntay's defense has been slipping of late and his offense leaves alot to be desired) than for him to try to qualify benching him because his shots aren't falling. Considering that he isn't known for his offense but rather his defense, such a statement behing such a move would make sense to any Pacers fan who pays close enough attention to this team and this player.

Well said, my man!

sportfireman
01-12-2010, 05:11 PM
Naptown and Nuffsaid I agree with you both but in DJ defense....... JOB had him guarding PF when Murph and Granger were hurt. Really a 6'6 210 lb SG guarding PF, he's setting him up for failure IMO. He had better options to guard them like Josh sitting there on the bench but he sticks DJ on them.:rolleyes:

ksuttonjr76
01-12-2010, 05:15 PM
Let's keep it real. JOB want players to shoot the 3...period. Plus, everyone is saying D. Jones' defense had fallen off, but he's being matched up against PFs at 6'6". When Granger and Murphy came back, I really thought that Head would be regulated to the bench, and D. Jones would be inserted at the starting SG (Rush plays better coming off the bench). I would have NEVER thought he would fall out of the rotation. That's some b.s. D. Jones is a better driver coming off the wings...not from the post. Did JOB see something in practice that suddenly made he think that D. Jones would be a better post defender/player? After the DNP-CD for Jones, I was convinced that JOB just doesn't know WTF he's doing. But he sure does love playing two PGs at the same time, and playing Murphy at the C who's our weakest post defender and offensive rebounder.

NuffSaid
01-12-2010, 05:16 PM
Understood, but my question to you (and others who've made this same observation) is were those PFs the opposing team's best players? If your answer is "YES", then Dahntay, supposingly being one of this team's better on-the-ball defenders, drew that assignment out of necessity.

ksuttonjr76
01-12-2010, 05:16 PM
Naptown and Nuffsaid I agree with you both but in DJ defense....... JOB had him guarding PF when Murph and Granger were hurt. Really a 6'6 210 lb SG guarding PF, he's setting him up for failure IMO. He had better options to guard them like Josh sitting there on the bench but he sticks DJ on them.:rolleyes:

Great minds think alike :D.

ksuttonjr76
01-12-2010, 05:20 PM
Understood, but my question to you (and others who've made this same observation) is where those PFs the opposing team's best players? If you're answer is "YES", then Dahntay, supposingly being one of this team's better on-the-ball defenders, drew that assignment out of necessity.

I would have taken my chances with McRoberts and S. Jones...not a 6'6" perimeter defender. Perhaps we'll have Granger guard Tony Parker and Chris Paul in the future.

sportfireman
01-12-2010, 05:25 PM
Great minds think alike :D. I wouldn't call my mind great, thanks. Lil dirty but not great.

sportfireman
01-12-2010, 05:27 PM
Understood, but my question to you (and others who've made this same observation) is were those PFs the opposing team's best players? If your answer is "YES", then Dahntay, supposingly being one of this team's better on-the-ball defenders, drew that assignment out of necessity.

Ok one that I remember off hand was Memphis. DJ was guarding Randolph....... not Gay or Mayo..... Randolph.

EDIT: I also can remember Harrington backing him down several times.

NuffSaid
01-12-2010, 06:13 PM
Ok one that I remember off hand was Memphis. DJ was guarding Randolph....... not Gay or Mayo..... Randolph.

EDIT: I also can remember Harrington backing him down several times.
Well, there you go...Dahntay at the 4 (PF) atleast for this defensive assignment was done out of necessity and rightly so. Zach Randolph ate us up last time these two teams played. I'd have to assume that JOB figured he'd do it again. Plus, you have to remember, Rudy Gay really didn't beat us from the floor. He "earned" 10 of his 31 pts from the line. Still, you're concerns here are understood and well received.

'Nuff Said.

sportfireman
01-12-2010, 06:52 PM
Well, there you go...Dahntay at the 4 (PF) atleast for this defensive assignment was done out of necessity and rightly so. Zach Randolph ate us up last time these two teams played. I'd have to assume that JOB figured he'd do it again. Plus, you have to remember, Rudy Gay really didn't beat us from the floor. He "earned" 10 of his 31 pts from the line. Still, you're concerns here are understood and well received.

'Nuff Said.

I understand that but we had another available big man ready to step in.

vnzla81
01-12-2010, 06:56 PM
Ok one that I remember off hand was Memphis. DJ was guarding Randolph....... not Gay or Mayo..... Randolph.

EDIT: I also can remember Harrington backing him down several times.

you forgot Lebron James

sportfireman
01-12-2010, 07:26 PM
you forgot Lebron James
Lebron backs down C's......he doesn't count.:)