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View Full Version : Why all the Tyler Hansbrough Hate



Jonathan
03-25-2009, 10:34 AM
I think the kid will be a respectable basketball player in the NBA. I would not mind seeing him in a Pacers uniform. Jeff Foster would be a great tutor for his development.

stevo
03-25-2009, 10:51 AM
Tyler lacks size to play his position effectively in the NBA. Most
scouts I believe are down on him because he is a dime a dozen player
at the NBA level. He needs to show something to support the idea
that he could actually get better than he is now. I just think most
teams and scouts think he is at his ceiling. IMO

BRushWithDeath
03-25-2009, 11:02 AM
Because nothing he does at the collegiate level will be possible for him at the professional level.

count55
03-25-2009, 11:03 AM
Because nothing he does at the collegiate level will be possible for him at the professional level.

Not true.

He will still be able to change most light bulbs without a ladder.

BRushWithDeath
03-25-2009, 11:05 AM
Not true.

He will still be able to change most light bulbs without a ladder.

Not really. He's only about 6'7.

Phree Refill
03-25-2009, 11:06 AM
Tyler lacks size to play his position effectively in the NBA. Most
scouts I believe are down on him because he is a dime a dozen player
at the NBA level. He needs to show something to support the idea
that he could actually get better than he is now. I just think most
teams and scouts think he is at his ceiling. IMO

6-9 250lbs is decent enough size for me. Especially considering Udonis Haslem is only 6-8 235. You can't tell me that any team he would get drafted by wouldn't like the energy he brings. I think he can work his way into any rotation within a few years in the league. As far as being a Foster type player, he already has a much more polished offensive game than Jeff. And if you still think his size is a concern, Brian Grant came into the league as a small forwad. At the end of his career he was playing center. I don't have any doubt that Tyler can bulk up a little more and hold his own against any other power forward in the league with the exception of Howard. The league has gotten smaller up front in the past 4-5 years anyways.

Phree Refill
03-25-2009, 11:15 AM
All i'm saying is if he can be had in the second round of the draft, why not give it a shot? Second round is a toss up anyways.

stevo
03-25-2009, 11:16 AM
6-9 250lbs is decent enough size for me. Especially considering Udonis Haslem is only 6-8 235. You can't tell me that any team he would get drafted by wouldn't like the energy he brings. I think he can work his way into any rotation within a few years in the league. As far as being a Foster type player, he already has a much more polished offensive game than Jeff. And if you still think his size is a concern, Brian Grant came into the league as a small forwad. At the end of his career he was playing center. I don't have any doubt that Tyler can bulk up a little more and hold his own against any other power forward in the league with the exception of Howard. The league has gotten smaller up front in the past 4-5 years anyways.

True, the two things he has going for him is his strength and energy. Those two things will help. I would not consider him a PF of the future. A solid backup on a good team or starter on a scrub team. BCS

BRushWithDeath
03-25-2009, 11:20 AM
All i'm saying is if he can be had in the second round of the draft, why not give it a shot? Second round is a toss up anyways.

Because he won't be had in the second round. He'll be taken in the first. Hopefully, by somebody in the Central who isn't us.

Jonathan
03-25-2009, 11:34 AM
Tyler is very good at drawing contact and getting to the foul line as well. My only knock on him is that he needs to learn to pass the ball better out of the low post. I think he will be a very decent player in the NBA. His energy, work ethic, and aggresiveness will get him playing time in the NBA.

Speed
03-25-2009, 11:38 AM
His advantage is his strength in college. He'll be going against guys in the pros who are bigger, faster, quicker, AND as strong. Haslem is a good example and Haslem would kill him.

d_c
03-25-2009, 12:58 PM
6-9 250lbs is decent enough size for me. Especially considering Udonis Haslem is only 6-8 235. You can't tell me that any team he would get drafted by wouldn't like the energy he brings. I think he can work his way into any rotation within a few years in the league. As far as being a Foster type player, he already has a much more polished offensive game than Jeff. And if you still think his size is a concern, Brian Grant came into the league as a small forwad. At the end of his career he was playing center. I don't have any doubt that Tyler can bulk up a little more and hold his own against any other power forward in the league with the exception of Howard. The league has gotten smaller up front in the past 4-5 years anyways.

He's "6-9" the same way Antawn Jamison is 6-9. In other words he's probably really about 6-7.5. Take listed heights with a grain of salt and use your eyes.

His old teammate Brandan Wright measured out at 6-8.75 at the draft combine and if you saw the two standing next to each other, Wright was easily taller by a couple inches.

Hansbrough doens't play the same way Udonis Haslam does. On top of all that, Hasnbrough will be 24 years old at the start of the next NBA season. He's much closer to being topped out in terms of ability and skill.

Pingu
03-25-2009, 01:00 PM
Mark Madsen Pt. II if you ask me

Your kidding right? There's a world of difference between Hansbrough's and Madsen's offensive skills.

Phree Refill
03-25-2009, 01:07 PM
He's "6-9" the same way Antawn Jamison is 6-9. In other words he's probably really about 6-7.5. Take listed heights with a grain of salt and use your eyes.

His old teammate Brandan Wright measured out at 6-8.75 at the draft combine and if you saw the two standing next to each other, Wright was easily taller by a couple inches.

Hansbrough doens't play the same way Udonis Haslam does. On top of all that, Hasnbrough will be 24 years old at the start of the next NBA season. He's much closer to being topped out in terms of ability and skill.

Same would go for Haslem then. Haslem is listed at 6-8 but in realtiy he's prolly on 6-7 6-6. You can make that argument for any player.

Jonathan
03-25-2009, 01:08 PM
His advantage is his strength in college. He'll be going against guys in the pros who are bigger, faster, quicker, AND as strong. Haslem is a good example and Haslem would kill him.

The same knock was on E J last year and his strength has transferred over just fine in the NBA. What did you say about EJ last year going into the draft Speed?

Speed
03-25-2009, 01:18 PM
The same knock was on E J last year and his strength has transferred over just fine in the NBA. What did you say about EJ last year going into the draft Speed?

I'm completely drawing a blank on who EJ is? At first I thought you meant Eric Gordon. Sorry I'm just blank.

My point with Hansbrough is that alot of his offense comes from a shoulder into the defender and muscling up a short one hander. I think going against 6'10" guys who have 7'4" wingspan won't allow him to do that at the next level.

I can see him being a garbage guy and a rotation guy, but I really do not see him being a starter in the league, ever. if I'm drafting in the lottery, I shooting for maybe a potential starter someday or at least the possibility.

I mean garbage not as in being 20 points up or down, but as in a guy who scraps after loose balls and won't get an offensive play called for him all season.

count55
03-25-2009, 01:26 PM
I'm completely drawing a blank on who EJ is? At first I thought you meant Eric Gordon. Sorry I'm just blank.


EJ is Eric Gordon.

Speed
03-25-2009, 01:36 PM
EJ is Eric Gordon.


Thanks, I don't remember saying his strength wouldn't equate in the NBA, I do remember wondering about him being undersized height wise for a shooting guard. Same things I always wonder about "combo" guards in general, sometimes I think it means short shooting guard, which sometimes means when they go from college to the pros they aren't able to get their shot off and become ineffective. Not the case with EJ, he's really playing well, same for Ben Gordon. Maybe it's a Gordon thing? Anyway, if I said that I was wrong, obviously.

Take any of my college analysis with a grain of salt. I thought Joe Alexander was going to be one of the top 3 players from last years draft and he hasn't gotten much time even.

I also really like the Landry guy from Wisconsin who I guess isn't that much of a prospect this year either and Pat Patterson from Kentucky. So, there is a good indicator of my body of work, not so good.

idioteque
03-25-2009, 01:42 PM
Now this is an off the wall post but I think a lot of Hansbrough hate (by fans not by scouts) is personal hatred and has nothing to do with his basketball skills. He is sort of this goofy looking, awkward frat boy that doesn't appear at least through the media to have much of a personality off the court. He doesn't fit in with the "typical basketball player" persona to me. And NO I'm not talking about race so there is no need to take it there.

jhondog28
03-25-2009, 01:53 PM
A lot of a teams appeal has to do with a toughness such as powerful dunks, lots of elevated height and a personality that is loud and attention getting. I think if you look at the Pacers they have a lot of scrappers who love to hustle, shoot jumpers and rebound. What they lack is the street appeal. The high wire acts and street playground style basketball. Fancy passing, spectacular dunks and don't **** with me attitude. I think Hansbrough fits the Indiana Pacers current team's style but that does not translate into heightened ticket sales or increased revenue. In all honesty I think that is what Herb should be looking for in this draft. Avoid the Thugs and focus on marketability.

count55
03-25-2009, 01:54 PM
He ran over my kid's cat!

(No...wait...I'm a dog person....let's draft him!)

idioteque
03-25-2009, 01:55 PM
A lot of a teams appeal has to do with a toughness such as powerful dunks, lots of elevated height and a personality that is loud and attention getting. I think if you look at the Pacers they have a lot of scrappers who love to hustle, shoot jumpers and rebound. What they lack is the street appeal. The high wire acts and street playground style basketball. Fancy passing, spectacular dunks and don't **** with me attitude. I think Hansbrough fits the Indiana Pacers current team's style but that does not translate into heightened ticket sales or increased revenue. In all honesty I think that is what Herb should be looking for in this draft. Avoid the Thugs and focus on marketability.

We have a lot of scrappers, yes, but at times scrapper is just a codeword for unathletic. And it is being exploited. Look what Pops Mensah Bonsu and Leon Powe did to our frontcourt.

In short, we need a guy who can do this:

http://www.nba.com/video/channels/top_plays/2009/03/16/nba_20090316_botn.nba/index.html

d_c
03-25-2009, 02:36 PM
Same would go for Haslem then. Haslem is listed at 6-8 but in realtiy he's prolly on 6-7 6-6. You can make that argument for any player.

Yes, I agree you can say the same thing about height for a lot of players, but I also said that Haslam doesn't play anything like the way Hansbrough plays.

duke dynamite
03-25-2009, 02:43 PM
Now this is an off the wall post but I think a lot of Hansbrough hate (by fans not by scouts) is personal hatred and has nothing to do with his basketball skills. He is sort of this goofy looking, awkward frat boy that doesn't appear at least through the media to have much of a personality off the court. He doesn't fit in with the "typical basketball player" persona to me. And NO I'm not talking about race so there is no need to take it there.
Someone who just wants to play basketball and is good at it? Now we can't have that kind of riff-raff on our team.

:laugh:

Naptown_Seth
03-25-2009, 03:04 PM
I'm with Count and BRush.

Foster won't be a great tutor for him, Sean May will be a great tutor for him.


Speed - you weren't the only one that like Alexander....but I wasn't on your side.;) I just know several people thought I was nuts for not being all that impressed. Then again he's still young so he's not exactly done yet (same with Bayless).

And I think PsychoT is much, much less applicable to the NBA than Alexander is/was.

What move does he have, what thing does he do that gives him a clear advantage on any below par NBA guy? I don't think he has a shot, a post move, a lane move, the handles to take a guy or anything like that where he'll have an advantage on a guy and make their coach say "I've got to find a way to stop that from happening."

I mean Curry is a guy falling, but unlike TylerH he does have that shot on the move coming over a screen or something. He can get that and teams will have to go out of their way to stop that from happening. They won't be able to let Joe Average just chase him around and have success with it. He's only falling because it seems like he can be stopped....if a team plans for it.

I don't think teams will have to plan for Hansbrough.

Haslem has a midrange shot that punishes people. It's better than average and has to be defended hard or it's free points.

DisplacedKnick
03-25-2009, 03:21 PM
I know I'm in the minority but unless he can't defend (I think he'll be OK - not great) I think he'll be a solid 12-8 player in the NBA - maybe a bit better rebounding. He does have a nose for the ball and enough of a midrange game where he should be able to hit a few buckets.

I'm sure this will be sacriledge but I think he'll have a better pro career than Dejuan Blair who won't be able to defend in the pros.

Naptown_Seth
03-25-2009, 03:30 PM
The same knock was on E J last year and his strength
:confused:

Bad handles if he was going to be an NBA PG, that I recall. I don't remember any other knock on EJ's game and that includes any strength issues. The Clips made him a SG and he shoots the heck out of the rock, so no problem there.

Not only that but I think people considered his strength a positive, not a negative. Height at SG maybe, but again strength issues?

stevo
03-25-2009, 03:35 PM
If he drops any more in the first round, he will only be a bench warmer on a really good team or until he is either traded or sent to the D league to prove himself. either way he would be a project.imo

Kid Minneapolis
03-25-2009, 03:35 PM
Two thoughts:

1) Why is Eric Gordon called "EJ"? Is his dad named Eric, also?

2) I've been doing this for a long time, and I've learned that when there's a lot of know-it-alls who think think a certain player won't translate to the NBA, that player usually ends up proving them wrong, for whatever that is worth. Never under-estimate heart, desire, and hard work. If Hansbrough has all that, you'd be unwise to bet against him.

count55
03-25-2009, 03:39 PM
I'm not actually anywhere on Hansborough, particularly, other than I don't want him at 8-12 where we're going to be picking.

pwee31
03-25-2009, 04:08 PM
Two thoughts:

1) Why is Eric Gordon called "EJ"? Is his dad named Eric, also?

2) I've been doing this for a long time, and I've learned that when there's a lot of know-it-alls who think think a certain player won't translate to the NBA, that player usually ends up proving them wrong, for whatever that is worth. Never under-estimate heart, desire, and hard work. If Hansbrough has all that, you'd be unwise to bet against him.

1. Yes, he's Eric Jr. which explains the EJ

2. I agree

BRushWithDeath
03-25-2009, 04:46 PM
I know I'm in the minority but unless he can't defend (I think he'll be OK - not great) I think he'll be a solid 12-8 player in the NBA - maybe a bit better rebounding. He does have a nose for the ball and enough of a midrange game where he should be able to hit a few buckets.

I'm sure this will be sacriledge but I think he'll have a better pro career than Dejuan Blair who won't be able to defend in the pros.

Hansbrough doesn't defend well at the college level. And he's too short and too unathletic to defend at the pro level.

Doddage
03-25-2009, 05:10 PM
I have a feeling that Pacer fans are going to have to learn to like him, as I can very much see us taking him in the draft. And no, not because of race before anyone tries to accuse me of implying that.

stevo
03-25-2009, 05:40 PM
I have a feeling that Pacer fans are going to have to learn to like him, as I can very much see us taking him in the draft. And no, not because of race before anyone tries to accuse me of implying that.
Im not so sure they would go down that road again drafting an undersized PF
ala Diogu, Williams. With Sean it was more of a mental thing not physical but he was
more of a weapon shooting threes. We have Murphy for that.

LG33
03-25-2009, 09:08 PM
Because he's a ****ing Tarheel. :)

DisplacedKnick
03-25-2009, 09:19 PM
Hansbrough doesn't defend well at the college level.

Nope - he's a very solid and sound college defender. Well above average.


And he's too short and too unathletic to defend at the pro level.

That's one of the things we'll find out - my guess is he'll have no problems defending the post because of his strength but he'll have trouble when athletic big men take him out on the floor - but most NBA PF's have trouble when NBA big men take them out on the floor. It's why athletic big men who can take defenders out on the floor are so valuable.

DisplacedKnick
03-25-2009, 09:21 PM
I'm not actually anywhere on Hansborough, particularly, other than I don't want him at 8-12 where we're going to be picking.

I won't know for sure until we see who's coming out in the draft but I'd think he should go 20-25. He'll be a safe pick who'll definitely contribute as a pro but doesn't seem to have much star potential.

circlecitysportsfan
03-25-2009, 09:53 PM
I thought the same of Carlos Boozer, I guess much of the league did. Not saying Hansborough will be at 25 and 10 but... you never know.

DisplacedKnick
03-25-2009, 10:06 PM
I thought the same of Carlos Boozer, I guess much of the league did. Not saying Hansborough will be at 25 and 10 but... you never know.

I thought Boozer was the best big man in the draft that year and got laughed at. I don't feel that way about Hansborough but you never really know - he works his *** off, is very strong and I think he'll be able to have a very solid 15-18 foot jump shot with a little work. He shoots 85% from the line - no reason he can't have a jump shot. But I just don't see the athleticism to be an elite player (though he could average 10 boards per game if he gets the PT which is elite in its way).

Of course he might pull a Kevin Love and put up athletic numbers in the draft camp. That happens and he's top ten in this draft.

danman
03-25-2009, 11:32 PM
Pacers (rightly) have all but confirmed that their #1 need is athleticism. Tyler brings some stuff to the table, but not that. No chance.

Phildog
03-26-2009, 10:59 AM
So where is he goining in the draft?

P's are picking top 10 most likely---don't think Hans is an option to consider at that mark.

MillerTime
03-26-2009, 11:16 AM
another Mark Madson

Jonathan
03-26-2009, 12:50 PM
So where is he goining in the draft?

P's are picking top 10 most likely---don't think Hans is an option to consider at that mark.

I believe odds are 75% we see another draft day deal.