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MagicRat
03-10-2009, 09:04 AM
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<!--PRINTER FRIENDLY ARTICLE-->http://www.indystar.com/article/20090310/SPORTS04/903100355/1004/SPORTS

March 10, 2009

Granger remains sidelined as red-hot Jazz visit

By Mike Wells
mike.wells@indystar.com

The Indiana Pacers returned from their three-city West Coast trip feeling good after gaining ground in the playoff race. They're also a game closer to having their leading scorer return.

But there's a catch: They'll be without Danny Granger tonight and have to beat the hottest team in the NBA if they expect to gain or maintain their ground in the Eastern Conference.

The Utah Jazz have won 11 consecutive games and are 14-1 since Feb. 1.

"When you play against them, you have to bring your hard hat," Pacers guard Jarrett Jack said.
Center Mehmet Okur scored a career-high 43 points in the Jazz's victory against the Pacers in January. Utah and San Antonio are the only teams among the NBA's top seven that the Pacers haven't beaten.

"You have to make sure you take pride in protecting the paint," coach Jim O'Brien said.
"They run the same offense and just execute the heck out of it. It's very unique to the NBA."

The Pacers are 4-2 in their past six games and 6-3 since All-Star Granger suffered a partially torn tendon in his right foot.

Scoreboard watching has become a habit for the Pacers, who have just 17 games remaining to climb over and move ahead of four tightly bunched teams for the final playoff spot. They have four games left against teams they're chasing -- Chicago (twice), Charlotte and Milwaukee.

"It's always good when you're in a situation where every game is meaningful," O'Brien said.
"As a result, your players don't need the coaching staff to keep them focused. They are focused. They understand the meaning of every basketball game."

Granger said his goal is to return Friday at Atlanta.

Granger has yet to practice with his teammates, but he did individual drills -- shooting, ballhandling, cutting -- with assistant coach Frank Vogel after practice Monday.

Lateral movement still puts stress on his foot.

"I can't do everything yet," Granger said.

"I'm getting most of it back. Some things I'm still limited with. I have to make sure when I come back I'm definitely ready and I'm not half speed. (The team has) been playing very well."

The Pacers have had success without Granger by spreading the scoring.

They have had a different scoring leader in four of the nine games he has missed. Jack is averaging 21.9 points a game in that span.

"It really has nothing do with who is on the court or who is not on the court," O'Brien said. "It has to do with the fact when we started the year, half the team was brand new and it's a matter of guys getting comfortable with the schemes, the offense. And when Danny went down, our guys were just starting to get comfortable with what we want to accomplish at both ends of the court, and when he comes back, I don't think there will be any difficulty of him getting back into the flow of things."

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duke dynamite
03-10-2009, 09:31 AM
This looks good.

BRushWithDeath
03-10-2009, 04:02 PM
Foster is out too.

Anthem
03-10-2009, 05:02 PM
Hopefully we see some McBob tonight. I'd like to see what he's capable of against Okur.

Justin Tyme
03-10-2009, 05:45 PM
Foster is out too.


That just gives someone else the opportunity to hit the bunnies he is notorious for missing.:D

Justin Tyme
03-10-2009, 05:46 PM
Hopefully we see some McBob tonight. I'd like to see what he's capable of against Okur.


I'll be pleasantly surprised if JO'B plays him.

dohman
03-10-2009, 05:59 PM
That just gives someone else the opportunity to hit the bunnies he is notorious for missing.:D

Someone would have to get his offensive rebounds to hit his bunnies.

Trader Joe
03-10-2009, 07:00 PM
This was from the ESPN article on Granger's return...
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3968147
AP

Granger said the foot injury likely came from overcompensating for soreness in his right knee that had been bothering him since before the All-Star break. He played limited minutes in the All-Star Game to protect himself from risking further damage, but eventually ended up hurting it anyway.

So. Pissed. Off.

When will anyone be held accountable for the poor decisions regarding the health of our players? Was there no one on the Pacers training staff that would have foreseen this situation?

CableKC
03-10-2009, 07:17 PM
"I can't do everything yet," Granger said.

"I'm getting most of it back. Some things I'm still limited with. I have to make sure when I come back I'm definitely ready and I'm not half speed. (The team has) been playing very well."[/B]
So....no one else is concerned about this little statement? :shrug:

I know that we are still in the Playoff hunt and need our best Player to help us out....but not at a cost of still playing injured.

I get the sense that he is not 100% but more like 75%. I would much rather wait for Granger to heal to the point where he can actually play at an acceptable rate....not get back an injured-but-healing Granger. I just don't want to aggrevate any injuries that he has.

MyFavMartin
03-10-2009, 09:33 PM
His interview during the game tonight mentioned that he has scar tissue on the foot tendon that needs breaking up through movement and exercise and this will help with return to 100%. During the Clips game, I believe, I heard he's lacking lateral quickness (proby via pushing off his planted foot), which is obviously required for defense as well as other stuff.

BRushWithDeath
03-11-2009, 10:43 AM
During the Clips game, I believe, I heard he's lacking lateral quickness (proby via pushing off his planted foot), which is obviously required for defense as well as other stuff.

He hasn't tried defensively all season, so that shouldn't affect him much.

BillS
03-11-2009, 01:54 PM
This was from the ESPN article on Granger's return...
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3968147
AP


So. Pissed. Off.

When will anyone be held accountable for the poor decisions regarding the health of our players? Was there no one on the Pacers training staff that would have foreseen this situation?

You know, it isn't like Danny is saying "it still hurts" and the training staff is forcing him onto the court with cattle prods.

These players are competitive and used to saying to themselves, "it hurts but I can play through it" and then telling the medical staff that it feels good enough to play on.

At some point, players and coaches make a decision to play through an injury or not. Sure, it'd be better to sit Danny any time there is an injury that might cause him to shift how he plays for a game or two, but then he (and a lot of other guys who play hard) would spend their entire careers on the bench.

All the medical staff can do is work with what they are told and make recommendations. The player and the coach decide what to do after that.

Unclebuck
03-11-2009, 03:18 PM
You know, it isn't like Danny is saying "it still hurts" and the training staff is forcing him onto the court with cattle prods.

These players are competitive and used to saying to themselves, "it hurts but I can play through it" and then telling the medical staff that it feels good enough to play on.

At some point, players and coaches make a decision to play through an injury or not. Sure, it'd be better to sit Danny any time there is an injury that might cause him to shift how he plays for a game or two, but then he (and a lot of other guys who play hard) would spend their entire careers on the bench.

All the medical staff can do is work with what they are told and make recommendations. The player and the coach decide what to do after that.

Thank you.

Seems like so many think injuries are an exact science when in reality it is all a guessing game with soooo many variables thrown in.

duke dynamite
03-11-2009, 03:40 PM
You know, it isn't like Danny is saying "it still hurts" and the training staff is forcing him onto the court with cattle prods.

These players are competitive and used to saying to themselves, "it hurts but I can play through it" and then telling the medical staff that it feels good enough to play on.

At some point, players and coaches make a decision to play through an injury or not. Sure, it'd be better to sit Danny any time there is an injury that might cause him to shift how he plays for a game or two, but then he (and a lot of other guys who play hard) would spend their entire careers on the bench.

All the medical staff can do is work with what they are told and make recommendations. The player and the coach decide what to do after that.

Exactly, it feels like I have been the only one to scream, plead, and defend the training staff all along.

Since86
03-11-2009, 03:44 PM
Exactly, it feels like I have been the only one to scream, plead, and defend the training staff all along.

:hmm:

count55
03-11-2009, 03:44 PM
You know, it isn't like Danny is saying "it still hurts" and the training staff is forcing him onto the court with cattle prods.

These players are competitive and used to saying to themselves, "it hurts but I can play through it" and then telling the medical staff that it feels good enough to play on.

At some point, players and coaches make a decision to play through an injury or not. Sure, it'd be better to sit Danny any time there is an injury that might cause him to shift how he plays for a game or two, but then he (and a lot of other guys who play hard) would spend their entire careers on the bench.

All the medical staff can do is work with what they are told and make recommendations. The player and the coach decide what to do after that.


Thank you.

Seems like so many think injuries are an exact science when in reality it is all a guessing game with soooo many variables thrown in.


Exactly, it feels like I have been the only one to scream, plead, and defend the training staff all along.

But it makes us all feel so much better when we can blame someone.

BillS
03-11-2009, 03:49 PM
Exactly, it feels like I have been the only one to scream, plead, and defend the training staff all along.


:hmm:

Well, yeah, Since86 has been there, but it would be far too logical to listen to someone who knows what he's talking about. This is the Internet, fer cryin' out loud.

Since86
03-11-2009, 03:53 PM
I wish Kaufman would post with regularity. He would be THE person to listen too, considering he does it for a living.

Noodle
03-11-2009, 03:59 PM
Thank you.

Seems like so many think injuries are an exact science when in reality it is all a guessing game with soooo many variables thrown in.

Yeah I guess people forget that it is considered a medical practice.

duke dynamite
03-11-2009, 04:26 PM
:hmm:
Sorry, sometimes your posts get mixed in with all the others. Didn't mean to bust your chops.

Since86
03-11-2009, 04:29 PM
Ah, it's cool. I thought you had me on ignore, like Grace. JK, I think....

I've been trying to bite my tongue on the subject. Whatever is said might squash the posts about how messed up our staff is for the day, but tomorrow the same people will be right back at it. The definition of crazy is doing the same things and expecting different results (or something close to that). Well I'm not looking to be called crazy.

Naptown_Seth
03-11-2009, 04:36 PM
:hmm:
Dude, dissed hard.
;)

What do you know though. You still think concussions are more than just a headache, but I've seen enough Chuck Norris movies to know that a good player would just shake that crap off.

My movie medical knowledge>>>>>your real medical knowledge

This is why when the zombies come you're getting chomped while I escape to a mall/farmhouse. Of course some will say that I went nuts and started shooting innocent people in the head because they had colds and/or nosebleeds and then holed up in my shack/Foot Locker making insane demands...but I'll know better.




ps - only the Most Offensive Poster could go off-topic this badly, vote now or risk being labeled a zombie

Naptown_Seth
03-11-2009, 04:42 PM
But it makes us all feel so much better when we can blame someone.
Oooh, sounds like someone just volunteered. :dance:

What, you don't like us enough to want us to feel better? I suppose you hate children and puppies too.

duke dynamite
03-11-2009, 04:47 PM
ps - only the Most Offensive Poster could go off-topic this badly, vote now or risk being labeled a zombie
More like ADD.

count55
03-11-2009, 04:47 PM
Oooh, sounds like someone just volunteered. :dance:

What, you don't like us enough to want us to feel better? I suppose you hate children and puppies too.

just children.

Naptown_Seth
03-11-2009, 04:54 PM
just children.
This explains some of your reactions to my posts.

I'd feel bad about this derail, but clearly there are several posters that don't want to really rehash this debate. Heck, I'm even on the side of "something seems to be going wrong" and I'm not bothered by this. JO breaking down and Tinsley's pseudo-injuries have us more sensitive to the issue.

Troy and Dun both had nagging injuries in Golden State for example. TJ obviously had injury fears coming into this season and I sure don't see threads about the wonderful miracle the trainers have done to keep him on court most of the year. No one mentions the fact that JO had just as many nagging issues in Toronto.

It seems bad but I think we are just myopic. I think it's easy to ignore the fact that guys have missed time in LA (um, Bynum anyone) and Boston just the same as they've missed here. Do we really need to say "Arenas" to make a point.

Trader Joe
03-11-2009, 05:49 PM
Look I'm not trying to pin all the blame on our training staff, but we had countless people on the board screaming that this would happen. I'd just like to see some sort of a sign that our training staff is doing something right. We rarely have huge devastating injuries (Dun being excluded for now since that condition existed prior to him being a Pacer), but we get these little injuries that turn into nagging injuries all the time. Maybe that's not entirely the trainer's fault, maybe they are telling Obie and the players and they aren't listening (and if that is the case then that is unacceptable), but maybe not. I'm just saying it seems so many times we say, the players will play no matter what the trainers say, and that just is not an acceptable answer for me. It's not like he would have been missing the NBA finals for crying out loud.

duke dynamite
03-11-2009, 06:05 PM
What do you want them to do, videoblog their day? I still don't think there is any way to hold the training staff accountable.

Trader Joe
03-12-2009, 01:01 PM
What do you want them to do, videoblog their day? I still don't think there is any way to hold the training staff accountable.

No, but I want them to actually take a stand about a player's health for once. That is THEIR job, and it should be their call on whether a player is playing or not. Otherwise what are they on salary for? Might as well just go to a third party whenever someone gets hurt if you just want a diagnosis and not day to day instructions on how to handle the injury.

duke dynamite
03-12-2009, 01:07 PM
No, but I want them to actually take a stand about a player's health for once. That is THEIR job, and it should be their call on whether a player is playing or not. Otherwise what are they on salary for? Might as well just go to a third party whenever someone gets hurt if you just want a diagnosis and not day to day instructions on how to handle the injury.

Player gets injured during game.

Trainer: "Well, this looks somewhat serious, sit out for the rest of the game, we are going to the doctor tomorrow."

Doctor to training staff: "Player cannot play. Until that time, here are some instructions on rehabbing the injury. This injury should last X long until he can practice, play, or what have you."

Training Staff to coach/media: "The player is out. Tests came back with said injury. The time table is X."

Trader Joe
03-12-2009, 01:10 PM
Player gets injured during game.

Trainer: "Well, this looks somewhat serious, sit out for the rest of the game, we are going to the doctor tomorrow."

Doctor to training staff: "Player cannot play."

Training Staff to coach/media: "The player is out."

I don't see your point here...I'm not talking about during a game.

Whatever, it's not worth arguing. I'm the bad guy trying to pin it on the innocent trainers (which isn't even my whole point).

Some of you won't pin any blame on anyone and some of you pin blame on everyone. Those of us that try to figure out why something is going wrong just get piled on to.

duke dynamite
03-12-2009, 01:15 PM
I don't see your point here...I'm not talking about during a game.

Whatever, it's not worth arguing. I'm the bad guy trying to pin it on the innocent trainers (which isn't even my whole point).

Some of you won't pin any blame on anyone and some of you pin blame on everyone. Those of us that try to figure out why something is going wrong just get piled on to.
My question is, what are you wanting them to take responsibility for???

They can do everything with the equipment and tests they have and do, but if a player is going to tell them that they feel like they can play, let them. The trainer is there to make sure they are in the best shape possible. I have a hard time believing that the trainers know more, say about Danny's body than he does himself.

Trader Joe
03-12-2009, 01:20 PM
My question is, what are you wanting them to take responsibility for???

I want them to be able to influence the players and coaches. There are either two things going on...

A.) Either our trainers aren't really thinking all this through. (I doubt this is happening)

or

B.) The coaches and players aren't listening to the trainers.

There was zero reason for Danny not to sit out before the all star break. You had people on the board worrying openly that him favoring his knee which he was clearly doing, would lead to an injury somewhere else. And what happens? He hurts his foot. Now, I have to give the trainers the benefit of the doubt and assume that they also thought about this, and I also probably need to give them the benefit of the doubt that they told Obie and Danny this could happen. Now, I'm HOPING that they advised them that Danny should probably sit out for a week or two and get back to 100%. If they did that, I think that the coaches and players should have to listen. This isn't high school or even college this is pro sports where it is a business and everyone has their role. In pro sports, I believe that the trainers should be the final word on whether or not a player plays. It didn't take a doctor to see that Danny was favoring his knee in a big way before the all star break.

Since86
03-12-2009, 01:21 PM
Otherwise what are they on salary for? Might as well just go to a third party whenever someone gets hurt if you just want a diagnosis and not day to day instructions on how to handle the injury.

Like I've already explained fifty thousand times before.

THAT ALREADY HAPPENS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Please, do a favor and read this. We might even need to sticky it.


Sport or athletic trainers are part of the allied health profession, and work in a variety of ways to either help athletes heal from injuries or to help prevent injuries from occurring while athletes practice or compete. In the US, in order to be an athletic trainer you must complete a minimum of a bachelorís degree in athletic training. Many people in this field also hold masterís degrees and PhDs. After completing the minimum college requirements, the athletic trainer must take examinations in the US to become board certified.
An athletic trainer could work in the following settings:


Sports medicine clinics
Privately with individual athletes
University sports programs
Junior high or high school sports programs
Amateur or professional sports teams
Teaching profession at the university level

The sports trainer tends to work alongside other medical professionals, and usually works with doctors, especially those who specialize in sports medicine. When an athlete is injured, the athletic trainer helps to carry out any plans and methods for healing injuries and hopefully helping athletes to continue their sports careers when they have fully healed. Depending upon the injury, athletic trainers may help bandage, tape, or use methods that allow the athlete to continue in their sport immediately. Alternately, they may work with athletes by helping them do rehabilitative activities, assessing them for ability to return to competition, and continuing to note any problems or progress the athlete is making during recovery.

Additionally, athletic trainers are on hand in most sports programs to evaluate exercises (http://www.wisegeek.com/what-does-an-athletic-trainer-do.htm#) and the sport itself in order to make sure injuries are kept to a minimum. Just as an occupational therapist might help to sort out the most ergonomic (http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-ergonomic.htm) ways for people to complete repetitive work, the sports trainer evaluates the type of exercises and movements in sport in order to determine whether certain exercises or activities pose potential risk of injury. With sports coaches, an athletic trainer may evolve safe exercise (http://www.wisegeek.com/what-does-an-athletic-trainer-do.htm#) regimens for athletes. They also can educate athletes on avoiding certain pitfalls/activities that might easily result in injuries.

When an athletic trainer works for a sports team or school, he or she is usually present at sporting events (http://www.wisegeek.com/what-does-an-athletic-trainer-do.htm#), which can mean traveling may be part of the job. The trainer maintains supplies of basic first aid equipment, and any rehabilitative equipment that might be needed at home or on the road. He may be in charge of making sure inventory (http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-inventory.htm) of all needed items remains stable, and may be required to order new supplies.

When an athlete is injured, the trainer may work like a case manager (http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-a-manager.htm), contacting all medical providers that the athlete will need to see, like doctors, physical therapists (http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-physical-therapy.htm), chiropractors, and orthopedic (http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-orthopedics.htm) specialists. The trainer may need to maintain records of an athleteís work with several specialists at once. This assures that all orders regarding recovery are integrated into rehabilitative exercise plans.
<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
http://www.wisegeek.com/what-does-an-athletic-trainer-do.htm
(Sorry, no author)

Trainers, for the most part, are NOT doctors. They don't determine when or if surgery is needed.

Trader Joe
03-12-2009, 01:22 PM
They can do everything with the equipment and tests they have and do, but if a player is going to tell them that they feel like they can play, let them. The trainer is there to make sure they are in the best shape possible. I have a hard time believing that the trainers know more, say about Danny's body than he does himself.

We have doctors on staff, Duke. Some players are going to say they can play with their left nut dragging along the floor and their foot bent to the right at a 90 degree angle, that doesn't mean you should let them.

Trader Joe
03-12-2009, 01:25 PM
Like I've already explained fifty thousand times before.

THAT ALREADY HAPPENS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Please, do a favor and read this. We might even need to sticky it.


http://www.wisegeek.com/what-does-an-athletic-trainer-do.htm
(Sorry, no author)

Trainers, for the most part, are NOT doctors. They don't determine when or if surgery is needed.

Yes, I know they go to third parties, but unless this has changed recently, the Pacers have always had a doctor(s) on staff. In the 90's, it was Dr. Kunkel. Now maybe they got rid of that position because I know he is no longer with the team, but I was under the impression that they just replaced him with someone new. If they got rid of the position entirely then that might explain some of what I'm complaining about.

EDIT: You're probably right that I shouldn't be using the word "trainers" as much when I'm complaining. I'm trying to find out who the team doctor(s) is right now.

duke dynamite
03-12-2009, 01:26 PM
We have doctors on staff, Duke. Some players are going to say they can play with their left nut dragging along the floor and their foot bent to the right at a 90 degree angle, that doesn't mean you should let them.
Okay, but what happened to these "external" or out-of-state physicians these players see?

I don't feel...nevermind.

Trader Joe
03-12-2009, 01:31 PM
Okay, but what happened to these "external" or out-of-state physicians these players see?

I don't feel...nevermind.

Look it's really not worth it to argue about it. It's clear that I share a differing opinion from the most of you. I respect Since's expert knowledge on the athletic training profession, but I'm looking at this from a business/organizational structure perspective. In other words, who gets to tell who what's going to happen.

I'm not suggesting that we drive to Conseco with pitchforks and tar and feather anyone who treats our players, but at the same time these nagging injuries that just hang around this franchise are becoming a little tiresome.

What really grinds me about this is that, there were multiple people on here saying that this could/would happen from Danny favoring the knee.

I'm just looking for a little accountability and I really don't think that is too much to ask for.

Since86
03-12-2009, 01:33 PM
We have doctors on staff, Duke. Some players are going to say they can play with their left nut dragging along the floor and their foot bent to the right at a 90 degree angle, that doesn't mean you should let them.

Coming back from an injury is tricky. You go by what the players are telling you.

If you tell them to give you a percentage on how they feel, they will inflate it. Obviously. It's not a science to be able to judge on how much they do.

If a player, like Danny, is telling you they are good to go then how can you say they are not? The players are ultimately responsible if they come back to quickly.

Every trainer knows that coming back too soon puts a high risk at reinjury or even another one. An ethic trainer wouldn't risk the health of a player, for 1 or 2 games. Sitting them 1 or 2 games longer gives almost a week, depending on the schedule, which a lot of time for a body to heal itself.

Injuries, like tendonitisis, is even trickier. One day the knee could be completely fine. They could have a great work out with no pain, or inflammation. The next day it could be the size of a grapefruit.

You can have weeks like that. Two weeks no problem, then bam, right back at the beginning.

duke dynamite
03-12-2009, 01:36 PM
Coming back from an injury is tricky. You go by what the players are telling you.

If you tell them to give you a percentage on how they feel, they will inflate it. Obviously. It's not a science to be able to judge on how much they do.

If a player, like Danny, is telling you they are good to go then how can you say they are not? The players are ultimately responsible if they come back to quickly.

Every trainer knows that coming back too soon puts a high risk at reinjury or even another one. An ethic trainer wouldn't risk the health of a player, for 1 or 2 games. Sitting them 1 or 2 games longer gives almost a week, depending on the schedule, which a lot of time for a body to heal itself.

Injuries, like tendonitisis, is even trickier. One day the knee could be completely fine. They could have a great work out with no pain, or inflammation. The next day it could be the size of a grapefruit.

You can have weeks like that. Two weeks no problem, then bam, right back at the beginning.
This is what I have been trying to say.

Indy, I am sorry if I rubbed you the wrong way with this, but I just feel that the training staff is not who we should be pointing the fingers at.

Since86
03-12-2009, 01:36 PM
What really grinds me about this is that, there were multiple people on here saying that this could/would happen from Danny favoring the knee.

To be honest, it's about like waking up every day and say it's going to be a bad day.

If it's not a bad day, then that's great news. If it is a bad day, you get to pat yourself on the back for being right.

Yes, it could happen. No one in their right mind would say it couldn't. Because it did happen, and there were people saying it was going too, doesn't make training staff less ept.

Trader Joe
03-12-2009, 01:40 PM
To be honest, it's about like waking up every day and say it's going to be a bad day.

If it's not a bad day, then that's great news. If it is a bad day, you get to pat yourself on the back for being right.

Yes, it could happen. No one in their right mind would say it couldn't. Because it did happen, and there were people saying it was going too, doesn't make training staff less ept.

I always try to set myself up for failure, that fall isn't as far. ;)

Again, I'm not questioning the ability of our medical staff to treat/diagnose something. I'm wondering how our power structure is arranged when it comes to injuries. I'll likely never know, and it's probably by the seat of everyone's pants, but it might help if it wasn't.

Since86
03-12-2009, 01:41 PM
I always try to set myself up for failure, that fall isn't as far. ;)

See we're polar opposites. My mantra is: Always shoot for the moon, because even if you miss, you'll be among the stars.

I know, I'm girlie.

Trader Joe
03-12-2009, 01:43 PM
See we're polar opposites. My mantra is: Always shoot for the moon, because even if you miss, you'll be among the stars.

I know, I'm girlie.

I'm like that sometimes, but when it comes to sports, I've been beaten down enough where I'm always waiting for the next shoe to drop...on my face.

duke dynamite
03-12-2009, 01:43 PM
See we're polar opposites. My mantra is: Always shoot for the moon, because even if you miss, you'll be among the stars.

I know, I'm girlie.
oooh la la

Naptown_Seth
03-12-2009, 02:21 PM
To not leave Indy hanging, I was there with Anthem and a few others that said "you can see this coming a mile away" and then it did.

So 86 is right about practical application but isn't there at least something to the casual fan thinking "we've seen this before" and being more right than the training staff in terms of what to expect?


What our point would be is that what TPTB are telling us isn't the full story, so you're basing your logic on what they say. We are basing it on thinking there's more there that we aren't being told that would change a trained medical opinion if it was known.

Teams have a desire to not fully disclose injury concerns. After awhile Pacers fans have come to recognize this. So we aren't evaluating the claimed injury, we are evaluating the truth behind the claim itself.

MagicRat
03-13-2009, 09:49 AM
From Kevin Lee's (apparently final) Indy Sports Insider blog on 1070thefan.com.....

http://www.1070thefan.com/insider/blogentry.aspx?BlogEntryID=10025244

The Pacers open up a 2-game road trip tonight in Atlanta (7:30 tip, 7:00 pregame). Danny Granger is likely to return tonight. On his radio show last night, Jim O'Brien said he thought Granger would play against the Hawks. Granger went through the full practice yesterday in Atlanta and O'Brien said Granger moved well, including laterally. O'Brien said he had about 90-95% mobility. He didn't shoot well and was pretty winded, but that was to expected. Granger has missed the last 10 games with a partially torn tendon in his foot. Yesterday was 3 weeks to the day of the original diagnosis - and the original prognosis was 10 days to 3 weeks. O'Brien wasn't certain if his minutes would be limited. If they are, it will be because of conditioning and not because of concern of reinjuring the foot.