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View Full Version : Post Game Thread - Pacers lose with a CP3 Clutch 3pt shot



CableKC
01-19-2009, 07:38 PM
In truth....the game was really lost cuz we poorly defended the corner pocket that Peja and Butler camped out at. Probably about a 1/3 of the points that the Hornets made were hit from that corner.

Granger was clutch for us and Ford played very poorly. Ford's such a hit and miss PG for us.....against some teams...he just owns the opposing team.....in others...like this game....he couldn't hit a shot and made many mistakes.

Discuss....

duke dynamite
01-19-2009, 07:39 PM
Perimeter defense needs some work.

Good job to Danny.

Evan_The_Dude
01-19-2009, 07:42 PM
I already knew what was going to happen when the Hornets had the ball with 2.5 left on the clock. But once again Great Great Great shot by Danny he's truly a beast out there.

Unclebuck
01-19-2009, 07:45 PM
Was able to watch the whole game on LP.

Sure the perimeter defense needs some work, but remember Chris Paul is almost impossible to stop for very good defensive teams, we tried to trap him on the pick and rolls, but he was able to split almost everytime so the corners were wide open.

Interestingly, Granger was guarding Paul on the last play but Granger was picked off after Paul got the ball so Murph had to pick him up and that was bad news right there.

The Hornets really played great defrense in the second half - that IMO was the difference in the game. Pacers defense tonight wasn't bad

MiaDragon
01-19-2009, 07:45 PM
Its rough to be a Pacer fan right about now....

duke dynamite
01-19-2009, 07:47 PM
Was able to watch the whole game on LP.

Sure the perimeter defense needs some work, but remember Chris Paul is almost impossible to stop for very good defensive teams, we tried to trap him on the pick and rolls, but he was able to split almost everytime so the corners were wide open.

Interestingly, Granger was guarding Paul on the last play but Granger was picked off after Paul got the ball so Murph had to pick him up and that was bad news right there.

The Hornets really played great defrense in the second half - that IMO was the difference in the game. Pacers defense tonight was bad
That's right. We had an appointment later in the second half, so had to leave. I was following it on ESPN on my iPhone. I knew that something was going to keep the game from going into extra innings.

Can't put them down for making it a game, though.

Peter_sixtyftsixin
01-19-2009, 07:48 PM
Its rough to be a Pacer fan right about now....

Yeah, it is, but I think things are still moving forward, even if we have to deal with losses like these.

CableKC
01-19-2009, 07:49 PM
After the 3rd QTR.....Diener, Dunleavy and Graham made a good solid run for us. We made very little mistakes after Ford sat. Ford is really good at dribbling around everyone in circles...even ending up inside the paint and directly underneath the basket....but half the time, once he gets there...he often coughs the ball up, gets his shot rejected or has no clue what to do with the ball once he's there.

Also, I'm guessing that JO'B has settled on his 8-man rotation. I'm not one for giving players like Hibbert minutes for the sake of it....but in the 4th QTR, CP3 hit 3 or 4 shots in a row where he simply split his defenders, skipped into the lane and layed it up in front of the basket. It would have been nice if we actually had a shot blocker or someone that was really tall....oh...I don't konw...maybe someone that was 7'2" with a tall wingspan that can stand in his way to try and block or at least alter his shot.

Murphy wasn't very effective in the 4th QTR.....I would really be interested in what his 4th QTR Stats are compared to his 1st 3 QTR Stats.....I would bet that the vast majority of his points that he makes in the season are made in the 1st 3 QTRs and he tends to miss more in the 4th QTR. He simply couldn't buy a shot against the likes of Sean Marks or Melving Ely.

speakout4
01-19-2009, 07:49 PM
Rookies aren't getting even a few minutes.

duke dynamite
01-19-2009, 07:51 PM
Rookies aren't getting even a few minutes.
The whole point of benching your young guys to win out...

count55
01-19-2009, 07:51 PM
It would have been nice if we actually had a shot blocker or someone that was really tall....oh...I don't konw...maybe someone that was 7'2" with a tall wingspan that can stand in his way to try and block or at least alter his shot.

Yes, and I'm sure Paul would've appreciated the And-1's.

Roaming Gnome
01-19-2009, 07:51 PM
What can you say about CP-3 making the shot?

I know I got tired of hearing how the ball was "kicked" by TJ Ford on his steal. It appeared that CP-3 dribbled the ball off of TJ's foot. Is that still considered a "kicked ball"?

Kemo
01-19-2009, 07:53 PM
It would have been nice if we actually had a shot blocker or someone that was really tall....oh...I don't konw...maybe someone that was 7'2" with a tall wingspan that can stand in his way to try and block or at least alter his shot.



+100

Also.. anyone notice that Brandon wasn't even listed in the box score as a DNP-CD ??

Inactive Pacers: McRoberts , Rush , Tinsley

I think it is VERY ridiculous that Hibbert starts for us and does a pretty stand-up job the last 3 or 4 games he played, then he disappears into nowhere land ...

It just doesn't make sense to me..

LG33
01-19-2009, 07:53 PM
I don't think we're going to make the playoffs.

duke dynamite
01-19-2009, 07:54 PM
What can you say about CP-3 making the shot?

I know I got tired of hearing how the ball was "kicked" by TJ Ford on his steal. It appeared that CP-3 dribbled the ball off of TJ's foot. Is that still considered a "kicked ball"?
Their commentators were just plain classless. They tended to complain, too when the tempo swung into our favor.

count55
01-19-2009, 07:56 PM
What can you say about CP-3 making the shot?

I know I got tired of hearing how the ball was "kicked" by TJ Ford on his steal. It appeared that CP-3 dribbled the ball off of TJ's foot. Is that still considered a "kicked ball"?

No, that's not a kicked ball. It has to be intentional.

BPump33
01-19-2009, 07:58 PM
You know, when we got the ball back down by three I had a really good feeling that Danny would come through. Just having that feeling back from the Reggie days is nice. I'm not putting Danny's clutchness in the same league as Reggie's, but it's nice to know we have someone that can deliver.

However, with 2.5 seconds left I also knew that CP3 would find a way to kill us. I want to be happy about Danny's progression, but our terrible, terrible defense is just so damn painful to watch.

BRushWithDeath
01-19-2009, 07:58 PM
Their commentators were just plain classless. They tended to complain, too when the tempo swung into our favor.

Give me a break. Our commentators (and every other local group) do the exact same thing. It's in their best interest. The vast majority of their viewers will be Hornets fans.

CableKC
01-19-2009, 07:59 PM
Yes, and I'm sure Paul would've appreciated the And-1's.
Believe me, I'm not saying that I want Hibbert in just cuz I want him to get more minutes.... but when CP3 is continually hitting that "split the defenders,drive to the FT line and lay it up to the hoop" shot...I would hope that we get a shotblocker or at least someone with a long frame in there to try to alter his shot and path to the hoop.

I would much rather have him drive to the hoop and run into Hibbert and his tall frame then have him take an uncontested shot with Murphy protecting the paint.

BRushWithDeath
01-19-2009, 08:00 PM
I don't think we're going to make the playoffs.

How anyone could think that since beyond maybe the 10th game of the season is beyond me.

Kuq_e_Zi91
01-19-2009, 08:02 PM
I don't think we're going to make the playoffs.

If we're not making the playoffs and we're not developing the young guys, what in the world are we doing?

BRushWithDeath
01-19-2009, 08:03 PM
If we're not making the playoffs and we're not developing the young guys, what in the world are we doing?

Wasting a year.

CableKC
01-19-2009, 08:03 PM
I don't think we're going to make the playoffs.
We're not going to if Ford plays like this every game. The game wasn't lost cuz of Ford.....it's cuz of our inability to properly defend that corner pocket 3pt shot.....but he has to really step up and play right if we stand any chance of making it.

duke dynamite
01-19-2009, 08:05 PM
Give me a break. Our commentators (and every other local group) do the exact same thing. It's in their best interest. The vast majority of their viewers will be Hornets fans.
Yeah, Chris and the rest are Biased, but they aren't jerks. Either way, they were throwing things out there that weren't necessary and just plain uncolorful.

Roaming Gnome
01-19-2009, 08:08 PM
Their commentators were just plain classless. They tended to complain, too when the tempo swung into our favor.

Actually, I will disagree with you. Until recently, I've always had league pass and enjoyed listening to their broadcast. I feel they are very fair, most times. As for your irritation...I think you misunderstood when it was being brought up that our big men were cheating. It meant cheating away from the men they were guarding... Not cheating the game.

dannygranger
01-19-2009, 08:10 PM
I didnt read all of the posts but I do see some of you saying its hard to be a Pacer fan right about now. I have to disagree. We have a great player in the making we get to see every game and get to see come of age. We are practically in every game at the end and thats all you ask for. Sure our record isn't the greatest, but as a fan winning isn't everything to me. In professional sports the talent is so good and the competition is so fierce that its a very rewarding experience to win one game. I like the team for the most part. I like where we are headed.

Roaming Gnome
01-19-2009, 08:11 PM
If we're not making the playoffs and we're not developing the young guys, what in the world are we doing?

Wishing that 30-something wins gets us into the play-offs.

Unclebuck
01-19-2009, 08:16 PM
If we're not making the playoffs and we're not developing the young guys, what in the world are we doing?



There are more than just those two options.

Like for example - 1) develop Granger 2) see if the veterans on this team can be a good team. 3) increase the trade value of some of the vets. 4) try to win every game they can this season, thereby developing a wining attitude for later this season and next

MiaDragon
01-19-2009, 08:18 PM
How anyone could think that since beyond maybe the 10th game of the season is beyond me.

Thank you.

Peter_sixtyftsixin
01-19-2009, 08:24 PM
I didnt read all of the posts but I do see some of you saying its hard to be a Pacer fan right about now. I have to disagree. We have a great player in the making we get to see every game and get to see come of age. We are practically in every game at the end and thats all you ask for. Sure our record isn't the greatest, but as a fan winning isn't everything to me. In professional sports the talent is so good and the competition is so fierce that its a very rewarding experience to win one game. I like the team for the most part. I like where we are headed.

I completely agree, when I followed up with quoting that earlier I was just adding that it's hard sometimes to continually have your heart ripped out of your chest.

The Pacers have always been my team, and are built into my love for Indiana and Indianapolis. It's never really hard to be a Pacers fan, but sometimes you do get sick of dying more than living with a team.

Also, I think it's still completely possible for us to make the playoffs. The East is a very even conference once you get past Cleveland, Orlando and Boston. Since Dunleavy has returned we've been heading in a better direction. I'm not saying it's a fact we will, but I'm not anywhere close to ruling it out yet. I could be wrong, but for now I'll remain high on the best drug in the world...hope.

Justin Tyme
01-19-2009, 08:25 PM
I'm really upset! The game was played this afternoon. I believe this is the 1st game this season that was televised I've missed. Dadgumit.

If I had known, I could have just looked at the last 3 minutes or so and seen the SOS as always from the sound and results of how the game went... little "D" and allowed the opposition to score 100 plus points.

Well, the Pacers are now .500 now after JO'B's comment about him and Bird are in 100% agreement of being in win mode. 3 out of the next 4 games are going to be tuff to win, so maybe the 3 after that are what they are counting on winning. I'm not even upset or frustrated over the results of this game, b/c I have just come to expect a close game ending in a loss. Oh well, the Spurs tomorrow with George Hill.

Doddage
01-19-2009, 08:26 PM
I don't think we're going to make the playoffs.
Can you go any more out on a limb?

Roaming Gnome
01-19-2009, 08:27 PM
There are more than just those two options.

Like for example - 1) develop Granger 2) see if the veterans on this team can be a good team. 3) increase the trade value of some of the vets. 4) try to win every game they can this season, thereby developing a wining attitude for later this season a next

Actually, I don't disagree with you. I just feel there is a place for slipping some minutes to the young guys too. Not major minutes, but maybe token minutes consistently, so they can continue to get the speed of the game down. That is not going to happen in practice or on the pine.

Justin Tyme
01-19-2009, 08:29 PM
what in the world are we doing?

From the looks of it, Bird and JO'B are in 'job salvage mode."

bnd45
01-19-2009, 08:33 PM
Danny Granger has become *Danny Granger, one of the NBA's best players* in the last 12 days. He been great all year, but the last couple of weeks he's become a superstar.

01/07- buzzer beater to beat the Suns
01/11- drops 42 and drills huge 3 with 25 seconds to give the Pacers a lead
01/14- drills jumper over Prince to send game into OT
01/19- another 30 point game and hits 3 with 2 seconds to tie it

bnd45
01-19-2009, 08:34 PM
Did Daniels come back too soon and re-injure himself?

Why only 3 minutes?

D23
01-19-2009, 08:41 PM
:suicide5:

MiaDragon
01-19-2009, 08:56 PM
All I can say is thank god BRush and Hibbert didnt get the chance to mess this one up for us..........

BlueNGold
01-19-2009, 09:15 PM
From the looks of it, Bird and JO'B are in 'job salvage mode."

This is not the year to be concerned, particularly for Bird who is not going anywhere anytime soon. Next year is the year JOb will be judged...and he best be playing his young players to help him next year when he really needs it.

BRushWithDeath
01-19-2009, 09:44 PM
At least Foster has an early lead in the team's bad facial hair contest.

Hicks
01-19-2009, 10:01 PM
The Hornets announcers were saying that the Pacers glaring need is at PG.

Considering how they all played today, it's hard to put up a loud argument.

I just want one PG who hits 99% of his layups.

dal9
01-19-2009, 10:13 PM
This is not the year to be concerned, particularly for Bird who is not going anywhere anytime soon.



wouldn't count on it, esp if his 08 draft picks don't start bringing something to the plate soon.

Peter_sixtyftsixin
01-19-2009, 10:18 PM
At least Foster has an early lead in the team's bad facial hair contest.

No question.

BRushWithDeath
01-19-2009, 10:22 PM
wouldn't count on it, esp if his 08 draft picks don't start bringing something to the plate soon.

It's hard to bring something to the table when you don't step on the court.

JBones19
01-19-2009, 10:23 PM
The Hornets announcers were saying that the Pacers glaring need is at PG.

Considering how they all played today, it's hard to put up a loud argument.

I just want one PG who hits 99% of his layups.

On a side note, I thought the Hornets announcers were absolutely horrible. They seemed to both have a very minimal basketball IQ (compared to Denari and Quin/Clark combo), they made stupid jokes all game, and at moments were just out right annoying or blatantly wrong with what they were saying.

At one point one of the announcers was saying how he liked Murph's offensive game but he was just a scorer and isn't a good rebounder and needed to work on that, moments later, the other announcer (after a Murphy rebound) noted that Troy is 5th in rebounds in the league and avgs a double-double. The same announcer also said that steal by TJ at the end on Paul shouldn't have happened because the ball went off of Ford's toe. Maybe I'm wrong, but if the ball handler dribbles the ball off the defenders foot while it's on the ground the ball is still live and it's not a "kick" right?

Oh well, I will watch and listen with much more respect and appreciation for Denari and Buck/Kellogg next game!

idioteque
01-19-2009, 10:31 PM
. I knew that something was going to keep the game from going into extra innings.



Reb Porter is REALLY having an effect on you. :D :-p

CableKC
01-19-2009, 10:39 PM
The Hornets announcers were saying that the Pacers glaring need is at PG.

Considering how they all played today, it's hard to put up a loud argument.

I just want one PG who hits 99% of his layups.
I can't argue with that.....Ford isn't a really finisher around the hoop.

dal9
01-19-2009, 10:53 PM
It's hard to bring something to the table when you don't step on the court.

im working with the assumption that O'Brien is not just benching the rookies for fun...

(not that they have looked that horrible to me when they played, but there are a good number of rookies this year with better #s at least)

Pacersfan46
01-19-2009, 10:59 PM
At one point one of the announcers was saying how he liked Murph's offensive game but he was just a scorer and isn't a good rebounder and needed to work on that, moments later, the other announcer (after a Murphy rebound) noted that Troy is 5th in rebounds in the league and avgs a double-double.

They weren't bad at all, but as far as what you quoted, you just heard what you wanted to hear, or tuned out what was said.

They were comparing Murphy to a former player he was coached by at Notre Dame. They said Murphy reminded him of his old coach, except his old coach was a TOUGHER rebounder, and defender. The 2nd announcer then mentioned his ranking in rebounding total, and the 1st announcer then mentioned that you can get a good number of rebounds without them being the TOUGH ones. Which is true.

I think too many of you are far too touchy because they weren't saying what you wanted to hear. Honestly. Didn't matter if it was true or not.

-- Steve --

Unclebuck
01-19-2009, 11:26 PM
The Hornets announcers were saying that the Pacers glaring need is at PG.

Considering how they all played today, it's hard to put up a loud argument.

I just want one PG who hits 99% of his layups.

Yeah, I was less than impresed with those announcer's besides being very annoying and I guess trying to be funny - their knowledge of the Pacers was less than impresive

BlueNGold
01-19-2009, 11:26 PM
The Hornets announcers were saying that the Pacers glaring need is at PG.

I would say the same thing if I watched CP3 all the time.

I'm not even a fan of Jack and Ford. I know they're not that good. But PG is not our most glaring need. What IS glaring is the dearth of athleticism on the interior.

When healthy, Ford is an average starting PG...or at least above the bottom quarter. Jack is borderline starting material. If you add Diener to the mix, I think we are doing just fine at that position.

I do wonder what these announcers would have said about us last year.

BlueNGold
01-19-2009, 11:32 PM
wouldn't count on it, esp if his 08 draft picks don't start bringing something to the plate soon.

I guess you are free to use your imagination. IMO, Bird's job is not even close to being in jeopardy...particularly after the JO trade. I think his job is more solid than it was right after he took over control from Walsh.

pacergod2
01-19-2009, 11:39 PM
There is a lot to be happy about this Pacer season. We have a team headed in the right direction. We as "hardcore" fans put so much of our pride and emotion into these games, it makes the disappointment difficult to deal with and we revert to negativity. I love that we are so competitive and I don't sit there and say oh we are going to lose. We compete with every team in this league and that is amazing for a team that is on the rise like ours.

I am one of the biggest of proponents of playing Rush, Hibbert, and McRoberts spot minutes with the best guys. I feel like one of the three should be on the floor with the veterans and not be subjected to playing in a lineup of more than one person outside of the top 8 in our rotation. Give them each ten minutes with the core players to let them get into a rhythm. There is less pressure and they don't kill you as much. Why did Toronto come back in that game. Because they decided to take everybody out and go with a garbage lineup just long enough for Toronto make up a 24 point lead. That is terrible coaching IMO. I really like JOB on a lot of fronts but I don't think he is comfortable with a rotation. I really think that this month we won't see much of our rookies. I feel like they are going to take a hard look at the veterans as someone mentioned and will decide what holes we have based on the players we are looking to keep. We are going to see a trade before the deadline I feel or else we would be continuing to see our rookies more than we are. There is no reason Baston should be on our active roster over McRoberts, but you know Baston will probably be a filler contract in a deal and might need to show something in some spot minutes between now and the deadline.

I think after February 15th, we will see a focus on developing our rookies. Another month from now we will be even more of a long-shot to make the playoffs, and they will have made whatever adjustments to our roster that they can. At that point, if they don't make the adjustments to our in-game rotations, there will be cause for concern. As for right now, I am glad we are seeing our coaching staff going after it, not playing the rookies much, and attempting to see what this team has as it is currently constructed. I will put my dire hopefulness to see our rooks develop on the back burner, because I trust that Larry and JOB are "on the same page". If there is no trade, and more importantly no adjustments after we call it quits for a playoff run, then there will be a time to complain. Right now, take the close games we have played with this league's elite and appreciate them. I had my heart broken today too, but I am very happy this team had the guts to bring it back from a 7 point deficit late in the game. GO PACERS!!!!

Anthem
01-19-2009, 11:43 PM
Interestingly, Granger was guarding Paul on the last play but Granger was picked off after Paul got the ball so Murph had to pick him up and that was bad news right there.
Yeah, I was screaming at my TV on that one. .8 seconds left on the clock and Murph is backing off like he's worried CP3's gonna drive. Get up on, dude!

jeffg-body
01-19-2009, 11:43 PM
The Hornets announcers were saying that the Pacers glaring need is at PG.

Considering how they all played today, it's hard to put up a loud argument.

I just want one PG who hits 99% of his layups.

I have to agree there. I think they are getting "Travis Best Syndrome". They pull off a great move to the basket and tank the lay up.

JBones19
01-19-2009, 11:43 PM
They weren't bad at all, but as far as what you quoted, you just heard what you wanted to hear, or tuned out what was said.

They were comparing Murphy to a former player he was coached by at Notre Dame. They said Murphy reminded him of his old coach, except his old coach was a TOUGHER rebounder, and defender. The 2nd announcer then mentioned his ranking in rebounding total, and the 1st announcer then mentioned that you can get a good number of rebounds without them being the TOUGH ones. Which is true.

I think too many of you are far too touchy because they weren't saying what you wanted to hear. Honestly. Didn't matter if it was true or not.

-- Steve --

I remember them comparing Murph to that other player, but the rebounding comment I heard was definitely at a different point in the game. I understand that when you are listening to the opposing teams announcers' they probably will say things about your team you don't agree with, that's part of being a die-hard fan for your team. I just felt they didn't do a very good job and I found them to very annoying :) JMO

duke dynamite
01-20-2009, 12:21 AM
Reb Porter is REALLY having an effect on you. :D :-p
LOL, yeah. I did that because I know there are few that do not like it.

duke dynamite
01-20-2009, 12:25 AM
Actually, I will disagree with you. Until recently, I've always had league pass and enjoyed listening to their broadcast. I feel they are very fair, most times. As for your irritation...I think you misunderstood when it was being brought up that our big men were cheating. It meant cheating away from the men they were guarding... Not cheating the game.
No, I made it clear in the game thread that I knew what they were talking about. I may have worded it to make it sound like that. Sorry about that.

Pacers4Life
01-20-2009, 12:39 AM
How anyone could think that since beyond maybe the 10th game of the season is beyond me.

I want to get better, really I do. And a better pick is the most obvious way to do it, young talent, a better trading piece, what have you. But I still can't help to want nothing more than to be in the post season, borrowing from the Arizona Cardinals here, with a chance to "shock the world."
I don't know the exact number but I think we're like 4 1/2 games out of 8th or something...still very doable

McKeyFan
01-20-2009, 01:05 AM
Why is Murphy even in on the last play? Aren't there a few better defenders we could have put in?

Kuq_e_Zi91
01-20-2009, 01:11 AM
Why is Murphy even in on the last play? Aren't there a few better defenders we could have put in?

Diener was in on the play as well. With Granger guarding CP, there was a mismatch waiting to happen if Granger didn't get picked off.

dal9
01-20-2009, 01:23 AM
yeah, ive noticed deiner being out there on D, on the last play in a game before (i forget which one). strange. murphy, too.

what's the best five defensively? of those active tonight, maybe Foster, Rasho, Marquis, Granger, and Jack? We really have a hard time coming up w even five competent defenders.

McBob and Rush (and Batson?) are reasonably good on D, but were inactive. If Marquis is not available, then I dont know who I'd put in. Dunleavy? Graham? No great options really. Its unclear that Rasho is much better than Murphy, even, to me.

Peck
01-20-2009, 05:14 AM
I'm going to add a couple of very rushed thoughts on this game.

1. I have no idea what some of you are talking about, I thought the N.O. announcing team was outstanding. I did not find them to be over homerish at all and in fact I thought that they went out of thier way to compliment several of our players. Granger obviously but he is from there but they talked about Foster, Jack and others as well. What they said about Murphy was to me absolutely correct, he is a great rebounder but not a tough rebounder. I see nothing wrong with that and in fact I agree, throw Foster in that statement and they would be absolutelye correct. I still like Dennari and Kellog better but I thought that they were very good.

2. I'm sick of seeing Jack on the floor. Sorry I like Jack and I wanted him on the team. But O'Briens absolute over use of him is killing me. There is no way on God's green earth that this guy should be getting 40 min on the floor and he get's that more than he doesn't.

3. I just wish Jim would let his inner small man out and do what he wants to truely do and put Graham as the center. If O'Brien thought he could get away with a 6'6" and under lineup he would do it. I don't want to hear anything about trying to match up with other teams when they go small because I have now heard enough other coach's say they have to go small to match us. I figure some day we will have Diener, Ford, Jack, Daniels, Granger and Graham on the floor.

I HATE SMALL BALL. Yes, I know he doesn't have a lot to work with but still.

4. Chris Paul is an amazing point guard. After now seeing him play several times I am now back peddling on my thoughts of him vs. Derron Williams. I have always thought Williams was the better player, now I freely admit I was wrong on that one.

5. I do not blame Troy Murphy for his defense on the Paul shot. He got caught on a rotation and he was cutting back to stop Paul from driving, which he did. As soon as he saw Chris pull up for the shot he tried to recover and get a hand up but it was to late. Would Bruce Bowen have done a better job? Yes, Artest as well. But Troy did the best he could do and in fact took away Chris first option. He just hit a great shot.

6. Moral victory's mean nothing anymore. I'm not sure they ever did, but since we have decided to win now losing, no matter to who no matter how much, means nothing since our rookies all got benched with no time. I actually believe Jim when he say's that Larry is on board for this because I have a feeling that Larry thought we would have a better record than this and that he feels he has to try and make the playoffs for the locals. I think he is underestimating us but I also understand. However I still hold to the fact that if O'Brien thinks that this is the lineup to win with then he needs to be held accountable for that.

7. The N.O. guys said we needed a point guard and as far as I'm concerned they are right. Look I still love both trades but neither of these guys are the answer (no I do not want Iverson either) I really hope that Larry is looking toward the p.g. for the future because IMO we are still very very weak there.

Mourning
01-20-2009, 05:52 AM
I'm proud of our players. I think, considering the team we have, we did a good job. It's not like we get blown out regularly and we have gotten a number of nail-biting endings going our way aswell. Not enough, but the team rightnow just isn't that great and in rebuilding, so let's keep things a little in perspective.

deekay85
01-20-2009, 05:55 AM
Yeah, I was less than impresed with those announcer's besides being very annoying and I guess trying to be funny - their knowledge of the Pacers was less than impresive

"Pacers, one of the worst rebounding teams in the nba" :confused::confused::censored:

RPG

1. Lakers 43.97
2. Dallas 43.95
3. Indiana 43.92
.
.
.
29. NOH 38.84 :jump:

Mourning
01-20-2009, 06:03 AM
I figure some day we will have Diener, Ford, Jack, Daniels, Granger and Graham on the floor.

I hope not! Six guys on the floor at the sametime seems like one too many... maybe we would get away with it against the Celtics though ;) :).

duke dynamite
01-20-2009, 09:18 AM
"Pacers, one of the worst rebounding teams in the nba" :confused::confused::censored:

RPG

1. Lakers 43.97
2. Dallas 43.95
3. Indiana 43.92
.
.
.
29. NOH 38.84 :jump:
Excatly what I said when they made that statement...

Pacersfan46
01-20-2009, 09:59 AM
"Pacers, one of the worst rebounding teams in the nba" :confused::confused::censored:

RPG

1. Lakers 43.97
2. Dallas 43.95
3. Indiana 43.92
.
.
.
29. NOH 38.84 :jump:

That number is nothing more than a result of the pace we play at, and the number of shots that generally go to the rim in a game with the Pacers.

We also ALLOW the 4th most rebounds to our opponents in the NBA, which is what I'm sure they're referring to.

-- Steve --

Unclebuck
01-20-2009, 10:02 AM
5. I do not blame Troy Murphy for his defense on the Paul shot. He got caught on a rotation and he was cutting back to stop Paul from driving, which he did. As soon as he saw Chris pull up for the shot he tried to recover and get a hand up but it was to late. Would Bruce Bowen have done a better job? Yes, Artest as well. But Troy did the best he could do and in fact took away Chris first option. He just hit a great shot.



7. The N.O. guys said we needed a point guard and as far as I'm concerned they are right. Look I still love both trades but neither of these guys are the answer (no I do not want Iverson either) I really hope that Larry is looking toward the p.g. for the future because IMO we are still very very weak there.


I won't blame Troy - except to say that with the very limited amount of time on the clock, he should not have been trying to cut off the drive. (The ball was in the air with I think .5 on the clock), so he had no time to drive at all - Troy should have tried to make him drive. That was a mental mistake by Troy - not a physical one.

Sure we need a better point guard. I think point guard is by far the most important position on the floor, so sure, we need a better point guard. But then so do about 23 or 24 teams. If Ford can get healthy (and maybe he'll never be able to stay healthy) he is good enough - better than a good 50% of the starting point guards in the NBA. Overall with Ford, Jack and Diener, I don't think we are weak at point - sure it is quantity over quality.

Peck, I guess we disagree about the Hornets announcers - I don't care if they don't say nice things about our team, coaches, players, city - or anything and I don't expect them to really know our team that well - they only see us twice a year - I just thought they were very annoying - seemed like they were trying to be a comedy team - very fake if you ask me

Unclebuck
01-20-2009, 10:08 AM
I'm proud of our players. I think, considering the team we have, we did a good job. It's not like we get blown out regularly and we have gotten a number of nail-biting endings going our way aswell. Not enough, but the team rightnow just isn't that great and in rebuilding, so let's keep things a little in perspective.

I agree, look at the Suns last night being down by 30 in the first half - it happens every night, teams with far more talent than the Pacers lose by huge margins which means they didn't put forth the effort necessary to even be in the game. But the Pacers never get blown out - (exception was the game at Denver) Who deserves credit for that. The players, the coaches - obviously both. I'll repeat my mantra - effort keeps you in games - talent wins games.

Bball
01-20-2009, 10:13 AM
I hope not! Six guys on the floor at the sametime seems like one too many... maybe we would get away with it against the Celtics though ;) :).

I think Peck knows of a little known rule in the NBA where if the collective height of your players on the court doesn't equal 32.5' then you are allowed an extra player....

BillS
01-20-2009, 10:34 AM
So help me understand.

I had to listen to the game and missed the fourth quarter, so my thoughts are colored by that horrible 3rd quarter.

It sounds to me like the defense has stepped up and has been doing what it needed to do.

It sounds to me like the offense is working as far as getting people open looks - including layup and dunk opportunities.

It sounds to me like the problem <i>right now</i> is that no one is consistently able to convert those opportunities.

Why is our point-blank shooting so dismal?

Unclebuck
01-20-2009, 10:46 AM
So help me understand.

I had to listen to the game and missed the fourth quarter, so my thoughts are colored by that horrible 3rd quarter.

It sounds to me like the defense has stepped up and has been doing what it needed to do.

It sounds to me like the offense is working as far as getting people open looks - including layup and dunk opportunities.

It sounds to me like the problem <i>right now</i> is that no one is consistently able to convert those opportunities.

Why is our point-blank shooting so dismal?

to answer your question directly - we lack athleticism around the basket and we lack players that are good at finishing. I give the Hornets defense a lot of credit for our poor scoring third, they played really good defense, very aggressive and activre.

I thought our defense overall was pretty good yesterday - sure Paul was curving us up, but he does that to almost every team in the NBA (that is one reason why we went small, because anytime rasho was in the game the Hornets put Rasho in a pick and roll and abused him with Paul splitting Rasho's attempt at trapping

naptownmenace
01-20-2009, 11:06 AM
I have to agree there. I think they are getting "Travis Best Syndrome". They pull off a great move to the basket and tank the lay up.

That's an insult to Travis. He was a much better finisher at the rim than Jack but especially TJ. I really like TJ but I don't understand why he blows so many wide open layups. Between him and Foster I can't tell who's worse - and that's a major problem.

Anyway, Danny and Mike got us back into the game. I'm at the point now where I think that in the last 2 minutes of the game, only Danny and Mike should have the ball in their hands.

Despite the negativity, I do have to recognize that the Pacers once again put a scare in another good team. That's a positive sign and it really is indicative of how good Danny Granger is. Once this team adds some better talent and/or our rookies improve, we will be a very good basketball team.

Justin Tyme
01-20-2009, 11:24 AM
IMO, Bird's job is not even close to being in jeopardy.


IMO, Bird's contract will not be renewed after next season if things don't change. A 15-26 record and being the 7-8 worst team in the league just doesn't exactly say I'm doing a great job. To me a change of definate proportions has to take place for the Simons to keep Bird. Larry Legend PR has been used up.

I'm one of those that believe O'Brien was brought in to change the chemistry of the team, get them pointed in the right direction, and then after his contract is up he's gone. I also feel the same about Bird. He's not the GM to get the Pacers to the Promise Land. JMOAA

BillS
01-20-2009, 12:21 PM
to answer your question directly - we lack athleticism around the basket and we lack players that are good at finishing.

So, by "athleticism around the basket", what do you mean? Do we lack jumping ability by our slashers? Do we lack upper body flexibility to twist in funky directions? None of these are needed for open layups.

I think "good at finishing" is more on the nose, and I think it is more a style of play issue than athleticism as such. I think what we have is a bunch of guys who do not like to drive hard "past the rim" - they'll get to the rim and then finish soft rather than following through.

To me, that isn't so much athletic ability as it is the proper <i>use</i> of athletic ability.

NuffSaid
01-20-2009, 07:14 PM
Yeah, I was screaming at my TV on that one. .8 seconds left on the clock and Murph is backing off like he's worried CP3's gonna drive. Get up on, dude!
I did the same thing! I couldn't believe Murphy didn't play him straight-up! There was just no way CP3 was going to drive the lane and even if he did the refs wouldn't have called a foul, not unless it was extremely obvious!

Something else that nagged at me during that play and I hate to sound like a sore loser, but at the risk of such did anyone else notice that the game clock didn't restart as soon as CP3 caught the ball? He was able to dribble the ball before the clock even started running!

BPump33
01-20-2009, 07:17 PM
I did the same thing! I couldn't believe Murphy didn't play him straight-up! There was just no way CP3 was going to drive the lane and even if he did the refs wouldn't have called a foul, not unless it was extremely obvious!

Something else that nagged at me during that play and I hate to sound like a sore loser, but at the risk of such did anyone else notice that the game clock didn't restart as soon as CP3 caught the ball? He was able to dribble the ball before the clock even started running!

I remember yelling, "Start the damn clock," but looking at it again it wasn't too terrible.

Kuq_e_Zi91
01-20-2009, 07:21 PM
I can't complain about the clock. I'm sure Danny's 0.9 didn't start right when he touched the ball.

My biggest problem was even having Murph and Diener in on the play when we needed defense.

BlueNGold
01-20-2009, 07:26 PM
IMO, Bird's contract will not be renewed after next season if things don't change. A 15-26 record and being the 7-8 worst team in the league just doesn't exactly say I'm doing a great job. To me a change of definate proportions has to take place for the Simons to keep Bird. Larry Legend PR has been used up.

I'm one of those that believe O'Brien was brought in to change the chemistry of the team, get them pointed in the right direction, and then after his contract is up he's gone. I also feel the same about Bird. He's not the GM to get the Pacers to the Promise Land. JMOAA

I have never been a big Bird fan because I tend to think he rubs some players the wrong way. Let's be nice and simply say he does not have an inferiority complex...;)

In any event, I suspect this team will start improving and Larry will stay put. Some people, even here in Indiana, seem to underestimate his legend. He is a Hoosier icon the Simons are not simply going to send packing like any other GM. This team is an Indiana team....maybe an Indianapolis team. Anyway, once this team gets back on track, Larry legend's fame will grow...and that fame will all of the sudden become an asset.

The fact is, we will start improving primarily because our best players are entering their prime and we have some young talent that will improve. Bird has also made a couple good moves, which are helping him. All things considered, we will be moving to .500 territory over the next couple years and the Legend will be here for awhile.