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grace
01-16-2009, 05:20 PM
During the Portland/NJ game one of the Nets' TV announcers said he thoguht you should be able to get an assist if you pass the ball to a guy who gets fouled and makes all his free throws.

Opinions?

BRushWithDeath
01-16-2009, 05:23 PM
Agreed. Been saying so for awhile. But it doesn't really matter.

Bball
01-16-2009, 05:36 PM
It does make some sense but how do you calculate it if the guy makes 1 of 2 FT's? Do you still get a full assist for that 1 point or a half assist? And if you do call it a 'half' how do you reconcile that with 3pt baskets just getting 1 assist? Shouldn't that be 1.5 then?

And then it's all in how you look at an 'assist'. Is it relative to anything other than the ball going thru the hoop and in that case handing out 1 assist for any score makes sense.

Kstat
01-16-2009, 05:57 PM
I think it would screw up every assist record in the books, but it should have been in there from the beginning.

And yes, ANY made FT should constitute an assist if it applies.

Hicks
01-16-2009, 06:00 PM
Since an assist is worth 1 regardless of a 2 or a 3, I think they should get one if at least, if not more, are hit.

0/2 FT = 0 assists
0/3 FT = 0 assists
1/2 FT = 1 assist
2/2 FT = 1 assist
2/3 FT = 1 assist
3/3 FT = 1 assist

Because in my view, an assist is giving credit to someone who is doing something that immediately results in a teammate adding to the scoreboard.

Regardless of how you do it, if record books are a concern, you could list them as FTA (Free Throw Assists) separately, while still listing all assists.

Meaning that say you had 6 regular assists and 2 FT assists, the box score will say you had 8 assists and 2 FT assists (like how some list total rebounds and then offensive rebounds).

BRushWithDeath
01-16-2009, 06:01 PM
Since an assist is worth 1 regardless of a 2 or a 3, I think they should get one if at least, if not more, are hit.

0/2 FT = 0 assists
0/3 FT = 0 assists
1/2 FT = 1 assist
2/2 FT = 1 assist
2/3 FT = 1 assist
3/3 FT = 1 assist

Because in my view, an assist is giving credit to someone who is doing something that immediately results in a teammate adding to the scoreboard.

Exactly.

Dr. Awesome
01-16-2009, 06:52 PM
Agreed.

Kemo
01-16-2009, 07:06 PM
on the same hand , a missed shot while getting a foul, should STILL count as a shot missed..

Bball
01-16-2009, 08:18 PM
on the same hand , a missed shot while getting a foul, should STILL count as a shot missed..


You're saying if a player goes up for a dunk and a defensive player comes flying in and shoves him 5' from the basket, the ball falls out of bounds, and the defensive player rightfully gets a foul- you want the player to still get a 'miss' on his stat sheet? I can't agree with that if that is what you mean.

Hicks
01-16-2009, 08:27 PM
That's how it works now. If they don't hit the shot, there's no assist.

Now, if the rule changed as discussed above, he might still get an assist if the would-be dunker hits at least 1 free throw.

Bball
01-16-2009, 08:57 PM
That's how it works now. If they don't hit the shot, there's no assist.

Now, if the rule changed as discussed above, he might still get an assist if the would-be dunker hits at least 1 free throw.

I thought the poster wanted to make the missed shot count in FG% even if he missed because he was fouled...

Kemo
01-16-2009, 09:23 PM
You're saying if a player goes up for a dunk and a defensive player comes flying in and shoves him 5' from the basket, the ball falls out of bounds, and the defensive player rightfully gets a foul- you want the player to still get a 'miss' on his stat sheet? I can't agree with that if that is what you mean.


I mean, that the player dunking STILL made an attempt.. maybe I shoulda clarified what I meant more... It should count as an attempt... regardless if they missed the shot for whatever reason.

Slick Pinkham
01-16-2009, 09:43 PM
that's crazy. If you missed the shot because the opponent broke the rules (fouled you) then you should never ever be charged with a shot attempt.

skyfire
01-16-2009, 10:22 PM
I think it should be harder to get assists, not easier. It should be a pass leading directly to a made basket. It would be hard to change the rules, but in circumstances where for example, Kidd passes the ball to Dirk at the top of the key, he holds it, pump fakes about three times then shoots the jumper over the guy defending him, did the pass really assist the shot?

beast23
01-16-2009, 10:37 PM
Since an assist is worth 1 regardless of a 2 or a 3, I think they should get one if at least, if not more, are hit.

0/2 FT = 0 assists
0/3 FT = 0 assists
1/2 FT = 1 assist
2/2 FT = 1 assist
2/3 FT = 1 assist
3/3 FT = 1 assist

Because in my view, an assist is giving credit to someone who is doing something that immediately results in a teammate adding to the scoreboard.

Regardless of how you do it, if record books are a concern, you could list them as FTA (Free Throw Assists) separately, while still listing all assists.

Meaning that say you had 6 regular assists and 2 FT assists, the box score will say you had 8 assists and 2 FT assists (like how some list total rebounds and then offensive rebounds).I don't totally agree with your assessment. I am a purist in that I believe that an assist should be awarded for a field goal, or the equivalent of a field goal.

Therefore, I would NOT award an assist when only one free throw is made.

As for counting a fouled shot as a field goal attempt, I would count it as a field goal attempt when the shooter does not hit at least two free throws.

count55
01-17-2009, 12:18 AM
on the same hand , a missed shot while getting a foul, should STILL count as a shot missed..


I mean, that the player dunking STILL made an attempt.. maybe I shoulda clarified what I meant more... It should count as an attempt... regardless if they missed the shot for whatever reason.

Nope. A foul negates the attempt unless the shot is made. To include the attempt would make the FG % a misleading, if not meaningless calculation.

BTW...technically, missed tip should not, and traditionally was not counted as an attempt or a rebound because the ball was not controlled. However, in over the last couple of decades, they've counted them as such in the NBA.


I don't totally agree with your assessment. I am a purist in that I believe that an assist should be awarded for a field goal, or the equivalent of a field goal.

Therefore, I would NOT award an assist when only one free throw is made.

As for counting a fouled shot as a field goal attempt, I would count it as a field goal attempt when the shooter does not hit at least two free throws.

I'm having a problem with your reasoning here. The idea behind giving an assist to a player who is fouled is that it forced the defense to foul, and the guy would've otherwise scored. You think this is right, but you would punish the passer if, for example, he got the ball to Shaq at the rim and the team intentionally fouls him.

The basic problem here is that assists are scored far too liberally. I never charted it, but anecdotally, it seems to me that only about 2/3 of the passes that are credited as assists are actually assists under the intent of the stat.

An assist is supposed to be a pass that leads directly to a basket. However, it's morphed into being the pass before a basket.

I don't believe that an assist should be given on FT's, because an assist was actually supposed to create the basket. Without the basket, even if there was a foul, then there can be no assist. The basket has to be made, and there was no guarantee that the guy was going to make the basket that was prevented by the foul.

If you're going to give an assist when the guy goes to the line, then why don't you also give an assist when the guy makes a pass to a guy in perfect position to score, but then blows the layup? (Jeff Foster, I'm looking at you.) Or how about the perfect pass in perfect position that the guy fumbles away?

Kemo
01-17-2009, 04:30 AM
As for counting a fouled shot as a field goal attempt, I would count it as a field goal attempt when the shooter does not hit at least two free throws.



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