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View Full Version : post game thread pacers got killed



vnzla81
01-05-2009, 11:35 PM
post your comments:-p

MyFavMartin
01-05-2009, 11:36 PM
Game ball to Nene?

vnzla81
01-05-2009, 11:37 PM
I meant to write killed. my bad:blush:

MyFavMartin
01-05-2009, 11:38 PM
I turned it off after down by 15 in the 1st back was surprised to find the pacers evened up near the end of the 3rd.

Turnover city from there on out. Seemed like a layup drill for the Nuggets til they got a 20 point lead and then it was jack-a-three the rest of the way, cause it was over.

MyFavMartin
01-05-2009, 11:38 PM
why was rush out for most of it?

Dr. Goldfoot
01-05-2009, 11:45 PM
Still alot of holes to fill on this team. I only see a few players worth keeping on this team. That's a start.

The Denver bench is pretty dynamic. Filled with vets, hustlers, strong defenders, basket attackers, smooth shooters etc..It's time the Pacers start looking for some of those kind of players.

Noodle
01-05-2009, 11:46 PM
Why was Daniels out there only 11 minutes?

Peck
01-05-2009, 11:48 PM
Why was Daniels out there only 11 minutes?

Pulled groin.

dohman
01-05-2009, 11:57 PM
yeah mid way threw the 3rd I checked the score and it was like 80-80 I was shocked to see us lose by this amount.

Shade
01-06-2009, 12:00 AM
This is one of the most anti-clutch teams I've ever seen. When the game's on the line, we typically become a jumbled mess, turning the ball over and missing shot after shot.

pwee31
01-06-2009, 12:06 AM
I think we should've used the bench more when we got close. Rush, McRoberts... could've brought some energy and gave us a couple fresh legs

MyFavMartin
01-06-2009, 12:08 AM
I think we should've used the bench more when we got close. Rush, McRoberts... could've brought some energy and gave us a couple fresh legs

2nd unit brought us back in the 1st half, right?

JR Smith should be starting for them.

Quis
01-06-2009, 12:09 AM
I'm growing incredibly bored with this team.

CableKC
01-06-2009, 01:58 AM
We lost to the Nuggets, a team that can keep pace with our uptempo offense, has 2 All-Star level players and more then enough decent interior scoring threats and defenders that can work in the Low-Post ( Kenyon Martin and Nene ).

Unfortunately, we're gonna likely lose in the next 3 games cuz we're playing 3 of the Top 5 scoring teams on the Road and we are one of the worst defending teams in the league on the Road.

MillerTime
01-06-2009, 02:45 AM
I turned it off after down by 15 in the 1st back was surprised to find the pacers evened up near the end of the 3rd.

Turnover city from there on out. Seemed like a layup drill for the Nuggets til they got a 20 point lead and then it was jack-a-three the rest of the way, cause it was over.
We only had 9 turnovers, which is good for us

why was rush out for most of it?
I think hes in JOB doghouse now for some reason

Peck
01-06-2009, 03:10 AM
In all honesty there really isn't much to say about this game because frankly the Nuggets are just a better overall team than we are. They have us at every single position on the floor with maybe, just maybe, Danny being Anthony's equal.

Stat wise Danny outplayed him, however this is the differance between a great player playing with other good players vs. a great player pretty much having to be a one man show.

I am not hounding on O'Brien for this because I honestly don't think it would have made a differance.

But, again, why when you are already short players due to injury and you are playing an up tempo team not to mention you are playing in an altitude that is not condusive to running anyway do you decide once again to shorten your rotation.

I get that Brandon is on the outs, I don't even have a problem with it because for the past couple of games he has been sluggish as heck, but circumstances dictated otherwise this game.

Daniels going down and T.J. not playing dictates that you open up the bench a little.

If you didn't see the game don't be fooled by the box score that shows a lot of players playing. McBob and Rush came in when we had thrown up the white flag. Roy fouled out with 5 fouls again.

But understand, I am not saying any of this would have made a differance at all in the outcome. I am just far more worried about fatigue and wear and tear on the players.

On that note, does anyone have any idea what is up with Rasho? I think the Rocky Mountains move faster anymore than he does.

Is he injured or fatigued or what???? He looks like 1/4 the player he was at the beginning of the season.

xtacy
01-06-2009, 06:53 AM
this game is a bigger disgrace to this franchise than the fight. whoever you are playing against letting them score 135 is unacceptable. bird gotta do something. i don't know what it would be. trading,firing the coach or something else i don't care but he must do something. waiting mike to come and save us shows how pathetic the situation is right now.

deekay85
01-06-2009, 07:24 AM
thats right.
incredible, 135 points!!!
As i mentioned it already you can win w/o defense against ny or sacramento. but against good teams like denver or atlanta you have to play solid/good D.
right now we arent deserve a playoff spot.
Priority number 1, we have to show everyone that we can play solid D. and not just in one game!

BIRD DO SOMETHING!!!

BillS
01-06-2009, 09:40 AM
Roy fouled out with 5 fouls again.

I thought Roy was in again after his fifth foul. In any event, he was getting schooled out there on defense and was playing far too weakly on offense to be anything other than the source of somebody's shot blocking record.

Sluggish defined the entire team in the first and fourth quarters. I'm not sure what it was, but it was like someone had beaten the heart out of them before the game even started.

Yeah, playing in Denver can be difficult, which might explain the collapse at the end, but still.

count55
01-06-2009, 10:03 AM
I thought Roy was in again after his fifth foul. In any event, he was getting schooled out there on defense and was playing far too weakly on offense to be anything other than the source of somebody's shot blocking record.

Sluggish defined the entire team in the first and fourth quarters. I'm not sure what it was, but it was like someone had beaten the heart out of them before the game even started.

Yeah, playing in Denver can be difficult, which might explain the collapse at the end, but still.

Hibbert did come back in and play the final 4:35, but the team was down 20 by that point.

As opposed to the Knicks game, where I thought it would've been nice to run some post ups for Roy in the 4th as the lead slipped away, it's difficult for me to understand the criticism regarding Roy's rotations in this game.

He picked up his 5th foul with 3:32 in the third and went to the bench. Denver then pushed the lead from 3 to 12 in a span of 91 seconds in the fourth quarter. I'm hard pressed to see Roy as a key component of a comeback, at least at this stage.

On the other hand, like others, I understand Brandon's fall from grace, but, boy, do we need him to get it together. With no Dunleavy and no Daniels, 29 minutes is just too long to have Stephen on the floor. Plus, it's unfair to him, in any case, to have him play all but 1 minute in the second half (if I have my numbers right) in any game, let alone a game in Denver at that pace.

OakMoses
01-06-2009, 10:08 AM
We got beaten badly by a much better team. Our defense was terrible, but their's wasn't a whole lot better. Danny and Troy missed a bunch of open three's or we would have run up the score with them.

Denver's roster is much better than ours, especially in the frontcourt. Nene, Martin, and Anderson are a strong 3 man rotation. This was another game where our lack of athleticism in the frontcourt killed us.

Hibbert didn't look very good. He's propensity for stupid fouls has not decreased. He didn't show any sort of solid or reliable low post moves. He's also one of the slowest players I've ever seen. I don't know how many times there are loose balls or rebounds that are snagged by a player who's 3-4 feet out of position because Roy can't move fast enough to get to them. I'm starting to get the feeling that he better develop into a very solid low post scorer and an excellent shot-blocker/alterer on defense if he's going to be much of a player. At this point I've given up on the idea that he's ever going to make a hustle play.

Also, you really can't expect to win a game where Graham plays 29 minutes. He's a good 6th wing player, but he shouldn't ever play that many minutes again.

This was one of the worst refereed games I've ever watched. Way too many silly whistles on both teams. Blocks, charges, and no calls were not called with any measure of consistency. Technicals were called for what seemed like mild reactions and then J.R. Smith is allowed to scream "That's b***s***!" after obviously fouling Graham on a putback attempt.

Putnam
01-06-2009, 10:10 AM
this game is a bigger disgrace to this franchise than the fight.

No it isn't. The Pacers were very shorthanded, playing Denver's game in Denver's arena. The loss counts as a loss, not a disgrace. Could this be called trolling?



As i mentioned it already you can win w/o defense against ny or sacramento. but against good teams like denver or atlanta you have to play solid/good D.

What I notice, deekay, is that until recently you said defense is always necessary to win, and that the Pacers play "no defense." After the Pacers beat the Knicks and the Kings, you changed your tune. Now you say, defense is always necessary except when it isn't.

Nobody here doesn't wish the Pacers were playing better and winning more games. I'd be happy if the Pacers won a 70-68 squeaker against Phoenix, but I don't think it would happen. I think this blanket argument that any loss equals "no defense" and that the Pacers would somehow do better if they averaged 82 points than they are doing now averaging 102 points is unproven. They might do even worse.

This loss to the Nuggets is regrettable, but it doesn't prove your point. Denver played "no defense" and still won the game with pure offense. They won becaue they played better than the Pacers, and they did that because they had more talent and experience on the floor than the Pacers had.

Major Cold
01-06-2009, 10:15 AM
Real teams show up in the fourth quarter. Every team we play, plays harder in the fourth quarter. We are unable to match their intensity. When The Nugs decided to play defense we could not do anything. And that is where we are at with this team. It doesn't matter that we score all these points. I don't care if it is "entertaining".

What I want is for this team to win a game entirely. Not blow big leads. I understand that Rush is not playing great, but is Stephen playing that much better. Have him and Jack out there is carelessness at it's best.

I want this team to improve. I don't care if we make the playoffs. I want a glimmer of progress. And not individual progress alone. I want a team, not players on a team.

After this road trip, I feel as if the Pacers will make a splash in the News Wire. I don't know how, but we all know why. It is time to readjust and tweak alittle.

OakMoses
01-06-2009, 10:45 AM
Real teams show up in the fourth quarter. Every team we play, plays harder in the fourth quarter. We are unable to match their intensity. When The Nugs decided to play defense we could not do anything. And that is where we are at with this team. It doesn't matter that we score all these points. I don't care if it is "entertaining".


I don't think it's a question of effort in the 4th quarter, I think it's a question of talent. We play harder than most teams through 3 quarters and that allows us to stay in games. Once they crank it up, however, we rarely have the talent to overcome the rise in intensity. We have almost no who can create for themselves or others, our offense is based on taking advantage of other team's mental lapses. Increased focus brings fewer mental lapses and our offense stalls. Also, other teams run iso's for their best player and we can't shut them down with one player. This causes breakdowns in our team defense that lead to wide open shots.

I haven't seen anything from this team that leads me to believe that they're not playing as hard. They just aren't as good.

I still believe, however, that this is a playoff team with a healthy Dunleavy and Ford.

loborick
01-06-2009, 10:47 AM
We got beaten badly by a much better team. Our defense was terrible, but their's wasn't a whole lot better. Danny and Troy missed a bunch of open three's or we would have run up the score with them.

Denver's roster is much better than ours, especially in the frontcourt. Nene, Martin, and Anderson are a strong 3 man rotation. This was another game where our lack of athleticism in the frontcourt killed us.

Hibbert didn't look very good. He's propensity for stupid fouls has not decreased. He didn't show any sort of solid or reliable low post moves. He's also one of the slowest players I've ever seen. I don't know how many times there are loose balls or rebounds that are snagged by a player who's 3-4 feet out of position because Roy can't move fast enough to get to them. I'm starting to get the feeling that he better develop into a very solid low post scorer and an excellent shot-blocker/alterer on defense if he's going to be much of a player. At this point I've given up on the idea that he's ever going to make a hustle play.

Also, you really can't expect to win a game where Graham plays 29 minutes. He's a good 6th wing player, but he shouldn't ever play that many minutes again.

This was one of the worst refereed games I've ever watched. Way too many silly whistles on both teams. Blocks, charges, and no calls were not called with any measure of consistency. Technicals were called for what seemed like mild reactions and then J.R. Smith is allowed to scream "That's b***s***!" after obviously fouling Graham on a putback attempt.

Granger was 4-8 from three. That's missing a bunch?

OakMoses
01-06-2009, 11:05 AM
Granger was 4-8 from three. That's missing a bunch?

No, it's not. My point wasn't that he didn't have a good shooting game, but that both he and Troy got very good, very uncontested looks from the 3 point line that they missed. Between the 2 of them there were at least 4 wide open 3's missed. A couple of the 3's Danny made were much tougher shots than the ones he missed. The point was that, on the whole, the Nuggets didn't play significantly better defense than the Pacers did, the main difference was that every interior defender they have is a good shot-blocker.

Unclebuck
01-06-2009, 11:15 AM
You can't beat the Nuggets in Denver playing the same style the Nuggests want to play

Hicks
01-06-2009, 11:19 AM
this game is a bigger disgrace to this franchise than the fight.

That's it. There it is. PD has finally outdone itself in the hyperbole department. Someone get a gold statue. :goodnight:

duke dynamite
01-06-2009, 11:25 AM
...

Anthem
01-06-2009, 01:21 PM
We play harder than most teams through 3 quarters and that allows us to stay in games. Once they crank it up, however, we rarely have the talent to overcome the rise in intensity.
Great summary. I was going to post something almost identical.

deekay85
01-06-2009, 01:26 PM
What I notice, deekay, is that until recently you said defense is always necessary to win, and that the Pacers play "no defense." After the Pacers beat the Knicks and the Kings, you changed your tune. Now you say, defense is always necessary except when it isn't.

Nobody here doesn't wish the Pacers were playing better and winning more games. I'd be happy if the Pacers won a 70-68 squeaker against Phoenix, but I don't think it would happen. I think this blanket argument that any loss equals "no defense" and that the Pacers would somehow do better if they averaged 82 points than they are doing now averaging 102 points is unproven. They might do even worse.

This loss to the Nuggets is regrettable, but it doesn't prove your point. Denver played "no defense" and still won the game with pure offense. They won becaue they played better than the Pacers, and they did that because they had more talent and experience on the floor than the Pacers had.

Denver did not win this game by "pure offense"! If you watched the game, you've noticed that denver played solid (not good) D in the first and the last quarter.
of course their bigs are way more athletic and defensive oriented then ours.
at the moment we cannot play good defense to hang in with the best.

on the offensive end we are right up there with the nuggets, suns etc.
but if we can improve our defense, we'll be tough cover for everybody.

i really don't know whats goin on right now with this team. at the beginning of the season we played very very solid at the d-end.
Whats wrong now`? Players tired? Coach?

And one more thing:

Offense wins games, defense c'chips!

And thats the fact! Spurs, Pistons,Lakers, Celtics, Cavs (< maybe) - for me only c'chip contenders.

Unclebuck
01-06-2009, 02:30 PM
Originally Posted by mellifluous
We play harder than most teams through 3 quarters and that allows us to stay in games. Once they crank it up, however, we rarely have the talent to overcome the rise in intensity.


Thank you that is very well said

Quis
01-06-2009, 04:58 PM
Jeff Foster broke a bone in Carmelo Anthony's hand, which will cause him to miss about 3 weeks.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=AoNxZcpK9mSbxlgQr8BF1MG8vLYF?slug=ap-nuggets-anthonyinjured&prov=ap&type=lgns

Midcoasted
01-06-2009, 05:02 PM
Still alot of holes to fill on this team. I only see a few players worth keeping on this team. That's a start.

The Denver bench is pretty dynamic. Filled with vets, hustlers, strong defenders, basket attackers, smooth shooters etc..It's time the Pacers start looking for some of those kind of players.

Denver may be the deepest team in the NBA. Who wouldn't love to have that kind of depth? That's why they are a top 8 team, and maybe a top 5 and we will be fighting for our lives the whole season.

owl
01-06-2009, 05:17 PM
Denver definitely has a good team. Most of them are veterans and quicker and more athletic.
Their front court is where the Pacers are put to shame. Troy,Roy and Rasho have to be the
slowest group in the NBA. That is where a lot of the defensive problems arise. The wings and guards are ok but not great either.
Rasho and Quis will not be back next year.

CableKC
01-06-2009, 05:46 PM
On that note, does anyone have any idea what is up with Rasho? I think the Rocky Mountains move faster anymore than he does.

Is he injured or fatigued or what???? He looks like 1/4 the player he was at the beginning of the season.
I'm glad that I'm not the only one that notices this.....but something that has been happening ever since Roy's minutes started to go up.

If we could simply play Rasho for 15 mpg ONLY in the 2nd half, then I would be fine with keeping him long-term........he would be a very solid Big Man that can do all the right things as a finisher. But I suspect that one of the reasons why Roy's minutes have gone up is because Rasho is starting to get worn out due to a pace that he is simply not used to and TPTB are really trying to see what Hibbert can do so that we can use Rasho as a trading piece THIS season to help address the obvious deficiencies that we have.

In a vacuum where I can ignore fatigue and amount of energy , I think that Rasho is a very solid Center that actually fits what JO'B wants to our Big Men should be doing on the offensive/defensive end. He passes very well from the high-post to cutting players to the hoop, is very stong on basketball fundamentals and has a fairly reliable high-post jumpshot from the top of the key. The problem is that I don't think that he is up to staying pace in the tempo that is required to be effective for the long term.

If Rasho was still on the roster after the trade deadline, I would be surprised.....I would even be more surprised if we decided to extend him and he actually decided to accept it. IMHO, Rasho is a player that could last another 2 seasons in the NBA.....but only if he is on some Half-court offense team like the Celtics, Cavs or the Spurs. This up-tempo stuff is simply too much for him.

deekay85
01-07-2009, 10:45 AM
In the game against denver you could see it very well. rasho isnt the fastest guy among our centers.

Justin Tyme
01-07-2009, 11:05 AM
Rasho and Quis will not be back next year.

I believe you are right, but I could see one or both being traded by the trade deadline.

Justin Tyme
01-07-2009, 11:09 AM
In the game against denver you could see it very well. rasho isnt the fastest guy among our centers.


The saying "slow as molasses" was coined to describe his lack of speed.