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View Full Version : It is obvious: Pacers are trying to trade Artest



Unclebuck
06-22-2004, 08:54 AM
All of us Artest lovers need to be honest and accept reality that the Pacers are trying to trade Artest. The other teams in the NBA know it, Pacers will deny it to try to keep his trade value as high as possible, but if you read the NY Times and Post articles today and several others from the past week or so, it is obvious to me that the Pacers are doing everything they can to trade Artest.

The still might trade Al Harrington also.

Mark Montieth found out about Artest missing the meeting when he called Ron and Ron told him so then MM confirmed with LB. This info was in MM latest Q&A.

As almost all of you know, I might be the biggest Artest fan around, but when the Pacers trade Artest and when they don't get what I consider fair trade value, I won't be mad at DW, LB or the Pacers, I'll be mad at Artest. This is all his fault, he had a chance this past season to have a clean slate, but he blew it, he appears to have caused some problems during the playoffs, he could have fit into the current team much better, but he didn't, and for that I blame Artest.

RWB
06-22-2004, 09:01 AM
[quote
As almost all of you know, I might be the biggest Artest fan around, but when the Pacers trade Artest and when they don't get what I consider fair trade value, I won't be mad at DW, LB or the Pacers, I'll be mad at Artest. [/quote]

While I see your point UB, I will not let Bird or Walsh off that easy. If they can't get some (more than) decent talent back for Artest then they have failed at their jobs. Plain and simple the buck ( ;) ) stops with them.

Suaveness
06-22-2004, 09:17 AM
I refuse to accept it....

Peck
06-22-2004, 09:18 AM
I'd be interested in knowing why he refused to get on the plane after the Miami loss.

But other than that, I know this has to be hard on Artest fans. It's very sad really because the guy is one hell of a player.

I can only assume that if this goes down Ron has caused so many problems behind the scenes that the Org. is just litterally throwing their hands up in the air & giving up.

Grant
06-22-2004, 09:18 AM
All of us Artest lovers need to be honest and accept reality that the Pacers are trying to trade Artest.

Maybe I'm just drinking the kool-aid, but I disagree.

I think there is a difference between trying to trade Artest, and being willing to trade him. I think the Pacers are actively shopping Harrington, but are listening to offers for Artest.

In other words, they prefer to keep Artest, but would trade him if the right offer came through. For all of his issues, the Pacers are far better off with him on the roster, and because of his issues, I think its unlikely they will get an offer they like.

BillS
06-22-2004, 09:38 AM
Y'all ...

I think it's my fault.

I ... I ... I bought a Ron Artest jersey at the Thanksgiving game this year.

I don't know what I was thinking. I know that every time I buy a jersey, a player leaves, but I couldn't help it.

Looks like this one might go in the drawer of discarded Pacers, along with Fred "the wonder dog" Hoiberg. :sadbanana:

Doug
06-22-2004, 09:54 AM
Y'all ...

I think it's my fault.

I ... I ... I bought a Ron Artest jersey at the Thanksgiving game this year.

I don't know what I was thinking. I know that every time I buy a jersey, a player leaves, but I couldn't help it.

Looks like this one might go in the drawer of discarded Pacers, along with Fred "the wonder dog" Hoiberg. :sadbanana:

I'll buy your Fred Hoiberg Pacers jersey. Honest.

Suaveness
06-22-2004, 10:05 AM
Y'all ...

I think it's my fault.

I ... I ... I bought a Ron Artest jersey at the Thanksgiving game this year.

I don't know what I was thinking. I know that every time I buy a jersey, a player leaves, but I couldn't help it.

Looks like this one might go in the drawer of discarded Pacers, along with Fred "the wonder dog" Hoiberg. :sadbanana:

I'll buy your Fred Hoiberg Pacers jersey. Honest.


:laugh:

PacerStud
06-22-2004, 10:05 AM
Maybe the rest of the league sees the problems with Artest and they aren't willing to give up much for him. Every GM or coach thinks that he can be the one person to handle a given 'problem child'. They'll be willing to take a chance on him, but don't want to give up too much just in case it doesn't work.

Suaveness
06-22-2004, 10:13 AM
Maybe the rest of the league sees the problems with Artest and they aren't willing to give up much for him. Every GM or coach thinks that he can be the one person to handle a given 'problem child'. They'll be willing to take a chance on him, but don't want to give up too much just in case it doesn't work.

I hope so. Maybe this way we can keep him. :devil:


I guess we'll see in the next few days.

DisplacedKnick
06-22-2004, 10:19 AM
Since Artest is a much better player than his salary, the only way I see him being traded is by packaging him with an albatross like Croshere or Pollard.

I don't see the point myself. He made huge strides in his behavior this year though he still doesn't qualify for the choir.

indygeezer
06-22-2004, 10:19 AM
Maybe the rest of the league sees the problems with Artest and they aren't willing to give up much for him. Every GM or coach thinks that he can be the one person to handle a given 'problem child'. They'll be willing to take a chance on him, but don't want to give up too much just in case it doesn't work.

I hope so. Maybe this way we can keep him. :devil:


I guess we'll see in the next few days.

:mad: That is simply NOT acceptable. I want to know NOW! :mad:

:cry: and following BillS's theory, I bought Geezer Jr. a JO jersey :cry:

Suaveness
06-22-2004, 10:22 AM
I don't see the point myself. He made huge strides in his behavior this year though he still doesn't qualify for the choir.

Precisely what I am saying. People can't seem to realize he made HUGE strides in his behavior this year. Compared to last year, he was amazing. I can't see why he isn't going to improve more.

BillS
06-22-2004, 11:50 AM
:cry: and following BillS's theory, I bought Geezer Jr. a JO jersey :cry:

Ahh, but as long as you haven't established a history of driving players away, that's not a problem.

Kegboy
06-22-2004, 12:22 PM
:cry: and following BillS's theory, I bought Geezer Jr. a JO jersey :cry:

Ahh, but as long as you haven't established a history of driving players away, that's not a problem.

I've always been terrified to buy a Pacers jersey, since I'm convinced if I do so, they'll either get hurt or traded. I got a Marvin Harrison jersey long before he ever made it big, so that wasn't a problem, but I'm not about to chance it with my Pacers. :shudder:

Snickers
06-22-2004, 12:26 PM
:cry: and following BillS's theory, I bought Geezer Jr. a JO jersey :cry:

Ahh, but as long as you haven't established a history of driving players away, that's not a problem.

I've always been terrified to buy a Pacers jersey, since I'm convinced if I do so, they'll either get hurt or traded. I got a Marvin Harrison jersey long before he ever made it big, so that wasn't a problem, but I'm not about to chance it with my Pacers. :shudder:

Go for Primoz. :flirt:

Will Galen
06-22-2004, 12:48 PM
All of us Artest lovers need to be honest and accept reality that the Pacers are trying to trade Artest.

Maybe I'm just drinking the kool-aid, but I disagree.

I think there is a difference between trying to trade Artest, and being willing to trade him. I think the Pacers are actively shopping Harrington, but are listening to offers for Artest.

In other words, they prefer to keep Artest, but would trade him if the right offer came through. For all of his issues, the Pacers are far better off with him on the roster, and because of his issues, I think its unlikely they will get an offer they like.

I wish I had said that! That's my thoughts!

Hicks
06-22-2004, 12:51 PM
To the few of you STILL in denial about Artest, WE ARE NOT REFERRING TO HIS ON-COURT ISSUES. THOSE HAVE IMPROVED. IT'S WHAT'S HAPPENED BEHIND-THE-SCENES THAT HAS HIM OUT THE DOOR.

Maybe by Christmas you'll all get that.

Young
06-22-2004, 12:55 PM
Well, I don't mind trading Artest but for Bonzi [and a pick landing Luke Jackson]

Come on now, we don't improve here.

We don't get to that championship level really, no better shooting because Jackson won't contribute enough this season so i'm crossing him out.

I would much rather get Posey but I guess Bonzi is the guy.

What about if we could get a package including Wells/Battier/Jackson for Artet? Just a quick thought.

able
06-22-2004, 12:57 PM
uhh Hicks ?

We are not shopping him :D

we only made it clear he is available for the "right" price.


now that is something to be discussed, but dumping him is NOT something I see DW/LB doing, they can ALWAYS do that, even when he is completely out of control again, there is alway someone who thinks he can do better with a talent of that magnitude.

If the right price does not come along, he will be a Pacer next year.

Unclebuck
06-22-2004, 12:58 PM
I figiured I would have been the last holdout, and maybe I will be to a small degree, I still love how the guy plays, but at some point enough is enough. I am a big believer in team chemistry.

My biggest fear is that the Pacers trade him in the next few weeks, (keep in mind he won't turn 25 until November) and in 2 or 3 years when he is in his prime at the ages of 27 and 28 years old that he matures to the point where he is not a distraction. And if that is the case he could be a star a top 6 player in the whole NBA. That is what I think of his talent and how hard he plays.

This is all very difficult for me

indygeezer
06-22-2004, 01:17 PM
A side note to the Artest for Bonzi and the #10 or whatever it is. I jsut noted that per Hoopshype listing, Bonzi's $8 mil contract expires at the end of this coming season. Draw your own conclusions.

beast23
06-22-2004, 01:25 PM
To the few of you STILL in denial about Artest, WE ARE NOT REFERRING TO HIS ON-COURT ISSUES. THOSE HAVE IMPROVED. IT'S WHAT'S HAPPENED BEHIND-THE-SCENES THAT HAS HIM OUT THE DOOR.

Maybe by Christmas you'll all get that.Hicks, a little strong, don't you think?

I think everyone "gets that". I think virtually everyone has a good grip between his on-court abilities, his occassional on-court antics and the part that we don't see that is behind the scenes.

But one thing that YOU must admit is that a lot of the behind-the-scenes stuff is 3rd-hand, 15th-hand, whatever.... rumor. A couple of those rumors have been confirmed by LB, others have not.

Larry and Donnie have a balancing act to play out this summer. They have team that is very close to making a finals appearance. With a break or two, maybe even capable of making a finals appearance with its present roster. With a little roster tweaking, a team that is likely to make a finals appearance.

If they give up players and receive lesser value in return, then we obviously are taking a step backwards. Not an astute statement, but one I'll start things off with anyway.

Based on the number of earlier rumors that we heard about possible trades with Orlando, I don't believe there is any doubt whatsoever that the Pacers are willing to part with Harrington. They aren't just listening when it comes to Al, they are actively pursuing alternatives.

However, we don't hear a lot out there about Artest. That would seem to indicate that they MAY NOT be actively pursuing alternatives, but are politely listening to what other GMs have to say in their inquiries about Artest.

I think one thing that must be analyzed is the likelihood that the Pacers would be willing to part with both Artest and Harrington. Now I don't pretend to be as sharp as LB or DW, but look at the facts. Bender is not ready and Croshere cannot adequately cover SF for 35 minutes a night, so it makes virtually no sense at all that our guys would intend to trade both Harrington and Artest, only to leave a hole at SF. Makes no sense at all.

So, I believe Harrington is being shopped to get us a backcourt player that can shoot. In virtually every rumored trade that has been published that has a SG coming to the Pacers, Al has been mentioned.

So, unless I start hearing multiple rumors about Ron being traded for another small forward and other players or draft choices, then I'm definitely not believing that the Pacers are actively shopping him.

But if the Pacers were actively shopping him, you'd be hearing a whole hell of a lot more rumors than you've heard so far about trades involving Ron. A team makes overtures to another, and those things have a habit of taking on a life of their own and leaking out.

If that doesn't sound rational to you, I challenge you to provide a better analysis.

You and others have got Ron "out the door" on basically an emotiional reaction alone. When it comes to business, I just think it's important to provide a logical scenario, and not merely an emotional one.

Hicks
06-22-2004, 01:35 PM
To the few of you STILL in denial about Artest, WE ARE NOT REFERRING TO HIS ON-COURT ISSUES. THOSE HAVE IMPROVED. IT'S WHAT'S HAPPENED BEHIND-THE-SCENES THAT HAS HIM OUT THE DOOR.

Maybe by Christmas you'll all get that.Hicks, a little strong, don't you think?

I think everyone "gets that". I think virtually everyone has a good grip between his on-court abilities, his occassional on-court antics and the part that we don't see that is behind the scenes.

But one thing that YOU must admit is that a lot of the behind-the-scenes stuff is 3rd-hand, 15th-hand, whatever.... rumor. A couple of those rumors have been confirmed by LB, others have not.

I don't get them from rumors. Some of us have sources. I didn't like to hear it, didn't want to believe it at first, but the truth is it did confirm the speculation. He's been a big hassle behind the scenes all year.

I'm not happy about it, any trade we make for him is likely a step-backwards basketball-wise. But I've had time to get over it, and now I'm just getting a little fed up with people who pretend there is no problem despite public things slipping that point to what is in fact the truth.

beast23
06-22-2004, 01:42 PM
To the few of you STILL in denial about Artest, WE ARE NOT REFERRING TO HIS ON-COURT ISSUES. THOSE HAVE IMPROVED. IT'S WHAT'S HAPPENED BEHIND-THE-SCENES THAT HAS HIM OUT THE DOOR.

Maybe by Christmas you'll all get that.Hicks, a little strong, don't you think?

I think everyone "gets that". I think virtually everyone has a good grip between his on-court abilities, his occassional on-court antics and the part that we don't see that is behind the scenes.

But one thing that YOU must admit is that a lot of the behind-the-scenes stuff is 3rd-hand, 15th-hand, whatever.... rumor. A couple of those rumors have been confirmed by LB, others have not.

I don't get them from rumors. Some of us have sources. I didn't like to hear it, didn't want to believe it at first, but the truth is it did confirm the speculation. He's been a big hassle behind the scenes all year.

I'm not happy about it, any trade we make for him is likely a step-backwards basketball-wise. But I've had time to get over it, and now I'm just getting a little fed up with people who pretend there is no problem despite public things slipping that point to what is in fact the truth.

Hicks, I assure you that I also have "sources".... in the office, on the court, formerly on the court and in the broadcast booth.

But one thing that I'm able to accept is that as careful as they try to be, my "sources" may spew something and be wrong. Unless I see it in print coming straight form a DW or LB quote, you absolutely must take it with a grain of salt. If it's not from one of them, it is 3rd-hand at best.

Hoop
06-22-2004, 01:53 PM
Since Artest is a much better player than his salary, the only way I see him being traded is by packaging him with an albatross like Croshere or Pollard.

I don't see the point myself. He made huge strides in his behavior this year though he still doesn't qualify for the choir.

My thoughts exactly. Ron makes nothing for a 3rd team all NBAer. We would have to trade one of our bloated contracts along with Ron to get equal value back.

The thought of Bonzi here makes me sick, he has a lot of "baggage" too and his contract is up after next year, Artest is signed till 08. Portland wanted him gone so bad they took Wesley Person for him. :puke:

leon
06-22-2004, 01:57 PM
To the few of you STILL in denial about Artest, WE ARE NOT REFERRING TO HIS ON-COURT ISSUES. THOSE HAVE IMPROVED. IT'S WHAT'S HAPPENED BEHIND-THE-SCENES THAT HAS HIM OUT THE DOOR.

Maybe by Christmas you'll all get that.Hicks, a little strong, don't you think?

I think everyone "gets that". I think virtually everyone has a good grip between his on-court abilities, his occassional on-court antics and the part that we don't see that is behind the scenes.

But one thing that YOU must admit is that a lot of the behind-the-scenes stuff is 3rd-hand, 15th-hand, whatever.... rumor. A couple of those rumors have been confirmed by LB, others have not.

I don't get them from rumors. Some of us have sources. I didn't like to hear it, didn't want to believe it at first, but the truth is it did confirm the speculation. He's been a big hassle behind the scenes all year.

I'm not happy about it, any trade we make for him is likely a step-backwards basketball-wise. But I've had time to get over it, and now I'm just getting a little fed up with people who pretend there is no problem despite public things slipping that point to what is in fact the truth.

Hicks, I assure you that I also have "sources".... in the office, on the court, formerly on the court and in the broadcast booth.

But one thing that I'm able to accept is that as careful as they try to be, my "sources" may spew something and be wrong. Unless I see it in print coming straight form a DW or LB quote, you absolutely must take it with a grain of salt. If it's not from one of them, it is 3rd-hand at best.

It seems to me that we are talking about two separate issues with regards to Artest. The first issue, that there have been behind the scenes problems with Artest is pretty obvious. I have no problem believing unnamed sources regarding that.

The more important issue however is what DW and LB plan to do about it. Unless your source is one of those two guys you really don't know. DW especially plays things pretty close to the vest. Only he knows whether he is going to trade Artest.

From my standpoint I will base my opinion DW's track record. I do not believe he will just "dump" Artest to get rid of him. He will look for a trade that makes the Pacers a better team. If one is not available, I believe you will see Artest in a Pacer uniform next year, no matter what any sources (other than DW or LB) say.

Hicks
06-22-2004, 02:05 PM
Hicks, I assure you that I also have "sources".... in the office, on the court, formerly on the court and in the broadcast booth.

But one thing that I'm able to accept is that as careful as they try to be, my "sources" may spew something and be wrong. Unless I see it in print coming straight form a DW or LB quote, you absolutely must take it with a grain of salt. If it's not from one of them, it is 3rd-hand at best.

All I can say it, mine's likely the closest you'll get to the truth. I'm not talking about a secretary or a janitor or something that just works around the head duck(s).

Bball
06-22-2004, 02:17 PM
From my standpoint I will base my opinion DW's track record. I do not believe he will just "dump" Artest to get rid of him. He will look for a trade that makes the Pacers a better team.

But it could be 'dumping' him does make the team better if they feel he is a loose canon that cannot be trusted any longer to play within the team system... or feel that the other players have reached the breaking point in dealing with him internally.


-Bball

leon
06-22-2004, 02:22 PM
From my standpoint I will base my opinion DW's track record. I do not believe he will just "dump" Artest to get rid of him. He will look for a trade that makes the Pacers a better team.

But it could be 'dumping' him does make the team better if they feel he is a loose canon that cannot be trusted any longer to play within the team system... or feel that the other players have reached the breaking point in dealing with him internally.


-Bball

That could be. But as an all-star DPOY who just helped lead his team to 61 wins and the ECF, its hard for me to believe that the Pacers will be a better team without him.

Kstat
06-22-2004, 02:28 PM
From my standpoint I will base my opinion DW's track record. I do not believe he will just "dump" Artest to get rid of him. He will look for a trade that makes the Pacers a better team.

But it could be 'dumping' him does make the team better if they feel he is a loose canon that cannot be trusted any longer to play within the team system... or feel that the other players have reached the breaking point in dealing with him internally.


-Bball

With all the crap ive been hearing ALL YEAR LONG from you guys about Artest's newfound maturity as a player, if this turns out to be the case..... :maniac:

Bball
06-22-2004, 02:47 PM
From my standpoint I will base my opinion DW's track record. I do not believe he will just "dump" Artest to get rid of him. He will look for a trade that makes the Pacers a better team.

But it could be 'dumping' him does make the team better if they feel he is a loose canon that cannot be trusted any longer to play within the team system... or feel that the other players have reached the breaking point in dealing with him internally.


-Bball

That could be. But as an all-star DPOY who just helped lead his team to 61 wins and the ECF, its hard for me to believe that the Pacers will be a better team without him.

Unless... the team is about ready to disintegrate due to Artest's behind the scenes antics. Even tho he was part of the 61 wins IF he is becoming a cancer who has decided he's not interested in the system then there won't be 61 wins with him next year. That is making the assumption he tried being the good guy for a year (with some success) and has decided he'd rather be his own captain.

-Bball

Suaveness
06-22-2004, 03:19 PM
From my standpoint I will base my opinion DW's track record. I do not believe he will just "dump" Artest to get rid of him. He will look for a trade that makes the Pacers a better team.

But it could be 'dumping' him does make the team better if they feel he is a loose canon that cannot be trusted any longer to play within the team system... or feel that the other players have reached the breaking point in dealing with him internally.


-Bball

With all the crap ive been hearing ALL YEAR LONG from you guys about Artest's newfound maturity as a player, if this turns out to be the case..... :maniac:

See, I keep saying that he HAS matured, and I don't understand why people are ready to kill him more THIS year than last. It befuddles me. Unless I am blind, I do believe his behavior has improved, has it not?

Bball
06-22-2004, 03:26 PM
From my standpoint I will base my opinion DW's track record. I do not believe he will just "dump" Artest to get rid of him. He will look for a trade that makes the Pacers a better team.

But it could be 'dumping' him does make the team better if they feel he is a loose canon that cannot be trusted any longer to play within the team system... or feel that the other players have reached the breaking point in dealing with him internally.


-Bball

With all the crap ive been hearing ALL YEAR LONG from you guys about Artest's newfound maturity as a player, if this turns out to be the case..... :maniac:
See, I keep saying that he HAS matured, and I don't understand why people are ready to kill him more THIS year than last. It befuddles me. Unless I am blind, I do believe his behavior has improved, has it not?

Last year we had questions about the team hierarchy (particularly Isiah) and whether a change there could make any difference. Then we got Bird and Carlisle. Artest could start clean and both are proven entities. While his act PUBLICLY did clean up there were still incidents that were seen or heard about by all. There is also background stuff that was swept under the rug or in some cases not reported prominently or even immediately. And then there are things that can be called into question when you put the other stuff together.

If Artest is traded look for the floodgates to open when DW give Vescey the go ahead to print it... IMHO...

-Bball

Suaveness
06-22-2004, 03:30 PM
I don't understand how you people can know what goes on in his private life. How in the world do you know that he is a problem? I just don't see it.

Hicks
06-22-2004, 03:32 PM
I don't understand how you people can know what goes on in his private life. How in the world do you know that he is a problem? I just don't see it.

I've tried to explain it to you, but you've basically implied you think I'm either lying or making it up. Seems like denial to me. :shrug:

ChicagoJ
06-22-2004, 03:48 PM
What part of 'conduct detrimental to winning' do you not understand?

Here's what we know that's public information: He skips team flights and meetings. He hogs the ball. He breaks down the offense. He wants everyone else to do things his way, but he's not the coach, and he's not even the best or most important player on the team. The only thing he didn't do this year that he's done in the past is commit all of those stupid flagrant fouls. The tackle late in the Clippers game was the worst on-court display of his temper. But those flagrants and technicals were a symptom of a bigger problem, not the problem themselves. And the jury is still out as to whether or not he was faking an injury/ illness to get out of practice - which was a problem of Ron's in Chicago that was so well known that K.C. Johnson had to field questions about it in his Q&A column in the Trib.

Some of us wouldn't be putting up with the same $h!t from JO, and he's much much much much more valuable to the Pacers. But there's nothing to worry about here; JO is much more valuable to the Pacers, in part, because he realizes its all about the team and uses his leadership to build up the team.

Suaveness
06-22-2004, 04:17 PM
I don't understand how you people can know what goes on in his private life. How in the world do you know that he is a problem? I just don't see it.

I've tried to explain it to you, but you've basically implied you think I'm either lying or making it up. Seems like denial to me. :shrug:

It's not that I don't believe you, but like I told you, I won't believe anything unless something happens. That is the way i am going.


Plus someone has to defend him. ;)

Kstat
06-22-2004, 04:19 PM
Count me in the camp that would like to believe that Artest's issues stem from immaturity rather than inherent craziness. If he's back next season I'll continue to give him the benefit of the doubt.

However, for the sake of argument, let's say the threshold has been reached for Bird and Walsh to do something about it. If Memphis is somehow the team interested, how about the following (again, just for the sake of argument)

1. Artest for Posey + a future 1st rounder.

This deal does not currently work, but I think it would upon Artest's BYC status expiring. I know this seems a little thin for Artest. However, I think Posey can play the 2 spot effectively and is under a reasonalbe salary structure for the next few years.

2. Artest and Croshere for Posey and Outlaw

I believe this deal would have to transpire before Artest's BYC status expires. This deal is basically the same as scenario 1, except the Pacers could save over 20 million in cap space over the next three years (Croshere - 3 years at about 27mil, Outlaw - 1 year at 5.3mil).

Again, not what you might want in return for the DPOY and a 3rd team all-nba player, but let's face facts. Getting fair value in return for Artest will be difficult. Might a more probable scenario be a deal that returns an already quality and improving player (Posey) and pretty significant cap flexibility over the next few years?

If this is how low Artest's value has dropped, there must be a few dead bodies in Indianapolis we dont know about.....

Suaveness
06-22-2004, 04:20 PM
Maybe that is what people know that we don't....

TheSauceMaster
06-22-2004, 04:27 PM
To the few of you STILL in denial about Artest, WE ARE NOT REFERRING TO HIS ON-COURT ISSUES. THOSE HAVE IMPROVED. IT'S WHAT'S HAPPENED BEHIND-THE-SCENES THAT HAS HIM OUT THE DOOR.

Maybe by Christmas you'll all get that.

It's not a matter of denial , it was a matter of me hearing and reading , I realized there may have been problems behind the scences , but reall if you knew what happened with every team in the NBA , I am sure things happen that we never hear about , it took a Tmac possiable trade and now the truth is coming out about him.

I am not the type of person to go alot of rumors or here say ,I want too hear the facts or read it , it's clear Ron had alittle meltdown in the playoffs ,but compared to the previous year it's nothing.

I will be sad to see Ron go ig he does get traded he was actually becoming a real favorite of mine behind JO , but I don't have to deal with the problems and if it affects the team in a negative way and he must be moved , I can live with it. I would hope we could get something in return that would help ease the pain of losing Ron but I think it's gonna be hard.

fwpacerfan
06-22-2004, 04:28 PM
I don't think the Pacers are shopping Artest. I think they are shopping Harrington and all conversations switch to Artest. Of course I don't have any high level sources like some of you but then again I haven't seen any proof that these sources actually know what they are talking about. I doubt that DW and Bird have their meetings in the Cafeteria and invite all of the staff to sit in. I think there are many things going on that only Bird, DW and maybe Carlisle know about.

Edit:

I was tongue in cheek and I forget to add a smiley! :D

TheSauceMaster
06-22-2004, 04:31 PM
Well I see Donnie say in one Article there not Shopping Artest and I read in another Article they are desperately trying to trade Ron , You guys should know by now Donnie Walsh is not Mr Truth , Remember IT wasn't gonna be Fired ? I so I do believe they are shoping Artest , it fits the Donnie Walsh Smokescreen ;)

sweabs
06-22-2004, 05:49 PM
I figiured I would have been the last holdout, and maybe I will be to a small degree, I still love how the guy plays, but at some point enough is enough. I am a big believer in team chemistry.

My biggest fear is that the Pacers trade him in the next few weeks, (keep in mind he won't turn 25 until November) and in 2 or 3 years when he is in his prime at the ages of 27 and 28 years old that he matures to the point where he is not a distraction. And if that is the case he could be a star a top 6 player in the whole NBA. That is what I think of his talent and how hard he plays.

This is all very difficult for me

I completely agree with you UB...that is also my greatest fear.

I too, am a huge Artest fan and have been since his days in St. Johns. I am really hoping that the guys in the front office are willing to give Artest another couple years to let him improve.

Ron has so much raw talent that has yet to be fully uncovered - and if he can continue to make strides in his behaviour we are really going to lose out.

At this point, I am just hoping that LB and DW can find it in their hearts to give Ron another couple years (it's not like his contract is weighing us down...). God knows they've given Bender 5 years :cry:

TheSauceMaster
06-22-2004, 07:31 PM
The sad part is Ron is young and I agree he will mature and grow out of it , Perfect example Rasheed Wallace , yeah he has some small flashbacks but he is nothing like he used to be.

Like I said it's not my call , I don't have to deal with him on a professional level , but I don't think you get your trade value by trading Ron. Also if things like the Plane incident are known by leaugue sources I am sure there is a buzz in teams ears of his antics , so we may not be able to get a good value for him.

Ron is a emotinonal basketball player and alot of times when someone like that has such a passion for something it tends to cause conflict.

Also I find it funny that some people are playing this little game and you know what game , the one where you say I know x and x person and they said ..Blah Blah but I can't tell you what they said. If you can't say it then shut the bloody hell up , it's like a little kid at the play ground , I know something you don't know ..ha ha ha

Funny these people never announced there rumors before all this stuff came into question , what a perfect opprutinity to act like you have something no one else has :laugh:

It's not that I have doubts but I wanna see some proof , stuff in writing , not this He said , she said ******** ..it gets old real quick.

For the record I have sources also but I am not parading around here like some cat who just swallowed the canary.

Steveman
06-22-2004, 08:36 PM
Ron might have off the court issues, and I don't think Ron and JO can co-exist and win the championship. If the Artest lovers want to keep him, then we should trade JO and Tins to Miami for Odem and Wade, at least Lamar and Ron are good friends and there could be some chemistry there ;)