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DgR
07-02-2008, 04:05 PM
I think Quis is one of the main benefactors of us acquiring some decent screen setters and high IQ players and I think he can become a real weapon off the bench. He's already one of the few players on the roster who can create for himself and although he's terribly inconsistent I think he will produce (if given the chance- isn't this the last year of his contract?).

I know he's part of the bad image guys we want to get rid of but right now he's part of the team and can be an important part. Assuming he's still a Pacer next year where is he going to fit on the team? If he plays better than Rush- should he still be behind him in the rotation? We definitely don't need him as a PG anymore.

What are your thoughts concerning him?

2minutes twowa
07-02-2008, 04:14 PM
I like Quis as a utility guy off the bench. I know he was involved in the 8 second saloon deal, but I really don't lump him in with the trouble makers. He seems to have a decent attitude and gives the Pacers a different look when he's on the floor. I think you look at what trades are available for him since he has a team option for next year, but I don't think he has to be traded. If there isn't a trade that greatly improves the team, I would hang on to him this year, then probably not pick up his option next year.

Unclebuck
07-02-2008, 04:18 PM
I'm not ready to give up on him, he too played rather well the last 20 games or so of the saeason once he was no longer playing point guard at all.

Pacers
07-02-2008, 04:19 PM
Daniels is probably our 6th man, depending on rotation. I don't think Rush starts the season at the 2 (barring any move that gets rid of Dunleavy). Until Rush gets his bearings, Daniels is first off the bench.

LG33
07-02-2008, 04:20 PM
If we trade Shawne and keep Quis I will be pissed. That is my only thought.

Suaveness
07-02-2008, 04:32 PM
I'm not ready to give up on him, he too played rather well the last 20 games or so of the saeason once he was no longer playing point guard at all.


I thought we were supposed to be getting rid of trouble makers. Hasn't he made some poor decisions too?

RamBo_Lamar
07-02-2008, 04:33 PM
Quis is a knucklehead and I really hope he gets traded very soon.

Young
07-02-2008, 04:41 PM
My thoughts on Marquis are that if we have to keep him then so be it. Maybe we could get something around the trade deadline or at worst we let his contract expire.

I would like to trade him for a big man though. I don't know that he would net us anything decent.

He can be replaced very easily though. We have Granger, Dunleavy, Rush, Shawne and Graham and we can probably sign another solid swingman pretty cheaply.

DgR
07-02-2008, 04:59 PM
keeping Quis poses a problem in itself since we want ( I want) to develop Rush as quickly as possible- he's already known as one of the most NBA ready players in the draft. I dont want to keep him as a 3rd option in the 2 guard position but I have a feeling Quis could really blossom in next years offense. And if he is playing well we will have quite a dilema. He might be a knucklehead but I dont see it as one of our top priorities to get rid of him- I dont see him as a bad guy even if he did do something stupid with a bunch of other idiots who used to be on the team.

Pacers
07-02-2008, 05:09 PM
Sure would be nice to see him play well next season and deal him at the deadline.

BlueNGold
07-02-2008, 05:16 PM
He is a minor issue wrt off court issues....but his time is short. I would not be too concerned if he's not traded this summer.

...but his contract expires soon and might draw some interest.

Worst case, we keep him and he runs around Hibbert to get open...

CableKC
07-02-2008, 05:17 PM
If we are forced to play him ( maybe because Brandon isn't quite ready to be a 4th GF off the bench ), then I can see him benefitting from having a player like Hibbert on the floor with him.

However, as far as I am concerned....Marquis is the guy standing in the way of Brandon getting a consistent 10-12 minutes a game in his rookie season. For that very reason....I won't be disappointed if Marquis is traded.

317Kim
07-02-2008, 06:04 PM
I have absolutely nothing against Quis and I would love to see him stay.

duke dynamite
07-02-2008, 06:15 PM
He still owes me a pair of gold shin guards...

Roaming Gnome
07-02-2008, 06:31 PM
I actually like his mid-range game and hope that he can flourish with the new guys. I always liked how he would use his hands in the passing lanes to disrupt the opponents offense. As mentioned above...as long as we have no delusions of using him as a point guard...I think Marquise could add a little bit off the bench


Quis is a knucklehead and I really hope he gets traded very soon.

I personally don't feel he has done anything really to lump himself as the "knucklehead" that must go at all cost. I'm not opposed to trading him for more talent or something that improves the team, but I'm not down with a trade that makes us no better or nets us a worse contract because he ended up in a jacked up situation or two. Yeah, he is on paper thin ice, as he should be. But, I don't think he has done enough to warrent making this team worse just to be rid of him.

Isaac
07-02-2008, 07:16 PM
Rush will definitley be ahead of him in the rotation, I'm surprised people think otherwise. Brandon provides three point shooting and better defense than Quis, and his defense would be the reason JOB would play him.

Anthem
07-02-2008, 07:39 PM
Quis has proven that he can defend NBA players. I believe Rush will be able to, but saying that he's definitely a better defender than Quis right now is stretching a bit.

Also, I agree with UB that Quis should be much better now that he can play off ball.

McKeyFan
07-02-2008, 09:46 PM
I personally don't feel he has done anything really to lump himself as the "knucklehead" that must go at all cost.

It's not just 8-Second Saloon. It's that he dresses like a chicken.

He'a a knucklehead.

jeffg-body
07-02-2008, 10:10 PM
I have to admit that I like Quis as well, but we need help with bigs, specifically the 4 spot. It may mean we trade that expiring as a sweetener to get a descent PF.

Kuq_e_Zi91
07-02-2008, 10:26 PM
I don't have a problem with Quis either. I like his game, I just wish he was more consistent. I'd rather keep him unless something blows us away. You never know how he'll play during his contract year. He doesn't neccesarily have to play the 2 and take minutes from Brandon. He could play the 3 and back up Danny. Having Brandon and Quis out there together gives us nice perimeter D.

Hicks
07-02-2008, 10:54 PM
I guess my brain has washed out my memory of him looking better at the end of the year because my memory of Quis 2008 is "what happened?"

If we lose him in one form or another for the P.R., I wouldn't be offended at this point.

wintermute
07-02-2008, 11:44 PM
i agree that quis' skills would be useful to the team this year. on the other hand, i'd rather force feed granger and rush into developing go to moves than relying on quis.

i wouldn't be opposed to keeping quis for the year (both granger and rush need work on their ball handling) but after that i'd just let his contract expire for salary relief.

MyFavMartin
07-02-2008, 11:44 PM
I guess my brain has washed out my memory of him looking better at the end of the year because my memory of Quis 2008 is "what happened?"



I thought he pulled some bone headed plays and turnovers at the end of games that were extremely frustrating?

RamBo_Lamar
07-02-2008, 11:58 PM
It's not just 8-Second Saloon. It's that he dresses like a chicken.

He'a a knucklehead.


And it's not just that he is a knucklehead, or just one legal slip-up from
having the 8-Second Saloon charges brought back up.

He lacks durability and is injury prone. Those tweety-bird legs and knees
of his have already shown us that much. He is frail, and unless he is
spending substantially more time on conditioning his legs than going out
clubbing this summer, will be inconsequential over the course of the
season.

Would rather see the minutes alotted to developing the newer guys who
are our future anyway.

I think Quis is probably a nice guy and fun person to be around, however
the Pacers do not need him now, and there are likely better team situations
out there somewhere for him.

Roaming Gnome
07-03-2008, 12:04 AM
And it's not just that he is a knucklehead, or just one legal slip-up from
having the 8-Second Saloon charges brought back up.

He lacks durability and is injury prone. Those tweety-bird legs and knees
of his have already shown us that much. He is frail, and unless he is
spending substantially more time on conditioning his legs than going out
clubbing this summer, will be inconsequential over the course of the
season.

Would rather see the minutes alotted to developing the newer guys who
are our future anyway.

I think Quis is probably a nice guy and fun person to be around, however
the Pacers do not need him now, and there are likely better team situations
out there somewhere for him.

You know...You are probably right, but...

I don't want to see them take another crummy player with a longer contract because of the "P.R. Witch Hunt" going on. His value goes thru the roof about mid-season so why dump him now, for nuttin'?

Infinite MAN_force
07-03-2008, 01:08 AM
bury him at the end of the bench and let him expire.

I would much much much much much rather see B. Rush, Graham, Shawne, etc.. out there getting experience than see quis. We need to start developing some of the younger guys and quis is just standing in the way of that.

I don't understand why everyone wants to trade this guy after all the whining about cap room. Just keep him and let him expire. Same with Rasho. Trading quis means brining a longer contract back.

PR07
07-03-2008, 01:25 AM
I'd lean towards moving him at this point if a trade makes sense, but I wouldn't be mad to see him on the roster when the season starts up. He's an expiring contract essentially, so his contract is already pretty valuable to us. Still, it would be nice to have a clean roster with no players of prior off the court lawful misdeeds.

As for the player, I'm not really sure he fits this system. He does in the fact that he can handle the ball and initiate an offense from the wing position and defend, but he doesn't in the fact that he can't shoot a lick from 3 pt. range. It's also hard to rely on him to be a key rotational player when he is constantly having knee issues. Still, the Pacers generally were a much better team when Quis played...and played well.

I don't think there is enough time for B. Rush, Quis, and Shawne. Shawne looks like the odd man out at the moment, but I wouldn't be surprised to see Quis moved at some point.

Reckoner
07-03-2008, 05:46 AM
He's definately expendable but I wouldn't move him just for the sake of it.

With Dunleavy and Rush able to play the 3 he could still find some minutes at the 2. His ability to score quickly and offer something different could be very effective off the bench...and if he does well his trade value will only go up.

JayRedd
07-03-2008, 06:31 AM
Wing players who can't shoot or take someone off the bounce are pretty worthless in this system.

Quis' two best (only?) NBA skills are defense and finding open space in the middle of the floor (i.e., slashing). Give him the ball in the middle of the court when he has a little room and he'll score at an uncanny percentage. Give him the ball anywhere else on the court and he''ll hold it for a few seconds or dribble a few times and then look to hand it back to another wing player or make a sloppy pass to someone posting up. He won't make a creative pass. He won't see cutters or plays developing. He won't do anything effective off the dribble.

And his D might be above average, but he's not uber-aggressive enough to really be disruptive out there on the ball, so he's not really anything to be excited about on that end of the floor either.

In summation, he's just not very good.

Justin Tyme
07-03-2008, 07:27 AM
Shawne looks like the odd man out at the moment, but I wouldn't be surprised to see Quis moved at some point.


No, Shawne isn't the odd man out. In fact, it's a player no one even mentions anymore... it's Graham. Last season, when given a chance, Graham produced. So many posts were made wanting to see him get minutes of PT, b/c he produced when given PT. Now with Rush, Graham's become the forgotten soldier. It sort of reminds be of an old pet being cast aside for the excitment of a new one.

If Graham's not going to get any PT, then cut him with his $800,000 salary, so he can catch on with a team where he might have a chance to play. If Williams and Quis aren't moved, then there is no real reason to keep Graham. If the Pacers could cut Edwards and White with their guaranteed contracts, then they might as well cut Graham. Personally, I'm hoping both Shawne and Quis are traded. If for no other reason, than to give Graham a chance to play this season. Personally, I'm as interested in seeing what Graham can do with PT this season. JMOAA

BlueNGold
07-03-2008, 07:40 AM
Quis can create his own shot and defend...two things highly valued in the league. If he's healthy, we definitely lose a good bench player. I recall his absence being a significant negative last year.

But if Brandon Rush is as good or better, Quis immediately becomes expendable. With Jarrett Jack, he also faces some competition. In any event, Quis is on his way out within the next year or two.

Hicks
07-03-2008, 09:34 AM
bury him ... and let him expire.

:-o

Slick Pinkham
07-03-2008, 01:39 PM
Don Nelson supposedly loved the guy in Dallas as a PG.

Larry should make a call and see if Nellie wants him...

with Tinsley!






It's not like I dislike Quis, but if he can used to make up for the negative value of Tinsley, I'm all for it. A deal sending back draft picks would be nice, since I think the Warriors might be headed downhill.

PR07
07-03-2008, 02:08 PM
No, Shawne isn't the odd man out. In fact, it's a player no one even mentions anymore... it's Graham. Last season, when given a chance, Graham produced. So many posts were made wanting to see him get minutes of PT, b/c he produced when given PT. Now with Rush, Graham's become the forgotten soldier. It sort of reminds be of an old pet being cast aside for the excitment of a new one.

If Graham's not going to get any PT, then cut him with his $800,000 salary, so he can catch on with a team where he might have a chance to play. If Williams and Quis aren't moved, then there is no real reason to keep Graham. If the Pacers could cut Edwards and White with their guaranteed contracts, then they might as well cut Graham. Personally, I'm hoping both Shawne and Quis are traded. If for no other reason, than to give Graham a chance to play this season. Personally, I'm as interested in seeing what Graham can do with PT this season. JMOAA

Graham isn't that good. For a third stringer, he is...but in the grand scheme of things, no. Yes, he produced pretty well when given the opportunity, but most of his minutes were also against backups in garbage time, mostly when games got out of hand (with us mostly on the losing end). He's not forgotten, he's just a third string type player. A nice guy to have in the locker room because of his energy and work ethic, but a guy who really shouldn't be a rotational player on a good team. I'm glad he's on the roster though.

CableKC
07-03-2008, 02:20 PM
:-o
I agree with IMF....unless we can use him as some trading piece to get something of value that will help our rotation ( as in get a solid PF ) that won't severely limit our ability to resign all the players that we want to resign next season....then I would much rather park Marquis at the end of the bench.

This doesn't mean that his skills aren't valued.....the only time I wouldn't mind playing Marquis is IF there is an obvious situation that he can clearly take advantage of on the Offensive end. If there is a team that is using a lineup that has ZERO interior defense that has a very slow and ineffective Frontcourt, then I wouldn't putting him in to put up some points.

But in most cases, I would much rather give garbage and 3rd/4th/5th GF minutes to Brandon and Shawne. If we need defense at the PG/SG positions...I would much rather run a lineup of Jack and Brandon then give them to Marquis.

clownskull
07-03-2008, 02:40 PM
i'd say my biggest beef with quis is that he has proven himself to be injury prone. its not like he hasn't had opportunities throughout his career in this league to prove he can stay healthy (and he hasn't)
i'm tired of our team always having guys who we can pretty much count on missing a significant amount of time.

McKeyFan
07-03-2008, 03:50 PM
Graham isn't that good. For a third stringer, he is...but in the grand scheme of things, no. Yes, he produced pretty well when given the opportunity, but most of his minutes were also against backups in garbage time, mostly when games got out of hand (with us mostly on the losing end). He's not forgotten, he's just a third string type player. A nice guy to have in the locker room because of his energy and work ethic, but a guy who really shouldn't be a rotational player on a good team. I'm glad he's on the roster though.

We coulda used him post brawl, that's for sure.

Justin Tyme
07-03-2008, 03:55 PM
Graham isn't that good.

For a third stringer, he is...but in the grand scheme of things, no.

He's not forgotten, he's just a third string type player.

I'm glad he's on the roster though.

Says who? The samething was said about Nash and Billups! It seems to me JO was a 3rd or 4th stringer on a Portland team. W/o giving Graham a chance, who really knows?

Quis is a 3rd stringer, and he doesn't earn the 6.8mil salary he's being paid! I'd rather give the minutes to Graham to see what he can do at 1/8th the salary. How many games is Quis going to miss this season? 7-10, 11-15, or 16-20?

As far as I'm concerned, so is Williams, and a problem waiting to happen.

So am I, but I'd be even more glad to see JOB play him this year. Isn't that what JOB said previously, or is that just trying to be politically correct when discussing Graham?

Kemo
07-03-2008, 04:15 PM
No, Shawne isn't the odd man out. In fact, it's a player no one even mentions anymore... it's Graham. Last season, when given a chance, Graham produced. So many posts were made wanting to see him get minutes of PT, b/c he produced when given PT. Now with Rush, Graham's become the forgotten soldier. It sort of reminds be of an old pet being cast aside for the excitment of a new one.

If Graham's not going to get any PT, then cut him with his $800,000 salary, so he can catch on with a team where he might have a chance to play. If Williams and Quis aren't moved, then there is no real reason to keep Graham. If the Pacers could cut Edwards and White with their guaranteed contracts, then they might as well cut Graham. Personally, I'm hoping both Shawne and Quis are traded. If for no other reason, than to give Graham a chance to play this season. Personally, I'm as interested in seeing what Graham can do with PT this season. JMOAA



AMEN !!!!!!!!!!!

Besides Maceo Baston , Stephen Graham is another VERY UNDERRATED player that NEEDS to be given the opportunity to show everyone what most of us know he is capable of doing on the court...

Hell I don't see why early in the season , that J.O.B don't let Graham play 20+ minutes per game for 6 to 10 games.. to see what kind of player he has in Graham..

I hate it when coaches get the favortism thing goin.. and overlook good players for mediocre players like Quis and Flip Murray..

Bugs the crap out of me to see a potentially GREAT player on a team .. given the shaft ...to the point that his career never gets developed.. and he remains on the pine in obscurity collecting garbage minutes his whole career... or becomes a garbage-minute journeyman...

DgR
07-03-2008, 09:08 PM
I dont think JOB is giving minutes to players based on the order in which he likes them. The same was with Ike last season. Guys who play well at practice get more minutes. thats it. the coach's sole purpose is to put the best lineup that he possibly can in order to get more wins. we, the fans sometimes forget that the coach sees the players every day and knows a lot more about their abilities than we do. maybe Quis and the others just outplay Graham on a daily basis...the fact that Graham is still on the team just proves how much JOB likes him to give him more chances to improve and show he can be better than the guys currently ahead of him in the rotation.

Kuq_e_Zi91
07-04-2008, 05:10 AM
Please please please give Graham more minutes! When he is given the opportunity he produces.

Dec 11 @ Cle 7 pts 2 rbs in 5 min
Jan 19 vs Sac 15 pts 3 rbs in 17 min
Feb 5 vs SA 7 pts in 7 min
Feb 13th @ Det 9 pts 2 rbs in 12 min
Feb 29th (Danny's Suspension Game) @ Tor 16 pts 6 rbs 2 ast in 21 min
Mar 5 @ Hou 9 pts in 9 min
Mar 6 @ Sa 8 pts 4 rbs in 12 min

I don't get it. Just put him in the game and reap the benefits. He's a physical player, can play defense, get to the free throw line and make shots. Play him.

MillerTime
07-04-2008, 05:53 AM
Please please please give Graham more minutes! When he is given the opportunity he produces.

Dec 11 @ Cle 7 pts 2 rbs in 5 min
Jan 19 vs Sac 15 pts 3 rbs in 17 min
Feb 5 vs SA 7 pts in 7 min
Feb 13th @ Det 9 pts 2 rbs in 12 min
Feb 29th (Danny's Suspension Game) @ Tor 16 pts 6 rbs 2 ast in 21 min
Mar 5 @ Hou 9 pts in 9 min
Mar 6 @ Sa 8 pts 4 rbs in 12 min

I don't get it. Just put him in the game and reap the benefits. He's a physical player, can play defense, get to the free throw line and make shots. Play him.
he kind of reminds me of a Leon Powe, just good for off the bench engery. I dont think he'll be a good starter in this league

count55
07-04-2008, 07:21 AM
I like Quis as a utility guy off the bench. I know he was involved in the 8 second saloon deal, but I really don't lump him in with the trouble makers. He seems to have a decent attitude and gives the Pacers a different look when he's on the floor. I think you look at what trades are available for him since he has a team option for next year, but I don't think he has to be traded. If there isn't a trade that greatly improves the team, I would hang on to him this year, then probably not pick up his option next year.


If we are forced to play him ( maybe because Brandon isn't quite ready to be a 4th GF off the bench ), then I can see him benefitting from having a player like Hibbert on the floor with him.

However, as far as I am concerned....Marquis is the guy standing in the way of Brandon getting a consistent 10-12 minutes a game in his rookie season. For that very reason....I won't be disappointed if Marquis is traded.


Quis has proven that he can defend NBA players. I believe Rush will be able to, but saying that he's definitely a better defender than Quis right now is stretching a bit.

Also, I agree with UB that Quis should be much better now that he can play off ball.

The above kind of sum up my opinions about Quis. I think he's a serviceable bench player, but I don't see a long term future for him here. I am hopeful that B Rush and S Williams can play well enough to render him unnecessary. I don't see a need to pick up his option next year, but, at the same time, I wouldn't trade him unless I got something back that's going to help me with my rebuild.


AMEN !!!!!!!!!!!

Besides Maceo Baston , Stephen Graham is another VERY UNDERRATED player that NEEDS to be given the opportunity to show everyone what most of us know he is capable of doing on the court...

Hell I don't see why early in the season , that J.O.B don't let Graham play 20+ minutes per game for 6 to 10 games.. to see what kind of player he has in Graham..

I hate it when coaches get the favortism thing goin.. and overlook good players for mediocre players like Quis and Flip Murray..

Bugs the crap out of me to see a potentially GREAT player on a team .. given the shaft ...to the point that his career never gets developed.. and he remains on the pine in obscurity collecting garbage minutes his whole career... or becomes a garbage-minute journeyman...

Yikes! :eek:

wjs
07-04-2008, 08:03 AM
Please please please give Graham more minutes! When he is given the opportunity he produces.

I don't get it. Just put him in the game and reap the benefits. He's a physical player, can play defense, get to the free throw line and make shots. Play him.


Totally agree with this. Always looked forward to seeing Graham play. Usually, he played during garbage time, so we don't really know about him either way. I think he can be a decent player, and I think the Pacers do also.

As to Quis ... Quis, Shawne and Tinsley should be moved, in some combination, for the right deal. Any deal which sends out Tinsley is the right deal, because it will save cap space $$ arising from a buyout. Otherwise, we can use draft picks or a decent PF for some combination of this group. Of the three, I'd be willing to keep Shawne if we could not exchange him for reasonable value. Hopefully, as reported, Arenas re-signs with the Wiz, and Golden State finds a Quis/Tinsley package attractive enough to make a trade. I'd take Al back and trust Bird/OB's judgment whether to keep him or move him on to someone else.

Justin Tyme
07-04-2008, 09:59 AM
he kind of reminds me of a Leon Powe, just good for off the bench engery. I dont think he'll be a good starter in this league

Graham just needs to be given minutes to play to determine his ability. I'm not advocating him being starting material, but I believe he can be some nice rotational material.... not 3rd string sitting at the end of the bench towel waving 13-15 Eddie Gill type player.

Quis is a stumbling block to any growth chance Graham has by taking minutes he could be getting. I've seen enough of Quis to know he's not worth 6.8 mil as a 3rd stringer, and apparently Dallas saw his lack of value too!

Whoever made the decision to deal Cro and his expiring for Daniels didn't do the Pacers any favors, and that's putting it pretty darn politely. Cro's expiring was far worth more than Quis!

Infinite MAN_force
07-04-2008, 12:28 PM
Please please please give Graham more minutes! When he is given the opportunity he produces.

Dec 11 @ Cle 7 pts 2 rbs in 5 min
Jan 19 vs Sac 15 pts 3 rbs in 17 min
Feb 5 vs SA 7 pts in 7 min
Feb 13th @ Det 9 pts 2 rbs in 12 min
Feb 29th (Danny's Suspension Game) @ Tor 16 pts 6 rbs 2 ast in 21 min
Mar 5 @ Hou 9 pts in 9 min
Mar 6 @ Sa 8 pts 4 rbs in 12 min

I don't get it. Just put him in the game and reap the benefits. He's a physical player, can play defense, get to the free throw line and make shots. Play him.

That Toronto game in particular was immpressive because he was NOT playing garbage minutes at all. In fact, if memory serves, he sparked a scoring run that got us back in the game after being down.

I think he will be a servicable backup/energy guy if he ever gets a shot. If we ran a three man Dun-Rush-Granger rotation at the 2 and 3, I would love to hold on to graham as a cheap solution and "next guy up" in case of an injury or foul trouble, or if someone is just having an off night. I would much rather see him in this role than Marquis. by far.

JayRedd
07-04-2008, 01:53 PM
Quis can create his own shot

News to me.