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View Full Version : When is David Harrison off the roster?



Putnam
07-01-2008, 08:02 AM
The Pacers.com site still has David Harrison listed on the roster as of 4am this morning (when it was last updated.) But isn't this the day when old contracts expire and new contracts begin?

Harrison is a restricted free agent. I understand that means the Pacers can match any offer and keep him. But, assuming they aren't going to match any offers, when does Harrison become morally, ethic'lly,
spiritually, physically, positively, absolutely, undeniably and reliably an ex-Pacer?

Will Galen
07-01-2008, 08:09 AM
He's not on the roster except as a hold. That will disappear when he signs with another club. Or the season starts of course.

Putnam
07-01-2008, 08:21 AM
That means he is officially off the roster when he signs with another club.


Do the Pacers have to continue paying him?

Will Galen
07-01-2008, 08:30 AM
Do the Pacers have to continue paying him?
As of today he is no longer under contract, so no.

Will Galen
07-01-2008, 08:37 AM
As of today he is no longer under contract, so no.

EDIT; Regarding the roster. After July 9th they will add the new players and subtract JO and Ike, but will probably leave the rest of the roster as is until it's finalized.

Sometimes you see roster changes the next day and other times it doesn't change until it has to. Probably depends on who is in charge of changing it.

count55
07-01-2008, 08:58 AM
The Pacers.com site still has David Harrison listed on the roster as of 4am this morning (when it was last updated.) But isn't this the day when old contracts expire and new contracts begin?

Harrison is a restricted free agent. I understand that means the Pacers can match any offer and keep him. But, assuming they aren't going to match any offers, when does Harrison become morally, ethic'lly,
spiritually, physically, positively, absolutely, undeniably and reliably an ex-Pacer?

The ruling on the requirements for the restriction for David would seem to be:


In order to make their free agent a restricted free agent, a team must submit a qualifying offer to the player by June 30. The amount of the qualifying offer for players on rookie "scale" contracts is based on the player's draft position (see question number 41). The qualifying offer for all other players must be for 125% of the player's previous salary, or the player's minimum salary (see question number 11) plus $175,000, whichever is greater. The qualifying offer must be for one season. A player can elect to accept his qualifying offer (the qualifying offer must be accepted by March 1) and play the following season under its terms. This is sometimes done in order to become an unrestricted free agent the following summer (see question number 38).

If the player is coming off the fourth year of his rookie scale contract, then in addition to a qualifying offer, his team can also submit a maximum qualifying offer. A maximum qualifying offer is for six seasons at the maximum salary with 10.5% annual raises. It can contain no options, ETOs or bonuses of any kind, and must be fully guaranteed. When a team submits a maximum qualifying offer (in essence "stepping up" with a maximum contract offer before the player even hits the market), it places a more stringent requirement on other teams' offer sheets (see below).

If I'm reading this correctly, for the Pacers to maintain the restriction (right of first refusal) on David, they would've had to already tender him a 1-year offer at around $2.6mm. I have not heard that they made that offer, and I doubt that they will, for fear of the very good possibility that Harrison would accept.

Therefore, I believe we will either hear very soon that David is, in fact, an unrestricted free agent.

Will Galen
07-01-2008, 09:58 AM
The ruling on the requirements for the restriction for David would seem to be:



If I'm reading this correctly, for the Pacers to maintain the restriction (right of first refusal) on David, they would've had to already tender him a 1-year offer at around $2.6mm. I have not heard that they made that offer, and I doubt that they will, for fear of the very good possibility that Harrison would accept.

Therefore, I believe we will either hear very soon that David is, in fact, an unrestricted free agent.

I think you are right. The probability is David is a unrestricted free agent as of today. I don't think the Pacers want him back.

duke dynamite
07-01-2008, 12:13 PM
You know, the webmasters aren't always ready to jump the gun when it comes to updating the rosters and everything, so I wouldn't expect much to change until the 9th when we get Ford and the draftees.

d_c
07-01-2008, 12:17 PM
The Pacers.com site still has David Harrison listed on the roster as of 4am this morning (when it was last updated.) But isn't this the day when old contracts expire and new contracts begin?

Harrison is a restricted free agent. I understand that means the Pacers can match any offer and keep him. But, assuming they aren't going to match any offers, when does Harrison become morally, ethic'lly,
spiritually, physically, positively, absolutely, undeniably and reliably an ex-Pacer?

Harrison is no longer a Pacer when he either signs with another team (and the Pacers decide not to match) or the Pacers renounce their rights to Harrison (he could still come back as a Pacer if this happens but it's unlikely).

Naptown_Seth
07-01-2008, 12:32 PM
Harrison is no longer a Pacer when he either signs with another team (and the Pacers decide not to match) or the Pacers renounce their rights to Harrison (he could still come back as a Pacer if this happens but it's unlikely).
Exactly. The issue as I understand it is one of potential cap space. The cap hold stays in plays till you say "I will not keep this player" or another team gives him a contract. Then you have a drop dead date when he is officially not on your roster/cap regardless of what you have officially announced.

Typically teams aren't in a rush to officially change a status unless it helps their situation. For one example, your cap holds also include the MLE space, but if by renouncing players you have yet to resign you go below the cap level despite all the remaining holds then you lose those exceptions (they are exceptions to the rule that if you are over the cap you can't sign anyone, much like trade exceptions that let you take on an additional 25%+100K in contracts...or forfeit that amount in order to conclude the deal later as we saw with Harrington).


I don't think they gain anything by keeping David right now, but I also don't think they gain anything by letting him go either.


And no, this costs the Pacers zilch. They didn't extend his current deal so as of "next" season (basically now) he's not getting paychecks anymore unless he got a deal to extend his pay over a longer period of time than he was actually playing. I think guys sometimes do that but I'm not 100%. No cap hit, just a thing where for your own benefit you spread your pay out over a longer period.

Mourning
07-01-2008, 01:14 PM
SOON! :happydanc :woohoo:

SoupIsGood
07-01-2008, 01:29 PM
SOON! :happydanc :woohoo:
:(

Justin Tyme
07-01-2008, 02:08 PM
The ruling on the requirements for the restriction for David would seem to be:



If I'm reading this correctly, for the Pacers to maintain the restriction (right of first refusal) on David, they would've had to already tender him a 1-year offer at around $2.6mm. I have not heard that they made that offer, and I doubt that they will, for fear of the very good possibility that Harrison would accept.

Therefore, I believe we will either hear very soon that David is, in fact, an unrestricted free agent.


Isn't this what happened to Tony Allen? Boston didn't make him an offer, and he's now a UFA.

count55
07-01-2008, 02:11 PM
Isn't this what happened to Tony Allen? Boston didn't make him an offer, and he's now a UFA.

Yes, I believe that is correct.

d_c
07-01-2008, 02:13 PM
Isn't this what happened to Tony Allen? Boston didn't make him an offer, and he's now a UFA.

Yes, but that doesn't mean his right have been renounced.

By not giving him a tender offer, it just means you're giving up the first right of refusal (the right to match offers other teams make).

That said, this is just all technical stuff. Harrison probably won't be a Pacer next year and it doesn't matter which exat day he's officially gone.

All you need to know is he won't be on the opening day roster.

Mourning
07-01-2008, 02:57 PM
:(

Come on now... we got Hibbert just for you ;).

Justin Tyme
07-01-2008, 03:19 PM
All you need to know is he won't be on the opening day roster.


That was a given last season when they wouldn't give Harrison a qualifying offer. The handwriting was on the wall, and Harrison did nothing during the season to change it. And to think if he had he'd be in right place with the Pacers needing a big who could score down low and defend. What a waste GOD of given talent! There isn't a lot of demand for 7' counter help at Mickey D's.

NuffSaid
07-01-2008, 04:08 PM
This is alittle off-topic, but assuming (correctly) that David Harrison's days as a Pacers are over and given that Courtney Sims is back on the Summer League roster, what are the odds that Sims actually makes the cut this year?

Centers: Hibbert, Foster, Nesterovic
PFs: Murphy, Baston

By the numbers, I'd say his odds are once again very long.

SoupIsGood
07-01-2008, 04:11 PM
Come on now... we got Hibbert just for you ;).


And Rashoooooo. :)

LG33
07-01-2008, 05:19 PM
David Harrison never leaves.

aceace
07-01-2008, 07:42 PM
Courtney Sims is not currently one of the 16 players we have under contract. Unless we do some dealin', he's on display for other teams to take a look at.

NuffSaid
07-02-2008, 11:47 AM
Courtney Sims is not currently one of the 16 players we have under contract.
I know that. (Duh! :rolleyes:) Was just wondering what others thought of his chances of making the team this time considering it's his 3rd(?) time around and he did make the training camp (pre-season) roster last year.


Unless we do some dealin', he's on display for other teams to take a look at.
That's a given.

BTW, does anyone know if David Harrison has his own website or a blog that he routinely posts to?

JayRedd
07-02-2008, 12:09 PM
Don't let that wall hit you on the way out.

pizza guy
07-02-2008, 12:16 PM
David Harrison never leaves.

There will always be a little piece of him with us.

LG33
07-02-2008, 01:06 PM
Don't let that wall hit you on the way out.

He always was serious about his water.

Speed
07-02-2008, 01:24 PM
He always was serious about his water.

Yes, he was a great actor, if anything. Dry erase boards are safe, for now. However, there are some local dealers who are saddened.

Putnam
09-25-2008, 09:38 AM
:bump:

"I'm waitiiiiing"

http://keitholbermannisevil.files.wordpress.com/2007/03/wallace-shawn-vizzini.jpg

count55
09-25-2008, 09:52 AM
I'm thinking you're probably waiting for Andre Owens to be removed from that roster, as well, and he's already signed overseas.

They'll probably take them off if Harrison signs with another NBA team or training camp starts, and he's not there.

Harrison is off the roster, but he's listed probably because we retain his rights (Bird, not matching).

Tinsley, on the other hand, is actually still a Pacer.

Putnam
09-25-2008, 10:51 AM
Thanks count55. I understood from your earlier explanation that there's nothing going on and the roster as stated on Pacers.com is not definite.

I just want to see Harrison's name off the roster so I can say:


"My team is on the floor."

http://angryorange55.files.wordpress.com/2008/03/normandale.jpg

count55
09-25-2008, 10:55 AM
Thanks count55. I understood from your earlier explanation that there's nothing going on and the roster as stated on Pacers.com is not definite.

I just want to see Harrison's name off the roster so I can say:


"My team is on the floor."

http://angryorange55.files.wordpress.com/2008/03/normandale.jpg


That's why I keep waiting for Tinsley to come off the roster, too. ;)

Bball
09-25-2008, 02:21 PM
Maybe Tinsley can play for Terhune?

-Bball

count55
09-25-2008, 02:38 PM
Maybe Tinsley can play for Terhune?

-Bball

Oolitic

Putnam
09-25-2008, 03:25 PM
Terhune?


Oolitic

Or Muncie Central.


Whatever the case, I am totally going to sit over there at Pacers.com and refresh the screen every 10 seconds for as long as it takes until Bruno gets Harrison off the roster.

See you all after that!

duke dynamite
09-25-2008, 05:16 PM
Oolitic
Oh no...keep that away from me. We live in a quiet neighborhood!

Adrian
09-28-2008, 10:32 AM
David Harrison worked out for Chicago the other day.
Thought you should know...
www.rumorpress.net (http://www.rumorpress.net)

"The Bulls still could add a veteran big man before the season begins as well. The team has recently worked out former Bull Michael Ruffin and Indiana Pacers David Harrison. The Bulls also have talked about bringing in 14 year veteran Juwan Howard, who spent last season with the Mavericks as well as Bonzi Wells, who spent last season with the New Orleans Hornets. But once again, no veteran big man will likely be added until Ben Gordonís situation is cleared up."

RamBo_Lamar
09-28-2008, 11:24 AM
David Harrison worked out for Chicago the other day.
Thought you should know...


Well lets hope Harrison doesn't end up getting picked up by Chicago or any
other NBA team. That could mean dissapointing alot of Liaoning Hunters
(Chinese CBA) fans.

http://www.pacersdigest.com/apache2-default/showthread.php?t=41216&highlight=hunters

Harrison would have much greater entertainment value if he was in China.

:thumbup:

BlueNGold
09-28-2008, 12:16 PM
David Harrison worked out for Chicago the other day.
Thought you should know...
www.rumorpress.net (http://www.rumorpress.net)

"The Bulls still could add a veteran big man before the season begins as well. The team has recently worked out former Bull Michael Ruffin and Indiana Pacers David Harrison. The Bulls also have talked about bringing in 14 year veteran Juwan Howard, who spent last season with the Mavericks as well as Bonzi Wells, who spent last season with the New Orleans Hornets. But once again, no veteran big man will likely be added until Ben Gordonís situation is cleared up."

It really seems strange to hear David even indirectly described as a "veteran big man". He still seems like a troubled, tantrum throwing 12 year old to me....after several years in the league. ...and I had hope for that guy too...so sad...

Putnam
10-03-2008, 11:28 AM
It's done!



http://www.nba.com/pacers/roster/index.html




:happydanc:dance::pepper::jump::bdance::fireworks



Yeah, I know the roster on pacers.com isn't definitive and Harrison was gone from the time his contract expired. But it makes me happy seeing he's off the list.

Be happy with me. Let's all drink some water to celebrate!

Hicks
10-03-2008, 11:29 AM
I almost bumped this for you a couple days ago when I first noticed he disappeared, but I wanted you to have your moment.

!Pacers-Fan!
10-03-2008, 09:56 PM
Harrison Is Useless.

SoupIsGood
10-03-2008, 10:06 PM
:(

imawhat
10-03-2008, 11:11 PM
I almost bumped this for you a couple days ago when I first noticed he disappeared, but I wanted you to have your moment.

Likewise. I noticed on Tuesday, but wanted to see how long it'd take.

Speed
10-05-2008, 07:49 AM
Harrison Is Useless.


Well at least he has a sure fire fallback career.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cdKODCBH28I&feature=related