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View Full Version : Projected Lineups (As of 06.29.08)



duke dynamite
06-29-2008, 03:52 AM
We've gotten off track in other threads, so I took the liberty of creating a new one with all your opinions on what our lineups should look like barring no more trades. (You guys are allowed to talk trades and the possible booting of Tinsley.)

Feel free to explain why you think your lineup is the ideal one for the upcoming season. You can quote or link your lineups from other threads if you like. Oh, and please no arguing!

Thanks!

Ford>Jack>Diener>>>>>>>Tinsley
Dunleavy>B. Rush>K.Rush>Daniels
Granger>Williams
Murphy>McRoberts
Foster>Hibbert>Nesterovic

I don't really see Shawne staying around much longer, but if not, I see him coming off the bench for Danny. He really has a lot more to prove with the team barring some off-court incident waiting to happen.

As much as I like Kareem and Marquis, I suspect they will be gone one way or the other. Jeff Foster's days are numbered but again, he is our leading rebounder and can be a driving force if needed.

Troy Murphy is capable of playing power forward, he isn't fast, but fast enough. He can drive through the lane with little or no effort what so ever. He is also great with coming up with a deep jump shot if absolutely necessary.

granger33
06-29-2008, 03:54 AM
Yeh that's the same lineup Im thinking about.

I just find it a real pitty Diener is going to get nearly, next to no game time thanks to aquireing Jarrett Jack. after he performed IMO so well in the last 20+ games.

When he found his stroke he was great. Also his assist/TO ratio was awesome.

duke dynamite
06-29-2008, 03:59 AM
Yeh that's the same lineup Im thinking about.

I just find it a real pitty Diener is going to get nearly, next to no game time thanks to aquireing Jarrett Jack. after he performed IMO so well in the last 20+ games.

When he found his stroke he was great. Also his assist/TO ratio was awesome.
Yeah, it will be Orlando all over again for Travee.

avoidingtheclowns
06-29-2008, 08:17 AM
i think you're undervaluing rasho quite a bit. in fact, i wouldn't be surprised if opening night our lineup was

ford / dunleavy / granger / foster / rasho

at least if we still have both guys. then you play murphy with hibbert off the bench -- seems to make more sense in the o'brien offense.

Kegboy
06-29-2008, 09:09 AM
I think you're undervaluing Murphy, ATC. I don't see how Jimmy doesn't start him.

avoidingtheclowns
06-29-2008, 09:25 AM
I think you're undervaluing Murphy, ATC. I don't see how Jimmy doesn't start him.

it isn't undervaluing per se. i just think the rasho & foster, murphy & hibbert combo might work better - mainly for defensive and rebounding reasons.

ford / dunleavy / granger / foster / rasho
jack / b. rush / baston / murphy / hibbert

once again, this assumes that all four are still on the team in november.

Cobol Sam
06-29-2008, 10:13 AM
Could Diener see some time on the court as a Second PG? There are some up tempo teams playing 2 point guards.

avoidingtheclowns
06-29-2008, 10:26 AM
yeah, you could see a little of that. jack and steve blake did a lot of that last season, with jack at the 2.

Justin Tyme
06-29-2008, 10:29 AM
it isn't undervaluing per se. i just think the rasho & foster, murphy & hibbert combo might work better - mainly for defensive and rebounding reasons.

ford / dunleavy / granger / foster / rasho
jack / b. rush / baston / murphy / hibbert

once again, this assumes that all four are still on the team in november.


I'd rather see Graham substituted for Baston at SF. I feel posters are undervaluing Graham! But if Williams and Quis aren't traded I can see JOB not giving him anymore PT than last year.

pianoman
06-29-2008, 10:42 AM
I'd rather have baston taking up the backup pf spot than mcroberts

Hicks
06-29-2008, 12:00 PM
What I'd like to see, but it's probably way too soon:

Ford
B.Rush
Granger
Murphy
Hibbert

What it will probably be at first:

Ford
Dunleavy
Granger
Murphy
Nesterovic (or Foster)

If here, prominent backups:

Jack, Dunleavy, Williams, Foster, Nesterovic

or in the second instance

Jack, B.Rush, Williams, Foster or Nesterovic, Hibbert

idioteque
06-29-2008, 12:14 PM
I think people are tending to forget that rookies really shouldn't be expected to start their first year unless they are like one of the top 3 or 4 picks in the draft.

I see it as:

Ford
Dunleavy
Granger
Murphy
Foster

6 Jarrett Jack
7 Rasho Nesterovic
8 Shawne Williams
9 Brandon Rush
10 Roy Hibbert
11 Travis Deiner
12 Marquis Daniels

At least that's what I'm hoping. Yes, I have Quis as the 12th man, but our roster is really jam packed and I am sure if Shawne is playing poorly Quis will get his time.

And that doesn't even account for Baston or Stephen Graham, I guess they will be looking good in suits. Even though I am a Baston fan and I wouldn't mind having him on the active roster.

Infinite MAN_force
06-29-2008, 01:06 PM
Yeah, on opening day... I would probably not expect to see the rookies starting. Though I woulden't be terribly surprised if they start Hibbert.

Ford/Jack
Dunleavy/Rush
Granger/Rush
Foster/Murphy
Nesterovic/Hibbert

That will probably be the sort of 9 man rotation Obrien likes.

I think the eventual intended starting lineup will be this...

Ford/Jack
Rush/Dunleavy
Granger/Dunleavy
Murphy/Foster
Hibbert/Nesterovic (later to be replaced by stanko :D)

I honestly think the frontcourt for next season is, while unspectacular, pretty solid.

I personally hope we keep shawne williams and fit him into this puzzle somehow though. I would love to see him playing murphy's role at the 4 spot. I think his body could handle it if he bulked up a little. If he puts on 20 pounds he could be like a three point shooting Antonio Mcdyess.

If shawne realized his potential he could be the missing piece at the 4 spot.

imawhat
06-29-2008, 04:40 PM
What I'd like to see, but it's probably way too soon:

Ford
B.Rush
Granger
Murphy
Hibbert

What it will probably be at first:

Ford
Dunleavy
Granger
Murphy
Nesterovic (or Foster)

If here, prominent backups:

Jack, Dunleavy, Williams, Foster, Nesterovic

or in the second instance

Jack, B.Rush, Williams, Foster or Nesterovic, Hibbert

As the roster stands now, that's exactly how I see it.

I would highly prefer the first lineup you posted, or perhaps with Nesterovic/Jack in the lineup. I think we sorely need defense in the starting lineup. Ford obviously provides better penetration and would be more effective with Murphy than Jack. Rush in the starting lineup makes the perimeter defense better while providing a big burst of scoring off the bench from Dunleavy. Nesterovic will get better rebounding numbers than Hibbert, which will be sorely needed. Having Jack in the starting lineup provides better backcourt defense and slightly better 3 point shooting (Ford slightly worse than Tinsley, Jack slightly better than Tinsley), though penetration isn't as great. I think Ford would be really good with Dunleavy and Foster off the bench, but he's better utilized when paired with shooters. Plus, Jack will be better utilized as a shooter, with Dunleavy, off the bench with Hibbert's ability to pass out of the post. Dunleavy, Foster, and Hibbert probably give us the best fundamental bench in the league. However, Hibbert is great at passing low and high, so he'll find good cutters like Rush/Ford high and good shooters from low.

The lineup that we'll most likely have will be interesting. The positives include having a penetrating passer with the ability to kick it to three shooters in Dunleavy, Granger, and Murphy. He's a better penetrator than Tinsley (actually, Tinsley and Ford's career numbers are eerily similar in mpg & apg, with Ford having a slightly higher PPG most likely due to his slighly higer FG%). Nesterovic will get Foster-like numbers, but less rebounds and more blocks. And since we're built as an outside-in team, this will most likely give us our best offensive lineup.

However, I think it's more valuable to have much better defense against other teams' starting offenses at the cost of not having our best offensive weapons in the starting lineup. I think it provides us with a lot more balance, and we won't have to rely on shooting our way back into the game.

croz24
06-29-2008, 04:54 PM
if you truly believe mcroberts is in our rotation this year, then we are a lock for the worst record in the league.

Eindar
06-29-2008, 05:22 PM
It's tricky, because as slated, Tinsley is still on the roster, and if he's still on the roster on opening day, it's a dogfight between him and Ford for the starting PG spot, with the other one getting all the leftover minutes. In other words, Jack better buy a suit until one of those two get injured if Tinsley isn't traded.

Other than that, I think it's pretty much as everyone else says, and I see the starting lineup as:

Ford
Dunleavy
Granger
Foster
Nesterovic

Reason I pick Nesterovic over Murphy is that he's got a higher FG%, plays better post D, and is a threat to block shots. His numbers don't show all that well, but he does a lot of small, good things, which is why the Spurs kept him around. Putting Foster with him gives us someone to grab rebounds, which is probably Rasho's big weakness. Hibbert and Murphy pair well together because Hibbert has a post game and should be a good passer and Murphy will spread the floor for him.

Ownagedood
06-29-2008, 05:58 PM
Im guessing this will be close to our lineup.. Of course you never know because there is a lot of summer left and deals could be made..

Ford/Tinsley/Jack/Diener?
Dunleavy/B. Rush/K.Rush
Granger/Daniels/Baston?
Foster/Murphy/Williams?
Rasho/Hibbert/Harrison?

Like it or not, Tinsley is still better then Jack and Diener if we decide to play him.. No reason to put an undersized Foster at Center anymore since we have two, possibly three 7+ footers.

And remember, Rasho started for the Spurs, so he obviously can play.

My list being a total 15 man roster(Minus the one least likely to make the team), three would have to be in a suit.. Probably Diener, Harrison and Baston.. Although I rather play Baston then Daniels, I just never trust daniels.

EDIT: I also want to add in Graham in, but I just can't find out where he would fit with all the other talent that we have.. Unless we trade someone.

Hicks
06-29-2008, 06:02 PM
I don't think Tinsley will be back.

Dece
06-29-2008, 06:13 PM
I don't understand wanting Diener to see the court, I'm very happy that even without Tinsley we have 2 guys who are vastly superior to him in every possible way.

Rasho will probably be a starter, he's actually a very solid player.

Ford/Jack
Dunleavy/Rush
Granger/Rush
Murphy/Foster
Rasho/Hibbert

I basically see our 2-3 as a 3 man rotation of Dun/Rush/Granger, mostly because I don't think Williams will be here, and realistically most teams aren't playing 10 man rotations most the time anyway, I think this 9 man rotation is our best bet, with Williams*if here*/Marquis only seeing minutes during people's off nights and/or foul trouble.

OpenWheel
06-29-2008, 06:56 PM
Tinsley is awful. He has no business playing significant minutes on any team. If he's better than Jack, that wasn't a good trade with Portland. When Tinsley became our PG of the future I figured the team had little future.

I like the looks of some of the lineups. I'm one who has hope for McRoberts. Of course he has to raise his game if he wants to see the court. But as a wildcard, maybe he can. Nesterovic won't be a bad option in the middle, and Foster has been a decent player for the team, I have no beef if he plays. But I hope Hibbert gets a lot of time, he won't develop or get in shape for a long NBA season sitting on the pine.

I expect Rush to get a lot of minutes, at either the two, or as a slightly out of position three when they use a quick lineup.

Ownagedood
06-29-2008, 07:17 PM
Tinsley is awful. He has no business playing significant minutes on any team.
Are you kidding me?? People forget how much skill he really has.. He just has two big downers.. He gets into trouble off court, and is injured often.. Just look at the numbers.. They don't lie..http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=1024

Ya, It's better he's not on our team, because of his off court actions, but don't say he's horrible, the guy can play...When he does.

He was actually having a career year last year, before the injury. Now saying all this, I am by no means a Tinsley supporter, But I just have to back him up that he can play ball.. But I really do hope he isn't on our roster next season.

OpenWheel
06-29-2008, 07:25 PM
Sure, he can dish.

I'm just not a fan of someone tossing up rocks. Which is a generous term for Tinsley's shooting.

I think he's an adequate back up for when you play a running game. Otherwise, deep pine.

Never thought he was much, and I don't think I'm wrong. I understand differing opinions though.

Dece
06-29-2008, 08:52 PM
So tinsley is a serviceable backup at best, but you think McRoberts could become useful.

I gotta say you aren't much of a talent scout, do you even watch basketball?

Jose Slaughter
06-29-2008, 08:53 PM
I invision Ford & Jack as our rotation at point.

I'm with Duce on our 2/3 rotation, with a slight twist. It might be just me but I see Rush as just playing the 2. Whoever is on the court with him will be the 3. Starting out it more than likely will be Granger & Dunleavy as the starters but its only a matter of time before Rush replaces Dunleavy in the lineup & Granger moves to strictly a SF.

As of now Murphy should be our starter at the 4. Foster should see some minutes there with Baston as an option depending on matchups. I believe Foster will be moved for a more traditional 4 sometime between now & the trade deadline. At that time Murphy might still be the starter & the new guy his backup, or the other way around. Either way, Baston is our 3rd string 4.

Nesterovic is just to expereinced to not get the starters spot over Hibbert. I think Hibbert's minutes will go up as the season goes on. If any player could be pointed to as not hitting a rookie wall it will be Hibbert.

So........

Ford - Jack
Granger - Rush
Dunleavy - Granger
Murphy - Foster/Baston
Nesterovic - Hibbert

I don't see Tinsley being around more than a couple more weeks.

Diener gets moved down the bench but with Ford on our roster we need a 3rd PG & Diener would be as good a 3rd as any in the league.

Daniels could make the team but with him being an endng contract he could be moved for a solid bench player.

Williams could be moved with Daniels to sweeten the deal for the other team.

McRoberts more than likely will be waived.

Harrison has a team option that shouldn't be picked up. Thanks Dave, see ya!

Pacerized
06-29-2008, 09:09 PM
I'd go with that. It's a good sized lineup, but with a 1, or 2 player tweek we can play bigger, or smaller and still have a decent lineup. I hope we can get something from Tins, Harrison, and McRoberts, even a 2cd. rounder would be nice.




I see it as:

Ford
Dunleavy
Granger
Murphy
Foster

6 Jarrett Jack
7 Rasho Nesterovic
8 Shawne Williams
9 Brandon Rush
10 Roy Hibbert
11 Travis Deiner
12 Marquis Daniels

At least that's what I'm hoping. Yes, I have Quis as the 12th man, but our roster is really jam packed and I am sure if Shawne is playing poorly Quis will get his time.

And that doesn't even account for Baston or Stephen Graham, I guess they will be looking good in suits. Even though I am a Baston fan and I wouldn't mind having him on the active roster.

OpenWheel
06-29-2008, 09:34 PM
So tinsley is a serviceable backup at best, but you think McRoberts could become useful.

I gotta say you aren't much of a talent scout, do you even watch basketball?

Sure, I watch a lot of bb. Admittedly I didn't watch Tinsley's breakout year last year as I didn't get many Pacer games and didn't think they had a future anyway.

I'm saying McRoberts is a wildcard who could be servicable if his head is one size smaller than coming out of college, yes.

I don't think teams can win with Tinsley. Although again, I missed his breakout and improved shooting.

Anyway, Tinsley or lack of Tinsley is probably OT without other lineup talk. Maybe we can debate talent scouting later. I'll bow out for now.

Anthem
06-29-2008, 10:39 PM
Wheel, Tinsley's problem isn't his work ethic. He comes into camp every year looking pretty good... he's been doing summer work for years.

His problem is his head. Dude just ain't smart... about himself, who he hangs with, how he spends his time, when to go one-on-one, when to go one-on-five, etc. He's got the gifts, but doesn't know what to do with him.

Also, he's not good in the open court... he's much better in the halfcourt.

I'm really not sure we're watching the same guy.

OpenWheel
06-29-2008, 10:45 PM
Hmm, we aren't watching the same guy. Because to me, he's a liabaility as a shooter which makes him not so hot in the half court since you can sag off of him.

I think he's a capable ballhandler though and can penetrate some, along with some decent passes, hence my running game thing even though I have never thought of him as quick. But I don't like him much in the half court.

I'm not saying he could never play. But even several years ago I wasn't a fan. And now he's beat up and older.

I never knocked his work ethic, I don't know anything about that.

CableKC
06-29-2008, 11:52 PM
At the beginning of the season, I'm expecting:

Starters:

PG - Ford
SG - Dunleavy
SF - Granger
PF - Murphy
C - Rasho

Reserves ( in order )

6 ) Jack
7 ) Foster
8 ) Shawne
9 ) Brandon
10 ) Hibbert

I expect that we would start with the Vets at the start of the season. I want to ensure that Brandon and Hibbert get some solid minutes and hope to spread out the Big Man PF/C minutes somewhat evenly among Murphy/Foster/Rasho/Hibbert. As long as both Brandon and Hibbert get an average of about 10-12 minutes a game...then I am happy.

But I am hoping that after the ASB that we can move Brandon ahead of Shawne in the SG/SF rotation and then find a way to increase Hibbert's minutes....likely at the expense of Rasho.

BlueNGold
06-30-2008, 12:10 AM
Those are going to be pretty solid reserves IMO. I would like to see normal rotations where the reserves play together consistently.

I hope to see Hibbert and Foster in the starting lineup though. I suspect those two will provide a solid tandem in the middle on defense.

Noodle
06-30-2008, 12:38 AM
We have players that are good in motion, and we have players that are good in half-court. Expect line-ups on the floor that reflect that. JOb will start with the gunners.

Ford
Dun
Granger
Murphy
Nest

The half-court team will look like this.

Jack
Rush
Williams
Foster
Hibbert

Pairing Foster/Hibbert and Murphy/Nest gives JOb combos that can provide scoring from his bigs, courtesy of Troy and Roy. Murphy wil score in the high post, and Hibbert in the low. Whatever the combo having scoring from big guys, seems to be essential to the coach. We will also see small ball at times.

Ford/Rush/Dun/DG/and Troy or Jeff

Ford/Jack/DG/SW/and Troy or Jeff